A thorough dissection, Doctor - thank you. I purchased 88 of these cartridges at a local auction in hopes of purchasing a CPA rifle in this caliber eventually. Hopefully, these cartridges were cast properly and I can avoid the cold shut defect as these cartridges are extremely rare in Canada.
Good evening Mark, My 100 year old cases from UMC shot fine without cracking. Conversely, Bertram brass is notorious for cracking. Best of luck on your rifle acquisition.....Doc
Good to see you, Doc! What a beauty. I rarely buy engraved guns, but this one I liked. Certainly an enteresting gun as well. Gotta love the scope. Thanks for sharing. Keep them comming! Loved the turkey in the end. Wish we had them in Norway.
Good morning John, I hope all is well in Norway. Seven of these male birds came out of the woods one day together and I was lucky enough the get some pictures of them. There majestic and silly all in one package. I was always intrigued by the .28-30 and its story, so that prompted the video. Hope you got some quality time at the cabin this summer.....Doc
Quite the fancy set up Doc. I have to watch your videos a couple of times for my little brain to absorb all the information you somehow fit in your productions. I have to admit every time you close the action and the hammer dropped, I flinched! A nice solution for bullet seating that long cartridge. A drill press in a handy thing.
Good afternoon Sir, and thanks for coming along on the adventure. She is real pretty, a real testament to those Stevens artists and craftsmen. I was pleased to hear that you watched several times as I do try to sneak all sorts of tidbits into the mix. It is disheartening when you look at your video analytics and see most people only watch 25% average and they watch on their tiny phone screens. They truly miss the full immersion into the Single Shot experience. Most people today have a very short attention span, it's like trying to talk to a moth ! Best regards...Doc
@@dr.durellshepard398 Yes doc, I see the short attention syndrome on mine also. Rest assured your fans appreciate the attention to detail in your videos. I like the old advertisements and maps of the factories. I find the biographies of the inventors very interesting. Keep up the good work, looking forward to the next one. Gp
Wonderfull rifle and the process, have one similar, i have a stevens in 25 25 and hope to get to work with this winter, got a box of new brass from gaintwist bbl. The only mold i have is a old ideal tong tool with nice looking mold. I been warned 25 25 is tuff to work , cant be worse than the 22 15 60.
Hi Tom, Be sure to check out "Shooting a #2 Remington sporting rifle in .25-25 Stevens" on the Steve Blancard channel. All those long skinny rounds are tricky to reload now. Back in the day you could get the correct brass, dies, and bullets and only needed to concentrate on your marksmanship. Regards.....doc
Hi Doc! Great Video. Wow the trigger on that is exceptional. What a beautiful Stevens rifle. 14 pounds, amazing! I have heard of the cartridge, but never seen one in action. Had to look it up in one of my ammuntion books. It sure is a fine Stevens, in a fine cartridge. You sure make nice looking bullets I must add. Hope you had a great summer. Fall is upon us. Leavves are changing here in Minnesota! Thank you for making this neat video. As always I will watch it more then once for sure! Take Care. Dave
Good evening Dave, Glad you could join the walk back 100 years down shooters lane. What craftsmen back then. Yes, Fall is coming, I do see some leaves coming down. Are you going hunting this fall? (I'm loading .45-70s as I type this.) Regards...Doc
@@dr.durellshepard398 Doc...45-70 is one of my favorites to shoot and reload for. Yes, I plan to hunt this fall. How about you? You are correct in the fine workmanship of the past. That seems to be a lost art these days...Dave
@@daveclemons1225 Here's is to good luck on you hunting trip. Actually we did a lot of bird hunting but all the grouse and pheasants are gone in this area. A few woodcock migrate through, all very sad. Later....Doc
Doc, my expectation of your newest video is always...It's Going To Be Great, and it NEVER disappoints! That is one Beautiful Rifle. BTW, I believe that's an old Ship Anchor on your property, if so, that's one fantastic piece of lawn art 🤣. Lastly, Doc I noticed you shoot both left & right handed, do you have a preference or are you more accurate with one side, just curious. Have a great day Doc, and thanks for another great Video!
