The most EXPRESSIVE Strings EVER? SWAM String Sections first look!
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- čas přidán 24. 06. 2024
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2:57 it is the main theme of the second part of Tchaikovsky's Symphony No. 6 also named the "Pathétique" 🤓
Thank you so much Dom for everything you do for the community! 💖
Spot on 🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼
@@DomSigalas Bro Can you tell me your headphone model?
Correct. It's also in 5/4 time, unusual in that era and genre.
SWAMs products are AMAZING! I recently purchased their Saxophone bundle and I can't stop playing them, their great. I want their flutes and strings next.
Love SWAM's solo strings; they're so agile to play, and that puts them a peg above most sampled libraries. :D
Thanks dom, its wonderful.
Such a good performance! ❤ great review !
They're not realistic, too synthy. Far better options out there.
6:46 😊
agreed. while expressive. but not realistic.
Which one do you prefer? I studied the cello and listen to a lot of orchestral music, but I think I could be tricked by those instruments, when played (phrased) and edited well.
@@DomSigalas i'm agree with this..... i'm really decieved by the quality of strings regarding to see how realstic are horns for exemple (and i was more fan of horns when they were under kontakt version....) now i'm agree this can add some realism on what is missing in samples based libraries... as fast playing for exemple.... but yes alone... it really sounds like an old korg keyboard....
Amazing sound Dom ! and playing as well !!
Sounds amazing
Swam is amazing, I love the brass instruments
Great video Dom, as always. I appreciate the time and effort you put in to make these really informative videos. I’m not an expert but they do sound really good. Cheers Dave
This is honestly mind-blowing! 🤯 Such a huge time saver compared to messing with all the articulations in classical sample libraries!
Great vid! Thanks🤎
Thanks for the video Dom! It's certainly expressive, but I think the issue is that it still sounds like a single person playing it, just with the sounds multiplied. In a real group of musicians there will be subtle differences between the timing, articulations, etc that are missing here, such as the tremolo. It would be amazing if they could truly model multiple players with their variations rather than applying exactly the same modulations and expression values to every instrument in the group. (My musical training was a long time ago so sorry if I used the wrong terms.)
Agreed 100%
That's what i pretty much wrote in Dr Mix comment section for showing this Swam product. I was onto their webpage but couldn't see the demo links on it for unknown reason, so i've searched and found this video. The vibration and tremolo ain't there yet. it sounds none human to me. It's still good don't get me wrong, but they need to get the vibration right. It's key for stringed instruments. All players have a characteristic vibrato.
Perhaps they could study players and create presets after their vibrations, i don't know. But it needs to be better that's for sure before it's a "yes" for me.
That's because it is a single person playing it. You can just copy a string line and adjust all the parameters slightly. Weird criticism.
@@Transform108 I also agree that one person is playing.
@@MaxFury_Official No, they don't create presets, everything is controllable, clearly you haven't used their product. Maybe know what you're talking about first.
Excellent l'artiste 👍🎹.
Thanks Dom, Really really interesting. For what it's worth, here's some thoughts.
1. Although expressive, SWAM still needs a prominent 'humanise' slider - no section can be this tight?
2. SWAM tremolos seem way too defined, regular, exaggerated, especially for sections?
3. I think we are about to witness a pandemic of portamentos.
I have all the SWAM solo instruments, but on top of them, price might be a barrier, at least for me.
🙂
Dumb comment, everything is controllable in SWAM independently.
@@misternordberg3675it is controllable but has almost no effect. I purchased them and they have great strengths. But everything posted isn’t dumb but exactly right. That’s why Audio Modeling will improve on that in Version 1.0.1 as said under one of their videos
You're a good teacher:))))
Dom the don😉👍
I'm purchasing mine ASAP!!!! 😂
Does sound very synthy. The modulation or expression volume going up and down with these sounds doesn't sound great.
