The Two Biggest Reasons Beginners Quit Baking Sourdough
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- čas přidán 26. 06. 2024
- Sometimes it's easy to overcomplicate things, often the answers to our problems are right under our noses. The biggest problems for new sourdough bakers to overcome are no different.
In this video, I'll do a side by side comparison. Two doughs, one made with a strong flour and one made with a soft flour and slightly higher hydration.
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Chapters:
0:00 The biggest Hurdles
1:01 The Sourdough Pyramid
3:10 The Contending Flours
3:40 Hydration
4:10 Mixing the Dough
5:10 First Peek at the Dough
5:55 Stretch No.1
6:40 Stretch No.2
7:20 Last peek
7:45 Shape
8:30 Bake
9:10 Checking Them Out
#sourdoughbaking - Jak na to + styl
Hey everyone. Some viewers have asked why I didn't use the same hydration for both flours. Here's my reasoning, (I did give it a lot of thought). I wanted to show that using a softer flour with slightly higher hydration has a huge impact on the dough when comparing it to a stronger flour and lower hydration. I wanted to demonstrate that both hydration and flour have an important role. If I had used the same hydration for both flours I would have demonstrated the difference in flour only. Finding the balance between the flour used and the hydration is key in my opinion. Apologies if it was unclear for some. If you want to see a different side by side then let me know! ATB Phil
I had the same immediate question. It didn’t seem logical at to change the flour and the hydration. Different flours have different absorption rates so I think for education purposes it would have helped a newby baker to understand that and know that changing only one variable is not such a disaster. But two, well that is where they will give up.
I guess a side by side with the same hydration would be very interesting as well :) Also, since a lot of your followers rely on flours with protein contents of around 11-12%, maybe you could show techniques and ways how to bake and adjust your recipe with such a flour.
Yes, not ideal to compare flours and use different hydrations.
@@christophp665 That's an idea Christoph
Perhaps as a follow up you can reverse the hydrations and use the higher hydration with the stronger bread flour to show how the stronger flour can hold more hydration and still be workable. Perhaps a lower hydration may have even made the softer flour more manageable and even produce a more edible final product. That would demonstrate how manipulating the blocks in your pyramid can have dramatic impacts on the final product.
A lot of sourdough blogs and videos are showing great-looking loaves made with 80% or higher hydration, which can be done if you have the right flour and some experience handling high-hydration dough. A new baker probably won't have either. Thank you for almost always mentioning what your flour's protein content is. It makes a huge difference in choosing a workable hydration level. For instance, our usual sourdough is made with higher protein flour at 75% hydration but we also make baguettes with AP flour (probably 11% protein) at 65% hydration. By the way, it helps to learn the dough-handling techniques if you start with lower hydration and work your way up.
You can have an excellent bread with hydration not higher than 65%. This is a very nice dough and realy easy to handle. With all these thousends hobby bakers they produce bread for Instagram posts. Lot of them use not only sourdough but also small quantities of commercial yeast. Also most of the professionell bakers do it also to secure their production and speed up the Fermentation. In that small quantities its still a sourdough bread.
One of the things that kept me from getting into sourdough, or really, any sort of bread, has been the messiness factor of flour. It's always been my nemesis. It sticks really bad to everything and it's a pain to get it off your hands. The way I make sourdough reflects this aversion to messy hands, and so I've developed this technique:
1> Rule #1: Wet dough, wet hands. Dry dough, dry & floured hands.
2> Mix flour, water & salt in a glass bowl. Mix with a plastic dough scraper, up until it's about mixed and I might do a little final mixing and folding with my hand (Wet hands!!!), just to make sure all the flour is well incorporated and wet, but not enough that my hands get too bad. Autolyze for an hour.
3> Add my starter and fold it into the dough ith as bunch of stretch & folds (hands wet!!!) until I feel it's well incorporated into the dough. Usually the way the dough responds, changes after 3 or 4 minutes and this is also an indicator that it's ready. Basically it becomes very easy to do a continuous stretch & fold without having to work the dough much to get it to stretch. This is by far the messiest step, but I find that my hands still wash very easily.
