Quick correction, in my video I said that Legends of the Dead was at 80 something percent ratings on Steam. As of this video's release (sorry, I didn't have time to go back and correct it) the steam reviews are now at 65%. My bad, but I guess it means my opinion may be more popular than I first expected. Cool.
@theblahj oh, so you think 59 rating is just because all of people who hate everything? Nonsense. When something you love gets a bad review, its fault of things you like, not the world around. Don't be like conspiracy theorists
I think it kinda sucks ngl. The legends just disappearing forever a week after you 'pop them' kinda sucks. They could have also done a waaaaay better job with the dynamic legends instead there are like 5 which repeat over and over. This is one of the things I never understood about Paradox, they will set up a very good and complex system that is pisseasy to iterate on because it's basically just text-stuff happening there. Then they write like 50 possible event texts and outcomes. Something that could likely be done in 1 day once the system is in place. There is also near to no integreating between the systems. For example at the bare minimum the game should log if a a legend was present in a place once. Then if you travel through that place give you a chance of an event where you hear about it, like a bard singing in a tabvern or like a statue or something.
PDKs new philosophy is just "let modders fix it" compare this to CK2s bloodlines system, the generic ones were like the same 4 or 5 but they were genuinely hard to get - then of course there was also sainthood which basically required you to be pious for a characters entire lifetime. But there were also really obscure and cool custom ones like The Blood of Mardavij if you were trying to restore Zoroastrian Persia in the Iron Century start, and it was for a character that wasn't even in the interesting start section, and it actually added a ton of flavour. Iron century itself was a huge high effort gift from PDX. Now? They just shit out lazy content and barely bother with start dates.
@@hyugahablak1186 Nah, PDX is actually adding powerful systems that modders can really go wild with, and they implement an example or two. Bethesda just drops a piles of barely playable garbage and walks away. Yeah, Paradox is doing little more than the bare minimum, but that's still incomparably more than Bethesda does.
As in increasingly common with CK3 DLCs, the free update is kinda better than the DLC itself, although I'd say in this case, the DLC isn't so bad that I'd give it that level of treatment. Royal Court was the best example of an update that outdid its accompanying DLC
I'm getting fed up with Paradox recently so I've decided to wait for the DLC's before getting the bundle. If the large expansion lives up to expectations ill get it.
Plagues arent named after kings because "the king caused it". they are named after kings because they happened during the reign of that king. Kinda like how the romans named their year according to the consuls that year or how japan literally is in year 7 of emperor whatever.
Rulers in ancient times got blamed for natural dissasters that happened during their reign. it was seen as a sighn that God disapproves of them in some way.
@@viorp5267That's not always the case, for example the Justinian plague happened during the reign of Justinian the Great yet he wasn't blame for that.
That's totally fair to say as like, what generally what would have happened, and I'd be willing to say that not every plague which is named after an individual or culture should be scapegoated, but maybe some of them could? People love to shift blame and put their tragedy on someone else when they can, and I'm sure that sort of thing could have been happening in the medieval era.
Honestly, I really wish they even added a simple population mechanic to this DLC. It would’ve made plagues feel so much more impactful to see a tangible effect on more than just development.
I think the main thing that makes the majority of people like the new DLC so much is they get them at the same time at the update, and so it's hard to distinguish between what came in the dlc and what came in the update
That's a big thing, but a lot of people don't care to disentangle the differences. They're already paying for the updates by buying the DLC, and it's arguably a good thing if a lot of the update features aren't locked behind the paywall (that they're already planning on buying). Some people talk about "the DLC" when they mostly mean the patch, or mean "the update in general."
My thoughts on it are pretty similar... its not bad its just... okay. The plagues don't play as much of a part as I thought they would and the legends just fade so quickly it isn't really worth it unless you have a high martial character
To be fair it's not as though I'd want plagues to be an integral part of the whole game, it's not like this is medieval disease simulator or plague inc, the main important thing is black death which I think they did a decent job with. I agree the dlc as a whole is mid tho
Would be interesting if the legends could influence the frequency of certain traits in our realm,for example,the legitimizing legends could make the brave trait appear more often in your dynasty,or a holy legend could make a certain pious trait more comon.
I think one of the best things that could be done about Legends is to make it so that they linger for a generation or so after you complete them. It wouldn't grow after completion, nor would it cost anything, but all promoters would keep the bonuses for promoting it for 25 years or so, and likewise it would continue giving bonuses to counties, maybe lasting in each county for a random amount of time in some range. I think that could even go towards making them more unique, imo part of why the modifiers you pick up are so ignorable is because you get them later on when promoting the Legend, and stop having any effect after you complete, so they only exist for a narrow window of time.
Agreed, honestly wasn't expecting anything more than "mid" for this dlc. Good news is that we hopefully might soon be seeing more information on Roads to power, which i am infinitely more excited for than this DLC.
Why does it kinda feel like a lesser version of CK2's bloodlines? At least those remained and were somewhat unique instead of being the same boring thing. When I went for the King Arthur Legend, I expected something cool. Maybe going to find Excalibur or Camelot. Turns out it as well as Uniting Iberia or reforming the Roman Empire pretty much get THE SAME events and no unique stuff to it. That just makes it so boring to me.