I will make a video using only these strings and you’ll be able to tell about how realistic they sound. But like I said, they are not meant to replace sample libraries- try and layer them with sample libraries and you’re in for a treat :)
I think a problem with all string sections played live, is that you tend to “over use” the expression control. A string section is a little bit sluggish. So when you ramp up the expression like you would do with a single violin or cello, it sounds fake, because 6 players won’t do it at the exact same time. It would be smart to introduce expression latency to the different instruments. But when programming or finalising an mock-up, you can smoothen the expression curve…
Great. It's all about playability and expressiveness. Let's face it. Dom could make a matchbox win an elastic band sound like the Wiener Philarmoniker ;)
Playability, flexibility, agility, section sizing, positioning in any hall, bow pressure adjustment, normale/sordino/flautando/etc. in one consistent instrument? Wow!
I don't mind if it sounds like any other sampled library. It sounds like an organic, expressive instrument.🚀
And doesn't take much footprint on SSD!
its extraordianary.. so so so expressive. I use some of there indian instruments and a clarinet as well that they have created for geoshred. I m mind blown. Great insight.
Great playing Dom. For me I need more bow and scratchy string noises
Hey Harry! I am on the same camp like you. What I love doing is layering with samples for this element. But I have already talked with the guys at Audio Modelling and asked for the same thing and they told me that these are instruments that will evolve with time so expect them to improve constantly- as there are no samples involved this means that they can change however the developers want- it’s not a static product :)
@@DomSigalasexactly my hopes. I’m about to move to modelled instruments from my TB of samples. And the possibility of the developers to further improve them over time are just one argument. Loading time is another big thing. Pianoteq, for example, is almost the only piano library I use.
Still, I’m not convinced by the orchestral brass of Audio Modeling (the trumpet I like, though). I use Aaron Venture for that, which is a hybrid, like Sample Modeling, who’s Strings I’m using all the time.
So, I have a full post romantic sized orchestra, which is absolutely flexible, and takes just several GB of my HD. And in the end it all about the composition (and how fast you get there). When the music you compose is great, no one will complain about details in sound. And at this level of realism to different rooms and microphones make a bigger difference than SWAM vs. VSL.
I recommend checking out the Expressive E touché also. It's quite good for expression. Great video so far! I'm halfway though
I think the thing that needs the most improvement, is it needs to be less perfect. They need to have a “looseness “parameter that can be adjusted to try to simulate a group of individual players that have more imperfect timing and pitch. In other words, everything sounds too tight. It needs to be a little more sloppy.
Agreed. Especially regarding the portamenti.
Audio Modeling confirmed that they will improve that in the upcoming 1.0.1 Update. I don’t know to what extent. But since it seems to me the most requested feature I’m confident it will further improve
That godfather theme is in my top 10 sickest melodies of all time. It doesn't hurt to have them played from a great library hehe! :D
Physical modeling is the next big thing, and no I know it's been around at Standford before the Yamaha VL1 in the early 90s so it's not "new", but it hasn't caught on until fairly recently.
And the most expressive Dom!👌
Hey Dom. Thank you for the video. I bought the all in bundle just a month ago and was eagerly waiting for the section strings (btw I knew that there wouldn’t be an discount for previous owners). Beside the little disappointment that there is no col legno, I wonder if the scratches can be as extreme with the sections as they can be with the solo strings. I really need that kind of sound in a project…
I wish I had the same kind of control and technique with MIDI live playing like you have
I use their package with Roli seaboard and it sounds amazing
Excellent video, thanks! BTW - What's the cool controller with the 3 faders?
Dom have you demo'd Pacific Ensemble Strings by Performance Samples?
Having played in an orchestra it sounds like these simulations do not convincingly model the body resonance of these stringed instruments. There are overtones that are clearly missing.
agreed, i've worked with the best in Australia, real strings, even the best, don't sound sound this tight. that is the charm of real players. j.
