More Harley Davidson Dealerships Closing In UK
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- čas přidán 12. 09. 2024
- So last night I got the news that 2 more Harley Davidson dealerships are closing here in the UK, making it 5 closures in the past few months alone. What is going on?
#H-DCEO #HarleyClosingDown #DealershipsClose
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Whenever a CEO and the Directors of a company become more concerned about keeping investors happy, rather than customers and employees, it's the beginning of the end.
Just like Boeing
Stopping the old sportster didn't help.
The most affordable and brilliant piece of machinery Harley made for a large % of buyers. I have a 2020, great bike. Shame some donut/s made a decision to stop making them, or they just listened to nonsense EU "rules". HD was successful for breaking the "rules".
I agree 100%
Also the dynas 🤙🏍👏
Agreed, and getting rid of the dyna was stupid
Agree, good value and quality at price point, loved my 48
95% of all Harley Davidson motorcycles are still on the road. The other 5% managed to make it home.
Ha had 4 since 1989 went to work 40 miles there and back near every day rain or shine ,none of the 3 evos I had before I retired in 05 let me down .Did my own servicing .Currently have a immaculate 03 FLSTF As a retirement bike .That is totally reliable.
@@John-ob7dhStephenwilliams mistook HDs for RRs
I was waiting for someone to post that tired, tired old bollocks. Get some new material. I've decades on many H-Ds. Aside from some 1970s bikes they've been solid and reliable. Buy one. You might just love it.
Bellend
The old ones are the best
Just look at what Royal Enfield and the likes of CF Moto are doing, love them or hate them they will rule the world. Ignore them at your peril.
Love my RE Super Meteor 650, great value for money. Something Harley could have made as an affordable bike.
Royal Enfields are recently priced in third world countries like India and England. Where I live in the EU, a new Suzuki SV650 is the same price as a guerrilla 450. A three year "new" 350 is only a few quids cheaper. Not a serious competitor here. CFMotos are cheaper but not common.
Very true, I bought my E4 interceptor during covid, for a bargain £5600, it was exactly half the price in India at £2800 and change, shows what is costs to build a bike.
14:33 a mid season release will just be another colour/trim permutation of the existing bikes they have out on the market.
@@checker3694 the bikes made for the indian market dont have to comply with eu emission law, safety reg's & then there is the import tarrifs, hence the price difference. if you saw the price of a harley davidson in india your eyes would pop out...lol
The chicken are coming home to roost. The old guys are retiring for riding but the young guys are looking for value for money they don’t care about the brand.
Your right , the riders are all 50 or 60 plus now and retiring , government has stopped the kids taking up bikes with the CBT nightmare test if over 21 ? All over for bikes now .....
Judging by the BMI many of the people that ride Harleys, they're probably running out of customers due to natural wastage.
😂😂😂
You maybe should tell people BMI means Body Mass Index! 😭
ring leather chaps and a moustache is not a good look for 2024 , village people comes to mind and now a Gay CEO .....lol
A changing society, people lost interest in motorcycles, hard economic times, people have no money and are struggling to survive. People have no desire for high price Harley-Davidsons. There are more important things in life like trying to live comfortable.
Most of the motorcyclist in the UK are 60+ years old, the young people are not interested in them.
I think the largest contributing factor is the high price. For the price of most harley's you can get a cracking bike from the jap and euro bikes
they are luxury items ,expensive to buy and maintain ,when I grew up in the 70s bikes were the ''thing'' but not anymore
And a Woke CEO
@@denniswilliams2385A german CEO on a mission😮 - go woke go broke😂
Yesterdays technology at tomorrow's prices.
lie..todays technology is why the price is high and why a local dude cannot work on them
That’s not the problem. Many Harley’s are now very sophisticated. Some have IMU, lean sensitive ABS, traction control and all the good stuff.
@@clemfandango9534that’s why I wouldn’t buy one
@@martincvitkovich724 Bornslippy's comment is aimed at the fact HD mostly makes air cooled engines that produce around 120 HP and heavy frames.
Bornslippy's comment is aimed at the fact HD mostly makes air cooled engines that produce around 120 HP and heavy frames.
20 year olds can't afford Harley Davidsons. They are two expensive. I'm 40, and I can't afford a harley davidson
I am seventy years old and I can’t afford a Harley Davidson either.
I bought and old EVO for cash and the only HD i will own
It’s nothing to do with age, its do with disposable income.
HD Inc doesn't care.
I'm 40yrs old and I've had harleys since I was 21.......