I think I got word for word the same text for: usurping Byz, Mending the schism, ending the papacy and restoring the Roman Empire. The same bullshit about some random plague or bandit.
Bloodlines were much better not only for their longevity, but also for the fact that they weren't just some events to click and forget. You actually had to plan your marriages and raiding as a pagan to obtain desired people with bloodlines and marry them into your dynasty
I really thought 'legends' was going to weave this growing story of the journey your dynasty has taken over the centuries, with legends commemorating major achievements. It's... definitely not that. The legends just disappear when you complete them, and the text is extremely generic, barely related to the actual legend seed at all. Plagues are great, though, which balances out how much of a miss legends are. I really don't know what was going through the devs' minds when they created legends - I think they got as far as 'spreads like a plague but is positive', and didn't really get much further in the design than that.
Only buildings, dev and dynasty legacies serve as any form of continuity in the whole game. Weird that they spent all this effort on legends, when in game they don't last more than a single generation. Huge waste indeed.
One of the problems I have with CK3 in general is the passiveness of... well a lot actually. The AI is super passive when it comes to declaring war on you, is passive when they try to murder you (cant even murder unless rival) and the nature of most of CK3s events: Almost all events are single events that are standing on their own and dont influence other events. The events also are almost all asking for a reaction form the player, not an action. When the event would ask for a meaningful action taken I would enjoy it more and not just click the funny button for the biggest boost 90% of the time
Actually disagree with the procedural generation thing. I’d rather have a different legend for every legend seed instead of all these generic legends that you’re gonna get bored of when you play this game for another 50 hours.
Agreed on that. Imagine how cool a written Arthurian Myth would be where you discover Excalibur and Camelot instead of basic events that have NOTHING to do with Arthur or the Arthurian Myths.
A fair enough take. I'm definitely not so attached to the procedural seeds that I'd fight for them. If procedural seeds were removed, and replaced with like, at least 50 more historical seeds, scattered throughout the world, I'd be cool with that, especially if it resulted in better writing.
One Proud Bavarian is literally sponsored by Paradox, he literally gets all his DLC early and you expect him not to be a massive shill? We're talking about a man who got butt hurt when it was pointed out that base CKIII was just an overpriced and incomplete port of CKII with a worse map and bloated UI...
I treat all major creators for paradox games the same way I do sponsered youtubers for the Total War series. Just a shame they flood my search results with garbage.
I love those plauge suggestions, more social shenanigans as scheme opportunity generator would be great. Like the legitimacy idea of each place and more land more problems.
I honestly dont use the hostages at all, first time I used it myself and wasnt just offered by an ai, was during my persia run in legacy of persia, just for the hell of it. Trading my 14'th daughter bottom of the succession line with the byzantines, who gave me their heir for some fucking reason...
Yea i agree 5/10 for me. I made a post on the subreddit that got 800 upvotes on how Legends aren’t impactful. Once you complete your legend even at mythical tier disappears after about 20 yrs along with the chronicle. Plague are great but paradox is selling us a DLC that was already a DLC for ck2 for $20. The good parts is the plagues and some decisions you can take with certain legends.
Legends should be a lot more cheaper and thus happen all the time and everywhere. Then its a game of competing for legends, which could incite rivalries, propagandize your realm or faith, etc An issue with legitimacy is that its extremely hard to be challenged in a generation or two, especially compared to ck2. The legitimacy mechanic just strengthens this flaw, as that rarely ever goes down either. I remembered I got caught having a kid out of wedlock, and i lost a level of devotion, but legitimacy stayed far up
The whole legends mechanic seems very gamey and acts as just another money funnel. When the devs first described it, I thought the game would exploit the old ck2 chroincle but have it affect gameplay. Instead it just ended up being a new form of dynasty bloodline bonuses and casus belli. The only reason they included it in the dlc was to hide the fact they sold The reaper's due for a second time with minimal changes. Ck3 keeps motivating me to at worst return to ck2, and best wish people could just port all the new content in ck3 to ck2.
I like the dlc but I wish the actual legends lasted longer and more unique/diverse. The building you get is pretty sweet but yeah the money drain is CRAZY! I had like 6k and started a legend and maxed it out and I was losing -300 per month lol without receiving indulgences I would’ve gone bankrupt.
Your whole take on the plagues seem to forget that this is the medieval world, even if the player knows how to deal with the plague nobody in the time the game takes place should. Even the people educated in the top of the line treatments still consider things like blood letting to be viable. So you sort of lost me there. Yes the plague should be spread more easily through trade, no the plague should not be easy for the player to micro manage or have a perfect solution to (since the rulers shouldn't know of the details to how it even works). Hell didn't they claim the plagues spread through war in the trailer for the DLC alreadry? You also misunderstood why plagues are named after rules, is during the reign and place it came from, nothing about a grudge against those rulers. I think the plagues are just fine, with how passive the player is in their ability to deal with them. The real problem is how the plagues don't even spread in any organic manner.
