Porsche 944 and 924S Differences
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- čas přidán 8. 06. 2022
- Hey guys, today we will be looking at some of the similarities and differences between the early US spec 944 and the 924S!
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Porsche 924S porsche 944 comparison differences early 944 late 944 Porsche 924 engine - Auta a dopravní prostředky
Great info! Thanks for clarifying the “European” aspect of the de-tuning. I had read that Porsche detuned the engine on the 1986 924S by about 10hp at launch. Although that was later increased slightly in 1987, all of which was done to justify the additional cost of opting for the 944 over the 924S. The 924S ultimately proved to be faster than the 944 with its new power plant given that the 924S was lighter and performed better in wind tunnel tests over the 944, but the source I reviewed didn’t differentiate between US spec and European spec. Very cool! 👍🏼
The 924S is a better car than early 944. I’ve driven both and own a near concourse 924S. The 924 suspension rides better, the steering feels lighter and quicker and the car feels more lively in general. Basically the 924S feels like a perfected vintage sports car, whereas the 944 feels more contemporary but without the power and thrill contemporary sports cars have.
If you want a 944, get an S2 or Turbo. Otherwise a 924S is better.
So much knowledge. And I really like the 924, my 1977 had manual steering, manual trans, manual windows and doors. That's how I like a sports car, not a lot of luxury car doo dads, just power and handling. Unfortunately that car has only around 100 HP so...
I think the best 924 is an early 944 with manual everything lol.
I have an early 944 that has the engine and turbo out of an '86 swapped into it. Definitely makes a huge difference in performance with a very minor weight penalty.
First of al I would like to say that you are probably one of the most knowledgable people on these cars and your videos are soooo entertaining. I think that 944 needs a timing service. My 1987 Porsche 924s made that knock until warm so I sold it to someone willing to take on the service.
You're correct! It is the timing belt tapping the cover. I just did the timing belt service on it 1,500 miles ago and it is time to snug up the belt... while annoying it won't hurt anything as little as I drive it but I just haven't got around to it yet! Thanks!
Hello, I could not have finished my front engine reseal/water pump/belt job without your awesome videos, THANK YOU!. Would you happen to have anything about how to re-glue the rear hatch glass back on it's upper frame?
Very nice video. Thank you for sharing. The side-by-side comparison and your expertise really makes this video special.
I’ve recently been binge-watching some of your videos, so it’s nice to see you again. Happy Summer!
Thanks! Is there any other comparisons you would like to see? Turbo vs S2 or N/A vs S?
@@edredas My pleasure. Thank you for the offer. Although I like anything 944, I have an early ‘83 with manual steering, so anything centered around my model is extra special. Thanks again and I appreciate you and your content. Take care!
Great video, thank you
Great video thank you 😊
Excellent video. Sadly, I just found an '88 944S in a junkyard, pretty complete still. Grabbed the tach for my '84 944na. Hope to grab the wheels, too, and some other parts.
Bra jobbat, kul även för oss i Sverige.mvh gh i onsala.
That was fun.
Yeah Edredes
Nice comparison. You said the front suspension is the same for both, but the rear on the 924s got the better turbo suspension? You also said that the 944 felt softer, so is it true that because the rear is different, the whole car felt soft? Or is it just that particular 944. I've only driven one 944 and it did feel like it was too soft.
All the early 944’s I’ve driven seem a bit soft compared to the 924S’ that I owned. I think they have the same spring rate… so I’m not entirely sure why that is. Both cars in the video are mine with the same struts and shocks all around on both.
@@edredas with the same suspension but different back spacing on the tyres you're effectively increasing the lever arm acting on the spring so the same spring rate will feel slightly softer on the 944.
Does the 924 have the same delaminating problem with the rear hatch glass?
Thanks for making this video!
Yes, to some degree although it isn’t as common since the 924 uses weaker struts due to the smaller spoiler.
@@edredas thanks! Trying to decide which one to buy, I like both but the 944 looks better but the 924 parts are cheaper…
Good luck with your search! Keep in mind that since this 924 is an S model it has all the same parts as the 944. So there won't be any differences in prices if you get on of those. The original 2.0L 924 has an Audi engine with 110 hp. While the parts for those may be cheaper they can be very hard to find and some are discontinued all together. You won't have this issue with the 924S and 944 since almost every part is available brand new and in abundance. Not to mention the CIS fuel injection, and a lot were not completely galvanized... you might end up spending 10x more trying to save a penny one parts.
what's that thing on the dashboard over the clocks? That seems either like an empty space or a speaker
That’s a speaker grill. The original 924 had a speaker there for a mono radio setup. Later the speakers were moved to the doors but this remained on the dash without a speaker there.
