Repertoire: The BEST Tchaikovsky Sixth Symphony "Pathétique"
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- čas přidán 16. 07. 2024
- Tchaikovsky seems not to be in vogue these days with conductors, although his popularity with listeners happily remains undimmed. His Sixth Symphony, however, has served as a vehicle for some of the greatest performances captured on disc--quite a few of them in fact--and in this video I take great pleasure in telling you which ones merit your close attention
- Hudba
I've NEVER paid attention to those who want to look down their noses at Tchaikovsky. His music is wonderful. No one was better at writing beautiful melodies. As for being "Too emotional", it's ridiculous to think that music shouldn't convey emotion.
Well, Mozart was better at tunes
And, of all People in the world, Tchaikovsky would admit it :dd
@@anariondanumenor9675 I disagree.
@@anariondanumenor9675simply untrue. Mozart was too limited by the music theory of his time
@@canismajoris6733 "Simply untrue" that Mozart was a better composer, musical mind, whatever you want to call it than Tchaikovsky? Lol
Tchaikovsky was a genius. He was a transcendental melodist, a brilliant orchestrator, and wrote music with a profound emotional weight that he captured in his inimitable way.
Thank you VERY much for your appreciation of Tchiaikovsky! When I entered colloge in 1961, I was practically mobbed as the only person seriously interested in music who had loved Tchaikovsky beyond his or her twelfth birthday - similar blasphemes were also uttered regrading Beethoven's symphonies. In the meantime, Tchaikovsky has become more widely acknowledged - an example of this is the establishment of his opera „Pique Dame,“ in the standard repertoire which anticipates „Wozzeck,“ Proust, and Freud.
I consider Tchaikovsky one of the greatest composers who ever iived not only thanks to his unsurpassable craftsmanship, but above all because he expresses a vaster scope of emotions than any other composer. From despair to jubilation, from heaviness to iightness, from ineffable tenderness to utmost brutality: the entire gamut of human experience is packed into this one composer, even moreso than in Beethoven or Wagner! Mahler is perhaps an exception, but Tchaikovsky was his trailbrlazer! It is unfathomable what an experimental and innovative work the „Pathétique“ is - „Manfred“ also - it is incredibly modern!
Tchaikovsky rules. His ballets are why I discovered classical music and his symphonies made me stay. Great video and great choices. I already love a few of these recordings and now have some new ones to check out. Thanks!
“It’s time to come back to Tchaikovsky!” Man, you made my day!!! 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
"This name, the Pathetic Symphony, was given to my piece by some of my old friends. Well, I have a new set of friends now..." - Peter Schickele
Joking aside, great video. The Fricsay really is an absolutely searing recording, and very well recorded for its 1959 vintage too. I cannot imagine why DG neglected it for so long.
Fricsay was a phenomenal Tchaikovsky conductor and a phenomenal conductor, period. This Pathetique is superb but in my book the earlier 1953 mono with the same Orchestra is even more intense and more impulsive, the stereo slower. This 1953 Fricsay is desert island Pathetique!
@@silviofernandez585it's not with the same orchestra. Teh earlier recording is with the Berlin Phil, the later one with the Berlin Radio
I had the Ashkenazi 4,5,6 on cassettes and use to listen to them in the car when I would drive from South Carolina to Miami (and back)
They where FANTASTIC and will always hold a special place in my heart 👍
Hello friends! Love this greeting - cheers me up when I feel blue. Thanks Dave! My personal favourite are Mravinsky and the EMI Karajan. Never understood why people get sniffy about Tchaikovsky. He was a big genius imo.
I haven’t heard to all of these, but when I first listened to the Fricsay stereo recording with Berlin Radio I was absolutely floored. It was so emotional, a perfect mixture of melancholy and joy that was excruciatingly beautiful. I really became enamored with the piece after that and sought out other performances but none have topped this one.
Ashamed to say the Fricsay is new to me, but tardy or not I can't thank you enough for the introduction. What a phenomenal performance! From the opening bars it's so clearly an "event," everything speaking, every phrase, every dynamic shift, every new color registering. I think you called it supremely "communicative," and that's just the word. Deeply expressive. And so moving. I'm frequently moved by this symphony, but not often from the very start. Yet Fricsay has an uncanny way of pulling you right in, there's an intimacy and particularity of address that's hard to describe but impossible not to feel. And it never lets up, right through to that shattering finale. I've encountered a number of recordings new to me over this past year of listening, all of which I'm grateful for--the way they've expanded my sense of the music and the range of music-making. But I think it's fair to say that none of these have hit me with the force of this Fricsay Pathetique. What a discovery. Almost takes me back to my first years of buying LPs, bringing them home, dropping the needle, and entering a whole new world. I feel quite young again! And that too is a gift. Thanks, Dave.
Thank YOU for sharing this experience. It should give everyone hope!
Fricsay was the man. Astonishing profoundness of interpretation
That's incredible that Bernstein read your review! I love that performance, will always be dear to me.