4> Leave the dough in the bowl. Do 3-4 stretch & folds every 15-20 mins (Wet hands!!!). I hardly get anything on my hands at this point and what does get on my hands washes off very easily.
5> Stretch out the dough onto the counter (Wet hands!!!) and make a long rectangle and roll it up and stick into the loaf pan to ferment & rise. This is also a very clean step.
So really, there's only the one step (#3) that's kinda messy in the sense that my hands have little bits of dough all over them, but because my hands are wet and the dough is wet, the dough washes off pretty easily in the sink.
I do think part of it comes from just learning how to handle the dough and I think that's kind of an individual thing that's probably hard, if not impossible to teach. I do certain little motions with my hands to unstick myself from dough and it's just kind of a learned muscle-memory thing over time and it does make it easier to handle dough, I think. I feel much more comfortable working with doughs in general, not just sourdough using this method, and a good bit of that, I think, is this just sort of learning to handle dough.
Cheers for sharing your process Pete, appreciated it. It's good to know how other people manage their processes and gives me ideas :)
Thank you so much for sharing, I was almost ready to give up because of my dough was wet and sticky to the very end.
If you made the weaker flour loaf with a 65% hydration, it would probably have turned out ok. I've used AP Flour in the US at this hydration and level with 20% Rye and it comes out fine and tastes great. I prefer to use bread flour with close to 13% protein and a 70% hydration. This was a good experiment to show new bakers how not to mess up hydration with protein level.
Your videos and the way your teach are beyond exceptional!
Just wanted to say a big thank you because I’ve just started my sourdough journey and my first bake was PERFECT! I’m delighted ☺️👌🏼
This is so helpful. I’ve tried the higher hydration (a la Tartine) recipes, but the dough seems to be an unworkable mess, and the loaves come out flat with a tough crumb. You’ve given me great information on how to manipulate the variables to find the best balance and ratio for me. Thank you so much. Keep it coming!!! Love the comparisons
Love these side by side experiments!
I found that extremely interesting! Thanks for the quick comparison!
Happy New Year Philip. Thank you for running this side-by-side for us to see. Many thanks and best to you and yours.
Happy new year to you too! Thank you :)
Really informative video - basic principles covered without being patronising. Thanks!
Keep up the great work. You keep me motivated!
Awesome! Thank you!
Really liked the side-by-side. Makes things very clear :)
Cheers Wombat
The more I watch your videos, the more I learn. Thank you so much for putting forth the effort to create them.
Cheers Rick :)
Fascinating. It's great to see the process being broken down this way. Thanks.
Cheers Spacial :)
Thank you for this video!!! I literally was so frustrated with my sticky dough and I figured sourdough baking just isn't for me. This is so clear. Thank you!!!
You're welcome Natasha :)
A quick recommendation regarding shaping, particularly helpful with sticky doughs, is the use of a nice wide metal bench scraper/bench knife .. which enables dough to be lifted cleanly off the bench, eliminates dough sticking to your fingers and the need for excessive flour late in the fermentation process
If we’re going to learn a lesson, why would you change two variables? (Protein content AND hydration level)
Awesome, thanks, I now know what to watch for.
Another awesome video Philip, fascinating insight into different protein and hydration levels, have to say you handled the sticky dough very well, the difference between them is so clear. Great video! :)
Cheers Dom! Was the footage on your new vid from the new Canon?
@@CulinaryExploration Yes it was, although it's not a good representation as I'm shooting in automatic, and the lighting's not right. Wait for my carbonara + bangers and mash videos, the results are much better then. :)
@@DomBill1 I'm looking forward to that!
Have struggled for a year perfecting the loaf watching your videos has helped me enormously thank you
That's good to hear Valerie, Cheers
Excellent video.
This video is going to help many struggling beginners for sure! This problem is exactly why some people just give up. Thank you!
Pleased you enjoyed it :)
Great video. You have become my go to source for anything bread.