The boycott against Harley here in the US is on fire. The company has relied on being American made as a point of pride amongst Harley owners. Most of the people that can buy Harleys are over 40 and have good jobs and grown or near grown children. The buyers are generally conservative politically. Harley has been slowly ignoring their core customers and have discontinued many of their more affordable bikes and have focused on the very high end expensive bikes. On the other end they have dropped the sportster for the sportster X which is supposed to appeal to younger riders. Now that they have been exposed as being in support of everything that their core buyers are against, it’s going to be disastrous for them. They have tried to backtrack saying that they will stop the DEI practices with in the company, but have not really addressed this issue. American buyers are even more furious after their half assed announcement and no apology to the Harley riders and supporters. I look for many dealers to go out of business here in the US. If they don’t get rid of the CEO and woke board members, they are going to take a beating. And they deserve it.
DEI or not, if H-D priced bikes like the Sport Glide or Road Glide @ $20k (and not $29k+) plus fees, they would be flying off the showrooms. Rational people could care less about social issues if the price is right. The problem is that the traditional H-D rider hates anything new or innovative that The Motor Company attempts, and Harley is trying to keep those people happy. That's why the company is hurting right now. Woke is not killing Harley; their core customer is.
@@algee0218”Social issues” as you call them, certainly do matter. Just look at what happened to Bud Light. Corporations should stay out of politics and social engineering and stick to their knitting.
@@algee0218that same bike in Europe or here in the UK you can add on another $10,000 on it
@@algee0218 Harley is not keeping their core customers happy & that is the point.
Harley was always a marketing success story. They started selling "modern retros" based on marketing intangibles when Japanese bikes started killing them on quality and performance. Pioneered the "lifestyle brand" of consumerism. The change in that strategy is simply because their customer base is now aging out of riding. Hence trying to appeal to a new generation with cheap HD X500s here in Oceania. Made in China, priced accordingly and modelled on the more capable XR1200 style of naked bike rather than a cruiser.
The bikes are simply too expensive , and the price of the Harley Davidson clothing is also too expensive . On top of that , financing is too expensive , as is dealer maintenance after purchase .
engineering and electricals/electronics are crap
@@ClovisPoint Engineering is fine, the only electrical problems I've had was with a Triumph Scrambler I recently sold.
@ClovisPoint not as bad as shite triumph
3 years ago higher end softails were 17 to 18k, now 21 to 23k. There your problem, when your retailing bikes in the twenties, you better have something special.
Yeah, inflation. Covid spending was outrageous, and you also have most economies centralizing.
Sorry, all prices are up 20-50% since covid and it will never go down. Proper economic policy can easily drive up wages by the same rates, but left wing government and high taxes are the opposite of that.
I paid thirteen-four out the door for my brand-new FLHT 27 years ago. Over 110,000 trouble free miles. All hail Keihin.
Spot on, I can confirm this as I bought my Breakout in 2019 for around £17,000 - £18,000 ... now the Breakout is around £24,000 - £25,000
We all know what is going on with HD I have ridden HD since 2002 when I had a Buell Cyclone M2, several sportsters and a Pan America later the issue with HD is the following.
1, The got rid of the entry level bike in the EVO Sporsters which they didn’t have too it can pass EU5 and most likely EU6 laws as the Chinese version has shown.
So the £6-7k entry bike and secondhand versions are gone which were super popular in the U.K.
2, The new CEO has implemented this we are premium so we can rip people off vision into the company and priced most current bikes out of reach of normal motorcycle buyers in the hunt for profit!
3, They rushed the REV MAX range release and got the software and wiring looms done in the cheap which have ruined the reputation of basically good machines (now) this will not come back so a lame duck now.
They also didn’t release the Bronx which was a stupid mistake as most bikes bought are the naked middleweight class like Street Triple etc.
I have no faith in the current CEO or the bored of directors of HD and the dealerships are suffering because of their decisions.
Harleys at ridiculous prices, that's why they he dealers are going to the wall.
Money is tight for most people and Harleys have become ridiculously expensive. Most UK riders have a Harley as a weekend sunshine toy, so having one sat in the garage for most of the year is no longer affordable. Servicing is also ridiculously expensive as are parts and accessories. All in all it’s the perfect storm. Finally the Owners Groups have been hijacked by the dealerships, the old autonomy has been lost, with HOG being more of an extension of the marketing network, rather than an owners group. I had a Dyna some years ago, can’t see me ever owning one again. I have a RE Super Meteor 650 and it gives me everything a Harley would.
Harleys are no more expensive to service than any other brand.
Triumph are ridiculous!
Why are they closing? It's because of the cost of upgrading their stores to meet the HD HO re-branding requirements. I spoke to a dealer principal in Australia (won't mention which one) who said that the cost of re-branding the store to HD requirements would cost him 10 years of profits. When he enquired to a real estate agent how much he would get to sell the property or rent it out, it was significantly more than he would make selling and servicing HD motorcycles and merchandise. When you are a long-time dealer reaching or at or past retirement age, why would you work the next 10 years to give all your profits to HD HO? HD are not interested in making and selling lots of motorcycles at small margins, unfortunately, this is what many consumers want, more affordable quality motorcycles - and this is why smaller capacity bikes like the CFMoto 450, Himalayan 450 and Triumph (you mentioned) are selling affordable quality machines. Noting that HD is MIA in this popular and growing market segment.
