Thank you all again for the 700 subscriber milestone! I really appreciate the support and am always glad you're enjoying the videos :) I really hope this tierlist helps you when choosing backgrounds in Legends Mod. (Don't forget the spreadsheet)
You're really underrated man, great well thought out guide with a lot of effort and expertise put into it. I believe you'd be far more popular if battle brothers itself was.
Well done on 700, im sure you will go far, your enthusiasm for the game is amazing, the viewer feels the pain of every bro who dies and the satisfaction of every max roll :) keep up the good work. Interesting tier list, i should defo try out more shepherds i usually ignore them! one thing im looking for at the mo is an adventurous noble with stars in resolve/ranged and fearsome... that feels like it could be a devastating combo Syko
Thanks man! Appreciate the kind comments and support :) I'll keep at it and love that you guys love it! Hope shepherds show you how good they can be & maybe resolve/range for fearsome might be nice. Didn't think about the feasome build, bit expensive to grab them for that but you never know, it just might work :)
I waited for this video! 😄 So I play a lot myself so most of this I learned through trial and error combat efficiency-wise, but I'd love your tier list (of maybe only the more common backgrounds) of a "best bang for your buck" type deal, or "recommended picks for each price range". Maybe as a document so you don't have to do another 1.3hour video 😆 Great video and thank you for valuable info! Praise Davkul!
Thanks :) Glad it was able to help you! Trial and error is the way we all learn haha. Cost-effective pricing range sounds like a good idea. It wouldn't be that long though haha, most likely a nice condensed video to help your purchases :) Davkul FTW :)
Glad it was able to help :) I do need to keep working on putting out more 'guide/help' videos, but I do always have my helpful spreadsheet if you like looking at stats and such :) Links to my stuff are in the description (or here too: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WIUyYNJNEnHTwRZNfeyqVkH1fyt6xMBGl8OcP4RAYLo/edit#gid=0 )
hey indomitable new subscriber i saw and love battle brothers because of you! keep on doing the works bruv i know that not a lot of people love and know battle brothers but just like what you did to me people will know and learn to love battle brothers through your game plays
I agree with your list, i just put gravediggers and fishermen A tier, only because some runs, i have amazing grave diggers with amazing stars and they are fun to play, and fishermen because of one of my run, before beast and exploration. I played full dagger company to loot everything. They were not so much enemies to deal with, daggers were excellent for everyone. I had a lot of fun with daggers. And in this company, one of my two best bro was a fishermen, fully armored, he had 120+ fatigue left, and 100+ melee skill, without any stars in melee skill. I had only best rolls. (he still reached 100+ after the level 11)
Enjoyed your video. Will just put some of my personal thoughts, but because I play vanilla (DLC included) and not Legends, perhaps won't be too accurate to compare to Legends mode. Monk/Nun are great bannerman, because they have a lot of positive events and can increase their resolve through the game, in comparison other cheap bannerman backgrounds have some negative events related to them and rarely can grow their resolve. Peddler is also great early-game flank-holder with his high defense and economical impact (in Legends mode), so definitely in those circumstances can jump a tier until a better recruit show himself. Deserter is comparable stat-wise (range of stats included) to most of your A tier backgrounds and aside from his low resolve, which can be patched to reasonable levels reliably with trinket, arena and bannerman presence, he can outperform a lot of the others in there (A tier) such as the Manhunter and Militia. Is Juggler having 10% chance to hit the head in Legends, it's just 5% in vanilla (where Killer on the run have 10%) ?
All good, I'm glad you enjoyed it. Vanilla is great and there are some similarities but something are also very different too :) Thank you for putting the time into a nice big comment and I'll try to reply/explain myself well. With brothers I usually don't mind events too much (negative ones are annoying but usually not game or brother-breaking) but relying on random events for stats and such isn't very reliable. Removing dumb is good for monks though, I agree. Peddlers can sometimes have a nice defence roll, true, but so can a bunch of the B/C tiers, where most of them can just hold a shield in the early game and survive on a flank. However, the reliability of a peddler is rather low in most circumstances. I did mention the trading/barter benefit for a peddler and for that reason they are good (maybe even up a tier for trading playthroughs), but most of the time you will not be happy with how they perform or survive in combat and just grab them for their barter. (Early game the barter doesn't help that much in my opinion as you don't have much money to work with. Peddlers are more of a mid-later game choice in my opinion) Deserter are similar stat-wise to militia & manhunters but I definitely wouldn't say they that are better than the A-tier options, sorry. Yes, there are ways to work on their resolve but the reliable methods are hard and way too much effort to make the deserter background 'viable'. Winning 11 arenas with abysmal resolve is not an easy task unless you carry them with 2 amazing brothers. Banners effectiveness really diminishes with distance so it's not always a reliable source of resolve throughout a fight. I just cannot agree with you because the fact that you have to put all this effort into 'fixing' the deserter when you can just buy a militia or manhunter that doesn't need fixing, with practically the same stats & price, just makes them the better choice 99% of the time. The Juggler & Killer on the Run both have 10% extra chance to hit the head (35% base) in legends which is really nice :)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman Thanks for the reply. I was not stating that the things I said were solid, just my thinking process. Like events are not really that important, but in the case of Monks they have a lot of those, so some of them will eventually emerge and they have some which are great (when you have fight between Hedge Knights for example) and the fact that he as others cheap background with higher resolve that can turn into a bannerman, can further increase it. I mean - overall I think he is the best cheap background for that purpose alone, as others are similar, but lack the ability to further increase it. Also ... nice for role-playing :D Peddlers are just like any other C tier background I completely agree, they have mediocre rolls on all stats defense aside and so as any of them (just like you say) how 'decent' (as they never ever will be 'good') depends on luck of the dice. Yet their defense score is much higher then the average and for the early game with a shield in hand can do a great flank-holder who will eventually be replaced, due to better recruit taking his place or a hit to the head ... whatever comes first. Deserters indeed have serious problem with their resolve, but it's not 'that' bad depending on other things, but a low-rolled militia and high rolled deserter the difference is not that big, but his other stats are on average great and as he is cheap background can be considered slightly stronger and more cost-efficient. So if he is not worthy of A-tier, should be considered top of B tier at least. In Arenas I always aim to do 2 guys in the front which will win the fight and one in the back with ranged/reach weapon with a shield in his backpack ready to be carried and leech of anything which is not a threat.