Thanks for another fascinating talk, would be interested to read the "Hi Fidelity" article! Perhaps a future video could cover "Misunderstood Bernstein"? (maybe including his Amsterdam Mahler 9?)
Previously, I only had the top cycles to go by. I had been impressed by the performances under Haitink and Markevitch especially, but also Mehta. I'm glad to get to know some of these singleton performances. I just listened to the Munch, and I'm very glad for it. It's moved me deeply. Enough said, thank you David
One of my favorite symphonies. Thanks for this video!
Big, big Tchaikovsky fan here. And my personal favorite 6th is Toscanini.
Thanks for this overview David! It comes at a good time. This was the symphony that made me first realize how powerfull orchestral music could be, but I haven't really listened to it for about two or three years. Probably going to it hear it twice this concert season, so I've been trying to get back into Tchaikovsky, just hadn't found the time till now.
Thank sooo much for the individual Tchaikovsky symphonies. You are absolutely right.
I love your take on modern, young conductors. You are spot on. My introduction to the 'Pathetique' was Monteux's recording on a mono LP. I still have it in my collection of records and it still sounds beautiful.
I love it when you do these talks where you go through 15-20 recordings of a major work. The advantage of the Brilliant Classics Muti box compared to the EMI boxes available around the same time is that it doesn't split symphonies across discs.
Thank you so much Dave for putting a well deserved spotlight on two of the finest Pathetique's out there, Munch and Monteux and Boston. Anyone who believes there's only one "French" way of conducting needs only to listen to these two Desert Island performances. I've adored them for decades and both performances are something those of us in this country can be justly proud of. My God the Boston Symphony really could play the spots off that piece, both times! I only wish that the young conductors of today would sit down, or be tied down, and listen to these interpretations. I can't tell you how many bad Pathetique's I've sat through over the years silently wishing I'd stayed home and listened to Munch and Monteux instead. Thanks again Dave for your "spotlight" and your insight. Happy New Year!
thank you Dave - such an informative and entertaining episode - you are a treasure !
So many great ones. Fricsay, Muti (Philharmonia), Bernstein (DG), Markevitch, and a few others have always been my "go to" recordings, but I have probably 60 recordings of this work just because I love hearing it and hearing different recordings of it. One of the biggest surprises for me was Giulini and the Los Angeles Philharmonic on DG. I hadn't heard it until the Giulini Complete DG box came out. I thought it would be slow and overly heavy, but it's really exciting, dramatic, quick and dynamic. Definitely one I will be returning to more frequently.
Giulini also recorded the Pathetique with the Philharmonia for EMI and it is also a wonderful recording.
I had a time in which I didn't listen to Tchaikovsky's music because I thought it was "easy", or " just beauty", or nonsense like those. Then your channel came and I realised how moronic I was. Now I listen again a lot of his music, and for me Tchaikovsky is one of the very greatest. So thank you, David.
And I love your recomendation about Haitink's cycle (in the complete cycle video). I think Haitink is one who nails it and I never should have thought.
You make a lot of good points about choosing a recording, many thanks Dave.
YAY!!! I have some of those. I do enjoy the Reiner, though. I have the old RCA Ormandy/Philly version on 78s. I think it was his first recording for that label. Very good, video thank you.
I second Mr. Hurwitz's order: Read Galina! Simply wonderful.
Yes! I got an autographed copy for like $10.
As usual, I turned to Spotify to take a listen to the number one choice. I'm so enthralled I just purchased it on Presto. Thanks again for turning me on to a stellar interpretation I would have passed over.
I don't believe the final Fricsay recording is available on Spotify - I had to purchase the CD from amazon (Japanese DG import I think). The one DG Fricsay Pathétique available on Spotify is the much earlier one which is still good but the final stereo recording is amazing. Check out the red Orfeo one (coupled with Bartók's 3rd piano concerto), that IS available on Spotify and as David says, was recorded at a similar time.
@@joewebb1983 It IS on Spotify, but under the box title Ferenc Fricsay Complete Recordings on Deutsche Grammophon. If you specify Tchaikovsky you won't find it. Many titles seem not to be on Spotify, but that's because those filing under certain titles don't know classical. In this box on Spotify are both DGG Fricsay Tchaikovsky 6s... and a whole lot more!
@@davidaltschuler9687 good find but I don't see any Tchai 6's in either of the two compilations by that name. There are two results when I do that search which have an orange border. Part 1 and Part 2, loads of good stuff in there but no Tchaikovsky... I have all his recordings of the Pathétique but this would be useful for others. Maybe (I don't know why I would be) this is region-restricted. I am in the UK.
Spot on review, as per usual! Fricsay has always been my absolute favorite. Three other favorites are Silvestri/Philharmonia, Kondrashin, and Mravinsky/1982 live.
Just heard Daniele Gatti's Tchaikovsky 6th. Love it! Beautiful recording, thank you for the recommandation.
The first classical LP I ever bought, (I was in sixth grade at the time) was the wonderful Giulini PIT6 on Seraphim. Yes, I absolutely imprinted on it, and I still love it. One of my favorite Pathetiques ever.