I didn't necessarily want the player to be able to micromanage the plague, but rather that some of the options which come randomly via events should be a choice. I do understand that not every plague is named after a ruler in a sense of blaming them, but could we perhaps say that some of them were seen as a failure of the king or queen to fulfill their mandate? Like divine punishment against the people for an illegitimate ruler? That was more what I was looking for. If the trailer claimed that war spreads plagues, I have seen no evidence of that, so it's either a lie, or it's something which is so esoteric that you won't notice it. I have never seen a plague follow my army into new lands or anything like that. I do agree that plagues don't spread very organically. It just goes from county to county, and sometimes skips over a sea tile at most, but I'd have liked to see plagues spread more based on reasonable human movement, rather than just border to border.
while i did set the game rules to apocalyptic, i think plagues are heat and i really enjoy them (especially for speeding the game up) though imo legends are pretty mid and i don’t really care for them
Legends need to last longer...Nevermind, I wanted to wait until Roads to Power came out anyway. I'm sure mods like EK2 and Realms in Exile will be able to use the Legends system in cooler ways.
I wish the legends acted a bit more like bloodlines where they carried over to your descendants like how they should be i mean if i was a direct descendant of the person who reformed the Roman empire that should give my house and descendants some pedigree. I just dont understand why they didnt do this to begin with. Other than money money money.
@@jamesoconnor8985 it’s definitely easy to exploit but it’s still a lot more unpredictable. The AI in CK3 is too static. They don’t try to invade, they don’t start rebellions, they don’t start religious heresays, they don’t try to assassinate you. They literally do nothing.
Such a shame about plagues - could have been great interactions w/ culture and buildings - could have whole health related cultural traditions - "sorry, sleeping sickness is spreading via the public baths, swap the tradition or take penalties" or "looks like this plague came from the poor living conditions for pilgrims around this special religious building, fork out some cash to fix or the building will get a new disease spread modifier"
I didn't buy it yet because I'm waiting for a sale but it does seem underwhelming. Legends seemed so cool and then you realize the actual text of the story is sometimes gibberish because the procedural generation isn't done right. Or that there's just a few seeds because they "didn't have enough time" to write more (maybe you shouldn't have released the product so early then?). The most ridiculous thing is that nobody in the dev team saw anything wrong with LEGENDS disappearing after you complete them. It's not like people like looking at what they've accomplished or something. At the end of the day the ideas are cool but the implementation is lacking. Maybe 100-200 more hours of work put into this and the end result truly would have been amazing.
One thing I'm pretty unhappy with is how legitimacy works for us who don't have the DLC. If you have a ruler with low legitimacy, you're pretty boned. As far as I can tell, you can only scoop up a little bit here and there. 20 from a Hunt, 50 from a holy war. That doesn't help much when I'm hundreds of points down.
Every single mechanic discussed in this video just feels like wasted potential, they're not bad really but it just frustrates me how much more they could've been.
in my play through played a game where i was gonna recreate the north sea empire i conquered the angles and the danes and formed the kingdom of norway and through a legitimacy legend merged norway and sapmi into one kingdom i then move my capital and use my large amounts of wealth to show the anglos that im friendly walking around england and throwing parties and grand weddings i merge norse and anglo-saxon to create the kingdom of Albion, a new norse kingdom in preparation for my north sea empire back home in the norwegian and danish lands, i see Albion Boils as a plague running rampant and thought it would be cool ur right though i didn’t see a single change to acceptance or relationship to my scand vassals, really disappointing
I feel like the legends/chronicaler role should have synergy with the diplo/august tree perk "writing history". Disagree that legends are too expensive, maybe marginally early game? but by midgame (80+ years in), gold starts coming in faster than I can seem to spend it. Couldnt agree more with your analysis of plagues. They seem to be another click-to-handle and hope for the best. I think everybody agrees with your complaints about artifact clutter - I'm sure there are decent mods to help, but I wish they would build something in the core game - a better UI or court maintenance fee or something... Spot on with Legitimacy tire 5 being wicked OP currently - needs to be a some sort of diminishing returns on snow-balling. I'd vote a little higher, 7 to 8 as nothing is clearly broken (which has been my experience with most HOI4 paradox DLCs), but it feels like they opted for a field-goal instead of a touchdown - lots of missed opportunities... Awesome video as always!!!
i completed the legend i got from the dynasty skilltree at mythic level and "absorbed" the kingdom of wessex into my kingdom of frisias de jure. that was pretty neat :) good video
I think you should get legitimacy if you lead your army yourself as a leader. Especially in Europe it was a warrior culture and if a feudal lord didn't lead his army himself there was displeasure and so on
A thing I'd say about Legends of the Dead is that it makes the game so much more interesting. Before, I could barely play a hundred years before getting bored and closing the game, but now I wouldn't mind playing until 1444, as the plagues and legends add so many more challenges and fun things that could happen in the game.
The only reason plagues exist is to fix the late game LAG associated to large dynasties, and the unnecessary amounts of crap the game records for each NPC and Dynasty, plagues fix that by yeeting them out of existence! Black death in particular is really good at yeeting, as its basically a mid game REST BUTTON! I'm one of the few people who likes to micromanage everything in my kingdom down to how they look like, who they marry and what they own, legends of the dead came and ruined that for me. Now i cant play the game like i used to, as i cant leave a single NPC for more then few years only to notice that they've been Ctrl + Alt + Del YETTED!
legitimacy is such a huge missed opportunity. it's very important to the setting and it100% should be driven so much by traditions/doctrines/virtues/sins.
