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PPQ M2 (Chain Mag) Recoil Spring Strength Problem 25/07/2021
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2021
- Continued testing of the new Umarex PPQ M2 with its 21 shot chain magazine, after the Soup Can Bashing video. 567 fault free shots and then this collection of video clips. Short approximately 1/2 inch (12.7mm) extension of the recoil spring added another 1071 shots until the spring's complete failure. Next plan is to replace the recoil spring with something more robust and reliable.
Shame as this pistol shoots really well, not partially rapid due to the chain indexing pull, but nice and accurate, with a decent shot count per capsule. Something for Umarex to look at, a real problem, or just a one off?
Glad I saw this, was considering it but not a chance after watching this.
Many thanks
Looking at trying an improved recoil spring mine, but as it is, I couldn't recommend this pistol. Great shame as the rest of the pistol is great.
There's definitely something wrong with your pistol. I would have taken it back to the shop. Mines is perfect. Spring is perfect, and god knows how you managed to get that slide off. (And back on again)
You've ruined the warranty and Umarex must be turning in their grave! 😮
Definitely looks like a quality control issue. Thanks for making the video.
No worries.
Thanks For The Heads Up Mate :)
I had the exact same issue with my ppq m2, Thanks for making the video
Thanks for the heads up Reeves on that model. .
I agree with you its a weak spring great pistol nice video, cheers 🍻
The slide should not come off until you take out the front pin. This may indicate that the pin is broken in half in the middle, allowing for slide to move too far back and come off the rails. You need to take out the front pin and check, probably need to replace it.
Nice looking Pistol
Same as a previous comment, I too was seriously considering buying this gun. Will now be giving it a miss and looking for an alternative. Shame really when the magazine system performs well only to be let down by a simple component
Thanks for the post. I agree, it looks like the spring is a bit weak but also given the gradual yield I suspect it hasn't been annealed properly. Or at all.
I have found similar problems with some other mainly Umarex guns, with a complete lack of case hardening of key parts, the hammer in particular, as well as an astonishing lack of lubrication being the main issues.
Frankly it's not acceptable for a gun with a MSRP of £210. It was on my list but I won't be buying one now.
I have this Walther on pre-order as we speak. I agree that the spring is weak. This is a problem that plagues many blowback replicas, but I have a sneaky suspicion those rails are to blame as well. The rails on the left side of the frame do appear to have some serious wear on them. I couldn't get a very close look at the right side, or the grooves in the slide itself, but I would expect to see some wear there as well. Regardless of how weak the spring is, I doubt Walther would expect the recoil spring, and only the spring, to keep the slide from coming off the frame during live firing, (sounds like a lawsuit waiting to happen). There had to have been a slide stop molded into either the frame or the slide or both, and I suspect that has failed and is probably broken/missing. One question... Is this pistol designed to be field stripped? Does it mention this at all in the owner's manual? Thanks!
No. There is no mention of this pistol being field strippable. I'm currently testing some more robust recoil springs to reduce the distance the slide blowbacks, as their is definitely a point where it clears the slide guides, and the hammer pressure pops the slide off, even though the hammer is cocked well before the slide reaches its most rearward travel.
Nice! (Or actually not - but it is how one takes it..)
I think I once read about some issue on this model, but forgot what it actually was about. Apparently this slide issue then.
Is, or wasn't there at all a pin to punch out before removing the slide all the way back and off? But that spring definitely seemed too thin. I have dragged springs longer before - but the best is absolutely to find a replacement spring that is slightly thicker. I know that most Sig ASP pistols have a too thin spring around the barrel, which then mqkes the slide movement way too sloppy. No idea how Umarex effed this up so badly. This PPQ definitely woulda needed the recoil spring seat that is locked down with a pin just behind the end of the accessory rail..
But luckily this should not be a difficult fix if a suitable, better spring is found..
Hey was just wondering if you got this issue sorted??? as I was looking to purchase one, as I have paintball version 43 cal breaker balls.🔥💥
Hmm that’s a little concerning I think mine will be going back if I have this issue especially considering the price!
Yes mate, I’d recommend that, but I’m sure a better spring will fix mine. If my second one I have on pre-order does this, it will be returned mate.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 please could you give me shout if the spring fix works , cheers mate
@@dobbo4596 No worries mate.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 mr reeves dit your second one have the same issues ?
Just bought one and a bit afraid to use it now.
The only thing that bothers me is the slide rattle. No such thing on my t4e clock from umarex
@@frederikruysseveldt7106 If you check out some of my later videos on this pistol you will see I updated the recoil spring to stop this problem. Umarex were informed about the problem, and according to the reply, the video information was sent to their R&D department. I would shoot it as normal, and if you have a problem return it for a refund. If you decide to keep it I can give you the details on the spring I used.
Hey brother, so you just replaced the recoil spring with one of more tension, with a more robust build in order to fix the situation? I really am interested in buying this pistol but I’m trying to be wary of all the issues as well
Yes. It took some trial and error to get the length and strength right. I sent the video to Umarex so hopefully newer builds will not have this problem.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 ah ok that’s brilliant, thank you putting this legitimate educational video out, I’m set on buying it, whenever I get my next check!
