The Problem With Metal Sonic...
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- čas přidán 7. 07. 2024
- Recently with all the Sonic media I've been consuming I've noticed that the writing for Metal Sonic has been a bit off. Today I thought I'd share my thoughts on the current depiction of Metal Sonic.
#idwsonic #metalsonic #sonicova #sonicprimeseason2
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To be honest, i think that metal sonic in the comics has a lot more personality then some realise. After the metal virus arc, he has a bit of an epiphany. When he dips his hand into a barrel of the virus, he doesnt get turned, because he isnt organic. He isnt like sonic. So i imagine, that in the egg city arc, when he rushes in to fight them all by himself, (or whenever he fights more then one person by himself for that matter), its out of anger. A personal vendetta. Keep in mind, metal has been losing to sonic for AGES by this point. Given that the comics take place after forces. So it makes sense that hes starting to break out of his programming a bit, but only to try and prove that hes better then sonic. Heck, in the metal virus arc again, sonic is running on the treadmill thing, and he talks to metal for a bit. Sonic realizes that metal doesnt have to serve eggman, but he does it anyway. He just doesnt understand why. This concludes my metal sonic ted talk.
damn
damn
damn
damn
How does Sonic realize Metal doesn't HAVE to serve Eggman?
Eggman literally walks up to him and tell Sonic that Metal is actually hardcoded to behave the way he does. Metal tells Sonic when he first reveals his Neo form again that Eggman hardcoded him to no longer rebel and be totally loyal.
Sonic is just kind of an idiot who somehow didn't realize Metal's free will is in chains despite being directly told that more than once.
Metal is one of my favorite fictional characters, so it really does suck to see how badly he's been mishandled. He's called Metal Sonic for a reason, he's supposed to be on par with Sonic, not just falling short of.
Blame those "Eggman never has a solid plan" crowds
Fr
i miss shard
@@Aidel1011 Ironically, much of Metal's downgrading came from him being shoved back into the role of Eggman's lackey after he grew beyond that.
@@ToaArcan Yep, despite the fan outrage and the fact that Metal Sonic is not cool anymore for that
*sigh* time to go back to my sonic hyperfixation
Fr
Welcome back 😔
you never left your sonic phase, you will eventually crawl back into it
@@Spongyboi897fr
You will eventually stop doing your homework just to watch this like me
Dude, seeing him in the next movie would be awesome. I would love to see him get the respect he deserves and actually have a narrative impact. Like if sonic lost to metal sonic narratively that would look awesome for the movie and then they could build something from there.
@@huii_11I think most of us would
I doubt his appearance since it looks like the movie is gonna have a big focus on adventure era stuff
I would not be pissed if the biolizard was replaced with metal sonic or if Eggman used him as a placeholder for the first fight between shadow and the biolizard. If they implemented him good enough it would please fans and they could overlook the inconsistencies in Sonic Adventure 2 story by including him.
Imagine if the writers of a given Sonic property took the Terminator approach and made Metal Sonic a high-level threat again, difficult to harm and determined as all hell to take the heroes down. Even if his appearances were brief, they'd be so much more impactful! Like as soon as Metal shows up, no matter what Sonic and the gang are doing, suddenly their priorities shift and they're thrust headlong into survival mode. THAT would be terrifying.
Thing is, Metal has never been a real threat in the games outside of when he went Neo Metal in Heroes. Even in CD, we are never given a reason to see him as a major threat as your only interaction with him prior to the race is just him kidnapping a little girl who can't even fight.
@@ChaddyFantome He's meant to be a threat to the character of Sonic seeing as his whole point is to best sonic which is why most of his boss battles are races since Sonic's best attribute is speed. I think I'd love to see a story where Metal really disappears for a bit and during that time analyses how exactly Sonic became so great and fast. Imagine a story where he is all Taskmaster on Sonic and takes his friends out one by one and could make a great story where Metal finally beats Sonic
@@gibbsterV Is he though? Is he really? Because as far as I can tell, he never actual ever was. From what I can tell, the idea of Metal was always to elevate Sonic by showing how Eggman fails to understand what makes Sonic Sonic. Metal is a robotic subserviant tool that reduces Sonic down to purely his physical ability, which is why he could never compare to him and always failed to match him.
