GAUGE THE ISSUE: They Don't Make 'Em Like They Used To
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- čas přidán 18. 11. 2020
- DISCLAIMER:
Any views or opinions expressed in this video are those of Chris Eden-Green. These are made without intention of offending anyone.
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I've heard that Connery slipped and almost fell off the train during one of the scenes. Also that one of best coffees he had was from the café in Heuston/Kingsbridge.
Cork Kent/Glanmire road Station was also used in the film, providing the redbrick station and curved platforms.
Are you sure thats not the old platform at mullingar?
At least the trains weren't made up of mk 1 coaching stock or modern locos, they tried. I always enjoy the film
That is true
Gotta be pedantic, but that style of coach was still widespread in the 1850s. The preserved Eastern Counties Railway coach from 1851 is a good example of the type from that era. Although I agree it's unlikely they'd have been painted in bright yellow L&M livery. Anyway, love this movie. Excellent cast, and a lot of fun. RIP Sean. Thanks for the vid.
I feel that it is worth noting that Jerry Goldsmith also composed the scores for Von Ryan's Express (1965) and Breakheart Pass (1975)
And he also composed The Ghost and the Darkness(1996).
RIP sean, great GTI Chris and great new into!
Despite all of its flaws, this movie definitely deserves another look at
Yeah. It would be an excuse to restore 184 again. That would be nice.
@@Spud607 Other than cosmetically to film condition there's no reason to restore her. She's too slow and weak to be much use, 461 would be a better candidate to get back out on the mainline.
It's not like 184 has any proper looking carriages to run with, the heritage set in Inchicore neds lots of love to get going again, and even then only on certain lines at 50mph
@@NirateGoel what's the matter with 184 does she need a new boiler and lot of work to get her running again? when did she last move under her own steam?
@@NirateGoelemphasis on the word excuse. Its a dying shame really. Shes such a lovely locomotive. I agree there. No point in restoring her outside of filming reasons.
@@eliotreader8220 she last moved under her own steam last january but some of the cladding is missing, theres a massive crack down the front of the cylinder block and the ends of the cylinders are open to all weathers. The rust is the main thing holding her tender together too. And thats just the visable damage. I believe after filming the RPSI aquired more engines and then ther was no space in the shed so she was left out in all weathers along with SLNCR 0-6-4T 'Lough Erne'. That may be wrong so dont quote me on that.
Although adapted from a novel, many of the scenes, which gave the flavour of the Victorian period, the jailbreak, The common lodginghouse sleeping on a rope, where lifted from a non-fiction book, " The Victoria Underworld " a Study of the Victorian underclass,crime and punishment.
This is spooky - I started watching this movie today! It's one of my favourites. Great job covering it. Love the intro music, too. Keep it up, mate.
We are both massive fans of your work. You keep it up too! Great episode today
Indeed, this is One of my FAVORITE movies of all time. Rest In Peace Sir. Sean Connery, SCOTLAND FOREVER!
Well well well look what we have here a famous CZcamsr oh my god wow
Always pleasant to see one of my own country's engines take the limelight in a film. Even if the J15s aren't of SECR origin, the livery is convincing, even if it is a shame that 184 won't run again (especially given they're the only class of Irish gauge engines preserved in quantity), especially given Ireland does have fewer operational steam engines than the fingers on a butcher's hand as you said Chris. Still, between these two and 461 appearing in Michael Collins, amazing how well travelled Ireland's small fleet are on the big and small screens
Well no not if you count narrow gauge. the moment there's 8. No.4 is under repairs and 171 under restoration once those are done that'll be 10. 7 standard and 3 3ft.
There's the 2 sugar puffs at the d
cdr. There's 131, 85 & 3BG.
And in 3ft are Nancy, Roisin and Slieve Callan.
I am a volunteer fireman/driver at a major heritage railway in New Zealand and I’ve been involved in several film shoots, and I can say that I am not surprised at all, nor do I blame filmmakers for using dummy trains instead of the real thing, real life steamers actually have several disadvantages in the world of film, some of the issues that we where presented with was - They wanted no smoke whilst the loco was in motion (the fire would go dead and then steam would fall), they wanted steam everywhere (in the height of summer this was near impossible without making the safety valves go off constantly which is never good for the boiler), standing around for hours on end to get the perfect shot (keeping the boiler going whilst not letting it cool down as much), too much noise (injectors, brake pumps, steam generators).
