Libertarian Argues Against Obamacare, Says You Should Diagnose Your Own Illnesses
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- čas přidán 21. 08. 2024
- In this Libertarian caller clip, a Libertarian calls into the show to make the argument for a perfect Libertarian healthcare system. He rails against Obamacare, discusses how he likes Singapore's universal healthcare model (but notes he would make changes as it's still not a perfect Libertarian system), and makes the case where you should be personally responsible and diagnose yourself when you are sick...
This clip from the Majority Report, live M-F at 12 noon EST and via daily podcast at Majority.FM
Healthcare Rationing: I go to a therapist because I deal with depression and bi-polar disorder, I'd go once a week. it was really the only outlet to have someone to talk to openly who would help me. after a while my insurance company said I can only go two times a month instead of 4. My therapist told me that they wanted to take it down to once a month so had to actually bargain with them by telling them the therapy keeps me out of the hospital which would cost them more money, they agreed, so they allowed me to go two times a week. so here I am trying to get help and my insurance company is just treating me like I'm a burden to them trying to limit the help they can provide for me to save money. how can anyone think that's okay? how can you honestly think that's a good system? that's profits before people, that's immoral and it's wrong.
I'm in the same boat with my birth control. They keep switching my regular pill with a cheaper version.
The cheaper pill causes so many side effects, but on my old pill there were ZERO side effects. I'm constantly having to bargain everytime my prescription needs renewing.
I am sorry you have to deal with this level of pure evil, the only people who should be deciding on how long treatment should be , how often and what method/meds is you the patient and your therapist period. The therapist says to come in 10 times a month in order to keep in good mental, physical or emotional health than that is what needs to happen not the unqualified insurance company, based on the greed. This a ridiculous and your doctor having to bargain and convince them to keep the best health plan for you is beyond unreal
you're right, a for profit healthcare system is criminal
Yep. I'm not allowed to see my therapist & psychiatrist on the same day or insurance won't pay for it. They also control the amount of pills you can refill.
The idea that capitalism doesn’t have rationing is insane. The whole point is that rationing is built into the system via price. If you have a million loaves of bread for 1.2 million people, standard rationing means you only get a loaf of bread 10 out of every 12 weeks. But in capitalism it just means the price goes up enough that 200,000 people can no longer afford a loaf of bread, maybe more and some richer people buy two.
The amount of demand after equilibrium quantity are the people who get rationed out. People with money don’t notice anything, and the poor are disenfranchised enough that no one cares.
Singaporean here. The last thing I expected was to hear my country’s health insurance plan to be brought up in an MR video. This guy talks about personal responsibility in healthcare as if all healthcare procedures are optional. No one goes to see the doctor “just because”. Preventive check-ups go a long way help keep overall costs low because illnesses are detected before they become more severe. No matter how healthy one lives their lives, health issues can still crop up! Because of family history with diabetes/hypertension/heart disease, I spent my life living as healthily as possible to avoid all these. Last year, I was diagnosed with a chronic autoimmune disorder which was none of these.
Funny enough the guy described something we already have in the USA: an HSA. It’s tax free up to $3600 a year and you can spend it on healthcare. I’m more willing to swipe the card on my HSA than my own account because it’s a sunk cost. So from a psychological angle it does help people pay for healthcare. And Sam was right: making it mandatory 6-8% of income would just be like social security. You get money back from SS based on what you paid in, only the limitation is by age not type of expense
The whole point of insurance is that some people have more expensive healthcare than others, and individual savings accounts are not enough to pay for a huge cost. 10 years of never using an HSA is $36k, but if I get in an accident and need a ton of surgeries that cost could enter the hundred thousands. So insurance means the healthy pay for the sick. Most people net lose money to insurance, but it’s ok because they are still covered for everything else and if they do happen to have a very expensive problem, they are still ok
Sorry about your diagnosis. I hope that you are doing ok; I wish you well. The idea that if one is just careful one won’t get sick is a harmful fiction that places blame on the unlucky.
