GREAT VIDEO as always! As an avid fermenter, I just want to bring to your attention a few considerations: 1) when making a brine, you are only concerned with the weight of water (and percentage amount of salt), not the weight of water PLUS veggies because you’re making a 2% SOLUTION . Now, when doing a dry-state ferment, like kimchi or sauerkraut, you want to weigh the veggies only, because cabbages are “self-brining”, meaning they release enough water when properly salted to make their own brine, 2) some veg, like cukes and peppers,, are prone to kahm yeast and mold, and should have a higher salt percentage, generally upwards of 3.5%, which helps keep both at bay 3) whole spices and herbs, like mustard seed or dill, will also mold if they float to the surface. Some people will use something like a cabbage leaf or a slice of onion that fits tightly in the jar (in addition to some sort of weight) to keep EVERYTHING under the brine, 4) lots of people (myself included) use air-locking lids on their glass jars which allow for off-gassing of carbon dioxide without allowing oxygen to enter the ferment, effectively eliminating mold. And lastly, fermenting works better when done at slightly lower temps, which allow time for ALL the stages of fermentation to develop. I would encourage anyone interested in fermenting to research the science behind it, explore various methods, etc. so that they get a deeper understanding of the process and a higher success rate. Your videos are always enjoyable and informative and I appreciate all the work you put in. Thanks!
Hey Allison, based on your comment I can tell you have experience with fermentation! This video's information is specifically based on the Noma Guide to Fermentation. Now, this isn't the only or best way to do lacto fermentation, but I do want to provide some color to your considerations within the Noma context. 1) We are calculating based on the total weight of the vegetables because the salt in the brine will pass into the vegetables due to osmosis / diffusion leading to what noma considers an ideal flavoring inside the pickle. For example, say I took 500 g of water to cover 500 g of carrots and added 20 g of salt (2% total weight). We are actually creating a 4% saline solution (20/500). Over time, the salt will pass from the solution into the carrots we are fermenting and balance the environment through osmosis/diffusion meaning we have 2% brine and 2% salt content in the carrots. Through Noma's experience (and I agree), the higher salt content in the fermented vegetable is tastier. If we had only made a 2% salt brine for the carrots, it would only be 1% solution and 1% salt in the carrots. Additionally, weighing the salt based on the total weight simplifies things. Some vegetables like you mentioned in #2 will stave off mold better in a higher % salt brine. Using the total weight, we naturally will have a higher salt brine, so there isn't much a need to worry about this. This is especially great for people who are newer to fermentation because they just have to remember 1 method and 1 number (2% total weight), rather than trying to figure out the appropriate salt brine % for each specific vegetable. Obviously, as we gain experience you may find different percentages work better for you and we can adjust, but the beauty in this method is the simplicity, which leads to new creations as your experiferment. 2) Yep, see the above paragraph as to why with this method you don't really need to worry about this. 3) Agreed, those are two more great methods to keep everything below the brine. 4) I just got some of those, excited to try them. I'm not sure what metric you are referencing, but fermenting is not inherently better at lower temperatures, it really depends on what you are looking for. Noma actually finds the best temperature at 82 F or 28 C, which is slightly higher than room temp because it provides all the bacterial activity needed and will go through all the fermentation stages faster than lower temperatures. That being said, climate control is the most important part, whether you are fermenting in the fridge, on the counter, or in a fermentation chamber at a higher temp. The noma guide is just one way (though I have found the best results using this book), but there are plenty of great resources on fermentation out there. Fermentation is fun!
Cook with E , interesting that Noma recommends weighing water AND veg together- in ALL of the years of fermentation research and experience that I’ve done/had, I’ve never heard of this, although I can def see that it gives you s higher salt percentage overall, and I certainly agree that saltier ferments are generally more successful, and taste better, AND keep mold down. I have a friend who SWEARS by a 5% brine- that’s a little TOO high for my taste! 😩😂 You’re right- fermentation is SO FUN! And so very healthy for maintaining a healthy gut microbiome! I have so much more energy since I’ve been eating more fermented foods! As always, keep up the great work- would love to see more fermentation videos! ❤️
I thought the exact same thing - I usually do a 2.5% Salinity solution when doing this (or making hot sauces). That high of a salt content would not allow for the Lactobacillus to grow as well. One thing I strongly recommend sanitizing everything - the bacteria lives on the vegetables and you wouldn't want to introduce some coudies in there from the jar or your hands. Great video though!
@@WhiteThunderBBQ In the book, Noma says some species of LAB can carry out fermentation at 8% salt concentration, so relatively that example isn't that high. In practice, using this method of snugly fitting the vegetables and filling with water usually gives me a saline solution somewhere between 3-4%.
I have had lactofermentation in 10% salt brines, so arguing that a 2% salt concentration overall is too high is bs. It is correct to consider the weight of the veggies when calculating the amount of salt or your chances are high that you are going to get into troube with tighly packed veggies and only a little brine.
I am from Poland and we eat lacto fermented food almost on daily basis - cucumbers, sauerkraut, beets, you name it. Most families make that at home. I have never even considered the risk of botulism. I've heard about it happen with old canned meat, but pickles? Never. I think it says something, that a nation of 40 million makes those all the time for hundreds of years and we don't have any problems with botulism
Americans will bash me but from what I see online and other fermentation communities (including beer brewing) they tend to obsess with cleanliness. I mean its cool but a lot of times its exaggerated. Beer brewing dudes from states tend to have almost surgery floor level of cleanliness standards. You can skip the whole plastic bag thing in the jar and just shake your jars daily. It will be just fine. Obviously if you have loads of them than just get a jar with a small air valve that will let gases out and nothing in. Easier than these screw on lids.
Zajebsite masz nazwisko! :) Ciekawe czy Twoi przodkowie zajmowali się może odwadnianiem Żóław wislanych z holenderskimi osadnikami. Chyba, że to chodzi o wiatrak do mielenia mąki. Pozdro
@@MartinZeme Beer, Unless you are aiming for a sour beer, it is important to sanitize everything, but aside from beer i totally agree with you. Most of my Lacto ferment jars just get cleaned with soap and water every once in a while. But I time batches so that when im taking one out of a jar something else is going right in, so why destroy all that good bacteria all over the inside of the jar!