Basically I can fully see why props are used sometimes, you can control it fully without the need for a third party, you can do what you want without fear of damaging a historic piece of equipment that would be very expensive to repair, It’s cheaper mostly to have a prop. Steam locomotives and trains in general where not invented for film, they where invented to provide transportation, therefore it is much harder than people realise to bring that across on a film.
However, nothing does beat having the real thing, and no matter what CGI is used the real thing can always provide better atmosphere and better visuals, plus the money generated for the group who owns the rolling stock is always welcomed!
There are always two sides to everything.
The thing is, very few people in the film industry actually understand how hard it is to get a steam locomotive to do as you want it. It's like trying to make a farm horse do showjumping.
Love the intro
Love the movie
LOVE THE SOUNDTRACK!
Its one of my favourite films. Great work again Chris. RIP Sir Sean Connery
That scene at 9:33 gave me so many Murder On the orient express (1976) memories. What with railway/railroad films being so good
The Isle of Wight Central Railway (or its predecessor, the Cowes & Newport) were still using that style of coach in the 1870's - admittedly they bought nearly everything thery had second hand! I saw this film when first released and loved it - still do. Forget the anachronisms and technically errors - its a great, fast paced adventure.
Interestingly, there is a very much earlier film version of the story - may even be called 'The Great Train Robbery' - made in either the late 30's or 40's. A British film, can't remember who the cast were, save for a cetain old friend of ours, the L&MR 'Lion', together with the LMS built replica coaches. The 'anti-hero' has to swing his way along the footboards in that picture, and I remember his horror on realising there's a young lady looking out of the window. Does anyone else remember it?
Great Southern and Western Railway number 186 also starred in another film, not a railway film though.
It was in The wind that shakes the barley. But it was in it's normal guise.
It's also a great film by Ken Loach.
Did it also appear in an episode of 'Murder She Wrote' in which Jessica goes home to Ireland? A red painted 0-6-0 hauls a vintage train on a single track line 'somewhere in the west of auld Ireland', long, long after CIE had dieselised, in a programme which had ever single Irish-American stereotype of the 'Auld Country', save, perhaps, Maureen O'Hara on a donkey cart.
RIP Sean Connery, btw love the new intro
I have seen this movie ages ago, and it is still a good souvenir for me. The recreation of the historical setting is astounding, the scenario well written, and the actors top notch. For my own, I can pass over the few inaccuracies here and there. They were billiant UK films in the 70's, this one is one of them. I dare call it a classic.
Any love for the woman who went along the outside of flying Scotsman while it was at full speed in the Flying Scotsman movie?
I’m glad Chris reviewed this movie. I loved the movie plane and simple. Just wish I could find it on dvd. But I wanted to know his opinion of the film. Now I do. It’s a crying shame what happened to the locomotive in the film though. At the very least it deserves a cosmetic restoration and a place of prominence in a museum.
The museum already is full, or atleast the display area.186 is cosmetically restored and can be boarded. 184 is also fairly visible too. It's in the main loco shed at the front. And can be seen easily from the viewing section.
Though I do agree that she could do with cosmetic restoration, and her tender brought in from the wet. But it's a matter of funding and man power.
I bought a copy a month ago from amazon.de - the german version of amazon. As for your second question I do completely agree with you but other projects come first such as the restoration of no. 171 and the new-build mogul project. Theres only 2 engines fit for the main line in Ireland right now and overall theres fewer (broad gauge) engines in Ireland combined than there is Black 5s in preservation. Unfortunatley, the museum is at full capacity so her tender is stuck outside. Its not like she can be run on heritage lines either because there are none. There is one thats about 2 miles long but thats it. Unless she is nominated for a publicity tour in Australia or Hollywood gets in touch she wont be restored any time soon. 😞😞
I really feel the choice of engines was very good too as both no. 184 and 186 are both from the victorian era. Its a shame that thy are the most numerous class of broad gauge engines in Ireland. And on
P.s. on Chris's note about the railways being turned into cylceways, yeah. Thats true. A large amount of Irelands most scenic railways are bow cycle paths but on the bright side, only the down line is a cycle path on the mullingar and athlone branch so there is potentual there... if only the bloody government would fund it instead of MORE cycle paths.