Canadian here.
Smoker. Know a lot of smokers.
Never once in my life have I thought of, or heard any smoker here ever justify their smoking with "well we're in Canada and healthcare is free, so puff up!"
Lmao
In fact, I remember something about people in universal healthcare countries making better health decisions because everyone is burdened by them, not just the employer they don’t like. Though it may just be more so a public policy (I.e. agricultural policy), since politicians can use healthcare costs to better regulate food.
I know that sounds like literally 1984 20 quadrillion dead vuvuzela to a libertarian, but considering how batshit insane the USA’s food corporations are I figure putting them under stricter scrutiny is a good thing. It’s the least intrusive way to get people to eat healthier.
There is a simple reason why the "free market" doesn't work when it comes to health care. Free market price is dictated by what people are willing to pay for a product. If health care is run this way, the free market says people will pay ANY amount of money to not die. Its not like you're picking between two cars. Its because people will pay any cost to not die that we have people like Martin Shkreli who start charging "market price" for a life saving drug. And by DEFAULT some amount of people will not be able to afford it. The free market works fine for every day products that your life does not depend on. But when it comes to health care, life or death, we need a "social" system like the fire department, like the police, etc.
A million thumbs up
I agree completely.
Theres a little thing called competition in the supply side which lowers costs, say one commodity is really expensive and on high demand a lot of business will open up to sell that product in order to capitalise as competition increases, prices go down. But since your govt is too involved in health, this has increases market price equilibrium and its going to get worse
@@JS-mc3ik What way is the government overly involved? The FDA is vital to ensuring Americans’ safety.
@@salmonvariety5896 i’m not from america we don’t have FDA, i’m talking about policies that try to artificially lower prices like subsidies but just increases prices over time like obamacare
Libertarian Consumer Doctor = Google + WebMD + Walgreens
WebMD costs money to see the actual useful stuff....
To Liberal- terroristians, alleged perfect and perfectly healthy humans who don't need no stinkin' health care, or regulations that may save your life
From: A nurse of 45 yrs. now on Medicare/ Medicaid
Please submit a list of your voter base , and their health history. Then We the People Committee can review whether these medications are Really?,Truly? NECESSARY.
And then , We the People will also tell them, based on their alleged illnesses ( cancer, heart disease, diabetes- the ones with the most 'fakers') , what the most effective folk remedy is. And before you even see a doctor, and despite your health declining, must use said remedy for 6 mos. Period. By that time, you need an undertaker. ( yeah Death is sooo much cheaper then Life/ Health ).
While I respect the fact you have given Thought about this topic, where 2.0 Libertarians fail in their thinking, is they think only of HOW THEY take care of THEIR health; not understand how others who don't or do it as well as you (.or you wouldn't be sick or God/ punnishment etc. ), impact you, me and all the People.
Picture Health like those dominoes the kids stand up into patterns; push the first one. Now THIS does involve science, ...
The first pushes the second etc.( like 10 y.o boys in a school lunchline. the girl ahead always gets pushed ).
While you may be healthy, you, the middle domino, is not only surrounded by smokers, alkies, heart/ kidney/ lung illness, AND / BUT the First domino is a 65 y.o with end stage assholism, COPD, diabetes 1, and cardiac issues, stds.
THEN (as Sheldon etal might propose, you, and your healthiness will be impacted due to the sheer numbers of sick dominoes. ( like picking up a cold because the bus riders are sick ...)
As a lifelong JFK Democrat/ F Boomer/70, and since the whole Bernie- Hillary dance in 2016 , and a former VISTA VOLUNTEER who worked with the low income in 1971, you fail to consider a basic human factor- We are Humans, frail, dumbasses who will get sick, yes, cause our own broken bones etc. And whether We the People, We- you & I, or the 'Royal' We, ARE IN THIS TOGETHER!
