Allosaurus is really underrated, it's a shame that it isn't featured in mainstream media as much other carnivorous Dinosaurs like T-Rex or Velociraptor. Ok so it wasn't as big as Tyrannosaurus, Spinosaurus, or Giganotosaurus. It was still a unique and interesting Dinosaur in it's own way and it deserves more appreciation than it gets.
until those other giant carnivores emerged in pop culture like spinosaurus and those massive allosauridaes like charcarodontosaurus and even bigger mapusaurus and giganotosaurs ,i think allosaurus was the second famous carnivore dinosaur after tyrannosaurs. BTW a question to you would you think it would help allosaurs in popularity if it would turn out that saurophaganax and allosaurs are the same species ?
@@19megamustaine85 Maybe, I think one of the main reasons Allosaurus isn't as popular as say T-Rex is because while it was definitely a very large animal it wasn't as large some of the largest Theropods ever. Saurophaganax was absolutely massive though (especially for late Jurassic standards since most Theropods didn't get that big until the Cretaceous when Theropods truly reached their peak in terms of size) so if it turns that it was the same animal as Allosaurus (which I think it was, or at least a subspecies of Allosaurus the same way Kodiak bears are a subspecies of the brown/grizzly bear) I think that would help Allosaurus become more popular because it would be comparable in size to Tyrannosaurus and the other giant Theropods of the Cretaceous.
@@19megamustaine85 Well the "Velociraptor" people are familiar with was actually based on Deaniychus as I'm sure you already know. Real Velociraptor was only about as big as a small dog or a coyote.
That's when Saurophaganax Maximus comes in. Didn't rival a rex at size, but it was a far larger allosaurid, and could put up a good fight against the trex if they ever met.
@@eybaza6018 I am doubtful that a Torvosaurus would choose to bite a prone Allosaurus on a difficult to reach and non-vital area like that. Dinosaur Revolution tried to make a story out of it though.
I was so surprised to see you only have 300 subscribers, this is a great and informative video! Would you ever do a profile on Dilophosaurus? It’s one of my favorite dinosaurs.
That was a really in-depth well-done dive into the Allosaurus, one of my all-time favorite dinosaurs. I am a little late to the party, but thank you for the video, mate. It was a joy to watch. :)
Thanks for pointing out the usage of the word hoofs in contrast to hooves and then leaving the audience stranded wondering what the difference is. When You say A You must also say B. One is meaningless without the other.
You have me here. I had never read the plural ‘hoofs’ before. I thought that it might be a typo in the original literature or an Americanism (like ‘dove’ instead of ‘dived’). But no, hoofs is a valid option.
@@palaeo_channel Nice to have gotten Your attention. I hope I didn't blow this Teeny Tiny detail out of proportion, but I saw room for improvement here.
Awesome video love your stuff, I think you should do an update video on the allo or at least it's hunting techniques and bite force some more recent show it may have had a much higher bite force than the aforementioned bite force
I am considering an update as I do not think I made it clear that I support the slash-and-tear hunting technique. In looking up more recent studies, I still see low bite forces, although the strong neck would have allowed the mouth to deliver powerful strikes. If you know of something that I have missed, let me know.
@@palaeo_channel recent studies have suggested that their bite was about average for their size and would use the tactic of inflicting large deep wounds. Think of like how wolves hunt large animals like moose and elk
I keep hearing this about recent studies about a higher bite force, but haven’t come across any. If you could provide a link or point me in the right direction, I would really appreciate it.
Found the paper: “Estimating bite force in extinct dinosaurs using phylogenetically predicted physiological cross-sectional areas of jaw adductor muscles” by Manabu Sakamoto. I had actually saved this for later reading, but it is a list of estimations. Very good estimations, but estimations nontheless. In the discussion portion, the author makes this clear using esxamples of Deinonychus and oviraptors, but the same could be said of Allosaurus as the loose muscles that allowed its jaws to open so wide would have weakened its bite to be outside the estimated range of these other dinosaurs. I will be looking into this further, though. If you are concerned about Allosaurus’ predator cred, fear not. It could have used its body and heavily muscled neck to tear apart prey with its jaws without the need for strong jaw muscles. Also, Allosaurus was a ferocious kick-boxer using hands, tail, and feet when attacking. There is an Allosaurus jaw that healed crooked, but the animal survived, taking down prey when its mouth was literally broken.
You don't need much force to cut you need a sharp edge. Allosaurus was likely taking bites out of large animals and not worrying about the bone. T-Rex hunted more armored prey and animals around its own size whereas Allosaurus was probably removing big chunks from larger prey or smaller prey.
Exactly my point. Some researchers have questioned Allosaurus’ predator status due to its bite, but they are comparing it to crocodilians, felines, and canines, all of which are bite-oriented. Allosaurus was a very different predator.
thats because they are. Allosaurus's have a weak jaw/bite force for their size, while t rex has the strongest bite force of any terrestrial animal. not to mention the size difference, the biggest species of allosaurs only weigh 1/3rd the size of an average t rex.
@@GodofSteel first of all, saurophaganax rivaled tyrannosaurus in size, next allosaurus wasnt evolved to have a strong bite, that wasnt its hunting technique
@@andrewjohnson115 the reason why I bring up bite forces is because in a fight between two dinosaurs that's usually the deciding factor the rest is just luck. and to say that saurophaganax rivals t rex in size is a stretch. the biggest of the species is around 9,900 pounds, while the modern estimate for the average adult trex is now 18,000 pounds.
