Placing viscous dampers under the feet of equipment creates a high-pass mechanical filter, so the higher frequencies still couple through. Better to have isolators that function primarily as springs, then add a single, relatively soft, damper to control the resonance between the springs and equipment mass.
@@Canadian_Eh_I Many hardware stores carry assortments of springs, or you can look online. They're inexpensive. Some experimentation will be required, but I think you would enjoy the tinkering and you are sure to learn some interesting things. The spring isolation can be made more effective by placing a heavy slab between the DAC and the springs.
May I ask if you feel vibration dampening is so important, and I agree that it is. Why don't you employ it in any of your components? Why do i have to spend extra on aftermarket products? Why do most manufacturers just use cheap rubber footers?
@@glengoodwin High end audio is a niche of a niche. Any highend manufacturer is usually a relatively small company unless you're talking about department store level brands which clearly you aren't. So expecting a small outfit to be an expert in manufacturing 50 different components isnt realistic. And as I said before, if they did add them to their consumer product it would be way to expensive and you wouldn't buy it.
@@Canadian_Eh_I so you’re trying to tell me that a brand like PS audio, who makes everything from cables to power products, to components plus tweaks can’t possibly refine their products to incorporate a $100 (retail) fuse or $1000 (retail) worth of footings when they’re already charging thousands for a power amp? Mate, if you’re ok paying $13000 Australian for a BHK power amp, I reckon you’d be fine paying an extra few hundred for a finished product. Plus, I’m sure they’d get a better wholesale discount on some stillpoints or a Synergistic fuse than you or I. Then there are other manufacturers that don’t subscribe to these tweaks such as Shindo or Audio Note because their products are already voiced the way they’re intended to be. My gripe with this video is, if ps audio know what they think is necessary to improve they’re already $13k products, then just incorporate it into the final product. Otherwise it gives people plenty of room to mess it up with aftermarket tweaks. I’ll give you a simple analogy - I work in high end restaurants, the food’s expensive cause the kitchen are professionals and know what they’re doing, so the dish as far as we are concerned is finished. We do not offer salt, pepper, ketchup, hot sauce, mustard etc. cause it’s how we want it to taste and if left to a non professional with a bunch of condiments left on the table, they’re gonna f@&k it up. So, bottom line is PS Audio should finish their products to a degree where they don’t think any extra tweaking is necessary unless someone out there with OCD can’t help but mess with their $13k amp. Thus perpetuating this bullshit audiophile merry go round that people seem to like to indulge in. Alas, people like you enjoy living in a world where you think you can improve upon an already overpriced product with a few aftermarket fuses and footers. Again, I believe they work, but they should already be voiced and implemented by the engineer/designer of the product. After all, design is all about solutions to problems. Why let any problems exist in your finished product?
I use different vibration control devices. Even in tubes, all with diferent performance but all with good results. Recently I change the steel balls of a set of jr rollerblocks with corundum equivalents. No much improvement but was no an expensive upgrade.
Seems to be a gentleman's agreement between component manufacturers and these companies that promote and sell dampening equipment. You spend 30k on a component to then be advised to spend another 1k on vibration control. What the actual f... It is all BS promoted by reviewers and audio manufacturers.
Paul misses half of the vibration picture in this video. Air borne vibration is only a part of isolation requirements for equipment. There is floor borne vibration and especially microvibration coming from the equipment itself, including DACs, amplifiers and pre-amps which have transformers which vibrate, capacitors, etc. and units with tubes which have their own vibrations). I don't use the NOS Stillpoints from 2000 as they darken the sound on every piece of equipment I have tried them on. I use Stillpoint Ultra SS under a poorly designed tube pre-amp case and a Bryston 20 isolation transformer. I previously used ultra-minis under some equipment but changed them. Those now go under my several blu-ray players and cable TV boxes.
Paul you forget one important thing about Stillpoints. I am a Stillpoint dealer as well. The great thing about Stillpoints is that you can improve parts of the quality of your sytstem you cannot create with other tools like cables, conditioners or even other ones. They also can make horizontal energy from vertical energy. This is why it is a lot more than only damping. Compare 3 vs 4 Stillpoints under the same device and you will hear that 4 works better than 3.
Bobby, I prefer to use 3 Ultra 6's + Ultra bases under my Vitus cdp in a triangular layout for stability. The wider utlra 6's are ideal for that purpose. However under my integrated amp & power conditioner I use 4 Ultra 6's + bases.
Products I.E CD players, Amps all resonate from inside, they don't really suffer from vibrations unless on wooden floors. Place Nordost Kones under the cd tray under the input transformer and outputs and this will drain the internal resonances. External vibration products are very limited as to what they do.