Bottom line - there has to be minimum govt. regulation because We the People are vulnerable, stupid but not perfect. ( I tried reattaching my finger but.... )
Ignoring the impact of health on the majority, is foolish. The word Contagious comes to mind. And , immigrants here legally or otherwise, bring cultural diseases, practices that Immigration considers unhealthy. But hey if you think those plantains don't need inspection, here the 911 number for 911.
Internet would not exist
So, this is basically what happened...
Caller: Hi, I'm a non-crazy libertarian.
Sam: Start talking. We'll see about that.
You forgot the ending part
Caller after proving he's insane: see? I'm not crazy!
Sam: that's what crazy people say...
@@terryfuldsgaming7995 what about the middle? the meat. oh ya, it's always pointless arguments that go no where because neither side is willing to concede an inch.
@@jdirty3460 What is the middle ground between "government should exist and serves an important purpose" and "government should do the absolute minimum"? Where should each one concede?
jayburdification : Insurance for Food...?!
Some of you guys replying are kinda dumb not gonna lie, when that one commenter said “the middle” they meant the middle of the discussion, aka the actual discussion. Centrists are extremely stupid and naive but come on you guys read
Having lived in Canada, UK and France, I can promise you that these issues/choices/cost benefit analyses seem absolutely absurd. Health isn't a commodity and I'm not certain that the libertarian deification of the free market isn't far more dangerous than whatever expansion of government is necessary for the US to move to single payer. BTW- these arguments clear up really quickly when one gets a serious illness.
+Steven Rosenblatt exactly, Market cultists who worship wealth and will do anything and say anything to keep the billionaires happy.
Steven Rosenblatt may I ask u a question? If you want a dr appointment, how long do u have to wait ?
MrMasterDebate Canadian here, last time I went to the doctor (with an appointment), I waited 10 minutes.
Rehman Chaudhry I more meant how far in advance do you wait for the appointment
Even in the US you cant get same day walk ins...if you do its rare...most of the time you have to make in advance appointments
I'm watching all these old videos and am particularly amused by libertarian callers.
Yes it's nice to binge watch
these are amazing im watching all of them
Another reason the free market doesn’t work for healthcare is because prevention is cheapest, and curing is super expensive. The free market disincentivizes you from going to the doctor until it’s too late to prevent it because it costs more. Remove the cost and everyone gets preventative care, and care costs will go down.
Kevin Baggett you can’t explain logic to people who consistently vote against their own interests.
The caller should have just said, "I don't know what I'm talking about, but I have decided I know how this should all work."
Lol perfect summary
"Personal responsibility" seems to mean some other person's responsibility.
When did the common good and trying to make sure as many people are helped become controversial?
dude sam you SHRED these guys so hard, i do not get how they are so obsessed with principles and yet breaking all of them or most by living in society RIGHT NOW and then arguing that they dont understand how they are doing that it is crazy thanks for posting these sam.
“There has to be some personal responsibility” is one of the tenets of the faith that the free market will solve everything, which is why he doesn’t have a good answer for it.
This man is so clueless - he thinks check-ups should happen when you're sick. The whole point of a YEARLY check-up is to make sure everything is right. Preventative healthcare is key in catching serious illnesses early and ends up costing WAY less than going to the urgent care with a life threatening ailment.
well the thing is ALL men in Switzerland over the age of 18 are members of the military and the minute they leave the service they have to hand back their guns because the whole point of them having firearms in the first place is so that they can raise an army for national defence quickly rather than owning a gun for the sake of owning a gun
While I completely disagree with everything the caller said, I will say that he did a very nice job of just having a decent conversation with Sam. Low bar, but still it was a good listen
Most people can't afford to put away 8%of they income in a health saving account
The most edifying thing that ANY libertarian caller has ever said on this show is "I don't know."
It's also the most honest!
Sam Seder you are great. Just love his show. All the best from the UK.