I believe the Karajan version you mention is his last analog recording with the Berlin Philharmonic from 1976. It remains my go to version even today, although I have many other digital recordings. No other recording of the Pathetique that I have heard has the intensity and such beautiful playing. Karajan also recorded it digitally again with the Berlin Philharmonic in the 1980s, but it is not nearly as inspired.
I suspect this video could have gone on for another 40mins... And I would have watched it 😊
It is a tremendous work both in emotion and form, as you say. I adore it.
I have the majority of the recordings you recommended aside from the Levine and the Melik-Pasharev - I'll try to find them.
So glad that Dorati and Gatti are mentioned, they are very fine. I also like Maazel's - it has a good mix of emotion, playing and attention to the score (short 2nd cymbal clash in 3rd movement, split strings so important in 4th).
I also love Silvestri's performance with the Philharmonia, the way he phrases the final movement, words cannot describe it.
Of more modern recordings I like Dausgaard and Pappano... I think they both do a very good job.
I agree about Fricsay... Perfection.
All of Tchaikovsky s music is magnificent!!!
Dear David, How in the world do you have so much time to listen to so many recordings and do so many review videos? My God man, how do you do it? Anyway, thank you for giving us these eccentric, entertaining, informative and humorous reviews. I have to say it took me a long time to get used to your style and take, but now that I am, I really like you.
Well, I've been listening for 45 years at least, and I have a trick memory--I really do. I remember almost everything musical that I've ever heard, especially differences between versions of the same thing. It's a quirk, and I can't really explain it, since my memory is quite fallible normally--just not when it comes to music.
@@DavesClassicalGuide It reminds me of something I heard about Sviatoslav Richter, he could remember the names of everyone he has ever met, and maybe the details of the conversation.
@@DavesClassicalGuide David you came into this world to love music, and moreover to spread that love around to a huge and appreciative audience, for more than 45 years. The heavens needed a voice to explain how great our music is, and it fell to you to be their choice.
I have heard Karajan and like all his recordings they can be scrappy in places. I have Ashkenazy with the Philharmonia and don't need to look any further. It's impeccably played and the sound quality is as good as it gets. 80's Decca sound is sensational. Great video Dave as usual.
@@DavesClassicalGuideQuite a gift. If you search for a Radiolab podcast episode called "A 4-Track Mind", you might be in for a treat, if you're into that sort of thing. It's a fascinating look at what the human brain is capable of musically. I wish I had his, and your, musical memories!
I was looking for the best version of this to send to my loved one.
I ran across your channel whilst looking for the best Beethhoven 6th and , if I may, you nailed it. So...here I am for the Tchaikovsky .
Hopefully Amazon has your favorite. I've been a novice for 40 years and will happily remain so for the next 20.
Cheers
Welcome! Thanks for listening. Remember, if you can't find my top choice, there are several alternatives that many would say are just as good or better. You can't go wrong with any of them. So don't make yourself crazy over it.
Heureka! I enjoyed that a lot. A very exciting and inspiring review of the best Pathetic recordings of which I have heard quiet a few and I am in complete accordance with you on the ‘razor sharp’ Muti and my first and beloved Bernstein versions. I am now very much looking forward to the Fricsay recording which I have not heard. As for the symphony it self I enjoy the inventions and the music of Tchaikovsky very, very much, and do not care for the conspiratorial hullabalu surrounding it, try Bernstein’s analysis of the work, and there you got it. Plain and simple - and complex. Thanks again for this video. And your channel!
Gergiev with the Marinsky . . . astounding! His sonorities, pacing, and climaxes are channeling Toscanini. Speaking of which, Toscanini made this symphony sing as few others have.
ah, but WHICH gergiev. i liked him in the 90s( from videos I see now, as I was a child then) but experiencing him live nowadays, omg....what a phony. Sorry, just my opinion.
@@classicalperformances8777 No need to apologize. Not everyone is consistently great. I love Muti when he was in Philadelphia with Stravinsky's Rite of Spring. Not so much with Beethoven's 7th.
My recordings of this 6th is the one conducted by Rojdestvensky. I like it. Mravinsky is on my top list. And Golovanov is my crazy one. And Mengelberg, I could'nt stop listening to it when I got it. And I will consider to get the Fricsay one. Thank you
I saw Jurowski conduct the Pathetique with the Russian National Orchestra in Seattle some years ago. He did it without a score. One of the greatest performances I've seen of any work.
David,
I agree wholeheartedly with your choice of Fricsay’s performance at the top of the list.
I was raised with Toscanini’s version but when I wrote a paper on the Pathetique in college in the 1970s, I heard Fricsay for the first time and never recovered!
Another enjoyable and informative presentation. Fun too. Lots of my favorites here especially these three: Monteux, Mravinsky and Munch. Tops for me. Will explore the others. A billion years ago in the early days of stereo, I remember a surprisingly good one from Carlo Maria Giulini on EMI with the Philharmonia I think. I lost the lp in one of my moves. Does anyone else remember it?
Yes! I have this --I really love it as I do Giulini!