Haven't tried the DLC yet, trying to run the game with all mods I have rn, lol; but I totally agree: this is yet another situation where DLC is going to be improved upon by the modding community. In fact, I prefer this approach to any game, rather than ignoring modding community or introducing obstacles which make modding difficult. CK3 is a kind of operating system for mods, with some system being bare-bones, which end up fleshed out by modders, and I like that. Thanks to that the game has unlimited replayability.
I think this is a 9/10 ideas with 5/10 execution. The disease works pretty well overall. Legitimacy is neat, but not quite there yet. Legends is a bit of missed opportunity. At least they could add more random variation to naming. Legends become samey very fast.
"Potential". Ck3 devs always praised by good potential, not actual consequence. And never gone futher. So i think its not potential. I'd like to call it "limit". So that's all. Everything we've seen is all of capability they have, and neither they nor the game will ever get better from there, so this is a limit. not a potential. And I think that's the smart attitude save my mental health. Let go of expectations. I'm pretty sure they will mess up landless play or byz flavor at Roads to Power just as legends, with only left empty "potential."
I think the free update is also pretty mid, both of the new mechanics aren't even fleshed out. Legitimacy only serves to hamper you early game and to be another late game buff, there seems to be literally no other way to gain legitimacy except throwing away money on activities (which there are only 3 of in vanilla) and winning wars, and what do you get? 25 Legitimacy. Now what happens when something bad happens like losing a war? You lose 100 legitimacy. This system doesn't make the game more challenging all it does is reward late game and punish early game. Also plagues have zero flavor in vanilla, i haven't seen a single plague event except "its here" and "its gone", not even one? They should have made legitimacy be affected by the stability of your realm, and not be another mechanic to BE the stability of your realm. What i mean is if you have good standing with your vassals, have ruled for a long time, inherited your primary title, have the same culture/religion as your domains/vassals, control the entirety of your primary titles de jure and more your legitimacy should be increased. The opposite should also be true if you have bad standing with your vassals, have ruled for a short time, conquered your primary title, have a different religion/culture from most of your domains/vassals, control a very small portion of your primary titles de jure and more your legitimacy should be decreased. This is so that legitimacy isn't just an arbitrary stat increased slightly by your actions, its directly the result of your realm stability. Imagine how much more accurate and more fun that legitimacy system would be? As it stands legitimacy just feels like a new useless arbitrary stat that only serves to make you weaker and then stronger in the late game, like we need more of that?
You should get an event atleast every month when theres a plague in your realm/capital, right now its just the plagues of random development decrease and some of your family members might die.
I also feel like the game needs History, what i mean is things that happened before in the game should be referenced in the future. Maybe a great plague (not necessarily the bubonic plague) swept across your kingdom 40 years ago and some old beggar comes up in a random travel event and talks about it. Maybe a scholar talks about a legend you created a century ago in an event, there's so much you could do.
I respect the comment about not being a meta slave. This is something that as RP has more of a role when playing CK3, us players have to respect it's true nature.
I cannot play it until they get rid of the annoying new UI sounds. I don't understand why they felt the need to change them. That weird popping click-clack-click-clack sound on hover over everything is just insanely irritating. Maybe only me. Seriously nobody else is bothered by it?
I'm not sure I understand how you can call yourself a hardcore player? In my experience "hardcore" crusader kings players just play ck2 and never made the switch to 3
Quick correction, in my video I said that Legends of the Dead was at 80 something percent ratings on Steam. As of this video's release (sorry, I didn't have time to go back and correct it) the steam reviews are now at 65%. My bad, but I guess it means my opinion may be more popular than I first expected. Cool.
bro's issuing corrections before we can even watch 😭
you do realize most steam reviewers are either jokesters or people who hate everything, right?
@theblahj oh, so you think 59 rating is just because all of people who hate everything? Nonsense. When something you love gets a bad review, its fault of things you like, not the world around. Don't be like conspiracy theorists
Mostly negative somehow translate to 65% good on steam?
I think it kinda sucks ngl. The legends just disappearing forever a week after you 'pop them' kinda sucks. They could have also done a waaaaay better job with the dynamic legends instead there are like 5 which repeat over and over.
This is one of the things I never understood about Paradox, they will set up a very good and complex system that is pisseasy to iterate on because it's basically just text-stuff happening there. Then they write like 50 possible event texts and outcomes. Something that could likely be done in 1 day once the system is in place.
There is also near to no integreating between the systems. For example at the bare minimum the game should log if a a legend was present in a place once. Then if you travel through that place give you a chance of an event where you hear about it, like a bard singing in a tabvern or like a statue or something.
PDKs new philosophy is just "let modders fix it"
compare this to CK2s bloodlines system, the generic ones were like the same 4 or 5 but they were genuinely hard to get - then of course there was also sainthood which basically required you to be pious for a characters entire lifetime. But there were also really obscure and cool custom ones like The Blood of Mardavij if you were trying to restore Zoroastrian Persia in the Iron Century start, and it was for a character that wasn't even in the interesting start section, and it actually added a ton of flavour. Iron century itself was a huge high effort gift from PDX.
