Lets Talk About Stem Length | Is shorter always better?
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- čas přidán 2. 09. 2020
- In this video, I explain my journey of finding the right stem and why you should try different lengths too if you are finding your riding a little uninspiring.
Cheers
Andrew
Hip Pack: This is the Hip Pack I use and trust on every single ride: labaustere.com/ get 25% off using promo code: This.Bike.Life at check out! - Sport
Switched to a 40mm stem from a 50mm stem and man could I feel it in my hands. Seemed like the bike was shaking me like crazy. Felt like every bump was going straight to my hands. Switched back to the 50mm and things are back to normal. I was shocked how such small change (50mm to 40mm) could make such a big difference.
Biking is a game of millimeters. Some as motor sports which I have background in. I tried a 45 once from a 50 and honestly did not like it. Same as you went back to a 50. As front centers get longer I feel like it allows for opportunities for longer stems to compensate
My hardtail came stock with a 60mm stem and my wrists were getting very sore on long rides. I swapped it for a 35mm and I can't believe the difference. Amazing! I haven't noticed a difference in handling but it's way more comfortable now. Thanks for the tips and for saving my wrists.
No problem man! Thanks for watching!
Topic of my life at the moment.. 😜 Stem Fitting is critical to a bikes handling & your cockpit setup can make or break a bikes geometry ☝🏼
You are exactly right! How goes the stem battle?
Timely discussion. Thanks for making this video!
Was glad to do it. Going to try and tackle all the hot topics. I got a good idea brewing about wheel weight 🙃
Pinkbike did a good article on this, and the article basically says there does come a point where a stem can be too short. For me, I am finding longer to be better. I changed my BronsonV3 to a 50mm (had 35mm) and it immediately made the front end more grippy. For my DH bike (a Mullet 2021 Commencal Furious), I am using a 60mm stem. Long stems do look UN-COOL, but hey, I like it. I tried 40mm, 50mm, and 60mm stem on this DH bike and found that the 60mm felt best and offered the most grip.
I don’t like to argue about what other reviewers have done but I always maintain there isn’t a best or worst. It’s always up to the end user to decide what works best. I took the bait that shorter stems were the way to go but I found after just getting over my notion of fitting in that 50mm makes the bike feel much better overall with no less confidence in steeps. I do love 800mm bars though.
@@RideEatWander , I don't argue, I ONLY have DISCUSSIONS.... and actually there is a best and the worse, but that is all relative to the individual. I too fell for the gimmick of "shorter stem is better". Then eventually I found out the shorter stem naturally understeers and unweights the front end for both uphill and downhill. I myself will never go anything shorter than 50mm. I myself run 780mm bars, but also have no problems going as short as 740mm, I just have to adjust the stack height by adding/taking-off headset spacers to make up for the shorter or longer bars to get the same feel.
Been riding a 50mm Renthal on my Levo SL with a 160mm fork and it's been great. Slapped on a 40mm Renthal just for fun and while I feel some of the benefits on the steep DH, I almost washed out twice on berms that I usually can rail pretty hard. The front feels unweighted a bit more and I feel I lost a little traction up front with the 40mm. Maybe I have to ride it a few times to give it a shot, but at the same time I know my bike pretty well and small changes are evident right away. Jumping was good, but I feel I can boost off the 50mm pretty well already. Climbing steeps is fine on both. It's crazy how 10mm can make a huge difference. I may go back to the 50mm lol. Great channel BTW! Keep up the good work! Thanks!
Thank you for the comments and feedback to your own testing. 50mm works great for me and 40mm may work for some. It depends on riding style and the bike. You will naturally adapt to whatever changes you make to your bike but a 50mm stem is something that just works and now I just don’t question it.
Thanks for creating content on this subject matter. It's really hard to find detailed info on stem length and rise, but for the most part length. I went from 40 to 35 and could feel the difference on a trail bike. It seems a bit twitchy and have been thinking about going to 50. You've convinced me to at least give it a try. Thanks again!
