I start off all my seeds in coir with perlite added ,the only seeds I start off in multipurpose are legumes & cucurbits .i sowed my carrots in a container with a layer of coir , brilliant germination .👍
Parsley seed! Oh, notoriously slow to germinate, in fact most of the sources I've seen/read on this subject will tell you that parsley wants at least three weeks to germinate, four is usual, and five isn't beyond what may be considered reasonable. I once had the experience of germinating parsley seed in under a week, but that was because I direct-sowed the seeds near where the business end of the garden hose happened to be and I happened to have forgotten that I'd not turned the water all the way off---so it trickled for about three days and apparently the parsley seeds just loved it: outdoors, warm soil, warm sun, and they were constantly wet (not merely moist) without being drowned. Thank you so much for having done this video! The compost brands you've trialed aren't available here, so far as I know, but it has *finally* dawned on me that perhaps I ought to be using a different brand of either seed starting medium or compost or both to improve seedling health and seedling performance. Thank you, again. Much gardening love from Northeast Ohio, USA! 😊💚💚💚💚💚😊
I use coco primarily for seed starting (added worm castings and perlite). Those weeds could have come from the seed packets. I get weeds in my starts often. Highly doubt it's from the coir.
The ban is likely not coming in now, I spoke to Clover themselves.. Europe is not banning peat anyway so they can still harvest here and ship to EU even if we do get a ban makes no sense at all
I bought that Coco Coir (Just the plain standard stuff) from company Coco & Coir in bulk big blocks (block expands to 75L) from them as it worked out the cheapest I could find and I'm mixing it with bought compost this year to make it go further. I used hot/boiling kettle water to break it down quicker, though does take a while being large blocks. I love the smell of it haha and the feel. Hopefully it'll work out well and help with moisture retention as 99% of everything I grow is in pots and it can get very windy and dry here in Cambridgeshire in summer.
JB..you have me on the edge of my seat..I can't wait to see the progress and then the final results..Perfect series 👍 always much love from Indian River County Fl 🌱
Hello from California. Our bags labeled as compost are specifically made to mix with soils we have. Whether it's potting soil, topsoil, raised bed soil, or just plain old "in the ground" dirt. Usually it is used to raise level of nutrients in soil and make it more friable. It took me a while to figure out your compost in UK isn't like ours. Doesn't really matter what it's called if plants grow well. 😊
Yes I think there is a distinction between a soil improver and something which is meant to be a growing medium. As a rule soil improvers in the UK will be manure or something with "SOIL IMPROVER" written on very clearly
Wow! I've always been dead against coir coz it's not a locally made product, but I'm going to give it a go this year. Thanks for investing your time in this trial JB. Appreciated 🌱💚
Thanks JB, interesting video. I must admit I have always used Asda peat free compost, but for seed sowing I always had to sieve it. But last two years, I have to say their compost has not come up to scratch. So last year I used compost from the shopping channels, but they had peat in them, so I wasn't very happy. But I still use Asda peat free gro bags for my tomatoes.
I love videos like this where you don't have to wait weeks for results! I'll be trying those composts! I only used cheap composts this year but started like Jan so majority is huge already (not leggy I used lots of lights) My issues was sun burn this year never had it before. I'm normally careful with the cold in getting them used to it bit by bit but just left them out when I was really sunny in April. The older leaves on my money maker toms got it worse. Chopped them off and let the tuckers grow there instead... seems to be working lots of flowers! They are around a meter tall with very thick strong stems! Awesome video!
Thank you! It's a lot more effort to do a long video but I'm the same, nothing worth than clicking something only to realise it's part 1 and part 2 isn't out yet! Glad your toms are doing well. Sun burn makes sense because we had such a rubbish start to the year so the plants wouldn't have experienced much sun!
I have used Coco Coir for my seeds before and have had great results then later when potting on i have used a mix of Compost, Coco Coir and Perlite again with great results. Thanks for doing this experiment JB, oh one more thing, years ago i couldn't find any Compost that didn't need me getting a bank loan for it and i came across the Wool Compost but for Seeds only and so i bought and tried it, and i have to say that the Wool Compost for Seed only isn't too bad. Take Care. Barry (the Wirral)
It's really good for the modules! I usually just use fingers but for chunky compost you have to use two or three fingers so it's quite slow and the dibber works well
I have coir and add in 20% maximum worm compost. Best germination, good growth, and the moisture retention is higher than the ordinary compost. Coco coir does have a different type of water absorption, it's better to water with a spray above, bottom watering and draining off excess. It worked especially well on a heat mat.
That's something I haven't thought about before. Adding worm compost into the coir 🤔I think I'll give that a go (maybe not at full scale, but "for science") next season, or during the autumn.
Great video! It is possible to find Sylvagrow at bargain prices if you are willing to buy in bulk. I managed to get 20 bags of Sylvagrow for 4.50 each from a coal merchant based in Northampton. The delivery was fast and free too!
Hi JB, I found some 10l Mr Fothergills Coir blocks at B&M for 4.99 so decided to give it a go for my seed starting and it's been brilliant. It apparently has a seaweed feed in it which feeds for 3 weeks I think. But honestly, I wasn't expecting much and was very pleasantly surprised. I really struggle to find, what I consider to be, a reasonably priced peat free compost. This was a great video.
I have been on Sylvagrow grow for this season, generally good, but I have had stones and plastic pieces. Given the choice, I’d use coir for the base of most of my growing mixes. Water less, let it drain, and feed with seaweed and comfrey, add 25% perlite if plants struggle. Great video. Oh, I sieve everything.
