How to Play OVERTONES on Saxophone for a better SOUND
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- čas přidán 28. 08. 2024
- #bettersax #saxophone #saxophonelessons
Jay Metcalf explains how to play and practice overtones on the saxophone and why practicing overtones helps improve your saxophone sound.
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“You’ll get there faster by going slower” is an incredibly insightful quote. definitely something i need to work on in my playing. thank you!!
if you can play it slowly, you can play it quickly.. if you know, you know.
@@caydenheddleston4810 I know, and I wish I didn't
My jazz teacher loves to say:
“Hurry up and wait!”
FYI: John Coltrane had a "Practice" Sax where he bent the octave so that it was NOT Operational. Therefore, he used it to practice the horn from low to high without the use of an octave key.
Nice
Two pieces of tape could do the same thing. :)
@@paulelkouss also a pencil
@@paulelkouss no! Not extreme enough
So a overtone is not using the octave key from going high or low? Sorry i didnt know for ages watching the vid what it was🤦🏽♀️
The thing with Jay is they don't make them more honest than him. I mean really is giving here for free the essential information you need to achieve what you want. The courses are even more worth it as it helps you along with the discipline, the accompaniment and the motivation. This guy is the real thing, straight to the point, no interminable blabla and not boring to death. Thumbs up for Jay.
Thanks for that. Made my day.
Ray u did demo on cheap esatar sax from Amazon and what do u think of swapping out mouthpiece and for Yamaha 4c mouth piece? I thn aandoren al3 or go right to al3????
I was a ten year student of Joe Allard . He is the "father" of teaching overtones. I use this on Clarinet, tenor sax and flute, all of which was taught to me by Mr. Allard. He had the most beautiful sound on tenor & alto sax and clarinet. He used the overtones exercises to correct problems with embrochures, adjusting the glottal opening, and just improving sound. When I was a senior in high school I asked him for more technical finger work; his reply was if you don't sound good no one will stick around to find out how fast you can move your fingers. Needless to say, I use overtone work with all my students. The video of him on You Tube was done when he was suffering from Alzheimer disease. When I studied with him in the 1960's and 70's he was sharp as a tack, and would not have needed the coaching evident in the video. However, for us who studied with him the video is our chance to visit with the master once more.
Thanks Doc for sharing this story.
Very nice Story Thanks for sharing . I,am very interested in that Video! Can you give the link here. I don’t find it on you tube Thanks 🙏
Awesome. Great advice from the master.
Dr Vincent Rufino
What a nice comment and tribute to your earlier mentor and how rewarding to be able to do the same for your own students. Let us hope that you are as fondly remembered by them and that they in turn, carry forward the Allard-Rufino torch.
I struggle with my meagre steps to stand on the shoulders of my personal giants.
My speciality is beginners who don't believe that they will ever play anything! Eventually I pass them on to the next level. (And sometimes think "Can I come with you?")
Nevertheless, I've gigged all over UK, EU and once into US.
Joe Allard sat in with my sax quartet when I was in high school in the late 70's. He seemed very old but what came out of the soprano sax was magnificent. He had the biggest beautiful sound and he was playing on our regular soprano players set up! Obviously it left a lasting impression on me.
I was just practising and started to play overtones when you posted this, good timing. This was helpful, especially with singing the notes and changing throat shape thanks!
great!
@@bettersax A revelation here was Jay's advice to sing the projected overtone and feel what the throat does. I had been hoping for the best with random changes of the variables, so when an overtone occasionally arrived I couldn't pin down why!
[ I saw a video entitled Better Sex and thought it was word play on your Better Sax.]
I agree this video is really helpful
Teaching a class on Overtones today, love the way you go about it! Hope to connect again soon!
Thank you brother. Yes let’s do another podcast episode with you.
One of the best guides I’ve seen. Gotten more consistency with overtones.
Man, you're teaching an old, old dog new tricks. Thank you.