@@dtibvgz8441 All good, I'm glad we can have a good discussion and talk about the game :) I am a cultist supporter at heart and that will always clash with a monk supporter haha, but I can't deny that monks are good. (for all the good reasons you have stated as well) I'd say peddler defence is just average but yeah, a shield in hand they can survive (hopefully) a flank for a bit :) I mean, expecting high-rolling deserters is just like expecting high-rolling anything. Almost anything high-rolling is good. On average, a Deserter is usually too much work to make good on the front-lines for the cost but I still believe they are a good background for sure. Backline is the easier choice and they'll be able to hold any stray flankers for a short while if they don't break. I can agree they are top of B-tier if you can get some higher rolls for their resolve but if you low roll they're horrible. (which is why they're B-tier: good but needs a little luck) That is a good arena strat which I also have used (the shield on the backliner is a good idea. Might have to add that in myself). 3 strong melee works but if you have 2 great babysitters you can afford a slightly weaker 3rd for sure :)
Definitely true if you can manage his fatigue, but that is a tricky job. If you can, I do agree that iron lungs for the party is a nice boon. Maybe the Qiyan (with hopefully iron lungs themselves) can provide a more reliable 'minstrel-support-service' :)
Glad to hear you had fun with the slave start :) I will need to play that one eventually but yeah, not to sold on the end-game viability. It seems to be more of a challenge run of sorts but definitly a different way to play the game haha.
One thing about the begger, i think the barter can justify almost a c tier and is, i think a c tier, in the trader origin. The low wage will make so the barter bonus will pay the cost and daily wage if you'r trading and that makes them money making slave in the long run. But you only justify them in mid to late if they are 2 or 3 stare high roll slinger. Also, that % barter affects delivery quest gold rewards.
Ahh yes, they do come with a 1% innate barter. I can see the benefit to trading runs as 2 beggers equals a peddler in the early game for such a cheap price. As long as you avoid combat, that does seem nice. I'd definitely say save your money for a peddler to last you through to late game but maybe they can be just throwaway brothers. High rolling range attack for slinging is ok, but that's really pushing their effectiveness with low Fat and Hp, he's gonna struggle alot even with high rolls. Thanks for the info and it's nice to know that barter helps with deliveries as they're not usually high paying quests. :)
Great guide. Where's your stat spreadsheet linked? I just jumped into Legends, trying to figure out crafting. A list of perks guarantees per background with "dynamic perk placement on" would be super useful. I hate finding a great bro, but doesn't have berserk or something lol
Glad to hear it was helpful :) I don't have a list of perks that are guaranteed per background and I'm not sure of the guarenteed perks as they've probably changed over the different versionof the mod. My stats spreadsheet is linked in the description and will help when looking at the stats of bro's and comparing them. (It also has some help with the benefits of each background e.g. map movement speed increase, camping modifiers, etc)
One time I started campaign with 3 random brothers and one of them had necrosavant background! Also he had some unique perks like teleportation and he could eat dead enemy bodies and restore 50hp. But I didn't tested him and decided to play an other origin
Yes, necrosavant-bros are a rare background that can only spawn in at the start of a campaign when you choose a "random bros" origin. Definitely cool and fun, but not a normal 'recruitable' sadly :(
Glad you're enjoying the content and finding it helpful. Haven't had a chance to update the spreadsheet for the oathtaker and anatomist backgrounds yet :(
Definitely nice as a little bit of recovery. (But 4hp isn't much if a guy is bleeding or getting smacked by 2h's haha) I prefer the fatigue recovery song :)
They do have lack-luster stats and all backgrounds can roll good stars. Since they have a higher up-front cost compared to other 'trash' backgrounds, the 0 cost per day doesn't 'break even' for a long time. 0 cost per day can be fun and abused for certain runs, but in general, buying other cheap backgrounds is better imo :)
The timestamp for Housemaid has extended into Hunter's and the Hunter's stamp should be changed to Indebtor's (description is correct but the youtube timestamp is not)
Random thought: I just watched a video about “baker’s lung” recently, and it got me thinking that the baker background should actually have lower fatigue. Or maybe a higher chance of being asthmatic.
Definitely an interesting 'weighted' trait/stat interation as many jobs in that era were bad on the lungs (notably seen in the miner background) Would be neat if they did something for the baker in the future :)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman completely unrelated, but it’d be nice if they added an option for realistic logistics, maybe expanding on the non-combat retinue system. Something like needing wagons, donkeys, etc. for carrying supplies, wounded brothers or loot. If a brother isn’t carrying it, someone or something has to. It would give some real value to backgrounds like beggar and cripple. Of course, the option of turning it off should probably be available too.
Not that I know of, but regardless of diminishing returns, the value of melee defence is still important. Most brothers in the game can't ever go above 50 (without a shield) and most of your brothers will be using either 2H's or 1H-duelists. Shieldmaidens get insane melee defence but more is still better when your building a tank. :)
I know this is a year ago, but what's your OP on the Pilgrims? I've been playing Solo Crusader alot and I get Pilgrims alot, I recognize them are mediocre melee only tho and very rare decent ranged, but almost always nimble, high resolve.