My favorite lacto-ferment is a sriracha like chili garlic sauce made with hot cherry peppers and maybe add some fresnos, or some fresh thai chili if I want to boost the heat.. I halve and deseed the peppers, then when everything is fermented I just blend it down with just enough of the liquid to get the texture I want. So good.
I love how I can tell that you’re teaching yourself all of this stuff and getting to a point where you’re capable of teaching others. I was always taught “if you want to see if you know what you’re talking about, try to explain a concept to someone who has no context”
Thanks for the video! The beets are super carbonated because they contain a lot of sugar, though, not more lactobacteria. It’s wild yeast breaking down the sugars into CO2 and alcohol. If you want it less bubbly/alcoholic you can cut the beets into bigger chunks to avoid that.
I usually do 1.5% brine without weighing vegetables. The reason is I usually add more brine than just to cover vegetation for the purpose of drinking the brine. I like that fermented brine so much so I lower the salt content so it's not too salty. My ferments were all successful so far. Try with beetroot for example. For 1kg of beetroot go for 2 liters of brine 1.5%. Stick it in a cool place with an airlock. Cool environment will cause it to slowly bring out the beets goodness into the brine and slightly carbonizes it. It's delicious to drink and I use brine and beets to make Ukrainian borscht.
I want the juice for drinking too but add water to the solution when I'm ready to drink it. It's interesting that you use so little salt but aren't having a mold problem. Maybe it's because your doing beets and they are less prone to mold than cukes? Do you ferment at room temperature?
@@dreamingrightnow1174 it's a popular misconception that there's a minimum salt requirement of 2%. 1.5% is only 0.5 less. Salt is there not to prevent mold but to promote lactobacillus bacteria and inhibit others. I do the same with cucumbers, cabbage and tomatoes. They all make delicious kvass. And yes, room temperature.
Ethan- Perhaps you could do one on pickling with Soy Sauce (instead of salt) which adds a nice umami. I've had some daikon pickled this way at a Korean restaurant and it was the best pickle ever. I also was curious what your thought are on adding some vinegar right from the git-go, like when you pickle red onions - kinda give the ferment a head-start on the sour, and keep the Butolism at bay.
If you're like me and didn't know what Noma is: Noma is a fancy restaurant in Denmark where the foods are all fermented. Ethan didn't explain what it was in his video, which maybe tells me I'm not his target audience as a novice chef haha.
But is that the correct way? I know a few people claim that is the correct way, but coming from a scientific perspective, I debate that claim. Let me explain why... Say you are doing one jar of a dense heavy veggie like carrot and another jar of a loose light veggie like cauliflower or cabbage. The dense veggie would use much less water than the loose veggie, so, if doing 2% salt by total weight, each jar will end up being wildly different salt percentages of the solution. The heavy veggies, which use less water, will end up being maybe 4% brine solution, while the loose veggies might be 0.5%. Does that sound like the “correct” way? I actually don’t know... you could argue that the salt fully penetrates the veggies once the ferment is done and becomes homogenous throughout the brine and veggies. But does the salt fully penetrate the veggies and become homogenous? Also... different veggies have a different water content. So... I think it is debatable and there actually is no correct way. Each veggie requires its own way.
James Ball I’m not saying you are right or wrong, but don’t be so sure. The only way to really know is through experimentation. For example, do one jar of dense veggie (carrot) and another of loose veggie (cauliflower) using the total weight to calculate the salt percentage. Again... the loose veggies would require much more water and therefore would have a much lower salinity at the beginning of the ferment. However, MAYBE, at the end of the ferment, both have reached the same salinity through osmosis. If that does in fact happen, then using total weigh probably is the more “correct” way. I’m sure experiments have been done on this and I would like to see the data.
Another method for those doing things that do not need a brine, Such as moisture rich things like fruits,tomatoes,etc is to add the veggie/fruit to a vacuum seal bag with the proper amount of salt and Vacuum seal it. Works Amazing for moisture rich because you start with very little if any oxygen in the bag.
I find it absolutely critical to keep those vegetable covered with brine to keep the mold away. I ferment often, so I have invested in glass weights made for this purpose. They are very helpful.
OH MY! I was recently gifted with the Noma Guide ! I have gotten pretty good at making my own version of KimChi, and now I want to try more. Your video has given me a little more confidence to try something new again ! Thanks !!
Good idea! You can also get rid of weights altogether though, a good advice I heard was to fill up the glass, turn it on its head for about an hour and then turn it back. Check daily if everything is covered with a thin layer of brine, but that's really it! Weights ould introduce harmful bacteria
I just want to say thank you for producing this video. Because of you I have had fresh vegetables through the winter months. I keep coming back to this video because it is so informative. Thank you for inspiring my own YT channel. I will be back for more!
Great video. I just did green beans. I did a traditional pickle and water bath canned them. I also did a lactoferment of some. I will see which ones I think taste better.
Ooh, I just thought of a ferment you might LOVE, E! Fermented salsa! There are two methods- fermenting veg whole, or blitzing everything and then fermenting, which is my preferred method. I pulse tomatoes (or tomatillos!), onion, garlic, peppers, cilantro, parsley, and oregano in a food processor. I strain it slightly so it’s not too liquid, and then salt generously to taste. Place into fermenting jar with a loose- fitting lid. This is a quick (~4-day) ferment, but you’ll have to stir it vigorously at least once a day to keep mold from forming. I use that opportunity to taste it each day (no double dipping!😂) until it’s as fermented as I like. I was SHOCKED the first time I did it- it is almost more delicious than I can stand! I hope you’ll try it! And fermented red onion may just replace vinegar-pickled onion for your tacos! Happy fermenting, my friend!
Looks like I have an afternoon project. I have tomatillos I'm gonna try this with! Thanks for the suggestion. Have you used the air locking fermentation lids for these? I think I'll try them on this.