@Matthew Tymczyszyn I know its ridiculous. At least in the UK you have railways and engines to run on them. We have fewer broad gauge engines in preservation than LMS Black Fives in preservation. It's depressing.
@@Spud607 I think there are more Irish locos of any gauge in Britain then there are broad gauge things in Ireland. Sad that.
@@ajaxengineco theres 19 broad gauge engines preserved in Ireland and yet our 15 guinea special was neither celebrated or commemorated since yet it happened 2 years after the real 15 guinea special. 18 2-6-4 tanks and a few other shunting engines were still in service in 1970. The last steam hauled service was in 1971 and yet one of those 2-6-4 tanks survive and none of their 2-6-0 counterparts exist anymore. Its a terrible shame. We never had a barry island scrapyard. We didnt habe money for engines as we just got our independence and had 3 wars in close proximity to eachother. Nobody had money nor interest to save the engines.
Lockdown is in England! England! ENGLAND!!!!! Rant over, great GTI as always. Keep it up and stay safe
Would you do a round up of the best railway films everyone should watch?
Now there's a suprising coïncidence !
I just finished reading the book which was very enjoyable. I had a sneaky feeling a film had been made but hadn't got round to researching the question. Thanks Chris. Good to see you back BTW.
Thank you Chris I enjoy your Gauge The Issue series.
I forgot all about this film!! :-)
Excellent in every way, particularly the music!
Great! Thanks!
It s a cleverly shot film, a regular one I watch! I especially like the camera shot as it draws away from the moving train with the sound of a skylark, clever! I am a railway buff but can overlook the imperfections like the 20th century girder bridge !😄
If I had a nickel for every time I heard that I could start my own preservation railway.
RIP Connery. The best man to play James Bond, and probably the best things about The Last Crusade. You will be missed.
I’ve never heard of this film, it might be worth a watch.
Welcome back!
The new theme fits perfectly
Agreed, the theme works very well.
I’m lovin the new music 👍👍
I'm sure if there was the funding & the man power then 184 might be restored. Or atleast one of the J15s/101s to working order. But at the moment there isn't enough of either.
At the moment I'd settle for even 461 to have a GSR engine running again. At the moment it's 2, on the way to 3 GNR(i) 4-4-0s and NCC 4-6-2T.
Chris, never took you for a headbanger :) - Love the new intro
Many years ago, I downloaded Vernian Process's tune "Crime of the century" from MySpace (remember when you could do that?) That particular track had a sample of Sean Connery talking about a plot to rob a moving train of gold destined to pay for the army in the Crimea.
Until watching this video I had no idea where that sample had come from. Thanks for sharing. Now I need to track down this movie and watch it.
Fantastic video once again Chris 👍🏻 looks like another movie I’ll have to add to the ‘watch list’
Keep up the great work and stay safe.
Love the new intro music!
Did he just saw Anthony Dawson? I love that guy’s YT channel. A collab would be awesome.
What time did Sean Connery expect to arrive in Wimbledon?
Tennish
Another good 'un, sir. Like the new music track! As for the film, wouldn't change a thing, it's what going to the movies are all about, strapping in and going for a rollicking ride.
The beginning of the short burst of the score you played sounded very similar to 'The Robbery' of 'Buster' so I wonder of Anne Dudley had seen this film (based on the 1963 Train Robbery of course) and been slightly influenced
I must say I thoroughly enjoyed this review regarding this film, I had actually seen it years earlier and love it and Sean Connery's performance.
And I have to ask since you brought buster keatons film up, have you thought of doing anything regarding his film "the general" or the only other film made about the Andrews raid Disney's "the Great Locomotive Chase from 1956?"
