@@600pp - There are a lot of smartypants commenters on this video pontificating how AI will never be able to produce good music. I encourage them to follow your link. Besides, it is so childishly naive to assume that what AI can do in 30 years will be no better than what it can do now ... as if what is does now is no better than what it did 30 years ago. I am constantly flabbergasted by the hubris of humans.
Imagine the AI just comes up on the spot 24/7 the sound that matches what you would like. The whole idea of a single individual unit of song doesn’t matter anymore, instruments don’t matter anymore. Just basically audible patterns that matches your emotional needs of the moment or steer your emotions toward a specific direction.
There are live streams on CZcams with AI-produced music, like czcams.com/video/MwtVkPKx3RA/video.html (which is surprisingly listenable, if you like Death Metal). I guess if you just turned the "seed" for the music into something related to your emotional state, you'd have just what you ask for.
I sometimes am aware of my dreams having a musical “backing track”. It’s all spontaneous and unusual, and perfectly fitting. It might be cool to have that while awake too. I actually know someone who has that for real. I think she said sometimes it’s not desirable, but it doesn’t “turn off”. I can also imagine future cultures who might surrender to total AI direction of creativity… like a sort of unavoidable destiny for us - scary to me.
In future there can be 2 directions of music : 1 - AI generated disposable music which anyone will be able to use it in content creation without worrying about copyrights and credits. 2 - Human composed music, which will have a separate fanbase and will be like handcrafted goods which are available today. P.S. I love your music and you will be in the 2nd category for us always!
I think there will be an app, which is going to generate music in real time, depending on your mood, and genre tastes. You want sad music? There you go, endless time of sad music of that genre you love, generated in that same moment, specifically for you.
As for case 1, I'm not so sure that AI-generated music will not be owned and under copyright by anyone. A large company like Micro$oft or IBM with lots of money for lawyers could well argue that anything created by their music AIs, therefore, belongs to them. It could be a significant source of income. Please note that I do not necessarily believe that this should happen, only that it could.
The way you referenced the creative "Seed" I thought you were going to say how all creative AI begin with similar "seed" value, which is often random noise. Especially GANs - the generator always starts with random seed that is later transformed into an image (or whatever else they are trying to generate) to fool the discriminator. When I was studying AI, this made me understand how artists have a creative nudge, something random in the everyday noise that sparks something creative. Worth thinking about.
I'm a little iffy on the idea of soul - mostly because I'm not a psychologist. I would think there's a source, and a personal 'take' (like style)... these seem like things we could replicate through AI.
i remember one time a friend of mine, who was a science buff and atheist, said something that creeped me out immediately, he said something like "maybe there will be a time when humans wont have to create art and computers can do it for us". the fleshy organic spirit of creativity in me repulsed in horror at the very thought of the idea that humans "HAVE to make art" like its some chore instead of a beautiful process that adds color to life, and the idea that lifeless cold calculated machines would produce all of our media in the future, thats a hellish nightmare to me, but my friend brought this up like it was some cool thing to look forward to
@Nine Waves Im banking on there being pockets of civilization that remain primitive and manage to hide or protect itself from the hell that will be a fully computerized society. if not, then theres always my handy dandy deliberate heroin OD super powers. cant punish me with the future if im dead, as if the present day isnt punishment enough, apparently us humans want to make it even worse for ourselves for some reason, guess we watched the jetsons too much as a kid. seriously though, if i could kms right now with the gaurantee that id respwan in an earlier time, like the 50s maybe, i would do it immediately just to get away from present society, and especially tomorrows society, which will be hell, based on the fact that each year gets worse and worse, the poeple get dumber, the machines get smarter, were going to end up worshiping a microsoft super computer or some crap, all the machine will have to do is put the following message on a screen "Covid 19 can be stopped if humans just worship AI and do everything to let us control your lives" and humans will jump in line to do this because theyre programmed easier than a computer.
AI was created a long long time ago and obviously not by humans. It is now or in the last few decades getting introduced to humans. Enki Technology is the actual term not AI technology. Enki is AI.
Nice disscusion right here. What makes us different from machines and animals is abstract thinking and AI will only combine human made data. I hope that it's gonna help us instead of wipping out musicians from the bussines. Otherwise we will do that just for fun
I see creativity as connecting the dots that was always there but not easy to detect. Thus, an A.I. with an extensive breath of knowledge is able to find these connections through sheer brute force alone thus being far more "creative".
I reckon creativity is either going to stagnate once AI takes over or it will become a catalyst for further human creativity like most modern tech advances. I hope its the latter.
AI will never take over. We are so far from AI being sentient, that you might as well talk about the internet with someone from the dark ages. Apparently, consciousness is a little more difficult than once thought.
@@freshtendrills5969 yes we are far , but we are growing exponentially fast! So it might not be in 10 year or 50 years or in a 100 years But somewhere in the future we will make an AI that can take over!
Sometimes while listening to white noise I hear some really nice melodies in my head. Sadly I don't know how to recreate them on a software the way I hear them :(
@@daveraschke I really wonder whether that would be the case. What we call human creativity will remain to exist as long as the are humans. Whether or not we’ll remain to appreciate human creativity is an open question, although I think we will even if we stop to do so for a while, since what is fashionable is cyclical.
@@dahleno2014 yep..this is pretty sad if you think about it. If the same result is obtained from everyone receiving the same input, it means that everything is pre-determined.
I dont think ppl wanna automate it "out". music composers and producers want to be creatively efficient by getting to the vibe or musical idea they're imagining using the infinite options created by AI. Similar concept to CAD CAM 3D printing or milling. sure some people find satisfaction is actually carving or manufacturing their furniture designs by hand, but some people just like to explore and churn out more creative designs or prototypes by automating machines to manufacture it quickly. it allows for more time to explore the increasing range of options which before wasn't possible if you needed to spend so much of the time in order to create or manufacture the idea into real life.
ColdFusion: "Is it even possible for a machine to produce original music?" Me, who is well acquainted with the term "Algorithmic Composition": "Well I guess SOMEONE has never played Warioware DIY."
Inspiration = seed Thought process = algorithm (or in this case, the neural connection) That's my understanding. I know it's not creativity based on our standard understanding of the said word, but our understanding is shaped by what we have as example. When AI managed to produce more and more sample of their creativity, I think our perception of the word will change, too. AI will get there, it is no longer a question of if, but when.
now i know you create your own backing music i love the content even more im guessing a lot of that demo track you just did is how a lot of your audio is done in these videos ExCELLENT WORK
AI making music like good ones will be really difficult, because music is a feel and feeling of the writer which is impossible to implement as of now. Tbh electronic music and pop can be done fairly easily I guess, as its mostly sampling and quantized beats. Things like classical rock, old school rap and old pop will be really difficult to do properly.
It's a very common misconception that the musician has to "feel" the feelings from the song. That's not AT ALL the case. I've been playing Guitar for 15+ years and create music myself. Let me tell you: After a certain point you learn how literally create emotion in people that they haven't had. And it's all rooted in music theory. You can "force" people to feel emotion by sitting down without any emotion, crate something ane people will feel those feels. It's literally that easy. No emotion from the composer needed. Short and simple demosntration: "How to Imitate a Whole Lot of Hollywood Film Music In Four Easy Steps" by Scott Murphy
This reminds me of the SouthPark where Germany is accused of being the worlds least funny people, so they build a joke-telling robot to prove them wrong. czcams.com/video/wVHQIHDSkZI/video.html
There was this anime I watched some time ago. Vivy's Fluorite Song. I think it adds a new aspect to the whole creativity argument - the _factor of desire_ or _inspiration_ . When an AI creates something not because it is said to, but when it wants to out of its own free will. I think that meshes up quite well with what Dagogo said about inspirational music near the end of the video.
I feel like mentioning that's precisely how humans learn music; from listening to countless songs and then meshing things we learn from them into our own music. Everything derives from musicians before us. Though at some point it had to begin...
You know entertainment companies are already looking at this. Add information from hit songs like BPM, key, genre, lyric subject, melody (if any) range and placement, danceability and how much teenage girls like it and they will have a cheap, never-ending source of "new" product that won't need creative minds at all. Then add sexy AI bots to perform the music and you won't need drug addled musicians or expensive, troublesome divas at either. Modernization has become de-humanization.
Except since the AI source code would be available to everyone, anyone with minimal skill would be able to generate the music and edit it to suit their end goal.
@@Constantin_91 Available to everyone, great. Background loops for You Tube videos OK, good but every tone-deaf musician wannabe with a computer will be able subject the internet with artless, soul killing robot music. Computers and the internet becoming more involved in music coincides with music quality going downhill over the last 20 years is no surprise. Ok, rant over.
I think the biggest difference is that an artist "knows" when it is right. He/she tries/imagens different variations and improves the art to make it better. AI chances things and gives variations, but the only way for it to tell if something is good is to how similar it is to other stuff in it's database. It has no idea when it makes something horrible or great.
But then you come across the problem posed by thought experiments like the Turing Test and the Chinese Room. Do we really know that the AI doesn't know? What is it like to know? Can we really prove that an artist knows and not just simulating that they know?
Nowadays the best chess ai actually use a form of intuition to improve their ability to play chess. If ai could develop an intuition for good music, that would be great.
@@macroxela Something like a turning test for different kinds of artistic processes would be interesting. Though for now I am convinced the AI will fail.
