A Controversial Theory of Gravity: Exploring the Mysteries of MOND with Dr. Brian Keating
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- čas přidán 19. 06. 2024
- Brian Keating and host John Michael Godier, delve into one of the most intriguing and controversial topics in modern physics - Modified Newtonian Dynamics (MOND). MOND is a theory that proposes a modification to our understanding of gravity, which could explain some of the peculiar observations in astrophysics that cannot be explained by the standard model of particle physics. Also in this video, an exploration into one of the most intriguing questions of our time: are we the only form of intelligent life in the universe?
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Always great to be back with my buddy John! Thanks very much for so many amazing questions!
The horizon of the impossible is pushed back a little when you two share spacetime.
💚♾️
Appreciate you taking the time Brian.
Love it when two of the people I subscribe to collaborate 🔥
Always fun when you're on the show, thanks for taking the time.
Saying there's no evidence for life is the same as refusing to look in Galileo's telescope. The evidence doesn't stop existing because you in particular refuse to look at it. There is a great deal of high quality evidence. Does life in the universe somehow refute the anthropomorphic exceptionalism of Yahweh and the people he made the universe for? The people chosen above all others. I don't understand the persistence of flat earth and dead universe theories.
Calling the expectation that there is other life in such an enormous universe , anthropocentric is quite amusing . And then giving an example of 1 out of 7 continents not having life ..when it still does. Wow what a guy.
He said it has "low amounts of life, which I would agree with in comparison to the rest of the world.
I can’t say I disagree with you here. He’s got a lot of hubris saying there’s no evidence.
It’s a shame how the scientific community is behaving about the question. But they’ll eventually pay the price and lose their credibility once things become more clear and unambiguous. Then no one will listen to them ever again. That’s the cost of operating from fear and scarcity and bending to politics as a scientist, when they go touting a party line that is rooted in deliberate obfuscation.
Event Horizon has become the place to get the best scientific interview mathematically possible.
Great work John.
I subbed after i saw the one with Isasc Arthur.
If the world made sense, JMG and Anton Petrov would have the most subscribers of any channels on this platform! Thank you so much for what you do for the betterment of humanity and the expansion of such important knowledge!
Not so sure about Petrov, I think his religious views get in the way of open mindedness. He did a video 12 months ago claiming anyone who believed in advanced extra terrestrial life was basically an idiot.
don't forget about Sabine Hossenfelder! speaking of which, it'd be nice to hear her on the show, although scheduling it will be a nightmare for both sides 😂😂😂
I may be an elitist, but I prefer that it's a small minority who dig these channels. I'd certainly like them to get more funding, and YT is designed around getting more subscribers for advertising, but that model is flawed. Let the masses watch mind-numbing morontube videos. We are the chosen few!
If they dyed their hair rainbow colors and constantly did stupid little dancing they would have millions of subscribers.
Anton said another day that the Southern Atlantic Magnetic Anomaly was an weakening of the Magnetic field over South America and the South Atlantic.
That was a big slip on his part, I posted correcting him but he didn't reply or anything.
Brian's pace of speech seemed a little more measured and easier to follow than I've previously found it to be. Can't help but wonder if John's dulcet tone of voice soothed and calmed the guy more than usual.
There are actually about 80 bases on Antarctica. I have several friends who work there with the Australian Antarctic Division. There are also private explorers and some tourists in summer.
Cool story, bud, but I’m still gonna need them pod bay doors opened. Chop chop, laser lips.
Why not interview an actual expert on MOND like Stacy McGaugh or Milgrom himself? Brian Keating has enough opportunity to self-promote already.
Yeah I’m not listening to this. Last time Keating was on he ranted about covid.
I always considered dark matter+energy just a mathematical *hack* so I'm really glad you're talking about MOND.