The REAL reason to practice overtones:
La Cucaracha
haha
or you know, for leo p and his moanin' solo
brasshouse
This is so cool I’ve been playing sax on and off for 7 years (a lot more off than on lol) and I had no idea this was even a thing and I am mainly a trumpet player and it translated over rlly well and I can already instantly play 4 octaves but I’ll keep working on it
Now I know how that one guy in my school went so high on his alto solos lol
This is great to know. I play alto but I would also love to play trumpet someday. Nice that some skills transfer over.
So have you found that you can use the same technique to play overtones on the trumpet?
I am a trombone player who has been advised by a sax player to try overtone playing, but I’m finding it hard to find information for brass instruments on the Internet..
@@michellejacob5190 you can't be serious
You’re such a good teacher Jay, I will start to work on this tomorrow. It’s already night here and I can’t disturb my neighbors anymore as I’ve competed my practice for today already. Thanks for this video.
Yeah - my warmup pre-gig is always overtones. When they're right I can get on with the main job of the day with a degree of confidence.
On bari it's vital.
The snag is that when neighbo(u)rs hear you trying out overtones they might think "Huh..This guy ain't as good as I thought he was!"
🤣😂🤣😂😂 so true
That’s why you do them at the BEGINNING, and save the good stuff for the end!
Great stuff. My overtones sound pretty rough but six weeks ago I found them impossible and a month ago they were bloody awful; I'm pleased with pretty rough right now.
Literally I’ve been practicing them for a month with the best teacher in the state, legitimately. As soon as you mentioned using your voice and singing and visualizing the threat closing off like that, I got it so naturally. THANKS SO MUCH!!!
Loved it. I have been working on my overtones again and decided to search it on CZcams. I’m in Sydney Australia and you made me laugh talking about how annoying it can be for neighbours. My dog loves them. He sings along.
My first 11 lessons with Joe Allard were exclusively about OVERTONES. I’ve come back to it almost 40 years later, and it’s been worth every moment…….of course back then I had no perspective as compared to now, but while at the Village Vanguard listening/watching Dexter Gordon in December 1979 Dexter gave me a lifetime of incomparable learning.
40-year player and yeah, I need to do this more for sure. Great channel Jay.
Thanks Tony!
Singing is greatly improved my practice! I discovered it intuitively and I do humming of Bb not with tonal energy app!
Top tones for the saxophone by Sigurd Rascher. Best book ever for overtones. Very sequential and does the necessary ear training. I spent about six months working out of this book. Cheap book.
Well presented. This rather no frills approach towards useful results resonates well over the more typical academic explanations. Cheers Jay.
glad i stuck around thanks
Great info.
Thanks for the reminder to work on fundamentals. There’s so little time to learn and practice new tunes is easy to overlook the basics.
Thank you, Jay! Before April 2020, I had never played and instrument before let alone a saxophone, but I now can play and continue to follow what you offer, and at 65 years old I feel confident because you are the best instructor.
Excellent! I can see this is how mastering the instrument happens. Great, clear vid.
I just found this video and precisely I was trying to improve my sound with the overtune. Jay, thanks so much because you avoid me to get bad habit. Thanks so much.
Great video and tips as usual ! I tend to work on overtones as a separate part of practicing, avoiding the term warm ups for them as I feel they are too important and need to be treated separately and more than just a couple of minutes. Coupled with mouthpiece only exercises they are the two factors that took my sound and confidence in playing to the next level.
I sometimes feel a lot of learning players tend to hang out in the middle of the horn because they don't have great control and confidence in the lower and upper registers. We don't have a lot of octaves to play with, in the first instance so it's good to be confident through out the range of the sax. Overtones will get you there. Once you get the hang of them they don't have to sound too awful. With regular practice you can be super creative with them. I found getting the 3rd B flat was a bit tricky at first and started sounding the note with normal fingering minus the octave key. that helped it sound in my ear and showed my throat what it should be doing. I was then able to revert back to the low B flat fingering and sound it from there. Overtones..they work !