@@MarijnvdSterre Such as a Engineer who created the complicated instruments like drums, guitar for Artist to work on. You are doubting the same Engineer for creating AI. You should only embrace it, you have no right to criticize Engineering Artists.
Your Music Creation process is similar to mine. I play with one riff and from that I can hear each subsequent sound and progression in my head. The hardest part is finding those sounds and making them match what's in my head.
I recently attended a concert, which gave me some clarity on this subject. The reason music is interesting is that there is a human connection. I went to the concert to marvel at the skill of the musicians and to connect with the musicians and other fans. The cool thing about music is being in sync with other people at a primal level. The knowledge that the music and lyrics came from a human mind and is conveying some sort of message is critical to my enjoyment. I have no doubt that AI could produce the music the bands were playing, but it would be meaningless
@Della Serenity I don't really care about the creative process used, just that an immaterial consciousness imbued ot with meaning instead of it just being random and meaningless
@@RealityBoat I think the distinction lies within the process by which that new piece of music came into existence. Yes, a new piece of music has come into existence. But it has been generated by an AI. I'm suggesting that generation of new art forms does not necessarily imply that there was creativity involved. Additionally, although a new piece of music has been created, that doesn't mean that an AI has created it. I'm implying that AI, in its current form, does not have the capacity for creativity, although they do have the capacity to generate things, that we may refer to colloquially as creations. Attributing the quality of creativity to an AI at this stage doesn't seem reasonable, but I guess that all depends on your definition of what creativity is, what a creation is, and what it means to create something; as well as your beliefs of how AI generates these "creations". It's largely a philosophical debate, but this is my opinion.
@@DJReachOfficial if you really break it down there is no truely original art. New art or music in this case is a remix of things we already know and experience which is almost an identical process the ai uses. Nonetheless it is original
Being a Web Developer I am always afraid of AI taking over my job in coming years but seeing others who share the same fear is what keeps me motivated 😂
@@scarm_rune If everything is done by AI then what am I supposed to do with the 80 years of my life? Ai is not replacing the Toilet Cleaners who hate their Job, AI is replacing the fun in peoples lives, Artists,Writers, Musicians, Programmers and many more. For those people it's not just a job, it's a lifestyle, a challenge and a passion, people live for those things alone. The only reason these things are being developed is to reduce the costs and maximise income for big companies so that they don't have to hire artists and programmers. They drastically reduce costs while maximizing productivity, gaining more wealth and power.
Idk I was actually super impressed by both the "avocado chair" and "blue pumpkin mural" results. Both had examples in there that looked "inspired". Like some of the chairs looked legitimately inspired by some very specific furniture designs, and one of the murals looked like it was done in a more abstract graffiti style.
I, Robot: “You are a machine. An imitation of life. Can a robot write a symphony? Can a robot take a canvas and turn into a beautiful masterpiece”? 2021: Actually………….
I honestly think AI should be used to assist humans and make their lives easy. But not entirely replace them. Problems that exist on a massive scale can benefit from AI/ML too. However, I think that art and music should be left alone.
Every one of our compositions has elements of human-created sound, are edited by human, and are designed to be listened to by humans. AI is just another tool. This is a great tool for creatives.
It's gonna change the very nature of entertainment. Like it or not. I don't like those big changes coming but all we can do is brace and try to find any creative avenues left. I feel like we will be like art directors. Less painting, more choosing. People with great taste will have advantage over other not so sophisticated artists.
An artist's soul is discovered with practice, time, experience etc. even if it already exists. The same can be true for AI as it gets more refined over time. We might end up seeing a Zima Blue in our lifetime after all.
Apparently I am doing my Final Year Engineering on this topic. We are going to generate original Melodies based on a Classical songs MIDI dataset and export it to MIDI format, so that we musicians can use them in their music softwares to make music (as Coldfusion showed). It's very similar to Google's Magenta. This really helps when there is an artist block or you get stuck somewhere. Using this you can generate a random idea and start working from there.
Another way to think of MIDI, at least in the context of this video, is, its like sheet music for a computer, a talented multi instrumentalist that can read sheet music can play the same written music on different instruments, because when it comes down to it, the notes are the same between instruments, its just how those notes sound that changes and its the same with MIDI files and computers, the MIDI file is basically just the sheet music, it tells the computer what notes to play, when to play them and how to play them its just displayed in a different way to sheet music.
"there's nothing new under the sun" "good artists borrow, great artists steal" The biggest hurdle to overcome in "validating" AI generated work is simply sentience. And perhaps it would be better not to.
The musician Benn Jordan (aka the artist behind The Flashbulb) has an excellent YT channel that showcases some AI made music concepts and discusses the tech behind it. The channel is just called Benn Jordan for anyone interested in that kind of thing!
Could you be able to program the AI to start creativity after a certain “inspiring moment”? Like programming it to work only when it hears, smells, or sees something specific
@@chunkyMunky329 Well, certain machine learning algorithms allow for new data to be added, so as long as you can add these sounds, smells, etc... as data, the AI can retrained itself to produce new stuff beyond its initial 'knowledge base'. Alternatively, you use these sensory data not as new data, but as modifiers for the learning process instead.
@@linhdanghoang2504 That doesn't make any sense. You can't "train" a neural network to create something that you don't even have any idea what the result should be. Thats called randomness and is not learning. The whole point of training a neural network is that you're giving the machine some kind of guidance on what output it should create based on that input. For example, you can give it a painting of a sad face and then show it an example of a happy face. Then the machine can learn how to perform that transformation to turn pictures of sad faces into happy faces. I work with neural networks and you have to have a plan on how you're going to get it to understand what a useful output is otherwise it will create useless garbage. There is no such thing as an AI training itself, unless you're talking about "unsupervised training" which is a different kind of situation where the AI simply finds patterns in your data and shows you where the patterns are. Nobody has created an unsupervised AI that can teach itself to do anything more complex than finding numerical patterns in data.
I play instruments with improvisation, Ableton is similar, how you turn on a loop and include them when you feel inspired. I think when I improvise sometimes I find the mistakes I have made serendipitous in how the finished product is. Sometimes the mistakes are very unique, or even birds chirping outside my house add a nice effect.
The masters would know how to manipulate ai tools to create music. I think maybe ai is just the next stage in art production. And perhaps music software plugins would be made to use ai but not for ai to use the musicians when creating music.
I think AI music is pretty much like a parakeet 🦜learning to mimic voices. It could only modify existing thing it will never create, but it will blend awesome stuff
The major flaw with current AI methods is that AI will never be able to imagine things that have never existed before, in the sense that these systems only learn to approximate and interpolate the dataset they’re trained on as accurately as possible. If something doesn’t exist in the dataset, the probability of such a thing being generated by the system is 0, simply by the way the system is trained.
everything you think you came up with from scratch are the result of all previous musical knowledge and influences which is exactly the same for AI. The big difference is that an AI activly remembers songs and has heard more music then you can listen to if you spent your entire life on it. It's in it infancy. Wait until it becomes adult
"The major flaw with _current_ AI methods is that AI will _never_ ..." The major flaw with cavemen is that they will never create a rocket to the moon. Right. Because rockets were never in the dataset. Got it! Thanks for the brilliance, Grop.
I fully agree, but it's kind of how humans work also (Obviously in a VERY watered down version lol), but as babies all we learn from is the world around us for the most part. When we come up with 'new' concepts, in reality, at least for the most part, it's just an amalgamation of things we've heard before. With that being said, I'm just trying to play the devils advocate here, and I do believe there is something fundamentally different (Call it the soul, or consciousness, ect) between us and computers but I figured I'd share my thoughts :) Cheers!
@@Queleb1 - Once we were cousins of the Great Apes. But something happened and now we compose symphonies. To assume that AI will never cross that divide is an unsupportable hypothesis. We don't know what changed between us and the apes. And so we can't know if something similar will happen with AI. But it is typical of humans to assume we're unique when, in fact, we don't really understand what "it" is. Many people believe God did it. That's your first clue that we're looking in all the wrong places and making all the wrong assumptions.
I think a very interesting way to use AI generated music is as inspiration for your own music composition. The unpredictability can make some really interesting rifts that you won’t think up yourself.
An interesting experiment would be for a human and and AI to compose the entire musical score to a full-length feature film. I think that would highlight the shortcomings of AI "creativity".
I think it would be interesting to consider and have a discussion on how the following principles can be combined where a conversation on creativity is concerned. 1) Godel's incompleteness theorem, 2) Heisenberg's uncertainty principle, and 3) The second law of thermodynamics. Godel's incompleteness theorem is a mathematical principle that shows that any logical system is incomplete, meaning that there will always be true statements that cannot be proven within that system. In the creative process, this principle can be used to inspire artists, writers, and other creatives to embrace the idea that there are always new ideas to be explored and discovered. It can also encourage them to take risks and to be open to unconventional or unexpected solutions. Heisenberg's uncertainty principle is a fundamental principle in quantum mechanics that states that the more precisely the position of a particle is known, the less precisely its momentum can be known, and vice versa. In the creative process, this principle can be used to encourage experimentation and exploration, and to embrace the unpredictable and unknown. It can also inspire creatives to embrace the idea that there are many different perspectives and ways of looking at a problem or challenge. Finally, The second law of thermodynamics states that the entropy (or disorder) of a closed system tends to increase over time. In the creative process, this principle can be used to encourage creatives to embrace imperfection and change. It can also inspire them to look for new and innovative ways to create order out of chaos, and to find beauty in the unexpected and unconventional. Food for thought?
objective observation: creativity seems to borrow from the phenomena of sets, where sets are ideas that delineate as they overlap on to other premises. in the range in which the overlap occurs, it can be said the brain experiences an interpretation of the objective stimuli, as the brain makes connections to templates of experience unique to its personal compilation of experiences.