Even in Heroes, Metal's character centers around this. He laments the fact that despite being made the outdo him, he has never been able to and it frustrates him that he simply cannot comprehend why he cant, regardless of the amount of power he amasses.
Metal is a wannabe. He isn't meant to be a genuine threat to Sonic as much as he is a relentless entity that tries in vain to be what it cannot.
I can't really agree with Metal Sonic being mishandled in the later portions of the comics due to Metal Sonic easily beating up Surge which led the to her to team up with Kit and strategies to immobilize him with extreme difficulty and we see Metal Sonic was the main reason why Sonic had his friends had a tough time escaping from the city while only being delayed or held back momentarily which showed how dangerous he is and later on we see that everyone needed to work to get to knock him out momentarily which shows his durability.
Sonic was also struggling against Surge with the dynamo cage and almost killed him and the main reason she beat him was strategy and absorbing energy which shows Metal Sonic being a consistent threat that requires strategy or hax to defeat.
I can definitely see it from that angle too! Like I mentioned I think the comics have given Metal the most justice. Personally I just noticed him catching hands a lot within the last several issues so I figured I'd bring it up 😁
@@SonicTheory96 and he was only defeated by Surge and Kit because they literally counter him
they can use both WATER and ELECTRICITY, and metal is... a robot
Dynamo Surge is an even bigger counter too, so it makes sense for Metal to be defeated there aswell
as for him going straight to one vs all of Sonic's Friends, its easily explained by the way he has been portrayed in the IDW after the first arc
I think that Metal was getting beaten up regularly because Eggman just didn't care to fix him completely and give some upgrade.
Because Eggman fears that if he fixes Metal completely, he will go back to being a traitor and he will restart Sonic Heroes like he did in the First IDW Sonic comics. Deja Vu is what Eggman fears. Flynn's "Eggman never had a solid plan" quote is pointless because Eggman always has a solid plan on how to deal with potential threats and double crossers like Metal Sonic.
Even in Sonic Forces does Eggman have a backup Solid plan on preventing Infinite from turning on him, meaning Flynn thinks Sonic Forces doesn't count when he said that
Good point. @@Aidel1011
@@pancake204 Ian Flynn doesn't need to keep Metal Sonic as Eggman's puppet anymore as that concept has gone stale since the end of Sonic Heroes. Metal Sonic needs return of his peak and more character development. I am talking about "Shard The Metal Sonic" style. A robot antithesis who goes from a villain obsessed with being "The real Sonic" into a Robot antithesis who sides with Sonic but still has a personality that keeps him apart from the hedgehog he is a copy of.
The closest they tried into doing that outside Archie is the Scrapped and Cut Content/Plans for Sonic Heroes where Metal Sonic is supposed to be a redeemed protagonist fighting another Metal Sonic (Neo)
Ian Hacko
@@Aidel1011 "Listen here, metalhead: if you really want to prove your superiority so badly, how about you try being better at 'hero stuff' than me? Can't be the better Sonic if you don't act like Sonic, now, can you? Live free, help the ones in need, that kind of stuff. But you? A servant to one, always just 'crush, kill, destroy'."
Metal Sonic has got to be a tricky character to write for since he doesn't talk, and the only way he can see how he thinks is by his action. Making him talk is way to circumvent it, but that would feel cheap given the whole aspect of him being how eggman would improve sonic (by removing every 'human' characteristic from him).
Tho, the recent issue has made me consider that they're trying to do something with him since he actively choses to attack Sonic and Co on his own as if trying to make up for always needing someone else to help him when he was up against surge and kit.