These do not sound like a string ensemble, at least not the ones i've worked with over the years. As another poster said, they are too tight. even the best sections have some looseness. in addition as most sections get into the higher registers, the intonation suffers from human error. this is a good thing as it broadens the sound without being out of tune. i have a number of SWAM libraries and like them very much, especially the Saxes. i'm not convinced by this new edition though. j.
I think the samples are brilliant especially the solo instruments. But I think the modelling for multiple instruments sounds like its the same source so its almost a "kind of" phasing. Not audible as in true phasing, but perhaps not enough differentiated character to make a section. I hope it makes sense.
Swam is amazing. Thanks, Dom. What is the MIDI controller that you use to play the fader?
Have you tried sample modelling strings?? They use the same kind of revolutionary technology, and some might say they sound even better, would love to know your opinion on them! 🙏🏽
Awesome demo! What kind of midi controller do you use?
Komplete Kontrol and Monogram CC (link in description :) )
Is there a way to be more natural sound when 6 instruments play together? It needs to have one kind of Swing for little micro-tempo differences appears and to fell more "human" play. If not, it could be a great implement for future updates.
I am not sure Dom! Don't get me wrong, SWAM is fantastic for live performance I guess? But it sounds artificial if I use it in trailer or an epic orchestral track. Like you said, it uses physical modelling rather than sampling which makes it unrealistic for film/tv composing. The sound is so similar to Korg or Yamaha arranger keyboards in live gigs so I think it does fit the orchestral pop genre more than film music production. I maybe wrong though :) Thanks for the review 👍
What controller are you using?
It will be a great pleasure if you explain about your controllers and how you use them..! A must video.
I have already done one and I have a link in the description - it’s called Monogram CC :)
It's a Bomb! Next step - Brass, Woods and Baroque instruments
How about using an XY pad and putting Expression and Vibrato on X and Y? Hope a simple tablet can be used for that.
It's not like a violin. It sounds more like an erhu, the portamento, the dynamics...
"You broke my heart Fredo!"
😂😂😂
Because of my own limitations I do not try to imitate the real world. Still...the VST World is so much more beautiful than the Real World...thanks for your music (and awesome view of the studio)
Great! Is there any way to disable solo mode to use with chords?
You can play two notes but not chords :)
@@DomSigalas Got it, thanks friend.
The "double" polypony is a real technique in string istruments where they bow on two neighboring strings. Obviously not every interval can be played like this so you need to know the instrument.
It's more common is solos.
Tchaikovsky Symphony 6 2nd movement. Similar to same composers Serenade for Strings
Yessss!!! 🙌🏼
Not for me I guess as I not have the performance skills to benefit from it. But I can see the point why and when it makes sense to use it. The question with the demo left in my mind is: Does it sound like a new e.g. violin just bought in the shop, or does it replicate old instruments and if so which ones?
Salve. Bellissimo video. Chiedo se c'è differenza tra Swam engine e Swam audio modelling? vedo ci sono due siti che hanno sostanzialmente le stesse plugin con modellizzazione. Grazie. Luigi
Apart from the ensemble sounding like "a single person with five carbon copies", I wish to add another thing: time. I keep seeing people spending lots of efforts with controllers to get the perfect phrasing. And I understand that, it'd be especially true when writing for e.g. a solo violin in a lead role. Often though, for film, tv, games 'n such, projects need to be done 'yesterday'. There's not always time to spend on expression, you may need to get going, in order to make deadlines. I can load my own templates for LASS, some extra layers from 8DIO (just mentioning things, everyone has his/her own templates of course), and then it works. It may not be 100% as expressive as controlled SWAM, but it's at least 80% useful, *and* it allows me to get on with it all and make deadlines. As film/tv producers are generally tone deaf, they'll be happy with the 80% if that means I'm finished 'n all at the deadline. Keep in mind that lots of genres fare well with just straight legatos/sustains. Not every note must always be controlled, especially by someone with a keyboard mindset who's likely to overdo things.
These virtual instruments needs more parametric input at the same time just like real playing scenario. The osmose piano' keybed is the solution of this kind of approach i think.