Pilgrims are a specific background only found in the crusader start. I made this list based on the general recruits you could find in any run. I'm not 100% on pilgrims, but they're pretty good and I think their stats can be rather varied. Still a good pickup as far as I know :)
Ah I see, ngl in legends the pilgrims are really good for the spear main nim/med tanks and shield. They get defense rolls up to 5-10 and melee rolls till 70-85 And almost always have mind over body which is great with the spears perks you find
Not long ago i played the Battle Sister Origin and got a male cannibal to join my group at level 11 he had 130 melee skill and in 200 days did not give any permanent injuries to my other people. So i cant understand why cannibal is E-Tier
I have a minstrel on my team that has war chant and by round 2 has my entire band at confident morale in battle which helps in so so many ways. I would honestly move them to B tier honestly
Appreciate the thoughts, and I've slowly warmed up to minstrels (Qiyan as well for the better stats) as they can be a nice support for the party. I still build my parties to be self sufficient and do not require a minstrel in my setups, but for large parties I can see that their benefits can help in sticky situations. It's possible that I might have to move them up a tier :)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman I got a few wolves through some events over a thousand days. They are the same niche but they are so good when it's time to run people down
On average, hunters will give you a better range stat (even if by a few points) and will still do better with low rolls, compared to the ranged nobles. Yes, I do agree most of their stats are rather similar but the cost-effectiveness for hunters is always better in my opinion. :) (They're also easier to find as nobles are rare) Thanks for your opinion though, the stats aren't too different for sure.
Yes, that's true :) Indebted outside of the manhunter origin are not very special or strong, but being capped at lvl 7 is super rough (and that origin is definitely near the bottom of my list lol)
I found that militia is severely nerfed now. I think their range of HP is now 30-55 or something like that. I've gotten tricked by so many militias with stars in matk and mdef but their hp was like 33. They also have a bias AGAINST colossus now. Most militias I've recruited do not have colossus where as miners, brawlers usually do. Militia have become just polearm bros for me. I now just recruit miners early game their matk is really high, hp really high (always have colossus too). Low fat so I make them into nimble or medium armor.
Good question. Currently worldwide-magic is not available as the mod creators said it needs some work. This means you can't find magic-based backgrounds (like the evoker) or brothers who get lucky magic perks (when using dynamic perks). Only way to get magic backgrounds is by starting with them, from your origin (or random solo, duo, party start) Hope this helps :) P.S. older versions of the mod could have some magic backgrounds as recruits and lucky brothers with magic perks. Not sure how stable they are nowadays because the base game has updated as well. Probably best to play with magic starts and wait for the magic update (I can't wait!) :)
@@fairtoki1685 Magic is fun, hope you enjoy it. If you check the discord, lots of people have seeds for the 'random party' which can have magic in them. Also the 'Seer' origin has magic missile and chain lightning (the classic mage) or there are others like the necromancer (warlock) or druid origins :)
can u post a document or spreadsheet with this tier list? Ur current spreadsheet tier list is with icons, but I think with letters, it will be more helpful. May be other ppl want it with icons, but for me, I prefer tier list with letters, thz mate
@@zarlay255 Haven't done vanilla content yet on the channel (and I haven't played vanilla in a while) Its a good idea but it might have to wait a bit soz.
Hey, thanks for the suggestion (and sorry for the late reply) I'll add it to my video list and definitely consider the idea. There are a lot of perks in legends and even more in PTR so it may be a long vid but I'll have a think :)
No cripple is good I got one with 2 stars in range and melee defense and 1 star in melee skill he end up being the last survivor of a mission we’re I went after the barbarian king after killing 5 enemies but a lot of luck needed
I love your vid but i have to disagree with most of the list . Servant is actually S tier because of the out combat utilities , they can multi task cooking and barter with lowest cost , alchemist can too but expensive , maid also does but field triage isn't that useful . Monks and nuns are S tier too because guaranted peaceful and healing pray perks, also dirt cheap ,make them best banner men . Qiyan , troubadour and minstrel also deserve better ranks because of cheer on being broken in some origins , with Qiyan being worse than the other two because lower resolve but can be broken if you find a golden lute because they have higher attack and better combat perks . Adventurous lady is actually best archer due to resolve+perfect focus and guaranted counter archer perk ( which gives 33% bonus on covered targets ) .Legend mod isn't all about combat stats .
Thanks for your personal opinions on the matter :) This list was more focussed on the combat aspects and viabilities of each background as BB is mostly combat-orientated. Playing and using brothers for their out-of-combat benefits is definitely a strategy but not one that I, and probably most players, recruit for. (except in the times you want to get the requirement for a retinue slot or specific perk or other requirement like blacksmiths) I'm glad you enjoyed the vid but I'll have to respectfully disagree with your placements of S-tier servants and monks/nuns. If you want a cook, a butcher can easly provide good & cheap combat stats while adding one or 2 cook perks to get the retinue slot and/or a required cooking style. If you require a paymaster (for the retinue or the reduced pay) you can easily grab a qiyan to have a useful supporting 'minstrel' background. Peaceful and praying perks are not that useful to be honest and I wouldn't recruit bros just for that ability (and they are not 100% required on a banner). A banner is a reach weapon that can be utilized more strongly with a polearm brother and you can easily get 100+ resolve with many different backgrounds (including my favourite cultists, cheap and able to do anything) The supporting qiyan, minstrel and troubadour are a 'hotly debated' set of backgrounds, as stated in the video, and some people prefer them more (which is no issue). I do believe the qiyan is haf-decent and the better choice when wanting a support background but I still believe that having brothers in your party that do not contribute to 'tanking' or 'damage' are ultimately weighing the team down. (and yes fatigue songs are nice, but legends has so much utility to allow your brothers to be fatigue-neutral, which is my philosophy, resulting in almost never needing 'minstrels') The Adventurous lady is usually overpriced and you don't need resolve on an archer unless you're desperate to make a MoB ranged build. (the counter-archer from favoured enemy archers is good, I can agree) Legends mod isn't all about combat stats, but it's a major part of the game and cannot be something you ignore in the pursuit of prioritising non-combat bros.
