Runescape player never played WoW, so he tried all of them
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- čas přidán 13. 02. 2024
- Original 👉 • I never played WoW, so...
By @J1mmy
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So stoked to see you react to it!! Was hoping some WoW guys would stumble on this project :)
Love you Jimmy! Hope all is well
@J1mmy let's hope he reacts to your questing series too!
omg your content is amazing!! this is my first time watching you so I'm excited to look more into your channel
I didn't read the books cause I heard they suck.
love you jimmy! great vid
J1mmy is such a gem to the runescape community, awesome to see him trying to branch out a bit and it doing well for him
Your content is sick too!
I found it funny how he was talking about wrath max level gear progression as if RuneScape isn't very similar
@@TheGoatLocker old school isn't really that similar progression wise in my opinion..
@@Brandon-vd7erif you play an iron it kind of is
Ive only seen a few clips from his vids but they all suck. That dude just sucks
My dad played WoW, so he didnt mind paying my sub. He said "Id rather you be a nerd than a drug addict, stay home and play WoW with me"
That contract was probably the best deal in the history of dadkind. At least 12 months of good behaviour and even had a no attitude clause. All that for 15$ a month.
I am very jealous! No one in my family is or every has been a gamer 👽
@@JohnSmith-ox3gy lmao 20 years of good attitude. I pay my own sub now ofc but I still dont go outside. Worst thing I've done in my life is cocaine once
Awesome 😍
that’s a cool ass dad. makes me wish i had more time with mine.
dude that subscription log is absolutely INSANELY good parenting
its really good work / reward enforcement
Exactly
It would be if they didn't specifically go out of their way to write in no talking back... Y'all saying this is good parenting must have had great parents yourselves but let me tell you that is shady as fuck.
@@JohnDBlue i think youre looking into it a bit too deep. also his parents didnt write that in. Xaryu did, for all we know he chose the rules of said agreement. the no talking back is pretty normal for a parent towards their kid. it doesnt mean he wasnt allowed to express himself towards them. it means he cant be a little shit.
@@shizocks yeah if i recall how i was as a teenager that dude would make me livid. always talking back, always knowing better, exactly knowing what he was doing too. what a little shit i was lmao
J1mmy is what you call an actual content creator. He isn't just some semi-lucky streamer who makes :O faces in all their thumbnails
Why you gotta go so hard on our boy
Violation
Just remember that Jimmy could NEVER been in the same universe as Xaryu in terms of being a skilled gamer. There's a ZERO percent chance he could ever pvp on his level.
@@clarkh3314 nobody cares about PVP
@@clarkh3314 gj totally missing the point while also pointing out that xaryu can't create content.
You should get in touch with J1mmy and have him take you through OSRS
Yeah, J1mmy got to max level in WoW, so Xaryu should get to max level in OSRS for us ❤️
@@CloudCollapselol ya cuz thats equally fair.
@@trentongardner2106what is joke
@lampisfun1139 getting max level in wow in every version is pretty quick, and easy. With hardcore being the hardest to do and it's more of a take your time thing than it's hard to do. Runescape max level would take a long time to do. Like a really long time.
OSRS is just an endless, pointless grind with minor dopamine hits spread throughout.
The beauty of the video is the line "the first experience you have sets the pace for the rest of the game" and now in WOW the experience is "hurry up, you aren't high enough level" and that is the feeling in retail. Constant rushing to get bigger numbers, but classic the experience was "explore".
I hadn't really thought of it that way but your absolutely correct. I knew retail felt off but I thought I just wasn't into MMOs anymore.
You can explore and play the game at the exact same pace in retail as you do in Classic. There's literally no difference.
@@Tazytotsyep. you can also feel pressured to level fast in classic so that makes no sense. Even more considering that retail atleast got side content to do.
The benefit of not having to rush you to be on the same level of players that have been playing for 20 years and Classic being relatively new so that mountsin of content is not there.
I played wow before burning crusade and that was how wow always felt. It's just now the game facilitates the fast leveling. But people still tried to rush to max level.
J1mmy gave such an objective and perfect outsider view of WoW.
No bias, no prejudice, both goods and bads
I would agree, it was fair No bias, no prejudice, but it was also like watching a Marvel movie review by a critic who hates action movies. WoW is about end-game and guild communities, and J1mmy clearly doesn't enjoy that at all. I've been playing WoW for 18 years and it's been about end-game the entire time. I find a guild, I make friends, we schedule time to fight challenging raid bosses, and progress through the raids.
So while J1mmy was fair in his assessment, I don't know how fair it was to have someone who doesn't enjoy the format reviewing the game.
@@RageDaugend game for you, for us it s about the journey. Just throw out leveling and just do raiding all day. It s bad design.
@@andipajeroking It's not about what you or I want. It's about the audience Blizzard wants to sell their game to. Leveling & raiding are two different games, which becomes increasingly more apparent with every subsequent expansion.
The problem Blizzard has is that it would take at minimum several months, and more likely years for a new player to play all the lore of the past twenty years of WoW as it was laid out, and that still leaves out all the old lore related raiding content. It would be near impossible for new players to catch up to friends who brought them into the game. And even if they don't have friends and just wanted to check out WoW, they will see end-game players all over who are raiding every week, and they will understand they won't be able to reach that for months or years of questing.
So if the majority of your repeat customers are people who couldn't care less about the leveling content, but are only looking to do end-game content, how can you satisfy them with forced quest & leveling content added for the minority?
So the question goes back to, who is the audience Blizzard is trying to reach?
@@RageDaug I agree with you, coming from Runescape as well and he's never gotten into end-game in that game as well, but he did lead off that this was specifically for a new player experience. Once you're into end-game you likely already have a big understanding of the game and have a group of people to play with.
@@agFreeze that is a fair point. I'm not really trying to get after the video's author. I believe he was doing an honest review, and it could definitely be helpful to new players who are considering playing the game if they are runescape style players, or players who enjoy a good story while they level /play.
I'm probably just a little defensive due to all the people who jump into the comments to use the video to confirm their bias and shit on the game.
Would be like if I reviewed the absolute best 1st person shooter. My take would just go on and on about the things I can't stand. It would be honest and helpful to anyone who doesn't like 1st person shooters, but it would not be a fair assessment of the game.
Hell yeah J1mmy kicks ass. One of the funniest OSRS content creators
First character was a troll hunter. Walking into org for the first time and seeing people on wolves/raptors with glowing weapons I was hooked instantly.
my condolences for playing troll
@@SonGoku5363 dw it didn't last
This was the dopest, launch weeks of an expansion have similar feelings
played orc first, got sick of the dirt and tried a human pally. Elwyn and SW was too good lol.
@@drgreenthumnb Alliance side: Forests, Plains, Trees, Meadows
Horde side: O R A N G E
The contract your dad made you do is actually such good parenting! Allows you to enjoy the game you want to play and yet makes you earn it and have responsibilities. That’s great parenting !
Anyone who's had even one bad experience with their parents will instantly know there's something deeply wrong with it though.
Not allowed to talk back? Yeah... fucking great. Parents are already God and Jesus and King and Emperor who have never been and will never be wrong, what could possibly be bad about this...
