I BOUGHT A CHURCH ORGAN PART 14 - CONSOLE BRAINS AND WIRING
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- čas přidán 27. 08. 2024
- TIME TO GIVE THE ORGAN BRAINS
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#restoration #howto #organ
reply to some code comments, something i had not mentionned in the vid as i failed to fully explain. it is also an issue with just a single keyboard, as in you have a stop playing and the same but transposed it has the ability to cut itself off. im in the middle of sorting it for the next vid, but be aware if your trying to think about solutionas, you cant just compare inputs from the keyboards.
also a Reply to the incoming "get the keys to move
By themselves" comments. Don't get me wrong awesome idea. I humoured it when putting together the first keyboard tried a handful of approaches and it was just turning into an absolute endeavour of modification. I'd have more luck sourcing something more suited. It's one thing being the big ideas talker down the pub. But it's nothing without seeing it through. But yeah don't get me wrong I'd love to and will do when i get to it :D.
Might be easier to find an old pianola (aka "player piano"), wire that up for MIDI, then feed its MIDI output into the organ. Not saying it'll be easy mind you, just perhaps easier ;)
@@MicraHakkinen indeed! I am after a rough pianola to midify for another day haha. However a self playing 2 tier key setup would be awesome as you play great to swell and it's like both keyboards move. I tried various different electromagnetic arrangements and none that were good enough were small enough
if you cannot source a self moving piano then maybe some more LEDs on the keys themselves for when it's auto-playing
maybe an led per key might be an easier option, like the pipe leds :)
@@ChongMcBong yeah I think this might be the better way since getting a similar electromechanical system would be potentially altering more of the console and Sam's been trying to keep it reversible
I'm so fucking glad Sam bought Joan's organ. This has to be one of the best series of videos I've watched. Every episode is so satisfying to see it get more and more complete.
The music is always on point and the fact we had a fuck you song for all the 'you shouldn't do it like that, do it like this' crowd was a cherry on top.
Omg, had tears in my eyes with the FU song, this project has been so fantastic. Had a quick play on the organ end of last year, can't wait to get to another open day. Amazing, awesome, made my day. ❤❤
SAM!! YOU DONT KNOW WHAT YOUR DOOOOINNNNNNNNN, U DON NO WOT UR DOINNNNNNN
This is truly an amazing work and we are learning how pipe organs work. This video series will outlive us like the great classics.
@@traida111 But Wot yer gonna do? 🙂
@@davechisholm9670 doin sam, you dun no wot ur DOINGGGGGGG
It's cool that you're able to add more features to it without wrecking the original mojo of the organ.
Agreed
I like that it still looks original
if Rob Scallon ever visits the UK you need to invite him to come and do a session on the organ. He would be absolutely blown away by what you've done here
exactly my thoughts too, been loving this all along, but something about this episode really hit home as to just what may be possible with a setup like this. and a collab with rob would be nuts
Would love to see Rob and Sam collaborate!
yes a little Phantom of the Opera cover with rob on guitar would be epic
YES OH MY GOD YES
I really want to see Rob visit the museum.
You are amazing. I have been an organist since age 14, and most organs have piston presets. Coils like that one are still used, but I like the fully electronic stuff - less mechanical things to break.
Joan would be so amazed at how you are keeping her legacy alive. 👍🏻
don't talk in past tense, she is watching every stage. she also is not bound by time anymore, so she can watch his entire build in one continuous moment. I think the finale, of when its finished and it runs its first fully configured midi file, she will be in pure joy.
I didn't expect this project to be this complicated. My knowledge of organs is almost non existent, so after you put the whole thing together, I thought you're basically done, but boy was I wrong. But that also means more great content to look forward to!
My knowledge of organs is also none existent so bear that in mind 😂
@@LOOKMUMNOCOMPUTER Yeah but you've got a lot of time, and a background in both music and electromechanical systems, so I imagine there's a lot of "oh, so that's why that is the way it is" discoveries every day, plus you then have to package that discovery into something you can show your audience that makes sense. You know way more than you're letting on.
I'm with you. I was thinking the same thing. Months later still stuff to do. Really cool watching Sam put it all together.
@@LOOKMUMNOCOMPUTER yeah you don’t know what your doing sammm it can’t be done sammmmm blah blah you are incredible man prove us all wrong including yourself! Keep it up!