I have both films and love them deeply but nobody's ever really done a full-scale review on either of them.
And in regards to the Disney film made about the andrews raid, I'm going to just tell you straight up it is by no means happy and go lucky like disneys other more well known work, Walt Disney himself wanted it to be as accurate as possible at the time.
I think the second video is about Buster Keating
Great locomotive chase has so many great train scenes but again historical or operational anomalies. Very hard to get a copy of this movie any more too.
@@james.black981 I have a copy of both Buster Keaton's film and the Disney film on DVD and I've also seen the real locomotive used in the actual Chase though the Texas has since been cosmetically restored to an appearance it would have had in the later half of the 1800 most likely 20 to 30 years after the chase
Haha that Jim Royle reference was perfect! xD
I've seldom watched a lot of Railway films as of yet but this looks another really good one to watch.
P.s. Not sure about the new intro music - I like the guitars but I feel it's far too "loud" for the type of show GTI is, which is why I think the old intro tune worked. That being said, I don't blame you for trying something new with it - perhaps build around the old intro theme to have a bit more "spice" to it without changing the melody completely? Just my two pennies. Great video Chris. Keep up the good work!
excellent
Recently watched this film again....taking all of the inaccuracies etc., it was nevertheless a thumping great film!
Cracking GTI this week Chris 😀 Top song choice for your intro 👏 And godspeed Sean Connery 🙏
A nice gauge the issue I do like the new music may have to download that. If 184 will never return to steam maybe they could mock it up in it film guise and make a display of it in the museum at whitehead.
They've already cosmetically restored 186, so it'd be doable. But funds and man power are a limiting factor.
Well covered! I also love the intro and lyrics! Preferably temporary but still good nonetheless.
I think I remember catching part of this film...
Can you show us a closer look at the steam engine that was pulling that train
love the new intro
I think I have managed to buy John Coghlan's single for 79p. I am aware that you get bugger all monetary benefit from that. I fully intend to work my way up to finding a way of giving you a full English Pound when I enjoy one of your videos, if I am drunk enough at the time.
Like most of your film reviews: this film showcases a historical artefact that shows: railway history; and film making history. It's like the way Time Team episodes show the history of stuff; archaeology; and television documentary making.
Well done, and thank you.
I like the old gauge the issue theme
Very good video!
Great Intro!
I like the old theme song
Love the new music Chris!
I like the new intro/outro, but the old one is just classic. Here's an idea: for the outro, you could mix the two together - starting with the new one, have it abruptly cut at an approprate time and splice the old one in, and have it fade out. Could be cool.
pls Keep the old them song
At first I thought you were going to do a review of Thomas Edison's 1903 film of the same name.
Have you done/ would you consider a SOLE SLIP on ex:NCC/LMS No.4?
i prefer the original intro music it has more charm than this new one
Even though it was dressed up specially, the J15 looks absolutely stunning in the SER livery with a weatherboard. The lack of outside cranks and coupling rods does give the double frames away slightly, but it's not major enough to damage the look of the engine overall.
Yeah. Have you seen an image of her today though? She hasn't aged well to put it lightly.
@@Spud607 Bit of a shame really. Irish steam isn't in good health all round. Still, at least she's preserved.
@@ajaxengineco yeah. I just wish there were more engines. :(
@@Spud607 You mean funding and interest right? Cause there's more preserved that will run as it is.
@@NirateGoel in Ireland yeah. Theres just no interest for us here which is pretty sad because we had many very unique locomotives e.g. CIÉ CC1
I LOVE THE INTRO! And this was a great review to watch
Whare can I find this movie
Can you do a review of Disney's The Great Locomotive Chase? Also, why are there so many different kinds of ways to cupping trains around the world?
