Kona Sutra ULTD Review: Beyond Gravel
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- čas přidán 4. 08. 2024
- Following Logan's written review of the Kona Sutra ULTD, he sent it along so we could get a different perspective on this bike for an in-depth video review. Neil ripped it around local singletrack, gravel, and took it on a short trip to Moab before collecting his thoughts. Watch the full review here, showcasing how the bike handled loaded and unloaded, analysis of the components and build, and a comparison with the popular Salsa Cutthroat
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Outline:
ULTD and LTD differences - 0:55
Sizing - 2:49
First Impressions - 3:35
Bikepacking - 5:32
Components - 6:50
ULTD vs. Salsa Cutthroat - 10:36
Mentioned Links:
Kona Sutra ULTD Review: bikepacking.com/bikes/kona-su...
Salsa Cutthroat Review: bikepacking.com/bikes/salsa-c...
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Hosted by Neil Beltchenko
Music by Ben Weaver (benweaver.net)
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![Steel Frame, External Cables... Does This Bike Make Sense? [ENG SUB]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/8dUnW-CNWpw/mqdefault.jpg)
This review was thorough and honest af. Your knowledge of and passion for cycling is obvious. Thank you for making this and all the other reviews you guys do, you're saving us all a ton of time and money, and entertaining us while you do it!
That ULTD must be crazy stable as I feel this is already the main characteristic of my 2017 LTD, which really bombs downhill.
Great review Neil!I also can confirm the softness of the derailleur hanger and the great feel of a loaded frame.
Cheers from Germany, stay healthy!✌️
useful review here! great production. loaded AND comparison = the best job possible.
Great review and comparison. I'm happy I opted for the Cutthroat but still glad that there are more bikepacking oriented drop bar mountain bikes being produced.
I was incredibly lucky to find a Kona Sutra ULTD at a local shop amongst this mad situation with so limited supply. My friend and I were hell-bent on finding our bikes and we tried anything that we could get our hands on over several days, cities, and through MANY stores (and we were able to try quite a bit). When I test-rode this bicycle... I don’t know what it was, but it felt almost like falling in love, like finding that perfect puppy at the shelter and she adopts you. I’m happy to say I’ve been adopted by this beauty and I love her right after my puppy.
Great review! Keep the amazing content coming.
Much appreciated!
Very informative review. Thanks!
Great review. Please also review the Poseidon Redwood monster cross since Logan already added it into the 27.5” plus bikes directory on your website!
It looks so sick!!
Good review. I enjoyed the comparison to the v2 Cutthroat which I ride. The ULTD is an interesting offering since it's basically a steel version of the Cutthroat and it's $400 cheaper than the Cutthroat Apex 1 but with hydro brakes. For my uses mostly unloaded mixed terrain rides with a few bikepacking trips each year, the Cutty seems to be a better fit. I enjoy the light racy feel when riding unloaded especially after upgrading the wtb wheels on my Apex 1 to lightweight xc race wheelset. I could see how the ULTD might be a good fit if one is doing an epic year long bikepacking adventure heavily loaded down. I personally think they should have gone with Apex 1 on the ULTD and then lowered the price to better differentiate with the Cutty.
Too bad Kona's short lived partnership with Lynskey didn't work out, cuz it sounds like the Sutra in Ti would be the best of both worlds.
My wife has a Kona Sutra LTD and is super happy with it, also when fully packed up.
It's a fantastic bike; I own one too...
I ride the LTD and my wife rides the ULTD. Can’t go wrong with either!
I went with the LTD and my wife went for the ULTD. The sloping top tube and dropper post were really helpful for her being a shorter rider on a bike with that big of wheel/tire combo. Can’t go wrong with either. I found the sizing to be pretty spot on for both of us. The short stem really makes up the difference. I’m glad I ordered true to size and didn’t size down with the LTD.
Hey, how tall is your wife and which size did she go for? I'm having a bit of trouble finding sizing online
@@mrgravyman She is 5’ 4” and went with a 49cm frame. I’m 5’ 10” and ride a 54cm. Despite the geometry looking misleading, I found the sizing to be pretty true to size. We both went with our usual road bike sizes and have to regrets on the overall fir.