Hello Jeff, I'm pleased that you found it of interest. The anchor and its twin were pulled up from the bottom by a local fisherman. I wounder who made it, ( can you imagine it at a red hot heat) and where it traveled in the world before relegated to the depths. I mainly shoot left handed, but sometimes switch for the camera. Regards...Doc
Doc like always excellent video. Was the 28-30-120 mainly designed as a target cartridge? I first hear about it when I was looking through the CPA rifle site, they still chamber for this cartridge. But I don't think anyone make brass for it. Is there another case that can be used to form the brass? Why do you think the brass is splitting? I have never see a video with this cartridge so thank you for that. Your rifles are beautiful, that trigger is a thing, like you said they just don't seem to be able to reproduce.
A target and varmint cartridge. RMC would probably make them. RCC in out of business. These cases are so long and skinny that no other case I know can be used to convert them. ...Doc
The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc
@@dr.durellshepard398 Undersized + alloy factors + length did make for only a one time use. What a shame. I have fired .32 S&W Longs in my Russian Nagant revolver which made for very accurate on target shooting. The brass is also undersized, and that causes a slight bulge in the case where the heel of the lead bullet was seated upon extraction. I suspect that the bulge could be sized with the proper die, and the case could be reloaded and fired. Did you contact Bertram bout the problem ?
@@robertrobert7924 I did not pursue it any father, they know they have a problem, they also know they are about the only game in town. I have had problems with Bertram cases before as have other shooters. When I scored two boxes of new brass I though I was all set. If the brass was not so brittle, they should have fire-formed like any other under sized round, as did your .32 S&W, which swelled but did not rupture.
Fascinating Rifles Doc The Set Trigger Pull Is Too Die For 😮😮😇 Was The Chamber Expanded From Years of Use Resulting In The Case Cracking Issue and If So Can it Be Sleeved to Repair it 😀 I Love That Lyman Scope I’m a Huge Unertil Scope Fan 😀😊 Thanks For Another Trip To The Finer Times In American History Those Original Cartridges are Awesome Too
Hi Chris, I too am a Unertl fan, I have one mounted on a Winchester 52. You are correct in your assumption that there was a disparity between the chamber and case dimensions. The chamber was factory fresh but the cases were undersized and brittle. Glad you enjoyed the "Hardware" and the shoot......Doc
Hi Steve, She is a beauty, truly a testament to the bygone artists that created it. I suspect your lathe turned cases would be fine. I did not do a casting as the chamber and bore are factory pristine, and the 100 year old cases, which did not crack, were exactly the correct size after firing. The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc P.S. Love your model 44 with the full lever loop.
Shooters have reported different results with Bertram cases. Not sure Bertram has always used the same brass "formula." Annealing sometimes helps, but not always..... Stevens 49's are some of the best-looking of their single-shot models.
Good morning Jeffrey, I have had problems with Bertram cases before as have other shooters. When I scored two boxes of new brass I though I was all set. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. If the brass was not so brittle, they should have fire-formed like any other under sized round. Regards...Doc
I dug out some fired .28-30 Bertram cases I acquired from someone who had reloaded them several times (with smokeless). I suspect these cases may be at least 30 years old, and I have used several in my modern built .28-30. I am undoubtedly tempting fate, but no splits. I was assembling fixed-bullet rounds with RCBS dies, only sizing enough for cases to chamber. Never got around to try breech-seating bullets. Perhaps this batch of Bertram cases were of better quality?
@@jeffreykropp7664 I suspect so, pardon the pun but it seems to be on a case-by-case basis, as the ones that didn't crack on the first firing, reloaded several more times without a problem.
A really wonderful rifle! Surely the cases are solid drawn, have you fire formed them before loading? The spits look very uniform almost as if they are under diameter and have split with the sudden expansion. 120 Grn of powder is a long column to ignite, have you used a few grains of nitro over the primer? Stay safe! Chris B.
Hi Chris, I tried numerous fire form techniques , but alas, ... it's the brass ! The were .010" under sized but, using methods as you describe, I have moved brass a lot farther than that with no problem. My 100 year old cases shot fine, with no cracks. Regards, Doc
Como nos tiene acostumbrados un maravilloso rifle en perfecto estado, y con muy buena precisión.Lo de las vainas puede ser por un hueco en el espacio aéreo? Un saludo desde Toledo Espańa.