Let's see them against the Samplemodeling ones now. :^)
I remember those sounding far more “real” years ago.
6:10 Though there is no need for a trill keyswitch on their solo instruments, it would make sense for them to add one to these section instruments. Otherwise, there is no way to get a trill that has different wiggle counts for different players. I'd say the fast tremolo control is more necessary on these instruments than the solo ones for the same reason, but it doesn't sound like they've actually taken advantage of it as a way to get tremolo speeds desynchronized per player.
@sashakindel3600 the Sample Modeling Strings can detect when you play runs or trills and then introduce great offset between the instruments. I think Audio Modeling can and will do so in the future
Extremely expressive, yes. I'm really tempted to buy them. But they seem to lack warmth, the sound stays a bit harsh. I don't know if they are substantially better than the Sample Modeling strings. I'm in doubt.
SM still sounds better to my ears
I'm curious too how they compare. Audio Modeling solo strings blows everything out of the water. These demos do sound a bit "tight" but I'm assuming there's some kind if looseness control?
Important question!!!!! What is the name of the controller? Cc11? Please help me
Better than Cremona quartet from
NI?
Where's the M8x master, new kid on the block then Dom?!!! Lovely strings instrument (hope you are fine now, as missed you at Synthfest😔, speaking with Luke) 😎🤘🎹🎵🌟
Aaah yes I missed this - Montage M8X is amazing right???
@@DomSigalas Defo Dom. Drove all way to Andertons (1.5hrs...) to try it out - gorgeous GEX Poly AT keybed on that, actually lighter than you'd expect no doubt for good reason, super quick to nav too now + AN-X at last! ..... "Dear Santa(!)" 🎅😂
its really hard to not press like on every video you upload, Im here since forever subbed but even if this isnt for me at all I appreciate your effort and the love you always put.
Thank you Oscar ❤️
Hello, I have a question: why are the i pad swam strings not working? Why are the violin images not formed as 3 or 5 violins as in your video? They occur one by one, which is annoying. How can I solve this problem? After all, swam sold this to us as a solo string for the i pad. Is there a setting for this on your Mac? You are using the application and I am using the iPad.
Have you reached out to their support? They are very good- I am pretty sure on the iPad only the solo instruments exist.
what is the name of the song at the beginning of the video?
Can't remember the exact name but it's from The Godfather movies.
Is it possible to assign attack parameter to a controller?
No
Is this a whole string section, 1&2 Violins, Viola, Cello, and Bass strings ??!! 😉
use it with Divisimate and play around with the rooms on the GUI and placement of the sections in those rooms, you'll probably hear a difference
😀😀😀😀
suena muy bien...pero esta un poco exagerado el movimiento de volumenes (expresion) ..
weirdly sounds like there is woodwind behind the strings 🤔
What? I can't belive what people see in swam instruments? It not to close to real? I can't belive that Dom Sigalas tested it...
First of all, great explanation video as always. Regarding the sound I think it can do better than shown in this video. I'm always impressed by your playing skills but this time I don't think you were able to show what's possible maybe because of the problem of explaining while using the full scale of articulation possible.
On the other hand...I would like to be excited about this new instrument but the fact that there is NO upgrade offer for existing customers is quite a shock for me, and I own all of the solo instruments. I don't want to express any further because right now I could become pretty rude regarding this proof of customer care.
What do you think I could have done better in terms showing what it’s capable of? I would love to know it’s an honest question :)
@@DomSigalas What I have seen of SWAM so far is that it has tremendous capabilities of realism if you use all the different controls for expression, vibrato and so on which can be linked to midi controllers. But I think it is very hard to use them while playing live. So making full use of it takes many hours of practise using maybe 5 controllers while playing.
What I have seen of you playing virtual instruments has been blowing me away so often that I think "If Dom can't do it who can?" 😉
In this video it seems that you are using the expression mainly and I had the feeling you backed off the notes at the end of a line a bit abrupt which made it sound to me a bit unnatural. I know it is hard to make an informative video which doesn't last three hours but I think maybe you should have played less or more slower phrases to show the power of the instrument by combining the different styles of expression controls.
