I hope Autodesk recognizes your wonderful contribution to their community and promotion of fan base. Your knowledge sharing with this is huge. Thank you so much for all your effort.
As some have added, I would use Touch surfaces and Contact point boundary. The tool didn't go off the end of the part during surfacing because you didn't have Contact Point Boundary checked it was using the centerline of the tool to contain it. When you check CPB it uses the actual point of contact on the ball mill
If you want to select specific faces to 3D machine. Go to that little "Avoid/Touch surfaces" check box. Select the faces you want to surface, and check the "touch surface" box. It's a sub-check box that comes up after checking the avoid/touch check box. That will limit the toolpath to only the surfaces you select.
+chronok I disagree. A more complex surfaced part will require multiple size ball endmills. Being able to specifically target surface sections, while avoiding neighboring sections is far better than trying to 2d contain and fiddle with the boundary extents. Also much faster to calculate than surfacing an entire part with a larger BEM than going back and rest surfacing with a smaller one.
John if you hold down ALT when picking your machining boundary it will automatically only select the line your on, Then keep clicking the lines to fill your boundry. you can skip the whole thing at 17:04
You should try using the avoid/touch with that ball mill at the end, works better when you combine it with a tool containment. change your containment to outside and then give it a touch surface that is the angled bit on that toe clamp.
Man, coming from mastercam, that surfacing op was brutal! I dont have fusion but from what I can see it really has some nice featutes. Hopefully some day I can use it. -Alex
Hi John, I did a lot of 3D machiening lately and learned that you dont have to use a ball mill a lot of the time. Using a flat mill has a way better cutting speed at the contact point and has more contact surface - larger steppover for good surface finish. I only use ball mills for concave surfaces. I think for convex shapes a flat mill is more efficient or for what you did at the front of the clamp. ...edit: although the effect is cool :)
Problem with a flat endmill is that your surface will most likely be incorrect. A flat endmill isn't actually flat on the bottom. The bottom is actually dished out for relief. It you're surfacing up and over a convex surface the tool path will start cutting with the leading edge, as it goes up the radius, when it reaches near the apex it'll move towards cutting with the center of the tool, and as it comes down will cut with the tools trailing edge. Since the tools center is dished and not compensated for, the sections it cut with the center area of the tool won't correctly match the profile. You can get away with using a flat if you up or down mill only and tell the CAM to force using leading or trailing edge tool comp only. A bull endmill would still be better though
You are right! Never thought of that. But for my applications this very very (very! :) minor inaccuracy never was an issue. Sure, if the mill is quite large in relation to the feature it really could be an issue but I was more refering to relationships like the one in the clamp video.
+der ProtoTyp Yes. Certainly for cosmetic only surfaces where it's just there to look pretty, a flat endmill is fine without having to do anything fancy.
Hi John great vid. When you are going to simulate just one operation why don't you just select that tool path then sim instead of sim the whole part and fast forward.
or you could just get a stock that is a little thicker in height, mill everything at once without screws (but a little deeper than the part itself). If thats done, just turn it around (upper side facing down in the jaws), touch the parallels or what the part is laying on and say Z -*part thickness* (like -15mm). Face it at Z0 and done :)
That crosshatch pattern you did on the slope with the parallel looked like it had a really rough surface finish in the cam. How did it actually turn out? When you showed a view from the side in the simulation it looked bumpy, at about 19:00 to 19:01. Also on another note, why not recess the part a little bit into the fixture?
Like so many Fusion 360 vids, you got off into the tangent weeds there. Throwing in all the extra little shortcuts you've learned over time overloads viewers to the point of frustration by trying to take it all in....
If you had to fixture it more precisely, could you have extruded the slot up 0.01" or so on the fixture? That would give an internal shoulder to position the part, but not interfere with the two bolts or the milling ops. Is it difficult to get the slots and such a fixture to fit precisely enough?
Why would you leave the bottom side Black-Mill finish and machine the top side? The Bottom side is in contact with your part (and your step block) and you should prefer that to be the smooth flat surface, you shouldn't care as much about the top side being black-mill finish since it's only in contact with the washer under the clamping nut. cheers
I would have approached it differently and skipped the fixture entirely. If you hold the additional stock material in the vise and face, drill, slot, machine outside perimeter and 3D all in one op. Then I would just flip the project in the vise and then machine the excess material off the bottom.
+Chief Machining I sometimes wonder if he does things inefficiently specifically to showcase certain things you can do in Fusion, rather than show the best most efficient (or easiest) way to do something
+Chief Machining If he were doing multiple parts at once he could take this single station fixture and transform it for multiple stations easily. So it's easily scalable design wise. For a single part, ya it's not great. But for multiple parts with one setup this would be a better way.