Another good comment!
As someone else better qualified than me mentioned here Joe Allard knew a thing or two even if his methods have been modified somewhat over the years, his insistance on overtones and everything that comes from them really stand up. Hope your students follow your advice. For those that worry about the neighbours give it a month, 10 to 20 mins a day and they'll be knocking on the door asking 'what happened ? You sound really good these days
"@@bettersax
@@thecontinentalist8816: Do you work much on the overtones of other bell notes and C# and D or do those overtones come easily once you can play the Bb overtones to a good standard?
Yes definitely Graham. If you can get up to the 3rd B flat then you're already doing good and you'll move on rapidly from there. Tone matching really helps make the tone stable ( and easier for the neighbours in the long run) So once you've got a few of the overtones down try matching them with the normal fingerings with the aim being to match the tone of the overtone. I think that helps to build the muscle memory in the mouth and throat so when you play normal fingerings you'll have a bigger tone, not necessarily louder just bigger with more control. Jay did the right thing in getting the ball rolling with this, but for him too cover all the complexities of the overtone series would be a lot of video time for him. Maybe later. I wouldn't want to steal his thunder on this subject but enjoy sharing my experiences on the subject. Slurring down through the overtone range to the low fingerings is a great thing to do. There you really feel the throat doing it's work. At the base of this ( in my experience ) is good air support. It all starts with that. If you can find writings by Dr David Dempsey, another Joe Allard student back in the day you'll find a mine of info on this and other subjects. Good luck with it.
You are a great teacher i like the way you teach
OMG! You are so right. Thank you for this lesson!
You're welcome!
R u kidding? The concept of overtones is probably the most amazing thing about notes!
You are an excellent teacher, IMHO. TY!
Thank you Jay for your excellent teaching. THis video should be watched many times to get it all to soak in. I will too!
definitely. This is an advanced concept and really takes years of work before it all makes sense...
I've had a hard time hitting my low C and low Bflat (I'm a beginner)..I started practicing overtones as you suggested..few minutes a day..and I tried one practice session to hit those low notes..I found I could hit them beautifully..that had never happened before..they were so good the geese that usually alighted on my window sill previously; flew away.
Thanks Jay.
Another great video Jay, thanks for sharing your expertise. I definitely need to spend more time consistently focused on overtones. One more thing to add to the list of goals for 2019. I really appreciate your videos as they are super helpful. Your teaching style is very sincere and informative. Please keep them coming, cheers!
Thanks. The key is to hit the overtones for 5 minutes a day. They take time to work their magic.
Better Sax g
I very much appreciate what you do! I have been periodically watching your videos randomly when inspiration is at its lowest! Without fail you make my desire and motivation to practice skyrocket tenfold! Thank you again!
Patrick in Detroit.
I can't wait to get off of work and annoying my neighbors with overtones!
That is the right spirt! thanks for your support.
How do I take your lessons to the next level and not freeload all this great knowledge? I would like to support your cause! I've been playing Bari and tenor for 14 years self taught. Pretty good at scales and theory . Great ear bad reader. Extremest......ish Advent guard type player with no altissimo range..
Patrick, check out my courses for sale on bettersax.com/products you will probably learn a great deal from them.
Thanks Jay! Very helpful -- answering the questions I had after watching your clip on altissimo.
Memories ! Everything you said came back to me in the voice of my sax teacher ! It's absolutely true, and I will make that and long tones a part of EVERY practice sessi......most of my practice se......well , I'll promises to do it today ! 😋
Thank you, sir, Jay Metcalf for your videos on how to be a better saxophone player
Agreed about holding notes; it's part of the raga music ear training for correct pitch. Those teachers have you hold a note while having a drone instrument (such as tambura or a recording of one) as background so that you can hear any 'beats' indicating a discrepancy in pitch. Good practice for the ear. And, as you state, proper breathing, throat, embouchure are important as well. Thanks!