But all that is only my personal opinion.
Thanks a lot for the video
@@boogie2266I am actually using both expression, vibrato and bow pressure in the video. And I play a lot of slow passages. I agree, if you go and edit the midi in detail of course you can do amazing things but I wanted to demonstrate what you can do when playing 100% live here with the least amount of controllers.
Thanks for writing this, I appreciate the feedback!
@@DomSigalas Thank you my original comment wasn't meant as a harsh criticism please don't get me wrong especially as I am not able to play it nearly as good as you.
I was triggered by some of the comments here about it sounding fake which is a bit exaggered anyway in my opinion.
I really think that to use this plugins at maximum level you nearly have to spend your time completely practising but who has enough time for it. Me definitely not. ;)
Being a mockup creator I'm not convinced using this lib, judged by the live performance I just heard, although the performance itself is so passioned, also because of using these great melodies, what makes it tricky in itself also, using these well known refs.
I agree that creating serious convincing real sounding strings need more tweaking of available CC's and velocity. But ok, let's bare in mind the clickbaitisch questionmark title 😉. Triggering us to all have our own answer to it at the end.
Which I find then actually hard to do only judging it by this live performance. That makes this video title not so legitimate imho.
It;s impressive in a way but sampled Strings sound much better. I can't get past the bad tone. They don't really sound like Strings. They sound like Kitaro synth strings.
No. Very Synthy sound for me and like cheap libraries. Not for this price. But nice system to play.
violins sounds always strange, like recorded in some box. This is SWAM. i deeply prefer Synful Orchestra, much more realistic and warm.
It doesn't sound so realistic to me. I love SWAM solo instruments, they are very expressive, but for sections, I prefer sample libraries.
And it takes less space than kontakt😮
It sounds Strange and Little bit LOFI or Boxy
it doesn't sound like string Sessions The Solo sound is more than Session Sound
I'm sorry Dom but this sound just doesn't suit me.. maybe because I'm used to spitfire but in my opinion even the native suite has better
That’s absolutely fine! I have a suggestion though- download the demo and layer it with the Spitfire. Try and play fast and let me know what you think :)
I really like your videos, I've seen some and I think you have a lot of talent and level, but I do notice and I don't know if it's the library or that you're a pianist or I don't know, but the cc1 cc11 cc21 or the one you use for the vibrato doesn't quite sound Well...at least for me and it surprises me because you have skill in playing but I don't know what's happening there, I can't quite believe it. I say this out of respect and education, I am not a hater. I wish I could do it the same or similar to you, best regards
Not a fan of these. Spitfire, Audio Imperia and East West Opus all day.
6:46 😊
Also the most not sounding as strings string library.
SWAM solos are amazing but really not enjoying the sections as much, they have a weirdly synthetic character
Not something I would use. I love the concept, but unfortunately I loathe the sound of the low strings. They sound oddly muffled, as though sounding through a duvet. Pitty.
Sorry fake immediately. And that’s a synth portamento. Hope they improve it.
Honesttly I use this library a lot, but the amount of tweaking needed to make them sound realistic is almost unbearable.
so artificial….. but you have a very good channel and you are a god in cubase…. thanks for your channel but this software is not really good 😅
I think cremona quarted better.
Adastra von SOUNDPAINT ist besser👌😎
People sure like to hate don't they? This is excellent playing by Dom so let's cut him a little slack for the video. AND.... I have a LOT of libaries, Spitfire, Orch Tools, CineSamples, East West, a bunch of NI stuff, and VSL (which is generally my favorite, suprising how rarly they come up actually) and every single one of them has their positives and negatives.
My problem with the SWAM stuff is the portamento (but it's not nearly as bad as others make it out to be) and that the strings don't have that "bite" to them that I expect, especially from the cello and viola in the lower register. BUT, that doesn't make them bad and they don't sound like a synth like some poeple are saying.