Sylvagrow really shouldn't have any plastic in at all 🤔 never found any in mine! They do have a green waste version of multiple purpose compost too which we saw on site
Those gnats are the reason I stopped buying dalefoot. Every bag I ordered when I opened it, was full of them all flying out into my house. I haven’t had that issue since I stopped using them.
Vary interesting, thank you JB! My goal is to get a wormery, offset the price of this too variable peat free compost and mix it with leaf mould or maybe coir and see how that goes. I hate the amount of plastic compost bags I get through but the extra time that will take is a big concern. I wish there was an easy answer and that compost was regulated in some way, it might then be easier to stop the use of peat!
I use coco coir mixed with perlite and vermiculite (4:1:1) for seedling mix, then for potting up I add some worm castings from my worm bin (about 20 parts mix to 1 part castings). It works quite well for most seedlings, but for tomatoes, peppers, and anything else that needs to be inside for longer, I will feed with dilute fish emulsion.
I have found verve compost is always full of fungus knats, this has helped me choose a different brand for my house plants because I'm at my wits end with them 😅
Shocking price rises on the premium peat-free composts and it will get worse next year as the peat stuff runs out (and the industry starts to deplete the market of peat-free stock!) Gardening Which? suggests that green waste peat-free should have a shelf life of 12-16 weeks, so if you stored your Homebase one for 8 weeks it was probably well out of date, taking into account how long it had been at the store etc!
Hi, enjoyed your video on compost trial, thought it might be a bit boring ( sorry), however, I was pleasantly surprised probably because it's conclusion was similar to my own. I'm a very new gardener and I was struggling to get good germation on cheap water logged compost so I started again. With great determination and sowed all my seeds in coco coir with good success, then potted on with other compost when the plants were stronger and needed more nutrients and on the whole it has worked very well for me. I've used coco coir before as its very good for carrots, I put coir into small bottomless pots within a larger container of stronger compost thus allowing the carrot seeds the sandy soft surroundings they like but then the roots can grow down to the stronger compost and I had really excellent results as your not disturbing the carrots, anyway that how coir came into my life, it was the carrots. Love your videos 😊 sorry if I have prattled on bah! bah! bah!
This year all my seeds and plants were grown on in coir or a homemade mix. Houseplants - orchid bark, coir, worm castings and perlite Seeds - just coir Seedlings Coir, little bark and worm castings Its actually done great. Rather forgiving too
Very interesting! Here in the US, we don't find general "compost"... bagged soils are specifically named, ie: potting soil, garden soil, top soil. It helps remove the guesswork! Of course, there are specialty soils, too... for flower, for veg, for seed-starting, etc. We do have coir products, as well. Peat-free products aren't really pushed here yet.
We do have some products like that, but it's very very rare to see any kind of "potting mix" which is pre-sold with additives like vermiculite or perlite. 99% of the time a garden centre here will have two products "compost" or "farmyard manure". The composts are usually considered fine to plant anything into but the manure would be for soil improvement. It's why I was quite surprised by the homebase actually not being suitable for plant growing.
I've recently started growing on a couple of windowsills indoors (my only space for plants currently), and I've had to use coco coir as those bricks are way more convenient and clean than compost for indoor use, and I've had very similar results with it. My rocket also didn't like it and I got shockingly bad germination, but otherwise my other salad leaves, carrots, and one optimistic sweet pepper seem to be doing very well! I've just planted some strawberries in another tray, so we'll see what happens with them.
I agree,, Melcourt is the way for me now ,,,seconded by Bulrush as at times I may use 2 parts Melcourt Sylvagrow + 1 part Bullrush also Melcort Sylvagrow with added John Innes. good content , all the best 🙏
Having used the Dalefoot tomato compost before, i can safely say i wont ever use again. All the tomatoes, of which there were different varieties, were killed. I planted them all in to their final growing position in the Dalefoot tomato compost. They went in as big healthy plants but ended up dead. It was as if they were desperate for nutrition at first, then they slowly died. Not water logged or anything, they were treated like normal. I did wonder if it had become contaminated with weed killer? Not a good one for me.
I have had dreadful results with the sylvagrow, it has been drying out much quicker and germination has been very erratic. I'm going to give the Coir a go. I agree with Tony that Clover is much better, but of course it's not peat free 😮
Sylva has definitely not worked for us this year. My allotment neighbour thought it might have been because the compost may have been old but who knows. Very poor germination (even in the house), tomatoes went completely yellow and I couldn't get squashes to germinate at all. I also found that it was holding onto water for longer than I would like to. We replaced sylva with a basic compost and tomatoes are now thriving. Westlands has always been decent but we got weird insects from them in the house (not gnats). Live and learn!
Good show JB. Seaside Steve had real problems with Dalefoot last yr, he got it specifically for hanging baskets as it holds water, well it held far too much, roots on Toms & Peppers were severely hampered, so it's not you JB. I did a bunch of mixes this yr with my own composts as I had no leafmold to mix in which usually works fine 50/50, I did some with sand, some with johnson-Su compost, some with coir (I bought a box of big brick size blocks) Although all my mixes worked as a seed compost, by far the best was filling the modules with pure coir, then topping the modules off with ~8mm of worm compost. people paying 40p perL for compost must be mad, it's way overpriced.
Ahh I didn't know seaside Steve had used Dalefoot. Really interesting. Heard lots of people in the comments today say the same about coir and worm castings, sounds really unusual to me but it looks like it works for lots of people
We had some awful Homebase own-brand peat-free last year. Full of plastic, so chunky that if we sieved it there would be nothing to plant with, and the smell was atrocious! Musty, but not in a pleasant way. It smelt rotten. We’ve avoided it this year. It was shocking.
