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Iron in Aquaponics - Part 1
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- čas přidán 7. 05. 2013
- Find more info at: zipgrow.com/un...
In this video on Iron & Aquaponics, Dr. Nate Storey from Bright Agrotech explains soluble vs. insoluble iron and what kinds of iron supplements exist for aquaponics systems. Don't forget: each system is different! Make sure to watch part two on calculating how much iron you need for YOUR system!
WARNING: Some FeDDHA is the best iron for high pH systems, but many people have told us that the FeDDHA is turning their water red. If you're in the range of FeDTPA is more appropriate, it might be best to use that instead of red kool-aid water.
UPDATE:
We've had several folks ask about where they can get good iron supplements and how much they cost. Here is that info:
Chelated iron products you can google- available on Amazon and other online stores:
"Miller DP"- DTPA (What we use- on the shelf or ordered through Ace hardware)
"Sequestrene"- DTPA (5 lbs bag on Amazon for $57)
"Miller FerriPlus"- EDDHA (SunshineGardensFl dot com; 1 lb for $20, or 20 lbs for $300)
"Sequestar Iron 6% Chelate"- EDDHA (RoseCare dot com; 5 lbs for $73)
All of these products will work great in your system!
Remember to ask other questions in the comments box!
Nate is the Co-Founder of Bright Agrotech, a leader in vertical, space saving aquaponics and hydroponics systems and a commercial producer in the high plains of Laramie, WY. With this innovative technology, Nate and the Bright Agrotech team feed dozens of restaurants, over 50 people in a CSA program and supply for a local grocer.
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Excellent tutorial. I continue to learn more from CZcams videos like this than I did at university.
Josh E That's great to hear, Josh. Happy to help folks like you learn as much as possible for free!
You're welcome! We've very glad to hear you're learning a lot.
So glad we could help out, Brian!
Hi Noam,
Yes, UV can cause chelated iron to precipitate, but it's usually not in huge quantities. If you're dosing regularly, then you shouldn't have any major issues. If iron deficiencies do arise while using UV, then just increase your iron dosing.
You're welcome Greg! Glad you found it helpful.
An excellent clip with bags of information for those of us who are just back yarders or perhaps even people like myself still in the considering stage. Thankyou for putting the information in a way which is understood by all... All of your posts are great and I for one thank you in the sincerest way for taking the time to make them.
Regards
Bryan D
Great information. You are the first person I know of that has posted such information.
Thanks.
Thank you for clarifying Iron F++ and F+++. I have since removed the iron bar from my system:-)
Thanks for the video. Started using Iron in our system and really brought the leaves back to a nice deep green. Thanks so much!!!
Glad to hear it! Best of luck moving forward. We should get you using some ZipGrows if you aren't already!
Wow good information nobody had ever explained iron deficiency in such great detail. Keep up the good posts.
Thank you so much! Just started my aquaponics and this is very clear and much needed info 😊👍
Great info, my system is 5 months old and I'v been struggling to keep the ph below 8,and this video clears up qustions on how to add iron.Thx
Maxicrop is usually iron sulfate, which doesn't work so well at higher pH's. They may have a product that is a chelated iron - not 100% on that. Maxicrop will contain chelating agents though in the form of amino acids, etc. which may be useful but there's no way to quantify the chelating effect of those compounds, which makes dosing very difficult. By and large, we recommend people stay away from iron sulfate, unless they're using it as a foliar spray. Best of luck!
Thanks, studying for an interview!
Hi David,
I would stay away from FeNaEDTA. It will work in low pH systems, but it adds Na to your system in addition to Fe, which you probably don't want unless you're treating your fish for something, or want really salty chard, celery, etc.
I know that Aquaponic Source sells FeDTPA, also check out IrrigationMart- they sell Miller FeDTPA (what we use) as well as tons of other great products.
best place to look is ebay, got some eddha no problem. sprint 138, got a 5lb bag for about $120
Thanks for you videos bright agrotech
lower ph around 6,2 is so crucial for all nutrients intake its first to do when setting such system..
Hey Ned, we use "Miller DP"- DTPA (we find it on the shelf of our local Ace Hardware)
i always wanted to know how to put iron in an aquaponic system, this is great info thank you!!!
Great little explanation Nate!