Alberto, Es una belleza, un testimonio de los artistas del pasado que la crearon. Los casos Bertram son problemáticos por su resolución. Es su aleación o su proceso de fabricación. Tenían un tamaño insuficiente de 0,010" y estaban endurecidos. Recocí las cajas, pero eso no pareció ayudar. Mis mejores deseos del Doctor.
Doctor, Have you tried making a chamber casting of the rifle? If that checks out okay, then have you considered annealing the new brass before loading. I suspect the brass alloy between the old cases and the new ones are a bit different.
I did not do a casting as the chamber and bore are factory pristine, and the 100 year old cases, which did not crack, were exactly the correct size after firing. The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc
Hello Sir, ..........From an on line dictionary: "A cold shut is a discontinuity that appears on the surface of cast metal as a result of two streams of liquid meeting and failing to unite. A piece of metal caused by two streams of molten metal not joining properly when the piece is being cast." Here they speak of casting, and I know these cases are not cast, but this happens also in forging where a layer of metal is folded over another with out being bonded in a homogeneous mass. Just my speculation.The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc
Of all the old ammo I have witnessed, including the long skinny 22,25,28 and 32's, I have not seen any with paper patching. But I surmise someone would have tried it.....Doc
Masterpiece in steel and walnut. Absolutely beautiful.
Excellent video!
👍👍!!!
Eloquently stated, Sir.
Absolutely gorgeous rifle ! Thank you to present it for us. Greetings from France 🇫🇷
Thank you so much Eric. Glad you could come along with us on the adventure. Best regards from USA. ...Doc
A thorough dissection, Doctor - thank you. I purchased 88 of these cartridges at a local auction in hopes of purchasing a CPA rifle in this caliber eventually. Hopefully, these cartridges were cast properly and I can avoid the cold shut defect as these cartridges are extremely rare in Canada.
Good evening Mark, My 100 year old cases from UMC shot fine without cracking. Conversely, Bertram brass is notorious for cracking. Best of luck on your rifle acquisition.....Doc
Just beautiful very happy for you're luck keep the kindling a flowing cheers 🥂🎉😊😊
Thanks so much for the kind comments....Doc
I like the engraving style on the receiver. Simple and deep
Stevens used several different processes for engraving these rifles. Not sure how they did it but, it is a splendid embellishment. ....Doc
Good to see you, Doc! What a beauty. I rarely buy engraved guns, but this one I liked. Certainly an enteresting gun as well. Gotta love the scope. Thanks for sharing. Keep them comming! Loved the turkey in the end. Wish we had them in Norway.
Good morning John, I hope all is well in Norway. Seven of these male birds came out of the woods one day together and I was lucky enough the get some pictures of them. There majestic and silly all in one package. I was always intrigued by the .28-30 and its story, so that prompted the video. Hope you got some quality time at the cabin this summer.....Doc
Quite the fancy set up Doc. I have to watch your videos a couple of times for my little brain to absorb all the information you somehow fit in your productions. I have to admit every time you close the action and the hammer dropped, I flinched! A nice solution for bullet seating that long cartridge. A drill press in a handy thing.
Good afternoon Sir, and thanks for coming along on the adventure. She is real pretty, a real testament to those Stevens artists and craftsmen. I was pleased to hear that you watched several times as I do try to sneak all sorts of tidbits into the mix. It is disheartening when you look at your video analytics and see most people only watch 25% average and they watch on their tiny phone screens. They truly miss the full immersion into the Single Shot experience. Most people today have a very short attention span, it's like trying to talk to a moth ! Best regards...Doc
@@dr.durellshepard398 Yes doc, I see the short attention syndrome on mine also. Rest assured your fans appreciate the attention to detail in your videos. I like the old advertisements and maps of the factories. I find the biographies of the inventors very interesting. Keep up the good work, looking forward to the next one. Gp
@@oldscoutgpThanks so much GP, I do appreciate that. I too love the vintage cartography. ...Doc
another great video, love the details and the period ads
Hello Poppa, Thanks for mentioning the vintage advertisements, I really enjoy putting my head back into their time. Regards.. Doc.
That is a gorgeous rifle with a very cool scope to compliment it as well. Nice shooting.👍
Good morning ARM, Nice to have you along on the adventure....Doc
Wonderfull rifle and the process, have one similar, i have a stevens in 25 25 and hope to get to work with this winter, got a box of new brass from gaintwist bbl. The only mold i have is a old ideal tong tool with nice looking mold. I been warned 25 25 is tuff to work , cant be worse than the 22 15 60.