Edredas is it possible to put a 3.0liter engine from the 944S2 in to a 924 S ?I been thinking about this for a long time
Absolutely! I have seen a 3.0L from a 968 swapped into a 924S which is pretty much the same job.
@@edredas thank you very much for taking you time to reply my brother and I we are big fan of you my friend and I was thinking of doing a swap of engine and paint it with bi color and use those beautiful flat dish wheels on those 924 turbo and euro bumpers a big project and dream, too bad you live to far from San Diego, keep you awesome work Edredas thanks again
I have a 3,0 S2 engine in my 82 modell 944 with ITB`s and a stand alone Ecu. Mechanically it`s pretty much a direct swap as long as you have both engines from the start.
An 87 925S came up, is there a big difference in the performance with an 88? It has 140k miles. I probably need to do have the timing belt done. All basic services. Is this going to be an expensive care to have Serviced? I’ve had my 92 GTI 16v since 99, I tend to hold onto my cars :)
I own a few 1987 924S’ and a 1988 924S. If you can find a 1988 model, get it because they are so much fun. However the 1987 model isn’t bad but yes the 1988 is worth the extra effort to find. With that being said, I bought my 1988 924S 2016 and put about $3,000 into it day one. Since then just tires and it’s daily driven. So these cars can be extremely reliable and cheap to own but you got to knock out all the maintenance that they’re behind on. They’re 30+ years old, so a lot needs to be replaced. So buy the one that has the most work done and not the least expensive one. I hope that helps!
👍🏻
How many Can Can red interiors made it to the US? There's one on Bring a Trailer right now and it got me curious about numbers. Thanks in advance.
I'm not sure that there are any figures out there of how many came to the US. I've probably seen several hundred 944's and I don't believe I've ever seen one with can-can interior. I spoke with Elliott at 944 Barn who as probably seen several thousand 944's and he said he's only seen about a dozen. I hope that helps!
@@edredas Yeah that does help. My estimations lead me to believe that less than 50 made it to the states. That one on BaT was mine, it sold for just $6,100. I'm devastated. It's not immaculate but I expected at least 10k. Still, I'm happy I got to own a super rare color combo. Might be 1 of 1 Zermatt Silver Metallic With Can Can red in the states. Anyway, thanks for replying. I'm a long time viewer and I really appreciate all your videos and information.
@@AdaandHaven No reserve?
My 924s (us 87) did have a turbo gasket. Was it stock? It get about 8.4 comp ratio by my measurements. Now at 11to1... milled and thin gasketted. +++ dadada ;) but. Was it stock? Its thick as hell.
Not sure of the date but I believe it was after 1986 when the factory started using the turbo head gaskets on the N/A. So every gasket that comes with most N/A kits also say turbo since they are more durable. However, they aren't noticeably thicker than the older N/A gaskets, so its possible that someone has changed it over to a thicker one...
@@edredas poke me if you got one to measure. It was about 0.1 inch lol (0.09) by memory. The new one is .035 cometic s l
Is there a reason why you chose the 924 over the 944? thanks!
I own both of these cars! So in all I have two 924S' (one turbocharged) and two 944's, (early & late)! So I wouldn't say I really prefer one over the other... although my daily car is the 1988 924S in the video. I was into FB Rx-7's before discovering the 924S. I just thought it was beautiful and sleek. I was also probably the only one in the world that liked the in-your-face big side markers. The 944 is a fun car but the springs are rather soft, the 5th gear is great for fuel economy, but not so much for performance. Not to mention, that the 1988 model has more power. So I end up putting around in the 944 while the 924S feels tighter and a little more aggressive. Which makes the early 944 feels a bit sloppy in comparison. I also need to finish getting this white 944 to the point that it's as quiet as the 924S. It needs new weather stripping and a wheel bearing. The 924S is almost as quiet as my wifes new Lexus, so its really difficult to drive the 944 on long trips at the moment. Most probably wouldn't even be bothered by the noise and write it off as just an old car, but I'm so used to having one that is quiet while riding around with the A/C on that I won't have anything less! Thanks!
@@edredas I figured you probably owned more than one lol, I have a 1984 944 bit of a battleaxe now but i still love it. You are one of the few true 944 gurus, Wish I lived in the US and I appreciate the videos!
Bram, where do you get your parts from !?