You are so right. It's a real shame for all the staff , owners and local HD riders. Expensive bikes are just not selling right now. My local Honda dealer is selling a decent amount of sub £8000 bikes but not a single Goldwing all year.
In america, nearly 3/4 of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck with no savings and wages are going up at a much slower rate than inflation. Americans have no money, because they have a horrible government
In Europe, a fair premium price for an entry level softail would be around 15-17k euros.(passenger seat and footpegs included). Above this is just nonsense.
Sad to hear, definitely the price of bikes by Harley is getting a bit silly, and for the company to push bikes onto the dealership without them being ordered is putting a nail in their coffin
Pushing the extra bikes puts stress on dealers to sell. If I was a dealer, I would be putting bikes at no mark-up. Sell as many as possible, even at a loss
@@logangodofcandy how can a dealership survive running at a loss? These are independently owned franchisees running out of loss. It’s just a race to the bottom.
The price is getting silly when they pay domestic wages and people freak out when they try to ship some production overseas
Paid £285 for a full service at my local HD dealer only to get an advisory note saying the air filter needs cleaning .
I stopped going to those stealerships long ago..
Sad
😮
Time grab a biccy while got the lid off ? or have things moved on from my day ? Or is old age playing tricks on me. was it all just a dream about, The English Tea Company new Tea caddy...More tea Mr Rayborn Trans-ATLANIIC not WOKE Trophy Commemorative range ...pressed tin in white orange and black Very AMF Siamesed exhaust pipes.. Did run the Not so "Supa5/1" once to often in the shed with the door shut....Ying Ding Ding Ding Ying
It’s sad every time any business closes its doors and people lose jobs. Last night I overheard a conversation at the pub between 3 people I don’t know. One of them was saying that he remembers when their parents had normal blue collar jobs and could afford replacing the family car from time to time and go for holidays a couple of times per year. And now they can barely pay the bills with even better jobs. They were a few years younger than me, so they were probably the teenage kids of those guys 30 y/o guys riding 883s when I was in my early 20’s… and yeah, he was right. I managed to do the same, but just barely and the younger gens are struggling to pay the rent.
The rich people at the top are out of touch with the consumer. I bought a brand new Sportster in 2006 for $6,500. Then I bought a low mileage Dyna in 2016 for $7,000. I've enjoyed riding Harley-Davidson for the past 18 years but if I buy another new bike it'll be another brand for less than $10,000.
A Honda 750 is looking really good right now.
All their prices have become crazy even down to the t-shirts. I like to checkout the local shirts when I travel and maybe pick one up. Last year I went into the dealership in London and the cheapest shirt was £50 or more. For a t-shirt! Something that for years has been £30-£35 now over £50? I walked out empty handed.
Too expensive and limited, ugly colours. I can’t get a Low Rider in blue and to get one is red I need to pay a $6K premium for a limited edition.
colours are ghastly
That’s what’s happens when you over price motorcycles 👍🇬🇧 & Birmingham closed a couple of years ago 👍 & charging £150 hour 😡😡
Those are the same silly prices that have been destroying the car market in the last few years….
Over pricing.
Can't sell out of date tech on name only for ever.
I read where Harley Davidson is making 3,500 dollars per unit selling to the dealership and so the dealership has to make money to , overpriced motorcycles is the problem
It seems that HD in Japan are being targeted for legal action due to the pressure that HD are placing on dealers to meet quotas. They were threatening to remove their ability to sell Harleys unless they meet the quotas. This resulted in dealers buying the bikes and storing them. In order to maintain cash flow, the dealers are selling these bikes with discounts...impacting their margins. The Japanese authorities deem this to be unfair practice by Harley Davidson.
Go Woke Go Broke - My local HD dealer is Scottsdale, the biggest dealership in the world. I turned up on Monday morning as a few months ago I scheduled a service for my FatBoy. Dealership was closed.....nobody called me to tell me the hours had changed. They are now closed on a Sunday YES SUNDAY and Monday. Ironically i bumped in to my service advisor at the cinema and we chatted for a bit. He said "HD are f**king up man" they employed a woke CEO and all the staff and customers hate his guts as being a Taliban of sustainability doesn't align with their customer base.
Customer base is generational, the next generation is not aligned to the base as the base is dying out, they are doomed if they don't change. The bikes are far too expensive for the quality and most export bikes are not made in the USA.
Nothing to with woke - just crap old bikes.
@@stefansliwka2773 You are a special kind of stupid and obviously forgot what it’s like to be young.. Harley has really never had a generation when they were young and just getting out on their own to find their own way.. If you told me 20 years ago I’d be sporting a geezer glide I would have laughed in your face….
Younger generations have always been different and took some life experiences to figure things out.. If you really payed attention the newest generation is starting to push back on all this programming crap being pushed in the public school and seeing all the regressive policies are why everyone is struggling..