Oh yes, the beautiful Giulini recording!! I had that one too, on lp. And I enjoyed it very much and many times.
I have the Giuliani performance on EMI as well,
It’s stunning…like almost everything he recorded:
I too had the Giulini on lp and have fond memories of it.
Hey David, I love your channel and it's great to hear your love for Tchaikovsky. I love Tchaikovsky too, my favorite is the 5th symphony. That slow darkish opening melody and then....ah... Greatness. It's the first classical piece that I listened to 20 some years ago, I was coming from metal then and going through a lot of exploring musically, pop, jazz/fusion, singer songwriter and I stumbled on this symphony and it was the first time I actively listened to a classical piece with my eyes closed and it took me in. I loved it. It was a version by some London Orchestra (don't remember which) with Arpad Joo as conductor. Any way, enough rambling, I'm going to check your channel if you've made a video on the 5th.
I have not, yet, although I have done a list of "Ideal" Tchaikovsky symphonies.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Hi David. Thanks for your reply. As I said, Tchaikovsky's 5th has a special place in my heart,.I would love to hear your take on it, about the piece itself and the various recordings. But in the meanwhile your 6th symphony has got me inspired to listen once again to the 6th (the ones I have at least). Tonight I've listened to Karajan's version and Gergiev's (a bit tricky maybe in these days), difficult to compare because the Gergiev (Mariinsky 2010 ish) version has a better sound quality, still have to listen to a Mikhail Pletnev version I have for comparison.
How can you be so brilliant as critic and drop dead hysterical re Bruckner?
Bernstein will always be the prize for the 6th.
Abbado and Celi are both wanting in this symphony. I want to hear your top 3.
Incase some people are not aware of this,there is a live Szell/Cleveland performance on you tube.Pretty,pretty,pretty good.
Thanks, I'll have to check out some of your recommendations. The first recording I ever heard was part of an early Reader's Digest (RCA) box set; early stereo recording performed by the London Festival Orchestra conducted by Alexander Gibson. The brass section in the first Movt is pretty strong and crisp.and the recording has good stereo separation.
"Musicology has never given Tchaikovsky much credit..." This was certainly true at least in the West up until ,the late 70's, when the first volume of British scholar David Brown's four volume biographical study came out. Brown states in his intro to V.1, "The Early Years" that as a student, T's music "appealed to me then, but...I was a little ashamed of my response...[but] the intervening years have disclosed qualities in him that I had never suspected, and with which I believe he is still far too rarely credited."
In 2006, FIifteen years after the publication of the fourth volume, "The Final Years" (which contains a thoughtful and detailed analysis of the Pathetique - or "pot of tea", "puddity" or "potato", as it is variously rendered by the closed captions), Brown produced a single volume entitled "Tchaikovsky - the Man and his Music" which was intended as a biography/listener's guide aimed at "readers who may have little or no knowledge of musical theory and terminology, who may wish to make a closer acquaintance with a selection of Tchaikovsky's individual works." For those able to follow the musical examples, the earlier 4 volume study is of course more thorough and detailed, and especially valuable for detailed background, plot synopses and musical analyses of all the operas, for many of which, information is still hard to come by.
Re the "Italian" quality of his melodies: to anyone questioning this assertion, I'd suggest taking a look at the 1937 McDonald-Eddy film "Maytime" which contains a sequence where the two stars perform a mini "opera" called "Czaritsa" concocted by MGM
house composer Herbert Stothart using themes from the the 5th Symphony. It's remarkable how well T's tunes adapt to being turned into a love duet a la Puccini, which I think shows how vocal and Italianate these themes are.
Interesting that you mention "Maytime", a truly classic film. Initially, I recoiled from the "Czaritsa" episode, but must admit it works very well, for reasons you point out. Stothart occasionally resorted to wholesale use of "classic" repertoire for his big MGM soundtracks (Tchaik's Manfred Sym in "the Three Musketeers" ('48) and Delius' Appalachia in "The Yearling" ('46), but at least the original composer was given prominent screen credit. LR
Then there is the 1943 Universal 'Phantom of the Opera' with Nelson Eddy. Remember 'Love and Duty-- or Gloire?' (Amour et Gloire) taken from Tchaik 4th. With some Chopin thrown in.
Love the Young Frankenstein reference to Bruckner.
Glorious!!!!
The overall qualities of the RCA Japan complete Tchaikovsky symphonies by Philadelphia with Ormandy is solid in every aspect.
Another performance, worth listening to, is in my opinion Martinon with Vienna Phil.(1958). Excellent playing and sonics. Martinon direction pays attention to every orchestration detail and is perfectly balanced, intense where it has to be, without being hysterical, lyrical but not over-sentimental.
Thanks for the great survey! And the reminder of Melik-Pashayev, which I hadn't thought about in years. I'll just add one (imho) overlooked one....Paul Kletzki/Philharmonia (1960 EMI studio). I think it was on Classics for Pleasure, but the most recent issue is strangely coupled with a live Oistrakh Tchaikovsky Concerto on Medici Masters. I figured it was a live 6th, but nope, it's the studio one. For me it captures the elegance and the volatility, and wow, they sing like hell. Maybe Warner will do a Kletzki box? If so, sign me up!