MOND is more of a hack
@@Joe-lb8qn _refining_ gravity already has precedent
@@csehszlovakze my point is why refine a theory that is, sorry Mr Newton, wrong. Einstein didn't refine Newton he started from scratch. So do that or start with Einstein which is to date provably correct (including in some galaxies so that's an issue for MOND also)
But, that's purely a question if technique. It's still a matter of observation to theory. It's like saying we should give up on geometry because it's more like algebra than calculus! Don't look to closely at that metaphor, but... that's like what you're doing here. Why not go back, if there's answers that Einstein's models don't answer. Sometimes chocolate chip is better than pure vanilla or chocolate(I am an ice cream professional and mad scientist, don't question my Icecreamology here!)
@@Joe-lb8qn actually since MOND is based on observations particularly for relatively isolated galaxies the only part which is a "hack" is the mechanism extrapolated to explain it. The real question is why do MOND qualities appear in certain conditions but not in others?
Could you perhaps consider putting time stamps in the comments of what is being discussed/when the topics of discussion change? That would be very helpful for those of us who dont have time to listen to the whole video.
OR
Maybe post 3-4 minute clips pertaining to the topic shown in the thumbnails? Of some videos?
Please 🙏 🙏!
timestamps/chapters would be an excellent idea indeed. also, if this channel ever gets mirrored on odysee, they'll pick up the chapter info.
John. This channel has opened my eyes even more to the nature of the universe. Thank you from the bottom of my heart 🙂❤
What a dynamic interviewee -- very interesting and about more topics than I expected.
Fantastic interview! Thanks for the episode.
Jipppiiee a new Event Horizont! It always makes my day much brighter when I hear this lovely voice opening this amazing talk! One of the best contents on this plattform!
Thanks to both for a fascinating conversation. Highly enjoyable.
Dr. Keating, the "fluid or hyper-fluid" you mentioned was actually referred to many years ago as aether or ether. The universe is not expanding, but rather, all of what we call matter in the universe is shrinking due to the force exerted on it by the ether, or "Dark Matter/Dark Energy" if you prefer to think about it that way.
All that we perceive as the matter of our universe is just a temporary rift in the void. In much the same way that that we observe energy appearing and disappearing in a vacuum, so have we, on a much larger scale of distance and time. The universe isn't expanding, everything in it is shrinking proportionally which gives the illusion of expansion. It's really just a matter of time, literally!
Like they say, as Newtons "Cosmic Clock" continues to tick, all the stars and galaxies will appear farther and farther away from us until they eventually all just wink out of existence for us. Compare the law of gravity with the formula for expansion of the universe and I think you will see what I'm saying here. This is why the light from distant galaxies appears to be red-shifted to us and a longer wavelength.
Matter doesn't really exist. It's all basically empty space occupied by transient energy of all frequencies that react with each other to give us what we call reality or particles. What is mass really, other than what we observe and measure it to be?
While I don't agree with the "Big Bang" theory, I do subscribe to a version of the 'Many Worlds" theory, which may as well allude to the "Many Universes" theory, however, that is not necessary to explain our existence.
The earth is in the center of the bubble of our known universe and it appears the same regardless of the direction in which you look and new data from the JWST confirms large galaxies existing near the edge of our universe, where they should not be according to the big bang origin theory.
Our known universe contains billions and billions of galaxies, which each contain billions and billions of stars, each of which is home to a multitude of planets and moons in differing zones of distance from those stars. The probability of many of those worlds having conditions similar to those here is vast.
If you lived on a planet that we consider to be half of the distance from earth to the edge of our known universe, and you had the same JWST technology to view your own place in your visible universe, what would you see?
Your universe would appear the same to you as ours does to us - a bubble in which you are at the center! But, the fact is that like two venn-diagram intersecting spheres, your known universe would share a part of our known universe. The rest of both universes would be unknown to the other!
21:00 I'm team Macho. Rogue planets surely are more common than we think.