No problem and thank you for the watch!
Twitchy is bad for sure. Mechanics of wrists not being able to control the forces which come much stronger with the short stems. 45-50 seems to suit most of the bikes and forks ive owned. 50 is usually great.
Bikes have gotten longer which is why shorter stems have become popular. I think bikes have gotten almost too long and allows a narrower margin for adjustment. Jared Graves is really up front about his bike set up and he will sort through useful trends or not. I would hop to his Instagram and look at his yeti sb150 breakdowns
I’ll be trying a 50mm, just because I feel my new frame a lil bit short (35mm on it), great content, thanks Brother!
No problem and thank you!
Great content bro!
Blush
Love that kind of material. In my opinion cockpit setup is crucial. I’m also thinking about changing my stem from 40 to 50mm.
It has served me well and I don’t find I’m any less confident with it. Many pros still praise a 50mm stem. Thank you for the feedback!
My commencal meta TR 29 came with a 50mm stem. For a year I've been hearing people tell me "you NEED to try a shorter stem! It'll feel so much better!" I didn't care much to try, as I was comfortable with the factory setup.
Yesterday, I found a SUPER cheap 35mm stem at a local store, so I thought I'd try it out; I could get a higher quality 35mm stem if I decide I like it.
I DO NOT LIKE IT. My bike felt twitchy and the front end kept going away from me. I will be installing my 50mm stem back before my next ride.
I think that when building a bicycle, many people feel that they should pick a stem length that they think suits them personally. But I think that's not a good way to look at it. Instead, people should pick a stem length that suits the riding condition, trail type, handlebar, and sag geometry of that particular trail. Ideally, a serious biker should have multiple stems, shocks, forks, tires, handlebars that suits the trail or track they would be riding on that day. Some trails may need a shorter stem with a higher rise bar while some trails may need a low rise bar with a long stem. The best solution is to have a collection of different stems in your arsenal for the best riding performance.
True but also a good bike is a good bike. Had a gary fisher cake3 years ago. All mountain (like a beefed up xc frame but not trail), had 150 rear 160front. Genesis geometry with ultra short chain stays..that thing was a beast. It could take the big hits and race when needed. I was dropping 4ft to flat with no issues. Bike weighed 21lbs fully kitted up, including a steel plate bb protector i fabbed out of a pc case 😂. Havent had a bike come close to that one (even if it did have a misaligned bottom bracket 🥰). Xtr rim brakes would stop me on a dime and weighed nothing.
Some things we passed up for worse things. I have 230mm/180mm xtr disk brakes..and theyre not even close to the rim brakes. Not even with the fancy new pads (because apparently shimano pads cant handle humidity in the air and need baking and bedding in each time you want to trust them). But yeah that bike..throw any stem on it and its good. I ran 120 to 40mm on it 36mm fork rake i think..(90's rock shox).
My philosophy since then is that one bike can do pretty much all i need it to. So long as its built well.
I've had my 19 Bronson for almost 2yrs now and I'm still messing with settings lol. I built it frame up and just slapped parts on that had laying around. One being a 35mm length stem. Originally I liked it and it felt super good at low speeds, but as i got better on the bike and trails dried out to get faster i definitely felt to over the front end so i shot up to a 50mm stem. It completely changed the bike for the better and i have really been enjoying it, but feel it's a touch long. I plan to get a 45mm stem and I'm thinking that should give me sweet spot I'm looking for.
Nice. Are you running a 160mm fork? The megatower front center is pretty long.
@@RideEatWander I'm actually running it with a 150 fork, originally built it with a 170, but my local trails are tight and technical avg speeds below 7mph and the 150 made the bike much more nimble.
Nice. I am coming to my own conclusion that geometry>travel. We can do so much more with little these days
yes! I had a 40 then moved to 50 and it felt to long so I tried 36. the steering felt awesome but I felt to cramped. I am now on the 50. the steering can sometimes feel lazy but until I move up in bike size it will be okay.
