500 Series Bus Compressor Shootout - KMR Demo Room
Vložit
- čas přidán 18. 11. 2020
- In this shootout we compare five of our most popular 500 Series bus compressors. No talking, just audio so you can make up your own mind.
Check out our full range of 500 Series dynamics processors:
www.kmraudio.com/products/500... - Hudba
![If you can't hear this then you're not an audiophile [See description for link to followup video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/48PxwspDvrE/mqdefault.jpg)
![If you can't hear this then you're not an audiophile [See description for link to followup video]](/img/tr.png)
I like the Shadow Hills most in this shootout. By quite a lot!
No SSL G comp? I wish it had been included. Great video though. I like the CL1 and Shadow Hills best.
Really good shootout, thanks! I'm biased as I use the C1LA daily as my goto bus compressor, but I think it feels best out of the bunch for this mix - I think it's the most modern and polished sounding. The Shadow Hills and Retro both have some added richness/mojo, but also feel a little lethargic for this tune. The 527 was really appealing, lots of attitude! And RND felt a little uninspired to me, like it looses a bit of the top end in a way I don't care for. Good units all around! -James
That Doublewide 2 just has the vibe to my ears.
API gave the best finish all around. The RND 535 provided the best separation.
My fav is the Vandergraph. It sounds the tightest and has a very thick character, really glued and chunky. I think I'm a get tone!
Great Video thank you !
Shadow Hills did it for me on this shootout. I'm thinking I'll pick it up for drum bus duties.
0:13 shadow hills
0:40 retro doublewide
1:04 smart research
1:29 rupert neve 535
1:53 api 527
Thanks for clearing this up Thiago!
Shadow First. Neve Second. They just sound fuller warmer and damn near gives it a mastered sound.
Smart Research!
The API did a nice thing at the end
Great way to do a comparison video. Didn't like the API on this - snare seemed to snap too much and the Neve didn't seem to do it for me on this. The Smart was best for a modern sound I think and either the Retro or Shadow Hills for a more vintage feel which I preferred on this track - and in general. All great in their own way I guess so would happily add any of those to my rack but think the API and Neve would be better for drum bus.
I’ve got those Api & RND Pairs need that SR C1LA
shadow hills wins by a large margin. it sounds more mature, more refined, more artistic than the others.
The Vandy has a certain depth, space, and texture it adds... I just got one ;)
Shadow Hills!
Shadow hills was in a league of its own, retro came home second
For me the Neves win.
But are you sure of the settings on the API? I usually like API stuff but here was just bad...
Same. I’ve never heard any of these, and I preferred the RND 535, but the api sounded a bit gritty, and was pumping. It really stood out. First thing I wondered was how close all of these are to “matched”, as much as that’s possible, or if the coloration is inherent.
Neve, Retro, Shadow Hills, Smart Research, API, in that order. The API introduced a lot of punch to the point that I'd have to use some parallel compression to let some life into the dry/wet balance. The Smart Research lets a lot of the transients pass through, very clean I'd say. Neve, Retro, SH were the most suitable for this.
1. Shadow Hills
2. Neve
Agreed!
So would i need two of Retro double wide compressors on the master bus to process the in stereo?
Yes, that's correct - Doublewide is a single-channel processor. There's a Link function to run in stereo when using two units.
hey man, I'm wondering if I can use 2 mono units to process a stereo signal? (like api 527 and neve 535 in the video)
Of course you can. Just split the stereo signal into 2 mono. Process it. Then turn it back into stereo either through y splitter cable or through some stereo splitter unit.
@@INeedsMoneys actually I don't understand how can a mono unit process the signal of side channel..
@@INeedsMoneys if i would like to do the M/S processing
@@anthonywhang9951 aaah, well... I'm not sure about doing mid/side processing on mono units. Perhaps if you split the signal on another unit specifically made for mid/side processing then route the mid to one mono unit and the side to another mono unit then route it back to the mid/side splitting unit. It should work. It's like going back and forth from stereo to mono back to stereo.
@@anthonywhang9951 i was more talking about splitting left and right. Not mid/side, you know. But either way should work. I believe.
the shadow hills has that nice BUMP with rounded bottom end, but the c1LA has a totally clean, transparent sound to it.
everything else, on this particular piece anyway, didn't appear too remarkable for me. the changes were too subtle to even mention.
Good comparison regarding level match. I hope to get more of these videos. While Retro, Shadow Hills, 535 did nothing to the sound, the best and #1 for me are the two API527 on the transients. #2 is the SSL from Smart Research. These both have Punch and are giving the sound something. The rest is just boring and does nothing. I'm shocked. I heard on ATH r70x Headphones.
listen to the sustain of the kick and, especially, snare on the shadow hills vs the others. No way to say the shadow hills is doing nothing.