And to be fair to Homebase, JB didn't test their own brand peat free multi purpose compost, he tested a completely different product designed for soil conditioning and mulching. It says so on the front of the bag.
I googled and if you ask me "multi purpose compost" and "garden compost" sound very similar 😅 they should really rename it "soil conditioner" or "organic matter" or "mulch" like the compost centre's products are clearly labeled.
I did put a caveat on screen about this at some point! The homebase pack is called "garden compost" but when you read the small print it says it is not suitable for potting on. Dalefoot says it's not suitable for seedlings, but it is suitable for potting on so they're quite different distinctions in my mind.
Thats a very good comparison. The main thing that puts me off peat free compost is the cost. Our site sells clover multi with peat 60l bag for £5.50 or 3 for £14. So I can get 3 bags of 60l for the price of a 40l bag.
It's a very fair point. It's interesting because I've never seen clover in a local store since I started my allotment 4 years ago. I've always been peat free, partly due to wanting to "do my bit" but also it's just what's been around me since I started gardening. If I was used to clover and clover prices I think I'd be getting it too.
This year I sewed my seeds in coir. Good getmination and no gnats! When planting them on I did sterilise the pottong mix in the oven. Again, no gnats. Phew!
Great informative video. Definitely a few interesting results there. I'm using sylvagrow again this year and have had great results. Theres a lovely nursery near me that uses 100% peat free compost throughout and obviously they wouldn't if it didn't give satisfactory results, there is many others throughout the country that do the same. Using peat free might involve a few adjustments but if people as gardeners arent able to do that I dont have much hope for success whether in peat free or not 🥀
@@JBNatI’ve been using peat free for ethical reasons since the days of old Geoff Hamilton on Gardeners World and it’s what I’m used to. There’s only been two years where I’ve had serious issues with quality, 2020 was one (lockdown, hard to source, what there was was poor quality, resorted to making my own with garden compost and molehill soil) and this year has been even worse, putting that down to the companies that formerly used peat stretching the market for the peat free raw materials. Sylvagrow is not an option for me on a budget, there is only one stockist within 20 miles and they charge £13 for a bag which is outrageous.
Yep my first bag of peat free compost (new horizon) was full of fungus nats too, i mixed it 50/50 with clover and results very poor indeed. Im reluctant to try anymore until labelling and quality of consistency improves. The industry as a whole needs to get themselves sorted to get our confidence. In future when i cant get clover im going to go to soil based john innes
New horizon was what I used when I first started gardening. First year was fine, decent enough results, second was the worst compost I've ever used in my life and I swore I wouldn't be using it again! In the sylvagrow tour video I speak a bit about the reasons for the lack of consistency, and it is generally the best thing about sylvagrow, same ingredients every time.
I buy everything and mix them all up like a mad professor. I love amendments, jadams, klfs, compost teas, lactic acid bacteria, wormery leachate, seaweed, comfrey, nettles, mycorrizstuff, The plants should be 100 feet tall! triffids! or giant beanstalks! All great fun❤ (probably why they never gave me a chemistry set😂)
Interesting! I was actually gonna ask about fungus gnats in general. Even if your thought about the fungus gnats coming from spent compost, why weren't they in all the other bags 🤔I think I'd rather spend some more money on compost that is hopefully gnat free (or using coir) than having them chew on the roots of my seedlings and fly around my tent (and apartment). Interesting that the coir did so well. I wonder how well it would have done without any fertilizer in it 🤔And those tomatoes in Sylvagrow in the first experiment had much greener leaves too.
Very interesting! I'll give you my Sylvagrow hypothesis: maybe the slow-release fertilizer in the mix doesn't activate at the lower temperatures available to early sowings? Alternatively, I can't be the only one who struggles to get the watering right with peat free mixes.
Hey JB. I bought several bags of the Homebase compost to fill my tomato planters. Didn't realise it wasn't 'compost' until I got it home!! When I opened the bag it smelled of rotten egg, was putrid and horrible. Now my tomatoes are growing in it...
Very glad it wasn't just me. Considering it's not meant to be for growing in it worked okay in this trial for germination. I think if you mixed it with other stuff it could be a good growing medium.
Hi mate my names marlon did u move the trays of seedlings around on your shelving remember the top shelves will always do better and also the north and south sides of your shelves make a big difference
Yes this is a great question, I did move them all around a lot from week to week. I had a section in here explaining this but cut it for run time because it was such a long video!
@@DigwellGreenfingers sadly not, but I'm building a stock up in my allotment sheds, ok, maybe the feed will diminish, but I can always add to it. I make a huge amount of our own compost on the allotments, but for seed sowing, I'm sticking up the nice compost.
@@jeanhelliwell8160 The ban has changed now, in that retailers can slowly run down their stocks so if they are left with 1000 bags on 31 Dec 2024 they can still sell them into next year. My local GC has just had 3 articulated lorry loads of Motherearth and Clover compost delivered with more to come!
We are blessed to have a garden center nearby where we buy evergreen Irish compost full of glorious peaty goodness and our plants are doing great... And has not used coconut coir from India the planet zog or Lord knows where rinsed with 1000s of litres of water... Love it 🤣🤣🤣🤣
I have no idea about Southern Trident's sourcing but I am told they are definitely one of the better ones. The sylvagrow coir is 100% byproduct washed only by rainfall!
i did an experiment last year and used a layer of coir on top of sieved normal compost to germinate my carrots in, i grow in containers and had struggled in the past to get carrot seeds to germinate (i think we have all been there!). I had fantastic germination of all my different carrot seeds, i was amazed! I mostly buy multipurpose compost from b&q or wickes tho as i am on a budget, it can be hit and miss, some is great, but i have found plastic and bits of glass in others which was worrying, i was yelling at u for not using gloves with the homebase stuff yikes! be careful jb
I've bought a few different types of compost and I found levington compost was the worst! Bought 3 bags and all 3 were just wood chips and gravel! Big chunky pieces! Very disappointed.