Dare I say to try a 45?
@@RideEatWander on 45 now with more with slightly less bar roll then on 50! Still would love to just move up to a larger bike
One thing to check and it’s a common miss but see what your backsweep is on your bars. The more backsweep the closer your grips will be to you. Backsweep scan range from 7, 8, 9, degrees and sometimes more. Sometimes one degree can make a noticeable difference on hand position. 7 degree bars are rare but renthal is a popular brand. 8 is more common and 9 is pretty common as well. I can’t go more than 8 myself.
Thanks for the video, I ride a tallboy so I’m more trail and xc riding but while descending or standing I feel like I need a better attack position like my elbows are to far back and my wrist are not where I need to feel comfortable and strong I’m thinking of trying a 50 mm
Ya subtle set up changes can make large impacts to your position and riding. It’s crazy what little adjustments can make. I can feel a difference going from a 50 down to a 45 pretty noticeably.
Nice to see you back. You changed the channel name right? I think this is why I didn't notice it
Hey! Yes I made some changes and slowly evolving a bit. Working in more changes for 2021 so excited to get going. How have you been?
Am hoping to try a 50mm rise. My rise is 20mm stock.
Hey man quick update i went with a longer stem length and couldn't be happier with the out come
I recently broke out my 2008 trance 1 and went from a 90mm stem to a 70 and now a 50 is in the post, bars are 640mm and im going to put a set of 760mm on see how it goes. I findthe large frame for me 1.8m is a bit long so hopefully ill be able to slide the seat a touch forward make it more comfortable
Nice. Sounds like solid upgrades. It can really make a difference for older bikes
The bar width will drag your body a lot further forward, may not suit if the bike is long already.
The bar width will drag your body a lot further forward, may not suit if the bike is long already.
Would love to see a video comparing Schwalbe and Maxxis tire combos, a ton of people just go with Maxxis because theres not much info out there on the Magic Mary in the Addix
Interesting! I’ll add that to the idea board. I know a healer just released their new widths and casings so I might have to research. The Mary is still one of my top favorite tires out there.
@@RideEatWander I ordered one of the older ones on discount, if I like it i'm going to stick with it because it should work in every condition really well even mud.
The Mary grips in lots of conditions and clears mud fast. It’s a great tire.
The Mary is so far my best front tire i had, insane grip, but rolling speed is zero. It drags crazy
I have the 2.6 coming along with the big Betty. Going to do a back to back comparison with the assegai I take off
thank you. I heard Cy from Chotic bikes talking about same subject and he sad that if you have very slack HTA and short stem bike becomes too nervous
This is where I'm at. My Spec Chisel came with a 70mm stem, I went to 50mm as it felt too long - now more comfortable but also the bike it very edgy. Ordered a 60mm stem, we'll see!
@@NeRR2 You can always put longer stem with bigger angle and turn it backwards to lower the eff stack, in that way you bike will be smaller but your position will be lower
What garmin mount is that???
I watched a video of a guy experimenting with stem length and bar width and how it has an effect on reach from the saddle to the grips on Mtn bikes and hoods on gravel bikes.
I just recently switched my bar and stem to a wider bar and shorter stem, made a world of difference in my experience......especially with my plus hardtail
Agreed! Everyone will find their sweet spot but for aggressive or more confident riding, wider bars and shorter stems will almost always be a benefit.
Hi, may know wat is ur handlebar length and rise? Currently im using a 40mm stem on my enduro 2019 thinking of changing it to 50mm to assist me climbing as my local trail we have to climb to go down. Thanks.
My set up is 800mm width and 35mm rise. But I keep my stem pretty slammed.
Great video! What do you think about my situation. I hace an XC mtb hardtail and i feel it a litle bit long to me. So I am thinking to change a stem from 60mm to 40mm and change also my jandlebar from 760mm to 720mm because naturally my wirst position came to inside. What do you think it will be yhe impact in handling the bike? I really don't know but in terms of fit purpose, it will be better to my body. Thank you!!