@@GodofSteel sorry i forgot to mention i meant length, but im just trying to say that they are still powerful animals and not as weak and pathetic as they seem just cause they arent the famous t rex which was a scavenger primarily i believe
@@andrewjohnson115 t rex was not primarily a scavenger. there are many fossils remains showing that they not only killed and hunted herbivores but even fought and killed each other. that study about t rex being a scavenger was made by jack horner who is an absolute clown and is rejected by all paleontologist and scientist. do you really think that tyrannosaurs went through millions of years of evolution, evolving to become stronger just to eat already dead animals?
Thanks Andrew, I also enjoyed this very much. For me you provide more detail so that I feel I am learning more, rather than the frothy reports of David Attenborough god bless him. Many many thanks...CJ
A komodo dragon has the biteforce of a housecat. You don't want to get bitten by one if if its bite was not venomous and it had just brushed its teeth.
There are claims, but they use the largest possible size estimates and use a mass calculation from 1985. No similar estimates have been in the literature since and are increasingly unlikely to due to air sacs being considered in calculations. Recent calculations of Saurophaganax have not exceeded 3 tonnes. The popular consensus is that an adult Allosaurus of about 9.7 metres weighed around 1 tonne.
I would like to point out one small mistake. New studies have calculated that allosaurus had a bite force of 6000 to 9000 newtons just wanted to point that out no hate at all
I can’t put a link, but here’s the name of the study ,Estimating maximum bite performance in Tyrannosaurus rex using multi-body dynamics and then after that, click the first blue link
Stegosaurus’s plates make much more sense as defensive armour now considering allosaurus used the “hatchet” technique to attack prey. Imagine one of those plates breaking through the roof of your mouth… ouch.
While I think that Allosaurus used “slash and tear” attacks rather than a specific hatchet manoeuvre, I do think that stegosaur spines were defensive, like Kentrosaurus and Decentrurus. However, the placement and structure of specifically Stegosaurus’ plates indicate display to me while the thagomizers on the tail were effective weapons. I talk about this in my Stegosaurus video.
Hasn’t the hatchet strike hypothesis been largely overturned? It’s not like every top predator needs thousands of newtons of bite force or to replace it with something equally over the top. Allosaurus wasn’t a bone cruncher, it didn’t need to pull absurd figures.
The hatchet hypothesis has received a lot of push back, and I am more of the idea that Allosaurus used its neck to deliver slash and tear attacks. I admit that I probably spent too much time talking about the hatchet hypothesis for this to be clear to everyone. I am currently thinking about making a follow-up bonus video exclusively on Allosaurus' bite and unique predator traits.
Correction, one possible carnosaur had feathers. Scurruimimus (while it’s identity is debated) might be a megalosauriod and since megalosauriods are quite likely carnosaurs now thanks to asphaltsvenator, it is possible that carnosaurs had feathers
Some carnosaurs might have had feathers as there is evidence of them being a very basal trait in dinosaurs. It does seem to have been very easy for some to switch back to scales (like mammoths and elephants with fur). Large carnosaurs like Allosaurus and its close relatives that we have evidence of show little to no evidence of scales, and feathers would likely have messed with the thermoregulation of an animal in that environment and of that size. There are always possibilities, but I often go along with what seems likely and try to be clear when I am weighing probability.
The bite force calculations are bogus imo I definitely believe theropods bite force for ones that weighed over 1000lbs would be double or quadruple what we think for example allo probably had a strong bite like tigers or alligators and rexes were probably far scarier than we think they are bite force wise. Fast rex is bogus too they could maybe move at max 15mph otherwise they would disintegrate their leg bones. My theory for dino roars is they probably had a muscle mechanism for pushing out air and would probably make different sounds as they did it so it was more of bellowing than roaring with what we see in lions, to put it simply dino inhales then exhales while flexing throat muscle and making a very loud bellow in the process
A tibia was found in the Tendaguru Formation that was originally identified as an Allosaurid, possibly an African species of Allosaurus. The latest that I can see about it is that it is now considered an unidentifiable Tetanuran, probably a megalosauroid or carcharodontosaurid in 2011.
It does look absurd from looking at most modern apex predators and how they kill with their bite. Allosaurus seems to have been more like a bird of prey, which have weak bites, but use their talons and the sharp points of their beaks. Allosaurus could slash and tear using its powerful neck without biting down with significant force.
Allosaurus had a weak bite force but very strong neck muscles that could drive the sharp strong teeth. It would have closed its mouth around something, or dug its teeth into flesh, and then use its strong neck to pull and twist. This requires little bite force.
@@palaeo_channel this makes sense for flesh but I don't really get how it has a strong enough bite force to hold onto a stegosaurus back plate and tear it off which you can't really do to bone because it's very strong against tension Edit: also it seems kind of awkward to "hatched" method into a plate that's pointing up towards the sky, but if you have an explanation I wanna hear it because I'm becoming a fan
Although I talk about the ‘hatchet’ technique, I think that Allosaurus performed more slash-and-tear attacks. Although we do not know how the tip of the plate broke off, the struggle of two multi-tonne animals might have provided the force, while the jaw provided the fulcrum. Allosaurus was strong, just could not bite down too hard. It was just the tip that broke off. While the bite force might be incorrect, multiple studies have corroborated it and appears to have been a trade-off for a wide gape.
I probably did spend too much time talking about the hatchet method. I did say that I do not agree with it and go with the slash and tear method outlined in the paper. That could have been explained better, though. I also dislike saying that anything in paleontology has been ‘disproven’. It can be criticised and evidence presented against it, but little can be proven or disproven.
@@palaeo_channel i like the idea of nothing being disproved, paleontology is such a vast field. Thank you for the reply and opening me upto new ideas and ways of thinking of things.