Cheers Myriam
Great video and explanations. I'm a beginner and found that I wasn't doing my leaven right. It wasn't active enough before making it and had flat loafs. I do love the challenge of baking tasty sourdough.
It’s good fun Erik! Cheers for stopping by!
Excellent tutorial!
Thank you! Cheers John!
I stumbled onto your videos the other day and I am so glad I did! Made my first loaf with your method and although I think the hydration was a little too high it came out so good compared to all my previous loaves. I’m looking forward to seeing you show us recipes techniques using whole wheat flour in various proportions. My goal is 100% while wheat but until I can get better at this I’m trying 50%. Thank you!
Cheers Debby. I’ll organise a video on whole-wheat flour in the not too distant future! Pleased you enjoyed baking your first loaf!
Great inside to problems with flour,love it,I am a sticky dough victim.
Hello Phillip! I love the picture drawing, it's like school minus the chalk screeching on the board and the smell of glue :)) You do such a great job showing the difference and the why of it! Most would just keep adding flour instead of knowing to look for higher protein levels. This was so well done! Thank you for sharing!! The only bad thing about your video's is that there's only one a week!
Lol Melody. I’ve thought about trying to produce two vids every week or two but I don’t have the time 😌pleased you found it useful!
@@CulinaryExploration I surely understand the time issue but like a good loaf of sourdough, if it's really good you can't help but want more :) Now I'm hungry for a Greek salad LOL
Thank you ❤
Thanks!! 😊 it was almost as though you telling me!🙌👍
Cheers!
Great video. I pretty much gave up on making sourdough because I couldn't maintain my starter properly. My home is never at a consistent temperature because we heat with wood in winter and have no AC in summer. Therefor there is no way to actually control the temperature which is vital for a good starter and overall success of the loaf.
Ahhh!! Thanks! I was using a wonderful recipe and couldn't figure out why my dough was the consistency of "slime." The gluten built up beautifully during stretching and folding. However, it was still way too soft to hold any sort of shape on its own. It was like a giant blob.
Still cooked wonderfully and tasted good. I'm more about sustenance than looks, but still, trying to figure out what I was doing wrong. I think you helped me a lot!
What a video! Thanks bud!
Cheers Liam
@@CulinaryExploration not a problem, I’ve been watching the no need sourdough video and I’m getting something wrong, dough never holds it shape after I turn it out and it’s making me sad! 😂
I like how you work your strong flour dough .. as easy as folding a shirt... and thanks for showing us how nice a dough should work... unfortunately i been making a lot of flat crappy bread and now i know why ...so many vids make it look like u can knead your way out of a mess.... and I can tell you from my experience trying to knead and shape a wet sticky pile of wallpaper paste that never seems to magically firm up is pretty disheartening
Good video, Phil. I lost my way with sourdough when I started watching an array of bods on CZcams rabbitting continuously on about high hydration doughs. If you can get good, strong flour then great. If you can't, forget it. Your videos put me back on track again. Thanks fella 👍
A cheeky little video on multigrain loaves will be appreciated.
Hey bud. I will definitely get round to that multigrain loaf, although I am guessing you have already nailed it!
@@CulinaryExploration I haven't nailed it, yet- but I am determined!
I just came across your video, while im waiting my dough to develop / ferment while using 11% protein flour..
Its my fourth attempt and just experimented with lower hydration because the dough is very sticky....
your tip, helped me very much.
Σε ευχαριστω πολυ! Θα δοκιμασω και εγω το Robin Hood. ;)
hi! First of all, great video, packed with important information. But where can I find the recipe that you've mentioned in the video "linked in the description below"?
Nicely presented, I definitely encountered these! Another problem I encountered was my dough turning into a sticky and mushy mess after bulk ferment at room temp for 12-18 hours. I had no idea what was happening because the long ferment always worked great for yeast doughs. It drove me crazy, I couldn't even find an explanation Googling. I eventually came across a random post about the acid in the starter potentially destroying the dough's gluten if left too long, and I connected the dots. In hindsight, it's easy to appreciate mistakes because that's how you learn, but man can it be frustrating going through it.