Sam, America is,sick - obese, slovenly, don't exercise - if insurance would embrace nutritional counseking,,increasing foosmd stamps, doctors should hold, say, smokers to goals or dismiss them.
It's become obscene that docs do not pressure medicare/ Medicaid to invest in health.
Thank God we still have the NHS in Britain! *cries in Brexit*
The craziest thing about people who don’t want free healthcare for all is 99% would go broke if they got diagnosed with cancer or another serious illness. It’s all fun and games until you have to be homeless to pay for your chemo, or you can’t afford treatment at all. Also its despicable health insurance is often tied to your job. How am I supposed to keep my insurance to treat my cancer if I can’t continue to work BECAUSE OF THE CANCER.
Even actual doctors go to OTHER DOCTORS because they know they can be biased about diagnosing themselves. Now I'm not saying *all* doctors do this but this is common practice.
The only "personal responsibility" one has when it comes to healthcare is to use it when you need it. Period.
Yeah, its preposterous. The idea that if I get shot (and I work in a job that is a real possibility), go into the ER bleeding, oh, let me hop on my phone real quick and make sure the surgeon I'm getting charges a good rate, hey set it up like Priceline, I name my price for my surgeon!.. Ludicrous.
I guess we need to become our own doctors to know if we need one. That's why 30k people die each year from lack of care.
The libertarian dream.
“Im not sure how it works” but I’m all for it..... where have we heard that before ?
Libertarians version of health insurance and health care is not only unworkable for all but the wealthy and well-connected, it is absolutely cold-blooded and cruel.
+Ekkie101 It is brain washing for the ignorant. They tell you these stories of pure fraud. The examples are Steve Jobs. If you read the stories about these sort of folks they always came into the world naked. They had nothing and rose up to be super wealthy. They forget to tell you they were born out of a rich vag.
*****
They had no system before at all. It was just they die or suffer and die.
*****
You are a Looney, you said it pal. I ain't going to argue there. To pretend that everything is done better by private sector of the economy is looney. Why is it okay to have big government when it is for the military but not for health care? I suppose you will argue that we can do away with policing and the military and just have security guards right?
Private charities are better then nothing sometimes but for the most part are just tax dodges. If we had a strong social security , we would not need them.
*****
Well the US pays more for health care then any other industrialized nation with universal health care. Right now we have death panels that are on insurance companies that ration healthcare and make a profit when they deny healthcare. The private health care system is more expensive and produces bad outcomes.
+Matt Gallant That's not what the Affordable Care Act has done for me. It saves me about $400 a month on my premium. But I live in a state with an intelligent, courageous governor. Unlike the red-state governors who put their ideology ahead of the well being of their constituents.
I've been binging these Sam Seder vs Libertarians and I love the amount of glaringly obvious holes in their philosophy.
You are so right that it is nearly impossible to be an educated consumer of health care. Take the urgent care centers, for example. They are totally profit motivated and generally elevate the cost of care as much as possible. And they generally do not like to see complicated time consuming cases. They don't get paid as much to see chronically ill patients. They prefer to skim off the top and specialize in "boogers and bandaids" type care and charge 2-3 times what the care is worth. But where else can you easily get care after hours or on weekends. So just like you sometimes buy milk where you get gas instead of at the grocery store where it is cheaper, you go to the doc in the box. So there is a waste of financial resources. And it may cost as much for your cold as it costs to take care of your 70 year old grandma who is on multiple medications for multiple medical problems;
You are allowed to pay a premium to go see a doctor or get a procedure that the government doesn't think you need in a universal health care system. The government isn't forcing you not to, it's just not going to pay for you to do it. Replace "government" with "insurance company" and you've got the U.S. healthcare system.
Sam misses a major point here. What the guy is basically saying is that we would be more careful as to which medical tests we got if the money came out of our own pocket. The problem with that is that without medical tests, illnesses go undiagnosed and you end up paying twice as much which is precisely why the US has the highest healthcare costs in the world.