Besides the highly outdated and biased notion that Allosaurus outcompeted every single large carnivore to the forests,great video!It seems that was simply a case of niche partitioning and the dominance of drier environments in the Morrison,limiting the habitat of all of it's competitors besides Saurophaganax,which,alongside Torvosaurus would logically demolish Allosaurus 1v1
I do not know what research has been done that makes Allosaurus' dominance 'outdated'. While it is true that dinosaurs like Torvosaurus and Ceratosaurus had adaptations that benefitted them in the gallery forests, niche partitioning is not so clear as Allosaurus is found in the forest environments as well as the plains. Also, outcompeted among carnivores does not mean one being able to beat one in a fight. It is about the ability to hunt and bring down prey. While a large, powerful carnivore can claim other predators' kills, successful hunters generally still win out.
I don't know much about it either,but what you presented is a highly,dare I use that word biased and simplistic notion.Larger predators generally need more food and more specific conditions anyway so the Allosaurus' ,,dominance" could have been to it's relatively smaller size,adaptations for the plains and the ability to survive insane injuries.Probably same thing as with hyaenas and lions,sure the hyaenas may be morenumerous and have a higher kill succes % rate,but lions are higher in the trophic level and win unless outnumbered.@@palaeo_channel
Getting down to real numbers, 1 of the 9 Torvosaurus found from the Formation was found in a plain environment. The rest were in a channel or unknown environment. For Allosaurus, 50 were found in channel environments that Torvosaurus was native to. Forget trophic levels, that seems pretty dominant to me. I am working on a video with all of these Morrison Formation stats.
@@palaeo_channel Trophic levels are literally the definition of being an apex predator. The higher you are,the higher up prey you eat,which in this case would have included fellow predators such as Allosaurus and Ceratosaurus. Simply the fact an animal is more common does not necessarily mean it's the apex predator.The best analogy for the several large carnivores of the Morrison that I can think of is Pleistocene North America,Smilodon fatalis,the American lion and Panthera onca augusta all coexisting. The big 3 of the Morrison (Allosaurus,Torvosaurus and Saurophaganax)were probably similar in trophic position,but when it comes to 1v1 combat the substantially larger and more robust animal almost always wins if healthy.Another factor is how trophic level work to begin with,the higher you are,the more prey you need to sustain yourself-thus making your species rarer and seemingly less ,, dominant ".
@@palaeo_channel Judging by the top notch quality content you're providing, you will have many thousand subscribers in no time. Liking all your videos! Please keep em coming!
Glad that you're enjoying it. The book is very graphics heavy and iBooks has interactive elements. I have been looking into revising it and expanding into other platforms. Do you know any self publishing platforms that support books with graphics?
These are the highest numbers for a Rex bite force i have seen in my 25 years of paleo theory. The speed estimates seem incredibly conservative. Allosaurus was built for speed, being one of the sub apex Carnivores out there sacrificing a lot to gain more speed. These speeds are in the realm of a Giganotosaurus that is easily 4 times heavier and maxing out what's physically possible; plus, it was also making a lot of sacrifices to have massive bite force in a giant skull and being a long- distance sprinter on top. How terrible and pointless is Allosaurus to You, if it fails so massively and on the other hand, as evidence provides was so successful. It seems to have gained nothing from this. 🤯 As far as I remember long legs are not needed to be fast. They provide long distance running, especially the length of the femur is a good indicator, the tibia giving speed and the metatarsals acceleration, as a rule of thumb. Speeds exceeding 50km/h - 30mph the max speed of an elephant are much more realistic, maybe even reaching up to 65km/h - 40mph, always lagging behind Carnotaurus, OFC; the fastest sub apex Carnivorous Dinosaur of all time. Elephants weigh 2 - 3 times more having shorter legs and being quadrupedal without the ability to gallop. Tho their speed IS Impressive, so was Allosaurus'.
I have had a look back at my notes and the 57,000N bite force for Tyrannosaurus is from the 2012 study: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3391458/pdf/rsbl20120056.pdf It is the upper calculation from the study for adults, but it has estimates for Allosaurus that are lower than the warm-blooded force I referred to from a later study. I have also seen higher estimates. I took the 19-34mph speed from a biomechanical analysis of various theropods that I have not managed to find again (I do keep a closer eye on my references now). An upper limit of 34mph does not seem too far fetched as Giganotosaurus was calculated at 31mph in 2001. Both had similar leg structures and could not run with both feet off the ground. Allosaurus had faster strides, but Giganotosaurus had longer legs, a tradeoff that sees elephants of different sizes having the the same speed today. Comparing theropods to large mammals is tricky though. I refer to this in my Deinonychus video, but bird legs work very differently to mammalian ones, so femur length becomes far less important as tibia and metatarsal lengths. In fact, relatively small femurs in birds is usually a sign of speed. I would refer you to the work of John Hutchinson, who specialises in dinosaur locomotion. Allosaurus is among my favourite dinosaurs, and I do not think that a
I still doubt Allosaurus had *THAT* weak of a jaw force, there's no way an animal that big had such weak jaw muscles. Sure it has weak jaws in comparison but nowhere near that bad.
Remember that those muscles were just for closing the jaw. Allosaurus had slashing teeth wielded by a strongly muscled neck. With the clawed hands and feet, it did not necessarily need a bone-crushing bite.
Omg near the start you actually said "genie"! Genus is the singular, genera is the plural. It's a 3rd declension Neuter noun with a rhotal stem increment, easy; meaning "kind" or "sort". Could it be that Latin is not being taught in schools quite as widely as it used to be? Surely not. That would be dire. Can you imagine?? At least Greek is safe. Isn't it? Please tell me they aren't going to start dropping Greek too! (I should calm down: of course nobody would drop Greek from the curriculum.)