Your steering will quicken for sure. If you want you can try a bar that has more backsweep because that can have a noticeable impact as well and can suit your wrist angle. Given the geometry of an XC bike I don’t think you will lose much front end grip or feel
Im trying to order an adjustable stem so I can dial it in for me.
I have a 2001 Stump jumper FSR XC Comp, I need to know the correct diameter of the stems so I can order one knowing it will fit.
What is the correct size diameter to mount the stem on the bike?
Is it 28.6mm or not?
Does anyone know?
I can't find it in manuals or spec sheets anywhere.
What I noticed going from a 60 to a 40mm is going up hills just killed me...and where i live you have to pedal up hills not just fun flow down hill.. I do like the bike front end feeling so much quicker in response with the shorter stem.
Have you tried splitting the difference at 50?
@@RideEatWander I just bought another bike so problem solved..hahaha
Nice! Well you can’t tell me you got a new bike and not share what it is!
Hey man
I got a merida e160 went by there size chart and picked up a medium
I'm have been also struggling with not being able to dig the front tire in enough
to create a confident ride
I'll make the switch from 40 to 50mm and let you know how it goes
I’ll be interested to hear your feedback!
I can’t decide on stem, it was 32 mm at 790, very sharp control, now Chinese stem is 45 and the steering wheel is 800, it seems to be good but unreliable, the branded ones are either 40 or 50, my Rich is 465 with a height of 190cm, more often I go down, how to understand which one to take. comrades say that 50mm is for country. Helpful video and comments, thanks!
Lower the bar width. Too much and you have to turn with your shoulders and body more. Its not a good position. Im 6'3" slim with a long reach, i use 45mm where i can with my bars at 750-740mm (7 degree backsweep, 5 up). 40 is twitchy, 50 is reliable and good. The 800mm bars...i dont see the point honestly. Also trees, lamposts. People, parking...nightmare
Popular bike trends would suggest shorter is better but it’s all about needs. Front centers have gotten so much longer because of slacker angles and longer forks. I am settled on a 50mm and don’t have any problems in steep situations.
My bike has a short reach ( by today’s standard) so im running a 50mm stem but at the same time the 40mm that came with the bike puts my weight further back making the bike feel more playful and jumpy . So im kinda torn on which to use , maybe ill find a 45 mm .
There are some 45s out there to be found and given a proper amount of time you will adapt to any length. Happy shredding!
Experiment with a cheap 45 mm stem available on Amazon. I was surprised how much of a difference 5 mm can make.
Absolutely! We’re the differences better or worse for you? Was 45 shorter or longer?
@@RideEatWander My bike started with a 60mm stem. It seemed OK to me, but I tried a 40mm stem just to see what I thought. It made the front wheel too twitchy. I switched to a 45 and the twitchiness disappeared. The advantages of the 45mm stem over the 60mm stem is quicker steering and easier front wheel lifting. Front wheel lifts are key maneuvers on the terrain that I ride.
Don't forget to experiment with other variables: headset spacer placement, tire air pressure, fork air pressure, fork compression and rebound settings, fork volume spacers, and tires. I've had a few highly rated and popular tires up front that absolutely sucked (for me). And I've had tires from less popular brands that I've loved.
Agreed, there are a lot of great products outside the big names. I can be a sucker myself but I need try more.
