Grönefeld Watches by the Horological Brothers
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2024
- Hand-made watches by the Grönefeld Brothers have features that watch collectors value and pursue. This video looks at their main watches and the features each has.
/ williebegoode - Jak na to + styl
Great video. Thanks for sharing our watches Bill. Best regards, Bart & Tim
Hey Bart & Tim, your watches are magnificent! Hope my video did them justice. Kindest regards, Bill
Watchmaking at the pinnacle
Thanks for posting. Watching video like this help me to know their watches much better.
The bespoke guilloche dials are made by Kari Voutilenen I met Tim and Bart at Cellini during the Watch Times show. Very.nice guys. They said every design element of the watch has a story. Like the bridges are shaped like little Dutch houses.
Richard, tell me more about Kari Voutilainen doing the dials. I know that Kari has a case-making company (www.voutilainen-cattin.ch) but I did not know he has a dial-making/design company. Yes, I'll bet that there's an interesting story behind each design. Did you get a Grönefeld watch at Cellini's? Cheers, Bill
@@watchartsci comblemine.ch/
Bill,
Since Voutilenen only makes about 50 watches a year he needs to offer dial production to other companies. The Grönefeld watches with his dial command an extra $15k in price. I opted for a blue guilloche Voutilenen watch instead. It has true purity of form. Kari personally makes the hands for every watch and does the final assembly and testing.
@@richardr2555 But the quality of the bespoke dials for Gronefeld are the same as KV. In my opinion the 1941 Remontoire definitely deserves a bespoke dial.
Leya Y Yes they are indeed the same quality but different designs than Kari’s own watches. Given the choice between Grönefeld and Voutilenen most customers go for the Voutilenen first. Then they get a Grönefeld.
Another great video Bill. Very interesting brand with some good looking, hand made (and expensive) watches.
Hi Bruce, I wonder how close Rolf Lang would be to those? Take care, Bill
Among my favorite, Bill. Great video. Almost ordered one a couple of times. A Gronefeld Horo-bros is top of the list👍
Hey Matt, love the brand too, especially ... well all of them! Cheers, Bill
Great video Bill. Grönefeld is a brand that deserves all the attention it has been getting lately.
NSsomething, great watchmakers, but even their most meager offerings are almost $30,000. You never know, though... Cheers, Bill
Good morning Mr. Sanders, the brand you presented today was more like an art piece, especially the last two, totally out of my price range :). Thanks for your wrist watch checks with no glare (great job on that). Beautiful watch love that blue band!
That's well-described, Marc; horological art! I guess my Ceres 1974 doesn't like to show off as much as my Moser. Cheers, Bill
You’ve got yourself another beautiful watch to your wrist👌. You never cease to amaze us!🤩.
All the best,
John
Hey Johnny, thanks man! My Christiaan van der Klaauw Ceres 1974 is my only moon phase watch and only Dutch watch, and it seemed appropriate for a Dutch watchmaker! I like them both! Cheers, Bill
Bill the bespoke dials are Kari Voutilainen dials (I posted this in all the fb groups) from when I bought my Remointoire and spoke to the Bros: Bart/Tim: so Kari decided he wanted one snd approached them and told them but that he wanted to design his own dial for it Thus the partnership. BTW I found out my exact one was the dial Kari designed for himself!! ;-) .
Hey Richard, thanks! It's always great to hear from actual experience ... and given your watch collection ... I think you've got that! Cheers Bill
Gronefeld remontoire d'egalite is just a work of art. Most of the constant force is subtle and only with accuracy, its success is measured. Not this one. It is just loud and clear about what it does and does so very spectacularly. I just love the watch.
Nowshed, I'm the same. Other than 50,000 reasons I can't have one... Cheers, Bill
They are one of my favorite independent watch makers. Their watches all have interesting mechanisms(except the simple automatic 1941 Principia) and beautiful finishing. Definitely high horology I would say.
Hey Leya, they define Exceptional Horology. To me, the most interesting watch is the Principia-pure time-keeping. Cheers, bill
I would be interested in their tourbillon parallax model with hammered dial. Strikingly beautiful.