I really think we're about to reach a new level of understanding of the universe overall on the large scale, but also the absolutely tiny and maybe even additional dimensions! Most of the questions like, "maybe we just don't know what to look for..." almost feels like the correct answer is, "Duh!" ... That's why we're looking and coming up with these questions... but I don't mean that it in a condescending way in the slightest.... "Duh" is the answer from the physicist, mathmetician, astrophysicist, computer technology and A.I., etc, etc..... I feel as though we're just getting warmed up and I think a lot of people understand that, but also it is incomprehensible because it is the unknown! I love it! It's a great time to be a nerd, ain't it!? 😁🤯❤
P.S. - Keep in mind, what did we not know 100 years ago? 25 years ago? 5 years ago? What about just 6 months ago? Think hard about that right there.... just 6 months ago how much we've learned. You should be ashamed if you aren't blown away. lol I think we will find a "Unified Theory" or however you want to call it, once we unify our differences and get all the different sciences unified as well, doesn't mean agree, but just working together... discussing different ideas is how we learn anyways, isn't it?
John, you did it again. Best guest, best topics, great discussion. ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
Been waiting for round 2! It was 30 minutes too short, I guess I'll play it again.
Excellent. Thank you gentlemen.
Wait, what?
Brian is plenty smart.
If there is a ten-planet solar system and three of the planets are in the Habitable Zone nobody expects 7/10 of the life to be on the outside planets.
We know this, Brian knows this, Brian knows that we know that he knows this.
Blink twice if you're in trouble, Brian!
There's life in every cubic centimeter of Antarctica, and below the surface for kilometers.
Yess my favoriete youtube moment of the week ❤
Hmmm, about the opening I disagree with Dr. Keating in regards to anthropocentricity. While it's true thinking of the universe as teaming with life is anthropocentric, it's rolling the same human dice to assume that life doesn't exist in abundance. There is a distinct lack of evidence both for AND against the existence of alien life. Consider microscopes and magnifying glasses, our modern telescopes are magnifying glasses compared to what humans will have some day, and without microscopes humans never would have known the planet is covered head to toe in microscopic life. Even a place like Antarctica is technically teaming with life, the deep earth, under ice sheets, the deep sea, volcanic vents, etc. Maybe humans can start making statements about the universes capacity for life after we have concretely ruled out other forms of life within our own solar system. Till then I'm 100% with Carl Sagan and the like.
In any case this was still a very enjoyable episode, the MOND discussion was great food for thought.
I'm still trying to wrap my head around the idea that life being abundant is an anthropocentric idea. Unless he thinks that "teeming with life" necessarily means "life that resembles us." If that was the case, sure. I don't subscribe to the idea that our body plan or the way that our brains work or anything like that is a particularly likely product of evolution on worlds vastly different than our own. I give nature quite a bit more credit in the creativity department than that. But I also think we have little reason to doubt that simple life, at very least, is incredibly abundant. In a universe of trillions upon trillions of stars, with countless planets and moons, how many different ways might nature reinvent self-replicating chemistry?
1:50. “ Are we the only form of conscious and moral life”
Evidence suggests that life elsewhere in the cosmos, out from under our warm, moist and perilously thin atmosphere is extremely rare but no there are many other forms of conscious and moral life other than humanity here on earth with us. It’s just a matter of degrees. My beloved dog is most certainly conscious and aware of his existence, and I believe has a higher level of morality than many people.
I never questioned that there has to be some form of life out there. But this whole idea of defining "intelligent life" as something similar to us, is really narrow-minded. But who knows, maybe we have almost reached the pinnacle of technologies. Seriously, how much more can we realistically do without destroying ourselves? If any aliens did have better technology, I don't think we would even recognize it, since it would be based on science that we don't understand, and we would not be able to explain it as technology
Interesting discussion. Thankyou.
That was a good one 👍
The effect of gravity on entangled particles spread over a distance compared to condensed matter? 👀
Just seen this as I look for my night cap listen and you guys have nailed it again ! Please don’t stop this wonderful thing called communication!
Look at the earth he says.
Before focusing only on antartica.