Not even that is good idea. I would just cut them into strips to get 2 or 3 space so you could get 3/8 endmill and mill soft jaws for the parts and face them to thickness and chamfer
One more piece to this: When you make a fixture, check the "fixture" box and select the fixture object/component/bodies. This will let collision detection "see" the fixture and it will show up red in the simulation bar. -Elizabeth "only machined away the end of one clamp" Greene
Great video. I would skip the fixture. Add approximate.150in to the bottom to hold in the vice. Finish the part completely. Then flip the part in the vice and skim off the bottom.
John, you don't have to create a new component 100% of the time. In fact doing so will cause problems in some cases... take this toe clamp for example. If you were to use it in another design, it would be nested one level too deep in your BOM & Browser.... for no good reason. I personally encourage users to think and decide if they need a new component as the first step during the modelling process.
+Occams Sawzall there is only one component in the design. Don't forget that a Fusion design file is in its very nature a component already. Doing what you suggest would create a duplicate file in the project, with the BOM structure of how the design file should have been to begin with.
+Scott Moyse technically there's 3 components. The clamp, his fixture plate, and the screw he imported. I keep assemblies, sub assemblies and individual components in separate folders under each project. Keeps things better organized for me.
+Occams Sawzall that will teach me for not watching the whole video... there's been a few fusion videos lately that start by telling users they HAVE to create a new component before they do anything else. Which just isn't true, and frankly would instill bad practice.
Hi John! How would you do the pre-drill (4:39) in a square or rectangular slot? I know a endmill is not gonna reach the corners, but I would like to know how to pre-drill such a slot to prevent the ramp in.
Also you can pre-drill any where in your slot or square and any size hole as long as it is bigger then your end mill your using to rough out the slot or square.
Congratulations, your tutorial its great! I have two questions, as I can generate code from 360 fusion and I wonder if 360 fusion supports mach3? Thanks for your tutorials
it's nice to see how the cam works ..... BUT .... doing a short run of parts like that . I would just clamp the fixture at angle X and lob it off. guess I'm just old school...
Exactly. Must be quicker to set it up on a sine bar in the Bridgeport than to do all that parallel ball mill stuff on the CNC, and you'd get a flat surface on the toe. +Abom79 would have smashed that off in one pass with a slab mill on the K&T :)
did u consider pedestal machining? no fixture needed. just need to face off backside. less operations and more accurate not that its really necessary here but free! perhaps this was not done for the lessons being taught.
also known as 5 side machining. start off with a pc of stock thicker than the final size such that you have enough to clamp on the vise and be able to machine all 5 sides including the slot and angled surface and hole. doing so the part is as accurate as the machine and cutters. flip the part over and face off back side. you may waste more material (assuming it can be made from stock size) but you do not need a fixture and the setup for the second op is a simple face cut.
+Stuart Hardy Never heard the term "pedestal machining" but I think I know where he's going with this. Instead of leaving all the stock on the top of the part. Leave all the stock on the bottom of the part. You'd clamp on that extra stock on the bottom so the the bottom of your finished part is above the top of your vice jaws. This way you can machine the slot, profile, tapped hole and the sloped nose in the first op. Second op is to simply flip it over and face mill off the extra stock to bring the part into its finished thickness. No fixture required
+Occams Sawzall now it has been explained that's the way I do my small one offs,( by small they are 25mm square and 5 mm thick) Thanks for taking the time to educate me Stuart
What kind of hex collar? Single split? Double split? Either way it's pretty easy. You can "cheat" and drill out the corners of the hex with a #58 (.042) drill. Then machine out the hex and finish the inside walls of the hex with a 1/16" endmill. Or you can buy one online for like $4....
This is what we are looking making, its a custom spacing for the robot im building normal i would just buy the collar like you said but with where its going a store bought one wont really work. Picture of our part : imgur.com/a/fIuN3
+alex chisolm that's pretty easy unless you absolutely need the sharp corners (which you rarely ever do) Start with the flange side down. Skim the top flat, contour the hub profile and flange profile. Drill holes through the part at each corner of the hex (use the points as the center position for the hole) pocket out and finish the hex. Flip the part mill to overall height. Lay it on its side, flange side towards the solid jaw, use the flats in the hex to align the part for the side hole
+Omkar Bhattarai da hell you on about? XD Look. Fusion costs $25/mo for business's, free for everyone else. MasterCAM is $15-$20k plus maintenance fees. Yet Fusion for 2D and 3D is nearly identical to Mastercam. Mastercam may have a a slight edge. But not when you factor the massive cost difference. But hey. It's your money to waste, not mine. For 90% of 2D and 3D work Fusion is more than capable.