Even though I have a lot of distain for sonic 4, I feel like it gives Metal Sonic a lot of necessary rework. Metal doesn’t feel like a pawn that gets easily kicked aside, but an actual threat that has a meaningful presence. I also feel that the comics have a pretty good depiction of Metal Sonic, because most of his defeats are from him being delayed briefly instead of a complete destruction.
You mean sonic 3?
I think the problem is that more villains drills the old question.
"Why does Eggman keep trying if he never wins?"
It's the opposite effect of the Garry Stew dynamic , the villains never win anything.
As a kid , that's the one thing I liked about Adventures Of Sonic.
Simple, he got so, SO close in Forces, and has built a couple Eggmanlands by now, they just don’t last.
@@aidanhammans9337 , close isn't a win.
He keeps trying to find new ideas and lands that are not tainted by previous failures just to have the will to live.
And it's all to prove himself , but they never give him useful inventions.
If they hate him, why is he always badass though?
Yeah
They always find the most shamefull ways for him to lose
@@metalsonic4.1therobothedge24okay so running into a wall, getting destroyed by sonic heroes, getting smacked a bunk, going boom, ye hes not doin good
Great video man. I'm glad the algorithm through it my way.
I have a lot of love for Metal Sonic especially in the OVA and Heroes, and after the end of Heroes I had always hoped to see Metal return and have more interactions with Sonic whether it be fighting or possibly some conversations about their existence as two sides of the same coin kind of thing.
I've not read the comics but I do think he's been underutilised in the games. And since Sega are slowly integrating Sonic's friends into the games, I'd like to see him return in some way too.
I'm glad you enjoyed the video! Hopefully we see a cool character moment for Metal in an upcoming project!
Honestly I don't even like his iteration in Heroes either.
I really want a piece of media that has Metal Sonic and Omega talk or pair up.
The ending of Heroes where Shadow and Omega pick him up could've made for some great new development if they had followed through with it in Shadow the Hedgehog.
I feel so bad for Metal, being constantly thrown into unwinnable fights against sonic and all his friends.
metal sonics biggest weekness... NOT GETTING THE FAITH OF A ONE ON ONE
What did i do?
You became a joke. That is what you are, Metal. You are past your golden years
Appear way too much
You forgot to be a real threath to sonic
I've heard of this before. I know it as the "Worf Effect" named after Worf from Star Trek Next Gen. Basically, Metal Sonic has been used as a measurement. The writer uses Metal Sonic as a measurement to show the readers how powerful another threat is. If done too much it can make the reader wonder why the character is feared when he just goes down like a chump. Luckily, that hasn't happened to Metal Sonic. But it does seem to be skirting the edge a bit.
Metal's so complex for someone who never speaks.
while i do think the latter usage of metal in IDW is... lack luster, Surge is a enemy that USES electricity, which is a weakness to alot of robots, being short circuited. so him losing consistently to Surge makes sense to me. she has the counter to him in the form of just being able to shut him off.
Problem is that he has channeled a lot more energy than she can hope to put out and his internals would be shielded anyway. A little Zap wouldn't take him down.
as a big metal sonic fan, i love his character in sonic ova the most. he literally made me cry when [spoiler thingy that has something to do with lava] and the way he was copying sonic (like his nose rub) and sonic acknowledging that theyre the exact same and know what both of them will do afterwards, and metal so ic gaining some sentience and free will at the end, and everything... everything about that character made me appreciate and love him. he is a robot who has a sloght change to turn good or be a great opponent to his bological fleshy counterpart which, oppositely to him, shows lots of emotions while metal himself doesnt.
sonic, at the time of sonic cd, was all anti pollution and supportive or the nature being alive and not killed, so foe that time in that plot of sonic fighting for the nature, metal sonic and sonic's rivalry was literally "mechanics versus nature" battle WHICH FIT PERFECTLY BACK THEN because 90% of the sonic's plot in 1993 was him poofing robots and defeating eggman so he wouldnt ruin the whole nature and evilishly conquer the dead land and captured, experimented, and eventually enslaved animals that were used as ENGINES. sonic was fighting for freedom of those animals, and for the nature to not be destroyed and burnt to death, so that nature, a big part of the earth, wouldnt be endangered. and metal sonic was a version of sonic that was just like sonic,but also quite the opposite. sonic was all freedomy, careless, heroic and a bit proud of it to the point he was bragging about saving everyone. while metal sonic was obedient and quiet, he needed to have a purpose in life, rather than just living freely like sonic and chilling anywhere while occasionally helping everyone around.