@JohnDBlue Seen your replies several times on here now, all saying basically the same thing.
If everyone else thinks it's good parenting (which it absolutely is on every metric), and you're the only one who doesn't - then who's more likely to be correct?
Just say you had crap parents and you weren't exposed to healthy reward/discipline systems like the one in the video and move on. Get some therapy or something.
@@JohnDBlue Hey man, I've seen you reply to this same effect on multiple comments now. I understand why you would be apprehensive about a "no talking back" rule, since my parents also abused that phrase to shut down any attempt I made to defend myself.
Something you should understand though, is that, that was a character flaw on behalf of my parents (and I'm guessing yours too), and most parents only use such a rule to dissuade their children from truly egregious sass.
The creator of the video here, clearly has positive memories about it, so we can safely assume that his parents enforced this in a positive way.
If it is at all practical for you, I highly recommend having an earnest discussion with your parents about some of the things you seem like you've been feeling about your upbringing. If they can find the time to listen now that you're an adult, it can be very healing, otherwise, you'll know for sure that they are a lost cause. Just a suggestion bro, you don't have to listen. All the best to you, either way
@@GGMattyou need serious help 😂
OSRS fixes a lot of these problems because it has a core design philosophy where the game doesn't even really expect you to get to max level. It certainly doesn't require it. The old quests are still relevant, and you're practically never going to run out of content. You can put it down for years and pick right back up where you left off and continue your story from there without being thrust into a storyline with characters you'd never heard of. The server issue also isn't a problem in OSRS because you hop worlds whenever you want. They've got reasons why you'd want to be in a low pop or a high pop world depending on your activity, so there are always nearly full worlds.
bro was warcraft logging his chores.
Dude has the WORST parses I’ve SEEN 😂😂
Min maxing blade height on the mower to be able to double up cuts in between raid nights
when my two world combine
Bro…his parents were standing with him in the aisle at walmart and then he asked for it, his parents looked at the each other, turned around and deliberated. One said, fu$k no! The other one was like, “Wait Tanya, if we force him into a contract, we never have to take the trash out again, those dirty clothes…gone…bathroom mold, gone…tall grass doesnt exist tanya”.
I've been playing on and off since 2004, I'm in my 40s now. While I agree with a lot of what your saying, the underlying reality is that classic WoW is a solved game and is utterly trivial as a PvE gaming experience. I think for a new player who isn't experienced with MMOs it's a good solution to take babysteps into the genre. But I really struggle understanding the vets who can go back to spamming 1-3 buttons endlessly and maybe dodging 1-2 mechanics per boss when retail provides them with a significantly more engaging experience.
I fucking love J1mmy! So glad you did a react of his video
the answer to leveling is an exhiles reach style leveling experience that takes the players through all the important plot points for the last 20 years, but that isn't at a break neck speed so the players can enjoy it. It's reused quests and reused zones so the dev time would me much lower, and it would give people the opportunity to experience the story.
was thinking the same thing, and it would bottleneck players together, whether someone is a new player or someone is levelling an alt naturally making it feel more full, and new expansions instead of a continuation could also look at more seperate stories so new players could understand and follow whats happening
It looks like they're introducing something similar as part of time walking, a MoP storyline chain has been datamined already that mainlines you through the story and into the siege of Org. If I were them I'd make that permanent and add it along with one for each expansion in the Caverns of Time. You could even have Chromie stood there sending you in saying she's sure you were there so you need to go be there.
That together with the change to first time leveling (Exiles going straight to dragonflight which is obviously where it was always meant to go since they even mention going to a nearby expedition thats on a nearby island) should help a lot.
I started on retail in 19 and self restricted myself to going to chrome playing each expansion in order and I wasn't allowed to leave until I was bored and rail roaded the main quests. But I did this all at max level and it kinda felt bad.
@@imaginyou4You could of done it at the appropriate level you can turn XP off.
Its cool that J1mmy took a look into wc3 and used it to help build the story because we have to remember the story of warcraft started as a RTS then continued it through a MMO.
That log is amazing education
A big issue with WoW's story for retail is that while they try and make you level in a single expansion, a lot of that story happens not during the questing, but at max level as the future patches came out in that expansion, so even if someone tries to play in Chromie time once you hit 60 it kicks you out of Chromie Time regardless of how far in that story you are because they need you to play Dragonflight.
I started an alt and capped my exp at 19. So I could play all of legion. Wow has a big issue they created with level scaling. They did not increase the world npc mobs health or difficulty they instead make your toon weaker. Same with pvp each season you reset to build back to your baseline. 😅 private servers did it right by keeping gear the same but increasing mob health values and damage. TBC and Wrath private servers with extra spicey mobs will forever be my favorite time in wow.
Well, you simply can't force through 20 years of story. And you still CAN do it, but forcing people to do it, would create a lot of anger.
Wanna join your friend and raid? Just play revamped world, outland, northrend, cataclysm, pandaria, draenor, broken islands, zuldazar/kultiras, shadowlands and the dragon isles. It's just a short trip of 200h to barely scrap few zones of each continents.
You just actually have to read and put two and two together to understand whats happening in WoW's story, its all there. It just isnt laid out in a linear MSQ like ff14 or single player rpg.
There's a datamined set of MoP quests that mainline the whole MoP storyline from start to finish which is linked to timewalking. The current guess is it's them trialing it before doing it for all the expansions (and hopefully making them a permanent option in the caverns of time).
linear story quest line based on faction/race which takes you thru all xpacs with cutscenes and voiceovers etc
People would screech that leveling takes too long. Pandora's Box has already been opened.
@@DrewPicklesTheDark it could be optional in the settings to turn it on/off but when you would launch into world it would give you option if you want to play expansions linearly which would hide every npc that would be from future of your current expansion adventure while also saying that leveling is slower due your doing old content or if you want to progress on your own phase and want to hop soon straight into dragonflight once war within comes, it would say that in options you can disable/enable this if you want. then it would search for oldest expansion that you havent managed to complete main questline yet and show where to go if you want to progress slowly experiencing things as they come as blizzard made stuff and intended originally game to played so you arent thrown into battle of azeroth and getting jainas story without knowing what happened at theramore that is being refrenced, so you would know that theramore is a small town instead of hidden planet and and why she is being jailed by her mother, why in cutscene her father seemingly randomly yells MURDERER after calmly singing to her...
You know, I think I'm an outlier here, but I actually prefer when a game 'starts' at max level. Its the same with Diablo 3, Guild Wars 2, Destiny etc.
I like when the levelling takes between 3 days to 3 weeks, and that its effectively an extensive tutorial, and then the game starts and its time to grind out your sets and try new builds and pvp etc.
Lots of things to talk about here, but perhaps the biggest one is Jimmy's remark around the 29:00-minute mark about not interreacting with anyone else in retail. I played from 2005-2022. I lead our guild as GM and raid leader from 2007-2022, always did AOTC, achieved several CEs when we decided to begin that effort in Legion, etc. Through the lens of time, you can see how the community element of WoW was destroyed due to detrimental game design changes. Making things easier to get, while simultaneously making mythic raids overtuned and tedious, killed a lot of the community element. Guilds were also chipped away at with their incentives. Logging, parsing, esports, and all of that raiding cultural shifting also did a lot of damage, although that became more mandatory for CE and even AOTC for many guilds due to dramatic shifts in raid design philosophy coming from Activision Blizzard.