Depends on your reach
Uy, ten years ago i missed out on my size large frame and opted for the xl...mistake. never found the proper setup, either my legs are too forward for proper efficiency and comfort or im leaning way forward and messing my lower back up. Been through the ranges for my fork rake vs stem (44mm forward i think, metric hlr). 45mm was the sweet spot for handling, but ive had to get a 33mm just to stop my back getting damaged any more (i lost two disks someplace..if you see em laying about someplace..😂). I know its going to be horribly twitchy but cant take that forward positioning any longer. That and bikes have rocketed in price. So my aging banshee rune will have to see me through for a while (1500 with a nice build and a 50% discount back in the day) cant justify 5k for an adjustment, and even the second hand bikes are crazy priced atm. Guess i'm gonna get stronger wrists 😅 just cant do a damn thing about that crank position 😐
You could try narrower bars as well. There will be a crossover where you can go longer stem narrower bars or shorter stem and wider bars. I would say stem will impact handling more than bars where bars will affect fit first then handling
I run a 50mm stem on my jump bike and it feels to long for some tricks should I buy a shorter stem then?
Definitely if it feels too long shorten it up. I would try 10mm increments at most though to find your sweet spot
@@RideEatWander thank you I try it
Do you think going from 35mm to 50mm would be too much if a jump on a small frame? Or should I go with 40mm?
35-50 will be noticeable but since it will slow your steering it won’t be a wild change. 40 might not be worth experimenting with but there are some 45mm stems out there.
@@RideEatWander thanks for the reply, I am exactly looking at what you said in the video. Just want a bit mire reach from my frame. Bike is very lively 27.5 so not too fussed if it quietens it down a little and gives me a but more confidence! 👍🏻 50mm ordered, should be delivered tomorrow.
I am from the hilly region where I use a reverse 90 mm stem. You can go faster in hill incompare to the rider with small stem. Only downhill is poor in longer stem.
I ride 60mm and it feels great. Does your Apex Stem creak?
Mine does not. Just start with all clean surfaces. I take a Q tip and thread the Cotten head into each hole. Lightly grease the bolts and it’s never been an issue. Also using a torque tent ion for consistent torque
@@RideEatWander Yeah I did just that. Light grease on bolts and under heads, but still there was creaking. I just pulled the clamps off completely today. Cleaned everything and applied fiber grip on clamping surfaces. One bad thing is the clamps need to be slid over to the center making it difficult to keep some of the fiber grip in place. I prefer a stem with the usual solid face plate. I will test it tomorrow. Crossing my fingers no more creaking.
I’ve never used fiber grip on my stems before. Just used a torque wrench. One thing to try which isn’t ideal because of the cost is trying a bar with a grip area in the clamp zone. Renthal comes to mind
@@RideEatWander You can use fiber grip paste even on AL to AL surfaces to prevent creaks. I use torque wrench on every bolt, but if surfaces aren't exactly spot on it will cause slight movement. I will test today and see. I really like the Apex stem, but hate the bar clamp design.
Keep me posted!
I really struggle with long stems. With a long stem, your entire handlebar turns in a circle, so your shoulders move with it as you turn.
Let's use a silly example: Let's say your stem is 1 meter long, and you turn left. Where does your handlebar go ? 1 Meter to your left.
I bought a new bike, and nobody pcould tell me why i struggled so much with my steering. One day it just clicked. I swapped the bike for a bike with a shorter stem ... and i even chahged the stem on that bike for a shorter stem. What a difference 😮
I could've do skinnies with the long stem. With the short stem i can.
How much do you have to spend on a stem? I recently stripped the threads in my stem when greasing my headset so I'm going to have to get a new one, but I'd rather not spend $100 on just the stem. I'm in high-school and just spent all my money on a new bike, so a cheaper stem would be better. Want something that would be durable enough for occasional bike park laps and small drops, but nothing over a few feet high. Thanks!
Stems can be very expensive but there are definitely some less expensive options. Look at the one up components stem, race aefect stem and maybe their turbine stem.
You probably obtained a stem by now, but for anyone else wondering, check out Truvative Hussefelt stems. They are inexpensive and durable. The only compromise for the lower price being they weigh more but, unless you're a weight weenie, it's negligible.
I will warn you though, please stay away from super cheap stems like Wake stems (that go for $10) that a lot of people seem to buy as a cheap upgrade. They aren't good quality and have a high likelihood of failure, and you will get badly hurt.