Cook with E , no, I’ve not used the airlocking lids for salsa because I always blitz mine first as opposed to fermenting whole veg. Because I do it this way I have to open the jar each day to stir vigorously. I think you’re going to love it! The tomatoes get a little wine-y tasting- such a deep, perfect flavor! I’d be very interested to see how the tomatillos taste!
@@allygirl641 I went for the whole veg method because I wanted to try out the airlock lids. I used purple tomatillos, habanero, onion, and cilantro. Excited to see how it turns out!
Using a plastic bag of water as a weight/lid is a good thing to do, but it is better if it is filled with brine so a leak will not dilute your ferment.
I think of the fermentation crocks that my grandparents used, and I know that people are way too concerned about mold growth. Fermentation was done in open crocks until the era of refrigeration and grocery store canned goods arrived. Things like cabbage, green beans, and cucumbers were placed in a crock, covered with brine, then a dishtowel, then a clean board, and weighed down with a clean rock. The top of the crock was covered with a cloth to keep flies out. When you opened it, of course it had mold growth on top, which was scooped off and thrown out. The ferment underneath was just fine. Today when I see all the expensive ways people use to keep oxygen out of the ferment vessel, I wonder if they are missing tan important point of home food preservation; good food at an affordable price. I like to use a small crock with a water lip seal for my larger ferments, and fido jars for my smaller ones. I source them at estate sales, yard sales, and such.
Just bought Nora's Guide TF and was going to start with shoyu, but saw your video, it's fall, farmer's markets are full - pickles! Thanks - - - -tare, pronounced tear (like ripping, not crying)
My only experience with lactofermentation came when I was doing a lot with hot peppers a few years ago. I was also making yogurt regularly at the time, discovered references to LF, and on a whim, added some whey from the yogurt to a few jars of peppers+spices in ACV. I did get some foam, but it was restrained, mostly bubbly clusters edging the chopped pieces, one of which was my first attempt at pickling…. Things blew up long after that, and the experiments went off-course, but the pickles (and the sauce made from the sauce batches) turned out fine and flavorful; I was concerned that the veggies would lose all their structural integrity, bu they did not. They are not *crisp*…and overall, the flavors of the garlic/peppers/onions are generally softer, less sharp, less penetrating, while the spices are much more forward than identical batches without the added whey. Really enjoying your vids, Ethan…I like your approach, you are introducing me to foods and styles I’ve known nothing about: very exciting, actually. I think I’ll camp out with my coffee and your channel tomorrow. BTW, I envy your kitchen….
FYI, 1:49 "tare" is a native English word pronounced exactly like what you'd expect for an English word, i.e., the same as "tear". It's only pronounced ta-re when referring to the Japanese sauce.
You can always kick start your fermentation with a little bit of lactic acid, lactose and live lacto culture. All available on Amazon, or at cheese-making and homebrew suppliers. Calcium chloride helps keep the pickles crunchy as well, but you have to give it time to work by putting the pickles in the fridge for a couple days before setting it out at room temp to start fermenting. Otherwise the acid will neutralize the calcium before it has a chance to firm up the veggies.
You are more likely to get botulism from improperly home canned meat and low-acid vegetables, such as peas, carrots, green beans, mushrooms, potatoes etc, Tomatoes, jams and jellies, and pickles are high-acid, and safe from botulism.
Thank you, very nice but it is easier to put 30 gr of natural grey salt for one liter of filtered water. The smell of the food is the best indicator if the ferment has worked.
The trick to removing kahm yeast isn't to skim it off, rather, put the jar in the sink or in a large bowl and gently pour more brine into the jar. It'll overflow, taking all the kahm yeast out with it. Super simple.
in Poland, my mother and my grandmothet used to add 15 g salt for 1 l wather, thats 1.5% salt. I thinks it's better, less salty. And spices..... horseradish, (why you don't use horseradish?, it's basic), currant leaf or grape leaf, garic and a lot of fennel
@@adamthemute yes you should. If u can pick horseradish leafs to. They taste amazing. You can make rice and meat rolls with them after they ferment about a 3 weeks. Tey will be very soft. It's similar to Greek or French fermented wine grape leafs. My mother use one or two leafs of oak or walnut leafs for taste. Also I don't know why but ok leafs always help to vegiies be very crunchy.
If you weigh the vegetables w/the water you're using that's FAR from a true two percent brine. It would be a much higher percentage. Also eighty plus degrees is going to REALLY speed the process! Should be between 65-75 degrees! That said, great video, good info for starters! 👍✌️♥️
you coupd also add a layer of olive oil to protect submerged veggies…. as for C.Boutulum , is alcohol a protector from it when it comes to making vinegar?
If you want to ferment for longer keep, do it in much more salt and do not cut the cucumber. Also add salary for interesting flavour For the variety of information: czcams.com/video/ATntUZvepQ0/video.html
I purchased a fermentation kit, glass weights etc. Pickles were soft and rubbery after 4 days. Inedible. I used pure salt, bottled water. Pickle juice was also cloudy. What do you think went wrong?
You need tannins to keep the pickles (cucumbers) from getting "hollow" or rubbery. Try adding grape leaves or oak leaves at the top of the jar to add some tannins. Or you can brine the pickles overnight and do the traditional canning method (processing), but that won't be a lacto-fermentation.
I've never heard anyone say tar-AY instead of tare. Have I been saying it wrong all these years? Are we starting a new trend? Anyway, thanks for the vid! :)
it's likely the first time he's seen the word "tare" was for ramen broth seasoning which is pronounced that way. i did not know tare weight was pronounced differently until i read your comment
That scale makes the process so much easier. I use the percentage mode and add salt directly until I have the desired %. Then I cap and shake until all the salt dissolves.
Could you clarify the math for a 2% solution? Is it weight of the veg and water x .02 or divided by .98- the original weight? It won’t matter for smaller weights but could on large batches or higher brine concentrations. E.g. method one = 100g of veg and water plus 2g of salt (1.96% salt) Method 2= 98 g of veg and water plus 2g of salt (true 2% salt by weight)
Whoopsie. My pickles were on desk for additional days from planned and probably had that yeast instead of mold, but I threw them away before seeing this.