@@richardr2555 No doubt, just with a hefty price tag. I won't have that budget in the near future, but I can imagine many choices of "dream watches" in that price range.
My favourite style of movement finishing. You can keep your perlage and Geneva waves. I'd only seen the time only watches before. Thanks, Bill
Yes the styling is distinctive and attractive, and they choose stainless steel as the material, which is very rare and harder to finish.
Hey Jeremy, love those dial options ... and I think if you wanted something a little different, you could get those too! Cheers, Bill
excellent review like always, here is my question , if you see a more hand made like habring vs a good in house like VMF 5100 , with close prices , which one you pick?
It would depend on what the VMF 5100 is in and which Habring2 it was. Love the Doppel! Cheers, bill
Excellent question! I think it all depends on whether you appreciate honest craftmanship or are more tempted by artistry, the visual pleasure.
@@cedarcanoe Thanks Cedar, I was thinking the Harbring is hand made and the VMF is looking nicer specially with small router, but tough choice
I was looking between Habring time only and Hermes slim' hermes
Fascinating watches truly stunning Independent .
I agree, Mark. Now about that lottery win....Cheers, bill
Just popped over to the Gronefeld site 😍👍👏. So... A Principia with a lacquer dial or an L&H Georg? ⚖️❔🤔
Sheeeze! Jeremy, why not just ask which of your children would you pull out of a burning house first? But in this case, it would be the Georg...that view of the movement through the back is unmatched. Cheers, bill
@@watchartsci I think you're right. The Georg's movement is like nothing else, whereas the Principia movement is "just" the best finished (to my tastes) conventionally laid out movement. I need to buy a lottery ticket.
Me too!
Is it fair to say Gronfeld to Patek is like a Pagani to Ferrari? It seems to me that these micro brand high end luxury brands are for those who feel “the holy grail” brands ( Patek, Audemars, Vacheron ) are just too commonplace
Not anymore Newton. Grönefeld is hand-made by two talented watchmakers; Patek started stuffing silicon hairsprings in their watches in 2009 and crank out 50,000 watches a year. More like Rolls-Royce Wraith to Mercedes Benz 240D.... Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci Ouch!! that comparison would really hurt Patek fans. However, I do agree that Gronefeld is in an altogether different league compared to Patek in terms of " entirely hand made". What about comparisons between Gronefeld vs De Bethune?
Deccenium Tourbillon is my Grail, as is the Remontire fishscale guilloche, but Tourbillon first before all else...
I don't blame you Tony ... I like their Remontoir 1941 ... in any configuration! Cheers, Bill
@@watchartsci Was enlightened by a friend in Singapore only today. My research points me to your channel. :)
Very nice video as always mr Sanders, I am a huge fan of the Grönefeld brothers and also of Christian van der Klaauw. Has nothing to do with the fact I'm Dutch ;-)
Cheers from Rotterdam, Tim
Spent a wonderful summer at the Law School at the University of Leiden, TE, studying European criminal justice and criminology...at the time, you guys just didn't have enough crime! The Netherlands is civilized, which is nice! Cheers, Bill
@@watchartsci glad you've enjoyed your time in Holland, Leiden is a wonderful city, but next time make sure to visit Rotterdam ;-) coffee is on me. Cheers Tim
@@tengelen5955 For some Dutch coffee, definitely! Cheers, Bill
Very nice looking watches, Bill!
Hey Anastase, they are real beauties. They ought to make an "Anastase & Bill" version that we can afford! Cheers, Bill
Hi Bill , great video. how would you compare Groenfeld to Voutilainen and Fpj ?
Hi Rob, all are on the same ethereal level. All amazing in their own way and talent that you only see in a few watchmakers. Cheers, bill
Not much into this brand. But thanks for educating me. Nice video mate.