Surgeon is a retinue slot (the field triage one) Or, the new surgeon in legends that replaces the converted crusader, was changed a while after this vid was made 👍
I find farmers are too un-reliable with their melee stat rolls, but I can understand the love for them :) Great health, and if they roll well (which is what C-tier is) then they can be a great bro! Don't count C-tier out (c=average), there are just more "reliable" bros out there, which is what this tier list is all about.
Minstrel is basically god in militia runs Outside of that hes mediocre at best with some nice shenanigans going on You just dont get that many good resolve brothers as the militia for a banner
I'm slowly warming up to the minstrel in our barbarian playthrough. I can see the usefulness in a peasant militia run (but I'll always love cultists) :) Thanks for the suggestion.
@@TheIndomitableSnowman iirc you cant get cultists with peasants anymore Maybe per event, i even got an addicted noble once after all, but i didnt want to deal with that
@@Savaris96 I believe you are right, sorry. We did a peasant militia playthrough for season 5 so I should have remembered lol. I think you can get gamblers though iirc, but if not then yes minstrels will definitely do well for that origin. (thanks for the idea, and the correction) (and yeah the addicted noble is cool, useful, but a handful haha)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman My militia runs all look like the following: Does the Minstrel have good resolve potential and maybe even fatigue? Yes? Good, give me 5 or 6 decent ones among the rest and we are set No? Unless I get 5 or 6 absolute units, its time to reroll So im slightly biased here, but in this very specific situation, the minstrel is essentially of infinite value, especially since you cant get any other musician with the Militia, maybe through events or the Qiyan, im not THAT deep into the game To me, this minstrel is key, since i can fill up the rest with Poachers, Shepherds, Militiamen, Brawlers, Butchers and what not, good rolls make them decent, the right perks and equip makes them beasts, but that Minstrel? The one and only youll get Though I must admit, that i went completely over Gamblers, I always looked for Brawlers as back-up banners for militia
The inventor feels like wasted potential, normal legends and surprisingly PTR too from what I saw. Very few unique or hard to get perks, besides the dubious prosthetics, for a lot of money with bad stats. Even the camp abilities are easily replicated by combat viable backgrounds. I mean, I get not every background needs to be good but maybe some stuff for handgonne and/or bombs? Who knows.
Yeah, I agree that the inventor is a slight dissapointment but if you are having a very long campaign it could be a small light for some of your more valued and unlucky bros. But in general, not a strong/effective ability or complementing stats :( I do like your ideas about maybe bomb/tech bonuses from them. Would be cool to see something like that implemented.
Thank you all again for the 700 subscriber milestone!
I really appreciate the support and am always glad you're enjoying the videos :)
I really hope this tierlist helps you when choosing backgrounds in Legends Mod. (Don't forget the spreadsheet)
Bro almost two hours on Legends stuff? I'm only 10 mins in but Imma watch the whole thing. Big kudos for your effort
Thanks man, tried to pack in as much as I could so it wasn't just a basic tier list with no explanation :)
Hope it serves you well!
It was actually pretty good ngl
You're really underrated man, great well thought out guide with a lot of effort and expertise put into it. I believe you'd be far more popular if battle brothers itself was.
Many thanks man! I did try and make it quite thorough, glad you liked it. :)
(and hopefully we can make battle brothers popular again haha)
I've never seen a video broken up into so many different parts before.
Haha, yeah it took a while to get all the times right :)
I wanted to make sure you can find what background you want to hear about!
Well done on 700, im sure you will go far, your enthusiasm for the game is amazing, the viewer feels the pain of every bro who dies and the satisfaction of every max roll :) keep up the good work.
Interesting tier list, i should defo try out more shepherds i usually ignore them! one thing im looking for at the mo is an adventurous noble with stars in resolve/ranged and fearsome... that feels like it could be a devastating combo
Syko
Thanks man! Appreciate the kind comments and support :)
I'll keep at it and love that you guys love it!
Hope shepherds show you how good they can be & maybe resolve/range for fearsome might be nice.
Didn't think about the feasome build, bit expensive to grab them for that but you never know, it just might work :)
what a nice Breakdown, will watch the whole thing. Good job! Hard to find such things for a mod.
Hope you enjoy :)
I have slightly warmed up to minstrels but only situationally haha. But I hope this helps!
Gamblers: "They can have decent melee attack but don't bet money on them"
Heh nice one got me chuckle a bit
Excellent video - thanks for the effort you put into this!
You're welcome! Glad to hear you enjoyed the tier list and hope it helps with your runs :)
I waited for this video! 😄
So I play a lot myself so most of this I learned through trial and error combat efficiency-wise, but I'd love your tier list (of maybe only the more common backgrounds) of a "best bang for your buck" type deal, or "recommended picks for each price range".
Maybe as a document so you don't have to do another 1.3hour video 😆
Great video and thank you for valuable info!
Praise Davkul!
Thanks :) Glad it was able to help you! Trial and error is the way we all learn haha.
Cost-effective pricing range sounds like a good idea.
