Wrong Ways To Introduce A Character - Troy DeVolld
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- čas přidán 29. 01. 2023
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Producer Troy DeVolld, widely regarded as a leading authority on the reality television production process, boasts some four dozen credits spanning THE OSBOURNES to Food Network's BIG BAD BUDGET BATTLE and bestselling books REALITY TV: AN INSIDER'S GUIDE TO TELEVISION'S HOTTEST MARKET and AND ANOTHER THING: A BEGINNER'S GUIDE TO THE TELEVISION NOTES PROCESS. He's contributed to or been quoted in publications like TIME and NEWSWEEK and been seen on TODAY and SHOWBIZ TONIGHT. He's a 1996 graduate of Full Sail University and the ninth inductee into its Hall of Fame.
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My favorite Bond moments are those rare times when he seems in over his head - in Goldfinger, Connery's panic and clumsiness when he realizes he has no idea how to defuse atom bomb - in Casino Royale, both Craig and Mikkelsen are in over their heads, as is Green - making that film uniquely complex and emotionally moving
Maybe a hot take but I always want to show the FUNCTION of the character in their world. Is he/she helpful? ruthless? annoying? an outcast? the relationship to their society says alot about a realistic character
That’s a good tip
Walter White in Breaking Bad and Saul Goodman in Better Call Saul are brilliant examples of character introductions
Both amazing shows
Walt’s death is also great
YES
From Saul's very first scene in BB, I loved the character; every line and its delivery were perfect and hilarious.
At the time, I was thinking, "God, I hope this lawyer guy is in more episodes!" And he ends up having his own series!
Walter White’s cancer is one of the real flaws I thought was good. That is why he became evil, he had to do he could overcome the cancer. Then he became the villain and Hank became the hero. I hated it when Hank died earlier than he should have, but it opened the door for Walt to redeem himself and become good again in his last moments. I totally understand how people might think the ending was anticlimactic though.
Tried watching Better Call Saul. This show is not nearly as great as Breaking Bad.
I love how Quentin Tarantino and James Cameron introduce their characters, mainly for Pulp Fiction and Terminator 2.
Masterful.
Another few examples i really like are the setups in WHEN HARRY MET SALLY and KISS KISS, BANG BANG.
Omg THANK YOU for this. Im a self taught writer and have one graphic series while working on a few other new IPs im developing.
This literally affirms my intuition on how ive been starting my books.
Truly thank you so much
Glad it was helpful!
12 Angry men is a great counter example to many of his points.
As wannabe screenwriters and novelists we focus way too much on our story and the rules of stories while the people who succeed at this stuff just pump it out doesn’t matter what the story is. Remember that.
Okay...but..."Deadpool".
That started--hell, the first half of the movie--started with exactly that: "How did I get here?"
And it was _perfect._
Great film. Very well done, and a fabulous exception in regard to the character setup.
that film is built around parody and not taking itself seriously, which is why such a corny introduction works so well, I assume
@@tyc9909 I d'know...I'm pretty sure I've seen it done in movies taking themselves seriously.
You know...someone wakes up on a stained mattress looking hung over, maybe a dead body next to them, and then we get the flashback of how the heck ya got there...a long flashback...most of the movie flashback...
You know the kinda thing I mean.
@@BionicDance wonder if these examples are not more a framing device, than a way to introduce a character. I think the flawed way to introduce a character is to go into backstory for a few minutes, and then jump back to continue the main story.
@@JA-zr3xs Why is it flawed? And, honestly, I think you're describing a distinction without a difference; if it happens at the beginning, it's an intro, no matter how you slice it.
I guess there is a difference between wanting to know a character's back story and actually hearing it. The most interesting stories of James Bond's life is when he went up against the mysterious Dr No, not when the British government trained him how to be a spy.
I’m so sick of “flawed” characters just for the sake of being flawed. It’s done so much now it’s almost a hack move. It’s not fresh, anymore. It’s just overdone. It’s low hanging fruit.
I’m hoping for a return to characters who aren’t “us.” They’re who we want to be. They have their shit together in a world that doesn’t. Making a lead character like that work in today’s world would be something truly refreshing.
I couldn't agree more. I think it's sad and a deep problem of rotting hearts that a society simply can't survive with for very long. We need actual role models and states of being to aspire to. Insisting on flawed heroes just lowers the bar for what we can achieve in the real world. That someone is repulsed by seeing a well put together character, reflects a level of pride and resentment in that person as it highlights their own flaws and weaknesses, things a proud person can't stand to have reflected back at them.