It can be frustrating Jay, but hopefully it's fun along the way :)
🙏🙏🙏🙏... from Greece
Thank you
Great video. I realized you mentioned how the starter looked? Does that mean that you feed your starter with strong bread flour?
I love your videos. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and helping us armatures.
What type of flour is in the pan you rolled the loaves in before you put them in the baskets?
Thank you.
Hi Marianne, it's rice flour but you can use wheat flour. I find the dough has less tendency to stick when I use rice flour. Hope this helps.
My frustration is not on hydration but the inconsistent strength of starter, and so the levain over time. Everytime it takes me several intensive feedings to boom the levain, though the same starter has huge success before. Really time consuming to keep close look on the fermentation process..🤢 . BTW I love the idea of lamination it gives very good texture on any bread🥰🥰 Your twists are so practical!
This was so helpful! I've been playing around with sourdough on and off for a few years but can't achieve that nice oven spring! Time to invest in higher protein flour!
Cheers Kathryn, pleased it was helpful. Let me know how you get on with the new flour :)
@@CulinaryExploration I wish I could post a picture, but I had the best oven spring yet, I can't believe what a difference the flour has made. I still want to incorporate ancient grains in my bread so I'll continue to play around with how much whole grain flour I can add without weighing the loaf down.
@@katmmcdonald I saw the picture you sent me on IG and replied to your message. Looked amazing, really pleased the loaf turned out so well. Keep experimenting and let me know how you get on :)
Glad you did this video. I was growing frustrated and about to throw in the towel. Going to keep trying though👍
Try tweaking the hydration and possibly the flour. It’s a good place to start if you are struggling with the dough. Make sure your starter is active and fed with good flour too. Keep me posted
I only realised yesterday deep into establishing my starter that I accidentally used strong bread flour instead of plain flour. This video gives me hope that I haven't wasted 2 weeks building this starter for my daily bread.
The bacteria and yeast in your starter comes from the flour. If you change flours, over time, your starter will likely become colonized by the biotics from the new flour. That said, I've made starter from 3 different types of flour (white, whole wheat and rye) and I haven't noticed much of a difference between them, in terms of the resulting bread. The differences are fairly subtle. Not nearly as profound as I had believed they were.
I had trouble getting a decent starter until I found this channel. Yes, i continue to have sticky dough but I live with it. I have a batch in the refrigerator to be baked tomorrow (Sunday). I have to work on stickiness but what I have produced is delicious. Last loaf I worked too much. My learning curve is improving. I owe you a Theakston Old Peculiar (a beer I discovered on a business trip to the UK).
Wow, it’s been a while since I thought about old peculiar, I’m guessing you enjoyed it! Keep going with the baking Richard. Sounds like you are doing well. Enjoy the journey and keep me posted 👍🍻
Thanks for your videos, Mr. CE! My biggest problem is the fact that almost every time that I take my about - baked loaf out of the fridge and turn it over onto the baking stone, it deflates so much that it doesn't rise enough during the baking process. It looks good and feels right through the entire mixing and bulk fermentation process. It rises wonderfully on the counter ( I can see the wonderful gas using a glass bowl) and in the fridge. In the morning , I get everything ready so that the last thing that I have to do is put the loaf on the baking stone ready to score. But in those few seconds right before scoring, The loaf begins to deflate. So by the time I finished scoring the loaf and coveing itf with the dutch oven- sized pot, the loaf has really deflated. The taste is wonderful, the crumb itself is very soft, and the crust is pleasantly crunchy. I just can't seem to get that lovely, classic open crumb. I use a mixture of bread flour with rye flour. Unfortunately it's getting to the point that i'm paranoid about flipping my refrigerated loaf over. I have even been driven to the point of doing the refrigerator rise by placing the loaf in a banneton lined with parchment paper overnight, and then lifting up the entire loaf with the parchment paper and placing it into a bread pan. It helps, but I still can't get that open crumb.