@@LOOKMUMNOCOMPUTER I feel like if there were more folks out there like you, we would have more organs saved from the scrap heap. I'm sure you learned that organists and organ enthusiasts are very, VERY protective and traditionally minded of their instrument. "How could you bastardize it like that?!!" And they all clutch their pearls, to the point where it turns off people who would otherwise be more than interested in building, maintaining, and playing real pipe organs. At the end of the day, whether the traditionalists like this analogy or not, a pipe organ is merely a large box of tuned whistles. That's it. There are clever ways to arrange and control said whistles, but still - tuned whistles. It's not as scary or holy or whatever as people think it is.
One of the best project I follow. I hope to get time to visit your museum.
Thankyou very much Thomas that is awfully generous! That money will pay for the wheels and wood for organ console base me
Thinks. Thanks again! Yeah pop over if you do let us know. Cheers.
legend
If I wasn't in Ireland I'd legit try and come to your museum lol
Maybe someday haha
@@BenCos2018 That's practically next door lol I'd love to visit but I'm in the wrong hemisphere
@@ryanmccampbell7 lol not wrong
As a purely electromechanical device this must have been mind bending to wire up and configure. I just can't even conceive how purely mechanical organs achieved this level of multiplexing and demultiplexing of keys and pipes. The coding challenge for the software solution is clearly not to be sneezed at either and I reckon you have had plenty of sleepless nights thinking about all of this. Congratulations Sam for getting this marathon project just about over the line. You have found a way.
I've always loved the interface between the digital and real world actions instead of just graphic interfaces, hence the reason pinball games really enthral me. This keyboard and your channel really hit the spot.
I knew this was going to be a cool project - but this is turning out to be even cooler than I thought it would be. guess I like organs lol. Wish I had one near me I could play on the regular
This little improvised song starting at 14:05 immediately made me grin all over my face. Such a great project. I'm really curious when all is done and you play on it.
It felt so charming and genuine and musical while being facetious and simple. Should totally be a youtube short.
I've been plotting out the MIDI functionality of my organ, patiently waiting to see how you would go about rigging yours. You alerted me to some alternate solutions and also to some coding pitfalls that I would not have anticipated.
I'm definitely going to give that book a read!
I reckon: Don't try to count the MIDI on/off events. Just make an array of 127 Booleans for each channel. With each MIDI event in, XOR the arrays, and send out events only for the notes which have changed.
This is not as efficient computationally. 1980s hardware probably couldn't handle it. Which is why MIDI wasn't built this way. But modern microprocessors should be able to do it no problem.
Excellent work! Not sure if the orignial organ came with one, but you could add a tremulent stop to flucurate the wind pressure going to the pipes, this would create a vibrato effect and would sound great in combination with the salicional. You could probably create one from scratch if needed.
Please, @lookmumnocomputer we need a MIDI controlled VFD
I've never heard of this but it's a very cool idea. I wonder if anyone's applied the same idea to one of those electric chord organs.
**Wurlitzer Organ Company has entered the chat**
I’m 55 now (last month) and I see the absolute excitement you have for what you do. I was building circuit boards at 10 to control things from my ZX spectrum. You can do anything and it’s such a joy to watch. Your channel is just so much fun as I love organ music, organs and electronics. Simply heaven. If I get some money I will be a patrion.
The Aeolian company of New York and London (and a few other organ companies) made pipe organs that played themselves in the early part of the 20th century by using rolls like a player piano (pianola) Some people have restored some of these instruments and have made midi files that play instead of the fragile paper rolls. There are performances by some of the great organists of the era, and there are also fun pieces your audience might enjoy. I hope you pursue the possibility of getting some of the midi files for your project.
This drawing should totally be framed in the museum. No kidding.
it's all well and good for people to say the classic "OHHH YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOIN', SAM!!!1!" but you have put a LOT of effort into this beast
glad to see you're doing it justice, mate
thanks to them Sam does the impression and it makes me laugh a lot, I do enjoy it
It's tremendous the amount of work and effort you're putting in this project! If you don't know, if that thin pipes are really strings they have to be slightly out of tune with the other ones to create that sort of angelic effect. Good luck Sam!
Only if they're a celeste stop.
@@bigogle I think there is but it's not specified as a Celeste
I love your solution of having 3D printed inserts for the sockets in holes cut with a hole saw. Simple yet brilliant, and looks clean. Cutting accurate square holes in aluminium sheet is harder than it looks.
Easiest with a D-Sub punch, but you need several punches for the different lengths of connectors. Hole saw and a plastic plate is a good solution.
Your dedication to the critics was amazing. 🤣 I imagine this massive conversion to MIDI probably radically improved the reliability of this organ, too. All those fine little wires in the keyboards can work together rather than separately.