@@brianwilliam8971 Thanks for the info, that's really reassuring to know!
I was lucky to find a Sutra ULTD in stock in December. The thing seems like an absolute tank - it's like a bike for after the apocalypse. The review is correct that it's sluggish though, it moves okay once you have momentum but it's very slow to accelerate (or maybe that's just me). I feel like the bike kind of always wants to go about the same pace - on pavement sure you can speed it up a little faster, in mud it might slow down a little, but it's never far off. Whether you're on pavement or rocks or mud or dirt or whatever, the bike just doesn't really care all that much.
In hindsight I don't think I'll actually need the extra MTB-ness that the ULTD offers over the LTD very often and I could have saved some money, but the bike is a hoot. I feel like these gravel/MTB crossover bikes are at their best when you are doing something that feels improbable, thinking to yourself "I really shouldn't be doing this right now" but getting away with it, and the ULTD is perfect for that.
Yeah, this bike is a stout and I would have no worries brining it on an extended trip. I noticed that one speed feel while climbing and on the flats, once it gets going, this bike flies downhill. I think it all depends on what you are doing, I find that I ride a lot of singletrack, so this is certainly more forgiving when it comes to that style of riding. I swear I was going to go OTB on a few instances but the ULTD got me though it.
Sounds like a drop bar equivalent to my Surly Ogre
@@BIKEPACKINGcom Hi. Thanks for your review. Do you feel your impressions about its peppiness and climbing abilities would differ if it had a different groupset on it? What's listed as stock doesn't seem all that good even though it's a popular config. What about a 2x11? Maybe different rims and tires as well? Also....that paint job is a trip.....in some images it's dark purple and then goes to a yellowish orange.... It's very attractive....and then it's not. Thanks for your time.
@@cjohnson3836Same Geo Like the Ogre
Great review man! Would love a rundown of Neil’s personal Cutthroat.
Thats in the plans eventually this year. Once I take it on a trip this spring.
Gorgeous color !
Yeah, I actually really like it.
Hi. Great review. Apols if this has been addressed. Am I correct in understanding that to go to a 46 cassette (I climb a lot), I need to either change the hub / adaptor, or the wheelset (which I may do to go to a lighter wheelset). Do you see any issues with swapping in a carbon fork if I choose to do so in the future.
Great review! Did you consider reviewing the Cinelli Hobootleg Geo 2021? It looks like a great option, and share some similarities with this one and the Salsa Fargo as well. Thank you!
Well done.
Love it
*Looked at a lot of options for getting my **Latest.Bike** . Great find in SAVA. Super light, nice components, really good value as it comes with many options only found in much higher priced bikes.*
So what did you decide on, the unicycle or the BMX?
I have a Kona Honzo with the same paint color and hot diggity the paint makes the price tag worth it!
Hey, just wondering if you guys still have the bike? I'm looking for some inner frame dimensions of the 56cm to figure out which frame bag will work. Thanks!
I've had a Kona Sutra for 5 years and I've travelled some pretty crappy roads with an Extrawheel trailer. Never had an issue with the derailleur hanger.
I agree. I too have bike-packed, raced and ridden the Sutra Ltd on gravel and off-road and never had an issue with the derailleur hanger. Very happy with 2019 LTD but will be switching to a ULTD since I managed to get my hands on one of the last ULTD frames in Scandinavia (in my size). All that remains now is to hunt for components. Not the easiest thing to do these days when everything is out of stock. Great review, Neil. I especially enjoyed the comparison to the Cutthroat.
I think they're talking about the thru-axle ET2 detailleur hanger, not the quick-release version, which is all fine and smooth. I've had serious issues with the ET2 and ended up swapping by an upgrade hanger, the Wheels Manufacturing 322 KONA. No issues since the swap.
How do you think this frameset would fare for TDR or long distance mixed terrain races. Already have higher end components (carbon wheels, fork, stem, seat post, etc) that I would use on this build and this is alot cheaper than the cutty frameset.