Now? They just shit out lazy content and barely bother with start dates.
@@big_slurp4603so they adopted the bethesda method? Let modders fix what we missed
@@hyugahablak1186 Nah, PDX is actually adding powerful systems that modders can really go wild with, and they implement an example or two. Bethesda just drops a piles of barely playable garbage and walks away. Yeah, Paradox is doing little more than the bare minimum, but that's still incomparably more than Bethesda does.
As someone who has not gotten the DLC all the free content feels equivalent to DLC. So I'm pretty sated until I can afford the DLC
As in increasingly common with CK3 DLCs, the free update is kinda better than the DLC itself, although I'd say in this case, the DLC isn't so bad that I'd give it that level of treatment. Royal Court was the best example of an update that outdid its accompanying DLC
I'm getting fed up with Paradox recently so I've decided to wait for the DLC's before getting the bundle. If the large expansion lives up to expectations ill get it.
Just pirate it lol
Plagues arent named after kings because "the king caused it". they are named after kings because they happened during the reign of that king. Kinda like how the romans named their year according to the consuls that year or how japan literally is in year 7 of emperor whatever.
Rulers in ancient times got blamed for natural dissasters that happened during their reign. it was seen as a sighn that God disapproves of them in some way.
@@viorp5267 Yea, related to the divine right of kings.
@@viorp5267That's not always the case, for example the Justinian plague happened during the reign of Justinian the Great yet he wasn't blame for that.
That's totally fair to say as like, what generally what would have happened, and I'd be willing to say that not every plague which is named after an individual or culture should be scapegoated, but maybe some of them could? People love to shift blame and put their tragedy on someone else when they can, and I'm sure that sort of thing could have been happening in the medieval era.
@@Tarkusarkusar Maybe they could make an event in wich you need certain level of diplo skill to avoid the bad reputation penalty or smt like that.
Honestly, I really wish they even added a simple population mechanic to this DLC. It would’ve made plagues feel so much more impactful to see a tangible effect on more than just development.
I think the main thing that makes the majority of people like the new DLC so much is they get them at the same time at the update, and so it's hard to distinguish between what came in the dlc and what came in the update
That's a big thing, but a lot of people don't care to disentangle the differences. They're already paying for the updates by buying the DLC, and it's arguably a good thing if a lot of the update features aren't locked behind the paywall (that they're already planning on buying). Some people talk about "the DLC" when they mostly mean the patch, or mean "the update in general."
My thoughts on it are pretty similar... its not bad its just... okay. The plagues don't play as much of a part as I thought they would and the legends just fade so quickly it isn't really worth it unless you have a high martial character
To be fair it's not as though I'd want plagues to be an integral part of the whole game, it's not like this is medieval disease simulator or plague inc, the main important thing is black death which I think they did a decent job with. I agree the dlc as a whole is mid tho
Play more, legends are extremely useful! When i got the swear fealty CB I legit vassalized all of france.
@@jameswyatt1133 Oh yeah theres no denying they are super useful, but its more from an rp perspective
Would be interesting if the legends could influence the frequency of certain traits in our realm,for example,the legitimizing legends could make the brave trait appear more often in your dynasty,or a holy legend could make a certain pious trait more comon.
I think one of the best things that could be done about Legends is to make it so that they linger for a generation or so after you complete them. It wouldn't grow after completion, nor would it cost anything, but all promoters would keep the bonuses for promoting it for 25 years or so, and likewise it would continue giving bonuses to counties, maybe lasting in each county for a random amount of time in some range.
I think that could even go towards making them more unique, imo part of why the modifiers you pick up are so ignorable is because you get them later on when promoting the Legend, and stop having any effect after you complete, so they only exist for a narrow window of time.
I think Legends should have to be there forever if it's particuliarly impressive, i mean it's 2024 and we still know about Alexander or Cleopatra
Agreed, honestly wasn't expecting anything more than "mid" for this dlc. Good news is that we hopefully might soon be seeing more information on Roads to power, which i am infinitely more excited for than this DLC.
Roads to power is gonna be 10 events, that will always repeat. 7 out of 10 of those events will be fart jokes.
Why does it kinda feel like a lesser version of CK2's bloodlines? At least those remained and were somewhat unique instead of being the same boring thing. When I went for the King Arthur Legend, I expected something cool. Maybe going to find Excalibur or Camelot. Turns out it as well as Uniting Iberia or reforming the Roman Empire pretty much get THE SAME events and no unique stuff to it. That just makes it so boring to me.
I think I got word for word the same text for: usurping Byz, Mending the schism, ending the papacy and restoring the Roman Empire. The same bullshit about some random plague or bandit.
Bloodlines were much better not only for their longevity, but also for the fact that they weren't just some events to click and forget. You actually had to plan your marriages and raiding as a pagan to obtain desired people with bloodlines and marry them into your dynasty
I really thought 'legends' was going to weave this growing story of the journey your dynasty has taken over the centuries, with legends commemorating major achievements. It's... definitely not that. The legends just disappear when you complete them, and the text is extremely generic, barely related to the actual legend seed at all. Plagues are great, though, which balances out how much of a miss legends are. I really don't know what was going through the devs' minds when they created legends - I think they got as far as 'spreads like a plague but is positive', and didn't really get much further in the design than that.