Wow, so glad you like Levine and the CSO, I thought I was one of the few who even knew about that recording. I don't think it was in print very long and to my knowledge it was never reissued, at least in the USA. I think it's an exceptional performance.
Hi David, thanks again for this informative video.
I thought it noteworthy that four London orchestras (LSO, LPO, Philharmonia, and Royal PO) feature on this list. It could be a coincidence, but wonder if there is a case to make that British orchestras are particularly suitable for Tchaikovsky regarding colour and style, if indeed they share commonalities in those regards? (also thinking of the Royal Liverpool/Petrenko Tchaikovskies and the LSO ballets with Dorati and Previn)
I am so glad to hear your view on Bernstein's NYP on DG. Its 4th movement has always been my favorite. Some negative reviews of Bernstein made me wonder if I were crazy. I agree that Fricsay is the first choice on the whole.
I have nothing to add about the actual recordings -- you hit all my favorites, and there are so many good ones out there.
But I will add that I think this symphony is a great candidate for a complete beginner's very first classical recording. Many times, you have to overcome the prejudice that classical music is either stuffy music for geriatric snobs or the equivalent of a plate of steamed vegetables, supposedly good for you but utterly joyless to sit there and swallow ("Mozart to Get Your Baby Into Harvard").
And hey, you can't always predict what will reach out and grab you. I'm sure for some people, the St. Matthew Passion or Pierrot Lunaire is just the ticket to get them hooked. But for most people, I think Tchaikovsky gets it right: great tunes, great orchestration, heart on his sleeve emotions. The beautiful parts are beautiful, the exciting parts are exciting.
That's why I think the classic Mravinsky set is a particularly great candidate. Yes, the Fricsay is more musical, the Munch is better played. But I think the white-hot intensity of that recording is such a shock-and-awe moment the first time you hear it (yes, I know you said not to say other recordings are more exciting). It shows that classical can be just as thrilling, as loud, as heart pumping as anything in popular music. And it certainly doesn't hurt that it's very easy to find, probably hasn't gone out of print since the day it was issued.
"...I think this symphony is a great candidate for a complete beginner's very first classical recording..." Funny you should mention that -- I was a young and naïve teenager (eons ago) when I stepped into a record store and boldly asked for 'something classical'. The clerk suggested Tchaikovsky so I grabbed the 6th symphony, sight unseen. Never heard of a 'symphony', never heard of Tchaikovsky. "In the key of B minor" threw me because I didn't know what a key was, so I asked if they had it in any other key. Never looked back...
Thank you for a wonderful survey of recordings of my favorite symphony! I must listen to the Dorati, Fricsay and Bernstein performances.
May I add a few to your selection?
1. Rozhdestvensky/Melodiya: aristocratic and lyrical, like the rest of his cycle.
2. Kirill Petrenko/ Berlin Phil: musical, balanced and very well played.
3. Karajan mid-70s DG: yes its slick but excellent!
4. Karajan/VPO 1985: his last recording of the symphony with a deeply-felt last movement, truly tragic.
5. Currentzis: pure HOLLYWOOD and so contrived!
The Bernstein performance is special for all the reasons articulated. However in the finale there appears to be a breakdown in ensemble at the most important moment. Tchaikovsky builds up the emotion to fever pitch and this is released by a seven-pronged stabbing motion repeated several times ; here, the entry is all over the place, the orchestra not in unison though they recover by the second iteration, a flaw that detracts slightly from an otherwise astonishing account.
The video I’ve been waiting for, it is my favourite work.
Thanks Dave, eager to see what your top recommendation is.
Mine is Gergiev with the Vienna Phil, such a powerful recording.
Gergiev/Vienna is a real letdown, sadly.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Hi Dave, thanks for the reply. It’s interesting you think that because I hear a really terse, emotive account. One bit in the finale just before the loud C major chord - the D, C#, B, A motif - has the strings repeat some of the motif without vibrato which I find, ironically, moving.
This was recorded just after the atrocity in Beslan. Maybe that fact artificially elevates the recording personally.
I’m guessing there’s something particular you don’t like about it. I’m curious to know what it is you don’t like.
That is, of course, is the beauty of music. We all hear something different despite it being the same thing.
I’m with you on your top choices, the Fricsay, Munch are both outstanding as is the Markevitch.
@@danielhornby5581 You can read my review on ClassicsToday.com.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Thanks 😊
I just listened to a Fricsay recording on CZcams and it changed how I thought about this masterpiece. Fricsay's interpretation is dark, intense, and packed with passion. I experienced chills and my eyes filled with tears. Never have I heard the 6th grab the listener and not let go until the fade out at the end. It's like Fricsay opened Tchaikovsky's heart to us in 1893 and revealed all. Nobody plays Peter Ilyich this way anymore. What a tragedy that this remarkable musician died so young. Many thanks, David, for recommending this.