Most new parts I order from pelicanparts.com, however I also frequent 944store.com, 944online.com, partsgeek.com, and rockauto.com. It just depends on what I'm ordering. Pelican is great for engine parts such as gaskets and filters. 944store and 944online for more obscure parts such as sunroof parts etc. Partsgeek is great for suspension, while rockauto has the best prices for accessories such as alternators and A/C compressors. If you need used replacement parts for engines or interior then check out 944 barn. They have about 50 parts cars. I'm not affiliated in any way with any of these vendors. Thanks!
@@edredas thank you !
My 924s has the mpg gage
Nice! That’s very rare!
It's an 87
The prices r only going up lol
Paid up for our car but I think we did OK!!! Runs great!!! You may enjoy our car!! czcams.com/video/hCHTXCKGf7U/video.html 😀😀😀🍺🍺
Yep, buy now or regret it later.
Cool video, that must be a wimpy 83-84 944 that you are comparing to the 924s. Now go get you a 86 951 and compare it you your 924s and see what numbers you come up with. LOL! I have a snarling 86, with chipped "ecu", 4-inch exhaust, modded intake system and other mods that the previous owner mess round with. Yeup it eats vettes and stangs. LOL! 🤣
I think you missed the point of the video. I often get asked what the difference is between a 924S and a 944. As you can tell, when it comes to the early 944 there is very little that is different. Thus, the reason for the video. I have four 944 turbos however there would be no point in comparing a 924S to a 951 since they have very little in common.
944 2,5 8v in Europe have 163 hp until 1988
That was gross horsepower which was an exaggeration. The actual power was 156 net horsepower according to the factory workshop manual. The reason I can't use it is because it wasn't legal for them to sell cars in the US using gross hp so the figures aren't compatible in any way. In 1988 they did away with using gross hp in Europe so it looks like the the 944 lost 5 hp but in reality it gained 2 hp. I hope that helps!
No it was not. It is DIN. Americans was the ones that used gross hp (mainly before 1971). Europeans never did.
The main reasons for the horsepower difference between the european early models (that actually has 163 hp) and american modells, comes from the fact of a 10,6:1 compression instead of 9,5:1 as well as it only has a resonator and no O2-sensor, instead of a catalytic converter in the exhaust as the US-modells had. And therefore also most likely a totally different tune.
Swap pistons and remove the cat, the most likely most of the power from the euro cars would be there.
The factory workshop manual clearly states that 163 is gross horsepower. 156 is the net. DIN and PS are just metric versions of SAE or imperial and are within 2-3 hp of each other when converted. So in metric the early euro 944 might have made 158 DIN or PS but we don’t actually have those figures. In 1988 the compression dropped and even countries with a cat made the same hp as the RoW.
@@edredas From 88 all models had the 10,2:1 pistons and cat. Thats why the power is the same on all models after that year.
Before 1988, US cars was 9,5 and euro was 10,6.
I live in Norway btw. 1988 was the year when most cars here got cat as standard. But it was not mandatory until about 1990 or thereabout. Pretty much all cars at that time lost hp from what they previously had.
A no cat Alfa 164 3,0 has 192 hp. With cat it has 184. The 2,0 twin spark has 144 with cat and 148 without. Alfa 33 1,7 16v is 132 with and 137 without.
It might be that your 143hp SAE engine is a 163hp gross. (just as my old 1969 2,0 Alfa Romeo 130-131hp DIN was stated as 150hp gross in the US at its time). But that is not the same thing as a euro engine having 163hp DIN. DIN is a standard of ACTUAL measured hp. It is NOT the same as the old american Gross hp where they used different exhaust, intake, carburettor etc etc. We in europe didnt use that standard... You are simply just wrong. The early engines are NOT configured the same way. thats why the hp is not the same.
And of course it makes more sense that 2 mechanically different engines makes different horsepower, than you being right about the wording.
To calculate SAE NET from DIN, you divide the DIN by 1,0139 (because of the 745,7 watt per hp in SAE to 735,5 watt per hp in DIN standard). This would equate to a 163 hp DIN Porsche giving 160,76 hp SAE NET (at the time where your engines was 143 SAE NET)
In Europe we used DIN before you even got your SAE standard....
You can simply read the factory workshop manual and the please read a book on the things you are not understanding. DIN gross HP is an unusable figure any way you want to cut it. I have rebuilt a ton of 944’s both euro and US breaking apart the engines and looking at the programing. We simply cannot use DIN gross horsepower for anything.