Hi Tom, Be sure to check out "Shooting a #2 Remington sporting rifle in .25-25 Stevens" on the Steve Blancard channel. All those long skinny rounds are tricky to reload now. Back in the day you could get the correct brass, dies, and bullets and only needed to concentrate on your marksmanship. Regards.....doc
Hi Doc! Great Video. Wow the trigger on that is exceptional. What a beautiful Stevens rifle. 14 pounds, amazing! I have heard of the cartridge, but never seen one in action. Had to look it up in one of my ammuntion books. It sure is a fine Stevens, in a fine cartridge. You sure make nice looking bullets I must add. Hope you had a great summer. Fall is upon us. Leavves are changing here in Minnesota! Thank you for making this neat video. As always I will watch it more then once for sure! Take Care. Dave
Good evening Dave, Glad you could join the walk back 100 years down shooters lane. What craftsmen back then. Yes, Fall is coming, I do see some leaves coming down.
Are you going hunting this fall? (I'm loading .45-70s as I type this.) Regards...Doc
@@dr.durellshepard398 Doc...45-70 is one of my favorites to shoot and reload for. Yes, I plan to hunt this fall. How about you? You are correct in the fine workmanship of the past. That seems to be a lost art these days...Dave
@@daveclemons1225 Here's is to good luck on you hunting trip. Actually we did a lot of bird hunting but all the grouse and pheasants are gone in this area. A few woodcock migrate through, all very sad. Later....Doc
Doc, my expectation of your newest video is always...It's Going To Be Great, and it NEVER disappoints! That is one Beautiful Rifle. BTW, I believe that's an old Ship Anchor on your property, if so, that's one fantastic piece of lawn art 🤣. Lastly, Doc I noticed you shoot both left & right handed, do you have a preference or are you more accurate with one side, just curious. Have a great day Doc, and thanks for another great Video!
Hello Jeff, I'm pleased that you found it of interest. The anchor and its twin were pulled up from the bottom by a local fisherman. I wounder who made it, ( can you imagine it at a red hot heat) and where it traveled in the world before relegated to the depths. I mainly shoot left handed, but sometimes switch for the camera. Regards...Doc
Doc like always excellent video. Was the 28-30-120 mainly designed as a target cartridge? I first hear about it when I was looking through the CPA rifle site, they still chamber for this cartridge. But I don't think anyone make brass for it. Is there another case that can be used to form the brass? Why do you think the brass is splitting? I have never see a video with this cartridge so thank you for that. Your rifles are beautiful, that trigger is a thing, like you said they just don't seem to be able to reproduce.
A target and varmint cartridge. RMC would probably make them. RCC in out of business. These cases are so long and skinny that no other case I know can be used to convert them. ...Doc
Exquisitely beautiful rifle. I think I am suffering from brain freeze. Why did the brass cases crack/split again?
The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc
@@dr.durellshepard398 Undersized + alloy factors + length did make for only a one time use. What a shame. I have fired .32 S&W Longs in my Russian Nagant revolver which made for very accurate on target shooting. The brass is also undersized, and that causes a slight bulge in the case where the heel of the lead bullet was seated upon extraction. I suspect that the bulge could be sized with the proper die, and the case could be reloaded and fired.
Did you contact Bertram bout the problem ?
@@robertrobert7924 I did not pursue it any father, they know they have a problem, they also know they are about the only game in town. I have had problems with Bertram cases before as have other shooters. When I scored two boxes of new brass I though I was all set. If the brass was not so brittle, they should have fire-formed like any other under sized round, as did your .32 S&W, which swelled but did not rupture.
Fascinating Rifles Doc The Set Trigger Pull Is Too Die For 😮😮😇 Was The Chamber Expanded From Years of Use Resulting In The Case Cracking Issue and If So Can it Be Sleeved to Repair it 😀 I Love That Lyman Scope I’m a Huge Unertil Scope Fan 😀😊 Thanks For Another Trip To The Finer Times In American History Those Original Cartridges are Awesome Too
Hi Chris, I too am a Unertl fan, I have one mounted on a Winchester 52. You are correct in your assumption that there was a disparity between the chamber and case dimensions. The chamber was factory fresh but the cases were undersized and brittle. Glad you enjoyed the "Hardware" and the shoot......Doc
A beautiful rifle Doc - wow! Was it only Bertram cases that split? I've been using RMC .25-25 lathe turned brass with good success in my model 44.