I would be concerned about using anything made of plastic to weigh down the veggies. Especially a ziplock bag because the material is so thin. The acidic environment would cause plastic to break down and leech chemicals into the brine.
It doesn't, first off a zip bag is food grade, second acid will not attack plastic. No worries it will be fine. If your concerned about getting a puncture in a bag just fill them with brine and it will not dilute.
Love the video. Way overcomplicated the brine solution measurement in my opinion. In Europe the default jar is 720 mL. Lets say you fill it up completely. Veggies are basically water. For a 2% solution just do 14.4 grams (720 x 2%) of salt which you can throw inside the jar whenever. Then pour water/vinegar mix over everything.
Can I use honey and vinegar instead the salt water? And one thing is I wanted to eating it the next day and also I put it in the fridge after preparing.
I'm just watching the different fermentation methods, but I have a question: is this different than the "cook you brine" method? If so, what's the difference? What I mean with "cook your brine": boil part water and vinegar, sugar and salt. With lacto fermentation you are not using vinegar, so I'm just confused as if with only water and salt you could get the same results.
Hey i am tryingthe cucumber fermentation.. And there is no carbonation (bubble) formation after 6th day.. Is that ok.. Can i eat that kind of fermented (no bubble) pickles?
I not making anymore after finishing my lot because it sits in my fridge getting stinkier and the funky odor makes me sneeze. I'll stick with fresh vegetables. It is healthy enough for me to eat soygurt and miso.
Hey Ethan! Thanks for the great breakdown. Was just wondering if sauerkraut is the same 2% salt brine or is it different? I understand we have to pre-salt the cabbage to draw out excess water but just wondering if the brine is the same when we actually pickle the cabbage?
Adding 2% salt to the shredded cabbage, rubbing vigorously and tampining down into the jars or crocks will result in a 2% solution on its own. If for some reason your liquid drops below the cabbage you can add a 2% solution. That's why the zip lock bag on top is so helpful. Filled with 2% salt solution works so well in case of a leak. I've had it happen but only once. Just check daily, tamping down if necessary.
What about beets, should you just rub off the dirt under water with your hands? I do buy all organic and they don’t seem to always be that dirty. Thank you 🙏🏼💜🇨🇦
Videos kinda old but maybe someone will see this. First time pickling, Im about ready to try them. I noticed one of the jars had what LOOKED like mold forming on like day 2 of fermenting and I isolated it. But I checked it again 2 days later and it disappeared. I held on to it because I wanted to see how it spread to better identify. Now Ive dealt with mold problems before as I used to grow my own mushrooms and Ive never seen a mold colony just disappear! How sure can I be that it was this kahm yeast instead?
To keep air from contacting the water and whatnot, why not use olive oil? Pour enough olive oil to make a layer sufficient enough to separate residual air from the water and food. Mold can't grow on olive oil.
Sandor Katz has two great books 1) wild fermentation 2)the art of fermentation. both are full of amazing recipes, science and the history and geography behind certain ferments !
GREAT VIDEO as always! As an avid fermenter, I just want to bring to your attention a few considerations:
1) when making a brine, you are only concerned with the weight of water (and percentage amount of salt), not the weight of water PLUS veggies because you’re making a 2% SOLUTION . Now, when doing a dry-state ferment, like kimchi or sauerkraut, you want to weigh the veggies only, because cabbages are “self-brining”, meaning they release enough water when properly salted to make their own brine,
2) some veg, like cukes and peppers,, are prone to kahm yeast and mold, and should have a higher salt percentage, generally upwards of 3.5%, which helps keep both at bay
3) whole spices and herbs, like mustard seed or dill, will also mold if they float to the surface. Some people will use something like a cabbage leaf or a slice of onion that fits tightly in the jar (in addition to some sort of weight) to keep EVERYTHING under the brine,
4) lots of people (myself included) use air-locking lids on their glass jars which allow for off-gassing of carbon dioxide without allowing oxygen to enter the ferment, effectively eliminating mold.
And lastly, fermenting works better when done at slightly lower temps, which allow time for ALL the stages of fermentation to develop.
I would encourage anyone interested in fermenting to research the science behind it, explore various methods, etc. so that they get a deeper understanding of the process and a higher success rate.
Your videos are always enjoyable and informative and I appreciate all the work you put in. Thanks!
Hey Allison, based on your comment I can tell you have experience with fermentation!
This video's information is specifically based on the Noma Guide to Fermentation. Now, this isn't the only or best way to do lacto fermentation, but I do want to provide some color to your considerations within the Noma context.
1) We are calculating based on the total weight of the vegetables because the salt in the brine will pass into the vegetables due to osmosis / diffusion leading to what noma considers an ideal flavoring inside the pickle. For example, say I took 500 g of water to cover 500 g of carrots and added 20 g of salt (2% total weight). We are actually creating a 4% saline solution (20/500). Over time, the salt will pass from the solution into the carrots we are fermenting and balance the environment through osmosis/diffusion meaning we have 2% brine and 2% salt content in the carrots. Through Noma's experience (and I agree), the higher salt content in the fermented vegetable is tastier. If we had only made a 2% salt brine for the carrots, it would only be 1% solution and 1% salt in the carrots.
Additionally, weighing the salt based on the total weight simplifies things. Some vegetables like you mentioned in #2 will stave off mold better in a higher % salt brine. Using the total weight, we naturally will have a higher salt brine, so there isn't much a need to worry about this. This is especially great for people who are newer to fermentation because they just have to remember 1 method and 1 number (2% total weight), rather than trying to figure out the appropriate salt brine % for each specific vegetable. Obviously, as we gain experience you may find different percentages work better for you and we can adjust, but the beauty in this method is the simplicity, which leads to new creations as your experiferment.
2) Yep, see the above paragraph as to why with this method you don't really need to worry about this.
3) Agreed, those are two more great methods to keep everything below the brine.
4) I just got some of those, excited to try them.