- In Vanilla and Classic, achievement is based on leveling, gearing, farming, and guild progression. These are things achieved at the group level. This is an MMORPG.
- In retail, achievement is based on mechanical play and parsing. These are things achieved at the individual level. This is not an MMORPG.
With regards to monsters scaling with player level, this is indeed a horrible change. They did it in Diablo 4 as well. It takes away the key element of progression, and it appears as though Activision Blizzard wants to kill off the MMORPG element even more. I agree with Jimmy (and others) that Season of Discovery is the best thing WoW has going for it now.
To answer your question on how to fix retail, I would change how end-game raiding works, which would then in turn promote guild community. I would remove LFR and remove mythic, narrowing down from four raid difficulties to just two. Normal would be for the most casual people, and heroic would be for everyone else. I wouldn't provide an option to the sweats who are interested in race to world first, server firsts, clearing raids within 1-4 weeks, and all of that crap. That's what mythic+ can be for - the min-maxing stuff. I would also reduce the mechanical demands of raiding, and thus addon mandates. This would allow raiding to return to what it used to be - a group-oriented experience about having fun, hanging out for two nights per week, progressing through the gear farm, killing the final boss, and finishing the story for that tier.
Consider reacting to J1mmy's series "By Release" series. He starts a fresh OSRS ironman and completes the quests in order. Its one of the best OSRS series
It is definitely a fantastic series.
Great series but means nothing to people who havent played it tbh. Kinda like hardcore wow content for someone who makes osrs hc content and hasn't played wow
@@Masterofchodes Yeah I was thinking about that. I think enough WoW players have played at least the Runescape early game content which is where the series starts, and could get a nostalgia kick out of a few react vids. I could be wrong though
@@L2.Lagrange fair point actually I played rs before wow
@@Masterofchodes you'd be surprised how easy osrs and classic wow are to understand when the storytelling is good. there are many people who watch Settled (biggest osrs content creator) who have never played runescape, and there are lots of people who watch Savix's recent classic wow content even though they have never played wow, because the storytelling is easy to understand.
The progression statement you said: that's why SOD is keeping me going. The gated phases and raiding each of these reworked instances that I spammed ad nauseum, that I could speedrun while asleep - it's refreshing
Best thing I think Blizz could do for WoW would be making each expansion have unique armours or qeapons that have usea in the other expansions giving people a reason to go through old and obsolete expansions/areas.
I'm still at the very start of the video and I'm blown away by how insightful and amazing your parents were for writing up that contract and having your gameplay be tied to your word and your chores. What an incredible way to instill the habits of working for something that you want and understanding your personal accountability for decisions you made. That is amazing parenting and if you haven't thanked them often enough for it you should go out of your way to do so. I'm going to take that plan for my own kids if something ever comes up like this
i was 13 and got in a lot of trouble, my mother was glad my brother in law got me his old pc and a wow account. I got hooked on and i got in far less in trouble outside and with the law.
When I started my first Death knight back in Wotlk i was disappointed that I couldn't start from lvl 1 and play the whole game. Especially when it was the best class I ever played. It didn't feel that great that I missed the best part of the game that I played with so many classes that wasn't so fun for me.
when i first logged my lock in to deathknell in 2005 it definetly felt better than left clicking a cow or chicken in rs
I think that new expansions CAN focus on old locations and just make deeper interactions, options and secrets. Add couple class-unique and race-unique questlines an daily quests, add high-level activities in low-level locations and low-level activities in high level locations.
The solution is time travel Chromie done well.
You get 10 versions of the same character on the same realm with 10 different banks and gearsets and level depending on your timeline.
You have your classic gearset, your BC gearset, Your lich king gear set. and you can access every single raid and every single dungeon in precicely the timeline you want them with the patch that was relevant at the time. And you have to clear Karazhan or Gruul to unlock SSC for your character.
Force people to have to do the progression with their first character on the correct patch to unlock the progression for their account. Share Reputation amoungst characters so you do not have to do everything with every alt, but you have to do it once to unlock the next tier.
When you enter a timeline for the first time you start where that expansion would start. For BC that is the dark portal and for classic that is elwynn and leveling takes as long as it took back then.
We raid ICC today and Black temple tomorrow. the day after we do dragonflight raids and leveling in every expansion.
You can't do SSC on lvl 90 to unlock Black Temple for your lvl 70 character. You have to do it in the correct timeline.
Positive Reputation gets added to all your characters and negative Reputation does not. Make it so your alliance character can get Exalted with Horde factions if you level enough Horde characters to add to your Alliance characters rep.
Make it so you cannot sell gear to vendors for gold, but instead it goes into your infinate library like a transmog. If you get Bulwark in BC you will have it unlocked in all the following expansions, BUT you cannot farm bullwark in Dragonflight and use it in BC. So only upwards unlocking of gear. Make gear that you unlock available for every character on your account and make it so your account cannot get an item it has already unlocked again, to prevent people from griefing.
Same for items in your bank. make it so i can farm copper ore in classic and send it to mist of pandaria no problem, but don't let ppl farm in mists of pandaria and send it to classic. You can only send your stuff in one direction in the timeline never downwards. Same with Rep. only upwards in the timeline never down.
That would make WoW feel great. But actually implementing that seems just about impossible. That might require WoW2 and a ton of work and a huge harddrive KEKW, but that would be the perfect solution for me.
I got world of Warcraft for my birthday/Christmas gift around bc and my parents didn't know it had a monthly subscription. We were living out of a rv at the time so they didn't have money until a year later once we were more stable. Probably has a part in my love for the game and why it will always be apart of my gaming life, I was so obsessed to play it.
They need to make a BUNCH of those 2.5D cinematics like Daughter of the Sea... but maybe less cinematic that tells the story of each zone. They could add them to the map so that if you're looking at a zone and thinking "huh, what happened there" you can click to play the quick 1-2 minute zone story video.
In a perfect world there could be a quick intro video to each zone... it could even be a pan-through voice-over like the starting zones, it tells you whats going on there. You can then either choose to play that zone and find out what happens or be like "nah" and play an outro video that tells you how the story wraps up.
YES! Or something integrated to make new players understand and have a feeling of more impact should they choose to go there. It's far too chaotic currently.
The simplest and most effective way to introduce story...
Voice acted quest dialogue that continues playing while running to next objective.
That way you can enjoy the story without standing still.