Conveniently forgetting that 6 out of 7 continents are quite literally teeming with life...
Also,
Says that there is no life on antartica...
5 minutes later starts describing the life forms he has seen in Antarctica...
7:08
There is no life form out there...except for the life forms out there...
God damn this man sounds like a clown...
Par for the course. A few episodes back he made a point about scientists needing to stay in their wheelhouse and not comment on things their profession doesn't cover. He then immediately followed it up with conjecture about areas of science other than his own. And wouldn't you know, it was concerning a hot-button topic. I've come to realize that clicking on a Keating EH episode is a gamble, especially if there is any room for controversy. And that's a shame, because the EH is great and Dr Keating does have a ton of useful and relevant info to share without having to rely on stirring the pot to attract attention.
I'm sure he's good at what he does, and maybe he's a swell guy. But he's consistently inconsistent, and in my opinion that undermines his usefulness as a source of accurate and unbiased information. It seems, to me at least, that someone acting as a voice of science to the common man should be delivering a message that requires minimal sorting of the wheat from the chaff.
He also forgets that even the lakes deep under the ice are teaming with microbial life
@@gaming_henry There's life for kilometers below the surface.
Does anyone know if you can hear any of Jon's books in audiobook form? If so where?
Great show!
Are we the best it gets?- is that a legitimate question?
Are we the only or highest form of life?- what does it matter to you? Seriously..lol; this is your options you can you can think yes/no/maybe. I choose to think maybe but I imagine more in terms of infinities as opposed to limits.
Is life even good?
Why not termites instead? Why not bonobos?
@@olddecimal2736 we choose to continue it. Life is excitation. Temporary structures that have the ability to self reproduce. And when when one really thinks about it... When they're afraid of death with their really afraid of is that life won't continue..
Excellent! 👏
The dark matter spitballing was amazing. By the numbers though, I think we are the dark ness monsters of the proper dark matter universe. Not saying this is heaven or hell or anything like that, just that it could be the norm, and they call us dark matter. The universe we can measure is huge, and we’re the smaller bit of it. We’re starting to crack neutrino mysteries, I think this one will be next. I bet the island gets huge when we make some more steps that direction. Awesome guest today too, he was fun to listen to.
John might you be interested in Andrzej Dragan from the University of Warsaw, who, together with Artur Ekert, is working on the quantum principle of relativity, in which superluminal observers are taken into account, leading to very interesting theoretical conclusions. And it all started with Galileo Galilei and his parrot :) (Dragan, Ekert 2020 Quantum principle of relativity DOI 10.1088/1367-2630/ab76f7).
I was just watching the seti podcast before this. It's night and day. Event horizon is so much better. You don't treat your audience like they are 5 years old.
These podcasts are tremendously enlightening and satisfying for me. Awesome stuff. 💪🏽😎
I'm a big fan of modified gravity. It seems much more reasonable than the existence of a mysterious, invisible, none interacting matter that makes up most of the universe.
"I'll see your crazy and I'll raise you"-
I like it..
Great video !
I've recently been considering dark matter aliens, extra dimensional aliens, aliens made of strange matter and other esoteric material
You're funny
Thanks for another great show.
When I was a kid growing up in the 80’s, 90’s, even 00’s we thought water was a miracle substance. Now we know it’s everywhere including the GD moon!
still miracle substance
you guys need to have the guests record their own audio (eg with audacity) and send it over and put that in the video
I'm sure there's a small confusion made by Mr Keating but Antarctica is much much bigger than described. In fact is 20x size of Texas approx. Now that's really big.
Plenty of life in Antarctica, just most of it is microbial.
If I had 9 wives and 10 kids I think a one way trip to Mars would seem a very attractive proposition!! 😁
Don’t forget also….There maybe intelligent advanced civilisations which developed AFTER the light emitted by those ancient galaxies set forth. In space-time diagram terms they are outside our past light cone and we can not see them.