I'm not sure what metric you are referencing, but fermenting is not inherently better at lower temperatures, it really depends on what you are looking for. Noma actually finds the best temperature at 82 F or 28 C, which is slightly higher than room temp because it provides all the bacterial activity needed and will go through all the fermentation stages faster than lower temperatures. That being said, climate control is the most important part, whether you are fermenting in the fridge, on the counter, or in a fermentation chamber at a higher temp.
The noma guide is just one way (though I have found the best results using this book), but there are plenty of great resources on fermentation out there. Fermentation is fun!
Cook with E , interesting that Noma recommends weighing water AND veg together- in ALL of the years of fermentation research and experience that I’ve done/had, I’ve never heard of this, although I can def see that it gives you s higher salt percentage overall, and I certainly agree that saltier ferments are generally more successful, and taste better, AND keep mold down. I have a friend who SWEARS by a 5% brine- that’s a little TOO high for my taste! 😩😂
You’re right- fermentation is SO FUN! And so very healthy for maintaining a healthy gut microbiome! I have so much more energy since I’ve been eating more fermented foods!
As always, keep up the great work- would love to see more fermentation videos!
❤️
I thought the exact same thing - I usually do a 2.5% Salinity solution when doing this (or making hot sauces). That high of a salt content would not allow for the Lactobacillus to grow as well. One thing I strongly recommend sanitizing everything - the bacteria lives on the vegetables and you wouldn't want to introduce some coudies in there from the jar or your hands. Great video though!
@@WhiteThunderBBQ In the book, Noma says some species of LAB can carry out fermentation at 8% salt concentration, so relatively that example isn't that high.
In practice, using this method of snugly fitting the vegetables and filling with water usually gives me a saline solution somewhere between 3-4%.
I have had lactofermentation in 10% salt brines, so arguing that a 2% salt concentration overall is too high is bs. It is correct to consider the weight of the veggies when calculating the amount of salt or your chances are high that you are going to get into troube with tighly packed veggies and only a little brine.
I am from Poland and we eat lacto fermented food almost on daily basis - cucumbers, sauerkraut, beets, you name it. Most families make that at home. I have never even considered the risk of botulism. I've heard about it happen with old canned meat, but pickles? Never. I think it says something, that a nation of 40 million makes those all the time for hundreds of years and we don't have any problems with botulism
From India where mustard oil used instead water..can you suggest simple water brine pickles making with clear instructions
Americans will bash me but from what I see online and other fermentation communities (including beer brewing) they tend to obsess with cleanliness. I mean its cool but a lot of times its exaggerated. Beer brewing dudes from states tend to have almost surgery floor level of cleanliness standards.
You can skip the whole plastic bag thing in the jar and just shake your jars daily. It will be just fine. Obviously if you have loads of them than just get a jar with a small air valve that will let gases out and nothing in. Easier than these screw on lids.
Zajebsite masz nazwisko! :)
Ciekawe czy Twoi przodkowie zajmowali się może odwadnianiem Żóław wislanych z holenderskimi osadnikami. Chyba, że to chodzi o wiatrak do mielenia mąki. Pozdro
@@mihiec raczej zajmowali się mieleniem mąki :) we wsi, z której pochodzą moi dziadkowie, nadal znajduje się duży kompleks młynów
@@MartinZeme Beer, Unless you are aiming for a sour beer, it is important to sanitize everything, but aside from beer i totally agree with you. Most of my Lacto ferment jars just get cleaned with soap and water every once in a while. But I time batches so that when im taking one out of a jar something else is going right in, so why destroy all that good bacteria all over the inside of the jar!
My favorite lacto-ferment is a sriracha like chili garlic sauce made with hot cherry peppers and maybe add some fresnos, or some fresh thai chili if I want to boost the heat.. I halve and deseed the peppers, then when everything is fermented I just blend it down with just enough of the liquid to get the texture I want. So good.
I love how I can tell that you’re teaching yourself all of this stuff and getting to a point where you’re capable of teaching others. I was always taught “if you want to see if you know what you’re talking about, try to explain a concept to someone who has no context”
Thanks for the video! The beets are super carbonated because they contain a lot of sugar, though, not more lactobacteria. It’s wild yeast breaking down the sugars into CO2 and alcohol. If you want it less bubbly/alcoholic you can cut the beets into bigger chunks to avoid that.
I loveeee your cadence and how you structure useful information!! Subscribed.
This is a MUCH better and thorough introduction to lacto-fermentation than Joshua Weissman's video on the subject. Thanks Ethan!
You can give credit without dragging down others
I don’t even like weissman at all but this is just unnecessary
Awesome video. The end parts about botulism and mold was exactly what I was hoping to learn!
Glad to hear it!
I agree, he definitely didn't botch that segment!
We make a saurkraut like version but with mustard greens :) really into lacto ferments, and this guide is great for beginners
Mustard greens is a great idea! My next project.
I usually do 1.5% brine without weighing vegetables. The reason is I usually add more brine than just to cover vegetation for the purpose of drinking the brine. I like that fermented brine so much so I lower the salt content so it's not too salty. My ferments were all successful so far. Try with beetroot for example. For 1kg of beetroot go for 2 liters of brine 1.5%. Stick it in a cool place with an airlock. Cool environment will cause it to slowly bring out the beets goodness into the brine and slightly carbonizes it. It's delicious to drink and I use brine and beets to make Ukrainian borscht.
I want the juice for drinking too but add water to the solution when I'm ready to drink it. It's interesting that you use so little salt but aren't having a mold problem. Maybe it's because your doing beets and they are less prone to mold than cukes? Do you ferment at room temperature?
@@dreamingrightnow1174 it's a popular misconception that there's a minimum salt requirement of 2%. 1.5% is only 0.5 less. Salt is there not to prevent mold but to promote lactobacillus bacteria and inhibit others. I do the same with cucumbers, cabbage and tomatoes. They all make delicious kvass. And yes, room temperature.
To all you use fresh horseradish. It's make veggies to stay crispy. Dill help to. Dill flowers.