I could see Sub adults potentially hunting in a group. What if, this is way out there and almost impossible but there was either a very mean Allo or another large Predator that basically claimed the Quarry area was it's territory. Possible territory fighting? This is just me throwing imaginary shit at walls because it's fun sometimes.
Sorry about how long it took me to get back to you. I do like the out-of-the-box thinking, but I don't think so. Predators don't generally fight over anything if they can help it. They risk enough fighting with their food. A group of subadults would also not get together for territory that only one of them can own. Also there are the remains of huge herbivores. These could not be brought to the area as even a 1 tonne Allosaurus would not be able to carry a 14 tonne Camarasaurus. Like I said, I like your thinking, but the large predator trap flowing into a smaller space seems like the most probable for me.
I bet the theories about the inability for Dinosaurs to roar is false, you need only own a rooster, corvid, or large parrot to discover birds can indeed achieve a very loud roar, and for prolonged times....just these 3 examples familiar living descendants of dinosauria are quite capable of a wide range of sounds in high and low frequencies. I think it would be abundantly ignorant to imagine that dinosaurs could not do the same or better! I love the videos though, I just vehemently disagree with that particular theory....but that just me right?
It is certainly true that birds can achieve very loud calls. What I was talking about was a throaty verbalisation called a roar. All Archosaurs, roosters and corvids included, produce their sounds from their chests. This would sound very different from a huge dinosaur than a mammalian roar.
@@palaeo_channel There is an African Grey Parrot that has a Death Metal Band named "Hatebeak", the avian frontman demonstrates very convincing guttural growls...Check it out!
@@palaeo_channel I particularly enjoy "Planet of Dinosaurs" (1977) and the vocalizations they decided to use for their "go motion" alien Tyrannosaurs! (no clue what they used as a sample to synthesize the sound effects, but it's pretty eerie, wild, and cool) Hollywood traditionally uses the "roars" (the Lion, Tiger, Bear Roars, and Elephant Shrills), but the sounds featured in the movie seem more probable of what an angry Terror Bird or a menacing Theropod would produce in my opinion!
@@alexandercolon941 I never claimed that there was an allosaurus from Africa, but I have seen the Allosaurus europaeus specimen. If you have a study saying that it is something else, I would like to know.
Who is it that knew this animal was on the savannah? And Europe wasn't Europe back then it was just land! Couldn't even decide what it was now we know where it hunted... throw the study out the window
Spinosaurs have never been proposed as close relatives of Megaraptora,they're almost certainly basal Tyrannosauroids or the sister taxa to them.I understand your decision to not make a video on it though,not famous and a fragmentary mess.@@palaeo_channel
Allosaurus is my most favourite dinosaur of all, any media that expands on them to me is welcome
@Jayo Delaware nope, I'd still love it, even as I flee for my life
One piece has a guy that turns into one lol
I also love allosaurus
We meet again, my dear despondent butter chicken. Nice to see you not being a snot-nosed brat for once!
*The allosaurus had never seen such beautiful video before*
Underrated comment. :D
"Allosaurus had never seen such masterpiece before"
Allosaurus is really underrated, it's a shame that it isn't featured in mainstream media as much other carnivorous Dinosaurs like T-Rex or Velociraptor. Ok so it wasn't as big as Tyrannosaurus, Spinosaurus, or Giganotosaurus. It was still a unique and interesting Dinosaur in it's own way and it deserves more appreciation than it gets.
until those other giant carnivores emerged in pop culture like spinosaurus and those massive allosauridaes like charcarodontosaurus and even bigger mapusaurus and giganotosaurs ,i think allosaurus was the second famous carnivore dinosaur after tyrannosaurs. BTW a question to you would you think it would help allosaurs in popularity if it would turn out that saurophaganax and allosaurs are the same species ?
the funny thing is mainstream media only knows the fake velociraptor the real velociraptor is unknown .
@@19megamustaine85 Maybe, I think one of the main reasons Allosaurus isn't as popular as say T-Rex is because while it was definitely a very large animal it wasn't as large some of the largest Theropods ever. Saurophaganax was absolutely massive though (especially for late Jurassic standards since most Theropods didn't get that big until the Cretaceous when Theropods truly reached their peak in terms of size) so if it turns that it was the same animal as Allosaurus (which I think it was, or at least a subspecies of Allosaurus the same way Kodiak bears are a subspecies of the brown/grizzly bear) I think that would help Allosaurus become more popular because it would be comparable in size to Tyrannosaurus and the other giant Theropods of the Cretaceous.
@@19megamustaine85 Well the "Velociraptor" people are familiar with was actually based on Deaniychus as I'm sure you already know. Real Velociraptor was only about as big as a small dog or a coyote.
That's when Saurophaganax Maximus comes in. Didn't rival a rex at size, but it was a far larger allosaurid, and could put up a good fight against the trex if they ever met.
This video is really well-researched and an excellent summary of and its palaeoecology.
My favorite since I was a little kid ... and I'm 69 now.
9:08 - That explains why, in Dinosaur Revolution, Torvosaurus bit Allosaurus there.
As I said, it was probably a scavenging bite, considering the gymnastics that they had to do to get that bite in in Dinosaur Revolution.
Unless the much bigger Torvosaurus wrestled one to the ground@@palaeo_channel
@@eybaza6018 I am doubtful that a Torvosaurus would choose to bite a prone Allosaurus on a difficult to reach and non-vital area like that. Dinosaur Revolution tried to make a story out of it though.
Subbed. Really like these longer videos on dinosaurs and their environment.