and even metal sonic, the cold and calculated robot, was able to gain some self awareness and, due to being sonic's clone or a counterpart, even he was heroic. for once, nature and tech bonded and tech became good like nature, in the slightest. oh, and speaking in allegories, tech is made out of natural minerals or handmade materials who are always made from nature. everything we have is made out of nature! so it feels like, since metal was sonic's clone, even he somewhat became good and did something heroic.
even if afterwards nothing else like this was done to him, he is a GREAT threat and a great enemy to sonic. he is literally his clone andtheh both can predict everything both of them can do. even if nowadays, sega is making him alot weaker than he should be. of course, in sonic prime, chaos sonic(which is metal sonic but prime) even overpowered sonic in a way thaf he was alot stronger and looked like he would EASILY get the upper hand instantly in a fight where he would be SERIOUS. metal sonic is overall, a very advanced robot that copies sonic, and sonic runs in *the speed of sound.* and if a robot manages to copy running at such speeds without breaking apart, it is a serious threat of an enemy. he once was the biggest threat ever! and presumably, since mecha sonic could go super, i dont think metal cannot do the same aswell. i just wish he opposed more threat and was taken more seriously nowadays, except for sonic prime. they did him neat, even if that wasnt presicely metal sonic. also, i wait for the day that he might become a little bit good, just like sage, an ai, which is quite like a robot, if not the same, became more self aware and emotional, atleast for once, or i mean, atleast make him a bigger threat. i hope he will be jn the sonic movie, and i hope he will be a big threat so his potential wouldnt go to waste! (but of course, ova metal sonic is just mwah in every way, it would be even better in my opinion, if metal in sonic movie 3 would be similar a bit...)
This was a great analysis, but personally one of the things I found most underutilized about him is his characterization and the identity crisis he's sometimes teased to have. He doesn't need to have Shadow levels of backstory and angst, but I love the concept of a robot created for a purpose he can never seem to achieve and being driven to illogical conclusions by it. As well as the dynamic between this deadly but illogical machine and its callous, childish creator who probably doesn't care. There's a lot there they could dig into with them, and it breaks my heart that the direction with the character ended in 2003.
Metal Sonic loses too often and _never_ wins. It pretty much kills all sense of him being seen as a threatening bad guy. Even Eggman, who loses every game, still feels like more of a threat because he gets little wins here and there and takes a long time to defeat. When Metal Sonic appears as a one-off boss, its treating him like your average nameless faceless boss robot Eggman throws at the heroes rather than a complex character and a foil for Sonic.
Fleetway's Sonic The Comic/STC had the first Metallix/Metal Sonic being so powerful that Sonic had to travel back in time and destroy the machine that was going to create Metallix/Metal Sonic. The second Metallix/Mecha Sonic MK II beat Knuckles and Sonic easily until it knocked Sonic onto the Master Emerald causing Sonic to go Super. The Metallix/Mecha Sonic mentioned his brother Metallixes. After this the Metal Sonics were a Time Travelling army that erased Robotnik from history forcing Sonic to create Robotnik to stop them. They were beaten three times once with an EMP gun, the second time with a bomb that the Freedom Fighters placed in a Metallix they had taken down by Amy firing an arrow at their weakspot. The third time they turned both Mobius and the Little Planet into Machine worlds and beaten by Sonic using a shut down device that Robotnik built to stop them incase of Rebellion.
3:37 in forces, thats a copy used by infinite since metal was getting upgraded for the final battle in force, so it was a substitute.