+Occams Sawzall cost is not important bt how eassy work you ll find during n how u going to save ur time ur power n many more less cost give more result. more this is so eassy to do any work. even in learner. s its ur openion with ur experience so u also right.
I am a little disappointed in you. I understand you removing gun parts from this sight (understand not approve) however you said you would continue them on the other site and I haven't seen any. What's up?
I hope Autodesk recognizes your wonderful contribution to their community and
promotion of fan base. Your knowledge sharing with this is huge.
Thank you so much for all your effort.
As some have added, I would use Touch surfaces and Contact point boundary. The tool didn't go off the end of the part during surfacing because you didn't have Contact Point Boundary checked it was using the centerline of the tool to contain it. When you check CPB it uses the actual point of contact on the ball mill
Right on. I always enjoy seeing how you power through cam and modeling issues. I probably learn more in those few minutes than anywhere else.
Great tutorial John.............I am always amazed, I am trying to soak it all in! Thanks for these vids
If you want to select specific faces to 3D machine. Go to that little "Avoid/Touch surfaces" check box. Select the faces you want to surface, and check the "touch surface" box. It's a sub-check box that comes up after checking the avoid/touch check box.
That will limit the toolpath to only the surfaces you select.
+1
+chronok I disagree. A more complex surfaced part will require multiple size ball endmills. Being able to specifically target surface sections, while avoiding neighboring sections is far better than trying to 2d contain and fiddle with the boundary extents.
Also much faster to calculate than surfacing an entire part with a larger BEM than going back and rest surfacing with a smaller one.
Sweet tip!
John if you hold down ALT when picking your machining boundary it will automatically only select the line your on, Then keep clicking the lines to fill your boundry. you can skip the whole thing at 17:04
Didn't know about the perpendicular passes setting, very cool.
Great information in this video John. I really like the knurling tip
Great video John! Love the machining boundary tip, thanks.
Always learn something in your videos. Thanks!!
You should try using the avoid/touch with that ball mill at the end, works better when you combine it with a tool containment. change your containment to outside and then give it a touch surface that is the angled bit on that toe clamp.
Lots of great tips in this video John! Thanks
Man, coming from mastercam, that surfacing op was brutal! I dont have fusion but from what I can see it really has some nice featutes. Hopefully some day I can use it.
-Alex
Love the tip at 6:15!
Nice one John. I liked that perpendicular passes feature and it would be good if you could include how it looks in a future video.
feel like I'm in school when I watch these,I'm taking notes n shit,nice John
Of course, for a part like this, design around the stock!
Thanks Johnny
Wow, your speed and proficiency with fusion is growing weekly John. ... as the teenagers say these days "you got mad skills" lol
Awesome. Thanks John.
Hi John, I did a lot of 3D machiening lately and learned that you dont have to use a ball mill a lot of the time. Using a flat mill has a way better cutting speed at the contact point and has more contact surface - larger steppover for good surface finish. I only use ball mills for concave surfaces. I think for convex shapes a flat mill is more efficient or for what you did at the front of the clamp. ...edit: although the effect is cool :)
Problem with a flat endmill is that your surface will most likely be incorrect. A flat endmill isn't actually flat on the bottom. The bottom is actually dished out for relief. It you're surfacing up and over a convex surface the tool path will start cutting with the leading edge, as it goes up the radius, when it reaches near the apex it'll move towards cutting with the center of the tool, and as it comes down will cut with the tools trailing edge.
Since the tools center is dished and not compensated for, the sections it cut with the center area of the tool won't correctly match the profile.
You can get away with using a flat if you up or down mill only and tell the CAM to force using leading or trailing edge tool comp only. A bull endmill would still be better though
You are right! Never thought of that. But for my applications this very very (very! :) minor inaccuracy never was an issue. Sure, if the mill is quite large in relation to the feature it really could be an issue but I was more refering to relationships like the one in the clamp video.
+der ProtoTyp
Yes. Certainly for cosmetic only surfaces where it's just there to look pretty, a flat endmill is fine without having to do anything fancy.
Awesome video! I like it
You could also use the slope option to limit the toolpath.
Hi John great vid. When you are going to simulate just one operation why don't you just select that tool path then sim instead of sim the whole part and fast forward.