This is fantastic. Keep up the good work
Triassic animals are vastly under represented in CZcams documentaries. Great Work. Loving this channel... cheers 🍻
wow i didnt expect there to be an allosaur that big! that changes some things
My favorite dinosaur, this video is a 10 outta 10
I was so surprised to see you only have 300 subscribers, this is a great and informative video! Would you ever do a profile on Dilophosaurus? It’s one of my favorite dinosaurs.
The dude has 1.89K now!
I’ve started to appreciate this dinosaur more over this last few months because of this video.Also this was really well made.Good job.
Excellent video!
Would like to see a Utah raptor profile!?!?
How about one about everyone’s favorite Jurassic underdog Ceratosaurus?
"I want more experience to do it justice," immediately after the conclusion of perhaps the most in-depth and we'll executed species profile on CZcams.
That was a really in-depth well-done dive into the Allosaurus, one of my all-time favorite dinosaurs. I am a little late to the party, but thank you for the video, mate. It was a joy to watch. :)
Thanks for pointing out the usage of the word hoofs in contrast to hooves and then leaving the audience stranded wondering what the difference is.
When You say A You must also say B. One is meaningless without the other.
You have me here.
I had never read the plural ‘hoofs’ before. I thought that it might be a typo in the original literature or an Americanism (like ‘dove’ instead of ‘dived’). But no, hoofs is a valid option.
@@palaeo_channel Nice to have gotten Your attention. I hope I didn't blow this Teeny Tiny detail out of proportion, but I saw room for improvement here.
I didn't realise there was a Big Al 2 .... these are fascinating Dinosaurs much more interesting than Tyrannosaurs 😉
Awesome video love your stuff, I think you should do an update video on the allo or at least it's hunting techniques and bite force some more recent show it may have had a much higher bite force than the aforementioned bite force
I am considering an update as I do not think I made it clear that I support the slash-and-tear hunting technique.
In looking up more recent studies, I still see low bite forces, although the strong neck would have allowed the mouth to deliver powerful strikes. If you know of something that I have missed, let me know.
@@palaeo_channel recent studies have suggested that their bite was about average for their size and would use the tactic of inflicting large deep wounds. Think of like how wolves hunt large animals like moose and elk
I keep hearing this about recent studies about a higher bite force, but haven’t come across any. If you could provide a link or point me in the right direction, I would really appreciate it.
@@palaeo_channel I'm at work looking for the specific study article but it was a study from 2022 showing a bite force of 9,389 newtons
Found the paper: “Estimating bite force in extinct dinosaurs using phylogenetically predicted physiological cross-sectional areas of jaw adductor muscles” by Manabu Sakamoto.
I had actually saved this for later reading, but it is a list of estimations. Very good estimations, but estimations nontheless. In the discussion portion, the author makes this clear using esxamples of Deinonychus and oviraptors, but the same could be said of Allosaurus as the loose muscles that allowed its jaws to open so wide would have weakened its bite to be outside the estimated range of these other dinosaurs. I will be looking into this further, though.
If you are concerned about Allosaurus’ predator cred, fear not. It could have used its body and heavily muscled neck to tear apart prey with its jaws without the need for strong jaw muscles. Also, Allosaurus was a ferocious kick-boxer using hands, tail, and feet when attacking. There is an Allosaurus jaw that healed crooked, but the animal survived, taking down prey when its mouth was literally broken.
You did a great job on this. I’m excited to see more from this channel
You don't need much force to cut you need a sharp edge. Allosaurus was likely taking bites out of large animals and not worrying about the bone. T-Rex hunted more armored prey and animals around its own size whereas Allosaurus was probably removing big chunks from larger prey or smaller prey.
Exactly my point. Some researchers have questioned Allosaurus’ predator status due to its bite, but they are comparing it to crocodilians, felines, and canines, all of which are bite-oriented. Allosaurus was a very different predator.
its funny how some people think that the theropods of the jurassic were pathetic next to a t-rex
thats because they are. Allosaurus's have a weak jaw/bite force for their size, while t rex has the strongest bite force of any terrestrial animal. not to mention the size difference, the biggest species of allosaurs only weigh 1/3rd the size of an average t rex.
@@GodofSteel first of all, saurophaganax rivaled tyrannosaurus in size, next allosaurus wasnt evolved to have a strong bite, that wasnt its hunting technique
@@andrewjohnson115 the reason why I bring up bite forces is because in a fight between two dinosaurs that's usually the deciding factor the rest is just luck. and to say that saurophaganax rivals t rex in size is a stretch. the biggest of the species is around 9,900 pounds, while the modern estimate for the average adult trex is now 18,000 pounds.
@@GodofSteel sorry i forgot to mention i meant length, but im just trying to say that they are still powerful animals and not as weak and pathetic as they seem just cause they arent the famous t rex which was a scavenger primarily i believe
@@andrewjohnson115 t rex was not primarily a scavenger. there are many fossils remains showing that they not only killed and hunted herbivores but even fought and killed each other. that study about t rex being a scavenger was made by jack horner who is an absolute clown and is rejected by all paleontologist and scientist. do you really think that tyrannosaurs went through millions of years of evolution, evolving to become stronger just to eat already dead animals?
I think pound for pound the Allosaurus the fiercest dinosaur ever.
Ever since seeing a display of an Allosaurus in the Univ of Mich Natural History Museum, I've always wished to know more. Thanks for this video.
My favourite dinosaur the mighty Allosaurus
Thanks Andrew, I also enjoyed this very much. For me you provide more detail so that I feel I am learning more, rather than the frothy reports of David Attenborough god bless him. Many many thanks...CJ
Absolutely love the use of Gustav Holst’s Mars bringer of war !!
A komodo dragon has the biteforce of a housecat. You don't want to get bitten by one if if its bite was not venomous and it had just brushed its teeth.