Yo I’m so excited for sonic 3 I’m so obsessed with sonic now idkw so I’m watching all of your vids have a nice day
I feel like it’s stupid to send a robot after someone with any sort of electrical powers.
Nice video. I can understand some of the points being made here, however, I can't really see a lot of "out of character" moments for Metal Sonic. He always had tunnel vision when it came to Sonic so him following Tangle to get to the hedgehog was something I saw coming a mile away. MS was programmed to surpass the original in every way; the only way he can do that is defeating Sonic. To Metal: it's the only thing that gives him purpose. He's still incredibly dangerous as always; it's just that the game characters have had experience dealing with him.
On the other hand, the counter-strategy to the dilemma is to use him sparingly like Darth Vader is to the Emperor. The problem with this is that Metal is Eggman's Chief Enforcer, his right hand bot; He's the first robot the doctor thinks of to get a job done to some level of success. The Emperor at least have multiple enforcers, not just Vader, at his beck and call. I can't think of another machine the Doctor's made (that's still operating) that can go toe-to-toe with Sonic & Friends and come out of it with just a few scrapes; plus, it would just mean he doesn't show up as much as he does now which may come off as neglectful to some fans.
Everybody gangsta till Cubot snaps
In 1 sibgle video, you referenced Halo (my fav franchise), Lotr (my 2nd), Star wars (my 3rd) and the video is about sonic (my 4th).
You've got a new sub!
Also great video! Keep up the good work!
I love all those franchises myself which is why I always try to talk about them when applicable! I'm glad you liked the video and subbed!
What's happening in IDW right now is basically just a repeat of what happened in Archie's preboot toward the end. Like, this isn't the first time Flynn's portrayal of the character has started to slip.
For those unaware, over the course of one arc, Metal went from Mk.3.3 to _3.8,_ because he was getting blown up in every appearance he put in. Eggman would make a new Metal Sonic, it would go out and attack the heroes, and then it would explode by the end of the issue. At one point, Eggman activates Metal's self-destruct when he is fighting three characters who are all explicitly normal people with no superpowers, and only one of whom is armed. And the guy who is armed is using a _sword._ Like, purely out of spite, Eggman blows up Metal, and then immediately goes and builds a new one.
He was constantly getting upstaged by similar characters, mostly Scourge and Shard, and while he did eventually get a win back over Shard, it came at the cost of him exploding again.
Archie Metal Sonic got blown up so much that SEGA actually had to tell Flynn to stop doing that, and once the reboot came down, Metal never got exploded again, and remained a consistent threat for the rest of the book's run.
I also don't really think Flynn _gets_ the point of Neo Metal as a form. And nor do a lot of the fandom. A lot of people complained about Neo Metal not being fought in his default form, and instead immediately transforming into Metal Madness. And so, Flynn delivered what the fandom wanted. But... look at him. His legs are almost completely enclosed in extra plating that seems to serve no purposes besides aesthetics. His shoulder-spikes are oversized and would collide with his quills if he tried to turn his head. He's got a huge piece of cloth directly below the exhaust for his engine. That form could not be more clearly designed to look regal and intimidating at the expense of combat capability if it tried. So no wonder he doesn't waste time trying, and just goes into his giant dragon form at the first opportunity.
It's not a form Metal takes to get stronger, it's a form he takes to embody his new position as overlord, he's as kingly as he can get without slapping an actual crown on. So taking that and turning it into just a powered-up state that remains fully loyal to Eggman is... completely empty, and devoid of what made his evolution so cool in the first place.
Also, like, the Metal Overlord didn't need an upgrade, he was already one of the only bosses in the series that could actually cause damage to Super forms rather than having to time them out. That puts him in the same category as Solaris and Dark Gaia, the former of which is still the most powerful entity that has ever appeared in the franchise.
I think the best ting for Metal at this point would be to revert back to Heroes-era characterisation and make him a threat that Eggman can't fully control. He's aggressive, dangerous, and his cold, logical mind makes him far more pragmatic than Eggman's goofy antics, but there's also a touch of madness in there.