NAH ! JUST ANOTHER WHITE DUDE WHO IS GENERALLY OK ! AND THINK THE REST OF THE COUNTRY IS ON HIS TEET !
I THOUGHT HE WAS GONNA CRY !!!
You know, since I have free healthcare I’m just going to get AIDS and Diabetes just so I can go to the Dr as often as possible. Hell Yeah!
You're not a true libertarian until you use no true Scotsman fallacy as your first arguement
I love libertarians being explained like, medium level concepts, you can hear their brain fizzling, and then they go back to "no, you don't understand. Like, imagine you had money, you wouldn't want to spend it needlessly right? But if the govt has it, you don't care!"
And they like, truly think they are explaining the gold standard of logic that us plebs can't understand.
I just diagnosed myself and I prescribed more alcohol and pot.
Medical marijuana in a nutshell.
Rather than asking "Why?" in the face of the assertion of personal responsibility re health care, the better question is "How?"
How is someone unversed in medicine supposed to tell between a cold and the opening symptoms of, say, bubonic plague? Or a more recent and "scarier" scare, SARS? And No, in general basic health care does _not_ cover cosmetics, not unless necessitated by an acute episode of something, for example, maxilo-facial surgery after a serious car accident, etc. You pay extra for the elective side of things.
I don't get how spending ridiculous sums of money on the military makes us more safe. Our allies such as Japan can just get off the hook for not paying for their own military because the US will support them. Why would the EU pay for their military when the US can do it for them?
same reason why the US doesn't do the same thing. Political leaders tend to like the idea that they are the one's in charge of their countries destiny which can't really happen when your country is basically occupied by the US
C Gooding ...Japan isnt allowed to have a military. Its in their constitution. I mean, its about time that it changed, but I am telling the truth. Many Japanese actually join our military.
the have a very sizeble defense force airforce aircraft carrier, But they can not expand their navy same as germany
C Gooding I agree with some of what you say but the thing about japan is kind of wrong. Japan can only have self defense force, they can’t have any military cause after WW2 they by law can’t have any military cause the USA don’t want a repeated of what happen. Trust me japan would love to have their own military. Japan’s been trying to get their own military for awhile now but China will not let that happen as well.
@@thomassky4385 Pretty sure it's the other way around. The US was pushing Japan to amend their Constitution to allow for a military so the US could pull out of their defense obligations to Japan. Japan doesn't want to do that because militaries are expensive and it would require drastic rebalancing of the budget to expand the JSDF.
This discussion is foolish. The caller doesn't even know that he's talking about socialism not libertarianism. And his morality is crazy.
Atlas Shrugged is the Libertarians bible , it lets them justify there cold selfish hearts , and helps them come to terms with their lack of critical thinking . What , you don't know this ?
Yes, I have been asked to pay taxes and obey regulations. It's part of living in a civil society.
That does not imply that the govt has to use force... Unless you are a paranoid anarchist or a libertarian.
You paid tax, your personal responsibility is fulfilled.
“We don’t know what’s minor or not” and he doesn’t understand how one pain can bring death. Like literally a tooth ache can turn into a heart attack depending on the person.
Singapore's health system is much more than just the Savings Accounts. They _also_ have robust price controls and subsidies.
The bigger crime and reason why with health care we are not regular consumers is that even after a diagnosis and layout of our options for health care by a doctor, the hospital won't tell us how much anything will cost. We can't even know how much most things cost after leaving the doctors office. There is nothing else in our economy that you buy before knowing what it will cost and this is why health care costs are so high.
The Army of Personal Responsibility.
"Yearly check ups"
Bro i dont know a single dad thats been to the doctor in 15 years
Another problem with rising medical cost in U.S. is that many people hold off going to the doctor until it's too late.
a yearly checkup doesn't diagnosis all potential problems
Love the smirk on sams face when he hears the line, "I saw a couple of CZcams videos..."