1. Roll out a SoD that slowly over time takes you through expansions. The ones that people like less get less time before the next phase/expansion. It's clear they are capable of this by looking at classic bc-transition to wotlk. Start at classic, announce the plans, build a player base of people who are craving the old days and bring back those who have already experience it with SoD content like they are doing in vanilla. 2. Incentivise old content in retail for the end game players. Not all at once, but one month doing naxx would old naxx gear leveled for end game retail. This gives new players a chance to experience old raids for what they used to be. Do the same for old dungeons. 3. Close the information gap. Add cutscenes for the expansions that explain where the story Is and how we got here. Make the players feel like the goal they are working towards in the story is actually important. 4. Make a leveling lfg. They aren't gonna get rid of lfr or lfd. Why not implement a system that gives new players an easy way to meet other players searching for the same experience and in some cases open doors to friendships and multiplayer gameplay which at the core, is what an mmo should be. Your multiplayer content should not be locked behind hours of meaningless grinding. It's a dream to find people to take down world elites in different zones. Thoughts?
I just watched you cross your hands....I almost cried. You played exactly like I did! It wasn't until my bestie was laughing at my description of how I played, and he gently corrected me. Crossed hands made sense to me!
OSRS has the best quests in the genre and J1mmy loves those quests. WoW stood no chance.
They 2 dif games, OSRS is fucking boring, pure old school grind. And the graphics are only appealing to retro-lovers.
Any version of WoW is far superior to OSRS by a mile: visualy, auditive, gameplay, and quest wise.
@@josejuanandrade4439 quests in wow are legit kill 5 boars bro i can believe you actually think all of that except the quest part. also youre wrong about all of it
@@doomgu544 .... You realy are this dense? Is not the mechanics of the quest... of course mmo quests are all kill this, collect that.. is not the mechanics but the story the quests tell you.
There's for example, a quest line in wow known as "The legend of Stalvan"... is literaly just a side story... is not conected to the major lore in any way... but the story it tells is so good, it has became engraned in wow player's memory...
I dont know if you realy stupid, or you just trying to pretend you don't know what people mean about wow questing being great just to hate on the game... WoW questing IS what made wow become so huge in 2004.... no other mmo had this....
Most were blind grind... meanwhile, WoW told stories!
And here is the fun part bro... i dont need to proove anything because the proof is in the fact WoW killed all these other mmos. All the old school blind grind mmos like Everquest, Runescape, etc, died when WoW came out because WoW was THAT much better. Even the social aspect was better. I could sit here and tell you stories about this part, that i lived back in 2005 for fucking days!
Completely delusional.@@josejuanandrade4439
lol, lmao even.
He's right about Classic. Held my attention for 6-8 weeks and then I stopped.
Retail feels completely soulless, and a big convoluted mess story wise and leveling wise. Like an amusement park ride without the fun, and far too saturated content wise to wrap a new players head around.
@@maybecole id say the fun is the combat ngl
@@EmJayy661 I will say PVP feels good in retail, and a lot of the abilities can be fun, and the ability to respec for free on the fly is nice. For some weird reason, I still prefer classic combat. It doesn't feel so button-mashy, and having too many abilities on rotation. But I can see how in scenarios like mages spamming frost bolt in MC would get old
run out of copium and fart gas?
prog raiding is the only good part of wow everything else is a shit annoying chore
The best solution i can think of is instead of chromie just being all the old quests,there should be an experience similair to the tutorial island (but slower paced and probably 3-4x as long) that rehashes the overall story of each expansion. Obv a lot of work at this point, but they could release them 1 at a time with minor game updates.
The only solution I could think of to “fix” retail, is to eliminate chromie time (kinda). Slow down the leveling system by a ton, force players to level 1-60 in classic areas for their first characters. It should be a grind and take a decent amount of time to hit 60. Then at 60 you then do the newest expansion. Still same slow leveling. Once you have a max character then you can play through any 2 expansions 1-60. Slow leveling to make it feel more like a game rather than a simulation to get you to max level.
J1mmy is a legend and I'm so glad you're covering this!
I've never posted anything in any of your content. I'm your typical ghost viewer but I have to say, after all these years(discovered you when my friends convinced me that coming back to wow in bfa was a good idea) seeing your hair growing. I am really happy for you to watch a complete and joyful persone working in front of his screen. Cheers to that brother. It is not easy to get to that point in life. Keep it up!
we where doing Bwl and we had a new rogue on the raid for his gear he was smashing the dps meters ((later he became the rogue officer he was reaaaaally good )) anyway so we reach the suppressor rooms and on Ventrilo (discord was not a thing for many more years to come ) . At the suppressor rooms rogues have to disable the traps so at some point the new rogue says " Ahmm i can not disable the trap ! " raid leader : " just click it and wait for the timer is not hard " rogue : " but i do not have the skill ! " raid leader : " wait you never bought the skill from the trainer ? why ? " rogue : "it seemed expensive " .... that day the 39 rest of the raiders we almost died from laughing our ass off . In retrospect i should have been video capturing every single raid just to keep those 2 -3 moments in the end :P
The problem with retail is that they don't ever iterate on old content. Old school runescape sets a good example. Sometimes, updates are simply just quality of life or older parts that receive updates. OSRS adds new raids and all that, but they never ruin the overall experience. You still have to level every skill and all. It's not been sped up
bro at the moonguard tavern inn party was cathartic because i feel like that in most social settings lol
There are many zones in classic wow that actually have a good story, like duskwood, for example. Problem is that its usually just a single quest chain, or peppered inside of many pointless 'get me some herbs for my sick pet, or kill 10 kobolds cause they steal supplies'. After 50 of those pointless quests, it becomes much harder to engage with or even know you are on a decent story quest.
“Good story” yes having to read long ass paragraphs from random NPCs that mention bits and pieces about what’s going on in the zone that 99.9% of the players never read lol.
@@ItsYentI re-started on classic two weeks ago, I leveled through duskwood last week. That story was good, took the time to read quests, the journals, taking things slow. Just enjoying some relaxing after work gaming. It was a good experience.
Its in a way kinda nice how the quests are attached to stormwind as well. It might be annoying, but it makes it feel more grand.
@@00vaag yeah same is in retail too. They just put a bigger focus on making it easier for people to understand the story. In Classic you have to go out your way to read and learn the story which doesn’t touch majority of players .
Solution: Every year the game resets to classic version. Then they can release each expansion accordingly throughout the year depending on how many expansions they are at in total at that time.
It's not a character reset, just time laps.
I really hope they make a progression server. You HAVE to do the main story narrative in order of each expansion with leveling paced to fit. It would make for a truly epic leveling journey. It wouldn't be for everyone, but my god would the people it was made for love it.
all the people being forced to level through every campaign quests is the dumbest take ive heard in a while and i read a lot of comments congrats
@@WoWUndad I didn't say all players. It'd be like a classic server, or hardcore server, it'd be optional. And to quote myself: "It wouldn't be for everyone, but my god would the people it was made for love it." Just like hardcore wasn't for everyone. Learn reading comprehension before calling people dumb.
Yeah it would be a lot of fun, I've done something similar by locking my level at certain points back before Chromie time when leveling was from 1-120 and enjoyed it a lot. Only problem was that it was a lonely experience outside of dungeons.
@@MysticLlamaMan Would be less lonely with servers intended for that purpose, at least at first.
This is basically what final fantasy 14 does. I spent 6 months leveling through all the expansions and then got into raiding and endgame content.
Coming from Runescape and having experienced some of WoW myself, in my opinion SoD would be the best shot of solving the "reliving the same player progress problem in the future" problem. Runescape's multiple storylines progress in parallel (sometimes converging) over the course of years and each, or at least some, of them give significant upgrades to the player regardless of you being at max level or not.