Ethan- Perhaps you could do one on pickling with Soy Sauce (instead of salt) which adds a nice umami. I've had some daikon pickled this way at a Korean restaurant and it was the best pickle ever. I also was curious what your thought are on adding some vinegar right from the git-go, like when you pickle red onions - kinda give the ferment a head-start on the sour, and keep the Butolism at bay.
If you're like me and didn't know what Noma is: Noma is a fancy restaurant in Denmark where the foods are all fermented. Ethan didn't explain what it was in his video, which maybe tells me I'm not his target audience as a novice chef haha.
finally someone who knows how to measure the brine the right way👍
But is that the correct way? I know a few people claim that is the correct way, but coming from a scientific perspective, I debate that claim. Let me explain why...
Say you are doing one jar of a dense heavy veggie like carrot and another jar of a loose light veggie like cauliflower or cabbage. The dense veggie would use much less water than the loose veggie, so, if doing 2% salt by total weight, each jar will end up being wildly different salt percentages of the solution. The heavy veggies, which use less water, will end up being maybe 4% brine solution, while the loose veggies might be 0.5%. Does that sound like the “correct” way?
I actually don’t know... you could argue that the salt fully penetrates the veggies once the ferment is done and becomes homogenous throughout the brine and veggies. But does the salt fully penetrate the veggies and become homogenous? Also... different veggies have a different water content. So... I think it is debatable and there actually is no correct way. Each veggie requires its own way.
Makes zero sense to include the veggies, it’s just more bro science
James Ball I’m not saying you are right or wrong, but don’t be so sure. The only way to really know is through experimentation. For example, do one jar of dense veggie (carrot) and another of loose veggie (cauliflower) using the total weight to calculate the salt percentage. Again... the loose veggies would require much more water and therefore would have a much lower salinity at the beginning of the ferment. However, MAYBE, at the end of the ferment, both have reached the same salinity through osmosis. If that does in fact happen, then using total weigh probably is the more “correct” way. I’m sure experiments have been done on this and I would like to see the data.
I like how a fly flew by just as you were saying that you don't have to sterilize the jars (6:42).
I'm so glad you mentioned pH and botulinum.
This is really cool. I follow several cooking channels and like your channel a lot!
Thank you and keep up the nice work!
I'm glad you enjoy the content, much appreciated!
Another method for those doing things that do not need a brine, Such as moisture rich things like fruits,tomatoes,etc is to add the veggie/fruit to a vacuum seal bag with the proper amount of salt and Vacuum seal it. Works Amazing for moisture rich because you start with very little if any oxygen in the bag.
I find it absolutely critical to keep those vegetable covered with brine to keep the mold away. I ferment often, so I have invested in glass weights made for this purpose. They are very helpful.
Thanks dude, just made my first batch!
Well done, E! I have been watching quite a few fermentation vids lately and yours is the most straight-forward, easy to follow out there. Thanks!
John G Thanks John, making it straight forward was my goal of this video, looks like that was achieved!
Markiplier E
This guy is good and he told me more than any of the other videos I watched. (especially as far as explaining mold and Botulism).
OH MY! I was recently gifted with the Noma Guide ! I have gotten pretty good at making my own version of KimChi, and now I want to try more. Your video has given me a little more confidence to try something new again ! Thanks !!
Glad to hear it, I need to make a batch of kimchi, it's been over a year since my last one!
If you use a zip lock bag to weigh down your veg, fill the bag with a 2% saline solution in the event there is a leak🍻
Good idea! You can also get rid of weights altogether though, a good advice I heard was to fill up the glass, turn it on its head for about an hour and then turn it back. Check daily if everything is covered with a thin layer of brine, but that's really it! Weights ould introduce harmful bacteria
I just want to say thank you for producing this video. Because of you I have had fresh vegetables through the winter months. I keep coming back to this video because it is so informative. Thank you for inspiring my own YT channel. I will be back for more!
You’re welcome, glad to hear this video was helpful!
Great video. I just did green beans. I did a traditional pickle and water bath canned them. I also did a lactoferment of some. I will see which ones I think taste better.
Ooh, I just thought of a ferment you might LOVE, E! Fermented salsa! There are two methods- fermenting veg whole, or blitzing everything and then fermenting, which is my preferred method. I pulse tomatoes (or tomatillos!), onion, garlic, peppers, cilantro, parsley, and oregano in a food processor. I strain it slightly so it’s not too liquid, and then salt generously to taste. Place into fermenting jar with a loose- fitting lid. This is a quick (~4-day) ferment, but you’ll have to stir it vigorously at least once a day to keep mold from forming. I use that opportunity to taste it each day (no double dipping!😂) until it’s as fermented as I like. I was SHOCKED the first time I did it- it is almost more delicious than I can stand! I hope you’ll try it! And fermented red onion may just replace vinegar-pickled onion for your tacos!
Happy fermenting, my friend!
Looks like I have an afternoon project. I have tomatillos I'm gonna try this with! Thanks for the suggestion. Have you used the air locking fermentation lids for these? I think I'll try them on this.
Cook with E , no, I’ve not used the airlocking lids for salsa because I always blitz mine first as opposed to fermenting whole veg. Because I do it this way I have to open the jar each day to stir vigorously. I think you’re going to love it! The tomatoes get a little wine-y tasting- such a deep, perfect flavor! I’d be very interested to see how the tomatillos taste!
@@allygirl641 I went for the whole veg method because I wanted to try out the airlock lids. I used purple tomatillos, habanero, onion, and cilantro. Excited to see how it turns out!
Cook with E SO AWESOME!!!
“Carbonated pickle water with live culture” will be on sale at Whole Foods for 12.95 a pint.
It's always a good idea to have some canning weights at hand if you do canning!
Spot on, canning weights are another great way to keep the veg below the surface!
Using a plastic bag of water as a weight/lid is a good thing to do, but it is better if it is filled with brine so a leak will not dilute your ferment.
I think of the fermentation crocks that my grandparents used, and I know that people are way too concerned about mold growth.
Fermentation was done in open crocks until the era of refrigeration and grocery store canned goods arrived. Things like cabbage, green beans, and cucumbers were placed in a crock, covered with brine, then a dishtowel, then a clean board, and weighed down with a clean rock. The top of the crock was covered with a cloth to keep flies out.