Sam, you need to approach this health issue differently. Medical care is INVOLUNTARY. That places it in public goods, not private commodities. Economics do not apply here.
Health insurance companies would rather get their 30% profit from a $ trillion market than a $ billion market.
So as costs increase they celebrate higher earnings.
They actually WANT you sicker.
But not so sick that you'll be in paralyzing debt and thus a liability. They cut you off REAL quick then.
A doctor who operates on himself has a fool for a patient.
" a free market is a system of voluntary exchange in which force and fraud are not allowed."
And who enforces the rules against "force and fraud"?
Without organizations like the AMA, how would you know that the doctor is qualified to practice medicine?
And if you didn't know, then how can you have a "free market"?
The AMA does NOT have any special privileges granted by government.
The deal was simple. Either the industry regulates itself (the AMA), or govt will regulate the industry. When it comes to certifying doctors, most people would agree that the AMA would do a better job than the govt.
Problem solved.
Not only should you diagnose your own illnesses, but should you need surgery operate on yourself as well. I'm a Libertarian and if my appendix needs to come out I'll remove it myself.
Whenever I need a good laugh I like to listen to libertarians. The are so far removed from reality that it’s comical.
They built a whole ideology around not wanting to pay taxes. I feel it's similar to if kids decided what was and was not to be eaten for dinner. Feels nice, but isn't sustainable.
@@EastofVictoriaPark What also isn't sustainable is the ideal libertarian template for any man or woman.
Under libertarianism, you must be a...
Doctor (diagnose yourself).
Civil engineer (fix/repair those roads yourself).
Soldier (fend off those roving gangs yourself).
Attorney (sue that unscrupulous company yourself).
Economist/soothsayer (divine how the "free market" is behaving yourself).
No you misunderstand.I mean if I have back pain.My first inclination is to go to the doctor.But then I look at the fact that I'm not even breaking 10k, have nothing in the bank and knowing that the doctor for such a problem is going to probablly charge me thousands of dollars to fix said problem, thousands that I don't have so I stay home and bear the freaking pain until at some point I can no longer go on.That happens far too often in our country.
I have never been threatened with death by my government.
I am not the paranoid one.
Somewhere along the line we decided that when people get hurt or sick, that making them feel better equates making enough money to buy a high 6 figure income house, a boat, the newest model car and all the luxuries you can ever dream of having in life instead of really concentrating on helping this person feel better as their primary goal.
"am I on the air?" was a cute throwback
These fools would rather fatten the insurance companies than keep us alive.
I've never met a libertarian and thought, wow, that person must have done really well in school.
Of course, schools of economics and business exist so that even libertarians can get a college degree.
I've noticed every libertarian starts with 'yeah the guy you beat last time was dumb as hell,i'm representing the REAL libertarians' then makes identical points
I remember Tweeter! And yes. I do think people need to be informed about health and about their individual situation...having several diseases has led to ME teaching MY DOCTORS about my condition. I take their expertise and they take my lived experience and research that I’ve done...and we work together from there.
I've known several people who thought they had a minor illness, waited, ended up in the morgue. Perhaps if they'd had better, cheaper insurance, they would have survived. Hooray for capitalism, right?
These people need Hobbies instead of wanting to spend their time researching literally everything everyday
Hoping your pain in the ass is resolved Sam. Stay healthy
I'd imagine the pain went down considerably once the call was ended
This could be wrong, aka Citation Needed.
When their period of service has ended, militiamen have the choice of keeping their personal weapon and other selected items of their equipment.[citation needed] In this case of retention, the rifle is sent to the weapons factory where the fully automatic function is removed; the rifle is then returned to the discharged owner.[citation needed] The rifle is then a semi-automatic or self-loading rifle.
Cont...