I use the DTPA chelated iron. I did once look at the price for the EDDHA iron from my local supplier, my eyes bugged out and I got the 5 lb bag of DTPA again like normal. Luckily once a system gets mature and the pH comes down, at least for me I've been able to keep the system at about 7.6 or lower most of the time.
Hey TC,
Yeah, EDDHA is a bit pricy, but worth it for folks running high pH values and starting systems. It sounds like you're in a great range for DTPA though- and it usually runs a higher iron content percentage. . . a little more bang for the buck, so long as you're in the right range. ..
Pseudomonas species are very common soil bacteria and both plants and bacteria chelate iron. As far as culturing them in a controlled environment specifically for chelation gets very tricky...
I am grateful for your expertise & work you spend sharing it. You may have answered this question in other posts, but are there any concerns about chemicals leaching into the food of an AP system? I see people using all types of scary materials, including pressure treated lumber, in their systems. An envir. specialists that once worked for my city said that all filter media should be considered hazardous, as low levels of toxins present in pipes, water, etc can accumulate to dangerous levels.
So I have the wrong iron (I guess, it says derived from HEDTA) but it apparently is ok for my system because it self regulates at ph 6.4. Good timing on this video because I noticed some yellowing in my leaves this evening and was planning to dose tomorrow. Now I know what to buy when this runs out, which it will soon because now I know how much and often I need to dose, something I was just guessing at before. I admit I had a little trouble following the video but the blog post cleared it up
I understand there are natural chelating agents for iron could you do a video on them?
Hello Dr. Nate. First let me say this is the best channel I've found on aquaponics information. After using iron oxide for a number of years to manage phosphate levels in salt and fresh water aquariums, I was wondering if soluble iron would affect phosphate levels in a system making it harder for plants to receive it.
Hey Joe Strahan - Thanks for that awesome feedback. The iron oxide won't affect phosphate levels very much. At least not at the levels we're talking.
Thanks for this video on Iron Aquaponics.
Some systems don't need as much iron. If your plants aren't showing deficiency, then there's no need to add it. Adding iron rich fish feed won't help too much as it will mostly be oxidized- If you're looking for cheap chelation and it's worth it to you, you can include rye or other grasses that produce lots of chelating agents and do your chelation in system, for free.
Check out response to you on the blog. There are places to find it online, but lots of folks are reporting problems with it. If we were you, we'd just look for FeDTPA. Good luck.
ferrous sulfate as a foliar application would be better in an aquaponic system.
With the FE+++, why can't you ground the aquaponics system? The original growing medium was the ground to begin with so grounding the system should provide naturally the right amount of - electrons needed to mimic the natural growth the plants are use to. This should also help keep the pH lower.
Make iron available again
My "Calmag pro formula" actually says it has chelated iron, the bad kind "Iron EDTA" Just no FE in front of the EDTA. go figure... Thanks for the video 👍
Glad it was helpful!
Having your water turn red is not normal! Check the contents for any dyes. There shouldn't be anything in the EDDHA that is toxic to your fish. If it contains dye, or something like that, it should be harmless, but you might try dosing with more regularity in lower concentrations in the future.
Great video, really solidified it for me. I've been looking into options a little more. What's the story with nano iron chelate, amino (glycine) iron chelate and lignin iron chelate. has there been any studies using those in aquaponics?
Hmmmm...Apparently my Chelated Iron is TOXIC!!! Some shopping might be in order this weekend! I guess I'll save this stuff for the flower garden out front...
What are those natural compounds that chelate iron?
Thank you,
Aloha , like your video's and your teaching style very informative and easy to follow. My question is are you using any worm composting tea in your system and are you use any worms in your bio filter? Thanks much aloha
Hi Nate - Can UV sterilization cause the precipitation of Iron in an aquaponic system?
And if so - how should i approach this problem?
Iron deficiency vs parasite free water?
I typically try to favor the needs of the fish - and see the plants needs as secondary.
Basically - I employ aquaponic techniques as a means of creating a superior environment for the fish - rather than running a system which puts an equal amount of emphasis on both plant and fish health.
What Nate says goes...
Hi Bobby - We don't use worm compost teas but we do have redworms inside of our tower media to assist with breaking down solids, etc. Check out our video on "Redworms & Vertical Farming".
what about Fe-HEDTA?
how about ironite? I wasn't sure do to a list of other things in it. When I go to home depot, garden stores, pond stores etc. they say they don't have what I need. ironite is all I've found. I'm Also looking for the hydrated lime and potassium hydrocloride and not sure were to find it...