I was leanig towrad the shadowhills but the 535 did it for me.... had the vibe with adding too much thickness
listening there is more vibe from the shadowhills still and I would just tame other things to keep that vibe
@@TheSakuraGumiLTD Did you wind up picking one up? I have the SH but I’m thinking about picking up the 535 for its transparency and precision sound.
The SH has vibe but I don’t like how it pushes snares back in the mix. The darkness grated on me from mixing through it daily. After a while I just stopped using it and going back to it recently has made me think about switching to something else.
@Will Lewis no I didn’t... but ended up leaning towards the shadow hills in the end after some more critical listening.
Although in reality the SSL bus compressor is a far more universal so the shadow hills would be an an addition to that and used less.
I’m running by theory mainly because CZcams tests and quick hands on tests don’t really have the same reflection as using something for a couple months on a bunch of different projects.
Luckily, all work well and it’s how you use it that makes all the difference.
So I never worry too much about a buy.
The 535 would sit right between the two in sound and would fit some material better.
The SSL bus compressor would be the most universal and easily set mixes ready for mastering where that final bit of tone over the mix could be added by a good mastering engineer.
It’s quite a bit more affordable to pay for a fully kitted mastering engineer than a fully kitted mixing engineer.
So for me it’s function first then secret sauce later.
I’ll probably end up getting a SSL type clone and the shadow hills but then that decision will probably change 50 times before then.
Audio gear is like deciding every single part of your car and for that decision to make and break your professional career... but most of all, in the end of the day... it’s mainly how you drive
@@TheSakuraGumiLTD Loved your reply, lotta gold in there.
My main objective is my career path and I often dwell on “does X actually improve the trajectory of my career?” I spent my night after writing you dwelling on this very idea.
With that, I too came back around to the SSL (clone). It is what we hear when we think mainstream release. (I’m actually really digging the official SSL G Comp 500 after further YT listening.)
The SH, as much as I love it, is a vibe much unto its own, so my career path can take it or leave it. I knew soon as this video started that it was the SH because what it does to snares and it’s “darkness” is ingrained in my head.
The 535, is my personal favorite out of this line up but it doesn’t seem to give me a “feeling” as much as it is a utility. So again my career can take it or leave it. (They put red/blue silk on every other device, why not these? Lol)
The 527, I actually have one already. This device gives off a decent amount of the character I look for when using a 2500. This is a sound on many records and although my “I don’t love the sound of over compression” brain says “careful, buddy!”, my career says “be mindful, this is a beloved sound by many” Might as well buy another 527 and give it a go on the right material.
I had a Rosetta 800 and sold it for a Symphony64 IO. Although the IO is “cleaner” the Rosetta has that “it” sound because Rosettas (especially the 200) have been used on countless records, it’s ingrained in us.
That’s how I’m approaching my master buss comp. What gives the “it” sound? And in this videos lineup I have to say that goes to the SSL.
At least that’s my train of thought at this moment. Subject to change. ;) And as you said, it’s how you use what you got. I just know I’m not using my SH much any more so it’s doing nothing for my career but being a dormant asset.
@Will Lewis I’m finding the best option is to have a very good relationship with a good dealer... vintage king seems to be the best with that and you can test things for a while and switch... I’m thinking a actual SSL and maybe another later... it’s the issue putting so much time into research... I can bla bla bla all day about the theory hoping I make the right choice.... so what is popular with the frequent professionals is a good place to start... the problem is you have to know what I’m mostly going to be working on and I definitely do not know that hahaha... I’m with you on the Red and Blue but I’m going with a couple 542’s in the chain... So the SSL would be enough and the shadow hills might be a bit of shopping therapy when I have therapy shopping money... and buy it from where I can return it if I doesn’t become as useful as I need... this is the next day and my choices have changed again... the truth is, I’m going to be unhappy with any and will also miss any I don’t choose... these are objects so there’s not enough stigma on being shallow with the choices hahaha Drawmer make a bunch of things that are frigging useful with more uses than the rest... just not as much of a sure choice for the mix bus if you have the money... then I’m still liking the middle ground with the 543’s... but the SSL bus compressor with a pair of 542’s should fulfils nearly every I want... and with the 542’s I’ve also got a tone of control which would make the setup fit nearly everything with other devices just being micro shades of colour in difference... I’m almost set of a cranborne 500 summer with the SSL SiX channels in it for the buses to bus processing... recording also... Drawmer being the extra bits of out board to the analog mixing... and Kush Clariphonic and Electra in mix and master... SSL Ultraviolet and the OnTheMoon SPACECRAFT unit and this could change again... there’s a few other things but this is what I’ve decided as the meat of the analog domaine... not including gates, effects and things like the SPL TDX, which is great for drum