True, Metal Sonic peaked when he is in his Neo Form
To be honnest, Archie could of done so much with Metal mk3.3 - 3.8, unfortunately, like idw, it cant have good characters for too long
@@metalsonic4.1therobothedge24 I think a lot of Archie's villains suffered for Eggman's benefit. Flynn _really_ likes Eggman and he tried to avoid having other villains upstage him, even to the extent that it hurts the characterisation of said antagonists.
Flynn's also on record saying that he doesn't think Sonic needs other villains when Eggman exists, which is a bit like saying "We don't need Brainiac or Zod or Darkseid, Superman's already got Lex Luthor as a villain!", completely missing that a wider array of villains is interesting because they can challenge the heroes in different ways.
Metal is an obvious example, but when Finitevus' big strategy to blow up his enemies' home city is "Get Eggman to do it for him" and Naugus (who hates Eggman!) decides that the best way to assassinate Elias is "Call Eggman and let him do it", and the Dark Egg Legion is basically "A bunch of previous villains and a couple of new ones are now Eggman's pawns and if they rebel he blows their heads up", it starts to get a bit ridiculous.
But nothing tops the utter waste of a concept that was Mecha Sally. The tactical mind behind the Freedom Fighters, who has been at the core of the network of FF cells across the planet for basically the entire series, and knows all of their strengths and weaknesses becomes a villain? That should be like Batman going evil and having full access to all of his contingencies.
What does she do in the comic? Basically nothing. Yeah, the heroes start dropping like flies, but none of it has anything to do with Sally. Nicole and Bunnie give up because of Naugus. Antoine gets blown up by Eggman with Mecha Sally being barely present. Rotor doesn't even have anything bad happen to him, he just decides to stay at home. Eggman makes her into a battle robot and then she wins one fight. Against a depowered Bunnie.
She could've been the comic's best archvillain ever, and she isn't because Eggman's got to be the central antagonist.
Basically the only villain to escape this was Scourge, and he was basically the same problem writ small.
@@ToaArcan fr, i hate Flynn and his writting, why cant we have good writters
Your video was incredible, I thought I was the only one who thought that way about Metal Sonic, he's my favorite villain since I played Sonic
Personally I would be down with a sonic game where eggman, tired of metal sonic constantly failing, finally creates a new mark of Metal Sonic. But this time, its a hivemind nanotech army. Even if sonic were to somehow defeat one, they would simply repair another metal sonic or reform quickly. I feel this would be clever because it would showcase how eggman is willing to continue raising the stakes and to address how having 1 metal sonic hasn’t been working. You could still even continue having a central metal sonic by eventually having him be the reason why this plan fails, to prove to Eggman that he is ultimately his greatest creation and that he will never be replaceable.
off topic I just found your channel you have a really good voice
Oh thank you!
I think what would help metal sonic is a side kick. It would refresh the character a bit and finally have a little genius of his own, like tails is to sonic.
Maybe that’s what Sage will be
No add metal sonic and metal knuckles
What about the other Metal Robot From SA1 from Eggman's Hidden Base in Mystic Ruins?
Metal Sonic is my favorite Sonic character. That menacing vibe gives him a sense of presence that feels like the situation has just gotten serious. He feels like a genuine threat and a true challenge for Sonic and others to overcome.
...Until recently. I feel like it can generally be chalked up to SEGA's overreliance on nostalgia pandering, but he's really been getting shafted lately. Not just in the comics, but in general. He was great in Mania Adventures, but ever since he's mostly been getting relegated to a minor obstacle to be overcome or slapped into scenes to give Eggman some personality dynamic rather than to genuinely use him for anything of substance. SEGA's even going all in on this being Amy's anniversary year despite Metal's debut being in the same game.