John, fascinating
or you could just get a stock that is a little thicker in height, mill everything at once without screws (but a little deeper than the part itself). If thats done, just turn it around (upper side facing down in the jaws), touch the parallels or what the part is laying on and say Z -*part thickness* (like -15mm). Face it at Z0 and done :)
Take your "like" and go. :D
Another good one! Thanks!
That crosshatch pattern you did on the slope with the parallel looked like it had a really rough surface finish in the cam. How did it actually turn out? When you showed a view from the side in the simulation it looked bumpy, at about 19:00 to 19:01. Also on another note, why not recess the part a little bit into the fixture?
Like so many Fusion 360 vids, you got off into the tangent weeds there. Throwing in all the extra little shortcuts you've learned over time overloads viewers to the point of frustration by trying to take it all in....
If you had to fixture it more precisely, could you have extruded the slot up 0.01" or so on the fixture? That would give an internal shoulder to position the part, but not interfere with the two bolts or the milling ops. Is it difficult to get the slots and such a fixture to fit precisely enough?
what would we do without McMaster?!
A great tutorial thank you
Why would you leave the bottom side Black-Mill finish and machine the top side?
The Bottom side is in contact with your part (and your step block) and you should prefer that to be the smooth flat surface, you shouldn't care as much about the top side being black-mill finish since it's only in contact with the washer under the clamping nut.
cheers
I would have approached it differently and skipped the fixture entirely. If you hold the additional stock material in the vise and face, drill, slot, machine outside perimeter and 3D all in one op. Then I would just flip the project in the vise and then machine the excess material off the bottom.
LOL yep waste of time on the fixturing
+Chief Machining
I sometimes wonder if he does things inefficiently specifically to showcase certain things you can do in Fusion, rather than show the best most efficient (or easiest) way to do something
Really counterproductive then.. Find a sample that showcases what you're trying to accomplish instead horribly inefficient part.
+Chief Machining
If he were doing multiple parts at once he could take this single station fixture and transform it for multiple stations easily. So it's easily scalable design wise. For a single part, ya it's not great. But for multiple parts with one setup this would be a better way.
Not even that is good idea. I would just cut them into strips to get 2 or 3 space so you could get 3/8 endmill and mill soft jaws for the parts and face them to thickness and chamfer
where do you buy aluminum
yeah that way of selecting a face is crazy, but I have faith the fusion team will fix it as they have done with many other little bugs.
Good stuff, thanks!
One more piece to this: When you make a fixture, check the "fixture" box and select the fixture object/component/bodies. This will let collision detection "see" the fixture and it will show up red in the simulation bar.
-Elizabeth "only machined away the end of one clamp" Greene
Whoa... is the McMasterCarr addon a default, or did u download it?
It's a default. Comes with Fusion
Great man 👌👌👌
Great video. I would skip the fixture. Add approximate.150in to the bottom to hold in the vice. Finish the part completely. Then flip the part in the vice and skim off the bottom.
For your second circle, I'd use a 2 point circle.
John, you don't have to create a new component 100% of the time. In fact doing so will cause problems in some cases... take this toe clamp for example. If you were to use it in another design, it would be nested one level too deep in your BOM & Browser.... for no good reason. I personally encourage users to think and decide if they need a new component as the first step during the modelling process.
Since it's a new component, couldn't ou simply just export out that single component and use it in other assemblies that way?
+Occams Sawzall there is only one component in the design. Don't forget that a Fusion design file is in its very nature a component already. Doing what you suggest would create a duplicate file in the project, with the BOM structure of how the design file should have been to begin with.
+Scott Moyse technically there's 3 components. The clamp, his fixture plate, and the screw he imported.
I keep assemblies, sub assemblies and individual components in separate folders under each project. Keeps things better organized for me.
+Occams Sawzall that will teach me for not watching the whole video... there's been a few fusion videos lately that start by telling users they HAVE to create a new component before they do anything else. Which just isn't true, and frankly would instill bad practice.
+Scott Moyse agree. If you're just making one single part nothing extra, making a new component doesn't give any benefit and isn't needed.
Hi John! How would you do the pre-drill (4:39) in a square or rectangular slot? I know a endmill is not gonna reach the corners, but I would like to know how to pre-drill such a slot to prevent the ramp in.
Similar way. Draw a circle but make it tangent to 3 lines instead of 2
Also you can pre-drill any where in your slot or square and any size hole as long as it is bigger then your end mill your using to rough out the slot or square.
If I become a Patreon supporter, can I request a custom lesson on something?
Congratulations, your tutorial its great! I have two questions, as I can generate code from 360 fusion and I wonder if 360 fusion supports mach3?