Very nice video aboit my favourite dinosaur, i believe there are claims of allosaurus weighting up to 4 tons for fragalis.
There are claims, but they use the largest possible size estimates and use a mass calculation from 1985. No similar estimates have been in the literature since and are increasingly unlikely to due to air sacs being considered in calculations. Recent calculations of Saurophaganax have not exceeded 3 tonnes.
The popular consensus is that an adult Allosaurus of about 9.7 metres weighed around 1 tonne.
No dislikes. Thats how you know it is a good video
Allosaurus is one of my personal favorite dinosaurs along with the spinosauridae
Great video, wish I found it sooner
Interesting compilation of qualities. Liked and subscribed.
10/10 Very nice series.
Zby is now my favorite dinosaur purely because if its name 😂
It was named after a Polish paleontologist with the surname Zbyszewski,but the namers saw that...and gave up😂
I would like to point out one small mistake. New studies have calculated that allosaurus had a bite force of 6000 to 9000 newtons just wanted to point that out no hate at all
I am thinking of revisiting Allosaurus’ bite in a future short, so I would be grateful if you could send me a link to one of those studies.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3391458
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3391458/
This is the study www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3391458/
I can’t put a link, but here’s the name of the study ,Estimating maximum bite performance in Tyrannosaurus rex using multi-body dynamics and then after that, click the first blue link
I love dinosaurs
I love your videos! I think you deserve more views, so I am liking and subscribing.
First I’ve heard of zby. Interesting name!
Allosaurus maximus vs Allosaurus fragilis would be like a lion vs a leopard.
Quite excellent. Looks like a Masters Thesis.
I love your video
Top documentation.
Don't forget the "Time Of The Titans" episode of Walking With Dinosaurs".
Stegosaurus’s plates make much more sense as defensive armour now considering allosaurus used the “hatchet” technique to attack prey. Imagine one of those plates breaking through the roof of your mouth… ouch.
While I think that Allosaurus used “slash and tear” attacks rather than a specific hatchet manoeuvre, I do think that stegosaur spines were defensive, like Kentrosaurus and Decentrurus. However, the placement and structure of specifically Stegosaurus’ plates indicate display to me while the thagomizers on the tail were effective weapons. I talk about this in my Stegosaurus video.
Hope you do one about Saurophaganax Allos bigger cousin
I love allosaurus
Hasn’t the hatchet strike hypothesis been largely overturned? It’s not like every top predator needs thousands of newtons of bite force or to replace it with something equally over the top. Allosaurus wasn’t a bone cruncher, it didn’t need to pull absurd figures.
The hatchet hypothesis has received a lot of push back, and I am more of the idea that Allosaurus used its neck to deliver slash and tear attacks.
I admit that I probably spent too much time talking about the hatchet hypothesis for this to be clear to everyone. I am currently thinking about making a follow-up bonus video exclusively on Allosaurus' bite and unique predator traits.
Thank you for this.
I appreciate more knowledge on my soul dino. 😎
Correction, one possible carnosaur had feathers. Scurruimimus (while it’s identity is debated) might be a megalosauriod and since megalosauriods are quite likely carnosaurs now thanks to asphaltsvenator, it is possible that carnosaurs had feathers
Some carnosaurs might have had feathers as there is evidence of them being a very basal trait in dinosaurs. It does seem to have been very easy for some to switch back to scales (like mammoths and elephants with fur). Large carnosaurs like Allosaurus and its close relatives that we have evidence of show little to no evidence of scales, and feathers would likely have messed with the thermoregulation of an animal in that environment and of that size.
There are always possibilities, but I often go along with what seems likely and try to be clear when I am weighing probability.
@@palaeo_channel ah okay, got it. Not carnosaurs in general but just large carnosaurs
What a magnificent animal
The bite force calculations are bogus imo I definitely believe theropods bite force for ones that weighed over 1000lbs would be double or quadruple what we think for example allo probably had a strong bite like tigers or alligators and rexes were probably far scarier than we think they are bite force wise. Fast rex is bogus too they could maybe move at max 15mph otherwise they would disintegrate their leg bones. My theory for dino roars is they probably had a muscle mechanism for pushing out air and would probably make different sounds as they did it so it was more of bellowing than roaring with what we see in lions, to put it simply dino inhales then exhales while flexing throat muscle and making a very loud bellow in the process
Cool, so basically crocodiles, if crocodiles were lions, but also sabre tooth cats
Great video:)
Allosaurus also lived in the tendaguru formation in tanzania
A tibia was found in the Tendaguru Formation that was originally identified as an Allosaurid, possibly an African species of Allosaurus. The latest that I can see about it is that it is now considered an unidentifiable Tetanuran, probably a megalosauroid or carcharodontosaurid in 2011.
I played a dinosaur hunting game on computer. I was ambushed and eaten many times by an allosaurus.
Those estimates for an Allosaurus bite force are absurd.
It does look absurd from looking at most modern apex predators and how they kill with their bite. Allosaurus seems to have been more like a bird of prey, which have weak bites, but use their talons and the sharp points of their beaks. Allosaurus could slash and tear using its powerful neck without biting down with significant force.
21:00 how is there a bite mark on the back plate if allosaurus has such a weak bite.
Allosaurus had a weak bite force but very strong neck muscles that could drive the sharp strong teeth. It would have closed its mouth around something, or dug its teeth into flesh, and then use its strong neck to pull and twist. This requires little bite force.