Combination of evolution/revolution. On the very first railways in the UK the simplest way of coupling vehicles was to just sling a chain between them. You then needed some sort of bumpers for when wagons were being pushed and the chain went slack. Wooden blocks or "dumb" buffers were used, but as steam locomotives were introduced and wagons got heavy better cushioning was required and sprung buffers were used instead. As railways spread throughout the UK and Europe they standardised on this system, which has evolved in to what is still used today. In the US however, they started with link and pin. Although simple and did not require buffers as you could push with it as well as pull, it had a serious safety drawback - you could only couple vehicles as they were pushed together, and someone had to stand between the vehicles both to guide the link in place and drop the pin in at the right moment, unlike the three link chain where you could just nip between the stationary vehicles and swing the chain over. You could even use a pole to swing the chain over so you did not need to go between vehicles at all. Consequently there were many instances of people being crushed to death in America when it went wrong. An alternative had to be found, and that is where the invention of the revolutionary automatic knuckle coupler came in. It soon became the AAR standard, and most railroads based on American practice adopted it or something similar. Many smaller independent railways developed their own style of automatic coupling, like the chopper coupling often found on narrow gauge railways. Unfortunately in Europe the idea of standardisation has been dropped, and there is a whole multitude of incompatible automatic couplings used as each manufacturer comes up with their own idea, alongside the evolution of chain and sprung buffers.
@@Titan604 Thanks for the information.
It’s funny he said they were dummy frames and you can see the side rods under them
The lack of outside cranks and coupling rods does give it away slightly. Still, I reckon it would've been really difficult to get them right.
@@ajaxengineco very true. Still though, the fact they even tried to do outside frames and that they don't look terrible is mighty impressive.
the film was great But I've thought that is was 1890's or later
lock down. my girl friend is stuck in carlisle with a sick mom who has stage 4 breast cancer. so that ruins my holiday.
That's awful. My best wishes go to all three of you. Please do take it easy
Just Hang in there, my sister also has breast cancer, but luckily is responding well to Chemo. It does mean I cannot visit her as if she gets Covid it could kill her.
Sole slips on the ret of thr preserved irish locomotives, there only a few more to go anyway!
Can you make a video on greenways and reviving old railway lines?
Greenways just arn't the same in my eyes. Suee an empty trackbed leaves imagination but a cyclepath is boring. Its just concrete. Its completely and utterly wasteful of what could be a brilliant heritage route.
@@Spud607 It preseveres the right-of-way from having buildings, farmland, or other stuff built on top.
@@WesternOhioInterurbanHistory But it also removes any realistic chance of restoring them. The youghal line for instance would be a great commuter line, but now may never see a train again.
Elsewhere, we're not in lockdown.
Great new music! Thank you for this video! This has always been one of my favorite train-related movies, and the score is first rate! In fact, the beginning credits with the soaring theme, the train at full gallop is glorious!
S I C C intro!
I mean the new music is really good, but I don't think Gauge the issue is the place it belongs in. I mean the new music would be excellent for something slightly faster paced and with a bit more action, but gauge the issue is a relatively slow paced, discussion and debate show so to speak, and the music doesn't particularly fit that bill.
The intro music is good in my opinion but it just doesn't fit, the old intro tho basic just fits the mood of this a lot more. Granted this is just my opinion
hmmmm i like the old one
I don’t really like the new intro music, I like the simpler original music better tbh.
Same
Same too.
yes
Agreed
Yeah
Sorry Chris, but I really don't like the new intro music. It just doesn't fit.
Sounds like Scotty Kilmer for trains XD
Sounds like a montage scene from a movie about trucking.
@@MatecaCorp Whereas the original actually sounded like something steam-related.
I like the original song better
You probably should bash at Thomas the tank engine as much as you have. Without a doubt heritage rail, British or not. Have been affected by Chris awdry. Many young rail enthusiasts, like me have looked more into steam locomotives because of him
Pardon me, but I haven't even come close to 'bashing' Thomas in well over two years now.
I'm not the one moaning about the direction that the franchise has gone, or calling out the vocal minority of the fandom over all of the mess they've brought up this year, nor have I ever actually said Thomas was bad, rubbish or hateful.
If anything, I said over 18 months ago that Thomas is perfectly fine. But, people don't like to pay attention to that part.
There's people on Twitter who take pot shots at Thomas far more publicly and daily than me
The RWS is actually quite good. Awdry meant it to be accurate. It's the TVS with all the merchandising and pandering that gives railways the whole 'Thomas' stigma.