Only buildings, dev and dynasty legacies serve as any form of continuity in the whole game. Weird that they spent all this effort on legends, when in game they don't last more than a single generation. Huge waste indeed.
One of the problems I have with CK3 in general is the passiveness of... well a lot actually. The AI is super passive when it comes to declaring war on you, is passive when they try to murder you (cant even murder unless rival) and the nature of most of CK3s events: Almost all events are single events that are standing on their own and dont influence other events. The events also are almost all asking for a reaction form the player, not an action.
When the event would ask for a meaningful action taken I would enjoy it more and not just click the funny button for the biggest boost 90% of the time
The AI needs to be more aggressive
Actually disagree with the procedural generation thing. I’d rather have a different legend for every legend seed instead of all these generic legends that you’re gonna get bored of when you play this game for another 50 hours.
Agreed on that. Imagine how cool a written Arthurian Myth would be where you discover Excalibur and Camelot instead of basic events that have NOTHING to do with Arthur or the Arthurian Myths.
@@kunomuller7423but isn’t camelot in reality just wales?
A fair enough take. I'm definitely not so attached to the procedural seeds that I'd fight for them. If procedural seeds were removed, and replaced with like, at least 50 more historical seeds, scattered throughout the world, I'd be cool with that, especially if it resulted in better writing.
Just let the player write/edit the chronicle themselves. Would instantly be 10x better
One Proud Bavarian is literally sponsored by Paradox, he literally gets all his DLC early and you expect him not to be a massive shill? We're talking about a man who got butt hurt when it was pointed out that base CKIII was just an overpriced and incomplete port of CKII with a worse map and bloated UI...
I treat all major creators for paradox games the same way I do sponsered youtubers for the Total War series. Just a shame they flood my search results with garbage.
The biggest shill ever and the worst is he gets angry when pointed out
I love those plauge suggestions, more social shenanigans as scheme opportunity generator would be great.
Like the legitimacy idea of each place and more land more problems.
Crusader Kings III: Wards & Wardens event pack was very good, i still always use universities and hostages. I guess i use it more that any other dlc
I honestly dont use the hostages at all, first time I used it myself and wasnt just offered by an ai, was during my persia run in legacy of persia, just for the hell of it. Trading my 14'th daughter bottom of the succession line with the byzantines, who gave me their heir for some fucking reason...
@@The_Yukki yeah hostages are not that useful, but I get them when they have good traits so I can make them my family
Yea i agree 5/10 for me. I made a post on the subreddit that got 800 upvotes on how Legends aren’t impactful. Once you complete your legend even at mythical tier disappears after about 20 yrs along with the chronicle. Plague are great but paradox is selling us a DLC that was already a DLC for ck2 for $20. The good parts is the plagues and some decisions you can take with certain legends.
Legends should be a lot more cheaper and thus happen all the time and everywhere. Then its a game of competing for legends, which could incite rivalries, propagandize your realm or faith, etc
An issue with legitimacy is that its extremely hard to be challenged in a generation or two, especially compared to ck2. The legitimacy mechanic just strengthens this flaw, as that rarely ever goes down either. I remembered I got caught having a kid out of wedlock, and i lost a level of devotion, but legitimacy stayed far up
Plagues are fun at first but It just gets annoying after the first few times
I am so waiting for a dlc with a religion expansion of cult system implementation. Especially after bg3 i LOVED the vibe that cult gave off.
The whole legends mechanic seems very gamey and acts as just another money funnel. When the devs first described it, I thought the game would exploit the old ck2 chroincle but have it affect gameplay. Instead it just ended up being a new form of dynasty bloodline bonuses and casus belli. The only reason they included it in the dlc was to hide the fact they sold The reaper's due for a second time with minimal changes. Ck3 keeps motivating me to at worst return to ck2, and best wish people could just port all the new content in ck3 to ck2.
I like the dlc but I wish the actual legends lasted longer and more unique/diverse. The building you get is pretty sweet but yeah the money drain is CRAZY! I had like 6k and started a legend and maxed it out and I was losing -300 per month lol without receiving indulgences I would’ve gone bankrupt.
What do you expect from Eastern Roman dlc and do you have any expectations about unlanded gameplay?
Great recommendations for changes, would love to see them implemented
Your whole take on the plagues seem to forget that this is the medieval world, even if the player knows how to deal with the plague nobody in the time the game takes place should. Even the people educated in the top of the line treatments still consider things like blood letting to be viable. So you sort of lost me there. Yes the plague should be spread more easily through trade, no the plague should not be easy for the player to micro manage or have a perfect solution to (since the rulers shouldn't know of the details to how it even works). Hell didn't they claim the plagues spread through war in the trailer for the DLC alreadry? You also misunderstood why plagues are named after rules, is during the reign and place it came from, nothing about a grudge against those rulers. I think the plagues are just fine, with how passive the player is in their ability to deal with them. The real problem is how the plagues don't even spread in any organic manner.
I didn't necessarily want the player to be able to micromanage the plague, but rather that some of the options which come randomly via events should be a choice. I do understand that not every plague is named after a ruler in a sense of blaming them, but could we perhaps say that some of them were seen as a failure of the king or queen to fulfill their mandate? Like divine punishment against the people for an illegitimate ruler? That was more what I was looking for.