Unless people have a wealthy family they aren’t really buying new bikes and they are more focused on speed. When they get tired of leaning over a gas tank, gain some life experience they will come around like the Harley riders of today did..
Nothing to do with politics.
Biking is becoming damn expensive.
Oh FO@@colincampbell4261
Far too expensive for what they are.
Besides all the topics you mentioned Lind also closed their BMW dealership in Norwich which suggests to me that Lind are in trouble. BMW are not yet having the same problems that Harley are but with BMW prices edging over £20k for a Bike i think they'll soon find their sales dropping.
Harley in Preston, Lancashire also closed 3 years back.
The majority of Harley owners of the last 30 years have been middle-class professionals of the baby-boomer generation. Those baby-boomers benefitted from cheap housing and comprehensive pension schemes; they have disposable income.
By contrast, the younger generation have expensive housing costs, whether renting or buying and a future of financial uncertainty. They are not going to be buying a Harley. The cost of some Harleys would constitute a hefty deposit on a house! They do not have disposable income to spend on a Harley.
The modern Harley-Davidson is basically a toy for the weekend for the Baby-Boomers. How appropriate. I rarely see a Harley parked outside Sainsbury's, or in the factory or office car-park. In fact, I never have.
Harley-Davidson have simply priced themselves out of the market and for thirty-plus years they have not planned for the future by making 'entry-level' models to lure in the youngsters and therefore establish brand-loyalty. They have simply relied on their existing customers, the Boomers. But that generation is dying off and there's nothing to replace them.
I have two friends who have Harleys. One owns a Financial Services company, the other is a Civil Engineer and Property Developer. Both Boomers.
But the biggest problem in the fact that Harley has failed to nurture the next generation of customers, is that to the youngsters, Harley-Davidsons are just 'not-cool'. It's an 'old man's' bike.
That's it. A fatal error, I suggest. Harley have been for so long out of financial reach, so long out of touch, that to a thirty-something, they have simply dropped off the radar.
Triumph, on the other hand, has made an amazing rise from the ashes over the same period of Harley's gentrification; also Royal Enfield and of course the Japanese manufacturers have always been on point with building their markets and attracting the 'yoof'. And they all make cool, affordable bikes! Harley don't!
These days, Harley's look like larger versions of mobility scooters. In fact, you can even buy mobility scooters that emulate the look of a Harley! Plot lost!
Two of my sons, both in their thirties, ride bikes. Number 2 rides a Hinckley Bonneville. Number 3 rides a Guzzi V7, both decent bikes, with loads of character, and (quelle surprise) much cheaper than any Harley.
Harley management needs to gather around the espresso machine and take a deep lung-full.
I hope Harley-Davidson will pull through.
Love and peace.
You've absolutely nailed it with your reply.
Excellent comment. I'm 67 and have just bought a V7.
@@stephenb134yes, I’m looking closely at the V7 Classic, looks just what I’d like to ride 👍
I recently had a Triumph written off. Instead of buying another expensive bike I downgraded my budget and bought a 13 year old Tiger 800 instead. That was due to the economy and finances. Harley are just too expensive. On top of that people are moving away from the cruisers they sell and many who do buy new will buy a more capable adventure style bike.
The end of last year HD dealership of Bridgewater ,Cardiff and Jersey stopped doing Harley's and I understand it was because HD didn't want other motorcycles brands in the same showroom, which seems madness.
Thats correct. Its difficult to make money from being a single make dealer
Swansea HD at m&p got Enfield in the same showroom as harley
My favorite dealership closed down recently. It was outstanding and had a fantastic reputation. The other ones within an hour of me absolutely are atrocious. Rude, pushy, lie about simple things. I refuse to spend any money there (2 dealerships). I’ve also noticed dealerships all over the USA closing down.
Too expensive for what they are. Lack of a proper Sportster. It’s just ridiculously against the market.
I have just bought a one year old Fat Boy. I was looking at lots of different bikes and it was noticeable how quiet the Harley showroom was compared to Triumph and BMW.
I can afford a Harley but I do not want to spent to much money on a bike and I am happy with my versys 650, better equipt for long travelling on smal roads.😊
harley upped the price , cut the model range , tried telling us what to buy , rather than making the bronx which people want , and the livewire mess ;; typical gone wrong big corporation ;;
I’m new to riding at 49, and plenty of people I know don’t want ridiculous prices and that counts Harley’s out… when you look at Triumph and Yamaha, they are much better value….. also this is happening in the car sector as well…why buy BMW when Kia do such a good job..
The Lind group ( Norwich showroom) started as a BMW dealer, then added Harley A few years later. Yes, it has closed down.
I’ve just sold my Lowrider ST after 9 years of Harley ownership. The likelihood is that I won’t be replacing it with another Harley for the foreseeable future. I bought a Triumph. But just go and look at the offerings at entry level from Royal Enfield, CF Moto, Benelli and Voge as examples. My local HD dealership in Cardiff closed and those latter brands have replaced the Harley’s on the showroom floor. Great value and the choice of new riders, not highly expensive machines.