Resentment, no matter how slight, is like a single mold spore that will grow and consume the whole person. Then their family, their friends, and their community. The resentment is like that of a homeless drug addict who refuses to be reminded that he is homeless and a drug addict and who only wants to engage with other homeless drug addicts. "If you're not in the same pit I'm in, I want nothing to do with you!" How can someone like that ever be raised if he never even sees someone who's not homeless and addicted? And it's all rooted in the person wanting to protect their pride.
The reaction I have to perfect heroes is different. It's humbling and, yet, uplifting. Sure, it highlights all of my flaws and failings, but it also lights a path of improvement. If I see a mountain peak in the distance, I know there's an "up" from where I am and I can then orient myself in that direction.
It's so ironic. Pride, the thing that makes a man think highly of himself, is what keeps him down, while humility, the thing that makes a man think lowly of himself is what lifts him up.
@@CorazonDeCristoCano exactly!
Ben Gates in National Treasure. Pretty flawless
Spider Man, Superman, Batman... even the toughest characters have wounds and histories that affect their judgement and effectiveness.
there's a reson people moved on from those characters to begin with: they are not believable, realistic, organic or entertaining. What do you suggest instead? The reason why we don't "return to it" is the same why we dont relate to 50's movies anymore. The world changed.
That "introduction" for James Bond was amazingly terrible.
Agreed. Gradually learning bits of Bond's history over the series has been far more interesting than packing it all into a tedious lecture/prequel.
Amazing video
Love their content
Great examples, thank you for sharing!
Glad it was helpful!
You DEFINITELY need to make your characters flawed and make mistakes.
You shouldn’t make them utterly perfect or TOO prone to making mistakes
This is why I have never really liked superman as a character. He is too boringly perfect.
Superman, Captain Marvel, Mickey Mouse, Bugs Bunny - the perfect Protagonist is just booooring
@@11FBA11 What makes Superman work is Clark Kent--the contrast between this beefed-up, invincible "perfect" guy and this mild-mannered, sometimes bumbling nerd.
@@MelanieNLee there isnt much of a contrast anymore. I cant remember the last time they portrayed clack as bumbling and inept.
@@11FBA11 Sorry to hear that. I haven't seen the latest movies.
I just had an idea off of something this man said, and I just paused the video and wanted to leave this comment as a thank you. And thanks to this channel for the inspiration in general!
Cheers!
Speaking of trying to copy someone else's success:
In the 1970s, this police detective show called Kojak, starring Telly Savalas, became a big hit. The following year, a rival network released Kolchak, the Night Stalker, about a journalist confronting the supernatural, and Kodiak, about a cop in Alaska. I thought, Do they really think that the way to a hit TV series is to have a cop or cop-like main character whose last name starts with K-O and ends with A-K?
BTW, Kolchak, the Night Stalker lasted only a year, but it's doing fairly well in syndication. Kodiak lasted four episodes and is virtually forgotten.
You can gradually walk a character out, or you can air-drop them into a scenario right off the bat and watch the sparks fly. The key, in my mind, would be to make sure that the manner you choose suits the story AND the character before deciding which way to introduce them. Don't try and be clever with the audience. Don't try to jam square pegs in round holes either.
6:14 "I want to be a comic book artist which nobody I knew wanted to be..." I can tell you that your friends were smart. Been working in this "industry" for almost 20 years and every day I asked wtf have I done XD
I hope you get to work on something that isn't just an amalgamation of current ideals and blatent messaging. Something that will be timeless. Goodluck.
@@EvaOwnsAllThe current audience forces me and others to do exactly this, an amalgamation of current ideals and blatant messaging, and we can't innovate anything at all. When we try something new, the audience doesn't want anything besides big heads, bulgy eyes, and cute things. An example of this is to try to sell something that resembles more of a mature bande dessinée and see if you can sell more than 200 copies, no matter the quality (a creator gets something between 8 to 10% of the sales, 20% if you're lucky enough). But I've been trying to shift industries and see if I can contribute in another medium.
Thanks! I think everyone in this "industry" needs all the good luck in the universe.
Lots of great artists and writers in the field. Be proud of whatever work you've done. It's a tough field, and you have my admiration!