It wouldn't be that long though haha, most likely a nice condensed video to help your purchases :)
Davkul FTW :)
Amazing video, this information is really useful for new players thanks
Glad it was able to help :)
I do need to keep working on putting out more 'guide/help' videos, but I do always have my helpful spreadsheet if you like looking at stats and such :)
Links to my stuff are in the description
(or here too: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WIUyYNJNEnHTwRZNfeyqVkH1fyt6xMBGl8OcP4RAYLo/edit#gid=0 )
hey indomitable new subscriber i saw and love battle brothers because of you! keep on doing the works bruv i know that not a lot of people love and know battle brothers but just like what you did to me people will know and learn to love battle brothers through your game plays
good stuff, love the bookmarks.
Glad you enjoyed it and that it was helpful (bookmarks are so nice to have, glad it was useful!)
nice tier list for sure,help me alot
Glad to hear it was helpful and glad you enjoyed it :)
look how far you've come friend
It's been quite the journey (and still more to come) but I'm very thankful for the support
A tier list? Sing me up!
haha :) glad you're keen.
it's a long one so hope it helps :)
I agree with your list, i just put gravediggers and fishermen A tier, only because some runs, i have amazing grave diggers with amazing stars and they are fun to play, and fishermen because of one of my run, before beast and exploration. I played full dagger company to loot everything. They were not so much enemies to deal with, daggers were excellent for everyone. I had a lot of fun with daggers. And in this company, one of my two best bro was a fishermen, fully armored, he had 120+ fatigue left, and 100+ melee skill, without any stars in melee skill. I had only best rolls. (he still reached 100+ after the level 11)
Nice one.
Enjoyed your video. Will just put some of my personal thoughts, but because I play vanilla (DLC included) and not Legends, perhaps won't be too accurate to compare to Legends mode.
Monk/Nun are great bannerman, because they have a lot of positive events and can increase their resolve through the game, in comparison other cheap bannerman backgrounds have some negative events related to them and rarely can grow their resolve.
Peddler is also great early-game flank-holder with his high defense and economical impact (in Legends mode), so definitely in those circumstances can jump a tier until a better recruit show himself.
Deserter is comparable stat-wise (range of stats included) to most of your A tier backgrounds and aside from his low resolve, which can be patched to reasonable levels reliably with trinket, arena and bannerman presence, he can outperform a lot of the others in there (A tier) such as the Manhunter and Militia.
Is Juggler having 10% chance to hit the head in Legends, it's just 5% in vanilla (where Killer on the run have 10%) ?
All good, I'm glad you enjoyed it. Vanilla is great and there are some similarities but something are also very different too :)
Thank you for putting the time into a nice big comment and I'll try to reply/explain myself well.
With brothers I usually don't mind events too much (negative ones are annoying but usually not game or brother-breaking) but relying on random events for stats and such isn't very reliable. Removing dumb is good for monks though, I agree.
Peddlers can sometimes have a nice defence roll, true, but so can a bunch of the B/C tiers, where most of them can just hold a shield in the early game and survive on a flank. However, the reliability of a peddler is rather low in most circumstances. I did mention the trading/barter benefit for a peddler and for that reason they are good (maybe even up a tier for trading playthroughs), but most of the time you will not be happy with how they perform or survive in combat and just grab them for their barter. (Early game the barter doesn't help that much in my opinion as you don't have much money to work with. Peddlers are more of a mid-later game choice in my opinion)
Deserter are similar stat-wise to militia & manhunters but I definitely wouldn't say they that are better than the A-tier options, sorry. Yes, there are ways to work on their resolve but the reliable methods are hard and way too much effort to make the deserter background 'viable'. Winning 11 arenas with abysmal resolve is not an easy task unless you carry them with 2 amazing brothers. Banners effectiveness really diminishes with distance so it's not always a reliable source of resolve throughout a fight. I just cannot agree with you because the fact that you have to put all this effort into 'fixing' the deserter when you can just buy a militia or manhunter that doesn't need fixing, with practically the same stats & price, just makes them the better choice 99% of the time.
The Juggler & Killer on the Run both have 10% extra chance to hit the head (35% base) in legends which is really nice :)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman Thanks for the reply. I was not stating that the things I said were solid, just my thinking process. Like events are not really that important, but in the case of Monks they have a lot of those, so some of them will eventually emerge and they have some which are great (when you have fight between Hedge Knights for example) and the fact that he as others cheap background with higher resolve that can turn into a bannerman, can further increase it. I mean - overall I think he is the best cheap background for that purpose alone, as others are similar, but lack the ability to further increase it. Also ... nice for role-playing :D
Peddlers are just like any other C tier background I completely agree, they have mediocre rolls on all stats defense aside and so as any of them (just like you say) how 'decent' (as they never ever will be 'good') depends on luck of the dice. Yet their defense score is much higher then the average and for the early game with a shield in hand can do a great flank-holder who will eventually be replaced, due to better recruit taking his place or a hit to the head ... whatever comes first.
Deserters indeed have serious problem with their resolve, but it's not 'that' bad depending on other things, but a low-rolled militia and high rolled deserter the difference is not that big, but his other stats are on average great and as he is cheap background can be considered slightly stronger and more cost-efficient. So if he is not worthy of A-tier, should be considered top of B tier at least.
In Arenas I always aim to do 2 guys in the front which will win the fight and one in the back with ranged/reach weapon with a shield in his backpack ready to be carried and leech of anything which is not a threat.
@@dtibvgz8441 All good, I'm glad we can have a good discussion and talk about the game :)
I am a cultist supporter at heart and that will always clash with a monk supporter haha, but I can't deny that monks are good. (for all the good reasons you have stated as well)
I'd say peddler defence is just average but yeah, a shield in hand they can survive (hopefully) a flank for a bit :)
I mean, expecting high-rolling deserters is just like expecting high-rolling anything. Almost anything high-rolling is good. On average, a Deserter is usually too much work to make good on the front-lines for the cost but I still believe they are a good background for sure. Backline is the easier choice and they'll be able to hold any stray flankers for a short while if they don't break. I can agree they are top of B-tier if you can get some higher rolls for their resolve but if you low roll they're horrible. (which is why they're B-tier: good but needs a little luck)
That is a good arena strat which I also have used (the shield on the backliner is a good idea. Might have to add that in myself). 3 strong melee works but if you have 2 great babysitters you can afford a slightly weaker 3rd for sure :)
Also, I do think the minstrel can do a lot if you can manage his fatigue it is basically iron lungs for all of your party.