I’m new to bikes and when see the offerings from Yamaha and triumph I’d never buy a Harley
I love the ST though I'm no lifelong devotee. Why did you sell it?
@@farric1 The bike was good, but I had fancied going back to a 24 Pan Am but for all the bullshit about HD resale values blah blah, they offered very poor p.ex, I got more against a Rocket 3. I was also conscious that you can buy a lot more bang for your buck elsewhere. I’ve been disillusioned with HD for some time now.
When you're selling boutique motorcycles you need to sell them from boutiques - not large solus dealerships.
I believe Honda were the first franchise to insist on solus franchises, but that works for Honda because they have a wide range of products. A Honda dealership may not sell many Goldwings, but they can sell lots of small bikes and stay afloat.
Harley Davidson is a prestige, boutique brand. Insisting on solus dealerships with high corporate image standards severely eats in to dealer profits and when things go badly dealerships go bust - this is just a fact of life.
I'm seeing a few Ducati dealerships springing up and I fear some of them will go the same way.
Although Scrambler is more of a price-range product for Ducati, it probably won't sell in big enough numbers to keep a dealership afloat in hard times.
Triumph seem to be getting bolder as well. They have a wide range from 400-2,500cc now and frown on multi-franchise dealerships, it seems.
But I'm also hearing quite a few stories about poor servicing standards, high servicing costs and disappointing warranty support from solus dealerships of all franchises.
The corporate image costs of running a Triumph, Ducati or H-D solus dealership must be huge, so it's no surprise that service customers are screwed because you can only ever sell so many bikes and the money has to come from somewhere.
I don't think the manufacturers/importers care that much. They have a constant turnover of dealerships and they know that there'll be enough owners who will travel to buy a prestige motorcycle.
Buyers of prestige motorcycles probably have both the money and won't keep their bike long enough to worry about servicing costs, either.
As ever, the buck stops with us: the buying public.
So long as we are prepared to travel 100 miles+ to buy the latest/greatest bike of our desires, this cycle of growth & bust will continue.
It's not the state of the market, it's not the cost of the bikes - it's our own greed we have to blame.
Reading HD is closing because they dont understand customer service. I live 6m from the Reading dealership but travel to Sykes (75m) to buy my bikes & service.
Sykes: brilliant dealer, bought my softail slim from them in ‘21, faultless service
@@nickmurray721 picking up my 2024 Lowrider ST from them tomorrow. We have bought 7 bikes from them because Reading never looked at the long game and build a loyal customer base
Parts are too bloody expensive for what they are too
Preston closed at the same time as Manchester and Chester, Jersey closed at the beginning of this year.
Preston closed long before Manchester and Chester.
Just think about that the ceo of Harley Davidson said that they want to be electric by 2030. in this context it makes sense that they don’t bring out new motorcycles because of time being left and furthermore the E5+/E6 would need some changes as well wouldn’t be long enough to make money considering the coast of doing so. Indian seems to go another way and holds on to gasoline operating bikes and invest quite some money to do so. Another thing is how expensive it is to get a license and insurance for a bike. There won’t be a lot of money left for a 15-40 k bike anymore nor for high maintenance coast Harley ask for
Lind closed both Harley and BMW dealerships in Norwich with very little notice. Both manufacturers have lost touch with their customers finances or limitations. Just too expensive to buy and service. Other makes more real world with their prices.
Same with Ducati... The cheeky bastards want £38k for the Multi RS.
I bought my Dyna second hand from my local dealership. They were rubbish. Once they had my money they didn’t want to know, it was MOT tested and sold in an unroadworthy condition, and they only rectified that when I honestly filled in the HD UK customer service survey, suddenly the dealership were interested in putting things right. I rarely go there, they’re overpriced and only interested in the money. Most of the clothing is made in China and ridiculously expensive, they don’t have basic spares in stock, but they sell cocktail shakers and dog bandannas. I get my bike serviced by an HD trained independent now.
WEF... "You will own nothing and be happy". WEF you will live in a 15 minute city, if you keep a good social credit score. couple that with 4 years of small business shut downs... it is all adding up not just Harley it is happening to a lot of companies.tip of the ice berg... this has been happening since 1913.
Yes, very true...I'm 60 yrs old now and I've been watching everything..I mean everything go from bad to worse.
It's heartbreaking to watch these politicians and banksters destroy nations all over the world for power and greed.
I've heard Harley has a want to setup Harley owned distribution and maintenance centers eliminating dealerships completely eliminating the middle man. Same for some other brands.
Warrs in South London shut down last year
Really ? They were still open last Saturday when I was in there 😎
@paulharrison8155 in Chelsea yes, in Eltham no 😱
Moco is demanding 5 Mastertecs per dealership. Not enough people about to do the jobs.