Great advice!
how the Stem doing other review they said it creaks after 2-3 months of use.
Hello! Renthals can be prone to creaking but a little bit of grease on the threads, clean surfaces and proper torque should keep it quiet
I went from 50mm to 60mm to make me not feel so rear heavy on climbing and more stable at speed
That’s a good deduction for trying to diagnose that feeling! Some people like to steer with their feet or lower body and that’s fine but it’s not for everyone.
@Ride Eat Wander well I did it for the reach I went 60mm not 65 sorry my ebike I got is about 10mm shorter in reach then my enduro. So I added the reach back with a 60mm stem to make it feel the same steering is actually better to me as its not as twitchy on tech you don't over steer on slow tite tech and when going down hill it's more stable on really steep chutes I got lean farther back then normal
I bought a nucleus 29vr, was right on the end of the large, so went for the XL , i do feel slightly stretched out, went from a 50mm-40mm stem, and the front end felt slightly light, so went back to the 50mm stem, just trying to dial in my ride, any tips?
Much appreciated👍
Where is your saddle positioned? All the way forward?
@@RideEatWander Hi, saddle is bang in middle of the rail?
Few things I would try ranging from free to not free. Try sliding your saddle forward a little. Get close to the limit of where your saddle range says it’s acceptable. If you are back to the 50mm stem, you could try a bar with a little more backsweep or trim the bars narrower some.
If you still have the 40mm stem, I would ask how many spacers do you have underneath? I would recommend trying less spacers if you use some and maybe counter it with a slightly higher rise bar. Borrow from a friend or test with a cheap bar. The more spacers you have under the stem the more forward rearward your bars will go since your steerer rests at a rearward angle. You can counter the stack height with higher rise bars which only move vertically within the same brand of bar. Exchanging less spacers with higher rise bars will have some overlap in terms of feel and front end weight but I find if you were to use less spacers, and then counter with a higher rise bar, the difference of the less spacers will still yield a greater fee difference. My greatest battle was and still is front end feel. I always use no spacers under my stems and buy stems that have built in rise so I can try and experiment.
@@RideEatWander thank you, i will give those a try, i cant be far off hopefully👍
Little tiny stems make twitchy handling
Agreed
Whats up man? Can i get a Stem with 31.8 on fork side and 35MM on handlebars? or can i just use an adaptor on the fork side? i want 35mm Handlebars Thanks Bro.
If I’m understanding you correctly there are no adapters that I know of that can adapt a 35mm bar to a 31.8 stem. There are plenty of affordable stems though. I would look at race face.
Spank brand. They do a 31mount with a 35bar. Various sizes and models. 318 stem does for sure.
150mm stem turns you into a road biker.
35mm is too light on front wheel, 50mm is better but have to be smoother and I have less confidence. 40mm felt perfect for me, have just enough weight on the front but more confidence sliding the bike around.
Nice! Ya 35 would just feel to short too I think. The 50mm for me felt good size wise and I like the smoother feel. 40 wasn’t too bad but but at least on this bike the 50 was what I needed.
@@RideEatWander 50 felt good on my stock 64.9 degree head angle Ripmo, when I slackened it another 1.5 degrees the short stem just felt better, I had written it off completely and was sticking to 50mm, but I guess it is all a balance.
The slacker HA would naturally slow the handling down a bit so speeding it up with a faster stem makes sense
yeah i agree with you 50mm feels great on smoother terrian but relatively slow on consecutive sharp turns. after experimenting 50mm paird with 780mm bar for two weeks i have swapped back to either 35mm or 40mm
Nice! Find what works best for you!
Short stems big whips
Can’t disagree
Very so open about their stem lengths 🤷♂️
Where did modesty go
Who knows
Try a bigger bike and revers the stem backward.
On my first mtb the stem and seat wasnt tightened properly. I ended up going down the hill sat on the bar holding one end of a handlebar 😂 made it to the bottom. If it wasnt so painful im pretty sure it would have been great fun