Surely it would have made sense to compare all of these to at ;east one peat based compost. Most folks are using peat-based and would like a peat-free equivalent.
I think you wee a bit harsh on the compost just because it didn't say it was suitable for seedlings especially when a lot of brands make a seedling specific compost. I treat all compost bags as a general compost for potting on or soil improvement. People in general expect too much of items to perform in something they state are not made for. Just my opinion 👍🏼
Hi JB . I found this interesting,I bought a few bags off the silver compost a couple off months ago and two of the bags were full off fungus ants,luckily I only used it in my large plant pots outside,but I was concerned how they got in there. I haven’t got a allotment and I have only a medium sized garden,my new greenhouse will not be put up until July. I have a question. I have been growing a few salad peppers in my kitchen which have grown lovely in my window which is south facing,there now about 7 inches tall,what do I do next,do I need to feed them and can they go outside. Thank you.😊
I think fungus gnats can quite easily breed whilst it's being stored. Didn't see any at the factory though because it's all made outside in the open which the gnats generally won't like. It's also hot when it's bagged!
@@homey1455 it tends to be at independant garden centres .I get mine from Crick garden centre but I'm sure if you give Clover a call they'd tell you your nearest stockists .Been using it for 20 years and always excellent .
It's a good question! I'm fairly sure that for us it's anything which has been through any kind of composting process. It would be good if there was more clarity about what goes into products and that was part of the point of this video for sure
Unless that coco & coir product has lots of added nutrients it's not going to work well. Coco coir has just about NO nutrients. It's a decent alternative to peat moss though. I tend to use the cheapest stuff I can buy and sift it then add a bit of fine perlite. It works fairly well for me. I can add liquid feed if the plants need it. A very useful comparison for many growers. I'm in Australia so don't have those brands. Cheers!
This was exactly what I expected too, and even when I saw the added fertiliser they had in there I didn't really expect it to be enough. Maybe for a pot but certainly not for seed modules, which is why I was so surprised!
I don't think the compost labelling is a scam - seems like a regional misunderstanding? In Australia, bags labelled "compost" are for the garden and "potting mix" (or seed raising mix) is for pots.
Yes scam was a bit flippant. In the UK I think it's fair to say we expect soil improver to be quite clearly labeled as such. Most of our gardening websites give gardening instructions like "plant into a pot filled with compost". So if you're a newbie especially you could easily pick up that pack expecting to be able to plant into it.
I know it's deemed "environmentally friendly" BUT peat-free compost is just not "fit for purpose". That's my experience. Even the coco-coir that you found to be the best is still only the best of a bad lot IMHO. I'm going back to proper peat compost even though it's rocketed in price. At least my seeds would germinate in peat compost. They usually don't in this peat-free stuff. Quite honestly, if you're going to pay for good seed, what's the point in sowing them into compost where they won't germinate? I know this is the exact opposite of what the environmentalists wanted, but, I'm sick of wasting good seed in bad "compost" (which isn't really compost at all). It's a false economy to use peat-free "compost" if the seeds just won't grow in it.
I think it completely depends on the quality of the compost but totally agree that crap compost is false economy - and it really hurts the new gardener especially. Can knock your confidence and stop people from getting into the hobby. I've been peat free since I started gardening and haven't really noticed germination issues.
I’ve had trouble with fungus knats in all my composts, including Sylva. I ended up microwaving my compost for indoor planting!
I start off all my seeds in coir with perlite added ,the only seeds I start off in multipurpose are legumes & cucurbits .i sowed my carrots in a container with a layer of coir , brilliant germination .👍
I often use the coir bricks to sow my seeds as its easier and not so heavy to transport, my other choice is sylvagrow. Great video JB
Parsley seed! Oh, notoriously slow to germinate, in fact most of the sources I've seen/read on this subject will tell you that parsley wants at least three weeks to germinate, four is usual, and five isn't beyond what may be considered reasonable.
I once had the experience of germinating parsley seed in under a week, but that was because I direct-sowed the seeds near where the business end of the garden hose happened to be and I happened to have forgotten that I'd not turned the water all the way off---so it trickled for about three days and apparently the parsley seeds just loved it: outdoors, warm soil, warm sun, and they were constantly wet (not merely moist) without being drowned.
Thank you so much for having done this video! The compost brands you've trialed aren't available here, so far as I know, but it has *finally* dawned on me that perhaps I ought to be using a different brand of either seed starting medium or compost or both to improve seedling health and seedling performance.
Thank you, again.
Much gardening love from Northeast Ohio, USA! 😊💚💚💚💚💚😊
I use coco primarily for seed starting (added worm castings and perlite). Those weeds could have come from the seed packets. I get weeds in my starts often. Highly doubt it's from the coir.
Great trial, really enjoyed your video. I have to say that I am so, so pleased that I filled my garage to the brim last year of peat based compost!
The ban is likely not coming in now, I spoke to Clover themselves.. Europe is not banning peat anyway so they can still harvest here and ship to EU even if we do get a ban makes no sense at all
Hi JB, after the recommendations given by you and Jessie I bought Sylvagro and have had fantastic results, both for seed and seedlings. Thankyou
Hi JB, very good peat free comparison, really interesting to listen to your advice and tips too. Thanks for sharing and take care 😊
I bought that Coco Coir (Just the plain standard stuff) from company Coco & Coir in bulk big blocks (block expands to 75L) from them as it worked out the cheapest I could find and I'm mixing it with bought compost this year to make it go further. I used hot/boiling kettle water to break it down quicker, though does take a while being large blocks. I love the smell of it haha and the feel. Hopefully it'll work out well and help with moisture retention as 99% of everything I grow is in pots and it can get very windy and dry here in Cambridgeshire in summer.