Leveling up is like on classic WoW where it's part of the journey, with new content being released in, say, Northshire, and there's always someone doing it (because it's now part of the natural progression of the character) while new endgame areas are regularly added to the game and new players can strive for doing ir one day, too. Players are never rushed to the brand new giant map with a huge storyline, instead everyone is given the chance to catch up on some storyline in small parts and wait for the next step in that story. Nowadays there's some "annual roadmaps" with themed big expansions but Jagex always comes up with content for low and mid level and it would be only natural for WoW where you MUST replay them if you want to play a new class or faction (usually Runescape players have at most two characters compared to Classic's 9 classes - and we're not even talking about each class roles). Some content released in 2005 like Barrows Brothers is played even in RuneScape 3 (which is like Wow Retail) to this day!
In SoD, having a smaller blueprint to start from, rethinking character progression like this may help solve the level-up-and-quit/get-rushed-to-max-like-it's-nothing dilemma of classic/retail imo.
TL;DR; give up the expansion format (at least as the main one), it's a formula borrowed from single-player games which are meant to be one-and-done experiences, focus on improving it to every player, from noobs to endgame.
The only reason Runescape content like the barrows brothers gets gameplay to this day, is the amount of hours required in the activity to even get the gear. You could do a few hundred over even over a thousand barrows runs, depending on your luck, to get all the items.
Not only this, Runescape is a game structured around the ridiculous xp needed to even hit max. Andrew Gower never expected anyone to hit a level 99, the focus was on the gameplay and with that gameplay, short form content that can be played quickly but with drop rates so low, the bosses become more like a job where you farm the boss for 5 hours to make gp and hopefully get that rare drop.
If Runescape didn't have two decade old xp rates, it would have died a very long time ago. And it's because of those xp rates, that low and mid content is developed. Some people might be 100 combat after play for two years (because they have lives outside the game). In WoW, even classic, you can max in much much less than a year.
The expansion format is definitely terrible, and doesn't fit a live service game model. With live service, having larger content drops surrounded by QOL and smaller content paced in between leaves players feeling like there is always something new, players don't rush through it all and quit until the next expansion, because that content is drip fed.
I wish I could be in the position like, that guy who started Ashes of Creation. I would love to put my 24k hours of Runescape, my 9k hours of WoW and my two decades of experience into escapism into MMOs and youtube content around the games industry to create a long term mmo that focuses on progression around player power and community interaction. If a game like Halo 3 can foster millions into a varied active online community centered around the many custom gamemodes, hardcore and casual... then surely an MMO can exist today with paced progression and replayability?
I would love a game like Wrath with additionally, a list of story based quests like Runescape with options for casual and hardcore. A server system that lets you switch between 'world servers' that are limited to stop overflooding but you can switch to one of hundreds of worlds and connect with any person on the planet who plays.
A professional and friendly, but trained team of staff trained to act like the GM's of WoW classic, and actually message people in game as the first option if they're online.
A housing system that is instanced that doesn't limit housing to the rich, but lets you progress your character even more by unlocking additional elements to your property which help promote gameplay and community.
A pvp system that aims to teach players how their class operates and what to watch for from other classes, bridging the gap that many refuse to follow, of bringing up youtube and watching a pvp guide.
An economy that is player driven but still tied to pvp and pve progression. Everything has a price, but if you can go get that item yourself, you can use it or make some good money selling it (thinking more, challenges to get certain items, rather than grinding a boss or activity until you get rng).
A background progression system linked to all characters on the account which holds titles, banners and other non mechanical gameplay element customisation. Like imagine getting to pin a golden medal with a little magic ribbon to the front of your chest plate, people will see that and think "dude was top 20 last year in pvp" and he'll have something of recognition that doesn't give gameplay advantage (wanting to stick power to character progression and not, this person will always 2% more than you and there's no way for you to ever get that last 2%).
I want to stick power to the levelling, but make the levelling the game itself. Imagine if you did WoW classic but instead of doing barrens for 5 levels, you did barrens, then went off to do some mazes, a few pvp continent vs continents, then you decide to go do some side quests because a random event story captured your attention and pulled you into an optional experience. And said optional quest/experience gave you an item which made a future quest dialogue later about the king noticing your glowing trinket you have, before sending you off on another optional quest. And you can get this quest by speaking to the king anyway, without the item, but the item triggers the quest in a more profound way.
@@biadhoce non-ironman players play barrows, terrible drop-rate notwithstanding (or because of that lmao), because it's a low/moderate paced, mid-game (humble) money-maker for both versions. Oldschool barrows equipment is still useful for a variety of reasons while RS3's is on demand because of invention and archeology (the amulet).
For the IM characters, only the unluckiest of them have to endure that drop-rate to the end because not all of those items are essential to character progression (if any at all).
I do agree xp and drop rates can be harsh (specially for OSRS) and could be tweaked a bit, but is it really that bad if, as you said, it's over two decades now and somewhat healthy? Surely that isn't their problem -- but WoW doesn't need to copy it either; focus on the whole character progression instead. The class/race/faction systems have so much replayability potential which RuneScape would only dream of. That's why it takes years to max out there while you can do it n-fold times over on classic. Then they could implement everything you and I suggested to keep it healthy.
yeah cater to new players while alienating all your old players
what sort of dumb solution is this
@@Freestyle80 you must be dense if you hadn't enjoyed a QoL update locked behind new content that isn't aimed solely at veteran players before, or the game you're playing really is doomed because they apparently aren't doing these.
@@redcomet918 yeah WoW is doomed since 2006
guess what nothing happened and only miserable and bitter people like you complain about it 24/7 seething at the fact that people still play 😂
Talking about level 60 in vanila: Dude, there were no heroics in Vanilla. Heroics didn't exist until Burning Crusade.
Vanilla endgame was Molten Core, Zul Gurub, Blackwing Lair, and Onyxia. Later, Ahn Qiraj.
Upper and Lower blackwing Spire used to be 10 man raids. Molten Core and Blackwing Lair were 40 man raids. (ZG was always 25).
People did NOT stop playing at max level. we're not only talking about a small hardcore group of people, either.
This guy was delightfull, deff watching more of him.
This video explained everything pretty perfectly, Love J1mmy he really comes through for the communities with these videos.
Hopefully he does a follow up video explaining even more about the endgame and if he enjoys the journey of the raiding with a team and stuff like that if he ever thought worth it :)
I currently play OSRS and WoW and it was amazing to see this man finally get into WoW and try it and to actually hear how a completely NEW PLAYER sees the game was refreshing.
+1 Respect from both OSRS and WoW communities, this was an amazing video brother Jimbo!
No it doens't. He literally got everything wrong and nothing he said was of any value.
@@therabbits69 lmao keep smoking that copium kid
7:02 - anyone know what that skirt mog is? never seen that skirt and legs in all my Wow time
Edit: Found out, its the Love Witch Transmog from the retail traderpost for february.
