BSA Non-Return Valve Seat Grind
Vložit
- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- UPDATE - WARNING - the grinding approach that I used in this video is NOT RECOMMENDED.
Please see the comment from Martin Allan that highlights the dangers. He's right, I'm sure.
___________________________________________________________________________________________
I measured my BSA B50's wet sumping rate at 6ml / day. In attempting to cure this I ended up regrinding the ball bearing seat. Time will tell how effective this has been. . . .
Jump to:-
01:44 Chop stick
03:09 Chop stick + polish
03:53 Re-seating ball
05:39 Grinding with grinding paste
[L]
NEVER, NEVER use grinding paste on alloy seat as suggested here. The paste is likely to embed into the alloy and destroy the next ball used in the valve, cause excessive wear thus destroy the seat. If grit dies get into the engine (No matter how careful you are cleaning it after) It could cause untold problems especially destroying the engine. Best to just use the old ball to clout the seat a few times as he originally did. I also liked the idea of the Bamboo (or other really hardwood) used to smooth the seat. I have reamed a ball valve seat with an old HSS drill ground shallow by twiddling it with fingers like valve seat cutting, PLEASE DON'T USE GRINDING PASTE INSIDE ENGINES. IT CAN DESTROY AN OIL PUMP VERY QUICKLY!
Thanks for this. Thinking about it you are, of course, right. Particles of silicone carbide could become embedded in the aluminium and any that escape elsewhere would be even worse. The corroded pits on my ball valve seat were too deep for the normal 'sharp tap' technique but I should have used a modified drill to gently scrape the surface back to a clean homogenous surface. I'll put a warning in the video description text
Hi, l finished my B50 Victor about 4 months ago having to open up the engine due to a gearbox issue, l also fitted the alloy sump with drain plug and the return line filter mod and electronic ignition at the same time similar to your videos. Tried to start it at the weekend after being stood for the few months over winter, very hard and sluggish to kick over, so l checked the crankcase for oil and she has wet sumped about 2 litres. I have been told that the wet sumping is a worn oil pump, however looking at your video the check valve (ball bearing and spring) could be the issue. I have just orders the 2 items but would like to ask if you have had any wet sumping issues since your valve seat re-grinding. Kind regards, Brian
There should be two check valves. The one I re-seated on the pressure feed side of the pump and another on the input to the scavenge side. I haven't done anything with the scavenge side valve - in fact I'm not even sure where it is. According to Rupert Ratio and the parts book there should be a valve on the bottom end of the scavenge suction tube. My bike doesn't have a valve there at all, so I can only think it must be behind the oil pump somewhere(?). I've not had cause to take the oil pump off yet, so can't be sure. Fortunately, sorting out the feed side check valve has improved my wet-sumping problem. I've never left it for more than a about a month but it's OK so far. So, if you do have a check valve on your sump pick-up tube, you may find that you need to sort that one out as well as the one in the timing cover (i.e. the one in my video). All the best :)
@@Greeves Hi, Thank you for the prompt response, on the return side l do have a ball that drops down under gravity in the pick up (suction pipe) this is inside the aluminium tube which l had to shorten and cut on an angle as per your other video. I am happy about the return side as the return pipe work to the OIF tank is above the max oil level in the tank, so in theory only the oil that’s left in the return pipe work can run back which is not enough to cause an issue. The only other thing on the return pipe work is the filter, again it’s the same unit you have fitted in one of your videos, l had a close look at the filter housing head and there are no check valves inside, however if you look at the cartridge filter (if it’s the same make as yours) it has a thin rubber flap over the inlet holes which should stop any oil running back. Saying that; l have mounted my filter in the same orientation as yours albeit from the bracket between the frame and bottom mudguard mount so, if there is any back leakage it will be less than half the capacity of the oil filter which such a small quantity should not be an issue. l have a nylon rod which l will use for lapping, again as per your video l will grind a flat on the old ball and hot glue gun it to the nylon rod. Again many thanks for the info and videos. Regards Brian
@@TheCADengineer Of course! I stupidly hadn't realised that my oil return being above the max oil level means that back flow can only be what's in the pipework & filter! So thanks for pointing this out. I'll bet this is why BSA deleted the pick up tube ball valve - even though there's a part number for it in the B50 parts book. A shame that Rupert Ratio doesn't mention it either. Out of curiosity, I'll have another look on B50.org to see if there's any mention there.
Before I re-seated my ball valve I did remove the sump plug and let oil drip for several days into a measuring cup. It was April, so the weather was relatively warm. The flow was steady at just over 6ml / day. Repeating this test since playing with the valve the flow was virtually zero, once the initial flow had stopped. I'm going to try this again and see if I can deduce how much of the filter & return pipework contents end up back in the sump after a run. I guess it will take a few days for the oil to get past the filter cartridge 'flap' and the oil pump but it probably mostly gets there eventually - we'll see.
@@Greeves Hi, Now l have the alloy sump fitted with the drain plug l will also be able to measure and evaluate any perpetual leakage over time. I have recently purchased a B25 (1969 not OIF version) On initial strip down of the engine it looked like the whole of the oil tank contents was in the engine, however the last time the engine ran was 2013 according to the previous owner so it was to expected. The seat on the check valve on the B25 is very poorly pitted and have been looking for a good second hand inner timing case, l am now on plan B and will be turning up a new valve seat threaded plug in mild steel where l will drill out the old seat from the back, then thread the hole and screw in the new steel seat plug loctite in place. If l am happy with the modification it will be something l will do on the B50. Regarding the feed and return steel pipes under the engine on My B50; the pipes were badly damaged by previous trials riding without any bash plate, so l made new steel treaded pipes from the crankcase that go to 3/8” compression fittings and then to copper pipe work with just a short run in rubber to absorb any vibration. This would make it very easy to fit and isolation valve in the feed line, however this would only be the very last resort if the lapping or new steel seat dose not solve the issue, as there is always a chance of forgetting to turn it on one day. I have ruled out fitting one of the after market anti wet sumping valves, fitting such a device on the suction side of a gravity fed pump can only add to a restriction in flow and may cause cavitation on an already marginal lubrication system. If they were any good BSA/Triumph would have had them at the factory. New ball and spring should arrive today from Draganfly. Regards, Brian
@@TheCADengineer I like the sound of the steel valve seat. I wish I had a lathe but don't have the space, or ££ for a reasonable one. Like you, I've dismissed the option of one of those in-line anti-wet sumping valves. Having taken one apart they're pretty crude and, as you say, must add resistance to flow & another potential failure point. I've also considered a proper on-off tap but also dismissed it for the same reason as you. There used to be an (american?) supplier of taps that had an electrical switch incorporated. This could be wired into the ignition, in a fail-safe way, that prevented starting without the tap being open - see czcams.com/video/UZDliLSCYAw/video.html They don't seem to be available any more, though it wouldn't be too hard to DIY one. Best option, I suppose, is to have the BSA set up working correctly, which mine seems to be - for now at least :)