Definitely true if you can manage his fatigue, but that is a tricky job. If you can, I do agree that iron lungs for the party is a nice boon.
Maybe the Qiyan (with hopefully iron lungs themselves) can provide a more reliable 'minstrel-support-service' :)
I had fun with Indebted in the Slave Uprising (or whatever it's called) Start, although I don't know how end game viable the run was.
Glad to hear you had fun with the slave start :)
I will need to play that one eventually but yeah, not to sold on the end-game viability.
It seems to be more of a challenge run of sorts but definitly a different way to play the game haha.
Before the legend mod I didn't get what you meant about the Melissa being good now that I'm playing Legend Melissa's really great
Glad I was able to help :)
The militia are great backgrounds for almost any melee role.
You just need to try and find a cheap one (
One thing about the begger, i think the barter can justify almost a c tier and is, i think a c tier, in the trader origin.
The low wage will make so the barter bonus will pay the cost and daily wage if you'r trading and that makes them money making slave in the long run.
But you only justify them in mid to late if they are 2 or 3 stare high roll slinger.
Also, that % barter affects delivery quest gold rewards.
Ahh yes, they do come with a 1% innate barter. I can see the benefit to trading runs as 2 beggers equals a peddler in the early game for such a cheap price.
As long as you avoid combat, that does seem nice. I'd definitely say save your money for a peddler to last you through to late game but maybe they can be just throwaway brothers.
High rolling range attack for slinging is ok, but that's really pushing their effectiveness with low Fat and Hp, he's gonna struggle alot even with high rolls.
Thanks for the info and it's nice to know that barter helps with deliveries as they're not usually high paying quests. :)
Great guide.
Where's your stat spreadsheet linked?
I just jumped into Legends, trying to figure out crafting.
A list of perks guarantees per background with "dynamic perk placement on" would be super useful.
I hate finding a great bro, but doesn't have berserk or something lol
Glad to hear it was helpful :)
I don't have a list of perks that are guaranteed per background and I'm not sure of the guarenteed perks as they've probably changed over the different versionof the mod.
My stats spreadsheet is linked in the description and will help when looking at the stats of bro's and comparing them. (It also has some help with the benefits of each background e.g. map movement speed increase, camping modifiers, etc)
One time I started campaign with 3 random brothers and one of them had necrosavant background! Also he had some unique perks like teleportation and he could eat dead enemy bodies and restore 50hp. But I didn't tested him and decided to play an other origin
Yes, necrosavant-bros are a rare background that can only spawn in at the start of a campaign when you choose a "random bros" origin.
Definitely cool and fun, but not a normal 'recruitable' sadly :(
Really enjoying this content! Is the Google sheet updated? 🤔 I can't find some of the backgrounds in it.
Glad you're enjoying the content and finding it helpful.
Haven't had a chance to update the spreadsheet for the oathtaker and anatomist backgrounds yet :(
@@TheIndomitableSnowman Been binging your content, thank you for all you do!
Next do it with PTR so you cripple can go from E to A tier
Haha, yeah the cripple and other "PP" backgrounds definitely jump up in usefulness and 'fun' in PTR :)
song of life + nimble
Definitely nice as a little bit of recovery. (But 4hp isn't much if a guy is bleeding or getting smacked by 2h's haha)
I prefer the fatigue recovery song :)
Indebted go to lvl 11 in all other origins. Can roll very good stars all for 0 cost.
They do have lack-luster stats and all backgrounds can roll good stars.
Since they have a higher up-front cost compared to other 'trash' backgrounds, the 0 cost per day doesn't 'break even' for a long time.
0 cost per day can be fun and abused for certain runs, but in general, buying other cheap backgrounds is better imo :)
What about Druid?
Will you update this tier list because new updates on Legends mod?
How dint I come across your channel previously?
No idea, but I'm glad you're here and enjoying it :)
you should do a perks tier list for legends mod
And im just sitting here running solo Crusader with only cripples, beggars and refugees party...
Nice :) Those backgrounds do have worse stats, but they are cheap so you can cycle through them until you find a half-decent one.
The thing with the inventor is if you are doing a Warlock campaign it's very important, but getting the event to proc can be very annoying.
Ahh I see. Nice to know it can be useful in that origin. Thanks! :)
(but I'm not surprised that it's still annoying haha)
The timestamp for Housemaid has extended into Hunter's and the Hunter's stamp should be changed to Indebtor's (description is correct but the youtube timestamp is not)
Thanks for the info, I'll go and fix it :)
(was probably a typo or something from me)
Random thought: I just watched a video about “baker’s lung” recently, and it got me thinking that the baker background should actually have lower fatigue. Or maybe a higher chance of being asthmatic.
Definitely an interesting 'weighted' trait/stat interation as many jobs in that era were bad on the lungs (notably seen in the miner background)
Would be neat if they did something for the baker in the future :)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman completely unrelated, but it’d be nice if they added an option for realistic logistics, maybe expanding on the
non-combat retinue system. Something like needing wagons, donkeys, etc. for carrying supplies, wounded brothers or loot. If a brother isn’t carrying it, someone or something has to. It would give some real value to backgrounds like beggar and cripple.