If the trailer claimed that war spreads plagues, I have seen no evidence of that, so it's either a lie, or it's something which is so esoteric that you won't notice it. I have never seen a plague follow my army into new lands or anything like that.
I do agree that plagues don't spread very organically. It just goes from county to county, and sometimes skips over a sea tile at most, but I'd have liked to see plagues spread more based on reasonable human movement, rather than just border to border.
while i did set the game rules to apocalyptic, i think plagues are heat and i really enjoy them (especially for speeding the game up) though imo legends are pretty mid and i don’t really care for them
Legends need to last longer...Nevermind, I wanted to wait until Roads to Power came out anyway. I'm sure mods like EK2 and Realms in Exile will be able to use the Legends system in cooler ways.
Steam reviews for CK 3 DLCs always start off very positive. Then they gradually go down to mixed over a day or two.
I wish the legends acted a bit more like bloodlines where they carried over to your descendants like how they should be i mean if i was a direct descendant of the person who reformed the Roman empire that should give my house and descendants some pedigree. I just dont understand why they didnt do this to begin with. Other than money money money.
Wait so is the plagues without buying the dlc is free update? I haven’t purchased the new dlc however I have plagues
All I want is for this game to be as challenging as CK2. No two saves ever played the same in that game.
CK2 is almost too random at times. Got single province hungary in Scandinavia and the theocracy of Bavaria last time I played.
@@simonkorica9467 that’s what makes it so fun. The random stuff that happens which makes for interesting stories
Ck2 was as easy to exploit. People just were ignorant about how to do it.
@@jamesoconnor8985 it’s definitely easy to exploit but it’s still a lot more unpredictable. The AI in CK3 is too static. They don’t try to invade, they don’t start rebellions, they don’t start religious heresays, they don’t try to assassinate you. They literally do nothing.
Such a shame about plagues - could have been great interactions w/ culture and buildings - could have whole health related cultural traditions - "sorry, sleeping sickness is spreading via the public baths, swap the tradition or take penalties" or "looks like this plague came from the poor living conditions for pilgrims around this special religious building, fork out some cash to fix or the building will get a new disease spread modifier"
I hope they develop and add on to the legends and plague systems!
I didn't buy it yet because I'm waiting for a sale but it does seem underwhelming. Legends seemed so cool and then you realize the actual text of the story is sometimes gibberish because the procedural generation isn't done right. Or that there's just a few seeds because they "didn't have enough time" to write more (maybe you shouldn't have released the product so early then?). The most ridiculous thing is that nobody in the dev team saw anything wrong with LEGENDS disappearing after you complete them. It's not like people like looking at what they've accomplished or something.
At the end of the day the ideas are cool but the implementation is lacking. Maybe 100-200 more hours of work put into this and the end result truly would have been amazing.
One thing I'm pretty unhappy with is how legitimacy works for us who don't have the DLC. If you have a ruler with low legitimacy, you're pretty boned. As far as I can tell, you can only scoop up a little bit here and there. 20 from a Hunt, 50 from a holy war. That doesn't help much when I'm hundreds of points down.
Every single mechanic discussed in this video just feels like wasted potential, they're not bad really but it just frustrates me how much more they could've been.
Exactly my mind.
in my play through
played a game where i was gonna recreate the north sea empire
i conquered the angles and the danes and formed the kingdom of norway and through a legitimacy legend merged norway and sapmi into one kingdom
i then move my capital and use my large amounts of wealth to show the anglos that im friendly walking around england and throwing parties and grand weddings
i merge norse and anglo-saxon to create the kingdom of Albion, a new norse kingdom in preparation for my north sea empire
back home in the norwegian and danish lands, i see Albion Boils as a plague running rampant and thought it would be cool
ur right though i didn’t see a single change to acceptance or relationship to my scand vassals, really disappointing
Your ideas are great and really innovative, very cool.
I feel like the legends/chronicaler role should have synergy with the diplo/august tree perk "writing history".
Disagree that legends are too expensive, maybe marginally early game? but by midgame (80+ years in), gold starts coming in faster than I can seem to spend it.
Couldnt agree more with your analysis of plagues. They seem to be another click-to-handle and hope for the best.
I think everybody agrees with your complaints about artifact clutter - I'm sure there are decent mods to help, but I wish they would build something in the core game - a better UI or court maintenance fee or something...
Spot on with Legitimacy tire 5 being wicked OP currently - needs to be a some sort of diminishing returns on snow-balling.
I'd vote a little higher, 7 to 8 as nothing is clearly broken (which has been my experience with most HOI4 paradox DLCs), but it feels like they opted for a field-goal instead of a touchdown - lots of missed opportunities...
Awesome video as always!!!
i completed the legend i got from the dynasty skilltree at mythic level and "absorbed" the kingdom of wessex into my kingdom of frisias de jure. that was pretty neat :) good video
Just waiting for a sale
Also i love the event where I have 15% chance to get the disease and always get it lol!
