I can provide some insight on why Sunman was scrapped. Sunsoft still had the rights to Superman. They released a Superman game on Sega Genesis the same year that Sunman was scheduled to be released, 1992. Sunman releasing at the same time would have likely caused issues with their license with DC, as the characters were near identical, and they weren't willing to risk losing a license or possible litigation. Sunsoft knew what happened with the original Captain Marvel (now known as Shazam!) and wasn't gonna take that risk.
Wait, this doesn't add up. According to the video, Sunsoft wasn't able to to get the license. But they released Superman for the Genesis in 1992. So they had the license. Unless the licensing for NES Superman games is different for Genesis Superman games.
I don’t hear enough people talking about unreleased games like this - not as some spooky supernatural mystery, but really going into the production and why things are the way they are. There’s a lot of prototypes that have surfaced over the years id love to see videos about. It’s fun to imagine what might have been if any of them ever got completed and released!
I think the best part of this Superman/Sunman game is the blurry objects flying in front of the train stages. It would've been just as easy to do them as regular telephone poles, but the indistinct graphics add a lot to the impression of speed.
I remember renting return of the joker as a kid and I was blown away by the graphics. I can't remember exactly when it was released but we talked about either the genesis or the snes and how "similar" it was to some of those games in the graphics.
That's hilarious that DC didn't understand that video games need a challenge. "Your character must not die." Imagen if they went with that just to get the license 😂
@ZipplyZane mind blown. But we can't have him faint like a Pokémon hehe.. or can we.. I suppose there could be a time limit where the bad guy escapes or a bomb goes off killing a victim and then you have to retry mission. Something like that. Nah screw it.. he should just faint lol Or like Superman 64 where you just fly through rings and nothing hurts you. 😆 Oh now I understand why that game was made! Lol
They could have a situation in which the bad dudes were holding a politician hostage, and Zod challenges Supes “Are you a super enough man to rescue Ronnie?” And there’s a time limit or something. Maybe Batman got brainwashed and attacks you, but you can’t hurt him because he’s just under hypnotic control. I feel there are mountains of DC stories that could’ve been adapted into a game where the hero can’t be hurt.
Or you have to get to a bomb to disarm. Or divert an incoming asteroid from hitting Earth. Lots of potential time-limited scenarios for a Superman game.
This could have been one of the best, if not the best Superman game ever created. Perhaps a regenerative health bar would have been a good addition instead of the invulnerability that DC Comics wanted. A slightly larger ROM with more stages would also be welcome, as the game is beautiful and has a good setting with parallax effects that weren't so common in 8-bit games.
@@PhilipMarcYT I didn't think the gameplay was bad, I just thought it was a rather ambitious project for the NES hardware. Perhaps they could have made a more extensive and colorful game in an arcade version and then ported it to home consoles.
I would imagine that health pickups and item pickups would have been added to the final game. I always hoped a more final build would be found but it seems from your video that a complete version of Sunman wasn’t ever completed.
"DC wanted Superman go be invincible in his game" Why was this not an issue in Kemco and Taito's Superman games? Or when Sunsoft later made a Superman game on the Genesis? And I loved Return of the Joker as a kid. I actually thought it was even better than its predecessor.
I've always liked the idea of a Superman game where you (mostly) can't be damaged. My idea is this: Two damage meters. The first one is for Superman himself and almost nothing affects it. Bullets, lasers, bombs, etc. All of it does nothing. The only exceptions would be boss battles against characters like Darkseid, Brainiac, or Doomsday. The second life bar would be for everybody else. It would represent the citizens of Metropolis, innocent bystanders, etc. Protection of this life bar would force the player to place Superman between the bullets, lasers, bombs, etc so they don't hit innocent civilians. Combining this in some of the end boss levels, so that Superman has to protect the innocent while still not taking so much damage that he himself dies, would be a great challenge. The endings to the game would depend on how much total damage the innocents took, with the absolute best ending occurring only if the civilians bar NEVER took a single point of damage.