Found the Fricsay as part of his Complete Recordings on DG (Part 3 of Volume 1), which includes TWO Pathétiques, Berlin Phil and the Radio Symphony. The shock is that the one you’re recommending is fully 8 minutes longer. 50 minutes vs 42!
Yep. And I love every extra minute.
Bless David Hurwitz. From another angle, someone should compile a list of some of the treasures in the captions. For this symphony, one of the best: The Potted Teak.
So happy to hear you mention Levine's CSO recording. I've been listening to it for years, and it's perhaps the best thing he did in Chicago. The brass are stunning, but the winds and strings acquit themselves nicely. Terrific cymbal crash in third movement. Early digital recording, but not glassy at all. And the vinyl is great if you find it. Interestingly, the coupling does work. The Stravinsky is performed most excellently by Chicago's first chair players, and sonically it's great as well. Jay Friedman and Bud Herseth never sounded better. The Japan import is the only way to hear the Soldat on CD, because never released domestically except on 1970's vinyl. What are you waiting for? Go track it down.
Tchaikovsky/Bernstein/ New York/ DGG: ABSOLUTA MARAVILLA.
Bernstein's later 4-5-6 with New York are great. One crazy sleeper sixth that I was hoping you might touch was Mstislav Rostropovich and the National Symphony Orchestra. I call it a crazy sleeper because the first time I heard it was on the radio and, when it was over and the announcer recapped the performers, I was astounded. Not that it was a bad ensemble, but I had no clue the NSO of that time could sound so good with Tchaikovsky.
Interesting point about Bernstein's "expansion" of the fourth movement, because that movement has always seemed more along the lines of an epilogue, and I don't mean that in a negative way. So I'm very curious to hear the effect of Bernstein's approach.
I'm also curious about Russian performances. I read that when Stravinsky visited Soviet-era Moscow, he (and his entire entourage) were struck by the completely different sound of The Rite of Spring. After years of hearing precise, sonically polished performances by European and American orchestras, the composer felt he was reintroduced to the "primitive menace" of his original inspiration. (I'm drawing on Stephen Walsh's biography.)
Heard Lenny conduct this at Ravinia not long before he died. The last movement was even slower than the record. Absolute silence from the crowd, and a long silence at the end - then- PANDEMONIUM! Last time I saw him.
Wonderful video, David--I discovered a few versions of this symphony I had never heard! Thank you, as always. But I wanted to respond to something you said about the general decline in Tchaikovsky conducting (with notable exceptions) and his reduced status among the would-be cognoscenti of the classical music world (though not, as you noted elsewhere, among audiences, where he remains a bigger concert draw Bruckner--the horseless version of whom I also love, incidentally; I'm very glad the world contains Tchaikovsky and Bruckner, though I share your dislike of Bruchhhhhhhhhhkner). The particular point you made concerned the role of musicologists in downplaying Tchaikovsky's worth, self-recommending though he is, because their clinical descriptive vocabulary doesn't enable them to talk meaningfully about that most precious of commodities: a good tune.
My thought is this: if musicologists can't or won't do this, that is why we have critics; that is why we have you. Rather than worry about repeating discussions of the same cycles across multiple videos, or about appearing hopelessly retrogressive and old--no one who has heard you speak in glowing terms about excellent modern performances or challenging modern repertoire could possibly think that--I think one more yeoman service this channel can do, especially as its audience and influence continues to grow, is to take viewers on trips through great works, exactly as you tend to do in the Haydn "crusade." Those videos are treasures not only because of your wonderful aptitude for discussing form, but because of your exuberance for the way those forms become the vessels and vehicles of "glorious!" music. Perhaps the way to approach Tchaikovsky in the future, especially for newcomers, is to provide guided tours of his symphonies (and other great works--like those marvelous orchestral suites no one seems to talk about), calling attention both to how different mottoes and motives are developed across movements (the "musicological" stuff) but also the purely aesthetic matters of which the critic is, etymologically and otherwise, the judge (the "just LISTEN to this damned tune!" stuff).
I say this because it really is something special and wonderful this channel does: it combines musicology and a real enthusiasm for beauty to provide a refreshingly non-academic, accessible guide to "what to listen for in music" (as Copland put it). It is this combination of rigor and accessibility that is likely to open the most new ears to something as wonderful as Tchaikovsky. And as someone who teaches Gen Z kids (and is raising one), I can tell you: they could all use a bit of Tchaikovsky in their lives: real, unironic warmth and feeling that can make us long for meaningful connection to one another. He is not a hipster's composer; he speaks to those real feelings that make us human. So maybe you don't need to worry about the discography (though I always love to find new versions to enjoy). You can say "go watch my video on the ideal Tchaikovsky cycle" and indulge your love of form AND content. It is always a joy to watch you hold forth on a piece for thirty or forty minutes, taking it apart and calling attention to its secrets. Your viewers stand to learn more about Tchaikovsky (and Bruckner!) the more often you do just that. Just my two (prolix) cents.
Thanks for the great video!