If they're running out of ideas for how to use him as an obstacle to overcome in the story, it might be time to start incorporating some character development. Like with Omega and Gemerl before him, it could be time for Metal to stop being so stubbornly loyal to Eggman and start adopting a more independent point of view. I don't think we necessarily need him to start turning a new leaf and becoming a good guy, but imagine if he decided to go his own way and started becoming a threat totally independent of Eggman? At the very least, it would be nice for him to start getting used for something more than "Eggman being a dad" scenes.
Yep, Metal Sonic staying as "Eggman's lapdog" has been an outdated concept ever since Sonic Heroes
I think that a story where Metal takes a page out of Taskmaster's book and really analyses Sonic's moves and it's a story where some Sonic characters start going missing and it's Metal taking them out and working his way up to Sonic. Some characters would survive but this is a story where Metal could take out Sonic. In this it could also fix the characters of Tails and Knuckles forcing Tails to become brave again and Knuckles to stop being a dumbass and be a tactical warrior again. To add your part to the story the final boss could have Eggman messing about in the fight to try and help Metal but it ends up backfiring and Metal realises that if he wants to be the best Sonic he has to ditch Eggman
Sega should keep Metal Sonic absent for multiple games until they are ready to give him a big role. Maybe instead of having a wholesome brother-sister relationship with Sage, Sage is used a tool and hostage to make Eggman his b!tch
Eggman: “Impossible! You have manage to resist Sage’s new programming. She conquers and controls every badnik in the Eggman Empire.”
MS: “I…am the conqueror, I…am the Controller, I…AM…METAL SONIC!”
I found Chaos Sonic to be a pretty interesting new take. Instead of the original's silent menace, he's a instead a dark reflection of Sonic's own personality. It's not inferentially better or worse than traditional Metal Sonic, just refreshing.
The only thing I can think of that has been made in more recent years where Metal Sonic is actually intimidating is with Mania and Triple Trouble 16-Bit, and those games were made by fans. I imagine having a fan game where he is the villain for a good chunk of it until later when he's against, say, Mecha Sonic and sacrifices himself like in the OVA would be an excellent choice too. There's just so much missed potential with this character in general.
He still technically has a better fate than Fang though. He isn't even allowed to appear in more "modern" material for some largely unknown, strange, and completely stupid reasons. He isn't the only character in the classic series to get that treatment, but a lot of things could've been better utilized with him too.
5:57 Knuckle's Face Is Priceless
hope he has a major role in the third sonic movie
I wanna read these comics but idk where to start there's so many sonic comics series, someone help 😅
Man, I've been reading Sonic comics from the beggining recently, and it's hard not to love Metal.
The problem is, from a conceptual standpoint, Metal is a sort of ever-evolving threat. This can be seen in the fight against Sonic & Knuckles in Sonic the Comic, which was only won because of Fleetway, and it led to the Brotherhood of Metallix arc which was awesome.
I haven't read the entire comic yet, but I can immediately see that he's much more than a simple villain. It's not something that can be dealt with in an arc, and then treated like garbage afterwards, it's one of the most essential recurring threats, working like a ticking time-bomb whose consequences could lead to a dead-end scenario (y'know, when people where actually at risk of dying).
Metal Sonic is built to overcome the whole Eggman schtick and become one of the biggest menaces in the franchise, he shouldn't be thrown in scenes with no plan nor purpose.
It sucks because he's easily one of the characters with the most potential; alas, the entity known as Sonic Maurice Hedgehog can't be surpassed nor overcomed (despite some of his best moments being at his lowest, when he shows lack of confidence, fear, and worry. A bit of which Frontiers has started to explore after a long while).
Yeah I have a problem with this Metal Tonic Character it’s that it’s black hole is sticking out I kinda perfer if the black hole part goes completely gone and be's sealed up with yellow almost making Metal Sonic's Tummy Circle be like Classic Sonic's Tummy Circle except Metal Sonic's Tummy Circle is completely yellow.