I can already see comments comparing Sunman to Superman. This reminds me of Journey to Silius (NES) which was actually Terminator, but they didn't get/keep the license. One day I need to beat JTS, it also has awesome graphics for NES - I think JTS and Sunman have alot in common.
absolutely. the only difference is that JTS received a release but Sunman did not. i wonder what would have happen if it did receive a release. btw JTS is a decent game, fantastic music.
Sunsoft was a terribly underrated company back in the day... Gamers knew what was up with Sunsoft, but your average kid never seemed to know that Sunsoft titles were often on par with what Konami and Capcom were putting out. Just stumbled across your channel about a week ago, @POJR, and you put out some quality stuff, my dude... Pointless but amusing fact: every time you show up on screen for the first time in each video I hear honorable Arthur Morgan say "You got a real kind face, Mister". 😂😅🤣😂
Maybe it was supposed to be more like 10 or 15 levels, stretching it it. But if the controls didn't work well, that might have been enough to scrap it if they couldn't improve them.
I have a question for you. Do you know about any unauthorized SNES games other than 3D NOAH'S ARK? I have a really weird European sports ROM called futbol 96. It has some sound samples since I can't read the language or understand the rules that it's frustrating. However, I think it really is an unauthorized super Nintendo title from that time what have you got to say about that. Cool videos on your channel. Would love to see more videos on unauthorized releases for consoles. Thank you, Sal.
It costs a lot of money to fabricate cartridges. They likely figured that any game that game from this wouldn't sell well enough to justify the money they were spending. I'm sure there are lots of games that were similarly scrapped for monetary reasons during development. Sometimes its better to use 40% of the budget to see if a game is gonna be any good rather than using 100% of the budget and taking your chances when you really don't think it will work.
i saw a huge channel talking about your video one time, he didnt even give you props, he just said that he made this one game better for atari, saying atari had better hardware than nintendo, he was scrolling through your video explaining and when i realized your name on it, i closed his channel and came here . He dont deserve the view, he could have atleast credit you for the video .
@@pojr czcams.com/video/MCi5h84_rs0/video.html . I know there was a bigger youtuber that had it as well . i guess this guy does mention your name in the beginning . Maybe the other guy was the one who didnt mentioned it . Thats how i discovered the pojr channel, he kept speaking and i noticed he kept playing a video with the name on it.
It's so unfortunate that we got that turd of a Superman game instead of that expanded Arcade version. It would have been real high on people's lists by the look of the prototype.
Does anyone happen to have info on what mapper/board type Sunman was programmed for? I was looking for ways I could put a rom of this on a donor cartridge, but without info like this, I don't think I can find a compatible donor.
And how about this, I subscribed. Got one more for you. A Chinese bootleg console game that's actually good? SOUL EDGE. This is a bootleg game for the mega drive uses three buttons. Pretty damn good control and looks really nice.
**shrugs** Of course Superman can fly infinitely...but that isnt a problem so long as it is well balanced by...for example only allowing him to shoot heat vision in the direction he is flying.
Honestly the game still looks unfinished. And the music sounds "off", not in a good way. They should've made sunman a Shooter instead and replaced the sprite with a robot with wings. If they were afraid of the similarities with Superman.
I can provide some insight on why Sunman was scrapped. Sunsoft still had the rights to Superman. They released a Superman game on Sega Genesis the same year that Sunman was scheduled to be released, 1992. Sunman releasing at the same time would have likely caused issues with their license with DC, as the characters were near identical, and they weren't willing to risk losing a license or possible litigation. Sunsoft knew what happened with the original Captain Marvel (now known as Shazam!) and wasn't gonna take that risk.
I was thinking that may have been the reason. They should have just changed the character from a human to a spaceship with arms
this is huge! never realized this.
Wait, this doesn't add up. According to the video, Sunsoft wasn't able to to get the license. But they released Superman for the Genesis in 1992. So they had the license. Unless the licensing for NES Superman games is different for Genesis Superman games.
@@StriderVM Sunsoft had the Superman license, but DC had the final say. DC wasn't on board with the NES version 5:34
@@FeralInferno Even if thats the case, the Genesis and NES versions have a lot of similarities right?
I don’t hear enough people talking about unreleased games like this - not as some spooky supernatural mystery, but really going into the production and why things are the way they are.