That's all pretty neat. There is one detail I noticed: Your choice of MIDI channels for the keyboards are reversed of the de-facto standard for MIDI organs. Most MIDI organs (I have six of them) has CH1 for the top keyboard, CH2 for the bottom keyboard, and CH3 for the pedals. The same configuration goes for most MIDI accordions where CH1 is right hand's buttons or keys, CH2 is chord buttons, and CH3 is bass buttons.
i did it that way cus i did it that way :D
makes sense to me counting up from the ground :D
organfairy you are special to have six organs
@@curtisnixon5313 The six organs are just the ones that has MIDI. I also have some without....
That'll be interesting when Sam gets a MIDI file meant for one of those organs and plays it on his...
I never thought about organs this much. So much going on. Really giving all your skills a workout. Good job!
I think about my organ alot, ha haaaa haaaa...........
I think you need some kind of award for giving this old organ not just a new life but a life in the 21st century.
Sam this series has been amazing. Thanks for the nod to Joan with the name and to the house with the paint scheme. Thanks for your ingenuity. Thanks for the blood, sweat and tears. Thanks for making it work but not overdoing the refurbishment. Thanks for being an old soul. Thanks for being a thoroughly decent lad and thanks for making me laugh my head off a bunch of times, but never more than the pretentious art critic quite a few videos back ;-)
I bought two electronic organs from the thrift shop as a first instrument in 2010 $35 for both. It was so fun taking them apart fixing some keys, learning about spring reverb and leslies, and making loud noises. I gave them back to the same shop when I moved. It makes me really happy to see that you have taken on this large task. I really feel like I'm going to love the music you make with this even more from having watched the journey.
CZcams has change society enough that people like Look Mum no Computer can make a living refurbishing a pipe organ. What a time to be alive.
When I was a young cabinetmaker the firm I was with used to make and modify organ cabinets for organ builders. I bought myself a set of TCT holesaws (and a Festo - now Festool - jigsaw) when they were then still very expensive (nearly 2 weeks wages) , because the organ builders kept on changing their minds where the wiring and piping were going to go, and we were constantly drilling new holes in our newly finished/refurbished organ cases! Tungsten carbide tipped holesaws leave a lot neater hole than the bimetal ones we used to use. I still have them, that I use quite a lot, but they are less than 1/3 of the price now than when I bought mine. (made in Taiwan/China, not Germany). Sam, if you ever need quite a lot of cash quickly, there's organ restorers who would pay you whatever you wanted for the skills you have built up over the course of this project. Well done!
I refer to the comment from last time that the blower makes funny noises. I recognize that sound from the times I visited customers as a service engineer. The lingering grinding noises are actually caused by the binding cord in the motor. The same cord that you also use to tie the cables. The cord sometimes breaks due to age and then starts to rub against rotating parts in a stubborn way.
Sam, your dedication to this project is phenomenal! So enjoying the old and new coming together and the challenges you solve.
Sam, Joan has to be smiling down from above at what you've done to keep this old girl alive! Love it!
Loved the FY protest song🤣. Really enjoying this series, fantastic stuff!
Thank you for sharing your passion. I have worked with electronics mostly my whole life. As a helicopter mechanic, cnc machinist, and aircraft flight control technician for Parker Hannifin. I am semi retired but still watch people playing with electronics on CZcams. This addiction is for life. Again thanks.
Man, I fucking love the sound of organs so much. When all the pipes come in, its honestly euphoric.
"When we were making a display display, for the display display!" Love it! :D
Thank you for choosing to display the display display in this video as explanation. It just displays your attention to detail.
This series of videos has done two things for me. First, it has reinforced my belief that your creativity knows no bounds. Second, it has made me realize just how complex organs are, even without your “midification”.
Just while watching this I thought of a slightly different way of coding your 'organ brain'. Rather than trying to count on/offs, I'd try to keep track of the state of each keyboard, and calculate what pipes should be on, then creating the necessary on/off commands to control the pipes.
So, you'd have bitmaps for which keys are depressed on each keyboard, bitmaps of which stops are depressed, and bitmaps of which pipes are playing. You listen to the midi channels/scan the stops and update the bitmaps. Whenever a bitmap is updated, calculate which pipes that combination of keys and stops should be playing.
Then you'd have two sets of bitmaps for the pipes: which pipes are currently playing and which should be playing (as calculated). Issue the note on/off commands as needed and then set the 'currently playing' bitmap to the calculated bitmap.
Hope that confuses everyone less than me!
(Anyway, I love how you've wired the midi up for this! Looks like it'll play nicely as both an organ and as a MIDI instrument.)