This is great information
Cheers Edgar
Would you mind, for the sake of science (lol), give the finished weight of the loaf.
@@ekaram63 I'll try to remember that one :)
I wish I’d watched this video 2 days ago lol. Great info thank you!
LOL, hope it was helpful :)
Great video as always!
From your early video where you produce that amazing looking result, it calls for 375g flour and 237g water. I know from using that recipe that the amount of hydration can deviate by a few grams depending on the bag of flour (I also use Robin Hood). But 70% hydration would call for 262.5g of water in a recipe using 375g of flour. If i were to use 262.5g of water in that recipe it would be a sticky pile of glue right from the start. Am I calculating this incorrectly, or is this video and the ratio used not intended to be applied to that earlier no knead recipe which does not include the laminations and folding, etc.
I usually used HPF with 13% protein with 83% hydration. It works very well every single time 👍
Thanks for your videos. Very informative and well produced.
I made a loaf based on your other video about sticky dough. I used 11.7% supermarket bread flour. It seemed stickier and less smooth than yours. Still my best loaf ever (tagged you on Insta)
I'll definitely go for some other flour and give that a go.
Have a play around with different flour and see which one works best for you. Cheers Simon, keep me posted 👌
Nice video. A couple of months ago I used Walmart unbleached all purpose flour to see if I could make a decent loaf of sourdough bread. Hydration was 70%, I also used about 15% whole wheat flour for extra flavor. I was surprised that I baked a decent loaf of bread with that combination. Not bad for flour that averages out at about 32 cents per lb.
It's good to experiment with different flour. It's interesting how different flour and water combinations behave. Also interesting how the final texture and taste can be affected too. Cheers Al Fontana
too acidic of a starter is also a significant motivation killer among new bakers
I discovered early on in my sourdough bread baking that what is termed a “strong” flour here (gluten ≥12%) is essential, and of course water that is not chlorinated, since chlorinated water inhibits yeast growth. Apart from that, the biggest factor that must be coped with is time, which is simply going to be much longer than when baking with commercial yeast. The other techniques shown in the video for a no-knead loaf (when necessary- I don’t autolyse) are easier to manage.
OMG, no wonder I have no spring! Mine only has 3g
That's already made the video worthwhile Chris :)
@@CulinaryExploration just bought white 13% and wh wh 14% protein flour. thx so much
hello friend.. Namaste..,woooo that's amazing & interesting Vedio....thanks 4 sharing.... Sukria
As one Philip to another (also without the redundant second L)... nice video. I have subscribed and will be watching your work 👍
Cheers Philip! Thanks for taking the time to comment :)
Great video with a clear explanation too. I am curious as to why did you use higher hydration with the AP flour?
Hey Owen. I felt that using the same hydration would only compare the flour. I wanted to show beginners the difference between a strong flour and lower hydration compared to a soft flour with slightly higher hydration. Especially as 75% is often considered normal hydration. Cheers Phil
@@CulinaryExploration Thank for youtr prompt reply. I have learned a lot from your videos. Keep the great videos coming in.
I use silicone cube trays approximately 1 1/2 x 1 1/2 cubes in a half dozen tray then cover with plastic wrap then place the cover which comes with the tray. Each cube holds about 60 grams of starter which gives me 360 grams of backup starter and I freeze it. It will keep for up to a year, so they say…time will tell ✨🐌✨✨
Hello! I’m enjoying your channel! Why did you increase the hydration on the AP flour?
Hey Donna, I was hoping to illustrate that a small difference in hydration and using a soft four makes a big difference - not to compare the flours with the same hydration :)
Good morning to you. Can you tell me how to revive my dried sourdough starter please?😊
I thought the weaker flour needed lower hydration. I’ll need to go back and research that point. I’ve been going down in water and it really helps.
Where do you find good organic flour with that high of a protein content?! The einkorn and King Arthur flour I use only had a protein content of 3% and 4%! My first loaf turned out perfectly.