What about rusty water? Like a water pan full of old nails or rebar or something?
I've wanted to try spinach as its high in iron
VERY GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hi Nate. I bought Aqualron Chelated Iron for aquaponics. It is FeNaEDTA. Can I assume that is the same EDTA you just warned us not to use? Also, my local Ace Hardware has no idea what I am talking about and they do not have any chelated iron on their website. I saw the other sources you listed and will order online. Thank you.
Hi Dr Storey thank you for your information.. Im growing lettuce in my system with goldfish. Everything is ok but when the weather is cool but when the weather becames hot the lettuce is bitterish and tastes get different. What can l do for this situation. Best regards.
Saw a comment recommending against the use of FeSO4 below, but without an explanation... Could you clarify why Iron II Sulfate isn't a good option? I was interested in pursuing the foliar application method from Roosta & Mohsenian
Effects of foliar spray of different Fe sources on pepper (Capsicum annum L.) plants in aquaponic system Scientia Horticulturae 146 (2012) 182-191
Thanks!
Fantastic - does that mean plant living grasses or do you mean add cut grass, and allow it to decompose?
Can Ferrous fumarate be used for foliar application? or is Ferrous sulphate the best choice?
Great video
Hi, What happens to the chelating agent. does it build up in the system?
Dr. Storey, what did you actually study in school to get your Ph.D, curious as to what degrees one should look into if interested in aquaponics/horticulture?
Hi there! I'm currently trying out aquaponics using floating raft system. I would like to know how do I add the chelated iron to my system, do I add it to my growbed's water or do I add them to the fish tank? I would also like to know if adding chelated iron causes the system to be non-organic.
Hey, you can use the iron oxide obtained naturally in aquaponics? For example leaving iron oxidizing a metal?
So, if the system is cycling, and pH is 8.0. It means The iron DTPA cant work, right? Thank Dr. Nate
So I used the eddha I’m just wondering how long it takes for the water to clear up it is dark red and can’t see anything I only used 1/3 of the recommended dosage
If i add iron eddha in my system the water color will change, but i use aquarium test to see how much ammonia and nitretes i have in the water, so the test will work in a system with iron eddha ?
I don't add any iron, other than what is in the fish food. I only feed the fish - very basic.
I've got good water parameters, seemingly healthy fish, okay plants and extremely low running costs. - my plants are showing signs of a slight iron deficiency, however, applying Fe DTPA in the amounts you recommend would almost triple my total running costs ~
Perhaps I could purchase fish foods that contains more iron?
Or supplement the fish's current diet with blanched leafy greens or some shiz?
Hmmm. Check out The Aquaponic Source. I know they're working on a DTPA and EDDHA source for AP producers. . .let them know we sent you. :)
Hi chief, i have a question: I learned that the roots of plants have mechanisms to access iron in the soil, would it be possible to introduce iron as a solid or granulate in the growbed? Assuming the roots would shoot out H+ to access the iron. Or would that kill the microbia?
My wife heard this video playing and realized she hadn't taken her iron supplement yet 😃
can we use ferrous nitrate or ferric nitrate instead of that chelates?
great great information
Hi Nate I want to use iron as a foliar spray, what do you suggest?
Hi doc can I please ask if you have used a liquid form of iron for the Aquaponic system and if so which one(s)? What’s your scientific opinion on liquid vs power. Iron? Thanks 😊
I can only find it in the form of a vaccine for pigs. I'm curious if it will work. Hope to get a reply
Yea and the DTPA Iron I get is 10% so it even makes the math easier.
Trying to find at ACE Hardware and having no luck! Any advice?
Ferric Nitrate IS soluble though.
It comes as a nonhydrate and has 13.82% iron.
Grounding the system electrically unfortunately has nothing to do with the redox reactions or the fact that iron is so quickly oxidized. If it were that simple, we'd all be a lot happier!
I already added FeEDTA iron chelate to my system a while ago. Should I be concerned, and will it eventually be filtered out of the system?
+goltoof You should be just fine!
Hi!
First of all, big thanks for all your videos, they are really informational and accessible.