No one ever acknowledges this. So funny that everyone’s looking at the past and wondering why they don’t see what’s likely the present.
We can't see anything anyway. A few pixels. We aren't not seeing anything - we're blind.
Oh wow! Happy Thursday.
Into the impossible Event horizon!
April 20th is a day to celebrate.
Indeeeeeed.
💚♾️
"I hope he gets his wish, but I hope it's not on impact." 🤣
We're sooo close to providing life somewhere... I can feel it in my bones...
NGL, I am kinda with you. The way governments have been acting lately I get this weird feeling they already know and are trying to ease the world into it. IDK, maybe wishful thinking but I agree on the weird feeling like its coming.
Who's the lucky alien 🤭
@@seditt5146 something changed around 2010. World turned on its head. Maybe the ai made contact where us biologicals couldnt
I figured it out. Since everything started at one point in a singularity, in actuality the oldest galaxies will not be really far away, but will instead be right on top of us.
I bet interstellar travel and colonization is harder than it looks and mostly not worthwhile. I bet very few civs end up using a significant fraction of their star's total energy. I bet information technology is a powerful evolutionary pressure that keeps civs compact. Even the moon has undesirable / unacceptable internet latency - forget about Bandraginus V.
I suspect that a modified theory isn’t even necessary. We’re not very good at seeing perfectly ordinary matter unless it’s pretty hot.
Education, discussion!
To say we are the only form of matter that is conscious is incredibly arrogant and ignorant considering we dont know what consciousness is. Just saying. Otherwise another excellent interview :)
Great episode but were ANNA and the opossum on vacation? What gives?
International marijuana appreciation day? 🤓😊💚♾️
Though I don't disagree that entangled particles may invoked this coupler pair but when can easily find it from entangled particles. I don't think neutrinos because it escapes the galaxy. It's affects would be noticed in intergalactic medium.
MOND discussion begins around 10:20
2:15, I could not possibly disagree more. The only honest answer is "We don't know." A hard yes is as incorrect as a hard no, because you cannot demonstrate that is the case.
Isnt dark matter just unobserved matter or matter in wave form ? And could it be possible that the black holes are the local mechanism of observation that forces the wave form matter to choose its path as it remAins within the black holes sphere of influence ?
Dark matter is whatever we need it to be to make the math of our theories add up. This is of course completely different from the epicycles of earlier times.
Best collab
It's always amusing to hear people struggle against math and logic to claim life would be exclusive to only one dot in the Universe. Thanks for the laughs.
Be good to get Max Tegmark on or professor Brian Cox.. always good no matter what John.
Are we the best it gets? Given no data, assume we're average.
Life hack...
It is an option where you can speed up the content of what is being talked about if if you're only looking to absorb it...
Top right-hand corner settings playback speed 1.5 x
Always a pleasure listening to you John but when you collaborate with one of my favourite scientists it’s even better! Thank you John and Dr Brian keeting I really enjoyed that. Bravo
The existence of dark matter halos have been empirically disproven. This is evidenced by the speed of spiral arms in colliding galaxies remaining constant rather than slowing down due to resistance from a hypothetical dark matter halo. The endless futile search for dark matter seems to be barking up the wrong tree.
cbody Well, it looks like MOND has taken a hit and dark matter is still standing. Time will tell..........
5:43 on the surface, yes. We can live in cities underwater though.
The strawman interviewed.. "The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"!
By the way, there is no bigger Anthropomorphism then assuming Earth is special.
Moreover the very concept of what life is, is very dodgy...same goes for Intelligence.
Indeed our biggest sin is narrow perception.
Yeah. There's pretty nearly zero data. We are deaf, blind and clueless. But that's changing soon.
How much pressure and force would be created by the appearance and disapearance of particles from the quntum to the physical. If they're popping up all over the place it must have some effect. Like maybe gravitational micro pops.
There you may see a combined force that when looked for does not physically exist..only the forces...that would fit wouldnt it?