I've used the coco core compost in my repurposed fridge freezer the carrots and parsnips are doing amazing in it
Very interesting my dear Watson 👏
Very interesting experiment JB thank you for taking the time and effort to do this 👍
JB..you have me on the edge of my seat..I can't wait to see the progress and then the final results..Perfect series 👍 always much love from Indian River County Fl 🌱
I've forwarded this to my Queensway allotment Crosby Liverpool what's app. Thanks JB.
Thanks JB, very methodical and helpful.
That was really interesting ! Thanks JB… I love Petersfield but will also give silvagrow a go next year! 😊
Hi jb thank you for your trial ! Very interesting thank you for your hard work lv Irene 😘 xx
Great video thanks for all your hard work involved in making it
Thank you!
Formidable vidéo 😊
A bientôt
Hello from California. Our bags labeled as compost are specifically made to mix with soils we have. Whether it's potting soil, topsoil, raised bed soil, or just plain old "in the ground" dirt. Usually it is used to raise level of nutrients in soil and make it more friable. It took me a while to figure out your compost in UK isn't like ours. Doesn't really matter what it's called if plants grow well. 😊
Yes I think there is a distinction between a soil improver and something which is meant to be a growing medium. As a rule soil improvers in the UK will be manure or something with "SOIL IMPROVER" written on very clearly
Wow! I've always been dead against coir coz it's not a locally made product, but I'm going to give it a go this year. Thanks for investing your time in this trial JB. Appreciated 🌱💚
Important to note that standard coir doesn't have fertiliser so I don't think it would behave as the trial plants in this one!
Thanks JB, interesting video. I must admit I have always used Asda peat free compost, but for seed sowing I always had to sieve it. But last two years, I have to say their compost has not come up to scratch. So last year I used compost from the shopping channels, but they had peat in them, so I wasn't very happy. But I still use Asda peat free gro bags for my tomatoes.
Thank you, loved the trial.
I love videos like this where you don't have to wait weeks for results! I'll be trying those composts!
I only used cheap composts this year but started like Jan so majority is huge already (not leggy I used lots of lights)
My issues was sun burn this year never had it before. I'm normally careful with the cold in getting them used to it bit by bit but just left them out when I was really sunny in April.
The older leaves on my money maker toms got it worse. Chopped them off and let the tuckers grow there instead... seems to be working lots of flowers! They are around a meter tall with very thick strong stems!
Awesome video!
Thank you! It's a lot more effort to do a long video but I'm the same, nothing worth than clicking something only to realise it's part 1 and part 2 isn't out yet!
Glad your toms are doing well. Sun burn makes sense because we had such a rubbish start to the year so the plants wouldn't have experienced much sun!
@JBNat yes it's like torture waiting and then there's a billion other things to watch and forget if they don't pop up on my feed 😆
I have used Coco Coir for my seeds before and have had great results then later when potting on i have used a mix of Compost, Coco Coir and Perlite again with great results. Thanks for doing this experiment JB, oh one more thing, years ago i couldn't find any Compost that didn't need me getting a bank loan for it and i came across the Wool Compost but for Seeds only and so i bought and tried it, and i have to say that the Wool Compost for Seed only isn't too bad. Take Care.
Barry (the Wirral)
Hadn’t thought of that use for my dibber!
It's really good for the modules! I usually just use fingers but for chunky compost you have to use two or three fingers so it's quite slow and the dibber works well
I have coir and add in 20% maximum worm compost. Best germination, good growth, and the moisture retention is higher than the ordinary compost.
Coco coir does have a different type of water absorption, it's better to water with a spray above, bottom watering and draining off excess.
It worked especially well on a heat mat.
That's something I haven't thought about before. Adding worm compost into the coir 🤔I think I'll give that a go (maybe not at full scale, but "for science") next season, or during the autumn.
Makes a lot of sense, thank you!
Very interesting video JB, thank you
Great video!
It is possible to find Sylvagrow at bargain prices if you are willing to buy in bulk. I managed to get 20 bags of Sylvagrow for 4.50 each from a coal merchant based in Northampton. The delivery was fast and free too!
Hi JB, I found some 10l Mr Fothergills Coir blocks at B&M for 4.99 so decided to give it a go for my seed starting and it's been brilliant. It apparently has a seaweed feed in it which feeds for 3 weeks I think. But honestly, I wasn't expecting much and was very pleasantly surprised. I really struggle to find, what I consider to be, a reasonably priced peat free compost. This was a great video.
I have been on Sylvagrow grow for this season, generally good, but I have had stones and plastic pieces. Given the choice, I’d use coir for the base of most of my growing mixes. Water less, let it drain, and feed with seaweed and comfrey, add 25% perlite if plants struggle. Great video. Oh, I sieve everything.
Sylvagrow really shouldn't have any plastic in at all 🤔 never found any in mine! They do have a green waste version of multiple purpose compost too which we saw on site
Those gnats are the reason I stopped buying dalefoot. Every bag I ordered when I opened it, was full of them all flying out into my house. I haven’t had that issue since I stopped using them.
Vary interesting, thank you JB! My goal is to get a wormery, offset the price of this too variable peat free compost and mix it with leaf mould or maybe coir and see how that goes. I hate the amount of plastic compost bags I get through but the extra time that will take is a big concern. I wish there was an easy answer and that compost was regulated in some way, it might then be easier to stop the use of peat!