What size Apidura Backcountry frame bag did you have mounted to the Sutra?
Sweet
What about the Kona Sutra Vs Salsa Fargo? same material there and similar geometry. I personally LOVE my Fargo, super comfortable, responsive, reliable and overall amazing bike.
I’ll try and make that happen.
Would love to see that!!
I'm still riding my 2009 Fargo in "fun guy green" . Any retro bike reviews?
Fargo for the win!
@@cyrusf.4039 same here. The ultd looks identical in frame geo.
One niggle for me is the disappearance of any head tube length on the smaller frames...29ers look like wagon wheels on the 54 and smaller. I hope they have improved the paint quality on this over the 2020 too. Other than that a truly capable bikepacking rig.
Hey guys great review what does the Kona weigh compared to the cutthroat? Cheers
obviously its very dependent on the build of the cutthroat, but the Cutthroat Di2 GRX build is 22lbs (9.98kg)and the ULTD that I tested is 28Lbs (12.7kg)
Thanks for the solid review (along with Logan's)! I'm also 5.10 but with a 30.5" inseam, as you said you were on the edge of the 54-56 size guessing my best bet would be to size down to the 54? cheers
Yes, I would certainly think you are a 54, I honestly think I am too, but I made the 56 work.
I’m 5’10” with 30” inseam and a long torso. I went with 54 on my 2021 LTD and it’s dialed. I was tempted to size down to 52 but it was definitely cramped while riding in the drops.
@@brianwilliam8971 I also ended up going with the 54 on the ULTD, size is spot on, feels ever so slightly cramped when in the drops so thinking at some point either swapping the 50mm stem for a 70 or slightly wider drops, otherwise feels perfect. Love this bike!
Hi Neil, I'd like to know your thoughts. Do you think this frame would be a good candidate for building a flatbar offroad tourer, to make like a cheaper/light duty Prospector? I always end up shortening and lifting the stem on my bikes, gravel or mtb, so I feel like this longish dropbar bike would work well for me with flatbar and mtb drivetrain. Given the quality steel frame+fork, available at a great value.
Yah do it bro haha
Do you ship your book worldwide ?
Why do you think that the fork weight affected the “auto steer”? Increase fork rake translates to shorter trail which definitely makes for quicker steering response and would fit your auto steer comment but then the good descending ability would be in conflict, so who knows. Would like to know your further thoughts but older vid so probably too late 😊
Im 185cm and just got the 54cm frame LTD. Should be great considering it measures large (e.g reach compares equally to my bianchi road bike at 59cm).
Although i see mostly people
Just bout a 2022 Rove DL it’s a nice bike.
Sweet bike and great review. Do you have a review on the redwood? That bike is such a steal.
No, but that looks like a great bike and value.
Are you going to review those Apidura bags?
You bet! Need a touch more time on them, give me another month.
@@BIKEPACKINGcom thanks
Great day rider.
What was the weight of this bike?
So if I want one bikepacking rig to do it all (also classic touring if I need...), then ULTD seems like an overkill? I guess LTD can go to same heavy off-road, but with just little less comfort, while ULTD will not be that great in peaceful area, but it will still go comfortably. Also, weight of the for between LTD and ULTD cannot be that big... Anyway that dropper post seems convincing - there is always a downhill during the trip when this might come handy. And hey, we're not using those bikes for racing, but to explore! Sluggishness is not a key argument :)
I thought the LTD could fit 29x2.3 or 27.5x2.6? If this can fit 29x2.4 that is not much more clearance than the LTD. Related note Salsa's site says the Cutthroat maxes at 29x2.4(wish it was 2.6).
As I mentioned to another commenter below, the biggest difference is that the ULTD has a half-yoke, vs the LTD's pinched tubing stay design. So the rear ends are quite different. In my experience, a 2.25" tire is as large as I would want to go on the LTD while keeping enough mud clearance, whereas a 2.4 will fit comfortably on the ULTD with mud clearance.
Hey Neil, what bars do you have on your Cutthroat?? And thanks for a great review!!