The music and face creation are truly amazing. But the part where you talk about entering text and getting images doesn't seem like creation but more like a google images request where the text is used for a search and results are scanned for objects and colors detection and then either recolored, croped or slightly modified as results. What do you think @coldfusion ? Anyway, love your channel, your work is awesome :-D
Man! I always find it interesting seeing how other producers compose their tracks. I am not as free flowing as you. I choose a key, get a full chord progression mapped in that key THEN build off of that into the track layer by layer starting with the bass. I always find it interesting how other producers go about their production and what they do to get into a flow state. Thanks for covering AI music. I've always found it interesting!
Imagination is more than just the ability to create pictures in your mind. AI currently isn't imagining new sounds, it's just "combining combinations" from data examples that it is using to sequence a different combination. Also AI is unaware if it is has combined a combination that is truely great sounding or whether during the combination it's starting to sound bad. Imagination has the ability to think of something truely unique, that hasn't come from a combination of other existing possibilities. It can be possible to think of a new thought/idea that has never been thought of before in human history. "AI is just recycling different combinations"
For computers sound and images are just data. How do you know it can't imagine sound? If AI can create images, it can create sound. If you don't know have the skills of AI, you cannot criticize it. Same as I can't judge if the musical notes and tunes are correct it not. If you ask the Regional music, if Kpop and electronic music is good they would say it is trash. Thus, the combination of music is subjective. Humans itself are a mimicking creature. You can't state AI is just recycling different combinations, if it can make images from just avocado chair.
@@shrin210 Hi there, this isn't a criticism of AI, I like AI... it will be one of the most important developments in Human evolution. AI doesn't develop a picture from its imagination, it comes from the data set it has access too and the way the code has been written to reassemble an image from the data set. Now you can say it's created a new image!... but it hasn't come from AI imagination. I would suggest do your research into how AI algorithms and parameters work, they are amazing and have self improving structures. To your point about Music, let's keep the subjective nature of music out of this discussion as I'm not referring to whether or not the AI music is good or not subjectively, what I am pointing out is when the AI's musical sequence deviates to point where the Human experience would say that's not music any more, its just a rambling random combination of notes. Humans are not just mimicking creatures, we can use our imagination, without a data set, to create a truly unique thought. This has happened time and time again throughout history and lead to some of the greatest new directions in human thought and science. As famously quote by Albert Einstein "Imagination is more important than knowledge"
less skill gap required means the pool of imagination being poured into arts becomes larger. think CZcams, amateur / consumer camera gear, all in one photo / video editing programs that allowed social media and grassroots level entertainment like this channel. it allows more imagination to enter the world because people dont have to spend so much time of their life learning and developing the skill in order to express their imaginations.
I'd like to argue that this yearning for some level of definite skill is to be exhibited by an artist is more a manifestation a lack of confidence and insecurity regarding ones own taste and skills of assesment and valuation. See, kinda proof that fretting for the works of this artist who has established his/hers competence will not result in others laughing at me for digging this, kinda thing.,
@@TK-gd9td Is it really your imagination if a AI feeds you a song? I'm just saying there is alot of sounds that you can imagine but if you dont know music fundamentals you wont be able to put it to paper. Music has already become to impersonal because of sampling, theres is alot of times a new chord or progression would make a song better but is not implemented because the artist doesn't know how articulate it.
Couple of things: 1) as a fellow (hobbyist) producer it’s really cool to share an insight into our workflow and processes to so many people who otherwise would never look into what it takes to throw something together 2) in time with the right programming and algorithmic formulae AI will arguably be able to pump out top 40s at a much faster rate than the big label writing teams imo. Add the limitations of song structure and the concept of repetition for auditory value and I reckon it’ll happen soon. We ultimately all draw inspiration from our subconscious - computers will get it from RAM :p
As an improvising instrumentalist I find the idea of generated harmonies to use to improvise over fascinating. Sounds like a great interesting way to force improvising into new areas and a way for human creativity to mesh with cold, hard generative technology. Super interesting to me.
I remember similar debates occuring during era when chess was not yet dominated by AI. Something along the line: "Machines can never defeat best human because they lack creativity, inspiration..." Turns out you don't need those. For chess you can brute-force the solution by exhaustively searching the entire game tree. Since number of nodes increases exponentialy - a completely exhaustive search is not possible for most of the chess positions. However what is possible, is you create heuristics when by some "chess knowledge" you select promising moves to explore and calculate only to certain depth at which another chess knowledge is applied to evaluate the resulting position. You have now transformed the original problem of playing chess to performing elementary calculations really fast. I suspect something similar should be possible for music as well. After all there is only finite number of sound tracks of certain length (when represented digitally). So it's not like you need to "invent" the sound track, rather you need to navigate the almost endless space of possible tracks. Analogous to chess you would need some function that can evaluate "quality" or "likability" of the track created - e.g. by modeling response of "average" human brain to the track. If we had high quality model of how given track is "likable" to average human brain, then theoretically you could just search the entire space of all tracks of given length exhaustively, have them scored and select only those that scored the highest. For practical cases however better approach should be to again invent some sort of heuristics - i.e. have population of AI composers and use evolution algorithms to select those that score the highest etc. Or some other form of how the AI composers can teach them selfs how to improve in creating music (similarly as alpha zero self taught playing board games) Given all this, act of creating music is then also - similarly to chess - tranformed to performing elementary calculations really fast. The really tricky part is of course how to model realistic response of "average" human brain. In future we could theoretically learn to simulate all neurons in human brain so sort of "simulating" functionally equivalent response to one performed by human (i.e. numerical score given by average human and numerical socre obtained by simulating the average human brain could be very close). But even if this would turn out to be possible, the computation cost would be quite prohibitive for any forseable future. Therefore much simpler approach should be to feed AI with database of 10s of milions of songs and their ratings given by users. This way it should be possible to train model for scoring songs that is computationally manageable / much more practical. In the debate of computation complexity of P vs. NP problems it is expected that NP problems are "more difficult" Althought not yet proven either way - one of the compelling reasons for thinking so tends to be the fact, that it's much easier to appreciate i.e. Bach's music than it's to compose music of comparable quality to Bach. Similarly I would expect it's much easier to first teach AI how to "appreciate" the music (how to score it) and then use it to seach and navigate through the vast space of possible tracks than it's to learn AI how to compose music straight away (especially "original" music like invent new style of music - while first approach could work also for this new "original" type of music) Of course this is just a general idea - still lots of details to fill (i.e the track evaluation function could also evelove based on tracks it listened to etc.), but I'll stop here due to already substantial length of the text.
The genre of music I like is called "distorted 808 kicks" I need a high amount of gain on the electronic bass to create a tone that's an alternative to rock
I don't think AIs can be "creative" in the traditional sense since all AIs do is process many data points to randomly generate new ones that follow particular pattern(s) Basically, all an AI knows is to deal with values between 0 and 1, and nothing more; it's the guidance by humans that make an AI turn these values into something that humans are familiar with
You mentioned in your video, you were able to extract the vocals from another song using a website. Which one is it ? Asking as a fellow (beginning) producer :3.
Dude, make an 8 hour video and I'll watch it all. Your voice and background musing is so damn good, so relaxing. I won't even care what the video would be about.
Creativity of the collage (a piece of art made by sticking various different materials such as photographs and pieces of paper or fabric on to a backing) has been explored by artists since 1910. A little later they experimented with realism as in sur-realism. Many experiments were "auto creative" wich means that random fragments were applied to works of art. Selection was and still is an interaction of the human being. In music the modern approach was much more formal, initially around the skill of the player (Satie, Stravinsky) but after WWII increasingly more formal, mathematical, mechanical, serial and a-tonal. In post-modern times artists mostly shop & select in the modern history, largely creating atmospheric muzak or kitch-imagery, sometimes profound works of art. The examples from AI creations are just "collages" from predictions, as in corrective or additional text in messaging apps. Creativity and intelligence are concepts that have not yet yielded a well-defined knowledge of them. Machine learning is not intelligence and although it "creates", it's not a creative act in itself. It predicts outcomes from previously created art and photography. The process of creating AI machine learning software and selecting from the outcomes, is creative of course.
Inspiration is pretty straight forward.. You combine ideas in your head using your creativity, and if you like the outcome of one of those ideas you are inspired... AI can easily accomplish this, just giving it samples of what it "likes" and it can feel inspired when it creates a creative idea that it also likes.
Exactly, all “creative” endeavors are merely a mismatch of prior experiences (inputs) that you find connections between and create amalgam of these ideas (output) and expand it into a physical medium. All “creativeness is merely your brain processing and recontextualizing previous information that you have perceived.
The "missing inspiration and soul" link is an illusion, Dagogo, because the AI was created by humans. The AI created images and music is powered and born by these people's souls and inspiration. There is no missing link.