@@palaeo_channel this makes sense for flesh but I don't really get how it has a strong enough bite force to hold onto a stegosaurus back plate and tear it off which you can't really do to bone because it's very strong against tension
Edit: also it seems kind of awkward to "hatched" method into a plate that's pointing up towards the sky, but if you have an explanation I wanna hear it because I'm becoming a fan
Although I talk about the ‘hatchet’ technique, I think that Allosaurus performed more slash-and-tear attacks.
Although we do not know how the tip of the plate broke off, the struggle of two multi-tonne animals might have provided the force, while the jaw provided the fulcrum. Allosaurus was strong, just could not bite down too hard. It was just the tip that broke off.
While the bite force might be incorrect, multiple studies have corroborated it and appears to have been a trade-off for a wide gape.
Most Allosauruses are colored brown in life renderings, but I've always thought he was dark blue.
My favorite dino ❤
Whole video is great except the hatchet bite, been disproven for nearly 20 years now and the estimated bite force is based off of big al, a juvenile.
I probably did spend too much time talking about the hatchet method. I did say that I do not agree with it and go with the slash and tear method outlined in the paper. That could have been explained better, though.
I also dislike saying that anything in paleontology has been ‘disproven’. It can be criticised and evidence presented against it, but little can be proven or disproven.
@@palaeo_channel i like the idea of nothing being disproved, paleontology is such a vast field. Thank you for the reply and opening me upto new ideas and ways of thinking of things.
Can you make video about ceratosaurus?
What about sin raptor
Besides the highly outdated and biased notion that Allosaurus outcompeted every single large carnivore to the forests,great video!It seems that was simply a case of niche partitioning and the dominance of drier environments in the Morrison,limiting the habitat of all of it's competitors besides Saurophaganax,which,alongside Torvosaurus would logically demolish Allosaurus 1v1
I do not know what research has been done that makes Allosaurus' dominance 'outdated'. While it is true that dinosaurs like Torvosaurus and Ceratosaurus had adaptations that benefitted them in the gallery forests, niche partitioning is not so clear as Allosaurus is found in the forest environments as well as the plains.
Also, outcompeted among carnivores does not mean one being able to beat one in a fight. It is about the ability to hunt and bring down prey. While a large, powerful carnivore can claim other predators' kills, successful hunters generally still win out.
I don't know much about it either,but what you presented is a highly,dare I use that word biased and simplistic notion.Larger predators generally need more food and more specific conditions anyway so the Allosaurus' ,,dominance" could have been to it's relatively smaller size,adaptations for the plains and the ability to survive insane injuries.Probably same thing as with hyaenas and lions,sure the hyaenas may be morenumerous and have a higher kill succes % rate,but lions are higher in the trophic level and win unless outnumbered.@@palaeo_channel
Getting down to real numbers, 1 of the 9 Torvosaurus found from the Formation was found in a plain environment. The rest were in a channel or unknown environment. For Allosaurus, 50 were found in channel environments that Torvosaurus was native to. Forget trophic levels, that seems pretty dominant to me.
I am working on a video with all of these Morrison Formation stats.
@@palaeo_channel Trophic levels are literally the definition of being an apex predator. The higher you are,the higher up prey you eat,which in this case would have included fellow predators such as Allosaurus and Ceratosaurus. Simply the fact an animal is more common does not necessarily mean it's the apex predator.The best analogy for the several large carnivores of the Morrison that I can think of is Pleistocene North America,Smilodon fatalis,the American lion and Panthera onca augusta all coexisting. The big 3 of the Morrison (Allosaurus,Torvosaurus and Saurophaganax)were probably similar in trophic position,but when it comes to 1v1 combat the substantially larger and more robust animal almost always wins if healthy.Another factor is how trophic level work to begin with,the higher you are,the more prey you need to sustain yourself-thus making your species rarer and seemingly less ,, dominant ".
@@palaeo_channel It's been quite a while since the last upload,so can't wait!
I didn't need to know about flesh grazing.
Torvosaurus!!
It's on the list. I love spotlighting lesser known dinosaurs, but the big ones come first while I'm still trying to get this channel up and running.
@@palaeo_channel Judging by the top notch quality content you're providing, you will have many thousand subscribers in no time. Liking all your videos!
Please keep em coming!
And allosaurus is very awsome
Why not
Is your book available on any other platform than apple? Most unfortunate if not. This is a great series.
Glad that you're enjoying it. The book is very graphics heavy and iBooks has interactive elements. I have been looking into revising it and expanding into other platforms. Do you know any self publishing platforms that support books with graphics?
I think they were specialized in eating dead sauropods. They were like ground vultures
A recent study claimed that, but only for cold-blooded Allosaurus. Studies differ on how they fed based on whether they were warm or cold blooded.
These are the highest numbers for a Rex bite force i have seen in my 25 years of paleo theory.
The speed estimates seem incredibly conservative. Allosaurus was built for speed, being one of the sub apex Carnivores out there sacrificing a lot to gain more speed.
These speeds are in the realm of a Giganotosaurus that is easily 4 times heavier and maxing out what's physically possible; plus, it was also making a lot of sacrifices to have massive bite force in a giant skull and being a long- distance sprinter on top.
How terrible and pointless is Allosaurus to You, if it fails so massively and on the other hand, as evidence provides was so successful. It seems to have gained nothing from this.
🤯
As far as I remember long legs are not needed to be fast. They provide long distance running, especially the length of the femur is a good indicator, the tibia giving speed and the metatarsals acceleration, as a rule of thumb.
Speeds exceeding 50km/h - 30mph the max speed of an elephant are much more realistic, maybe even reaching up to 65km/h - 40mph, always lagging behind Carnotaurus, OFC; the fastest sub apex Carnivorous Dinosaur of all time. Elephants weigh 2 - 3 times more having shorter legs and being quadrupedal without the ability to gallop. Tho their speed IS Impressive, so was Allosaurus'.