Here in Britain, any day I can walk into either my doctor's office, or the walk-in clinic across the road, or the one in the centre of the city, or anywhere in the country if I'm not at home. And be seen in 5 - 30 minutes. Every time. I get diagnosed, get any necessary drugs prescribed (which the NHS pays for), and walk off home with what I need to get well. Done. This costs the UK govt. LESS per capita than the US state subsidies to healthcare AND the US individual pays twice that in insurance.
I'm 67 and live near small river, when young you couldn't go near it, you smell it from are home. After EPA started businesses up stream was forced to clean up there acts. NOW people swim in river, raft, and fish.
There is no "free market" when it comes to medical care.
For a free market to exist, there need to be multiple choices of products / service providers and a rational basis on making a choice.
The problem, how does anyone who is not a doctor make that rational choice.
If you are in the ER, and the doc tells you that you need to have that gall bladder removed, are you going to reach for that Consumer Report issue on local surgeons, surgical staff, hospitals, lab services provider, etc?
They don't hate the idea of being "asked". They hate the idea of being forced. If you were asked, you should be able to say "yes" or "no".
I hate that when the people want to allocate money it creates “economic troubles” but when the government allows it for corporate gain its okay and definitely possible lol
Ok, this is flat out stupid. What happens if you get a retinal detachment. You can go completely blind in one eye in a day, out of the blue. If you don't get help in a few hours you have very little chance of using that eye. So you should read up on how to perform surgery while going blind? Please.
What about a gun shot wound. Bone up on surgery while bleeding to death?
Sorry, this must be a joke.
Sobering thought - if I lived in the US I would have died 20 years ago owing to cancer but because I live in London I had a radical left nephrectomy and it cost me nothing at all thanks to 'socialised medical care'. I'm not an expert but there's no way I could have known how or why one of my kidneys got riddled with cancer, not even the consultants could agree on that so no amount of 'personal responsibility' would have saved me.
While you're at it, explain to me how in this country, people are expected to know what kind of treatment they need. That's why we have doctors. Currently, for most people in this country, they don't even bother making an appointment, because they know they can't afford the visit. So, my counterpoint is, I'd rather wait a few hours for cheaper treatment, than not get it at all, because I can't afford it.
Society by definition is a voluntary group of individuals.
You are the one that argued both of those positions, not me.
So you choose.
@ Hybrid: WRONG. The US constitution hs a number of provisions which by libertarian definition is "big government" soare you going to get rid of the ban on slavery? Re-institute Jim Crow by repealing the 14th amendment?
The taxing and spending clause allows the government to collect taxes to promote the general welfare of the US citizenry, fool.
Libertarian isn't anarchy, it is compatible with it to say "slavery shouldn't be allowed" in fact, it is a huge huge part of it..
Anthony Peasley
Except it really isn't when we talk about the libertarian idea of "free markets" which forbid any sort of law that punishes certain business practices. Slavery was seen as "free enterprise" and "acceptable via the free market" during the civil war, and slavery along with jim crow were "state's rights issues" according to them as well, despite how it is clearly a bastardization of what the tenth amendment actually says.
Libertarianism is the pratice of volunteerism and the non aggression principle. What about voluntary transaction and non aggression does slavery fall into?
Sean Marsh
the non aggression principle is immensely flawed, you lose automatically when you bring it up, especially since the principle itself conflicts with enforcement of the constitution to begin with.
One does not simply diagnose themselves.
It's easy to be a libertarian when you're a teenager with no expenses. Let's see if he changes his mind after his finally moves out of his parents' house and starts paying his own way in life.
This guy totally misunderstands the point of insurance. You don’t get food insurance because food doesn’t have massive risks. Smoker or nonsmoker, unless you are super rich you could never afford treatment for lung cancer. Or most any cancer. Cancer treatments cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.