Our definition of good music (in most cultures) is highly standardized in many ways. Once they limit the AI to following those standards, it will be able to more effectively channel the creativity it has learned.
13:35 that is a HUUUUUGE leap of assumption... An ai algorithm that isnt sentient, does not create "images in your mind", it has no mind. It has data, not images. You're also overly simplifying what imagination is. The oxford dictionary isnt the end-all definition of human concepts that have existed for millenia.
If you donot know don't comment. Alpha Zero is AI which did not even have data and only knew rules of game of chess. No data was given. Only experience of playing chess with itself for millions times, it is great player. But Humans are copying creatures, "copying" which translates to learn from others and compete on it and telling AI is copying what a hypocrisy.
If you think about it, the "seed" of any random generator, is just like our inspiration for thought, or any kind of creation. So google/fb already have a profile for everyone, and can use it for AI training with creator's published work. After they successfully do that, they can use it to generate your unique music, with your profile, recent life change, current sensor data
Music is an expression of the heart so it would be hard for something with no heart (emotion) to construct something meaningful. There’s a difference between noise and music. This is closer to noise imo.
bet you'd not even be able to distinguish music made by an artist and AI given the AI is coded well. emotion is just a human construct and never is objective. you'd probalbly love some AI generated music if you were told that it was made by a human. you're basically prejudiced to think humans are better.
Today's Kpop and autotune feels worse than AI. Today's people just enjoys music which has money behind it, there is no good competition for creation on new music. And you are talking about heart 💔
I spent years teaching myself music production. I am not quite at the level coldfusion is at but i was hopeful of this level being within my reach. Finishing projects is not always fun. The fun part is when all the ideas come. But finishing is rather an excercise of disciplin. I could always muster motivation for that by thinking about my personal goal of creating an audience that does not just consist of my closest friends. But learning about what A.I. can do already was a big blow to this entire endeavor of mine. I am not naive enough to believe that A.I. is forever just an assistance. I believe that it might very well wipe out the entire market for musicians and visual artists. This is so sad. It seems like we, as humans, separate more and more from each other. I do have appreciation for this achievement in technology. But I also wonder if that is really what we want as a society. The money that usually goes to artists, to people in our community, to people like you and I, instead goes to a handful of tech companies.
I've been a 2d artist since I was 4/5 yo. I'm starting to get into trying to make music. I don't ever anticipate being a big thing, just wanted to play with it. It's amazing to me that I can do this all on my computer now, but those programs are like Photoshop, it's a tool you still have to work with to make anything. Watching the AI art generators...it opens it up to more people, but at what cost to human creatives? I hope it goes in a good direction, but only time will tell.
14:41 Creative simply means to create. It seems unhelpful for the discussion. You give an AI some input and set it to work: it performs some calculations and produces a result. The same could be said of a car: you feed it some material and it produces an output. In mundane terms, what the car produces is prima facie always the "same" (obviously not at a quantum level). The level of abstraction we apply to the AI is unpredictability. But a human can produce both predictable and unpredictable output: does this make the work of a human uncreative when it is unproductive? Unoriginal or trite perhaps, but not uncreative. But an AI? We don't see it as creative because it is probabilistic. A human, on the other hand, is not confined by the parameters of code: the innate programming that exists when a human enters the world for the first time is what affords it the robes of creativity: the ghost in the machine is the essence of creativity - of determination. This is something that a machine can only ever fake. We know a human is real and we know an AI is artificial. It's an open and shut case. From a pragmatic standpoint, the universe is merely a series of differentiations occurring as a result of the first differentiation, i.e., the big bang: our choices were known in advance and the original differentiation I presume (due to the nature of differentiation being one thing different from another) was on a set ratio with the first point of existence being differentiated by the Creator on that ratio, which was the same ratio for the resulting series of differentiations that we witness today and label mundanely as, "existence", or "life", or "reality", with the Creator who has total knowledge knowing in advance what everyone wanted, and setting the ratio of the original differentiation and all subsequent differentiations accordingly. And if you want to dispute the existence of the Creator, try producing something like the Quran (challenge remains unmet after 14 centuries) or try making a single protein in the conditions that existed on pre-biotic earth.
I think experiments like these also help us understand how our mind works. We have made artificial eyes (Cameras), artificial memory, artificial mouth, artificial ear. Now we are in a process or creating artificial mind.
I think that a major part of artistic creativity, which is specifically what was discussed in my opinion, there must be motive, not just inspiration. People make art for a reason, they have motive. A.I. simply copies our method(neural pathways), but has never adopted our intrinsic motive. That's why A.I. is still a tool rather than a co-worker. One may argue that our formation of motive is also simply neural pathways but that is still very much lacking in A.I. as well and is what distinguishes us most in my eyes. I see A.I. being able to copy the outputs of humans in just about everything from stem to the humanities given enough examples of our work, but at the current moment they do not possess the same foundation for their work. We make for intrinsic purposes while they make for extrinsic purposes; our kinds of motive are opposing. This is probably for the best at this stage in humanity so that we don't create something to compete with.
I wanna see an AI trained entirely on Hans Zimmer scores lol.
Me too. Let me know if you find one
SAME
This AI from NVIDIA was for shure also trained on sountracks by Hans Zimmer: czcams.com/video/Emidxpkyk6o/video.html
@@600pp - There are a lot of smartypants commenters on this video pontificating how AI will never be able to produce good music. I encourage them to follow your link. Besides, it is so childishly naive to assume that what AI can do in 30 years will be no better than what it can do now ... as if what is does now is no better than what it did 30 years ago. I am constantly flabbergasted by the hubris of humans.
@@Hal_T Exactly. I wouldn't be surprised if AI was used in all creative professions to some extent in a decade from now.
Imagine the AI just comes up on the spot 24/7 the sound that matches what you would like. The whole idea of a single individual unit of song doesn’t matter anymore, instruments don’t matter anymore. Just basically audible patterns that matches your emotional needs of the moment or steer your emotions toward a specific direction.
I think too much exposure and saturation to a good thing would desensitise your brain to the emotional aspects of music
There are live streams on CZcams with AI-produced music, like czcams.com/video/MwtVkPKx3RA/video.html (which is surprisingly listenable, if you like Death Metal). I guess if you just turned the "seed" for the music into something related to your emotional state, you'd have just what you ask for.
That's like the idea of wireheads from Niven's Known Space. Brain's just hooked up to something making it happy indefinately.
I sometimes am aware of my dreams having a musical “backing track”. It’s all spontaneous and unusual, and perfectly fitting. It might be cool to have that while awake too. I actually know someone who has that for real. I think she said sometimes it’s not desirable, but it doesn’t “turn off”.
I can also imagine future cultures who might surrender to total AI direction of creativity… like a sort of unavoidable destiny for us - scary to me.
In future there can be 2 directions of music :
1 - AI generated disposable music which anyone will be able to use it in content creation without worrying about copyrights and credits.
2 - Human composed music, which will have a separate fanbase and will be like handcrafted goods which are available today.
P.S. I love your music and you will be in the 2nd category for us always!
Effectively, Ikea VS. Etsy.... I like it.
I think there will be an app, which is going to generate music in real time, depending on your mood, and genre tastes.
You want sad music? There you go, endless time of sad music of that genre you love, generated in that same moment, specifically for you.
And after that we will have fake human composed music that it's actually made from AI and it's indistinguinshable from human composed ones
As for case 1, I'm not so sure that AI-generated music will not be owned and under copyright by anyone. A large company like Micro$oft or IBM with lots of money for lawyers could well argue that anything created by their music AIs, therefore, belongs to them. It could be a significant source of income.
Please note that I do not necessarily believe that this should happen, only that it could.
............
So basically an Ai can make music for horror games, Noted.
God bless you brother 🙏
You nailed it!
Well, that's because that's the only kinda music AI's planning to be using in future.
I hear AI wants to play horror games in real life to give a more authentic experience
@@Brahmdagh That is the wittiest comment I have seen in ages.
yeah and scary malwares.
Damn Dagogo, that's so dope that you make your own music! Keep it up🔥
yeah it's excellent !
@@brxxkcxrx and a really good one! with the spirit ;)
check out his second channel: czcams.com/channels/GkpFfEMF0eMJlh9xXj2lMw.html
Yeah that just about knocked me out. His tunes are absolutely banging. I cannot believe how talented this man is!
The way you referenced the creative "Seed" I thought you were going to say how all creative AI begin with similar "seed" value, which is often random noise. Especially GANs - the generator always starts with random seed that is later transformed into an image (or whatever else they are trying to generate) to fool the discriminator.
When I was studying AI, this made me understand how artists have a creative nudge, something random in the everyday noise that sparks something creative. Worth thinking about.
oh you dont have a kid yet? you'll see!
I'm a little iffy on the idea of soul - mostly because I'm not a psychologist. I would think there's a source, and a personal 'take' (like style)... these seem like things we could replicate through AI.
i remember one time a friend of mine, who was a science buff and atheist, said something that creeped me out immediately, he said something like "maybe there will be a time when humans wont have to create art and computers can do it for us". the fleshy organic spirit of creativity in me repulsed in horror at the very thought of the idea that humans "HAVE to make art" like its some chore instead of a beautiful process that adds color to life, and the idea that lifeless cold calculated machines would produce all of our media in the future, thats a hellish nightmare to me, but my friend brought this up like it was some cool thing to look forward to
Don't worry, programmers are virgin machines without emotion, they would never reach the point of creating art.