@@troydevolld9793 Thank you! People who work in the entertainment industry are resented by society, and this is worsened when the position is in comics. They hated us.
We can only find other creatives like you on channels like Film Courage where we don't have to worry about hostility. ^^ It's a jungle out there.
Another great interview filled with much needed writing wisdom. Thank you !!
☺️🙏🏻 Leslie
Cheers Leslie!
What character introduction have you really enjoyed recently?
Cassian in Star Wars’ Andor along with any other character in that show
Dwight Manfredi in Tula King. Sylvester Stallone just OOZES charisma and charm.
Forrest Gump from Forrest Gump
poltergiest. The canary dies and the mother goes to flush it down the toilet but then carol ann comes in and, caring for her daughter, gives the bird a burial instead.
The Indiana Jones intro to Temple of Doom.
Mad Max: Fury road - perfect with all introductions.
That movie is probably perfect.
This is good. I always picture myself as Woody Allen, but acting in a movie like Rambo. I can imagine a director trying to tell Woody the next scene is where he jumps off a cliff into a tree, then stitches his own wound shut. Then I imagine Woody trying to convince the director that this is the job of his stunt double. ha.
First minute here explains exactly what the movie Renfield did
I’m 21 and I’m definitely not fond of my younger self and I often wonder myself what my legacy will be. I was often kinda awkward and still am.
You're young and learning still. Older you get better things become.
Damn. I miss my younger self everyday
Ah, that moment when you realize you've completely mis-remembered an iconic film scene.
When you want to create personable characters, you have to prepare for spending a LONG time with them. But most people want to create things fast, therefore their characters don't have enough time to evolve. I noticed how common this is now: writers try to come up with this 10-20 years long plan, trying to write at least 20-30 books in hope that even if all of them will sell poorly, at least they all will grant enough of passive income. This is kind of understandable but also, sad.
Troy is a great guy, glad to see more of him here :)
0:38 aww man that’s every BET movie 😩😅
I know him we have the same alma mater.
I didn't bother introducing anything in my youtube animation.
Not even a name for the main character.
I guess I'll need to add it somewhere...
Same, sometimes I dont even have them in the film.
@@williamshakespeare9815 You make films?
@@williamshakespeare9815 Thought you write plays....
@@BritneyLaZonga Not anymore, got to move with the times or they say youre dead
Isn't it that Marty McFly doesn't have an arc? He just has to solve everyone else's problem around him.
He stopped caring about other people calling him a chicken and getting goaded into stupid/dangerous situations because he'd seen and barely survived the consequences of his own mistakes, mostly thanks to Doc Browns guidance.
Also Jennifer knew that the accident was about to happen and it would ruin his life at the end of the third movie(she overheard her future self and Marty's mother discussing the accident in the second movie) and tried to half-heartedly stop him from racing but he'd already made the choice to back down(this was due to her not being 100% certain if the future was real or a confusing dream she'd just had).
@@andrewh5568 Ah right yea. Had forgotten a lot of that. That makes sense.
You know, I haven't truly witnessed a story where the main character is consistently succeeding and is perfect in every way even characters like Skeletor in the 80s He Man show did use his wits to thwart He Man.
"...consistently succeeding and is perfect in every way"
So you haven't seen the Disney Star Wars trilogy yet then? The main character Mary Sue Palpatine is exactly what you just described.
@@BigDaddyJinx
Han died, Luke died, Leia also died, I don't like Rey at all and think she is terrible but with any character that is considered a "mary sue" you could twist your words around and make it sound like they aren't that.
Perfect is a good word to describe something you like but when it's something you dislike then it's bad. I love this shit.
His attitude was immediately off putting. I was relieved when he stopped talking about his gripes. Point proven.
When it comes to making characters, I really want to make them flawed, troubled, vulnerable and complex. Even with heroic characters, I kinda want to make them start off as loners, then develop into leaders. With characters or heroes, you need or have to see them screw up. You really don't want a perfect character because... there's no such thing as perfect. The world (and people in it) was never perfect.
Don't write your hero as a victim.
And heroes aren't leaders, heroes are inspired by leaders. Al Powell in Die Hard is a leader, he isn't a hero as he's physically unable to intervene - analogous to a wise old man in tales of yore - but he is able to give guidance to the hero when he's at his physical, material and spiritually lowest point. The flaws, troubles and vulnerabilities must come from the severity of external factors, their internal flaws that are integral to them must never be wholly negative but one side of a coin that is the essence of their heroic character.