@paulfreespirit Yes the Eltham one was where the mechanic worked who was shot and killed in a Angel hit.
@@John-ob7dh that sounds murky….
I am in the demographic that HD say is their average customer. I recently bought a new bike and i didnt even consider a Harley even though i like them. The things that put me off were price, value for money, capacity and potential thieving. Main things were value for money (which i think is poor) and capacity, i wanted to go down to a mid sized bike and ended up with a 650cc which is perfect for me
lack of funds means thee bikes are left in the garage so the main income of any dealership is not being used and that is the workshop , then the merchandise and then the bikes , then the accountant and if a big group the shareholders want a bigger return each year ,
I've also seen a lot of Harley riders chopping in their bikes at Triumph dealers going for the 1200 twins and rocket 3 models .
Add to this the older aged riders are going for lighter more manageable bikes like the Royal Enfields 350 and 650 this leaves Harley with a shrinking customer base and few new riders and younger riders actually attracted to the brand
12 grand entry level, 15 grand for a Sportster and a grand shy of 40 grand for a top of the range Glide? Ridiculous prices by any standard. Harley have been dining out on their name for a long time and people would suck up inflated prices but that name isn't the same as it once was, especially in the UK, where I think Harley aren't considered cool or fashionable any more. And Harley keep pushing the prices up. I can get a new Royal Enfield and a Triumph for the price of a Sportster. I sold my Superglide a couple of years ago, and I'm in the market for a new bike, but there is no way I would spend that big on a motorbike so Harley isn't even a consideration.
I think it depends on region. Here in Taiwan the flagship store in Taipei and the one in South Taiwan. Harley sells very well. Here the average age of a Harley Davidson is between 20 and 40.
You say expensive? I laugh. The price we pay in Taiwan for a Harley like a Road Glide. We can buy 2 in the UK for the same price.
The best years Harley had in Taiwan was during Covid. There has been such a demand since 2022. They Harley Davidson has had to get bikes sent from Singapore and Malaysia to meet demand.
So, Taiwan has a great economy. What's your point?
@@logangodofcandy As I said it depends on region.
Harley's competition is the likes of Rolex and Mercedes. They're not doing too well either.
Where are you getting your info from? The FT says Mercedes had solid performance for the first half of the year. Rolex is doing tremendously well. So is Ducati. Harley are trying to be a luxury brand but is not seen that way.
My local( within walking distance) dealer also sales Royal Enfield . I have been seeing a lot of RE on the roads here so I think the dealership is doing ok. I bought a used 2018 Sport Glide and have had really good service from them. Hoping they stay in business as the next nearest dealer is about 30 minutes away and don't have as good of staff or mechanics.
From my limited experience with Harleys, I think it has a lot to do with the quality and reliability of the bikes. Not what they used to be. Very sad.
I have 1 suggestion for you, if you own any HD Stock shares, sell now before HD stock shares take a free-fall in value
My local HD dealer reduced the size of their showroom by 75%, increased the size of their workshop by 50% and took on a Japanese brand that is displayed in the other 25% of the area. They also increased the price of labour from £80 per hour to £120 per hour. I've recently had a dealing with them and wasn't that happy with the service I received. So my decision is that I wont give them any more custom. I am getting on a bit now and I'm thinking of moving my, bought new, 20 year old bike on and that will be me finished I'm afraid.
£80 service is pretty damn high, too. Odds are they have plenty of work.
It boils down to one thing, Go Woke, Go Broke. When companies invest more in politics and less in the people who buy their products, they will eventually go broke because the buying base will not support them. If there is no demand, then those who provide supply will have to stop.
Hi. I love Harley Davidson and appreciate their quality but the pricing and marketing are all wrong. I bought a Sportster Iron 883 in 2015 for £7000 and loved it. I spent money on accessories and upgrades but now you have to spend £10-13k on the entry level models depending on discounts. This is crazy. Stick to simple, cool and affordable bikes to get people into the brand. Then loyalty follows. They will upsell to better and more expensive bikes as they grow older. They’ve completely gone the wrong way in my opinion. Shame.
Great news, less noisy motorbikes on the road !
If the Harley board was paid less prices could be lower , credit crunch has hit luxury brands . Should sell some smaller cheaper models and a single cylinder off road bike !
Costs are a big factor affecting motorcycling. Not just the upfront price of new bikes. Maintenance too. My local Suzuki dealer quoted £432 to check the valve clearances on my Intruder! My first bike back in 1978 cost less than that.
I got stitced with £80 brake pads that can't fit. My nearest dealer made it unrealistic to prove.
I just won't go back.
Wouldn't buy anything they have made since last century.
Wouldn't recommend for anyone unless you have money to burn.