@Nine Waves Im banking on there being pockets of civilization that remain primitive and manage to hide or protect itself from the hell that will be a fully computerized society. if not, then theres always my handy dandy deliberate heroin OD super powers. cant punish me with the future if im dead, as if the present day isnt punishment enough, apparently us humans want to make it even worse for ourselves for some reason, guess we watched the jetsons too much as a kid. seriously though, if i could kms right now with the gaurantee that id respwan in an earlier time, like the 50s maybe, i would do it immediately just to get away from present society, and especially tomorrows society, which will be hell, based on the fact that each year gets worse and worse, the poeple get dumber, the machines get smarter, were going to end up worshiping a microsoft super computer or some crap, all the machine will have to do is put the following message on a screen "Covid 19 can be stopped if humans just worship AI and do everything to let us control your lives" and humans will jump in line to do this because theyre programmed easier than a computer.
AI was created a long long time ago and obviously not by humans. It is now or in the last few decades getting introduced to humans. Enki Technology is the actual term not AI technology. Enki is AI.
@@midnight-2021 What?
Nice disscusion right here. What makes us different from machines and animals is abstract thinking and AI will only combine human made data. I hope that it's gonna help us instead of wipping out musicians from the bussines. Otherwise we will do that just for fun
I see creativity as connecting the dots that was always there but not easy to detect. Thus, an A.I. with an extensive breath of knowledge is able to find these connections through sheer brute force alone thus being far more "creative".
I reckon creativity is either going to stagnate once AI takes over or it will become a catalyst for further human creativity like most modern tech advances. I hope its the latter.
*latter
@@Burbie god bless you🙏
AI will never take over. We are so far from AI being sentient, that you might as well talk about the internet with someone from the dark ages. Apparently, consciousness is a little more difficult than once thought.
It feels like music hasn't progressed in 100 years.
@@freshtendrills5969 yes we are far , but we are growing exponentially fast! So it might not be in 10 year or 50 years or in a 100 years
But somewhere in the future we will make an AI that can take over!
ColdFusion need to check "Everything is a Remix" series. It answers his question about creativity I think.
Everything but this one song and the first guy is like: wtf guys this was my work!
@@PhillipAmthor Even the first one is a remix of the sounds of nature.
Creativity is recycling
Sometimes while listening to white noise I hear some really nice melodies in my head. Sadly I don't know how to recreate them on a software the way I hear them :(
Watch some videos on music creation if you're serious about it. All the info you need is out there.
@@matthewmcclain1316 indeed I'm learning from tutorials
@@soontaek cool buddy. Good luck.
@@matthewmcclain1316 thank you very much
Learn to play the piano bud
" Rules are waiting for you to break!!" , Beethoven said.
" I just did.", AI said.
Thanks so much for the shoutout y'all! I've been a viewer for a while so it's wild to see my stuff pop up on here.
Always good for content creators to get to have a little recognition! Lol
“Yeah I do a little production” makes a heavenly beat
Your music is beautiful brother, an extremely astounding talent
Jesus Christ on a T shaped stick... I feel it.
That was awe.
The definition of creativity might change once AI is more commonplace. The thing we call soul is never discovered. It’s a term for something unknown.
thats a nightmare for creativity
@@daveraschke I really wonder whether that would be the case.
What we call human creativity will remain to exist as long as the are humans.
Whether or not we’ll remain to appreciate human creativity is an open question, although I think we will even if we stop to do so for a while, since what is fashionable is cyclical.
I teach music professionally and your composition methods are excellent man. Great vid too. Cheers.
This is very interesting and maybe one day we’ll be having AI getting Grammy awards for their creativity. Very amusing and weird at the same time
I can see that happening,there were computer chess tournaments so why not music?
We already have AI's getting Grammy Awards. Music is trash nowdays.
then people would rent out literal factories for crafting competitions. elaborate your braindead logic please
This is deep. It's like the Chaos Theory. As long as you have all the information, nothing seems random anymore.
Laplace’s Demon hiding in the dark m8 although much more complex, it is pretty wild.
@@dahleno2014 yep..this is pretty sad if you think about it. If the same result is obtained from everyone receiving the same input, it means that everything is pre-determined.
It’s almost like we’re trying to automate out everything in life that gives us enjoyment, fulfilment and meaning..
no, this sentence should be ended after the word everything.
I dont think ppl wanna automate it "out". music composers and producers want to be creatively efficient by getting to the vibe or musical idea they're imagining using the infinite options created by AI. Similar concept to CAD CAM 3D printing or milling. sure some people find satisfaction is actually carving or manufacturing their furniture designs by hand, but some people just like to explore and churn out more creative designs or prototypes by automating machines to manufacture it quickly. it allows for more time to explore the increasing range of options which before wasn't possible if you needed to spend so much of the time in order to create or manufacture the idea into real life.
We will always be okay
ColdFusion: "Is it even possible for a machine to produce original music?"
Me, who is well acquainted with the term "Algorithmic Composition": "Well I guess SOMEONE has never played Warioware DIY."
Inspiration = seed
Thought process = algorithm (or in this case, the neural connection)
That's my understanding. I know it's not creativity based on our standard understanding of the said word, but our understanding is shaped by what we have as example. When AI managed to produce more and more sample of their creativity, I think our perception of the word will change, too.
AI will get there, it is no longer a question of if, but when.
I agree with this... This is well put, and aligns well with how I experience creativity.
now i know you create your own backing music i love the content even more im guessing a lot of that demo track you just did is how a lot of your audio is done in these videos ExCELLENT WORK
10:28 damn that techno actually killed it lol
Yeah it was kind of a mess, but it had some really cool parts. Glad you enjoyed it!
That’s not techno
You really need to make a playlist of all the music you produce. Some raw talent on display
ColdFusion already does have a channel where he uploads the music that he makes. Link is in the description.
@@farhanbinamin nice one boss rly wanna add some to my coding playlist
As a fellow music producer, This is right up my street! Thank you
AI making music like good ones will be really difficult, because music is a feel and feeling of the writer which is impossible to implement as of now.
Tbh electronic music and pop can be done fairly easily I guess, as its mostly sampling and quantized beats.
Things like classical rock, old school rap and old pop will be really difficult to do properly.
you better dont say 'impossible to implement'.
dont't underestimate how much some kinds of electronic musik takes to make
Just a matter of time before scientists devise an algorithm for this
It's a very common misconception that the musician has to "feel" the feelings from the song. That's not AT ALL the case. I've been playing Guitar for 15+ years and create music myself. Let me tell you: After a certain point you learn how literally create emotion in people that they haven't had. And it's all rooted in music theory. You can "force" people to feel emotion by sitting down without any emotion, crate something ane people will feel those feels.
It's literally that easy. No emotion from the composer needed.
Short and simple demosntration: "How to Imitate a Whole Lot of Hollywood Film Music In Four Easy Steps" by Scott Murphy
This reminds me of the SouthPark where Germany is accused of being the worlds least funny people, so they build a joke-telling robot to prove them wrong. czcams.com/video/wVHQIHDSkZI/video.html
There was this anime I watched some time ago. Vivy's Fluorite Song.
I think it adds a new aspect to the whole creativity argument - the _factor of desire_ or _inspiration_ . When an AI creates something not because it is said to, but when it wants to out of its own free will. I think that meshes up quite well with what Dagogo said about inspirational music near the end of the video.
Good anime,too bad it didn't get much attention.. Maybe it'll be remembered as a cult classic in the future!
I love Cold Fusion. your work is great dude
La Musique •
All A.I music came from listening to countless songs and then it came up with it's own version. At the end, everything derives from us.
I feel like mentioning that's precisely how humans learn music; from listening to countless songs and then meshing things we learn from them into our own music. Everything derives from musicians before us.
Though at some point it had to begin...
That's how every great guitarists start to compose their own songs: by listening to other songs.
You know entertainment companies are already looking at this. Add information from hit songs like BPM, key, genre, lyric subject, melody (if any) range and placement, danceability and how much teenage girls like it and they will have a cheap, never-ending source of "new" product that won't need creative minds at all. Then add sexy AI bots to perform the music and you won't need drug addled musicians or expensive, troublesome divas at either. Modernization has become de-humanization.
Except since the AI source code would be available to everyone, anyone with minimal skill would be able to generate the music and edit it to suit their end goal.
@@Constantin_91 Available to everyone, great. Background loops for You Tube videos OK, good but every tone-deaf musician wannabe with a computer will be able subject the internet with artless, soul killing robot music. Computers and the internet becoming more involved in music coincides with music quality going downhill over the last 20 years is no surprise. Ok, rant over.
I think the biggest difference is that an artist "knows" when it is right. He/she tries/imagens different variations and improves the art to make it better. AI chances things and gives variations, but the only way for it to tell if something is good is to how similar it is to other stuff in it's database. It has no idea when it makes something horrible or great.
But then you come across the problem posed by thought experiments like the Turing Test and the Chinese Room. Do we really know that the AI doesn't know? What is it like to know? Can we really prove that an artist knows and not just simulating that they know?
Nowadays the best chess ai actually use a form of intuition to improve their ability to play chess. If ai could develop an intuition for good music, that would be great.