Wow... A nice surprise on a Sunday. My most favourite Tchaikovsky work and one of my most favourite of all works. I look forward to seeing the results of this one... 😊
@@finlybenyunes8385 sorry, my favouritist.
Earlier I had an allergy to the Pathétique. I was scared of listening to it especially since Tchaikovsky dropped dead no more than 9 days after the premiere. Also, Dennis Brain, the revered horn player died in a car accident with the Pathétique being his last performance. Only recently have I come to realise what a masterpiece it truly is.
Many years ago, I had a roommate, who played French Horn orchestrally. He introduced me to Dennin Brain, he had recordings of his. Wow beautiful horn playing!
Thanks David, some really interesting sounding versions to try. My own favourite recording is a different 70s option, Ozawa with the Orchestre de Paris, please dont dismiss due to reservations over the orchestra, it really is a great performance (great analogue sound too). So glad Pletnev wasn't mentioned, I bought his Russian National Orchestra version wanting a digital version years ago on the back of a glowing reference from the Penguin Guide but found it very underwhelming.. I do like the Ashkenazy Philharmonia recording but Ozawa has been my go to up to now
Fantastic talk! I also love several of these picks. David, what do you think of the Pathetique in that recent box of Rodzinski’s Columbia 1940s recordings?
Underwhelming.
A daunting task! My first acquaintance with the Pathetique was with Mitropoulos and the NY Phil Sym on LP that was soon replaced with Ormandy’s first stereo version on Columbia. I don’t remember how many copies of that I bought-but several to find one where you could actually hear the quiet opening without distracting clicks and pops! Much later I turned to Ashkenazy on cassette and then Pletnev’s first recording on CD because of all the rave reviews. I never liked it though, finding it cold and impersonal. Now on CD it is that Ashkenazy/Philharmonia on Decca for the fabulous sound as much as the wonderful performance, though I also like Gatti’s Royal Phil accounts of 4, 5, & 6.
A slight digression from the topic in question: The 4 Tchaik orchestral Suites are woefully underperformed and recorded in comparison with the symphonies. A DH review of the suites would be heartily appreciated... Hint.Hint.^^
Great video and has my favourite recordings. That Gergiev Kirov was brilliant, upfront sound and coupled with a knockout Romeo and Juliet too. Those remakes have such wet thick sound and he sounds utterly bored. Such pleased about Fricsay winning but I actually prefer his mono DG one with the Berlin phil: the first movement is so intense it takes the microphones past their tolerance. Utterly terryfying but still elegant when it needs. Pappano is my pick of the recent ones
I'm curious your thoughts on Dutoit's performance with Montreal on Decca. It seems to make a lot of other people's lists, and is one of my favorites as well, and it kind of surprised me that you didn't mention it at all.
It made little impression on me.
Thanks, Dave, for a most interesting talk. I'm quite curious about what you think about Paavo Järvi's 6th from Zürich. I admire his cycle and find the 6th very good.
Haven't heard it yet.
It surprises me that Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Brahms, Berlioz, Debussy, Ravel and Stravinsky have all received big box Complete Works Editions from Warner, Universal or Naxos --- but not Tchaikovsky.
Universal would seem to have a head start on the competition with the operas from Gergiev (Philips).
--- It would also be nice if Sony would bring us a Complete Serge Koussevitsky/Boston Symphony box.
Koussevitzky was 20 years old when Tchaikovsky died (1894).
The 17 year old Koussevitzky entered the Moscow Conservatory in 1891and once played the Andante Cantabile on the double bass with Professor Tchaikovsky at the piano
Koussevitzky's recordings would be an exemplar of Historical Performance Practice in Russian Music (sorry Teodor Currentzis).
I tried to cite the source for the information about Koussevitsky and Tchaikovsky but CZcams deleted my previous post.
My favorite is Eugene Ormandy and The Philadelphia Orchestra recorded by Columbia masterworks in the early 60's. Same with the fifth and the reconstructed 7th.
I believe it was recorded in 1960 and you are right it is a wonderful performance. Dignified, precise and passionate!
David, just wonder your though on the Mackerras/Philharmonia on Signum. I just discover this recording recently and I think it is very fine. He brought out the percussion more clearly than anyone else. It is somewhat an unsentimental reading.
It is very fine.
For me Temirkanov on RCA strikes a great balance between 'Russianness' and elegance.
His performances of it in Baltimore were glorious
The Bruckner bits were hilarious.
i wanted to add this comment last week when i watched the vid; unfortunately google now demands one login b4 leaving a comment and it took me days to get back into goodle. anyway, i disagree with you from time to time, but i must say your comments on p.i. tchaikovsky were just excellent. thank you.
I loved the dohnanyi cleveland recording. Is there any chance decca
Does a dohnanyi box at some point?
I wish.
I'm pretty sure that the Dohnanyi/Cleveland Tchaikovsky 6 was a Telarc recording, not Decca. But yes, a Decca Dohnanyi complete box would be wonderful. He's very deserving of one.