Like John McClane's stubbornness that is threatening his marriage, it's the one major thing that stops him being a complete prince charming. But that same stubbornness is what made him the hero to push through incredible odds and win.
Did you notice I think Die Hard is one of the greatest movies that Hollywood has ever written?
I know it's based on a book but it fundamentally changed the book from being a story about an old man filled with a life of regret who finds out his daughter is a complete scumbag who then dies and cannot be redeemed. They took the idea of a cop in a skyscraper full of terrorists and fundamentally changed the story into a modern Odysseus.
I believe Arnold Schwarzenegger characters don’t have flaws...... Dutch (predator) .... Quiad (total recall) ..... Harry (true lies)..... Conan (Conan)..... the terminator (t-800)........
I disagree and I'll do my best to show you why:
Dutch - believes that his crack team is invincible until he watches them get dispatched one after another and he's utterly helpless to do anything about it despite being an Uber-Alpha type. Runner-up flaw is how he lets his ego get in the way of making smart calls and allowing himself to be duped by a friend so easy.
Quaid - This one is easy. His flaw is that he is paranoid and not knowing who he can trust, including himself. He is easily led and that takes him into some pretty questionable situations. Runner-up is that Quaid isn't really Quaid but Howser/Hauser who is an absolute sociopath. He's playing a role pretending to be Quaid who is the hero of the story. He's only heroic because he can't remember being a douchenozzle.
Harry - This one is even easier. He's a professional LIAR. Hello?!
Conan - He hacks and slashes his way through problems. He doesn't actually think his way out of them. He has sidekicks for that sort of thing. So you can argue the flaws would be that he's all brawn and no brain or that he simply has some majestic impulse control problems and the IQ of a salad.
T-800 - This would depend on which movie you are referring to. The original or a specific sequel? In the original, his flaw was that he overestimated his own intelligence and and abilities while he underestimated a puny set of humans and their intelligence and abilities (we refer to such as hubris or arrogance). If you were referring to a particular sequel I'd have to know which one.
All of those characters you mentioned have flaws. You just have to be able to see them. Not all character flaws are on-the-nose or so overtly visible.
If they wouldn’t have flaws they wouldn’t run into problems and conflict
Its hard listening to someone who seems to hate their own profession. If everyone approached their field with such a jaded mindset they would never get anywhere to begin with.
I still dig reality tv, I can assure you. I'm just increasingly fed up with the hurry-hurry making of it and the constant noting that often has little regard for story and lots of asking for noisier moments.
@@troydevolld9793 You of all people should know better than anyone why that is too. Reality is BORING. That's why. If someone wanted to watch reality on TV they can record themselves on any given day and then rewind it and press play. YAWN.
So that's why your people are asking for more "noise". Noise is what gets people's eyes on your reality show. Not reality itself, which as I just explained, is BORING. C'mon man, you of all people should know this by now.
@BigDaddyJinx Authentic interaction instead of people self-producing themselves as perfect, nice and in control would be my first wish. I'm more entertained watching Phil Rosenthal joke around about food than I am watching a bunch of manufactured fights.
The best way to introduce a character is to show them in a way to make them likable: Show them getting out of bed, going through their Daily routine and interacting with others.
unless they're a villain or antagonist in the story
I mean, you could still make them likable like in YOU... so I guess it's director's preference
I don't think they have to be likeable. Just empathetic
@@recoveringintrovert717 👍👍
@@recoveringintrovert717 And the best way to do that is to hand them a problem-Instant empathy. I rank things that get a viewer/reader to bond with a character in this order of importance: 1. Empathy. 2. Identification. 3. Admiration (this is where Save the Cat helps). The fourth one is amusement, but that is thorny. Unless you're Steve Martin, consciously trying to engineer humor into anything usually results in the douche chills, bc laughter is it emotional reaction, and not a part of the intellectual process. If something naturally turns out to be humorous, go with that, and consider it a gift. IOW, let it happen, but don't try to make it happen.
I personally hate flawed characters. Find them annoying and pretentious, especially emo crap. I like awesome characters with bad guys to beat, women and treasure to win. I hate it when they have some kind of anxiety or emo problem, I really don’t care about drama that gets in the way of the stuff I care about. Maybe it’s just me, but I want a hero that I can aspire to be, not one to feel sorry for.