I have a (small) fishtank and system of about 500L, and calculated I need to add 14grams of chelated iron of 6% (EDDHA). Problem is that the water is completely dark red now. The fish are swimming in an glass aquarium, and you can't see through it anymore. Is this normal?
Tom
Hi Tom,
Yes, quite a few people have had issues with FeEDDHA in their system. The iron can turn the water red. This isn't always an issue in AP systems that aren't in glass aquariums. I would recommend switching to FeDTPA if your water needs to look clear and clean. It will supplement iron, but won't dye your water. A partial water change will help in the meantime. Don't worry about the red color- it won't hurt your fish! Sorry about the color- we addressed it on the blog, but it didn't make it into the video.
Bright Agrotech good to hear it's OK for the fishes. I quite like the looks to be honest, it gives a nice red glow in the room. :) thanks for the quick answer.
Tom
What brand chelated iron are you using?
5:01 Are the different types of iron
THANK YOU!!!!!
Is it possible to accurately measure the amount of Iron in the system if it is in chelated form? Aquarium-grade color tests give out a value, but do they actually react witht he chelates or do they show "free" iron?
Hi +DieAlphaEnte - Some do, some don't Unfortunately, I don't know enough about an individual test to give you a good answer on that. Sorry! Have a great weekend.
Ok, i'll look into the hydroponics literature, somebody somewhere surely tracks iron ;) Thx for answering though, great weekend to you too :)
I have contacted my friend , he owns an ACE hardware and he has no idea what i am talking about.... Any luck giving me a part number? That would be amazing and would help alot of others as well!
Next time we find it on the shelf, we'll post the part number. We haven't been able to find it online either. I think it's one of those weird seasonal products. . .
Anyone know the part number for miller dtpa from ace hardware?
Sorry, I can't find it for some reason. Try hydro-gardens.com. We buy iron from them.
Doc, can i use supplemental FeSO4 325mg that i can buy at any drugstore in our place? tnx
We wouldn't recommend it, Michael John Capistrano
awwww....too bad. tnx again
I got my tiny water spinach plant in my little mechanical filter box and on my 55 gallon tank loaded with 15 tilapias. I am wondering if it is potassium or iron that makes my water spinach leaves turning yellow for how many days and now it started to burn holes and drying up of its leaves. what should i do? are there any alternative ways to do now that i dont have the the necessary nutrients? does the ammonia in the system still being absorbed by the plant?
Michael John Capistrano Yellowing can be a lot of different deficiencies- if you don't know what it is, use the free nutrient deficiency guide that we offer on our blog. It will walk you through the process of figuring out what your problem is.
potassium calcium plz
Hi Tyler, try our potassium (czcams.com/video/4XwrpIrz8tQ/video.html) and calcium (czcams.com/video/GGcxyTKTl5U/video.html) videos!
the best results that i've ever had was by using the Keiths Ponics Site (i found it on google) without a doubt the most useful course i've tried.
Ah-huh, thanks
what a total pain in the backside it is to find this stuff, i think gold would be easier at this point, also nobody knows what the heck your talking about, had 2 hydroponic stores tell me to just through some scrap metal in the water....
Hey Jeff Jones - I would probably be wary of any more advice you might get from those hydroponic stores. Look on the label of any hydroponic solution and you'll see chelated iron, not ferric iron (the scrap metal your hydroponic store was telling about). Sorry you're having such a hard time finding it, we know that it's harder to find in some places over others. You can always find it online at places like Hydro-gardens.com Good luck.
Jeff, try hydro-gardens.com. They sell the chelated iron you want.
yeah education...teach a man fish ....and he ll build an AP sytem!!!!!
slow down there Einstein, You should be using sock puppets or something easier to understand.
+Marty Lynchian That's not a bad idea...
+Bright Agrotech lol, then you would be like Alton Brown. Now for a serious question, your video was recommended by a planted aquarium forum and various aquarium iron supplement products are using the EDTA for the chelated iron and most aquariums have a much higher PH then 6.3. For example, my aquarium is probably around 7.0 or maybe a little higher. Do you think these should have a warning label about the PH level required to make use of this iron or better yet use the DTPA instead?
Thanks.
+Marty Lynchian Yes, in that pH range FeEDTA is not the best choice.
+Bright Agrotech Oh, I almost forgot - we actually just created an iron calculator over at able.ag/calculators