Hi Paul ! I totally agree with Andrew. I find these products to be more effective than other decoupling systems. The other decoupling products are interesting with some devices but not with others. Does that mean that Stillpoints products are more neutral than the others ?
Andrew was referring to the 1st generation Stillpoints cones (as per this pic - positive-feedback.com/Issue27/stillpoint.htm). The latest Stillpoints Ultra feet (incl: the awesome Ultra 6's) are in another league altogether. I have 12 Ultra 6's, Ultra Mini's and Ultra LPI's in my system & together the improvement is remarkable; in the order of magnitude of a component upgrade.
Noooo Gold, myrrh and incense... It is God's stuffing inside as it is pure magic. That explains the price out of the sky. Some version consists of saffron too.
i just cut squash balls in half and put them under the equipment's feet. great for cutting down on external vibration and the resonance generated by the mechanical gear. the only problem is their weight limit is about 10-15kg.
You can insert squash balls into electrical tape rolls if you don't want to cut them, or for devices already with feet, you can put rubber bands over ashtrays.
It is a anti vibration product that has individually adjustable feet and an air bladder or bladders with a bubble level and a little bike pump to inflate it. The bladder ruptured on the one I have so I can tie a rope around it and use it to slow a boat down unless I can get it repaired.
@@stephenfleschler9682 Mine has needed repair. I never got it fixed. One of the bladders ruptured doesn't hold air anymore. I think I might have put a mega multi disc CD player on it that was too heavy.
None of this stuff does anything… it’s all marketing BS for the dealers so they have something else to sell. Unfortunately nice unsuspecting people walking off the street and believe these dealers that these products make a huge difference. These dealers should be slapped
Placing viscous dampers under the feet of equipment creates a high-pass mechanical filter, so the higher frequencies still couple through. Better to have isolators that function primarily as springs, then add a single, relatively soft, damper to control the resonance between the springs and equipment mass.
Firstly awesome to see a female audiophile, kudos! Secondly, any recommendations on springs to put under my dac?
@@Canadian_Eh_I
Many hardware stores carry assortments of springs, or you can look online. They're inexpensive. Some experimentation will be required, but I think you would enjoy the tinkering and you are sure to learn some interesting things. The spring isolation can be made more effective by placing a heavy slab between the DAC and the springs.
@@marianneoelund2940 Thanks, I'll look into it.
May I ask if you feel vibration dampening is so important, and I agree that it is. Why don't you employ it in any of your components? Why do i have to spend extra on aftermarket products? Why do most manufacturers just use cheap rubber footers?
Because if they added those, and high end fuses and 50 other things the component would be 3x as much and you wouldnt buy it
@@Canadian_Eh_I I call bullshit. I’d rather buy a complete product than have to tweak my already high end cost no object components
Do it right the first time
@@glengoodwin High end audio is a niche of a niche. Any highend manufacturer is usually a relatively small company unless you're talking about department store level brands which clearly you aren't. So expecting a small outfit to be an expert in manufacturing 50 different components isnt realistic. And as I said before, if they did add them to their consumer product it would be way to expensive and you wouldn't buy it.
@@Canadian_Eh_I so you’re trying to tell me that a brand like PS audio, who makes everything from cables to power products, to components plus tweaks can’t possibly refine their products to incorporate a $100 (retail) fuse or $1000 (retail) worth of footings when they’re already charging thousands for a power amp? Mate, if you’re ok paying $13000 Australian for a BHK power amp, I reckon you’d be fine paying an extra few hundred for a finished product. Plus, I’m sure they’d get a better wholesale discount on some stillpoints or a Synergistic fuse than you or I. Then there are other manufacturers that don’t subscribe to these tweaks such as Shindo or Audio Note because their products are already voiced the way they’re intended to be. My gripe with this video is, if ps audio know what they think is necessary to improve they’re already $13k products, then just incorporate it into the final product. Otherwise it gives people plenty of room to mess it up with aftermarket tweaks. I’ll give you a simple analogy - I work in high end restaurants, the food’s expensive cause the kitchen are professionals and know what they’re doing, so the dish as far as we are concerned is finished. We do not offer salt, pepper, ketchup, hot sauce, mustard etc. cause it’s how we want it to taste and if left to a non professional with a bunch of condiments left on the table, they’re gonna f@&k it up. So, bottom line is PS Audio should finish their products to a degree where they don’t think any extra tweaking is necessary unless someone out there with OCD can’t help but mess with their $13k amp. Thus perpetuating this bullshit audiophile merry go round that people seem to like to indulge in. Alas, people like you enjoy living in a world where you think you can improve upon an already overpriced product with a few aftermarket fuses and footers. Again, I believe they work, but they should already be voiced and implemented by the engineer/designer of the product. After all, design is all about solutions to problems. Why let any problems exist in your finished product?