Is it normal practice to also use bread flour for the starter? I use general purpose for my starter..should I change to bread flour? BTW I used to use a higher hydration (75-85%) and while the final result was ok, it definitely was difficult to work with. Now I use 65-70% hydration as you suggest and am very pleased with the improvement. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. :)
I notice you don’t use the cloth liners that come with some proof baskets. Are the liners more trouble than they are worth?
I’m a day or two away from my starter being ready. I’m excited to see how my first few loaves turn out.
Hey man beautiful videos. Are you leaving in Greece btw?
Yes, Nick, I do!
@@CulinaryExploration Beautiful! Me too and I always find it difficult to find some good strong bread flour, so I stick with the trusty Robin hood. There also some good ones on bioshops but quite expensive as well. Anyway happy baking and keep sharing your knowledge!
Hi what size is the banneton that you used in your video .Making the bread in 30 minutes.Thank you for your reply.Patricia
New people to this channel - he knows what he is doing and doesn't judge. Try his methods.
Birdy
I do a sour dough bread with fresh ground, hard red/white wheat flour. Does your recipe change a lot for fresh ground flour.
Would partial Einkorn flour be a good choice for sourdough bread?
I don’t care if my bread doesn’t have a giant holes, I just like the taste of sourdough bread. So what is the lowest hydration percentage that will give me a good bread, but with a consistency that I can either knead by hand or in the stand mixer?
Can you do a video about gluten free sour dough baking?
It's very iratating to hear all the experienced u tube bakers say this is easy, it's that simple, when it's not. There is a lot to troubleshoot when it goes wrong.
Making a 70% hydration dough, is that the hydration at autolysis stage or after adding the starter?
What temperature did u cook it at??
what can i do if in my country i can't find flours that have a decent amount of protein???....i just reduce the hydration?
Great vid but am wondering why you didn't use the same hydration for both doughs? I get it, you're trying to illustrate a point, but it feels like a bit of a handicap for the plain to have to contend with 5% higher hydration than the strong. High hydration isn't really its wheel house, it never really stood a chance ; )
Having said that, have you tried baking a 60-65% hydration plain sour dough? I'm optimistic as to the result. In fact It might be worth exploring, for people who can't source strong flour.
i almost quit because of my oven wasn't hot enough, like the lower heating unit is much hotter than the top, it makes my bread literally burnt on the bottom but pale on the top, since now i got a smoker (an ugly drum version) i finally can get a 450 F/230C heat and i got that thermal probe thing and i realised that the top only reach like 110 celcius....
Oh dear, forgive me………..I’m lost……I use KA organic white bread dough and organic ww flour……but I never thought to look at the protein content…….it is only 6%. I always end up with sticky dough….but the bread does come out pretty good. Where do I find a high protein flour?
Some I cant get a starter. But now that I watched this video I think I have the wrong flour. Greetings from the Netherlands
Thanks for your video! I’m using a 12% protein flour at 70% hydration, but it looks and behaves exactly like the wet one in your video. Do I just decrease the hydration? Or swap my flour (bought a 20kg sack in bulk though!)
I'd be using the 20kg sack of flour! Try decreasing the hydration a little until the dough is more manageable. If you continue to encounter problems you could blend it with a stronger flour. That's why mention baking with the flour to really test it. The protein content on the bag is one indication but you really need to get your hands involved and bake a loaf to know if the flour will work for you. Hope this helps Katie :)
Why did you hydrate the 10% flour with an extra 5%?
honestly I'm surprised how well the 11% protein flour handled at 75% hydration, I've used 11-12% flours that are standard in germany and at anything 75 or above they really are soup (at least at 100% of the flour mix). Sure it didn't handle *well* in your video but even that 11.2% punches above its weight I think, at least in terms of water absorption if not flavour!
One common aspect I see among good sourdough bakers is their strong starter. There is no doubt in my mind, this plays a major role in baking a successful loaf, all else being equal. I was surprised to see your pyramid diagram did not make mention of this essential requirement.