I love comparisons like this. Peppergeek has some of them and they’re my favorite videos he makes. Always interesting.
I use coco coir mixed with perlite and vermiculite (4:1:1) for seedling mix, then for potting up I add some worm castings from my worm bin (about 20 parts mix to 1 part castings). It works quite well for most seedlings, but for tomatoes, peppers, and anything else that needs to be inside for longer, I will feed with dilute fish emulsion.
Sounds perfect
I have found verve compost is always full of fungus knats, this has helped me choose a different brand for my house plants because I'm at my wits end with them 😅
Shocking price rises on the premium peat-free composts and it will get worse next year as the peat stuff runs out (and the industry starts to deplete the market of peat-free stock!)
Gardening Which? suggests that green waste peat-free should have a shelf life of 12-16 weeks, so if you stored your Homebase one for 8 weeks it was probably well out of date, taking into account how long it had been at the store etc!
Bought Levintons compost at the
Range . Seemed Ok.
Hi, enjoyed your video on compost trial, thought it might be a bit boring ( sorry), however, I was pleasantly surprised probably because it's conclusion was similar to my own. I'm a very new gardener and I was struggling to get good germation on cheap water logged compost so I started again. With great determination and sowed all my seeds in coco coir with good success, then potted on with other compost when the plants were stronger and needed more nutrients and on the whole it has worked very well for me. I've used coco coir before as its very good for carrots, I put coir into small bottomless pots within a larger container of stronger compost thus allowing the carrot seeds the sandy soft surroundings they like but then the roots can grow down to the stronger compost and I had really excellent results as your not disturbing the carrots, anyway that how coir came into my life, it was the carrots. Love your videos 😊 sorry if I have prattled on bah! bah! bah!
This year all my seeds and plants were grown on in coir or a homemade mix.
Houseplants - orchid bark, coir, worm castings and perlite
Seeds - just coir
Seedlings Coir, little bark and worm castings
Its actually done great. Rather forgiving too
That's good to know! It seems much more versatile than I gave it credit for
Very interesting! Here in the US, we don't find general "compost"... bagged soils are specifically named, ie: potting soil, garden soil, top soil. It helps remove the guesswork! Of course, there are specialty soils, too... for flower, for veg, for seed-starting, etc. We do have coir products, as well. Peat-free products aren't really pushed here yet.
We do have some products like that, but it's very very rare to see any kind of "potting mix" which is pre-sold with additives like vermiculite or perlite. 99% of the time a garden centre here will have two products "compost" or "farmyard manure". The composts are usually considered fine to plant anything into but the manure would be for soil improvement. It's why I was quite surprised by the homebase actually not being suitable for plant growing.
I've recently started growing on a couple of windowsills indoors (my only space for plants currently), and I've had to use coco coir as those bricks are way more convenient and clean than compost for indoor use, and I've had very similar results with it. My rocket also didn't like it and I got shockingly bad germination, but otherwise my other salad leaves, carrots, and one optimistic sweet pepper seem to be doing very well! I've just planted some strawberries in another tray, so we'll see what happens with them.
Quality content as always. 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Oh man.. I just bought 6 bags of Dalefoot.... I wish I had stumbled across this video earlier!
Hopefully still good for more mature plants, just be careful not to overwater and maybe ammend with perlite if you have any?
@@JBNat Thank you!
🐝thanks for the great video🌻
I agree,, Melcourt is the way for me now ,,,seconded by Bulrush as at times I may use 2 parts Melcourt Sylvagrow + 1 part Bullrush
also Melcort Sylvagrow with added John Innes.
good content , all the best 🙏
Having used the Dalefoot tomato compost before, i can safely say i wont ever use again. All the tomatoes, of which there were different varieties, were killed. I planted them all in to their final growing position in the Dalefoot tomato compost. They went in as big healthy plants but ended up dead. It was as if they were desperate for nutrition at first, then they slowly died. Not water logged or anything, they were treated like normal. I did wonder if it had become contaminated with weed killer? Not a good one for me.
I have had dreadful results with the sylvagrow, it has been drying out much quicker and germination has been very erratic. I'm going to give the Coir a go. I agree with Tony that Clover is much better, but of course it's not peat free 😮
Sylva has definitely not worked for us this year. My allotment neighbour thought it might have been because the compost may have been old but who knows. Very poor germination (even in the house), tomatoes went completely yellow and I couldn't get squashes to germinate at all. I also found that it was holding onto water for longer than I would like to. We replaced sylva with a basic compost and tomatoes are now thriving. Westlands has always been decent but we got weird insects from them in the house (not gnats). Live and learn!
Interesting! And slightly concerning!
There are good CZcams videos showing cheap ish compost with host added fertilisers giving the same results as expensive compost.
Good show JB. Seaside Steve had real problems with Dalefoot last yr, he got it specifically for hanging baskets as it holds water, well it held far too much, roots on Toms & Peppers were severely hampered, so it's not you JB. I did a bunch of mixes this yr with my own composts as I had no leafmold to mix in which usually works fine 50/50, I did some with sand, some with johnson-Su compost, some with coir (I bought a box of big brick size blocks) Although all my mixes worked as a seed compost, by far the best was filling the modules with pure coir, then topping the modules off with ~8mm of worm compost. people paying 40p perL for compost must be mad, it's way overpriced.
Ahh I didn't know seaside Steve had used Dalefoot. Really interesting. Heard lots of people in the comments today say the same about coir and worm castings, sounds really unusual to me but it looks like it works for lots of people
We had some awful Homebase own-brand peat-free last year. Full of plastic, so chunky that if we sieved it there would be nothing to plant with, and the smell was atrocious! Musty, but not in a pleasant way. It smelt rotten. We’ve avoided it this year. It was shocking.