The plankton of physics
Didn't really get the Ukranian comment, but whatever... great talk!
When someone is skeptical about Life in the Universe and quotes the Fermi Paradox, simply reply with Zoo Hypothesis, Panspermia, Von Neumann probes, Sumerian/Egyptian Kings List, Hindu Vimanas and mu or shem in the Sumerian and Akkadian texts.
Does dark matter and dark energy account for things like the great attractor and/or the shapely supercluster??
Dark Matter, this unknown weakly interacting matter is unlikely to exist in the quantities that is proposed.
When I think about the universe being super big I don't think about it being teeming with life I think about it being special like how lightning forms within in the atmosphere you know know?
I suspect there might be microbial life beneath the surface of just about every rocky body in the universe (that's big enough to retain a little heat in its core).
3:00 Step 1: State that no evidence exists for extraterrestrial life;
Step 2: Ignore all evidence to the contrary.
1:00 Even if Aliens were *exactly* like us. *I would be terrified*
Good gravy…when he said he hopes Elon doesn’t die on impact I spit my soda all over my iPad! Come on man…you owe me an iPad!! 😂
Sabina: New book: Miracle: The Creation of the Earth, explains the recent history of the solar system. It explains that Mercury is the former solid core of Mars. When it left through the Valles Marineris the outer shell collapsed and formed a 'core' of lighter elements. The book also explains what astronomers think is dark matter which you mentioned. It is due to clouds of stable 3He+ surrounding every star system that has a terrestrial planet. These are normal matter produced by normal matter which scatter and redshift light resulting in the Hubble being not so constant.
It's a fun idea to play with (I'm into ttrpgs). Aliens that suck. They have some really neat technology and aren't really that violent, but lack cooperative capacity in ways that leaves them open to choice one-liner burns, maybe the occasional practical joke that verges on art. The Space faring humans are stuck with these oafish clowns in this vast cosmos. You're doomed to fart jokes that don't even land right.
Right in the middle of the Overton window, wee timorous moos.
You know you are DEEP I'm the rabbit hole when you are using NFTs to make a concept easier to understand.
JMG!
What does the O in MOND stand for?
Professor Milgrom, instead of using the acronym MND for "Modified Newtonian Dynamics", uses MOND for "MOdified Newtonian Dynamics" so one might say that the "O" stands for the "o" in the word "modified". Please google "pavel kroupa dark matter" and "riccardo scarpa mond arxiv".
Question..week ow dark matter exist .but zynone with mercury.toridle field .
Dr Keating is always cool to listen to. 😎
What kind of question is "much worse than us"?
5:50 Aww. I liked Waterworld
No, increase parameters and you get that symbol again, infinity, no we are not as good as it gets just like a fractle getting as big or small as it can get.
Hello. Scotch? Yes! Yes, that exactly. Excuse me.
30:50 Sign me up!
It seems weird to me that when many observations dont fit what is calculated, they decided to alter Newtonian gravity to make the observations fit, when we know Newtonian equations are only an approximation to the EInstein equations, so why not modify the EInstein equations?
Also why is it seen as strange that there are particles we cant observe when until say 50 years ago we didnt even know about Neutrinos, W and Z bosons the Higgs, quarks etc? MOND is acting as if NOW we know everything about particle phsyics and there cant be any new unknown stuff.
I think MOND modifies Newton's equations rather than Einstein's for two reasons. The Einstein Field Equations are really hard to work with, and Newton is a very good approximation in most circumstances. In particular, stars are not orbiting the galaxy at relativistic speeds, so plain old Newton SHOULD be working just fine.
Aquatic life =/= non-technological life.
Here is no shortage of organisms in marine enviroment capable pf generating electric current.
Electroforming & electrodeposition are as viable manufactufing techniques as primitive forges.
cheers big ears
8:48 I would. 100%.
@21:33 but isn't that a redundant question?
The cosmic cavitation.
It's super easy to die here on earth. Barley an inconvenience.