All good! Yeah your on the right track state machine has come up a couple of times it would certainly be quicker
This was my exact thought too-you'd be able to take advantage of the arduino's bit operators which would be both ram efficient (important when working with Arduino nanos) and fast. Use standard bit mapping techniques, run a diff, and send the appropriate midi messages.
Would be great to see Anna Lapwood come and play when its all finished 😀
Organist Anna Lapwood should come around to give this thing a go, she might even be able to help you figure out the switches and stuff
I love your MIDI solution to this instead of having everything hard wired. Leaves the parts as modules that can be easily re-coded and changed as desired. You could even do weird non pipe organ stuff, like adding your own stop that toggles coils repetitively instead of constant on when pressed to give a warbled effect(?).
He already made it talk so it shouldn't be hard to add that function in the finished setup.
You should really invite Anna Lapwood or another organist to come and check out the organ. Would make for a great collab. :)
YES! That would be great! 😃
Fun way to make money for the museum: put out a template with all the midi channels / stops, and a short video about what they sound like. Then let people pay you money to play their midi files over your organ, and record them there, and send them the wav of the recording. I’d do it!
Edit: just remember to always preview anything sent there. Look out for 1/512 notes or other absurdly fast repetition of the same note. Don’t wanna let the smoke out!
Normally i would say have my energy for this project, but in your case this compliment seems not necessary. You are amazing, Sir.
I freaking love this series, one of my favorite things on YT ever. I love the vivaldi covers you posted, I can't wait to see the videos where the museum has organists visit just so they can play!
Sam, you're doing an AMAZING job on this project for a right plonker...Don't EVER let the naysayers stop your enthusiasm and creativity! I still want to see @AnnaLapwoodOrgan visit the museum!
I absolutely love the almost tape-like instability of the pitch. It does need a good tune, but i'd keep the little fluctuations in there
Absolutely amazing project! You madman are going more all out in every EP than i think you would :D
Just need to come rising from out of the floor ,
with a smoke machine
And mirror balls
And Sam in a Phantom of the Opera mask
I watch lots of different stuff on youtube. Car restorations, music, science, engineering stuff, cycling, beekeeping etc etc. This is up there with the very best content - a project Binky of the organ world. Keep up the amazing work.
“It’s sorta coming together.” I think it’s absolutely remarkable!
It's also lovely to see Tony's skrewdrivers in pretty every organ video.
Also known as an extension organ because one rank of pipes will have pipes that extend further up or further down in pitch and the different stops in effect control what relative pitch you're playing. Generally that sort of organ tends to sound a bit thin and squeeky when all stops are used due to the double or triple or quadruple duty some pipes are doing.
Thanks!
Seems like this project has been a good learning experience for yourself as well. It's been fun seeing someone take such a different approach to a pipe organ, and make it an educational exhibit at the same time.
You are the weird, intense and somewhat unhinged genius in a mad max-like sci-fi film who builds advanced robots and computer systems out of scrap. I just love that you exist!!!
This series is just brilliant.. lost count of the number of skills you need to get get this working.. Amazing progress.. Well done..
What would be even cooler, now you have the brain, you can record all the key and button presses, and replay it. So you can have a professional come in to perform a few good tunes, which can then be played back to visitors if they so choose to hear the organ's full potential.
Wow, you really pulled out all the stops for this video! (I'll show myself out, no need to push!)
I'm stoked to see this project coming together so beautifully, keep it up man👍 cant wait to see whats next
What I like about this project is that its taking the old world of music and new world of music and bashing them together to bring history into the now and the future also into the past.
Also this instrument has some of the most beautiful overtones I've ever heard.
Should definitely add an all notes off button, a reset switch in case MIDI sticks. It would definitely help with troubleshooting I would imagine.
Thank you for taking the effort of recording in decent stereo, it really makes a difference.
I admire your patience. There is so much work (time so many repetitions of the same work), it's already exhausting watching you do it.
You have created a truly fine electronic brain!
Always so fascinating and insane 😊
Knowledge & skill absolutely exceptional!! Mechanical, electronic, programming, musical.... Incredible
Every video about this project just makes me more excited for the next one, so much cool stuff going on with this :D
14:00 made my day... thank you so so so much
I must say I really like this proper church organ sound without the usual reverb of the church. It's unique and especially the quieter pipes sound really nice. Would be nice for recording session.
This is the best clip in the series so far. Tears of laughter and tears of joy. Taking such disparate technologies and fusing them together to create such a thing of joy and sonic beauty. F@$k you to anyone that says otherwise. ❤
It all makes sense now. Highly appreciated.