I'm rocking the Ritchey Venturemax XL bar, comes in at 52cm, its pretty cool bar, but one thing I'm not sure I like is the shallow drop, still trying to figure that out. I'm going to swap it out to the 50cm Salsa Cowchipper here soon to give a good comparison.
I'd love the bike too if... there were bikes in stock to sell...
not even frames anywhere :(
Just ordered one from a website today and already have the tracking number. Random bikeshop in Iowa had it in stock in my size. UPS ground was $180 but it arrives in 4 days. There were a few other shops online that had a size in stock.
Isn't Salsa Fargo a closer counterpart to the ULTD than Cutthroat?
you bet, we just got a bunch of requests to comp the two, so thats what we did.
@@BIKEPACKINGcom hey could you please link to where you did the comparison?
White Ranch? Is it dry?
No, it’s not but I bet by early next week if we dont get too much snow tomorrow. 🤞🏼
@@uber_franz1126 Correct, that first ride I was talking about was up on STM. I bet we are dry by Monday or Tuesday.
why Logan never shows up?
Pedaling nice bikes😊
What about Kona Rove Ltd?
We have a review of that one coming from Joe Cruz...
Wouldn't the Fargo be a better comparison?
can i 'upgrade' the fork to a carbon fork on this bike?
Yes, but unfortunately, there aren’t many carbon forks available in that length, at least for now. A couple of options are ENVE’s new Adventure fork or the Whiskey MCX. Either would need to be paired with an external cup (~12mm) lower headset, making them about 418 and 427mm, respectively.
@@pedalingnowhere you are the man! Thank you for the information. I, also, meant to ask/add, what about a suspension front fork (Rock Shox or something); would/could a suspension fork work with this Bike? Thanks again for your help/time and reply!
The Ltd will take 29x2.4 without issue and 27.5 plus. I bet with the longer fork the Ultd could run 29 plus up front. The rear is pretty much the same as the Ltd so 2.3-2.4 would likely still be the max.
The biggest difference is that the ULTD has a half-yoke, vs the LTD's pinched tubing stay design. So the rear ends are quite different. In my experience, a 2.25" tire is as large as I would want to go on the LTD, whereas a 2.4 will fit comfortably on the ULTD.
@@pedalingnowhere I did say pretty much. ;-), ie chainstay length and seat stays. I usually run 2.1 in the back on the ltd, and yes the new yoke will give you some more room on the Ultd. My point was you won’t get to plus size on either bike in 29 in the rear but I bet the new fork length would get you to 29x2.8 on the front. I will say that in the smaller sizes (I am on the 52) that I think that 29 with bigger tires just looks wrong. I am moving my bike to 27.5 (2.35 & 2.25) because I think the 29er look is odd. The 56 looks good with 29.
@@larrywhite8590 Yeah, I think you could squeeze a pretty big tire in that fork; plenty of room!!
You forgot to mention that Sutra is a *touring* bike. This means you add pannier racks to it - don't even try this with this Salsa bike!
If the derailler hanger is bending under loaded shifting, the hanger is crap! Nothing short of a rock hit should bend it.
I like that you mentioned another bike that may work just as well or better. One of the things that turned me off about the website is a ton of product endorsement without comparisons.
I'm not quite sure what website you're referring to as every one of our bike reviews touches on a comparison with at least one other bike. In addition, we have a ton of roundups and Gear Indexes, and have never taken a dollar from a company for a paid promotion.
@@pedalingnowhere It's not about literally taking money. The conflict is more subtle than that: czcams.com/video/Twy5Wo8m284/video.html. I haven't looked at the site in a couple of years; there was some basic stuff I found useful, but the overall vibe is very hashtag economy, whether it's $300 rain jackets or trips to countries where the average yearly wage is about the amount the gear you're rolling by on costs. Neil keeps it pretty down to earth -- I hope there's enough of an audience for that.
2700 for a bike that you need to replace anything on is fucked
Kona-sutra sound way too similar to Kama-sutra. That can't be a coincidence
Well this put me right off this bike
Or save $1000 and buy a Surly Ogre which is an even more capable bike - and that $1000 sure will pay for a lot of bike packing gear!
Top speed suffers