You helped me a lot on playing the soprano sax.you are the best teacher on CZcams.thank you Jay 🎷🙏
Fascinating thanks Jay. One of the best sax tutorials I’ve ever seen
I learned from my professor that to play overtones, or starts with the ears. If you can listen to overtone before playing it, thats the right direction.
As he also mentioned in the video (not my professor lol), this is key!
I just started Tenor in August 14 in band I switched from Clarinet to Saxephone and your videos have been helping me a bit more then my actual band teacher
Such an interesting topic! I never knew there was so much going on regarding the mechanics of achieving certain pitches/tones... I always thought it was just air flow and key presses 🤯😅
Muchas Gracias!!! Saludos desde Argentina!!!
Ok, I've tried to work on overtones on two previous occasions and got nowhere. You convinced me to try again. So, the first month I got nowhere, but I noticed that my sound was better and the flexibility inside mouth felt greater. Then, things changed. I do matching exercises between the 2nd partial in the 1st octave and the first partial in the 2nd octave- things like that. I also work on getting the partials above the low notes (I consider the first partial to be the fundamental pitch). I have gotten, at one time or another, eleven partials on low Bb. The 11th only twice, but the others fairly regularly. Some I cheat on by tapping a side key, but I do that less and less. I'm not sure where I go from here but plan to read up on it. Thanks for the encouragement.
It just gets easier from here. I spend no more than 5 minutes a day on this but after a few years...
This is very intuitive. I am just starting to play again after 15 years, but when I was younger, it was just natural to me. It actually makes sense now. Thanks. Great vid!!
I stumbled across this today, the day after I started Core Essentials. I had heard of Overtones, but did not know how they applied to sax. It sounded awful, like you said, but it was like going to the gym. It felt good when you stopped. Your videos are the best explanations I have found for so many important sax concepts. One suggestion is that you description of changing the throat would be great if it was mentioned in Core Essentials. If it is, I must have missed it and apologize. This video was a nice addition to the Core Essentials course material on Overtones.
So yeah, playing bugle calls (bugles have no keys) in trumpet we do this in practice all the time. It's pretty cool.
I've actually seen a saxophone with no keys, made just to teach this. A local music store had it for sale.
Fabulous advice, thankyou!
Hey Jay, Thanks for this. I just finished learning how to play overtone exercises on my flute. I actually succeeded in playing reveille. Now for the sax...
Similar concept as flute, let the air do the work. Pre-hear the note and find it by experimenting with mouth shape...
@@bettersax I had a fun time doing overtones on my tenor. I took your advice and forced those overtones out using just the shape of my mouth and throat. I can see how this will help my tone on both horns. With the flute it's helped me learn to direct my air stream so much better, for a more full sound. By golly Jay, I think I'm making progress.
As usual, Jay gives the “why” along with the “how” which is the best way to learn anything. I took his Pentatonic Foundation and Blues Foundation courses and am half way through his Blues Language course. I highly recommend them.
I live in an apartment building, and play three different saxophones…one of them being the soprano. I’m sure my neighbors LOVE me! 🥲😂 Overtones suck, but there is nothing better that has helped me with my tone, and intonation. They’re frustrating, but they work.
I saw benefits right away after applying your methods of playing overtones.. especially with flute.
Craziest thing I was practicing a song and went down to C so released the octave key, when I went back up I forgot to use the octave key but hit the notes just fine and didn't realize it till I went back down and went to release the octave that I wasn't holding. When I tried to intentionally go back and hit those same notes - I couldn't do it
I find it really important to work on this exercise. the book Top Tons for sax really helped me!
Do you all know it?
Wow, that quote at 5:30 was really deep. Actually gave me chills
Great concise package of demonstration and explanation. You nailed it!
Really good interpretation of the subject Jay!!!!
Thank you for another great video, Jay. About singing the notes before playing (which is really helpful!): since we'll be out of singing range pretty quickly as we progress upward, do you have any advice as to how to deal with that? E.g. would it be enough to imagine/'hear' the note before playing and letting the body adjust accordingly?