@@macroxela Something like a turning test for different kinds of artistic processes would be interesting. Though for now I am convinced the AI will fail.
@@diophantine1598 I never say AI will never be able to do something, there is so much progress. But it will be a while for we are there.
@@MarijnvdSterre Such as a Engineer who created the complicated instruments like drums, guitar for Artist to work on.
You are doubting the same Engineer for creating AI. You should only embrace it, you have no right to criticize Engineering Artists.
Was it you who made “Does it get easier”? That’s actually my best of all the music you’ve made.
I've always liked your background music never realized you produced it yourself. You talented freak
Wow , you’ve recently become one of my favorite channels. Now I find out you’re a musician and you sampled an incredible 1975 song !
He has a music channel in case you're interested: czcams.com/channels/GkpFfEMF0eMJlh9xXj2lMw.html
Your Music Creation process is similar to mine. I play with one riff and from that I can hear each subsequent sound and progression in my head. The hardest part is finding those sounds and making them match what's in my head.
I recently attended a concert, which gave me some clarity on this subject. The reason music is interesting is that there is a human connection. I went to the concert to marvel at the skill of the musicians and to connect with the musicians and other fans. The cool thing about music is being in sync with other people at a primal level. The knowledge that the music and lyrics came from a human mind and is conveying some sort of message is critical to my enjoyment. I have no doubt that AI could produce the music the bands were playing, but it would be meaningless
@Della Serenity I don't really care about the creative process used, just that an immaterial consciousness imbued ot with meaning instead of it just being random and meaningless
“Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether they could, they didn't stop to think if they should”
Dagogo, I've always thought you'd sourced your music, it sounds so professional. You have a musical talent, and it puts shivers down my spine
I wouldn't say an AI "created" a song. I would say that an AI "generated" a song. Definitely a difference between creativity, and generation.
Well a new original piece exists now? So it did create it
@@RealityBoat I think the distinction lies within the process by which that new piece of music came into existence. Yes, a new piece of music has come into existence. But it has been generated by an AI. I'm suggesting that generation of new art forms does not necessarily imply that there was creativity involved. Additionally, although a new piece of music has been created, that doesn't mean that an AI has created it. I'm implying that AI, in its current form, does not have the capacity for creativity, although they do have the capacity to generate things, that we may refer to colloquially as creations. Attributing the quality of creativity to an AI at this stage doesn't seem reasonable, but I guess that all depends on your definition of what creativity is, what a creation is, and what it means to create something; as well as your beliefs of how AI generates these "creations". It's largely a philosophical debate, but this is my opinion.
@@DJReachOfficial if you really break it down there is no truely original art. New art or music in this case is a remix of things we already know and experience which is almost an identical process the ai uses. Nonetheless it is original
Being a Web Developer I am always afraid of AI taking over my job in coming years but seeing others who share the same fear is what keeps me motivated 😂
Don't worry, indians have taken over the whole world... Humans are worried
you are afraid of neurons simulated through math. L
@@scarm_rune No not really, just afraid of the people in charge of those.
@@mikeostwald9645 why are we not afraid of industrial machine manufacturers then
@@scarm_rune If everything is done by AI then what am I supposed to do with the 80 years of my life? Ai is not replacing the Toilet Cleaners who hate their Job, AI is replacing the fun in peoples lives, Artists,Writers, Musicians, Programmers and many more. For those people it's not just a job, it's a lifestyle, a challenge and a passion, people live for those things alone. The only reason these things are being developed is to reduce the costs and maximise income for big companies so that they don't have to hire artists and programmers. They drastically reduce costs while maximizing productivity, gaining more wealth and power.
Idk I was actually super impressed by both the "avocado chair" and "blue pumpkin mural" results. Both had examples in there that looked "inspired". Like some of the chairs looked legitimately inspired by some very specific furniture designs, and one of the murals looked like it was done in a more abstract graffiti style.
I, Robot: “You are a machine. An imitation of life. Can a robot write a symphony? Can a robot take a canvas and turn into a beautiful masterpiece”?
2021: Actually………….
I would say it has no soul but, a lot of music made today has no soul either.
Try J-pop
I don't care bout no seouls in muh musick breough
@@Luovain what?
I honestly think AI should be used to assist humans and make their lives easy. But not entirely replace them. Problems that exist on a massive scale can benefit from AI/ML too. However, I think that art and music should be left alone.
Exactly, if everything is done for us can you imagine how unfulfilling and boring life would?
Every one of our compositions has elements of human-created sound, are edited by human, and are designed to be listened to by humans. AI is just another tool. This is a great tool for creatives.
It's gonna change the very nature of entertainment. Like it or not. I don't like those big changes coming but all we can do is brace and try to find any creative avenues left. I feel like we will be like art directors. Less painting, more choosing. People with great taste will have advantage over other not so sophisticated artists.
An artist's soul is discovered with practice, time, experience etc. even if it already exists. The same can be true for AI as it gets more refined over time. We might end up seeing a Zima Blue in our lifetime after all.
Hey its your mom's favorite musician!
Apparently I am doing my Final Year Engineering on this topic. We are going to generate original Melodies based on a Classical songs MIDI dataset and export it to MIDI format, so that we musicians can use them in their music softwares to make music (as Coldfusion showed). It's very similar to Google's Magenta. This really helps when there is an artist block or you get stuck somewhere. Using this you can generate a random idea and start working from there.
Cold Fusion = quality
Continue your work Bro
Another way to think of MIDI, at least in the context of this video, is, its like sheet music for a computer, a talented multi instrumentalist that can read sheet music can play the same written music on different instruments, because when it comes down to it, the notes are the same between instruments, its just how those notes sound that changes and its the same with MIDI files and computers, the MIDI file is basically just the sheet music, it tells the computer what notes to play, when to play them and how to play them its just displayed in a different way to sheet music.
"there's nothing new under the sun"
"good artists borrow, great artists steal"
The biggest hurdle to overcome in "validating" AI generated work is simply sentience. And perhaps it would be better not to.
The biggest hurdle will be convincing arrogant and often stupid humans that it is.
And not only is but "is more"
The musician Benn Jordan (aka the artist behind The Flashbulb) has an excellent YT channel that showcases some AI made music concepts and discusses the tech behind it. The channel is just called Benn Jordan for anyone interested in that kind of thing!
Could you be able to program the AI to start creativity after a certain “inspiring moment”? Like programming it to work only when it hears, smells, or sees something specific
No. The AI works based on what it has been trained to create. It can't work based on an inspiration
@@chunkyMunky329 Well, certain machine learning algorithms allow for new data to be added, so as long as you can add these sounds, smells, etc... as data, the AI can retrained itself to produce new stuff beyond its initial 'knowledge base'.
Alternatively, you use these sensory data not as new data, but as modifiers for the learning process instead.
@@linhdanghoang2504 That doesn't make any sense. You can't "train" a neural network to create something that you don't even have any idea what the result should be. Thats called randomness and is not learning. The whole point of training a neural network is that you're giving the machine some kind of guidance on what output it should create based on that input. For example, you can give it a painting of a sad face and then show it an example of a happy face. Then the machine can learn how to perform that transformation to turn pictures of sad faces into happy faces. I work with neural networks and you have to have a plan on how you're going to get it to understand what a useful output is otherwise it will create useless garbage. There is no such thing as an AI training itself, unless you're talking about "unsupervised training" which is a different kind of situation where the AI simply finds patterns in your data and shows you where the patterns are. Nobody has created an unsupervised AI that can teach itself to do anything more complex than finding numerical patterns in data.
I play instruments with improvisation, Ableton is similar, how you turn on a loop and include them when you feel inspired. I think when I improvise sometimes I find the mistakes I have made serendipitous in how the finished product is. Sometimes the mistakes are very unique, or even birds chirping outside my house add a nice effect.
The masters would know how to manipulate ai tools to create music. I think maybe ai is just the next stage in art production. And perhaps music software plugins would be made to use ai but not for ai to use the musicians when creating music.
I loved it how you were trying to decipher the creativity and the cafe smell thing.
I think AI music is pretty much like a parakeet 🦜learning to mimic voices. It could only modify existing thing it will never create, but it will blend awesome stuff
If one day we fully understand human brain, it’s just a matter of building a powerful enough computer to replace ANYTHING human can do and better
humans itself is a mimicking creature, why surprised when AI does it better!!!
14:14 - This is literally the tool I would have loved to have for my thesis research
Nigeria?
The major flaw with current AI methods is that AI will never be able to imagine things that have never existed before, in the sense that these systems only learn to approximate and interpolate the dataset they’re trained on as accurately as possible.
If something doesn’t exist in the dataset, the probability of such a thing being generated by the system is 0, simply by the way the system is trained.
everything you think you came up with from scratch are the result of all previous musical knowledge and influences which is exactly the same for AI. The big difference is that an AI activly remembers songs and has heard more music then you can listen to if you spent your entire life on it.
It's in it infancy. Wait until it becomes adult
"The major flaw with _current_ AI methods is that AI will _never_ ..." The major flaw with cavemen is that they will never create a rocket to the moon. Right. Because rockets were never in the dataset. Got it! Thanks for the brilliance, Grop.
I fully agree, but it's kind of how humans work also (Obviously in a VERY watered down version lol), but as babies all we learn from is the world around us for the most part.