When you opened it, of course it had mold growth on top, which was scooped off and thrown out. The ferment underneath was just fine.
Today when I see all the expensive ways people use to keep oxygen out of the ferment vessel, I wonder if they are missing tan important point of home food preservation; good food at an affordable price.
I like to use a small crock with a water lip seal for my larger ferments, and fido jars for my smaller ones. I source them at estate sales, yard sales, and such.
Dude! Great video. Love the science.
Just bought Nora's Guide TF and was going to start with shoyu, but saw your video, it's fall, farmer's markets are full - pickles! Thanks
- - - -tare, pronounced tear (like ripping, not crying)
My only experience with lactofermentation came when I was doing a lot with hot peppers a few years ago. I was also making yogurt regularly at the time, discovered references to LF, and on a whim, added some whey from the yogurt to a few jars of peppers+spices in ACV. I did get some foam, but it was restrained, mostly bubbly clusters edging the chopped pieces, one of which was my first attempt at pickling…. Things blew up long after that, and the experiments went off-course, but the pickles (and the sauce made from the sauce batches) turned out fine and flavorful; I was concerned that the veggies would lose all their structural integrity, bu they did not. They are not *crisp*…and overall, the flavors of the garlic/peppers/onions are generally softer, less sharp, less penetrating, while the spices are much more forward than identical batches without the added whey.
Really enjoying your vids, Ethan…I like your approach, you are introducing me to foods and styles I’ve known nothing about: very exciting, actually. I think I’ll camp out with my coffee and your channel tomorrow. BTW, I envy your kitchen….
Giardiniera: not sure what pepper you used, but I found I need 1lb serrano peppers per half-gallon to hit the right heat level for chicago style
FYI, 1:49 "tare" is a native English word pronounced exactly like what you'd expect for an English word, i.e., the same as "tear". It's only pronounced ta-re when referring to the Japanese sauce.
"Several months" in the fridge, as if they're going to be around that long 😄 my partner made a jar of pickles for a workmate. They lasted one evening!
Great video! I liked how it was succinct yet informative.
What you really want is a gartopf (sauerkraut fermenting crock) so that you can make a larger batch with less effort.
I make probiotic yogurt which is also a lacto fermented product. Tastes really alive.
Amazing video. I ate a burger at Noma last summer and I’ve been trying to copy it since. This adds so much to the recipe.
Can you do a pickles only vid? Like burger pickles, sweet, dill. Love ur vids x
Cucumbers?
@@rouxsauced200 cucumbers aren't pickles, cucumbers are what pickles are before they are pickles.
You can always kick start your fermentation with a little bit of lactic acid, lactose and live lacto culture. All available on Amazon, or at cheese-making and homebrew suppliers. Calcium chloride helps keep the pickles crunchy as well, but you have to give it time to work by putting the pickles in the fridge for a couple days before setting it out at room temp to start fermenting. Otherwise the acid will neutralize the calcium before it has a chance to firm up the veggies.
I keep a batch of young sauerkraut on hand and add a bit to new ferments to kickstart the fermentation.
Been trying to find some info to make giardiniera, this helped out more than you know!
You are more likely to get botulism from improperly home canned meat and low-acid vegetables, such as peas, carrots, green beans, mushrooms, potatoes etc, Tomatoes, jams and jellies, and pickles are high-acid, and safe from botulism.
Let‘s wait and see. Great tips, thanks!
I thought Lactobacillus transformed sugar into lactic acid, not acetic acid.
@3:25
Noice, adding that lid for extra plastics :D
I love mixing the Kahm with the fermented foods and eat them.
Thank You for your excellent showing
Love that you’re repurposing that plastic lid,
Beats are high sugar...good food for the lactobacillus
Thank you, very nice but it is easier to put 30 gr of natural grey salt for one liter of filtered water. The smell of the food is the best indicator if the ferment has worked.
You can always shake your jar if there’s vegetables over the water, just to keep everything wet
The trick to removing kahm yeast isn't to skim it off, rather, put the jar in the sink or in a large bowl and gently pour more brine into the jar. It'll overflow, taking all the kahm yeast out with it. Super simple.
How you get that extra brine tho? Won't you be doing this many days after making your ferment?
@@luccaharaway3973 Make a little extra and reserve it in a separate jar.
in Poland, my mother and my grandmothet used to add 15 g salt for 1 l wather, thats 1.5% salt. I thinks it's better, less salty. And spices..... horseradish, (why you don't use horseradish?, it's basic), currant leaf or grape leaf, garic and a lot of fennel
Horseradish cucumbers sound great, gonna try that
@@adamthemute yes you should. If u can pick horseradish leafs to. They taste amazing. You can make rice and meat rolls with them after they ferment about a 3 weeks. Tey will be very soft. It's similar to Greek or French fermented wine grape leafs.
My mother use one or two leafs of oak or walnut leafs for taste. Also I don't know why but ok leafs always help to vegiies be very crunchy.
Great video. Thanks!
If you weigh the vegetables w/the water you're using that's FAR from a true two percent brine. It would be a much higher percentage. Also eighty plus degrees is going to REALLY speed the process! Should be between 65-75 degrees! That said, great video, good info for starters! 👍✌️♥️
Good informative video, thanks.
you coupd also add a layer of olive oil to protect submerged veggies….
as for C.Boutulum , is alcohol a protector from it when it comes to making vinegar?
Just buy a lid with an airlock. It'll keep air and bacteria from coming in, and let gases out. It's what I use for my homemade wines.
If you want to ferment for longer keep, do it in much more salt and do not cut the cucumber. Also add salary for interesting flavour
For the variety of information:
czcams.com/video/ATntUZvepQ0/video.html
I purchased a fermentation kit, glass weights etc. Pickles were soft and rubbery after 4 days. Inedible. I used pure salt, bottled water. Pickle juice was also cloudy. What do you think went wrong?