Thanks for your tutorials
Yes, Fusion 360 has a Mach 3 Post Processor. I use it all the time.
it's nice to see how the cam works ..... BUT ....
doing a short run of parts like that . I would just clamp the fixture at angle X and lob it off.
guess I'm just old school...
Exactly. Must be quicker to set it up on a sine bar in the Bridgeport than to do all that parallel ball mill stuff on the CNC, and you'd get a flat surface on the toe. +Abom79 would have smashed that off in one pass with a slab mill on the K&T :)
He has a fourth axis that he never uses, but it could do this very easy.
my humbel request to admin can I have a video that the process of making cnc machine zero position on center,cent top , corner side through 3d sencer.
what is the difference between extrude and press pull?
Extrude uses a 2D sketch as the base profile for an extrusion.
Press pull alters an existing solid/ face surface
press pull seems to work for extruding sketches too.
did u consider pedestal machining? no fixture needed. just need to face off backside. less operations and more accurate not that its really necessary here but free! perhaps this was not done for the lessons being taught.
Would mind explaining for us dim ones🤓
I am new to CNC work in my hobby shop
Great video John funny I am just about to make som small toe clamps
also known as 5 side machining. start off with a pc of stock thicker than the final size such that you have enough to clamp on the vise and be able to machine all 5 sides including the slot and angled surface and hole. doing so the part is as accurate as the machine and cutters. flip the part over and face off back side. you may waste more material (assuming it can be made from stock size) but you do not need a fixture and the setup for the second op is a simple face cut.
+Stuart Hardy
Never heard the term "pedestal machining" but I think I know where he's going with this.
Instead of leaving all the stock on the top of the part. Leave all the stock on the bottom of the part. You'd clamp on that extra stock on the bottom so the the bottom of your finished part is above the top of your vice jaws.
This way you can machine the slot, profile, tapped hole and the sloped nose in the first op.
Second op is to simply flip it over and face mill off the extra stock to bring the part into its finished thickness.
No fixture required
+Occams Sawzall now it has been explained that's the way I do my small one offs,( by small they are 25mm square and 5 mm thick)
Thanks for taking the time to educate me
Stuart
How would you mill a hex collar for hex shaft ? I feel like that would be really hard to do
What kind of hex collar? Single split? Double split?
Either way it's pretty easy. You can "cheat" and drill out the corners of the hex with a #58 (.042) drill. Then machine out the hex and finish the inside walls of the hex with a 1/16" endmill.
Or you can buy one online for like $4....
This is what we are looking making, its a custom spacing for the robot im building normal i would just buy the collar like you said but with where its going a store bought one wont really work.
Picture of our part : imgur.com/a/fIuN3
+alex chisolm that's pretty easy unless you absolutely need the sharp corners (which you rarely ever do)
Start with the flange side down. Skim the top flat, contour the hub profile and flange profile. Drill holes through the part at each corner of the hex (use the points as the center position for the hole) pocket out and finish the hex.
Flip the part mill to overall height.
Lay it on its side, flange side towards the solid jaw, use the flats in the hex to align the part for the side hole
Thank you so much for the help. Im just starting getting into machining like this so im still fairly uncertain about everything
+alex chisolm
No problem.
And learning to machine invariably requires breaking a few tools and scrapping some parts ;)
Damn. I’m like number 666 😂
master cam is better then this for 3d cnc n lathe programme making. I think
I'd say for 3D milling Fusion is on par with Mastercam.
Lathe MasterCAM is better.
But now compare the price of each..,
+Occams Sawzall price is different of both master cam is heigher then, bt master cam is so eassy no no more step to do any 3 d n 2 d
+Omkar Bhattarai da hell you on about? XD
Look. Fusion costs $25/mo for business's, free for everyone else.
MasterCAM is $15-$20k plus maintenance fees.
Yet Fusion for 2D and 3D is nearly identical to Mastercam. Mastercam may have a a slight edge. But not when you factor the massive cost difference.
But hey. It's your money to waste, not mine. For 90% of 2D and 3D work Fusion is more than capable.
+Occams Sawzall cost is not important bt how eassy work you ll find during n how u going to save ur time ur power n many more less cost give more result. more this is so eassy to do any work. even in learner. s its ur openion with ur experience so u also right.
wHy WaStE tImE MaKing ThEsE bUt YoU cOuLd Buy ThEsE fOr LiKe nOtHiNg
Yeah, why educate people, they could learn something..
I am a little disappointed in you. I understand you removing gun parts from this sight (understand not approve) however you said you would continue them on the other site and I haven't seen any. What's up?
Fantastic project! I learned a great deal. Thanks!