Of course, the option of turning it off should probably be available too.
have the legends mod removed melee defense(after50) diminishing returns? if not I think you perhaps overvalue defense on the origin
Not that I know of, but regardless of diminishing returns, the value of melee defence is still important.
Most brothers in the game can't ever go above 50 (without a shield) and most of your brothers will be using either 2H's or 1H-duelists.
Shieldmaidens get insane melee defence but more is still better when your building a tank. :)
I know this is a year ago, but what's your OP on the Pilgrims? I've been playing Solo Crusader alot and I get Pilgrims alot, I recognize them are mediocre melee only tho and very rare decent ranged, but almost always nimble, high resolve.
Pilgrims are a specific background only found in the crusader start. I made this list based on the general recruits you could find in any run.
I'm not 100% on pilgrims, but they're pretty good and I think their stats can be rather varied.
Still a good pickup as far as I know :)
Ah I see, ngl in legends the pilgrims are really good for the spear main nim/med tanks and shield. They get defense rolls up to 5-10 and melee rolls till 70-85
And almost always have mind over body which is great with the spears perks you find
Jesus didn’t realize there where that many
Not long ago i played the Battle Sister Origin and got a male cannibal to join my group at level 11 he had 130 melee skill and in 200 days did not give any permanent injuries to my other people. So i cant understand why cannibal is E-Tier
Now you have to redo your list and take all the backgrounds you listed higher up and then said, "but don't get them" at the end
I did not know that the barbaric background was only found in the event after destroying a fort so he hard to get neet
Barbarian is usually from a rare random event.
There are other rare interactions, but the easiest is from the event.
Oh and btw i made a pretty neat event cannibal who cleavered his way through enemies with ease..
Cannibals do have decent stats, but eventually they will get hungry... :P
I have a minstrel on my team that has war chant and by round 2 has my entire band at confident morale in battle which helps in so so many ways. I would honestly move them to B tier honestly
Appreciate the thoughts, and I've slowly warmed up to minstrels (Qiyan as well for the better stats) as they can be a nice support for the party.
I still build my parties to be self sufficient and do not require a minstrel in my setups, but for large parties I can see that their benefits can help in sticky situations.
It's possible that I might have to move them up a tier :)
I love training houndmasters.
Houndmasters have decent stats, a good choice :) (and the dog buffs are nice too)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman I got a few wolves through some events over a thousand days. They are the same niche but they are so good when it's time to run people down
Where is my man melon mugger ? He is definitely s tier
It's not a mugging. The melon was juicy, wet, and asking for it.
@@clintholmes2061 I agree haha, the horse lover should be S-tier as well lol...
The ranged nobles have better stats than the Hunter, so just from a stats point I would say they are better, although expensive.
On average, hunters will give you a better range stat (even if by a few points) and will still do better with low rolls, compared to the ranged nobles.
Yes, I do agree most of their stats are rather similar but the cost-effectiveness for hunters is always better in my opinion. :)
(They're also easier to find as nobles are rare) Thanks for your opinion though, the stats aren't too different for sure.
I'm pretty sure indebted are only capped at level 7 in the Manhunter origin.
Yes, that's true :)
Indebted outside of the manhunter origin are not very special or strong, but being capped at lvl 7 is super rough (and that origin is definitely near the bottom of my list lol)
Is this list still accurate two years later? Or has there been any major changes?
I found that militia is severely nerfed now. I think their range of HP is now 30-55 or something like that. I've gotten tricked by so many militias with stars in matk and mdef but their hp was like 33. They also have a bias AGAINST colossus now. Most militias I've recruited do not have colossus where as miners, brawlers usually do. Militia have become just polearm bros for me. I now just recruit miners early game their matk is really high, hp really high (always have colossus too). Low fat so I make them into nimble or medium armor.
Can you get Evoker or magic user in hiring or you need to start with it?
Good question. Currently worldwide-magic is not available as the mod creators said it needs some work.
This means you can't find magic-based backgrounds (like the evoker) or brothers who get lucky magic perks (when using dynamic perks).
Only way to get magic backgrounds is by starting with them, from your origin (or random solo, duo, party start)
Hope this helps :)
P.S. older versions of the mod could have some magic backgrounds as recruits and lucky brothers with magic perks. Not sure how stable they are nowadays because the base game has updated as well. Probably best to play with magic starts and wait for the magic update (I can't wait!) :)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman thank you, i really want to try magic lol
@@fairtoki1685 Magic is fun, hope you enjoy it.
If you check the discord, lots of people have seeds for the 'random party' which can have magic in them.
Also the 'Seer' origin has magic missile and chain lightning (the classic mage) or there are others like the necromancer (warlock) or druid origins :)
Where is the anatomist?
can u post a document or spreadsheet with this tier list? Ur current spreadsheet tier list is with icons, but I think with letters, it will be more helpful. May be other ppl want it with icons, but for me, I prefer tier list with letters, thz mate
No problem, will try and put something together for you soon :)
Got a worded version on the spreadsheet :) Hope you like it!
@@TheIndomitableSnowman thz dude
@@TheIndomitableSnowman btw
Can u also make tier list for vanilla version?
Vanilla version after blazing desert dlc, background tier list.
@@zarlay255 Haven't done vanilla content yet on the channel (and I haven't played vanilla in a while)
Its a good idea but it might have to wait a bit soz.
Hi, is there any chance you'd could do a perk tier list and explain them like you did with the backgrounds here.
Hey, thanks for the suggestion (and sorry for the late reply) I'll add it to my video list and definitely consider the idea.
There are a lot of perks in legends and even more in PTR so it may be a long vid but I'll have a think :)
No cripple is good I got one with 2 stars in range and melee defense and 1 star in melee skill he end up being the last survivor of a mission we’re I went after the barbarian king after killing 5 enemies but a lot of luck needed
That's why the cripple is usually bad. Very rare chances for him to be good.