As far as your experiment, I absolutely agree you need to use the right hydration supported by your flour. However, I suspect there was a secondary, more subtle phenomenon going on behind the scenes- you mentioned doing a couple of feedings of your starter with the softer flour.This, I’m almost certain, derailed your starter a bit, and had you fed it with this flour for a full two weeks, you would have noticed an improvement in its potency and perhaps led to a better overall loaf. You still had the hydration issue to contend with but changing flours on a starter takes them a while to acclimate to the new bugs contained within the flour. This has been my experience; what are your thoughts Philip? Cheers!
Hey Cachi! I juggled with the idea of using my everyday starter to make the dough with the weaker flour. I don't think that would have worked through. I figure that if someone is using a soft flour for their dough then they are more than likely using it to feed their starter too. The fermentation in the starter was really active (potent) but you could tell there was no strength due to the soft flour. ATB Phil
@@CulinaryExploration you did the right thing in feeding the starter with the softer flour, no issues there. I thought perhaps you didn’t give it enough feedings with this softer flour but it looks like your starter was pretty active anyway so maybe there weren’t any negative effects from this part 😊. Thanks for replying !
@@cachi-7878 There were so many different ways to do them side by side. My main goal was just to show differences. Perhaps I'll follow up with some comparisons on different starters. I appreciate you taking the time to comment and ask questions. It keeps my gears turning lol
I was worried that making sourdough was extremely complex by the sounds of it at the beginning of the video .. especially when you drew a pyramid. After finishing the video all it comes down to is adjusting water and flour?
Can’t wait to try my hand at it.
It’s like anything. It takes some time to get a feel for the process. I don’t think it needs to be complicated. Good quality strong bread flour and the right hydration should see you well on your way
Shaping has been a pain as well as the bread coming out flat .
Now that you are in Greece try using flour from Limnos. Limnos' flours are the most ancient varieties of Greece, and maybe Europe's. The best flour you can have for anything imo. I think only 2 have kept the ancient tradition, Salamousas and Stamateri flours. Good job BTW I learned a lot from your videos. Thank you.
That's awesome info, thank you. You don't know where I can get the actual wheat grains, do you? I will try Evripidou but I doubt I'll find them there. Cheers :)
@@CulinaryExploration unfortunately I'm not from Athens and I'm not very familiar with whats out there. If you try asking people from rural regions maybe you will find something, or someone who know someone who knows.
@@SLIPKNOT2264 Thank you, I really appreciate you taking the time to get back to me. I'll have a chat with some contacts :)
The question is, can we produce decent bread with weak flour (10-11% protein) provided we give it the proper hydration? Is that even possible?
With me it has nowt to do with the stickiness i am okay with this its the sour taste that me and my partner don't like that much every single time i have tried it(3/4 times over the last 10 yrs) by loads of different methods I can't get ove r the sour taste can't think why its so popular. I much prefer long fermented doughs with small yeast amounts often using beer or cider.
I get such varying results from using the same technique. All decent bread but some rise that but better and some crumbs are the same. I tried duastic malt on my loaves recently because I read it's like giving your bread steroids. It was more like I gave it some weed.
How do I get a Softer crust I'm new to bread making, and my partner finds that sourdough crust is too hard, can I do anything to make it crisp but not to crusty if that makes sense 😁
Sourdough crust tends to be chewier than bread made with commercial yeast. You could try baking it in a loaf tin and see if that improves the texture. I've got a soft sourdough sandwich loaf on the channel that may work well. You could give that a try.
Philip, you make a great “Sensei”🤩. We are lucky all Canadian AF flour are 13.3%. Robinhood should ship you some complimentary flours😉! I like the No Knead, perfect at 71% hydration. With the Everyday SD even though same hydration, I found dough is very sticky, doesn’t look the same as yours, ended up adding couple tbsp flour still had a hard time, very frustrating. No problem with lamination, turned out good ears and crumbs. Made 4 times so far, all sticky, except one time I replaced w/30% whole wheat, dough came together easily, but smaller ears and crumbs. I even tried the quantity from No Knead, same??? Help
Try n find out the protein content of ur AP flour. Then subtract that from ur bread flour protein content, multiply the result by 2. Then subtract that from your hydration. So, for the 2 flours in the video: 13% - 10% = 3% lower protein content. Multiply 3% by 2 (because gluten absorbs 2 times more water than 'flour') = 6%. Now subtract 6% from hydration of your recipe, 70% = 64%. Using 64% hydration with the lower protein four would get very similar result. There are other factors to consider, too many to get into in the comment section, but lowering your hydration will resolved most handling issues.