I think you should get legitimacy if you lead your army yourself as a leader. Especially in Europe it was a warrior culture and if a feudal lord didn't lead his army himself there was displeasure and so on
A thing I'd say about Legends of the Dead is that it makes the game so much more interesting. Before, I could barely play a hundred years before getting bored and closing the game, but now I wouldn't mind playing until 1444, as the plagues and legends add so many more challenges and fun things that could happen in the game.
The only reason plagues exist is to fix the late game LAG associated to large dynasties, and the unnecessary amounts of crap the game records for each NPC and Dynasty, plagues fix that by yeeting them out of existence! Black death in particular is really good at yeeting, as its basically a mid game REST BUTTON! I'm one of the few people who likes to micromanage everything in my kingdom down to how they look like, who they marry and what they own, legends of the dead came and ruined that for me. Now i cant play the game like i used to, as i cant leave a single NPC for more then few years only to notice that they've been Ctrl + Alt + Del YETTED!
As if the Mods and Modders dont Show us how its done. Great Video.
legitimacy is such a huge missed opportunity. it's very important to the setting and it100% should be driven so much by traditions/doctrines/virtues/sins.
Great review. I haven't bought it because I don't think it looks like it's worth the price.
Haven't tried the DLC yet, trying to run the game with all mods I have rn, lol; but I totally agree: this is yet another situation where DLC is going to be improved upon by the modding community. In fact, I prefer this approach to any game, rather than ignoring modding community or introducing obstacles which make modding difficult. CK3 is a kind of operating system for mods, with some system being bare-bones, which end up fleshed out by modders, and I like that. Thanks to that the game has unlimited replayability.
I think this is a 9/10 ideas with 5/10 execution. The disease works pretty well overall. Legitimacy is neat, but not quite there yet. Legends is a bit of missed opportunity. At least they could add more random variation to naming. Legends become samey very fast.
Man I wish I was a modder so I could use the ideas you brought up.
i couldnt even tell i had the DLC installed tbh besides the diseases it has no noticeable mechanics
Kind of scummy for paradox punishing you for not buying the dlc.
Good video! You should go back to use the eu4 metal music again😊
if they will update the Legends to be stacked like bloodlines, we will make them billionaires period
Nice ideas, but the execution just feels 'off' somehow if you've dumped tons of time into CK2.
Thanks for being honest.
"Potential".
Ck3 devs always praised by good potential, not actual consequence. And never gone futher. So i think its not potential. I'd like to call it "limit".
So that's all. Everything we've seen is all of capability they have, and neither they nor the game will ever get better from there, so this is a limit. not a potential.
And I think that's the smart attitude save my mental health. Let go of expectations.
I'm pretty sure they will mess up landless play or byz flavor at Roads to Power just as legends, with only left empty "potential."
I think the free update is also pretty mid, both of the new mechanics aren't even fleshed out. Legitimacy only serves to hamper you early game and to be another late game buff, there seems to be literally no other way to gain legitimacy except throwing away money on activities (which there are only 3 of in vanilla) and winning wars, and what do you get? 25 Legitimacy. Now what happens when something bad happens like losing a war? You lose 100 legitimacy. This system doesn't make the game more challenging all it does is reward late game and punish early game.
Also plagues have zero flavor in vanilla, i haven't seen a single plague event except "its here" and "its gone", not even one?
They should have made legitimacy be affected by the stability of your realm, and not be another mechanic to BE the stability of your realm.
What i mean is if you have good standing with your vassals, have ruled for a long time, inherited your primary title, have the same culture/religion as your domains/vassals, control the entirety of your primary titles de jure and more your legitimacy should be increased. The opposite should also be true if you have bad standing with your vassals, have ruled for a short time, conquered your primary title, have a different religion/culture from most of your domains/vassals, control a very small portion of your primary titles de jure and more your legitimacy should be decreased.
This is so that legitimacy isn't just an arbitrary stat increased slightly by your actions, its directly the result of your realm stability.
Imagine how much more accurate and more fun that legitimacy system would be?
As it stands legitimacy just feels like a new useless arbitrary stat that only serves to make you weaker and then stronger in the late game, like we need more of that?
You should get an event atleast every month when theres a plague in your realm/capital, right now its just the plagues of random development decrease and some of your family members might die.
I also feel like the game needs History, what i mean is things that happened before in the game should be referenced in the future. Maybe a great plague (not necessarily the bubonic plague) swept across your kingdom 40 years ago and some old beggar comes up in a random travel event and talks about it. Maybe a scholar talks about a legend you created a century ago in an event, there's so much you could do.
Not bad, Not great
I respect the comment about not being a meta slave.
This is something that as RP has more of a role when playing CK3, us players have to respect it's true nature.
They just seem to not be able to reproduce the magic of CK2
I cannot play it until they get rid of the annoying new UI sounds. I don't understand why they felt the need to change them. That weird popping click-clack-click-clack sound on hover over everything is just insanely irritating. Maybe only me. Seriously nobody else is bothered by it?
I am not, but I also play with the sounds muted so I can listen to stuff in the background.
The Kingdom conglomeration is great and the religion spreading. Other than that its meh.
gigachads dont play autistic map painting games
17:15 opsie
👍
I'm not sure I understand how you can call yourself a hardcore player? In my experience "hardcore" crusader kings players just play ck2 and never made the switch to 3