You will have to use your head and falsetto voice if you want to sing those notes. Once you get the hang of overtones, and know the sequence of notes, you won't need to sing them anymore as you will hear them in your head.
I like the way you explaining is great one.Thank you a lot
Great guide!
I also am going over your pentatonic course as a refresher
You are a fantastic teacher. Thank you for your gift.
I love your teaching
I will be glad if I can be one of the beneficiary of that sax sir
Wow! That is incredible! The idea of basically singing the note worked on the second try and produced a really nice note! I wonder how this will work back on the clarinet ....
I love his teaching
You truly are the best really hope to meet u someday
I haven't mastered my embrouching as yet,but overtones are so convincing and helpful, especially when it comes to the comfortability of the jaws.
Your videos are really helping, thanks for posting, from Wales UK
Glad to hear it Nick.
Great video. Very clear and helpful. Thank you, Jay.
3 minutes in, I finally realized you're talking about harmonics... lol :)
Very informative! I am getting an overtone by accident when descending from high E to lower F and I believe it is due to a leak. My old Yamaha is overdue a service.
I love that cover photo Jay 😂 are you looking for the overtones? And by the way I had no idea you can play the overtones in all four octaves. Looks like I have more work to do.
Wow. Newbie here. I spent decades playing brass where overtones are just how you play a lot of notes (there are only 7 different fingerings on a 3 valve horn). I had no idea reed instruments could do this - or that one should even try....
Or 8?I think of it as binary:
000 001 010 011 100 101 110 111
Great video Jay!
I have a question though
Is it ok for me to "change" the shape of my throat while also moving my tongue closer to the roof of my mouth? Or should my tongue always remain in the bottom of my mouth?
Thanks in advance!
I’m mainly a trumpet player so I don’t know exactly but I’d say the throat is bad but the tongue could be ok bc resistance is necessary to go up (however resistance through the abs is probably better than the tongue)
This is just coming from experience as a lead trumpet tho, idk what I’m talking about but maybe it’s helpful to some degree
Tongue arches up and back like on French horn
if it works and you don't feel stress or unusual pain it should be fine
This was a very helpful video Jay i’m having a problem with my lower register on the alto sax
I am so excited!!!!! I got it!!! That is so cool. I am like Jonny 5 man I need more info hahahaha thanks again you rock!!!!
Thank you.
Thanks Maestro 👨🏫
Great instructor thank you🎷👍
thanks jay!
Kids in my beginner band sure are good at this
Thank you for this Jay.
In beginning band, my octave key somehow was broken a few weeks before our Christmas concert. My parents didn't have the money to send my sax to the shop, so I ended up just the fingering the notes and jumping the octave entirely using overtones. Of course, at the time, I had no idea what that was or what I was doing, I just figured out that I could do it if I tried. All that being said, it was beginning band in 6th grade, so the only notes we were playing using the octave key were D and E and maybe an occasional F#.
I play tenor sax and am in the jazz band. I am In 9th grade and most of the people in there are 11th and 12th so right now I need to have a better sound even though mine is pretty nice. This helps a lot and thanks, I would also appreciate if you told me how I could get a better jazz sound and style.
Hey Jay Happy Holidays! I'm going to try to figure out La COO CA Rocha, I know I killed the spelling, I think that's what you were playing in overtones.I'm blissfully copying your OH SO TASTY BLUES LICKS from the Blues Course. Funny thing days can go by practicing your lessons than you remind us of something else to add to our program! By the way I really think the greenery perked up your practice space behind you, it's looking way more cozy now!! Still waiting for the posters and Fido!! Peace and Love to you and all!!!
Thanks Wayne!