buses with its Dry/Wet knob... I have the time to comment like this because I’m sat in the worlds of hope... I’m starting again from square one and soon, once I start again I will be documenting my journey... I will be starting with £500 (not including computer) to begin the journey and have a few chucks of money coming to make the up grades and feel it would be good for people starting to see what you can achieve with very little and what these big prices actually add once you have the skill... there is a hell of a lot you can do in the box and this will be the first part... for me analog isn’t worth it until you can start of with a Chuck as well as converters that do the equipment justice also... first chuck for that is a minimum of £10,000... the rest will need to be reached through profit and I hope to document this... my setup I spoke of is actually around £70,000 with also added recording processing and equipment and is a long way off... although research can make a million changing decisions the key factors of how you use it become more obvious through research and no longer does a small budget seem so bad... I’m start from scratch again but have a lot of knowledge... but not that much that I ever stop learning... so the never ending learning process is a important one to watch also... I myself got my inspiration from this from seeing this from well known professionals doing this idea themselves... It’s also a good way to have a voice in the world of music as a producer and recording, mix and mastering engineer... it also makes the hobby stage more productive and opens way more doors... I’m actually glad to be in the position to start again because it gives more purpose to this idea and when I review cheaper things I will be giving a reflection as someone that isn’t currently spoiled by every else... I remember in my creation days the amount of bad choices I made because people left out key information about a product that can really mess with a work flow... so I will come with all directions of purpose with each upgrade that comes and I have no problem being completely honest... the only channels I like are those who are completely honest
Of these I would most like to own the Vandergraph. The 2.5:1 and 4:1 ratios both have 500ms release time which I doubt I would use very often, especially not on busses. That's just my taste. I really dig the sound on the other ratios with their faster release times. And I would least like to own the 527s. Feels blasphemous to say--because I love compression so much--but I really dislike the punch they're adding! Feels jerky and unnatural. Does not seem like those models have a ton of range. God bless API and forgive me my sins, amen father and hail mary 2x. Great shootout. Thanks, KMR!
Lol 😆 i couldn't agree more
Shadow hills and api...
Shadow Hill 1st and Neve a close 2nd......the rest...ok
Slamming the Retro Doublewides isn’t where their best tone is, IMO. Looks like it was hitting -17, which is way too hard for that box.. Using mine every day, I tend to never go over -10 when compressing anything with them, as that seems to be where the sweet spot is. I also prefer the Doublewides 1st gen with more tubes for color, personally. Having them working independently also changes the mojo from linked. I did my own shoot out and went with the Wes Audio Dione as my buss comp. mainly for the recall, what I felt was the most consistent glue and the flexibility of it handling many different genres of music. I do own Neve 543’s and 535’s in pairs as well as Great River 501’s, an Xpressor, a Alta Moda Hippo, CAPI 526’s, Empress 519’s and a stereo pair of Doublewides, too. So, there’s always options to grab if I don’t like what’s happening at the moment.
Thanks for the reply. We usually push the settings a touch on these demos so it's clear what the difference between the units is ;-)
I have the same pair of Doublewides. How do you use the link function? I have them on a API500V Lunchbox.
@@isaacpn7 there isn’t a “link function” per se, just matching the input levels and setting them each to match each other. The best way to do it is get a good sound with your ears with your source material and then dime both to a test tone within your DAW that are close to that if you’re needing to be that accurate.
These units are fastidious; you really have to give them what they want, how they want to get what you want from them. I’ve heard demos of the Neve 535 that show what it can do. Here I didn’t hear it so much. 🤷♂️
why not Api 529
That was our first choice but we didn't have a demo unit available at the time! It's 500 Series so it wold be rude not to put in some API - hence the 2x 527's
@@kmraudio Were the 527 pair linked or not ? cheers
2:42
APi messed up the snare.
Shadow Hills sounds huge, neve nice and detailed, API is punchy. Not sure I care for the rest
This is a terrible shootout, sorry. The input level to these compressors are wildly over the top. One who knows analog gear would never gain-stage to this extreme. You're asking for distortion and serious over compression artifacts. I can't imagine anyone using these compressors in such a way. The concept of this shootout is great, but it's terribly misleading as some units will handle this sort of pummeling than others. And just by listening I can tell the gain reduction is in a territory that only the worst case scenario mixes would have, if even that.
Exactly all of them sound bad in this shootout way too much pumping
I dunno, they were all pretty similar, except the API was tooooo much, too grabby and snappy,, . I think i heard the bass guitar come out more with the Neve.. Retro is nice and smooth,, Shadow and Smart both rocked.
Maybe the API on a different setting would work,, its a great smasher and smacker though, definitely useful for certain things.