I sometimes wonder if poeple listen wlith their eyes instead of their ears? They hear that this is a modleing app and they conclude that it's a "synth".... listening with my ears I think these sound excellent.
Would I use them as my only string option, hell no.. but I would say that about anything I own (other than maybe VSL and even then there are small things I wish VSL did that they don't). But would I use SWAM in congunction with my other libaries? All day long.... in fact, I plan on purchashing these.
Thanks for your great video Dom, this is excellent.
Great playing but sounded fake. I’ve heard more realistic SWAM pieces, but this was live playing…. Do you have to spend hours programming to get the realistic sounds I’ve heard?
Articulations are very weak..So,it sounds fake.
oh why? Probably the worst I've heard in recent years.
I’ve heard much better
“The Most EXPRESSIVE Strings Library Ever?!” How about no. Then you go on to say they should be layered not replaced. Very disingenuous. It’s not just you obviously but I’ve had enough of people using clickbaity thumbnails on CZcams. From one “Dom” to another I LOVE your videos but this one ain’t it lol
It can be the most expressive library and simultaneously not the most complete one. So you may need to layer it with others. He didn't claim that it is the most complete library in the thumbnail and say otherwise in the video. You are just acting like a hater even if you claim that you are not one. Why is it so hard to just spread some love instead of hatred ?
The reason why I have the questionmark is exactly because ultimately, you’ll be the ones to judge if this is something that you will appreciate in your arrangements. I am 100% honest on the video I explain what I think the product is and what it isn’t . And it’s not a replacement for sample libraries - but hell it gives you so much more expression without having to worry about key switches. I have tens of terabytes of sample libraries and I’ve always been super transparent saying that there is NO perfect sample library yet. These are all tools and you have to appreciate what they offer and how they can help you :)
It's not hate. I feel like you're trying to dance around my statement by arguing "Expressive" vs "Complete". How can it be expressive when it's not? Idk guys I NEVER leave hate comments so if I'm complaining about something it's normally for a good reason. I apologize if I came off as too direct. Maybe I could have worded this better. @@majid__jafari
I may have misinterpreted what you meant when you labeled it as "Expressive". I immediately assume expressive libraries sound realistic BECAUSE of the expression. So maybe there was a miscommunication on that on my part.@@DomSigalas
@@DomzTunes it's just that i think Dom has one of the most honest reviews out there and he is not even sponsored by creators of these libraries and i'm sure his income from youtube is way less than his musical projects. So there's no reason he would want to fool anyone to get more views as he is doing all these videos out of love for his subscribers. And i'm sorry if i was too defensive here. I just felt that Dom didn't deserve that comment.
Sorry but it sounds really fake...
Sounds bad
Don't know, sounds fake
I agree. Fine for roughing out a composition but not suitable for a finished work unless buried in the mix or reverb.
I do agree but it IS the future for sure
@@Harrysound for me, over the last 40 years, the closer to realism we get, the less satisfying the results. It's like all the unrealistic physics in movie CGIs are so much less acceptable than unrealistic physics in hand-drawn or stop-motion animations (and I mean stuff like getting the acceleration of falling objects wrong, not the fact something might be impossible IRL). Similarly I'd be quite happy to include "Roland strings" in a recording as a thing in of itself but if I ever need a violin in a finished work for public consumption, I'll find a real violinist.
Well, I don't wanna be the a$$hole, but this review isn't that great. I've always seen SWAM instruments as not being good for performing. They sound great if you tweak the hell out of them, you need to input a LOT of midi data in order to have them sound "realistic".
The sound is like 80% there in terms of comparing to the real thing. Put this in a context, mix it well, and the listeners won't even notice.
Remember, all tools are great in the hands of a good musician.
@@alexsartandmusicthe sample thing needs to go though. As someone who plays an instrument working with sample libraries is like using a tv remote with a litter picker