You need tannins to keep the pickles (cucumbers) from getting "hollow" or rubbery. Try adding grape leaves or oak leaves at the top of the jar to add some tannins. Or you can brine the pickles overnight and do the traditional canning method (processing), but that won't be a lacto-fermentation.
If you fill your bag with 2% salt brine, there are no worries if your weight bag tears.
It's the perfect solution....regarding solution😎
I've never heard anyone say tar-AY instead of tare. Have I been saying it wrong all these years? Are we starting a new trend? Anyway, thanks for the vid! :)
it's likely the first time he's seen the word "tare" was for ramen broth seasoning which is pronounced that way. i did not know tare weight was pronounced differently until i read your comment
Pretty sure tare is pronounced the same as tearing a piece of paper like you are saying.
It is
^ ditto
That scale makes the process so much easier.
I use the percentage mode and add salt directly until I have the desired %.
Then I cap and shake until all the salt dissolves.
It really does!
I pickle with my used pickle juice all my vegs.
Could you clarify the math for a 2% solution? Is it weight of the veg and water x .02 or divided by .98- the original weight? It won’t matter for smaller weights but could on large batches or higher brine concentrations.
E.g. method one = 100g of veg and water plus 2g of salt (1.96% salt)
Method 2= 98 g of veg and water plus 2g of salt (true 2% salt by weight)
Whoopsie. My pickles were on desk for additional days from planned and probably had that yeast instead of mold, but I threw them away before seeing this.
I would be concerned about using anything made of plastic to weigh down the veggies. Especially a ziplock bag because the material is so thin. The acidic environment would cause plastic to break down and leech chemicals into the brine.
It doesn't, first off a zip bag is food grade, second acid will not attack plastic. No worries it will be fine. If your concerned about getting a puncture in a bag just fill them with brine and it will not dilute.
Love the video.
Way overcomplicated the brine solution measurement in my opinion.
In Europe the default jar is 720 mL. Lets say you fill it up completely.
Veggies are basically water. For a 2% solution just do 14.4 grams (720 x 2%) of salt which you can throw inside the jar whenever. Then pour water/vinegar mix over everything.
Did Ethan mention to use salt without additives? I think he did.
Can I use honey and vinegar instead the salt water? And one thing is I wanted to eating it the next day and also I put it in the fridge after preparing.
I'm just watching the different fermentation methods, but I have a question: is this different than the "cook you brine" method?
If so, what's the difference?
What I mean with "cook your brine": boil part water and vinegar, sugar and salt. With lacto fermentation you are not using vinegar, so I'm just confused as if with only water and salt you could get the same results.
thanks
Thank u for guide
I never do the 2% part, I just iball the salt and never had any problem.
nice video thank you
Hey i am tryingthe cucumber fermentation.. And there is no carbonation (bubble) formation after 6th day.. Is that ok.. Can i eat that kind of fermented (no bubble) pickles?
I usually slightly cook the garlic otherwise you get out of control fermenting for some reason
Thanks for your excellent video. Can I use the same method for fermenting walnuts? Do you have to use green one?
I not making anymore after finishing my lot because it sits in my fridge getting stinkier and the funky odor makes me sneeze. I'll stick with fresh vegetables. It is healthy enough for me to eat soygurt and miso.
Don't forget to taste often
Green tomato fermentation pleaseee
a little late but here is my question, if i use a jar with an airlock i still have to make sure the solids are below the liquid level
Hey Ethan! Thanks for the great breakdown. Was just wondering if sauerkraut is the same 2% salt brine or is it different? I understand we have to pre-salt the cabbage to draw out excess water but just wondering if the brine is the same when we actually pickle the cabbage?
Dry salting would be a different process.
Adding 2% salt to the shredded cabbage, rubbing vigorously and tampining down into the jars or crocks will result in a 2% solution on its own. If for some reason your liquid drops below the cabbage you can add a 2% solution. That's why the zip lock bag on top is so helpful. Filled with 2% salt solution works so well in case of a leak. I've had it happen but only once. Just check daily, tamping down if necessary.
Awesome!
What about beets, should you just rub off the dirt under water with your hands? I do buy all organic and they don’t seem to always be that dirty. Thank you 🙏🏼💜🇨🇦
Why would the jars (unless particularly dirty) have more bad bacteria than the vegetables and not be killed off by the brine?
Doesn’t using plastic weights risk chemicals leaching into the liquid because the acid dissolves it?
Hi! I used this method to make brine and mine are too salty. I measured PH and the fermentation should be over but it’s still salty.
Videos kinda old but maybe someone will see this. First time pickling, Im about ready to try them. I noticed one of the jars had what LOOKED like mold forming on like day 2 of fermenting and I isolated it. But I checked it again 2 days later and it disappeared. I held on to it because I wanted to see how it spread to better identify. Now Ive dealt with mold problems before as I used to grow my own mushrooms and Ive never seen a mold colony just disappear! How sure can I be that it was this kahm yeast instead?
When you move to the fridge do you need to keep the vegetables below the water line? The veggies start floating as I eat them.
can I use Iodised salt for fermentation?
btw thanks for these videos Joshua Weismann and you are my favorite channel on this subject!
Nope
Iodine will kill the LAB. Get a good kosher or sea salt with no iodine. Salt with yellow prussiate is safe to ferment with.
Just to be sure, you calculate the 2% on both the weight of the vegetables and water? Or just one or the other?
Can you move a cucumber ferment that you started in the fridge out to room temp?
Last time i was told to use table sugar too.. Is that correct? And can I use pink salt instead?
Should the 2.5% brine be related to the weight of: only the food, only the water or both of them?
I think it's both.
To keep air from contacting the water and whatnot, why not use olive oil? Pour enough olive oil to make a layer sufficient enough to separate residual air from the water and food. Mold can't grow on olive oil.
higher chance of botulism
@@kross2490 Why?
For a beginner who might want to do a variety of fermenting would the Noma Guide book be the best?
I would highly recommend it!
👍
Sandor Katz has two great books 1) wild fermentation 2)the art of fermentation. both are full of amazing recipes, science and the history and geography behind certain ferments !
The Noma is terrible get something useful