I think it's various things going on.. Credit crunch age demographics etc.. My local Triumph Dealer went bust after 30 plus years trading... When they got the franchise they had to spend 250k refurbing the showroom to their corporate requirements. Yamaha demanded similar which they couldn't do, even though they were Yamaha main dealers they had to withdraw from the franchise.. So are the manufacturers demanding too much? Caravan dealers have gone bust too recently.
i would say a lot of it is corp. around here some dealers are shutting down because corp is making them do a muti million renovations and they are not selling the bikes to afford that
I bought and owned a brand new softail standard in 2004. 20 years ago 😮.
Harley don’t make lighter air cooled motorcycles that sound like they used to.
Everything they make now is big and flabby and there is no way to cut the weight out.
Indian royal Enfield and triumph have eaten their lunch 😮
My local Triumph dealer sold a fair few of the 400 model, all to 45 plus year olds (roughly). The dealer still went under. I was on the Dave Day ride and it was the same thing. Only a handful were under that sort of age.
young lad here , qouted 16 THOUSAND POUNDS for insurance on pan america
HD have made their new bikes too complicated, meaning a lot of independent mechanics no longer have the necessary kit to work on them. I’ve got both a 2015 street bob and a 2013 sportster, and the pre canbus sportster is much more reliable than the overly computerised street bob. It’s not just the sales that are destroying them, it’s the servicing and repairs that are becoming more difficult.
Buy a small bike as first bike, tend to stick to that brand unless they have a bad experience
In 2021 I purchased a brand-new road king special for AU$35,000. Today the bike cost AU$43,000. And it is the exact same bike they have not changed one thing. The parts and accessories are also way overpriced. The younger generation with big home loans and high interest rates cannot afford them. And rich people they buy Ducati and BMWs.
Harley profited from WW1 and in between WW2 sales and profits dwindled.during WW2 sales were on the up again ... wonder if this will change again in the near future... Ordinary folk need food and fuel for the coming winter.... Luxury is too costly these days....
You have to follow where the money is, Harley have decided on a course that they wanted, not what the trends were saying. Ducati are a premium brand, they have a wide range of bikes to allow more people buy into the brand......they even departed from their v twins, they kept up with the times and it's worked. Where's Harley going ?
Im 30, I'm buying an 07 Dyna for 7.5k from a non Harley dealer. No chance in hell could i afford the 10k they'd ask at a main dealer or the 13k they'd ask for a new model. It'd just be a dumb financial decision, no two ways about it.
Money is becoming VERY tight for most people these days, so the cost of a very "Premium" and costly to run (insurance, maintenance, even fuel consumption) bike is no longer affordable. There appears to be a slow, but nevertheless steady move to having a "useful" bike rather than just a "fun" bike for w/e or holiday touring.
I moved to a scooter (Burgman 400) a while ago, and have recently upgraded to the Kymco AT 550 Premium. Simple (so cheap) to service, ergonomically superior riding position, excellent frontal protection, and very good economy (60mpg at 60 mph), yet with the power to get to 60 in 7 seconds, and a top speed of around 115 mph, all on a 550 cc twin motor. Lots of under seat storage, and with a top box this machine is both a highly utilitarian commuter, and a reasonably capacious tourer.
I have had a poor experience with Lind Newmarket with the dealer principle wanting to pick a fight he has not got the intelligence to win. Brands like HD have lost connection to the biker and we have moved to the same corporate P&L approach as the car market. I suspect we are going to see more dealers closing
When LIND opened their Watford H-D dealership with Triumph next door I thought they'd got their strategy right. Having both dealerships under one roof made complete sense given that they aim at a different customer base and with the extensive Triumph range it would probably help support the lower sales of H-Ds. Well, it appears that hasn't worked well enough and now we have this closure announcement. However, it is reported that Watford will transition their H-D showroom to Ducati later this year and this has led to some job security for their staff, although Ducati are not one of the cheapest brands either so again maybe their Triumph sales will offset lower Ducati sales.
My hometown dealer from years ago , were the ones who sold me a new Deluxe in 2018.
Great Service, Techs.
A small museum with local history.
New Owners, New misspelled franchise name, New Service. Installed wrong switch and did not verify functionality.
Closed soon after.
Same owner of the franchise where I was sacked yesterday.
About one person sacked a month now.
Happy to be gone! Emancipated.
Free at last.
LET THEM CLOSE.
The biggest shocker for me was Jersey Harley losing their Harley franchise; it was my go to for Harley bits (as it was for many people). I was under the impression that they didn't want to relinquish the franchise, they had it taken away from them because they weren't selling enough bikes
"you own nothing"...step by step..grrrreets,
Klaus S
Another point:
This idea that younger buyers will remain brand-loyal and age-in to bigger, more expensive bikes is a myth
When I was selling BMW Motorcycles in the 90s and early 2000s, we'd get the young guys on sports bikes (usually 600s) drop by and take tbe piss out of the 'old man' bikes we sold.
And to be fair, BMW bikes largely were that back then.
We'd laugh and say: 'see you when you grow up, Sonny' and we were right: those giys would be back a few years later to buy a GS or something.