I have had a look back at my notes and the 57,000N bite force for Tyrannosaurus is from the 2012 study: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3391458/pdf/rsbl20120056.pdf
It is the upper calculation from the study for adults, but it has estimates for Allosaurus that are lower than the warm-blooded force I referred to from a later study. I have also seen higher estimates.
I took the 19-34mph speed from a biomechanical analysis of various theropods that I have not managed to find again (I do keep a closer eye on my references now). An upper limit of 34mph does not seem too far fetched as Giganotosaurus was calculated at 31mph in 2001. Both had similar leg structures and could not run with both feet off the ground. Allosaurus had faster strides, but Giganotosaurus had longer legs, a tradeoff that sees elephants of different sizes having the the same speed today.
Comparing theropods to large mammals is tricky though. I refer to this in my Deinonychus video, but bird legs work very differently to mammalian ones, so femur length becomes far less important as tibia and metatarsal lengths. In fact, relatively small femurs in birds is usually a sign of speed. I would refer you to the work of John Hutchinson, who specialises in dinosaur locomotion.
Allosaurus is among my favourite dinosaurs, and I do not think that a
Not really a dinosaur question. But what is the song he’s using?
Planets by Holst. This one is a section from Mars.
I still doubt Allosaurus had *THAT* weak of a jaw force, there's no way an animal that big had such weak jaw muscles. Sure it has weak jaws in comparison but nowhere near that bad.
Remember that those muscles were just for closing the jaw. Allosaurus had slashing teeth wielded by a strongly muscled neck. With the clawed hands and feet, it did not necessarily need a bone-crushing bite.
Omg near the start you actually said "genie"! Genus is the singular, genera is the plural. It's a 3rd declension Neuter noun with a rhotal stem increment, easy; meaning "kind" or "sort". Could it be that Latin is not being taught in schools quite as widely as it used to be? Surely not. That would be dire. Can you imagine?? At least Greek is safe. Isn't it? Please tell me they aren't going to start dropping Greek too! (I should calm down: of course nobody would drop Greek from the curriculum.)
I could see Sub adults potentially hunting in a group.
What if, this is way out there and almost impossible but there was either a very mean Allo or another large Predator that basically claimed the Quarry area was it's territory. Possible territory fighting? This is just me throwing imaginary shit at walls because it's fun sometimes.
Sorry about how long it took me to get back to you.
I do like the out-of-the-box thinking, but I don't think so.
Predators don't generally fight over anything if they can help it. They risk enough fighting with their food. A group of subadults would also not get together for territory that only one of them can own.
Also there are the remains of huge herbivores. These could not be brought to the area as even a 1 tonne Allosaurus would not be able to carry a 14 tonne Camarasaurus.
Like I said, I like your thinking, but the large predator trap flowing into a smaller space seems like the most probable for me.
It's from Asia I think
Bummer. Blocked by ads. If I wanted politics, I'd look it up.
Camarasarus
Let me do Brachiosaurus and I will plan on it being the next sauropod.
I bet the theories about the inability for Dinosaurs to roar is false, you need only own a rooster, corvid, or large parrot to discover birds can indeed achieve a very loud roar, and for prolonged times....just these 3 examples familiar living descendants of dinosauria are quite capable of a wide range of sounds in high and low frequencies.
I think it would be abundantly ignorant to imagine that dinosaurs could not do the same or better!
I love the videos though, I just vehemently disagree with that particular theory....but that just me right?
It is certainly true that birds can achieve very loud calls. What I was talking about was a throaty verbalisation called a roar. All Archosaurs, roosters and corvids included, produce their sounds from their chests. This would sound very different from a huge dinosaur than a mammalian roar.
@@palaeo_channel allosaurus from north america not euorpe and africa
@@palaeo_channel There is an African Grey Parrot that has a Death Metal Band named "Hatebeak", the avian frontman demonstrates very convincing guttural growls...Check it out!
@@palaeo_channel I particularly enjoy "Planet of Dinosaurs" (1977) and the vocalizations they decided to use for their "go motion" alien Tyrannosaurs! (no clue what they used as a sample to synthesize the sound effects, but it's pretty eerie, wild, and cool)
Hollywood traditionally uses the "roars" (the Lion, Tiger, Bear Roars, and Elephant Shrills), but the sounds featured in the movie seem more probable of what an angry Terror Bird or a menacing Theropod would produce in my opinion!
@@alexandercolon941 I never claimed that there was an allosaurus from Africa, but I have seen the Allosaurus europaeus specimen. If you have a study saying that it is something else, I would like to know.
T rex is awsome
Who is it that knew this animal was on the savannah? And Europe wasn't Europe back then it was just land! Couldn't even decide what it was now we know where it hunted... throw the study out the window
19:43
Tyrannosaurus rex PLEASE!
Could you do megaraptor
Not planning on it I'm afraid. Not much is known about it, but it seems closely related to Spinosaurs or Tyrannosaurs rather than raptors.
Spinosaurs have never been proposed as close relatives of Megaraptora,they're almost certainly basal Tyrannosauroids or the sister taxa to them.I understand your decision to not make a video on it though,not famous and a fragmentary mess.@@palaeo_channel
❤
10/10 but you already knew that 😉
huh allosaurus bigger then t-rex ? sauro what ?
Saurophaganax
@@MonoNoAware_ make a video of that and thx for the name i google him haha i never know that dinosaur
The t rex
Baryonyx
Go allosaurus
Another comment for the YT gods.
Damn 😬 just be glad they’re extinct 24:38
Very nice video aboit my favourite dinosaur, i believe there are claims of allosaurus weighting up to 4 tons for fragalis.