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 if by any chance, is it possible you can show the capabilities of this gun with different pellets? I will he carrying it as I’m not old enough to purchase the real deal for another year, I would really appreciate it! I’ve seen videos where people put it against a can a spam or the likes, but I’ve never seen one of those videos with this specific gun, cheers!
Hi mate , i just got the Glock gen5 pellet with the updated white belt (supposed fix) that seems all good however i still feel the recoil spring is not great and want to replace it , it has not faied i might add but would like to replace anyway. how do you remove the slide on these type of pistols? Does that front push pin need to come out? Once apart i can then measur the spring for a potential replacement. Cheers.
At the end of this video i show how the slide is put back on, removal is the reverse. If the pistol is shooting good i would leave it. The Glock may well have a retention pin for the slide, something the PPQ M2 doesn't have. Spring used was the RS Components Part. Number 121-163 trimmed at one end down to 55mm overall free length.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 Thanks for the reply , it shoots really well tbh and the trigger after the first shot is very nice with a very short reset. Would like a stronger recoil spring so may look into the RS components offering.
With out knowing how the slide is removed it may be a case of “if it’s not broken don’t fix it”..
Soooo the hammer is hanging on the slide by the pin that goes between the hammer and mag. I’m drawing up a new part and 3D printing it to fix this. It will limit how far the slide can blow back and keep it from hanging up… but still go far enough back to set the hammer.
A stronger spring would Bandaid the issue. But the issue is a design problem. The slide is not supposed to go back that far with the front take down pin installed. But be it design flaw, or manufacturing tolerance issue, it allows the slide to go back further than it should. The new model isn’t as bad as yours, but I did run into a similar issue when I modified the magazine for more FPS.
Appreciate this video I’ve heard similar stories from others too - did you hear back from Umarex? Any defining fault?
I’m hoping they address these in quality because that’s the only thing holding me back from purchasing one, they’re beautiful otherwise!
I sent the link to Umarex but I have had no response. I have been testing stronger springs without complete success due to this pistols strong blowback. Really need to slow down that down, to stop the slide jumping off. Umarex should really have made this with a takedown lever, but I have other ideas. If I solve the problem, testing a post of results. I will try Umarex again.
Hi, so I bought one! The mag belt is different and made of hard white plastic not black rubber. The trigger pull consequently is f..ing awful. Heavy, inconsistent and everything the real ppq isn't. As I bought it to train with, have you any ideas to make the mag belt advance better?
On the original rubber type belt the manual recommends oil lubricant on the front and back side of the belt. A small drop of gun oil per side should help. I also use molybdenum grease to lubricate behind and Infront of the trigger. After the first shot, and the hammer cocked she should be better. Hope this is useful.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 once again, thank you. I have tried to lube with silicone oil, but the belt advance is the issue, it's hard and inconsistent.
@@Guide504 I found silicone oil a bit heavy, a lighter oil should be better. I did try various lubricants.
Hi Sir, was planning to buy a PPQ M2 (would be my very first airgun), but after this video .. not sure it's a good choice. Would you know if this 'spring' issue is solved in the meantime ?... Thanks D, greetings from Belgium.
Hi Danny. I never had a reply from Umarex about the slide blowing off, and I haven’t heard of any recent reports. I have many blowback Co2 pistols and this is the only one that has ever done this. Apart from that problem it is a great pistol, and they have recently changed the pellet belt from black to white as it had wear after long use. Make sure you lubricate the belt in use. Best to handle one and talk to the RFD about this old problem and if they won’t allow you to return it if you have that problem, buy something else.
Thanks for your quick answer. Will indeed check if return is possible (thanks for your advice). Indeed I read everywhere that it is a good gun but of course any possible issue should be handled correctly. Not nice and not client friendly that Umarex did not react !. regards D.
Hallo,leider spreche ich kein Englisch. Ich habe mir jetzt genau diese PPQ gekauft, aber noch nicht damit geschossen. Also Weiß ich nicht,ob das Problem mit dem Schlitten auch bei mir irgendwann auftritt. Woran liegt das Problem denn? Leider verstehe ich nicht,was der Mann dort spricht,kann leider nur das Video gucken. Kann mir vielleicht einer auf deutsch erklären,was das Problem ist? Und wie man es beheben kann?
Gruß, Jürgen
Hi,
Just wondering if you sent it back or fixed it, or of its still a problem?
Can't see anyone else has had this issue so probably a one off failure.
Mine is coming on Monday.
Anyone else had any issues?
I have heard of a few others having a similar problem and I did send the link to this video to Umarex, even though I had no reply. I have improved it with a new stronger spring so it is not coming off completely.
Just got mine. How is it working out for you ?
@Frederik Ruysseveldt havnt had any issues yet, must be on my second tin.