Last year Gardening Which recommended Homebase peat-free as a Best Buy. I found it ok.
And to be fair to Homebase, JB didn't test their own brand peat free multi purpose compost, he tested a completely different product designed for soil conditioning and mulching. It says so on the front of the bag.
I googled and if you ask me "multi purpose compost" and "garden compost" sound very similar 😅 they should really rename it "soil conditioner" or "organic matter" or "mulch" like the compost centre's products are clearly labeled.
But to denounce it as a 'scam', and yet be very forgiving towards Dalefoot for a similar thing seems a bit unfair.
I did put a caveat on screen about this at some point! The homebase pack is called "garden compost" but when you read the small print it says it is not suitable for potting on. Dalefoot says it's not suitable for seedlings, but it is suitable for potting on so they're quite different distinctions in my mind.
Thats a very good comparison. The main thing that puts me off peat free compost is the cost. Our site sells clover multi with peat 60l bag for £5.50 or 3 for £14. So I can get 3 bags of 60l for the price of a 40l bag.
It's a very fair point. It's interesting because I've never seen clover in a local store since I started my allotment 4 years ago. I've always been peat free, partly due to wanting to "do my bit" but also it's just what's been around me since I started gardening. If I was used to clover and clover prices I think I'd be getting it too.
This year I sewed my seeds in coir. Good getmination and no gnats!
When planting them on I did sterilise the pottong mix in the oven. Again, no gnats. Phew!
Great informative video. Definitely a few interesting results there. I'm using sylvagrow again this year and have had great results. Theres a lovely nursery near me that uses 100% peat free compost throughout and obviously they wouldn't if it didn't give satisfactory results, there is many others throughout the country that do the same. Using peat free might involve a few adjustments but if people as gardeners arent able to do that I dont have much hope for success whether in peat free or not 🥀
100% agree!
@@JBNatI’ve been using peat free for ethical reasons since the days of old Geoff Hamilton on Gardeners World and it’s what I’m used to. There’s only been two years where I’ve had serious issues with quality, 2020 was one (lockdown, hard to source, what there was was poor quality, resorted to making my own with garden compost and molehill soil) and this year has been even worse, putting that down to the companies that formerly used peat stretching the market for the peat free raw materials. Sylvagrow is not an option for me on a budget, there is only one stockist within 20 miles and they charge £13 for a bag which is outrageous.
Yep my first bag of peat free compost (new horizon) was full of fungus nats too, i mixed it 50/50 with clover and results very poor indeed. Im reluctant to try anymore until labelling and quality of consistency improves. The industry as a whole needs to get themselves sorted to get our confidence. In future when i cant get clover im going to go to soil based john innes
New horizon was what I used when I first started gardening. First year was fine, decent enough results, second was the worst compost I've ever used in my life and I swore I wouldn't be using it again!
In the sylvagrow tour video I speak a bit about the reasons for the lack of consistency, and it is generally the best thing about sylvagrow, same ingredients every time.
I buy everything and mix them all up like a mad professor. I love amendments, jadams, klfs, compost teas, lactic acid bacteria, wormery leachate, seaweed, comfrey, nettles, mycorrizstuff, The plants should be 100 feet tall! triffids! or giant beanstalks! All great fun❤ (probably why they never gave me a chemistry set😂)
Hahaha sounds great Chris
Interesting! I was actually gonna ask about fungus gnats in general. Even if your thought about the fungus gnats coming from spent compost, why weren't they in all the other bags 🤔I think I'd rather spend some more money on compost that is hopefully gnat free (or using coir) than having them chew on the roots of my seedlings and fly around my tent (and apartment). Interesting that the coir did so well. I wonder how well it would have done without any fertilizer in it 🤔And those tomatoes in Sylvagrow in the first experiment had much greener leaves too.
Very interesting! I'll give you my Sylvagrow hypothesis: maybe the slow-release fertilizer in the mix doesn't activate at the lower temperatures available to early sowings?
Alternatively, I can't be the only one who struggles to get the watering right with peat free mixes.
Hey JB. I bought several bags of the Homebase compost to fill my tomato planters. Didn't realise it wasn't 'compost' until I got it home!!
When I opened the bag it smelled of rotten egg, was putrid and horrible. Now my tomatoes are growing in it...
Very glad it wasn't just me. Considering it's not meant to be for growing in it worked okay in this trial for germination. I think if you mixed it with other stuff it could be a good growing medium.
Hi mate my names marlon did u move the trays of seedlings around on your shelving remember the top shelves will always do better and also the north and south sides of your shelves make a big difference
I wondered the same!
Yes this is a great question, I did move them all around a lot from week to week. I had a section in here explaining this but cut it for run time because it was such a long video!
Great video JB. I use clover compost, £5 a bag for 60 ltr. Grows stuff really well.
Not available after the end of 2024 sadly
@@DigwellGreenfingers sadly not, but I'm building a stock up in my allotment sheds, ok, maybe the feed will diminish, but I can always add to it. I make a huge amount of our own compost on the allotments, but for seed sowing, I'm sticking up the nice compost.
@@jeanhelliwell8160 The ban has changed now, in that retailers can slowly run down their stocks so if they are left with 1000 bags on 31 Dec 2024 they can still sell them into next year. My local GC has just had 3 articulated lorry loads of Motherearth and Clover compost delivered with more to come!
Not strictly true. Its not legislation yet so not law.
I've even got a letter from an MP from one of my suppliers in regards to it.