When we come up with 'new' concepts, in reality, at least for the most part, it's just an amalgamation of things we've heard before.
With that being said, I'm just trying to play the devils advocate here, and I do believe there is something fundamentally different (Call it the soul, or consciousness, ect) between us and computers but I figured I'd share my thoughts :)
Cheers!
@@Queleb1 - Once we were cousins of the Great Apes. But something happened and now we compose symphonies. To assume that AI will never cross that divide is an unsupportable hypothesis. We don't know what changed between us and the apes. And so we can't know if something similar will happen with AI. But it is typical of humans to assume we're unique when, in fact, we don't really understand what "it" is. Many people believe God did it. That's your first clue that we're looking in all the wrong places and making all the wrong assumptions.
I think a very interesting way to use AI generated music is as inspiration for your own music composition. The unpredictability can make some really interesting rifts that you won’t think up yourself.
That's exactly what I would like to use AI for as well. I can build off the initial sounds that they make
meaning creativity will pretty much die cause everyone just uses AI to make music for them
An interesting experiment would be for a human and and AI to compose the entire musical score to a full-length feature film. I think that would highlight the shortcomings of AI "creativity".
Me an Connor are working on an album... is that close enough?
I think it would be interesting to consider and have a discussion on how the following principles can be combined where a conversation on creativity is concerned. 1) Godel's incompleteness theorem, 2) Heisenberg's uncertainty principle, and 3) The second law of thermodynamics. Godel's incompleteness theorem is a mathematical principle that shows that any logical system is incomplete, meaning that there will always be true statements that cannot be proven within that system. In the creative process, this principle can be used to inspire artists, writers, and other creatives to embrace the idea that there are always new ideas to be explored and discovered. It can also encourage them to take risks and to be open to unconventional or unexpected solutions. Heisenberg's uncertainty principle is a fundamental principle in quantum mechanics that states that the more precisely the position of a particle is known, the less precisely its momentum can be known, and vice versa. In the creative process, this principle can be used to encourage experimentation and exploration, and to embrace the unpredictable and unknown. It can also inspire creatives to embrace the idea that there are many different perspectives and ways of looking at a problem or challenge. Finally, The second law of thermodynamics states that the entropy (or disorder) of a closed system tends to increase over time. In the creative process, this principle can be used to encourage creatives to embrace imperfection and change. It can also inspire them to look for new and innovative ways to create order out of chaos, and to find beauty in the unexpected and unconventional. Food for thought?
Narrative of Self is the result of a feedback loop between “Separate Self” & Cosmos 🎈
we get it your woke stop spamming comments everwhere haha
objective observation: creativity seems to borrow from the phenomena of sets, where sets are ideas that delineate as they overlap on to other premises. in the range in which the overlap occurs, it can be said the brain experiences an interpretation of the objective stimuli, as the brain makes connections to templates of experience unique to its personal compilation of experiences.
I hope some day I'll be able to listen to custom music generated by an AI tailored to me.
that would be wild
The music and face creation are truly amazing. But the part where you talk about entering text and getting images doesn't seem like creation but more like a google images request where the text is used for a search and results are scanned for objects and colors detection and then either recolored, croped or slightly modified as results. What do you think @coldfusion ?
Anyway, love your channel, your work is awesome :-D
Man! I always find it interesting seeing how other producers compose their tracks. I am not as free flowing as you. I choose a key, get a full chord progression mapped in that key THEN build off of that into the track layer by layer starting with the bass. I always find it interesting how other producers go about their production and what they do to get into a flow state. Thanks for covering AI music. I've always found it interesting!
Imagination is more than just the ability to create pictures in your mind. AI currently isn't imagining new sounds, it's just "combining combinations" from data examples that it is using to sequence a different combination. Also AI is unaware if it is has combined a combination that is truely great sounding or whether during the combination it's starting to sound bad. Imagination has the ability to think of something truely unique, that hasn't come from a combination of other existing possibilities. It can be possible to think of a new thought/idea that has never been thought of before in human history.
"AI is just recycling different combinations"
For computers sound and images are just data. How do you know it can't imagine sound?
If AI can create images, it can create sound.
If you don't know have the skills of AI, you cannot criticize it.
Same as I can't judge if the musical notes and tunes are correct it not.
If you ask the Regional music, if Kpop and electronic music is good they would say it is trash. Thus, the combination of music is subjective.
Humans itself are a mimicking creature. You can't state AI is just recycling different combinations, if it can make images from just avocado chair.
@@shrin210 Hi there, this isn't a criticism of AI, I like AI... it will be one of the most important developments in Human evolution. AI doesn't develop a picture from its imagination, it comes from the data set it has access too and the way the code has been written to reassemble an image from the data set. Now you can say it's created a new image!... but it hasn't come from AI imagination.
I would suggest do your research into how AI algorithms and parameters work, they are amazing and have self improving structures.
To your point about Music, let's keep the subjective nature of music out of this discussion as I'm not referring to whether or not the AI music is good or not subjectively, what I am pointing out is when the AI's musical sequence deviates to point where the Human experience would say that's not music any more, its just a rambling random combination of notes.
Humans are not just mimicking creatures, we can use our imagination, without a data set, to create a truly unique thought. This has happened time and time again throughout history and lead to some of the greatest new directions in human thought and science.
As famously quote by Albert Einstein "Imagination is more important than knowledge"
Perfect! A bunch of illiterate artists will emerge because of this new creative AI
Gross, you're right. It will put auto tune to shame with it's ability to make crappy singers sound good. Lol
less skill gap required means the pool of imagination being poured into arts becomes larger. think CZcams, amateur / consumer camera gear, all in one photo / video editing programs that allowed social media and grassroots level entertainment like this channel. it allows more imagination to enter the world because people dont have to spend so much time of their life learning and developing the skill in order to express their imaginations.
I'd like to argue that this yearning for some level of definite skill is to be exhibited by an artist is more a manifestation a lack of confidence and insecurity regarding ones own taste and skills of assesment and valuation. See, kinda proof that fretting for the works of this artist who has established his/hers competence will not result in others laughing at me for digging this, kinda thing.,
@@TK-gd9td Yeah I agree what am more worried about is AI artist those corporations would love those !
@@TK-gd9td Is it really your imagination if a AI feeds you a song? I'm just saying there is alot of sounds that you can imagine but if you dont know music fundamentals you wont be able to put it to paper. Music has already become to impersonal because of sampling, theres is alot of times a new chord or progression would make a song better but is not implemented because the artist doesn't know how articulate it.
Couple of things:
1) as a fellow (hobbyist) producer it’s really cool to share an insight into our workflow and processes to so many people who otherwise would never look into what it takes to throw something together
2) in time with the right programming and algorithmic formulae AI will arguably be able to pump out top 40s at a much faster rate than the big label writing teams imo. Add the limitations of song structure and the concept of repetition for auditory value and I reckon it’ll happen soon. We ultimately all draw inspiration from our subconscious - computers will get it from RAM :p
That's pretty great! I've wrote AI music programs before (samples on my channel) and this does give me more ideas to make it better
As an improvising instrumentalist I find the idea of generated harmonies to use to improvise over fascinating. Sounds like a great interesting way to force improvising into new areas and a way for human creativity to mesh with cold, hard generative technology. Super interesting to me.
I sometimes use mubert to listen to music and every time I get amazed on how far AI has come
I remember similar debates occuring during era when chess was not yet dominated by AI. Something along the line: "Machines can never defeat best human because they lack creativity, inspiration..."
Turns out you don't need those. For chess you can brute-force the solution by exhaustively searching the entire game tree. Since number of nodes increases exponentialy - a completely exhaustive search is not possible for most of the chess positions. However what is possible, is you create heuristics when by some "chess knowledge" you select promising moves to explore and calculate only to certain depth at which another chess knowledge is applied to evaluate the resulting position. You have now transformed the original problem of playing chess to performing elementary calculations really fast.
I suspect something similar should be possible for music as well. After all there is only finite number of sound tracks of certain length (when represented digitally). So it's not like you need to "invent" the sound track, rather you need to navigate the almost endless space of possible tracks. Analogous to chess you would need some function that can evaluate "quality" or "likability" of the track created - e.g. by modeling response of "average" human brain to the track. If we had high quality model of how given track is "likable" to average human brain, then theoretically you could just search the entire space of all tracks of given length exhaustively, have them scored and select only those that scored the highest. For practical cases however better approach should be to again invent some sort of heuristics - i.e. have population of AI composers and use evolution algorithms to select those that score the highest etc. Or some other form of how the AI composers can teach them selfs how to improve in creating music (similarly as alpha zero self taught playing board games) Given all this, act of creating music is then also - similarly to chess - tranformed to performing elementary calculations really fast.
The really tricky part is of course how to model realistic response of "average" human brain. In future we could theoretically learn to simulate all neurons in human brain so sort of "simulating" functionally equivalent response to one performed by human (i.e. numerical score given by average human and numerical socre obtained by simulating the average human brain could be very close). But even if this would turn out to be possible, the computation cost would be quite prohibitive for any forseable future. Therefore much simpler approach should be to feed AI with database of 10s of milions of songs and their ratings given by users. This way it should be possible to train model for scoring songs that is computationally manageable / much more practical.