@@toddschurk8143 you are right...don't know who owns telarc recordings. I was a regular in the dohnanyi days and also saw the last few years of maazel in Cleveland. I would like to hear the story of what happened to the cleveland orchestra ring cycle. Dave has hinted he might give us the story one of these days.
Im a huge fan of this incredible music...Always love the brutal passion of the Russians..Svetlanov,Mravinsky. Konstantin Ivanov, Gennady Rozhdestvensky.....doing this music.
This is a fine array of recommendations, most of which I've heard. All good in their own way. I'm old and require stimulation, so I tend to measure T6's by the 3rd movement, which must absolutely kick ass. Too slow or tepid seriously taints an otherwise excellent performance. The Mravinski November 1982 live Leningrad PO recording (released in 1983) is my desert island choice. Beautifully played throughout, with an epic 3rd movement. Another really excellent one few people know about from the 1980's is Klaus Tennstedt conducting the Philadelphia Orchestra live.
I think the Muti / Philly remake is also on EMI. If you have the big Muti box, you can compare the two. I am enjoying the recent Pittsburgh / Honeck recording. It’s also has a fun suite from Dvorak’s Rusalka.
Yes.
The great thing about the sixth symphony of Tchaikovsky is if you want a happy ending, just swap the last two movements around. It works surprisingly well. Sure, you'll go to hell, but it is really mind bending to hear if you've never done it. 😆
Thanks for another great talk! One reason why Fricsay might not have wanted his recording with the Berlin DSO to be released could be the terrible cutting error at the end of the first movement: at 20:38 the tempo suddenly gets quicker. Kind of ruins the wonderful pizzicato passage, what a pity.
The contrast between the 62 Markevitch's recording with the LSO and the Bernstein NYPO from the 1987 is fascinating. The first movement is 18'37'' in the Markevitch rendition. L.B. takes 22'34" in his late 80s version. The finale is 9'45" long in the I.M. recording. In Bernstein's it is 17'12" (!). Markevitch version is very swift, one might indeed say antisentimental, but also acoustically voluptuous, and the clarity in the dialogue between orchestral sections can even be "tasted". I was surprised also at how well it is recorded. I felt almost in a concert hall. On the other end, Bernstein's contrasts are monumental. The change from the main "love theme" to the menacing, pessimistic passage in the first movement is crushing, even though I think the very slow tempi feels like trying to walk on heavy snow, and it takes away from the menacing atmosphere and tension that could be better with more energy (before tragedy, there should be tension, menace, not just sadness and lamentation). Anyway, thanks to Mr. Hurwitz for these recommendations. My favorite so far is Karajan's from the mid 60s. I still have a lot of these to hear.
Karajan's mid '60s version is beautiful except for all those late woodwind entrances in the first movement which makes me nuts.
Markevitch is still my choice, as it is with all Tchaikovsky Symphonies, save for Maazel here and there. But I shall be checking out Bernstein and Fricsay. And I’ll revisit Ormandy, which I think was my first hearing ages ago. I still find the triumphant 3rd movement being followed by the depths of despair in the Finale incongruous. It’s certainly intentional. Whether he knew he was dying or was suicidal is unknown. Anything surmised is pure conjecture.
My favourites are Janssens + Oslo and Mravinsky. Karajan with the Philharmonia was good too.
I am not a Tchaikovsky fan when I am not listening to him. But whenever I hear him, which is not often, I am seduced against my will into the glorious emotion of his genius.
Ditto
Oooh......come on !
Huh?
Alguien que me diga en su opinión cual es la mejor versión de la Cuarta Sinfonía de Tchaikovsky? Es mi favorita y parece que a los que revisan discos no les interesa reseñarla. Tengo muchas de las grabaciones que menciona el señor Hurwitz, pero me interesaría más que me recomendaran versiones de la Cuarta de T.
Por favor, espere el siguiente video!
Pyotr's magnum opus for me.
my favorite fricsay recording....(1) beethoven 7 ,(2) schereazade,(3) the pathetique,.....a midsummer nigth dream,and the rite of spring...all on dgg or heliodor....and the strauss walz...!!!! of course
The one I grew up with was Vladimir Golschmann on open reel on the Vanguard label. I listen to it now and I feel he is outclassed by a good many others. Not bad by any means, but doesn't compare with so many of the great ones out there.
I have a soft spot for the recording by Mikko Franck and the Swedish Radio Symphony Orchestra. Very similar to Bernstein’s. Unusually slow in certain sections, but it pays off at its climaxes.
He was famous as a "slow" conductor.
Hi Dave, what’s your opinion on the Honeck recording of Tchaikovsky 6?
Check out the review at ClassicsToday.com.
Wondering just how many recordings of this work were made by the Philharmonia Orchestra. They may hold the record.
Just a question: in what video did the Bruckner/Horse running gag start? I must have missed it.
Me too. I don't remember.
Young Frankenstein
Hey Dave, have you heard Kazimierz Kord and the Royal Philharmonic? I think it was released by Decca in 1979. Thats the one I compare every other to .......
I forgot to add, but I'm curious; Dave, your opinion of Ormandy's 1960 stereo version?
What's not to like?