Well... I'm impressed, it's turning out so much better than I expected when you started!
Great it took time to travel to go and dismantle the organ and transport back to the museum to work 11 months on you done well with other project's in-between the organ.
This is such a magical project!
Cool to see the OnShape shout-out... I've been using it as an engineering consultant since it first launched, its great for collaboration since clients don't have to download anything to see the work in progress! If your 3d printing projects get more complex, you could share the design!
Man, hearing you swear is amazing
Good policy on making it modular and moveable, someday you're gonna want that on the highest floor of your mad scientist tower for ideal lightning storm scenes.
Brilliant. Amazing work keeping this organ alive and giving it a new life. I totally agree with how you have re-built but not polished to perfection Joan's organ. It needs to show it's age and story. It is in good hands. Fascinating series to watch.
When you finally have this amazing project finished, we're going to need a video of the organ playing Bach's Toccata and Fugue in Dm by itself. With all the lights off in the room and maybe a smoke machine running in there too.
Incredible work, Sam. Keep it up!
If I had Elon Musk amounts of wealth I'd go to Atlantic City and ask how much money and how many people do they need to get that pipe organ up and running 100% ASAP? The pipe organ there may be the biggest in the world but it hasn't been fully functional since 1944. Some restoration work was done in 1998 but in 2001 the arena underwent a renovation, apparently by a gang of monkeys who cut wires, air lines, yanked out and stepped on pipes and just in general vandalized most parts of the organ. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boardwalk_Hall_Auditorium_Organ
Damn, was never thinking how organs works... Now I know how it's builds 🤣. Amazing project, amazing job.
This is such a great project. When I was younger, i played quite some time church-organ, too (not very good, though), today i'm a network-administrator, that likes to play around with microcontrollers, too, so this project tickles me in every possible way. really worth watching every second, and the outro-song is just amazing.
by the way, in my option every proper organ needs to have a "tutti"-switch.
back in the day, ours had one. Tutti basically means "turn on all the damn switches on to maximize volume, and blow out any dust of granny's ears". Most organists use this switch to transition from the moody, devotional phase right before service in a church to the explicit beginning of the service, often accompanied by some choir-action.
however, keep up the great work.
I've never understood what all the levers and knobs and why 2 keyboards as well as I do now! And I've tried to understand before. Everyone just always talks over your head about it. For whatever reason the way you broke it down in this video was the perfect way for me to finally understand what's going on! This has been such a great series.
This series is just utterly fantastic, the amount of progress you've made physically with this as well as your learning is outstanding. The end product will be amazing i'm sure.
When I was a boy, 150 years ago, I sang in the choir of the church. They had Installed a pipe organ the year before I started. These videos have taken me back to that time. Thank you ever so much.
this is probabbly the most technologically advanced organ in the world given the very mechanical based designs that are still used.
Man. You are the few CZcamsrs that make me smile by showing your passion for the subject. I love music and I’m programmer. Your skills are just amazing. Music, engineering, electronic and programming all at once
I am an INFJ, sigma empath with PTSD, ADHD with the ability to admit fault and learn from mistakes and my sources have revealed to me that this CZcams channel is the only obstacle preventing AI from killing us all. Thanks Sam, you are a true hero.
With a fully pneumatic the stops are slide values that you pull out or push in to affect the changes between the keyboard and the sets of pipes. Thus the source of the phrase "pulling out all the stops", which results in each key playing as many pipes as possible that causes the organ to be quite loud. 🤪
When you get it finally finished, PLEASE get Anna Lapwood to come play it! 😍
I've always wanted a VC system with a restore-able state. This is an amazing project.
Undoubtedly the funkiest organ on the web. Good work.
What a fabulous thing you have done, your effort and work is magnificent. I'm sure Joan would be very pleased with the results so far. I look forward to the next video.
Looks like you may have a great career in upgrading and automating church organs. Bring some of those instruments back to life.
Love your channel and the work you are doing to save this fantastic sounding pipe organ. What a wonderful sound those pipes have.
This thing is exactly where it needs to be and it's been great seeing this develop. Great tune at 14:12 too 😆 The best way to get back at people truly is with success.
I think Joan would have been sad to see it destroyed, she loved it. I think it brings Joy to her seeing it modernised and cherished by thousands of people.
The amazing journey continues ... Excelsior!
You’re actually a genius. Amazing work. My hat off to you.
So good to see the love-hate relationship with this project 🤣
Love hate is very accurate haha
"It does look a little bit scrappy" - with tidier wiring and soldering than anything I've ever made in my life. Amazing, Sam!