We are blessed to have a garden center nearby where we buy evergreen Irish compost full of glorious peaty goodness and our plants are doing great... And has not used coconut coir from India the planet zog or Lord knows where rinsed with 1000s of litres of water... Love it 🤣🤣🤣🤣
I have no idea about Southern Trident's sourcing but I am told they are definitely one of the better ones. The sylvagrow coir is 100% byproduct washed only by rainfall!
i did an experiment last year and used a layer of coir on top of sieved normal compost to germinate my carrots in, i grow in containers and had struggled in the past to get carrot seeds to germinate (i think we have all been there!). I had fantastic germination of all my different carrot seeds, i was amazed! I mostly buy multipurpose compost from b&q or wickes tho as i am on a budget, it can be hit and miss, some is great, but i have found plastic and bits of glass in others which was worrying, i was yelling at u for not using gloves with the homebase stuff yikes! be careful jb
Yes you're probably right about not wearing gloves actually, bit of a sad indictment about the state of compost isn't it!
@@JBNat it really is :( theres no better feeling than having your hands straight in the dirt too!
I've bought a few different types of compost and I found levington compost was the worst! Bought 3 bags and all 3 were just wood chips and gravel! Big chunky pieces! Very disappointed.
I just learned, accidentally, that good looking average ph soil can have zero germination from perfectly good seed!
Surely it would have made sense to compare all of these to at ;east one peat based compost.
Most folks are using peat-based and would like a peat-free equivalent.
I can't get any near me and have never used it
I think you wee a bit harsh on the compost just because it didn't say it was suitable for seedlings especially when a lot of brands make a seedling specific compost.
I treat all compost bags as a general compost for potting on or soil improvement.
People in general expect too much of items to perform in something they state are not made for. Just my opinion 👍🏼
Which one? The homebase one says its not even suitable for potting on! Saying it's unsuitable for seedlings (like the dalefoot) I think is fine.
Hi JB . I found this interesting,I bought a few bags off the silver compost a couple off months ago and two of the bags were full off fungus ants,luckily I only used it in my large plant pots outside,but I was concerned how they got in there. I haven’t got a allotment and I have only a medium sized garden,my new greenhouse will not be put up until July.
I have a question. I have been growing a few salad peppers in my kitchen which have grown lovely in my window which is south facing,there now about 7 inches tall,what do I do next,do I need to feed them and can they go outside. Thank you.😊
I think fungus gnats can quite easily breed whilst it's being stored. Didn't see any at the factory though because it's all made outside in the open which the gnats generally won't like. It's also hot when it's bagged!
Also depending on where you are they can probably go out! Check out my chilli guide for more info :)
👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
I'm paying £5.90 for 70 litres of Clover .Brilliant compost ,you can keep vile peat free .
Agree,very good compost sylvagrow to expensive.
were do you buy it from
@@homey1455 it tends to be at independant garden centres .I get mine from Crick garden centre but I'm sure if you give Clover a call they'd tell you your nearest stockists .Been using it for 20 years and always excellent .
That's a brilliant price I've been getting it from amazon costs quite a bit more for 50 litres
@@homey1455 just give Clover a call for your nearest stockists .Mine is in Crick ,near Rugby
Fungus gnat larvae can damage plant roots and stunt growth, particularly seedlings.
Yep! I said this in the video but at the same time I don't think it's worth panicking over. Look at my chilli plants this year.
What do you guys define as compost in the UK? You seem to use the word differently than everywhere else in the world.
It's a good question! I'm fairly sure that for us it's anything which has been through any kind of composting process. It would be good if there was more clarity about what goes into products and that was part of the point of this video for sure
Unless that coco & coir product has lots of added nutrients it's not going to work well. Coco coir has just about NO nutrients. It's a decent alternative to peat moss though.
I tend to use the cheapest stuff I can buy and sift it then add a bit of fine perlite. It works fairly well for me. I can add liquid feed if the plants need it.
A very useful comparison for many growers. I'm in Australia so don't have those brands. Cheers!
This was exactly what I expected too, and even when I saw the added fertiliser they had in there I didn't really expect it to be enough. Maybe for a pot but certainly not for seed modules, which is why I was so surprised!
Surprised you were surprised by the coir germination. You said it yourself, it's used for microgreens.
Not surprised by the germination but by the effectiveness of the added fertiliser and subsequent plant growth beyond cotyledons!
I don't think the compost labelling is a scam - seems like a regional misunderstanding? In Australia, bags labelled "compost" are for the garden and "potting mix" (or seed raising mix) is for pots.
Yes scam was a bit flippant. In the UK I think it's fair to say we expect soil improver to be quite clearly labeled as such. Most of our gardening websites give gardening instructions like "plant into a pot filled with compost". So if you're a newbie especially you could easily pick up that pack expecting to be able to plant into it.
I know it's deemed "environmentally friendly" BUT peat-free compost is just not "fit for purpose". That's my experience. Even the coco-coir that you found to be the best is still only the best of a bad lot IMHO. I'm going back to proper peat compost even though it's rocketed in price. At least my seeds would germinate in peat compost. They usually don't in this peat-free stuff. Quite honestly, if you're going to pay for good seed, what's the point in sowing them into compost where they won't germinate?
I know this is the exact opposite of what the environmentalists wanted, but, I'm sick of wasting good seed in bad "compost" (which isn't really compost at all). It's a false economy to use peat-free "compost" if the seeds just won't grow in it.
I think it completely depends on the quality of the compost but totally agree that crap compost is false economy - and it really hurts the new gardener especially. Can knock your confidence and stop people from getting into the hobby.
I've been peat free since I started gardening and haven't really noticed germination issues.
This is actually super interesting 🪴