There are of course a few who remain brand-loyal for life, but so few that it doesn't make sense building a marketing policy around them.
Lynd have more dealerships than they're officially allowed to have.
They're simply slimming down which allows more focus on their top dealerships and enables them to hit newer targets more easily. Simple as that.
No great loss I've been riding motorcycles all my life I've had over 30 different machines none of which were Harley Davison..
Maybe if you’d bought a Harley you wouldn’t have had so many bikes.
@@mdf1671yeah, because buying a Harley would have put him off owning motorcycles for life.
@@jonm7272 good one. I’ll give you that.
To each their own. Mine is a joy to ride.
@@jonm7272 ha good one. Fair play I’ll give you that.
Great video 👍 The same business model as snap on plus it's a franchise business ,when in doubt go up market happens to lot's of brands of car's and bike etc.😊
I think the same is going to happen with Japanese dealerships. Bikes don't seem to be selling. I'm watching a couple of Kawasaki ZX6R's on eBay, and they've been there for weeks. I used to put a bike in the paper, or MCN, and it would sell within days.
Many reviews of dealership experiences in the US indicate that the workmanship during services, the repair of none functioning parts under warranty, the cost of these and the frequency of them, and the eff you jack attitude of the dealerships in general are a complete turn off for people who can't do their own tinkering of fettling, who may even be rusted on HD owners. They are becoming dislousioned with the inherent patriotism required to own a HD but getting nothing for it, and are trying other brands.
in the Northern ireland i think its relatively rare to see a harley on the road now. Don't get me wrong, you do still see them at bike meets and coastal runs on good days but they make up like 10% of the bikes if even. Most of the older riders who I know that used to ride harleys have moved on to adv tourers.
Since 1998 when I bought my first Harley, 6 local to me Harley Davidson dealerships have closed.
Wheels International, Wayside Harley Davidson, Silverstone Harley Davidson, Tagger Harley Davidson, Three Rivers Harley Davidson and Stadium Harley Davidson.
Since then I have used Black Bear Harley Davidson, or as they are now known, Newmarket Harley Davidson, since they are now my local dealership, even though they are 56 miles away.
Fortunately for me they are the best dealership I have used, so hopefully they will stay open and keep servicing my 2000 Twin Cam, as I have no intention of selling it for anything newer, as nothing Harley make appeals to me, they now seem to be run by accountants cutting more and more for what you get but still asking sky high prices.
And as for the Harley Davidson management, for me they haven't got a clue. By closing down Buell when they had a first class product that could have brought many younger buyers in to the Harley Davidson brand, and then getting rid of the Dyna and Softail range was two of the most stupid decision they have made.
As a Harley owner myself, even I've seen a massive increase in bikes similar to mine in the showrooms. In the space of 4 years since purchasing, I've seen the same model bike (brand new) as my own increase by £6,000 - £7,000 and in some cases £10,000+. It will deter many owners from trading in, and it has certainly deterred me because I'm not prepared to purchase the same bike I have for £6,000 - £7,000 more. Plus I think you're right, there is an issue now where young riders are either priced out or there simply isn't a model that is lower in CC, or even stylish to them to attract them towards the brand. Harley has basically cornered itself.
Interesting stuff dude, as a non HD owner but rider and ex Victory owner.. I follow Spite’s corner and Different Spokes 📺 and their commentary is spot on.. for me the failure to release the Bronx was telling and why I don’t own a HD, to me HD is the canary in the coal mine for big capacity ICE bikes, which is sad but as a fifty something rider I feel we are dying breed 😞
A better way to look at this is ‘why did the big HD dealerships rise up in the first place in 90s, 2000s?? cheap debt, baby boomers and Fat Boy in Terminator 2..
Times a changing.. ‘no one laughs at Tuco’ 🤠
All the best, happy riding
Jon
CB1100RS, XSR700, 85 Vmax
P.S. I think impact of Royal Enfield can’t be underestimated and response by other firms to cover that 659cc and under market.
Harley has been slowly failing for years with there prices. It’s a very slow death if they carry on this route
I recently replaced my tyres. The local Harley dealership wanted double the price just for the tyres not including fitting. Needless to say I took my business elsewhere. They shoot themselves in the foot by being greedy.
I bought a Yamaha dragstar classic 2002 ,with just 3500 miles on the clock ,cost me 3600€ over here in Ireland ,in as new condition ,Harley Davidson in Dublin haven’t got anything under 10k.was looking for an Indian scout,but no one had one for sale over here.
In the Netherlands there are still 8 harley dealerships . I have not heard of closing down harley dealerships in the Netherlands. My dealer is in Amersfoort , it is 80 KM from my home. The entry nightster is 19000,00 in the Netherlands. I will go to my Dealer and ask of he heard something about closing dealerships in The Netherlands.
Dudley Perkins oldest dealership in the world, family run in San Francisco closed last month.