There's also a black version of the same set on the cash shop for like 30 dollars or something too, I think it comes with a mount as well
32:46 It's not about the leveling speed - it's about the progression and mob scaling. This is the solution: Start people out weak, like in classic - only able to handle 1 mob at a time. Then increase your relative power to the mobs of your level, as you level up, so you are killing them MORE quickly as you level up - NOT LESS QUICKLY.. and can handle more mobs at a time as you get higher level - NOT LESS.
As a person who decided to play Guild Wars instead of WoW, I will always blame WoW players for bringing monetization to big games. It was completely common after the success that was WoW.
I'm so glad i built up tens of thousands of hours in WoW, runescape and league of legends during my teen and early adulthood years. being able to juggle these three games and going back and forth whenever i want is so nice. I couldnt imagine learning these games now.
Exactly my situations, its amazing to hop between those 3 :D
Well done. Sounds like the most useful way to spend your life.
thats why the game sucks, it caters to the subs that want to hop back in here and there so they make everything so easy to obtain, easy to level. no point in the game anymore when there is no reason to strive for things
I started playing Wow around last summer. I wanted to start with classic, but was convinced to try retail first. So my first playthrough was on retail, so I never realized it was a fast leveling process. I personally enjoy being able to level very quickly without feeling obligated to find a group for dungeons, quest, etc.(antisocial) I will say after playing retail first, it kinda tainted my leveling experience in classic. It felt sooo slow, BUT also more rewarding when i dinged or found a gear upgrade. (Mostly just felt slow though) Professions in classic also feel very useful and relevant, whereas in retail it just seen as a goldmaker. Anyways, that was my perspective as a new player who tried retail before classic. Interesting how your starting version choice can affect how you view the whole game.
Very much agree, you have solidified my choice of playing WOW Classic first. I wish there was leveling even past "Max Level" even if you don't get anything from it, you still have players competing to be much higher. I was bummed when I found out that your experience bar disappears.
There should be an option to turn on/off scaled zones so you can pick if a zone's level scales up with you or each zone has a set level like it used to(maybe talk to Chromie to switch between them). This way you can turn it off and experience the way it used to be, but you can turn it on if you want to power level.
Watching WoW players go through what Everquest players went through...priceless.
i remember my first time in stormwind , we were smashing Varian head 1 week after wotlk doing “For the Horde”
You will absolutely not regret reading the first three books in the entire lore timeline for Warcraft. I can't remember what they're called, but it's the Three night elf trilogy series explaining the very beginning of everything basically and they are really good
World of Warcraft Chronicles, Part 1-2-3 (Black/Green/Blue)
@@psycropticqcPretty sure he meant the War of the Ancients trilogy, but those are good too
Aren't most books retconned and full of insconsistencies?
Most of the book retcons are heavily overstated. Over the roughly 24 years of books they've released, the majority of them likely either won't have any noticeable retcons or will only have 1 or 2.@@Eustres
@@Eustres no, can you stop spreading forum rumors
omg Xar explaining how he put his hands when he started playing wow had me in tears, exact same thing here.
As a lore junky for MMORPGs, I have been progressively hating WoW with every expansion release. Their ability to tell the stories are getting better, whether people like the direction the story went is something people can fairly debate about. Nevertheless, their story telling has gotten so much better with the assistance of even better cutscenes and more and more voice acting because people's eyes do grow weary of reading after 8+ hours of gaming or a long day of work. The biggest problem I have, despite the story telling getting better, is how it seemingly forces people to skip all of the previous expansions' stories and will leave a new player completely in the dark as to why they are all of the sudden a Commander or Hero or why leaders talk to you about things you have done together in the past. When I last played, a few months ago, I tried to do a full story run through the game, in expansion order as it currently is in Retail. Before I even could finish HALF of 1 of the continents I was of level to start Dragonflgiht and I was constantly being "paged" to start the Dragonflight adventure. Can't stop it either, abandon the quest, it pops up again and again and again. Leave it in your log and it's always on your screen. I did get through Vanilla, BC and most of Wrath before I finally got fed up with that damn quest and just stopped playing. Unfortunately, after being part of WoW from the Closed Beta Tests, which pulled me from Dark Age of Camelot, through WoD as a dedicated WoW Player and returning off and on through Dragonflight I have to say I'm finally done with the game and will not be coming back. That was a lot longer of a post than I was planning on making. My apologies for my story/rant.
What is that website he said to put your gear and it tells you what to di next?
Yea, can you let me know if you find out?
raidbots.. its the website that you paste your character data into, and it sims each piece of gear to tell you your best in slot.. Mostly for high-end players, who sim potential gear upgrades regularly
@@herrgeo2361 eightyupgrades :)
its an addon and website. guides post the links to it in them
5:17 you did just say “that was a clean ass plug”
I mean, perhaps I parsed it incorrectly, but you did say it
My journey into Runescape lasted only ten minutes. I accidentally misspelled my character name and couldn't change it, delete the character, or make a new one.
Welp, that was the end of that MMO.
The fact that a lot of players quit after max level in classic wow really proves to me exactly why I thought that game was so bad. The entire leveling system in classic was so miserable to me. Questing in classic wow is not questing, it's runescape's slayer skill but less fun and less rewarding.
What’s the website he was talking about at 24:20?
sixtyupgrades
You said you played other games where you actually have to pay attention to the story and listed elden ring? Aren't from software games famous for having optional stories you can completely ignore?
The solution of how to unify the old and the new would be to complete the "classic" expansions and then have megaservers for each era, and flags for players so they could start from vanilla classic and after completing levels and/or content, they flag to join the next expansion's megaserver. This wouldn't be mandatory, but it would allow for everyone to play their way, and this is certainly possible for someone like Blizzard.
J1mmy is definitely one of our finest.. also mate.. your parents should be proud.. the way you paid off your membership is just phenomenal
What if you only have Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms to get to lvl 60.
Then each expansion has its own lvl system from 60 - 70 and the loot you get in other expansions is scaled down to 60.
Leveling is changing in the next expac later this year, you'll be going from exiles reach to dragonflight which has been the intent since dragonflight was entering development (they even mention the nearby island expedition as where you're supposed to be flying to at the end). This has a much more linear story and its intended for you to reach the right level as you complete the last "shield" quest.
There is also an addon called "immersion" or something like that which changes how quests are presented. I don't have it, but I've seen it.
IMO, Guild Wars 2 has answers to most of the problems mentioned here. GW2 level and gear cap does not change with expansions. With expansions you are able to unlock the ability to fully access a new content through gameplay. It does not mean GW2 has no problems, tho.
"Now THAT is a massive time commitment." Said to a Runescape player.
Wow was NEVER meant to be an expansion game. It was meant to be phased content. I lost so many people who quit when TBC came out and our hard won, guild progressed toon was replacing gear at 61 with green quest items. Meant to have more content opened while staying at level 60 and just getting small power creep items and more fun stuff to explore WITH your friends. The world sucks right now and we want an immersive fun MULTI player game. Just like everything, CORPORATE GREED has ruined our human experience and they figured out xpacs and micro transactions make the shareholders happy. Fiduciary Responsibility trumps good products lately.