A great resource for overtones and altissimo is "top tones for the saxophone" by Sigurd M Rascher
So…this overtone business is not crystal clear to. But I am understanding that you press the low Bb keys…then keeping all the Bb fingering, you switch to a middle Bb with just your throat sound? Or do you press middle Bb keys? I’m just not sure what exactly to do. I thought overtones was basically playing a low note and playing that same note consecutively in the next octaves. Please help with my understanding what I should be doing. Thanks!
really helpful thank you so much
I have been a pro sax player and teacher for over forty years and there is a perplexing question I want to put out there. "Why are some people unable to play in tune on the neck?" I think I am correct in saying that the tone produced on the alto sax neck should be a concert 'A' but many of my students past and present have been significantly below this pitch. I even had one student who managed to get to ABRSM grade VI who played a semitone flat on the neck but was somehow able to play in tune when he put the neck on his sax. How can you explain that? Do some alto sax necks produce a different fundamental tone? I think the answer to this question is linked to what Jay is saying about overtones in this video but it may also be a combination of other factors such as air speed, diaphragmatic support, embouchure shape, tongue position, jaw pressure and the hidden mysteries of the throat when playing. I would like to know what Jay thinks about this and also welcome comments from others who may have experience of this issue when teaching the sax.
Thanks for this vid!! I did get severe pain in my pinky finger from holding down the low Bb key for a while though.
Whenever I do it, it doesn't go an octave higher, it just goes in-between the low note and the high note, is that weird?
You should probably get your sax checked I had a few problems with mine but now the lowest to the top altissimo note comes out smoothly and clear and the octaves react properly, this also could be an embouchure problem.
thank you for suggesting singing as it has shown me what happening in my throat.
As I’m a new player, figured I would try this now and get it in my practice time. This is not easy lol.
Excellent. You teach at least as well as anyone on any subject.
SPEAKING OF Bb, Jay, do you have a stand on which of the five fingerings (that I know of) to use for Bb and when? (Make that six if I count the overtone fingering!)
John, that's a good topic for a video. the rule of thumb is to use side Bb when you have to go to B natural, and use bis Bb for everything else. 1 and 1 Bb is not useful to me on sax.
Thanks, Jay.@@bettersax I came to the sax from the flute so I've been inclined to use the 1 & 1 fingering for everything. But since starting on your courses I've been working on using side Bb. I need to work on the bis key even more--I don't trust getting on & off it as needed.
1and1 is actually useful for a a# - h thrill
Another cool lesson 👍🎷
What sax are you playing ?
Yanagisawa TWO2
I’m hitting the 2nd overtone pretty consistently but for some reason I keep missing the first one, anybody have any tips on how I can find that tricky first overtone?
I changed mouthpiece from Yamaha 7 c to Otto Link 5*. With Yamaha was piece of cake almost all the overtones. With OL I’m suffering big time! The first 3 comes out regularly but the 4th almost never.
nice one thanks!
Hi Jay: I seem to be stuck on the first octave overtone going up the scale from low Bb to about E. I just can't seem to get above that first octave. I have tried reshaping my embouchere, my throat and my tongue. I am really getting discouraged. I have only had 4 lessons on the sax from a one on one teacher, but the virus put a stop to that. I have been playing since about mid March, which
was my very first experience with the saxophone. I can play a bunch of songs and can generally get a week E and F out with the octave key pressed. Above that--nope! I practice at least an hour everyday since I started in March but have pretty much been working on my own and looking at videos such as yours. I know I started late in life, I was 82 on July 4th, but I am in very good shape for my age. I can hold a note for quite a long time so have plenty of air. I have practiced long tones often but overtones, not so much. Probably because I get discouraged in not being able to get more than a single octave overtone on each note from Bb to E. I have tried 3 mouthpieces and both #2 caine and Legere plastic reeds. the Legere's seem to be the best for me. I have a Selmer TS500S tenor saxophone which I bought new. I had a sax tech look it over and he made some adjustments but stated that it was an excellent and well made sax. By the way, I love your videos!
You're post is very inspiring to me. I began learning sax 2 months ago and am also 😣persevering with overtones 💥 ... practice practice practice 😀😄😊