I replaced mine with Part#88272 -upc code 7 38287 88272 8 15/32" x 5 1/4" compression spring cut to 2 3/8" or the same size as the old spring
Not good if that is coming from the factory in that condition!! Kinda put me off it
Started after 567 shots, so it's probably something Umarex can fix. Going to replace the recoil spring, with something more robust.
Unfortunately, I have the same issue just after 100 pallets! It is a piece of sh**...it is a second issue. The first was cracking the pallet belt.
Try using flat head diabolos. This pistol is not made for roundhead diabolos.
I know this issue...look my TestVideo ! But this Issue happend only once in my test. When i pusch back the breech manuell...it always remains in the backposition. Sorry for my englisch...i come from germany.Greetings.
Hi from England🏴. I have watched you video and noticed your PPQ M2 jamming as you pull back the slide. Mine only did that after it blew off the rear the first time. It was completely faultless up to 567 pellets. Now looking at a suitable replacement spring to solve this problem. I have also contacted Umarex with a link to this video, which shows the fault, being a long term reliability issue.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 I dont think that it is a spring problem...You mean it is too powerfull ?...I think...the breech stucks somewhere in the back ..inside the PPQ... Do you see any scratches inside the weapon...inside the breech....or near the nozzle..???? Because of guarantee i didnt open the PPQ not yet.
@@zteamgreen Mine is definitely not catching on the breech, no marks anywhere. As you pull the slide back, it will cock the hammer, so release it at that point, and it’s fine. If you pull the slide hard back, you will hear a click, which as this point it jams, and the rear of the slide lifts. Because of the weakened spring the slide is over-ridding that final point. Like I said before, up to 567 shots it was prefect, no jams with the slide being pulled back firmly, with no need to tap the slide at the rear, like you have shown. I have taken detailed measurements of the spring, and now searching for an up-rated recoil spring.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 Now i disassambled the PPQ and found on the left side....inside... a big scratch...where the breech could stuck.The spring in my PPQ is not as weak as yours...so it could be another issue in my PPQ as in yours.I think..tomorrow i will produce another video about fixing my PPQ....with a link to your channel :)..
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 Have Umerex got back to you RE this issue? I have not had the failure as yet but i would imagine its matter of time, how "simple" is it to disassemble the gun if you come across replacement springs? Have you contacted the RFD also? Cheers
Your not supposed to disassemble those types of pistols it even says on the manual
With the right pellets this thing is dangerous
Can you use the 43cal with pellet magzine?
this gun is not very good, the pellet rubber spindle keeps jamming pellets
@@techbit7607 The Rubber belt is not too good as after time it wears out. You really need to use a good quality pellet and pre-seat in the belt. The newer White nylon belts are much better, but you still have to pre-seat them otherwise they will move and jam.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 thank you for the great tip, what do you mean by pre-seat?
@@techbit7607 put the pellet in the belt, then push the pellet into the belt slightly ( so the pellet is below the belt surface). I use a cocktail stick for this. This should stop the pellet moving while firing. If it’s jammed then some holes may have broken so you will need to get a replacement belt, which are easy to change. The new ones are White nylon, not black rubber. Don’t forget to lubricant the belt with two small drops of oil, check manual.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 thank you 🙏
Looks like Dude Took it apart and amazingly it nolonger works. Good To Go MATE. 😮😊😅😂
No. I didn’t take it apart. The slide blew off from new, and I eventually fixed the problem with a stronger recoil spring. I don’t take my airguns apart unless they are designed to be dismantled, and this one isn’t.
So, remember, kids, when you buy a brand new car and it quickly breaks down on you, just fix the engine yourself. Don't bother sending it back to the showroom for a replacement or refund.
So remember Kids when you spend thousands of pounds on a brand new car and it breaks down, do take it back, but if you review new cars and you find a problem it could be handy to tell the manufacturer what the problem is, and what the solution could be to fix it. (The link to this video was sent to Umarex, but as of yet, no reply) Also it is very important to tell other people that in no way would you recommend that particular brand of new car as it has a problem that affects its correct operation. Garry this is the exact reason why I cannot recommend anyone buying this pistol, and if you do consider it you should bring this problem to the attention of the RFD to are talking too before buying it. If you still choose to buy it then it is your choice, and a risk like all products. Of course this maybe a problem with only a small batch which is why you should talk to your RFD. This pistol only developed this problem after 700 plus pellets. (Unlike some reviewers I give all my airguns a good reliability shoot on review for any problems, and some have been returned, and replaced over the years. Umarex needs to fix this as apart from this problem the pistol shoots very well. This problem has been found elsewhere, and I have seen one other video showing it. I also own all my airguns, I’m not sponsored so I don’t get airguns from companies or RFD’s to review. This means I can long term test airguns and can be totally honest with what I find.
@@reevessairgunningreviews5572 Thank you. It is people like you who do the airgunning community a really valuable and great service.
If only more reviewers were as thorough then manufacturers wouldn't take the mick' like this so often.
Well, except maybe Sig but then they're probably a lost cause.