@@cociman7365 I use Robinhood 13.3%. Thank you for the detail explanation, which reminded me I also need to decrease the hydration when baking in a high humidity environment.
Hey Becky, maybe it's the reduction in the amount of starter used in the recipe that makes the difference
@@CulinaryExploration I just finished baking a loaf using same amount as No Knead (128g starter. 375g flour and 247g water) but in the method as Everyday SD, it is still sticky. Bread turned out good oven spring, ears and crumbs. Next time I am going to rest a little longer before kneading.
@@BTs-he1lg Not sure about that one Becky. But I'm interested to know jow you get on when you increase the rest
Why would you go with a higher hydration dough for the lower protein content. Seems like having the hydration the same would have been a better comparison.
I did consider that Alexander, I was unsure whether that would only demonstrate the difference in the flour. I wanted to show that using a soft flour with slightly higher hydration (although not crazy) in comparison to lower hydration and a stronger flour. Cheers, Phil
I am struggling, too. I've ordered higher protein flour but my starter has only been fed the cheap all purpose flour. Do I change feedings or start a new one? Mine came from King Arthur Flour and I've fed it all purpose from Costco for about a month and a half now.
Thank you! :-)
Switch flour, you don’t need to throw it away 😀
@@CulinaryExploration Thank you. I was told people name their starter, and it's different if you change it up. Should I feel guilty if I never named the weaker one? (Just kidding.) :-) Thanks again!
The starter is what's making me want to quit! I can't get it to rise sometimes so I feed it again and I have wasted so much flour and have way too much starter
How do you get to 70% hydration? As opposed to 75%? Thank you I’m a beginner and need a little help here.
The easiest way to calculate hydration is to use a recipe calculator. There are lots out there that will do the job. I have one that's free on my website if you'd like to try it. www.culinaryexploration.eu/sourdough-calculator-signup
I'm about to give up on sourdough because I can't seem to make the bread taste tart, tangy, sour, granny smithy. I've tried overripe starter, longer fermentation at cold temp and refridgerator temp. , Different kinds of flour for the starter, different flour blends for the dough, different hydration ratios etc. No sour taste whatsoever. I'm about to give up because it costs a lot of money to heat my oven to 500 degrees for over an hour just to make bread that looks great but tastes meh.
I kept doing until I got it right. I still make mistakes but it always taste better than store bought bagged bread.
In my experience using KA flour brand, the bread flour is 12.7% and can handle a higher hydration than All-purpose @ 11.7%.
I'd like to try baking with KA flour but I can't get that here in Greece. Luckily I am able to find the Canadian Robin Hood flour.
@@CulinaryExploration There are times when I’ve baked with all-purpose flour recently and had good results by adding vital wheat gluten. I always keep some on hand. I never bake just white flour sourdough as I have a grain mill and the flavor is so improved with a blend of different wheats percentages. Recently I couldn’t get the KA bread flour and that’s why I was baking with an organic unbleached AP flour that Central Milling sells at Costco. For now, I ordered Bob’s Red Mill Artisan Bread Flour online and giving that some experiments with varying hydration. You are absolutely right-flour and water make all the difference, along with a strong, well-fed starter.
@@pzpierce I'm just getting into milling... :)
I like KA AP and used it today. It was good overall except I didn't get the spring I wanted. I think I over-proofed and the kitchen was warm. I am trying Bob's Red Mill bread flour next.
@@ChristineSpringerElaine ..Bobs Red Mill is also good ...I got about the same oven spring with both of them, and higher oven spring when I used their organic pkgs. Get organic if you can find it.