Hi Tim, unfortunately for me, I like them very much! And I cannot afford them very much! Cheers, Bill
good work, Mr Bill
Hey Saman, thanks man! Cheers, Bill
Absolutely gorgeous watches bill I’d not heard of this brand until recently but they are absolutely beautiful mate ,,I suppose their tourbillon movement is always gonna cost more than a house lol but so does any other manufacturer who makes tourbillon movements you can always add tens of thousands just for this one complication ..or movement ...but they would definitely grace any Collection ps I hope you get one bill you only live once mate ...😊
Well Colin, they only made 188 of the one I wanted...the 1941 Remontoir. Maybe one will come my way. Take care and be safe, Bill 😷
Scared to watch this video - can’t afford a new watch obsession
Yes Marcus, I should have aired it on Halloween! Take care, Bill
Oldenzaal forever!
Whoaa, Oldenzaal is all the way on the other side of The Netherlands from where I was for a bucolic summer at the University of Leiden... I did visit nearby Munster, though! Cheers, Bill
Beautiful watches but I have an unrelated question, you're always noticably distracted and look to your right?
No JJ ... I'm trying to draw attention to the image on my right. Take care, Bill
Without a doubt very high level of finishing but visually they don’t really speak to me. Except for the one with the large jumping second
Hey Erik, the 1 Hz Jumping Second is a favorite of mine too. They speak to be, but not my bank account. Cheers, Bill
WatchArtSci but enjoying it visualilly is free!
The colors of the enameled face of the dial are amazing, and other color choices are exquisite😍.
There should be a watchmaker basic course in existence (just to understand to them basic knowledge )as to vulgarise concepts for the ordinary consumer. Most of the time they use term which are Chinese to us.😕
Hi Johnny, yes I wish I had spent time at the Grönefeld booth at the WatchTime show last year-I hope they are back this next year! I saw some at Cellini's on Park Ave, but only a whirlwind pass at the show! Next time! Cheers, Bill
The 1969 Deltaworks is way overpriced. It is only a stainless steel case with a rubber strap watch. No matter how good the movement and finishing are, it's not worth €49,800. I used to love their watches. When I saw how unreasonable the asking price is, the brand has become a turn off.
Eugene, it's the craftsmanship for hand-made individual watches. A Grönefeld is like an original piece of art you'd pay a lot for. Take care, Bill
@@watchartsci Yes, the craftsmanship is very good but it's still not worth €49,800. Too greedy. What if they asked for €498,000? Can you still say it is very good craftsmanship? €49,800 is not a fair or reasonable price. Just because a merchant asks for a certain price, it doesn't mean it's a reasonable price. For €49,800, you can get a gold PP 5396 or 5205. PP craftsmanship is very good too plus at least you get a gold case. I think PP spends more money in marketing. So why is Gronefeld asking for that amount of money for such a watch? I wouldn't buy it for sure because it's definitely not worth that price.
@@watchartsci Hi Bill, I don't mean to be long-winded. Another example to show how overpriced the 1969 Deltaworks is when you compare it with the Lang & Heyne Frederick III. This Lang & Heyne watch is beautiful and its craftsmanship is as good as the 1969 if not better. On top the case is gold whereas 1969 is stainless steel. The Frederick III's price is less than 1969. The Frederick III has a very reasonable and fair price. Merchants need to be fair and have a conscience. The 1969 doesn't worth 49,800 Euros at all. They are simply too greedy. We will not and should not pay what they asked for. In their website, they say their timepieces are made in very small quantities. Well, I remember in one of your videos, you said anyone can make a limited edition. They just change something very little and make another limited edition. Why? To hype it up and ask for more money. I know the 1969 is not a limited edition but they say they make very small quantities. Its website also says, "building your watch can take several months to several years." So after paying a 30% non-refundable down payment, when are you going to get your watch? Have a good day, Eugene
@@eugenejohnson7755 I think the long-winded train has left the station already, Eugene...😉 However, we're here to discuss watches, and your comments are worth noting. The Grönefeld brothers make unique and masterfully crafted watches and people are on waiting lists for the quality they offer. There's far more to watchmaking on that level than either of us knows or appreciates. Take care Bill