The initial idea was VERY different for what WoW supposed to be. It pretty much had to be Everquest v.2 but better. Even vanilla itself took a lot of things differently, like instanced dungeons or quest-oriented leveling. With BC almost everyone working on the game left so yeah that vision was lost forever, BC is pretty much a product of completely different people
All of his opinions about retail are completely moot to me since he didn't even make it to max lvl.
I only made it to 80, that was the lvl cap at the time. It was becoming a real hassle to find groups to do dailies with. Oh but what a time it was indeed 😊.
The main issue for me has not been fixed on SoD. It's only happened faster. In my opinion it stems from power creep. Player lever < item level. Blizzard understands this in an issue that they have tried to fix several times over the years with level/stat squishes, but then goes right back down the road to oblivion again... Great job Champion!
One easy answer is to empower guilds. Guild leaders and established guilds can easily help a new player. The variety in the types of guilds also caters to new players as they are able to join a guild that fits their game style. When guilds had levels (LVL 25) there was an incentive to joining for the perks (that summon buff was so OP) and it was a symbiotic relationship where new guildies got rewards for being active, while guild leaders got to set standards for their communities. Guild garrisons should have been done years ago. Quests can be difficult, leveling can be slower, just ask your guildies for help.
My biggest issue with WoW's expansions and I believe the biggest problem Blizz has to solve is the fact that every single expansion is an isolated experience from the rest of the content. I started a new character in retail when Legion came out after several years of playing pirated WotLK and decided to complete Loremaster/Explorer as I leveled up my Pandaren monk.
As I finished expansions I started to notice nothing I did in the previous expansion mattered for the next one. Take the MoP farm and WoD garrison as examples; they're pretty fun things to do while you quest around and level up, but once you're done with that level bracket there's very little reason to go back to them other than to force force yourself to do dailies that take up a pretty long time and rewards you with the gold equivalent of getting 1-2 uncommon drops from the current expansion at the time. Why go back to the farm and garrison then when I can just pop on any high density area in Legion and get triple the gold in half the time? It felt pretty pointless.
And yeah, also the fact I almost exclusively leveled on my own and most areas were ghost towns. Blizzard should stop focusing on releasing new content and instead shift focus on better integrating the content that already exists.
Wrath is for a clear reason the most popular expansion to date, and the expansion that marked the "overall just decline" of WoW. People say it is MMO, but GW and FFXIV prove it wrong.
Wrath relied on stories that existed before, and on people that loved the game. Up to its 2 last patches, and the entering of Cata.
I am the old guy on WoW, I was already in my 20s when it came up, and I had the money and the time to enjoy it. I was there to see anxious the launch of Tides of Darkness, and that "radio narrator" saying "The orchish horde".
But no matter new or old players, they met in Wrath, they interacted. I remember helping and being helped by different experienced players, and people respected other players as part of a World.
From the last part of WotLK, onward, WoW became a "competition" game. Either you are competing with everyone else the "space" and the "money", or you are competing with a group with other groups.
The whole GW boom came when people realized the game (From Ex WOW devs) wasnt a zero sum game. If 1000s of people were on a World boss, everyone wins. Someone shows up to do one hit, they win something, less than those from the start, but no matter how people participate, they do not TAKE from others. Even if WoW was competitive from the start, it was not a zero sum. It wasnt (no one earns anything). Because everyone was "much lower" status.
The "Maw Walker" , "Avatar of Bla bla", cannot share in the glory of something. That "entity" can only get its glory or leave glory to someone else.
It is like the "elected" president. There is no "lets band together and be president". If you have one president, it is a competition, and no matter how many presidents you have, all are competing in a zero sum.
Up to mid Wrath, wow wasnt about the leveling, it was about the community, and THAT made leveling a nice experience.
The "correct" way to introduce new players would be to
- scrap the entire leveling system
- Take the players through a curated highlight reel of all the important story relevant to the current and the next expansion
- This includes running through simulated old raids as part of the quests with an AI party (we know from Island expeditions and newer features that they have the tech)
- And then start the "leveling" process through the current expansion, where the "leveling" means completing the main storyline.
I'm glad to finally see WoW fans acknowledging that leveling matters. For the past 14 years, it's all about raiding, raiding, and more raiding. IMO, M+ is just 5-man raiding. I felt really bad for this guy being shoved into the Beta dungeon garbage at the end-game. Original WotLK didn't divide the playerbase like that at the end. If you were a newly leveled 80, you were dungeon running with your guildies right away. When I hit 80 in Classic, I was in the same position as in Retail, where I was holding back my guildies and reliant on someone with enough spare time to do me the favor of sandbagging their own progression for my sake. Just like this guy, I lost all motivation to even log in anymore after a couple of weeks of grinding at 80. In OG WoW I was pre-ICC BiS in under a month thanks to previous tier raids. Now, it's a progression grind through "Gamma Slammas." No, thanks.
Solution: make expansions seasonal only. MMO are the original live service games, so treat them as such. Have a strong but revised classic experience brought up to modern standards in some ways and then reuse good old expansions or add new expansions seasonally where all players who reached 60 can complete it together and reach season specific max level like 60+20 to raid together in that season, then a new season begins, your seasonal level gets reset so you're back to 60+0 but you keep some rewards like cosmetics, titles, maybe some good (but not OP) items. Some classic expansions like wrath could be in the base or they could be always available if popular enough. Eliminating servers would be another step, instead automatically create location specific instances and group people together and spread them out if required. The only issue with this model is that they'd legitimately have to care about the game enough to commit a lot of resources to seasonally, which we know isn't going to happen.
About how to fix it. We need WoW 2.0. A full reboot. Where Blizzard messed up was making each expansion be in a whole new area absolutely unrelated to the previous.
Instead, you just update the world. It grows and changes, but it's the same world. Maybe you discover a new island or continent every few expansions, but finding it should be an expansion in and of itself. And you still use the old world the entire time.
How do you do that? Well, for example at the end of Vanilla you defeat KT in Naxx. Well, that turns the Plaguepands into a lush, fertile land and a power vacuum. The next expansion those end zones become the starting zones and the point is to take control of them for your faction. Then while Horde and Alliance are starting to go to war with each other, a new big threat arises, like the Burning Legion invades, but rather than sending us to Outlands, they come rampaging through Blasted Lands, SoS, DWP, into Alliance zones.
Now those leveling zones have pockets for end game players.
This keeps new players and endgame players in largely the same areas. If new players need help with something, higher level characters are nearby and might be more likely to help out.
When you create whole new worlds all the time and there is no reason for people to visit the old areas, it spreads everyone out and community dies.
They need to change to a horizontal progression system like Guild Wars 2. They either do scaling zones (people can level and enjoy all aspects of the game regardless of where they are at) and each expansion isn't a new max level, but a new story with new items, new abilities, new zones/dungeons/raids (but eliminate the powercreep).