There’s a lot of prototypes that have surfaced over the years id love to see videos about. It’s fun to imagine what might have been if any of them ever got completed and released!
thanks! i do plan on covering more prototype releases.
I think the best part of this Superman/Sunman game is the blurry objects flying in front of the train stages. It would've been just as easy to do them as regular telephone poles, but the indistinct graphics add a lot to the impression of speed.
I remember renting return of the joker as a kid and I was blown away by the graphics. I can't remember exactly when it was released but we talked about either the genesis or the snes and how "similar" it was to some of those games in the graphics.
That 8-bit arrangement of the Superman theme was awesome! Shame it never got any use.
right! i had to include it in this video.
One of the original Lost Levels members here, thanks for mentioning the forum!
I love how varied and well researched your content is mate, every vid has some unique facts I've never heard before!
That's hilarious that DC didn't understand that video games need a challenge.
"Your character must not die."
Imagen if they went with that just to get the license 😂
You could do it. Just have him fail but not die. I mean, Pokemon only faint, after all, and that works.
@ZipplyZane mind blown.
But we can't have him faint like a Pokémon hehe.. or can we..
I suppose there could be a time limit where the bad guy escapes or a bomb goes off killing a victim and then you have to retry mission. Something like that.
Nah screw it.. he should just faint lol
Or like Superman 64 where you just fly through rings and nothing hurts you. 😆
Oh now I understand why that game was made! Lol
They could have a situation in which the bad dudes were holding a politician hostage, and Zod challenges Supes “Are you a super enough man to rescue Ronnie?” And there’s a time limit or something. Maybe Batman got brainwashed and attacks you, but you can’t hurt him because he’s just under hypnotic control. I feel there are mountains of DC stories that could’ve been adapted into a game where the hero can’t be hurt.
In some of the Wario Land games he is indestructible.
"Superman cannot be harmed, and cannot die." Easy. Time based game. You rescue hostages or you fail.
Or you have to get to a bomb to disarm. Or divert an incoming asteroid from hitting Earth. Lots of potential time-limited scenarios for a Superman game.
"It all started with that smile, that da*m smile" 🤭 Hey man, I'm loving your videos. This channel is amazing!
This could have been one of the best, if not the best Superman game ever created. Perhaps a regenerative health bar would have been a good addition instead of the invulnerability that DC Comics wanted. A slightly larger ROM with more stages would also be welcome, as the game is beautiful and has a good setting with parallax effects that weren't so common in 8-bit games.
They'd need to severely restrict the flying so as not to feel like cheating/cheap.
@@PhilipMarcYT I didn't think the gameplay was bad, I just thought it was a rather ambitious project for the NES hardware. Perhaps they could have made a more extensive and colorful game in an arcade version and then ported it to home consoles.
I would imagine that health pickups and item pickups would have been added to the final game. I always hoped a more final build would be found but it seems from your video that a complete version of Sunman wasn’t ever completed.
"DC wanted Superman go be invincible in his game"
Why was this not an issue in Kemco and Taito's Superman games? Or when Sunsoft later made a Superman game on the Genesis?
And I loved Return of the Joker as a kid. I actually thought it was even better than its predecessor.
I've always liked the idea of a Superman game where you (mostly) can't be damaged. My idea is this: Two damage meters. The first one is for Superman himself and almost nothing affects it. Bullets, lasers, bombs, etc. All of it does nothing. The only exceptions would be boss battles against characters like Darkseid, Brainiac, or Doomsday.
The second life bar would be for everybody else. It would represent the citizens of Metropolis, innocent bystanders, etc. Protection of this life bar would force the player to place Superman between the bullets, lasers, bombs, etc so they don't hit innocent civilians. Combining this in some of the end boss levels, so that Superman has to protect the innocent while still not taking so much damage that he himself dies, would be a great challenge.
The endings to the game would depend on how much total damage the innocents took, with the absolute best ending occurring only if the civilians bar NEVER took a single point of damage.