The point of insurance is this: everyone has a baseline healthcare cost, but some people have insanely high healthcare costs. And that insanely high cost could be YOU just by bad luck. So insurance takes that risk of getting super sick/injured and spreads it out among everyone through premiums. You pay a premium every month, but everything is covered including super expensive things. Most people pay a bit more than they get out of it, but they are still covered, and the handful of unlucky people aren’t totally screwed.
Insurance means the healthy pay for the sick, under the assumption that we want to care for the sick or that we may be sick ourselves one day. The more people on the plan, the more evenly spread out the risk is, so in general people pay less. The most people an American plan can cover is everyone in America, so a single health insurance for everyone is most efficient.
There is a reason the disabled and elderly are on government plans. Their healthcare is far more expensive, they are the sick the healthy are paying for. The government is playing on hard mode since basically everyone in government plans are more expensive cases, which is why they need tax dollars. The private sector, by contrast, is playing on easy mode by pushing all the elderly/poor/disabled people onto government plans. They have more healthy people to pay for fewer sick people, and thus can make a profit.
But that profit is itself an inefficiency, and since corporations hate public competition they’ve whittled away at what the public covers so some get no coverage at all. This is a problem, a problem that is only solved by completely removing the private sector from the equation and forming a healthcare monopsony: single payer. I would go even further to nationalize the whole industry from top to bottom to guarantee no private industry can weave its way back in and siphon money through profits
and this is what happens when you listen to right wing talk radio or youtube shows.
You hear buzzwords like free economy and personal responsibility being said. But theres never any context for what those things mean in society.
So you end up like the caller, who became flustered and could not explain why "personal responsibility" is necessary in the example of healthcare.
His right wing sources dont give a damn about what it actually means, so they never told him any actual details about it.
Fascinating
13:45 Not double, we pay three times on average. Check the prices of Prince Court Hospital, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
If it violated another amendment, then it would be unconstitutional.
Why should we in the U.S. care how good or bad the Canadian health care system is?
No member of congress that I can recall has suggested that we copy the Canadian system, but many have noted that all systems in first world countries outside of the U.S. is far less expensive than the current system.
Your point was irrelevant, whatever it was.
Then call the show, what are you waiting for, I don't get it?
It was not spam
You miss-read it. You do that often.
Your welcome.
When I think of a libertarian society, I think of Hunger Games. All the rich people will have iPhones, and I’ll be working in the fields trying to buy deer carcass from mountain people to feed my family for the winter lol. Like North Korea but our allegiance is to Elon musk and grimes 😀
"There has to be some personal responsibility", yes... that's what the TAXES ARE FOR!!! That's what is meant when people say "pay your fair share". Imagine if libertarians would think of their taxes as personal responsibility for living in society rather than theft.
"[medicare] costs of just already-made commitments will exceed the total US economy..."
It is not possible that any single industry to exceed the total economy unless absolutely everyone works in that one industry, which is also impossible.
Try thinking for yourself.
listening to these libertarians calling in is making me lose brain cells, i'm sure....seriously, my god.
These guys are so bold in their ignorance. They make me sick. They lack basic empathy and common sense.
This guy would rather an insurance drone decide which treatments he gets rather than a doctor.
These people are so dogmatically against any and all government that they would happily hand our society over to the sociopaths that run large corporations.
I also have pain in my ass on a regular basis, but I know exactly where that is coming from!
Singapore... aka the country whose government owns ~37% of market stocks as well as over 20% of the top twenty companies stocks... please champion Singapore, Libertarians, you only prove that public ownership of production is optimal.
Its a logical fallacy to think that because Group A provided you with a service, that if they stopped providing that service, nobody would provide it.
It's not spam... It's the truth.
I know I am way late but has this kid ever been to Singapore?!?!? I wouldn’t use them as a model of almost anything at all
Liberdy liberdy liberdy!!!
Why does the libertarian think people don't have an interest in being healthy aside from the cost of potential medical expenses?
0:20 captions: "a libertarian thermal Bonita"