Hi Steve, She is a beauty, truly a testament to the bygone artists that created it. I suspect your lathe turned cases would be fine. I did not do a casting as the chamber and bore are factory pristine, and the 100 year old cases, which did not crack, were exactly the correct size after firing. The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc P.S. Love your model 44 with the full lever loop.
Shooters have reported different results with Bertram cases. Not sure Bertram has always used the same brass "formula." Annealing sometimes helps, but not always..... Stevens 49's are some of the best-looking of their single-shot models.
Good morning Jeffrey, I have had problems with Bertram cases before as have other shooters. When I scored two boxes of new brass I though I was all set. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. If the brass was not so brittle, they should have fire-formed like any other under sized round. Regards...Doc
I dug out some fired .28-30 Bertram cases I acquired from someone who had reloaded them several times (with smokeless). I suspect these cases may be at least 30 years old, and I have used several in my modern built .28-30. I am undoubtedly tempting fate, but no splits. I was assembling fixed-bullet rounds with RCBS dies, only sizing enough for cases to chamber. Never got around to try breech-seating bullets. Perhaps this batch of Bertram cases were of better quality?
@@jeffreykropp7664 I suspect so, pardon the pun but it seems to be on a case-by-case basis, as the ones that didn't crack on the first firing, reloaded several more times without a problem.
A really wonderful rifle! Surely the cases are solid drawn, have you fire formed them before loading? The spits look very uniform almost as if they are under diameter and have split with the sudden expansion. 120 Grn of powder is a long column to ignite, have you used a few grains of nitro over the primer? Stay safe! Chris B.
Hi Chris, I tried numerous fire form techniques , but alas, ... it's the brass ! The were .010" under sized but, using methods as you describe, I have moved brass a lot farther than that with no problem. My 100 year old cases shot fine, with no cracks. Regards, Doc
Como nos tiene acostumbrados un maravilloso rifle en perfecto estado, y con muy buena precisión.Lo de las vainas puede ser por un hueco en el espacio aéreo? Un saludo desde Toledo Espańa.
Alberto, Es una belleza, un testimonio de los artistas del pasado que la crearon. Los casos Bertram son problemáticos por su resolución. Es su aleación o su proceso de fabricación. Tenían un tamaño insuficiente de 0,010" y estaban endurecidos. Recocí las cajas, pero eso no pareció ayudar.
Mis mejores deseos del Doctor.
Doctor, Have you tried making a chamber casting of the rifle? If that checks out okay, then have you considered annealing the new brass before loading. I suspect the brass alloy between the old cases and the new ones are a bit different.
I did not do a casting as the chamber and bore are factory pristine, and the 100 year old cases, which did not crack, were exactly the correct size after firing. The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc
Where do you find brass for these old but still fun to shoot cartridges?
Hi Tom, Bertram Brass or Rocky Mountain Cartridge make a lot of obsolete cases. Sometimes new old stock can be found at gun shows.
I'm unfamiliar with a cold shut on drawn brass. How does that happen ?
Hello Sir, ..........From an on line dictionary: "A cold shut is a discontinuity that appears on the surface of cast metal as a result of two streams of liquid meeting and failing to unite. A piece of metal caused by two streams of molten metal not joining properly when the piece is being cast." Here they speak of casting, and I know these cases are not cast, but this happens also in forging where a layer of metal is folded over another with out being bonded in a homogeneous mass. Just my speculation.The Bertram cases are problematic in their cracking. It's either their alloy or their drawing process. And they were .010" undersized, and work hardened. And at $4.50 a pop it was an expensive shoot. I fully annealed the cases but that did not seam to help at all. Regards...Doc
Doc, did Hurricane Lee do any damage up your way ?
Hi Robert, All we got was two windy days as it stayed out to sea far enough. Fine with me, I'm to old to rebuild now.
@@dr.durellshepard398 Good to hear that.
Has anyone ever paper patched this round?
Of all the old ammo I have witnessed, including the long skinny 22,25,28 and 32's, I have not seen any with paper patching. But I surmise someone would have tried it.....Doc
"promosm"
thank you very much, большое спасибо !