I can already see comments comparing Sunman to Superman. This reminds me of Journey to Silius (NES) which was actually Terminator, but they didn't get/keep the license. One day I need to beat JTS, it also has awesome graphics for NES - I think JTS and Sunman have alot in common.
absolutely. the only difference is that JTS received a release but Sunman did not. i wonder what would have happen if it did receive a release. btw JTS is a decent game, fantastic music.
classic sunsoft... making really impressive games that are way too short
This is great news! Now, the amazing romhacking community will be able to create gems with that engine.
Sunsoft was a terribly underrated company back in the day... Gamers knew what was up with Sunsoft, but your average kid never seemed to know that Sunsoft titles were often on par with what Konami and Capcom were putting out.
Just stumbled across your channel about a week ago, @POJR, and you put out some quality stuff, my dude... Pointless but amusing fact: every time you show up on screen for the first time in each video I hear honorable Arthur Morgan say "You got a real kind face, Mister". 😂😅🤣😂
One thing in certain, Sunsoft really had great soundtracks.
Maybe it was supposed to be more like 10 or 15 levels, stretching it it. But if the controls didn't work well, that might have been enough to scrap it if they couldn't improve them.
Sure looks like the Superman arcade game from Taito.
I have a question for you. Do you know about any unauthorized SNES games other than 3D NOAH'S ARK? I have a really weird European sports ROM called futbol 96. It has some sound samples since I can't read the language or understand the rules that it's frustrating. However, I think it really is an unauthorized super Nintendo title from that time what have you got to say about that. Cool videos on your channel. Would love to see more videos on unauthorized releases for consoles. Thank you, Sal.
It costs a lot of money to fabricate cartridges. They likely figured that any game that game from this wouldn't sell well enough to justify the money they were spending. I'm sure there are lots of games that were similarly scrapped for monetary reasons during development. Sometimes its better to use 40% of the budget to see if a game is gonna be any good rather than using 100% of the budget and taking your chances when you really don't think it will work.
Looks a lot like the arcade Superman game from the 80s... I wonder if that was sunsoft too
That was Taito
Kirby: Am I a joke to you?
i saw a huge channel talking about your video one time, he didnt even give you props, he just said that he made this one game better for atari, saying atari had better hardware than nintendo, he was scrolling through your video explaining and when i realized your name on it, i closed his channel and came here . He dont deserve the view, he could have atleast credit you for the video .
Interesting. What channel was it? Thanks for letting me know.
@@pojr czcams.com/video/MCi5h84_rs0/video.html . I know there was a bigger youtuber that had it as well . i guess this guy does mention your name in the beginning . Maybe the other guy was the one who didnt mentioned it . Thats how i discovered the pojr channel, he kept speaking and i noticed he kept playing a video with the name on it.
Sunman...fighter of the Nightman
Think how Sunsoft would have fared had they held onto the licenses for Superman & The Terminator.
It's so unfortunate that we got that turd of a Superman game instead of that expanded Arcade version. It would have been real high on people's lists by the look of the prototype.
Does anyone happen to have info on what mapper/board type Sunman was programmed for? I was looking for ways I could put a rom of this on a donor cartridge, but without info like this, I don't think I can find a compatible donor.
And how about this, I subscribed. Got one more for you. A Chinese bootleg console game that's actually good? SOUL EDGE. This is a bootleg game for the mega drive uses three buttons. Pretty damn good control and looks really nice.
Thanks
**shrugs** Of course Superman can fly infinitely...but that isnt a problem so long as it is well balanced by...for example only allowing him to shoot heat vision in the direction he is flying.
"Honestly, this could pass for a sega genesis game" hmm... don't stretch it. Master System maybe... genesis... forget it. It does look nice though.
The download link doesn't work 😢
whats the backgrounnd music at 11:15 ?
It's from Cosmic Carnage on the 32x.
Seems like it had potential, oh well..
If you have played one nes platformer, you have played them all.
Honestly the game still looks unfinished. And the music sounds "off", not in a good way.
They should've made sunman a Shooter instead and replaced the sprite with a robot with wings. If they were afraid of the similarities with Superman.
The constant flying isn't just annoying, but feels like cheating. 😕
It probably also didn't help that Superman on NES was licensed to Kemco.
Don't bother, that game is lousy.