Never thought I’d hear xar say “clean ass plug”
My experience back in the days was that there was no way you could go raiding. People wouldn't allow anyone with bad gear to join their raids but without raiding you would never get the gear needed to join a raid... And if you on top of having bad gear also had no experience in raiding.. well then you were screwed because NOBODY would let a noob join their party... As a new player you were LUCKY if you managed to join in on raiding. I was so eager to try it, but no matter who I talked to, which guild I joined and so on, i was never given the chance. That killed the game for me. Not the game itself but the community. That and pandas. F-ing pandas
Honestly, I think it's one of the things that Runescape kind of did right was that they allowed the player to keep leveling should they so desire even though the End-Game content at the time was only scaled to level 80 or so. And so the reward for continued leveling past that point was about 3% dmg increases per combat level which of course adds up.
Perhaps if WoW allotted a more streamlined world under the guise of another "Cataclysm" and took the previous Expansion Zones into a multitude of rotating community content it would thrive more. So like, for example, RS3 has a Community Spotlight where all players flock to a certain minigame for that period.
What if WoW had something similar like a Month of Pandaria where all players do majority of their content in Pandaria that month. Similar to how Dalaran was conveyed as this moving city in the sky. If you want your people interacting together, take them and move them to the same place.
If you want to incentivize continuation of play you can't put this behemoth of separation between casual players and completionists but rather offer casual players reachable incentives to continue playing up to a cap within grasp with respect to a person's time (such as 4 to 8 hours a week) as well as offer your completionists incentives to keep grinding (such as a 3% increase to that particular skills hit chance, dmg, gather speed, or catch rate etc). And for completionists, it doesn't have to be every level, it could be every 5 or 10 levels.
Necromancy in RS3 has been a great testament to how far a player will go for an additional 5% critical strike damage or 3% flat damage increase.
Runescape aged better because to progress in that game you do quests. There are only like 200-300 quests I think in runescape, but they're all hand crafted and interesting. They tell the story of runescape. Even if you outlevel the quest its not just fetch and kill stuff there's getting a bucket and emptying fountains to find a key and stuff like that in there that takes some thought. The quests in runescape are the dopamine for me because you have to level up to get to experience them and get your character prepared to go on these journeys that unlock neat things you can use to travel around the world like fairy rings or let you into areas that make leveling skills easier. I will say that runescape is a mostly single player game, but the world still feels alive since you can see other players doing the things you're doing and you can talk to them as your doing the things. I have a lot of hours in the game and the only group content I can think of that I have done is barbarian assault. I haven't done the raids in it, but as I have played wow alongside runescape for the past 20 years I am anxious about being bad in those raids.
I played WoW for the first time when Shadowlands came out and I didn't see a single thing about Shadowlands. All I saw was this cool Troll city where I bred dinosaurs for a quest. I had no idea what was going on but those quest were fun. Nothing was really explained about the world and I had no idea how to do anything other than quest. I quit playing since it cost a lot to play.
i agree on reducing retail servers, but blizzard knows server identity is still a thing. For instance, we have a guy joining our guild, but he's waiting until the war within so he doesn't have to leave the Laughing Skull server, because that's where Leroy Jenkins was from and he's proud to have been from that server
In fairness there’s interaction in Classic because it’s not trying to rush the players to the point where they can actually play with people that have been playing for 20 years.
Tirns out often addressing ‘there is too much stuff, everyone is way ahead, how do I get started?’ often times kills the fun in games.
I've watched J1mmy for a while and when I 1st watched his video on this, I think it resonated alot with the osrs community and for me personally I have wondered what it would have been like if I ended up being a wow player. Runescape has been a huge part of my life in a lot of ways (started late 06) Although I don't play it thesedays I miss it.
Anyways, I ended up rewatching this whole thing again and I dont usually leave comments or even watch reaction videos, this was recommended to me on my feed. This video was really enjoyable ❤
I think they should do WoW 2, like an actual new WoW. Not an update, a whole fucking reboot for everyone. We're all going to lose our characters, they need to start over with a second game.
As a new player. I wish they would just do what FF14 does. Focus on the story telling. Force new players to play the games expansions in order. But every character leveled in each expansion can be a different max level character you can use for the latest expansion. Create new cutscenes and instances to help flow the story better. They’re already doing it for The War Within where they force you to do dungeons while progressing the story. Do that. Force them to do the dungeon or a custom raid instance solo with npcs (like the follower dungeons they have now) or queue up with a group. It’s a lot to catch up on, like with ff14. There’s a lot of content to go through to get to the end. But it’s better than plowing through old content and makes the experience feel pointless and I get zero story. This to me is the only way to solve retail’s new player experience problem. The only temporary solution they’re doing is the WoW Remix. Which is great as a new player. I can finally experience MoP and collect cool transmogs. Just wish it wasn’t a timed event. Chromie Time as a new player, sucks ass. It’s completely broken, confusing, and it’s just a shit system for us new players to understand what the fuck we are doing. I desperately wish for an MSQ system like ff14. All they need to do is copy what ff14 does and this will be fixed. At least for me. One of the biggest frustrations that made me not get into wow for years after trying ff14. And I prefer wow’s lore and world building more. But ff14 is just a better game for new players because of the MSQ…
as a 41 yo and as someone that played wow for 13/14 years, i don't care about leveling on retail, i care about getting things done, my time to play games is limited so i want to level as quick as possible so i can start doing what i like, that is raiding and m+, but this is coming from a standpoint of someone that knows everything about the game, that played every expansion, that knows every map, and possibly read 80% the books about the game too, so the story not being there doesn't bother me, but i can see how it can be kinda of strange to someone that is starting the game playing on retail alone, but i don't consider that an issue on retail, its an issue within the whole game, since it's impossible to just condensate a lot of expansions into leveling a new character from 1 to max level, the only way to actually do it would be to just reset the world, like war within being the new burning crusade, something like a reboot, but the main question relies on the simple fact, does the target audience that plays retail like me, feel bothered by the lack of progression feeling while leveling or the lack of story / player interaction? for me is great, but i don't really know if i am the target audience of retail wow
I boosted a retail character today and upon logging in greeted by a dragon who doesn’t stop fking following me around until I accept his quest.
Once I do, I think “great” that nuisance is gone - but 3 seconds later a snail shows up with 8 quests that I have to accept…
I try flying away from this snail only for it to chase me in a freaking balloon…
Defeated I accept the 8 quests…
Now I’m safe from these annoying npcs I thought…
Until, a bird shows up - I know the drill - I accept the quest…
No way there’s another NPC who will stalk me until I accept quests right?
You bet - the original dragon returns and stalks me until I accept yet another quest…
Holy crap - how annoying
The issue isn't that the game is old. OldSchool Runescape is older than WoW, and recieved weekly updates and yet some of the content and weapons/armor released in 2004/2005 (like the Dragon Scimitar and barrows armor) will still be your best-in-slot items for some relevant content even after hundreds of hours of playtime.
The issue is that WoW discards EVERYTHING for EVERY expansion and for gear it is every path
While Dungeons and dragons online is stagnant I think most MMOs could learn about how to implement expansions and progression from them. They have a max level lategame, but incentivize you to restart the leveling process and do new quest lines from different expansion to level to max again providing a permanent boon each time you reincarnate back to level 1. And basically from level 1 difficulty of ALL content is select-able by players unlocked with each reincarnation so you don't get bored in early levels when you reincarnate and keeps storylines making sense with character level.