I use different vibration control devices. Even in tubes, all with diferent performance but all with good results. Recently I change the steel balls of a set of jr rollerblocks with corundum equivalents. No much improvement but was no an expensive upgrade.
Seems to be a gentleman's agreement between component manufacturers and these companies that promote and sell dampening equipment. You spend 30k on a component to then be advised to spend another 1k on vibration control. What the actual f... It is all BS promoted by reviewers and audio manufacturers.
Paul misses half of the vibration picture in this video. Air borne vibration is only a part of isolation requirements for equipment. There is floor borne vibration and especially microvibration coming from the equipment itself, including DACs, amplifiers and pre-amps which have transformers which vibrate, capacitors, etc. and units with tubes which have their own vibrations). I don't use the NOS Stillpoints from 2000 as they darken the sound on every piece of equipment I have tried them on. I use Stillpoint Ultra SS under a poorly designed tube pre-amp case and a Bryston 20 isolation transformer. I previously used ultra-minis under some equipment but changed them. Those now go under my several blu-ray players and cable TV boxes.
Paul you forget one important thing about Stillpoints. I am a Stillpoint dealer as well. The great thing about Stillpoints is that you can improve parts of the quality of your sytstem you cannot create with other tools like cables, conditioners or even other ones. They also can make horizontal energy from vertical energy. This is why it is a lot more than only damping. Compare 3 vs 4 Stillpoints under the same device and you will hear that 4 works better than 3.
Bobby, I prefer to use 3 Ultra 6's + Ultra bases under my Vitus cdp in a triangular layout for stability. The wider utlra 6's are ideal for that purpose. However under my integrated amp & power conditioner I use 4 Ultra 6's + bases.
Products I.E CD players, Amps all resonate from inside, they don't really suffer from vibrations unless on wooden floors. Place Nordost Kones under the cd tray under the input transformer and outputs and this will drain the internal resonances. External vibration products are very limited as to what they do.
Hi Paul ! I totally agree with Andrew. I find these products to be more effective than other decoupling systems. The other decoupling products are interesting with some devices but not with others. Does that mean that Stillpoints products are more neutral than the others ?
Lumps of Blue tac under the equipment can help too, but is not very pretty and can tear the feet off. But is super cheap :D
that's right not sure why mess up your feet? you could stick some felt feet pads on first
I want to try Stillpoints. I heard HRS are good too.
Andrew was referring to the 1st generation Stillpoints cones (as per this pic - positive-feedback.com/Issue27/stillpoint.htm). The latest Stillpoints Ultra feet (incl: the awesome Ultra 6's) are in another league altogether. I have 12 Ultra 6's, Ultra Mini's and Ultra LPI's in my system & together the improvement is remarkable; in the order of magnitude of a component upgrade.
what is the damping material inside I'm assuming rubber or gel like substance anybody know
Noooo
Gold, myrrh and incense...
It is God's stuffing inside as it is pure magic.
That explains the price out of the sky.
Some version consists of saffron too.
i just cut squash balls in half and put them under the equipment's feet. great for cutting down on external vibration and the resonance generated by the mechanical gear. the only problem is their weight limit is about 10-15kg.
You can insert squash balls into electrical tape rolls if you don't want to cut them, or for devices already with feet, you can put rubber bands over ashtrays.
Paul I have owned a product called the Seismic sink have you ever heard of this?
It is a anti vibration product that has individually adjustable feet and an air bladder or bladders with a bubble level and a little bike pump to inflate it. The bladder ruptured on the one I have so I can tie a rope around it and use it to slow a boat down unless I can get it repaired.
@@Geerladenlad My seismic sink under my VPI TNT VI just needs two or three pumps of air every six weeks. I've had it for 16 years. It's fabulous.
@@stephenfleschler9682 Mine has needed repair. I never got it fixed.
One of the bladders ruptured doesn't hold air anymore.
I think I might have put a mega multi disc CD player on it that was too heavy.
@@Geerladenlad I'm sorry to hear that. My VPI TNT VI and HDF beneath it weighs about 65 lbs. That must have been a really big mega disc CD player!
@@stephenfleschler9682 yeah it held like 400 CDs
None of this stuff does anything… it’s all marketing BS for the dealers so they have something else to sell. Unfortunately nice unsuspecting people walking off the street and believe these dealers that these products make a huge difference. These dealers should be slapped
Yeah sure, I'm gonna pay $600+ for a piece of metal, WHY NOT 11/10, 101% RECOMMENDED!!!