In the debate of computation complexity of P vs. NP problems it is expected that NP problems are "more difficult" Althought not yet proven either way - one of the compelling reasons for thinking so tends to be the fact, that it's much easier to appreciate i.e. Bach's music than it's to compose music of comparable quality to Bach. Similarly I would expect it's much easier to first teach AI how to "appreciate" the music (how to score it) and then use it to seach and navigate through the vast space of possible tracks than it's to learn AI how to compose music straight away (especially "original" music like invent new style of music - while first approach could work also for this new "original" type of music)
Of course this is just a general idea - still lots of details to fill (i.e the track evaluation function could also evelove based on tracks it listened to etc.), but I'll stop here due to already substantial length of the text.
The tracks created by AI feel off, like it lacks something.
Soul
The genre of music I like is called "distorted 808 kicks" I need a high amount of gain on the electronic bass to create a tone that's an alternative to rock
I don't think AIs can be "creative" in the traditional sense since all AIs do is process many data points to randomly generate new ones that follow particular pattern(s)
Basically, all an AI knows is to deal with values between 0 and 1, and nothing more; it's the guidance by humans that make an AI turn these values into something that humans are familiar with
your neuron activations could also be represented by numbers from 0 to 1
@@TVDaJa That is correct. This discussion generally goes to the philosophical part of "what is conscious?" and stuff like that
You mentioned in your video, you were able to extract the vocals from another song using a website. Which one is it ? Asking as a fellow (beginning) producer :3.
Hi, who ever reads this I hope you have a great day 😀
First
You too bud
Its night in here
Right back at you🙂👍
I hope you have an even better day!
Dude, make an 8 hour video and I'll watch it all. Your voice and background musing is so damn good, so relaxing. I won't even care what the video would be about.
Dagogo is like Brian Transeau aka BT when it comes to making music and implementing uniqueness! 🙌
Not even close.
I love how you went so in depth. Way more than you usually do. Very informative
It is easy to write lyrics, when you have nothing to say, stringing empty words on patterns that impress as mere word-play
Wonderful Ryhme!
Wait until you discover scat singing in jazz music.
Creativity of the collage (a piece of art made by sticking various different materials such as photographs and pieces of paper or fabric on to a backing) has been explored by artists since 1910. A little later they experimented with realism as in sur-realism. Many experiments were "auto creative" wich means that random fragments were applied to works of art. Selection was and still is an interaction of the human being.
In music the modern approach was much more formal, initially around the skill of the player (Satie, Stravinsky) but after WWII increasingly more formal, mathematical, mechanical, serial and a-tonal.
In post-modern times artists mostly shop & select in the modern history, largely creating atmospheric muzak or kitch-imagery, sometimes profound works of art. The examples from AI creations are just "collages" from predictions, as in corrective or additional text in messaging apps.
Creativity and intelligence are concepts that have not yet yielded a well-defined knowledge of them. Machine learning is not intelligence and although it "creates", it's not a creative act in itself. It predicts outcomes from previously created art and photography. The process of creating AI machine learning software and selecting from the outcomes, is creative of course.
Inspiration is pretty straight forward.. You combine ideas in your head using your creativity, and if you like the outcome of one of those ideas you are inspired...
AI can easily accomplish this, just giving it samples of what it "likes" and it can feel inspired when it creates a creative idea that it also likes.
Exactly, all “creative” endeavors are merely a mismatch of prior experiences (inputs) that you find connections between and create amalgam of these ideas (output) and expand it into a physical medium. All “creativeness is merely your brain processing and recontextualizing previous information that you have perceived.
At 11mins it sounds like Knower/Louis Cole, cool!
The "missing inspiration and soul" link is an illusion, Dagogo, because the AI was created by humans. The AI created images and music is powered and born by these people's souls and inspiration. There is no missing link.
Creativity is diverging from paterns that is recognized
Our definition of good music (in most cultures) is highly standardized in many ways. Once they limit the AI to following those standards, it will be able to more effectively channel the creativity it has learned.
10:50 I can't help but hearing Eddy are you ok, are you ok Eddy
"We don't understand how that works" - IT'S EMOTIONS. For a musician, you missed the mark...
"Creativity is the art of concealing your influences"
- Someome from black mesa
13:35 that is a HUUUUUGE leap of assumption...
An ai algorithm that isnt sentient, does not create "images in your mind", it has no mind.
It has data, not images. You're also overly simplifying what imagination is.
The oxford dictionary isnt the end-all definition of human concepts that have existed for millenia.
Well, how would you define mind?
If you donot know don't comment.
Alpha Zero is AI which did not even have data and only knew rules of game of chess. No data was given. Only experience of playing chess with itself for millions times, it is great player.
But Humans are copying creatures, "copying" which translates to learn from others and compete on it and telling AI is copying what a hypocrisy.
If you think about it, the "seed" of any random generator, is just like our inspiration for thought, or any kind of creation.
So google/fb already have a profile for everyone, and can use it for AI training with creator's published work.
After they successfully do that, they can use it to generate your unique music, with your profile, recent life change, current sensor data
Music is an expression of the heart so it would be hard for something with no heart (emotion) to construct something meaningful. There’s a difference between noise and music. This is closer to noise imo.
Well said
Boo.
bet you'd not even be able to distinguish music made by an artist and AI given the AI is coded well. emotion is just a human construct and never is objective. you'd probalbly love some AI generated music if you were told that it was made by a human. you're basically prejudiced to think humans are better.
Today's Kpop and autotune feels worse than AI.
Today's people just enjoys music which has money behind it, there is no good competition for creation on new music. And you are talking about heart 💔
I spent years teaching myself music production. I am not quite at the level coldfusion is at but i was hopeful of this level being within my reach. Finishing projects is not always fun. The fun part is when all the ideas come. But finishing is rather an excercise of disciplin. I could always muster motivation for that by thinking about my personal goal of creating an audience that does not just consist of my closest friends. But learning about what A.I. can do already was a big blow to this entire endeavor of mine. I am not naive enough to believe that A.I. is forever just an assistance. I believe that it might very well wipe out the entire market for musicians and visual artists. This is so sad. It seems like we, as humans, separate more and more from each other.
I do have appreciation for this achievement in technology. But I also wonder if that is really what we want as a society. The money that usually goes to artists, to people in our community, to people like you and I, instead goes to a handful of tech companies.
I've been a 2d artist since I was 4/5 yo. I'm starting to get into trying to make music. I don't ever anticipate being a big thing, just wanted to play with it. It's amazing to me that I can do this all on my computer now, but those programs are like Photoshop, it's a tool you still have to work with to make anything. Watching the AI art generators...it opens it up to more people, but at what cost to human creatives? I hope it goes in a good direction, but only time will tell.
@@jennyheidewald5006 Yay!! The world needs more female procuders!
@@marihi8621 Thanks! 😁
14:41 Creative simply means to create. It seems unhelpful for the discussion. You give an AI some input and set it to work: it performs some calculations and produces a result. The same could be said of a car: you feed it some material and it produces an output. In mundane terms, what the car produces is prima facie always the "same" (obviously not at a quantum level). The level of abstraction we apply to the AI is unpredictability. But a human can produce both predictable and unpredictable output: does this make the work of a human uncreative when it is unproductive? Unoriginal or trite perhaps, but not uncreative. But an AI? We don't see it as creative because it is probabilistic. A human, on the other hand, is not confined by the parameters of code: the innate programming that exists when a human enters the world for the first time is what affords it the robes of creativity: the ghost in the machine is the essence of creativity - of determination. This is something that a machine can only ever fake. We know a human is real and we know an AI is artificial. It's an open and shut case. From a pragmatic standpoint, the universe is merely a series of differentiations occurring as a result of the first differentiation, i.e., the big bang: our choices were known in advance and the original differentiation I presume (due to the nature of differentiation being one thing different from another) was on a set ratio with the first point of existence being differentiated by the Creator on that ratio, which was the same ratio for the resulting series of differentiations that we witness today and label mundanely as, "existence", or "life", or "reality", with the Creator who has total knowledge knowing in advance what everyone wanted, and setting the ratio of the original differentiation and all subsequent differentiations accordingly. And if you want to dispute the existence of the Creator, try producing something like the Quran (challenge remains unmet after 14 centuries) or try making a single protein in the conditions that existed on pre-biotic earth.
I think experiments like these also help us understand how our mind works. We have made artificial eyes (Cameras), artificial memory, artificial mouth, artificial ear. Now we are in a process or creating artificial mind.
Let me know when AI can write meaningful, original lyrics for that music.
Once ai have the ability to feel emotions like humans then probably lol
Just a matter of time
Alert us when you can pretend to post stuff that is meaning full deeply.🚬🥃🤠
Most of the artists/songwriters today also can't do that
I think that a major part of artistic creativity, which is specifically what was discussed in my opinion, there must be motive, not just inspiration.
People make art for a reason, they have motive. A.I. simply copies our method(neural pathways), but has never adopted our intrinsic motive. That's why A.I. is still a tool rather than a co-worker. One may argue that our formation of motive is also simply neural pathways but that is still very much lacking in A.I. as well and is what distinguishes us most in my eyes. I see A.I. being able to copy the outputs of humans in just about everything from stem to the humanities given enough examples of our work, but at the current moment they do not possess the same foundation for their work. We make for intrinsic purposes while they make for extrinsic purposes; our kinds of motive are opposing. This is probably for the best at this stage in humanity so that we don't create something to compete with.