Gz on finding a good one.
There is no sound?
There should be sound.
It's still working on my end and many others as well. Maybe it's something on your end?
I love your vid but i have to disagree with most of the list . Servant is actually S tier because of the out combat utilities , they can multi task cooking and barter with lowest cost , alchemist can too but expensive , maid also does but field triage isn't that useful . Monks and nuns are S tier too because guaranted peaceful and healing pray perks, also dirt cheap ,make them best banner men . Qiyan , troubadour and minstrel also deserve better ranks because of cheer on being broken in some origins , with Qiyan being worse than the other two because lower resolve but can be broken if you find a golden lute because they have higher attack and better combat perks . Adventurous lady is actually best archer due to resolve+perfect focus and guaranted counter archer perk ( which gives 33% bonus on covered targets ) .Legend mod isn't all about combat stats .
Thanks for your personal opinions on the matter :)
This list was more focussed on the combat aspects and viabilities of each background as BB is mostly combat-orientated.
Playing and using brothers for their out-of-combat benefits is definitely a strategy but not one that I, and probably most players, recruit for. (except in the times you want to get the requirement for a retinue slot or specific perk or other requirement like blacksmiths)
I'm glad you enjoyed the vid but I'll have to respectfully disagree with your placements of S-tier servants and monks/nuns. If you want a cook, a butcher can easly provide good & cheap combat stats while adding one or 2 cook perks to get the retinue slot and/or a required cooking style. If you require a paymaster (for the retinue or the reduced pay) you can easily grab a qiyan to have a useful supporting 'minstrel' background.
Peaceful and praying perks are not that useful to be honest and I wouldn't recruit bros just for that ability (and they are not 100% required on a banner). A banner is a reach weapon that can be utilized more strongly with a polearm brother and you can easily get 100+ resolve with many different backgrounds (including my favourite cultists, cheap and able to do anything)
The supporting qiyan, minstrel and troubadour are a 'hotly debated' set of backgrounds, as stated in the video, and some people prefer them more (which is no issue). I do believe the qiyan is haf-decent and the better choice when wanting a support background but I still believe that having brothers in your party that do not contribute to 'tanking' or 'damage' are ultimately weighing the team down. (and yes fatigue songs are nice, but legends has so much utility to allow your brothers to be fatigue-neutral, which is my philosophy, resulting in almost never needing 'minstrels')
The Adventurous lady is usually overpriced and you don't need resolve on an archer unless you're desperate to make a MoB ranged build. (the counter-archer from favoured enemy archers is good, I can agree)
Legends mod isn't all about combat stats, but it's a major part of the game and cannot be something you ignore in the pursuit of prioritising non-combat bros.
Haych P 😂👌🏾
:)
surgeon seems to be missing
Surgeon is a retinue slot (the field triage one)
Or, the new surgeon in legends that replaces the converted crusader, was changed a while after this vid was made 👍
@@TheIndomitableSnowman i meant a new one anyway i didn't found it useful at all. thanx for the video
Farmhand easily A Tier
I find farmers are too un-reliable with their melee stat rolls, but I can understand the love for them :)
Great health, and if they roll well (which is what C-tier is) then they can be a great bro!
Don't count C-tier out (c=average), there are just more "reliable" bros out there, which is what this tier list is all about.
Did militia get nerfed? They have shit HP now. I'm getting guys in the 30-45 range and they rarely have colosus. its become a shitbackground or what
Minstrel is basically god in militia runs
Outside of that hes mediocre at best with some nice shenanigans going on
You just dont get that many good resolve brothers as the militia for a banner
I'm slowly warming up to the minstrel in our barbarian playthrough.
I can see the usefulness in a peasant militia run (but I'll always love cultists) :)
Thanks for the suggestion.
@@TheIndomitableSnowman iirc you cant get cultists with peasants anymore
Maybe per event, i even got an addicted noble once after all, but i didnt want to deal with that
@@Savaris96 I believe you are right, sorry.
We did a peasant militia playthrough for season 5 so I should have remembered lol.
I think you can get gamblers though iirc, but if not then yes minstrels will definitely do well for that origin. (thanks for the idea, and the correction)
(and yeah the addicted noble is cool, useful, but a handful haha)
@@TheIndomitableSnowman My militia runs all look like the following:
Does the Minstrel have good resolve potential and maybe even fatigue?
Yes? Good, give me 5 or 6 decent ones among the rest and we are set
No? Unless I get 5 or 6 absolute units, its time to reroll
So im slightly biased here, but in this very specific situation, the minstrel is essentially of infinite value, especially since you cant get any other musician with the Militia, maybe through events or the Qiyan, im not THAT deep into the game
To me, this minstrel is key, since i can fill up the rest with Poachers, Shepherds, Militiamen, Brawlers, Butchers and what not, good rolls make them decent, the right perks and equip makes them beasts, but that Minstrel? The one and only youll get
Though I must admit, that i went completely over Gamblers, I always looked for Brawlers as back-up banners for militia
The inventor feels like wasted potential, normal legends and surprisingly PTR too from what I saw.
Very few unique or hard to get perks, besides the dubious prosthetics, for a lot of money with bad stats. Even the camp abilities are easily replicated by combat viable backgrounds.
I mean, I get not every background needs to be good but maybe some stuff for handgonne and/or bombs? Who knows.
Yeah, I agree that the inventor is a slight dissapointment but if you are having a very long campaign it could be a small light for some of your more valued and unlucky bros.
But in general, not a strong/effective ability or complementing stats :(
I do like your ideas about maybe bomb/tech bonuses from them. Would be cool to see something like that implemented.
Battle sisters? CRINGE