A good idea is in then next sonic 3d game they should use metal and the girl in founters when it's a relationship that she isnt the first powerful crashon
surprised you didnt talk about his run on the pvp
Seu video ficou incrível, achei que eu era o unico que pensava assim do metal sonic, ele e meu vilão favorito desde que eu joguei sonic
Yeah, Sonic Team and SEGA really didn't know what to do with Metal Sonic after Sonic Heroes except shove him into any new spin-off game.
But I feel like the fatigue started at the same point as Green Hill zone's, they just kept appearing for no reason over and over again after Sonic Generations
Seeing as Sonic Team are finally dropping Green Hill for Sonic Superstars, I'm also hoping that Metal Sonic DOES NOT appear. Other robots need the spotlight for a change; such as Mecha Sonic (Mk1 or Mk2), Metal Knuckles, and Tails Doll. But seeing as Nack is back and Trip is being introduced, I doubt any of those will make it in, but I'm just gonna hope.
If they wanna keep shoving Metal Sonic even more into the games, at least continue to develop his character and let's say, I would accept if Game Metal Sonic becomes like Shard from the Archie comics. That will be way better than the joke of a robot he became in 2010s
I totally agree. He just feels so unnecessary most of the time...
Sonic Mania? Appeared as a cool boss fight in Stardust Speedway, but had literally no bearing on the story.
Sonic Forces? It's not even the real Metal Sonic; its just an illusion.
The Archie comics also had so many different Metal Sonics until SEGA told them that there was only one Metal Sonic.
@@Wolfric_RogersSega of Japan told Archie that there is only one Metal Sonic because the ones in charge of both Sega of Japan and Archie (who are now Sega of Japan puppets) wanted to reboot the Archie Sonic comics even before the lawsuit due to greed and refusal to pay royalties. Ken Penders never claimed Shard yet they still killed him off anyway because you know? Spite towards others who are not even named Ken Penders and those who don't follow Pellerito and Spaziante's 'visions'
Mainly Mike Pellerito felt that there is "no use" for Shard outside Preboot and he and his friends are known for Sabotaging the Archie Comics even when Penders isn't around anymore
Shard is most likely Mike Gallagher's character, not Ken Penders' character and the character has way too many legal complications behind his development. If Shard is undoubtedly Mike Gallagher's baby, then it means he is a public domain character like Fiona Fox and all his other Sonic characters
Where do i read these comics and what order do you read all these is?
i think, at least in the games, metal sonic was an arc villian pretty much how in sonic 1+2 it was just eggman then 3 it was knuckles, the next one i believe was cd which was metal sonic, then adventure it was chaos, adventure 2 it was shadow, then in heroes we revisit metal sonic and wrap up his arc, then i havent played many of the others or was really involved in the fandom until generations but what i understand it was silver and shadow sort of then generations was pretty much just a celebration then forces was infinite which could have had better character writing and lastly sonic frontiers which was sage
all in all metal sonic, while i would love to see him return, probably wont unless we have more to explore of his character, but i would love to see a neo metal sonic boss fight in sonic shadow generations
Hmm I wonder how metal sonic's and sage's meeting went
I think Metal appearing in a future sonic movie would be great. We've seen robotnik try to fights sonic his own way, and even with the chaos emerald, it failed. The next logical step would be for him to come to the conclusion that if he cant beat sonic, then he should copy and improve upon him instead..
You forgot to cover the comic reflection from sonic IDW
Chaos Sonic's personality reminds me a lot of metal sonic 2.5 from the archie comics.
-powered by a gem
-weird quills for a metal sonic
-a similar personality, but more cocky and sadistic
-super short lived
-almost the only robot sonics that can talk
12:01 What I think Sega should do is give him a arc in SA3 where he comes to terms with not being the real Sonic and squash's his beef with Sonic and helps him in battle.
That would definitely be interesting to see!
i would love if sa3 had metal sonic's story
He went from a menacing opponent, to just a normal badnik.
Just wait until Metal Sonic's 30th anniversary comic, you'll be even madder.
I just want Mecha Sonic MKI and MKII to have a chance to shine again. I feel there is more that can be done with them instead of just reusing Metal Sonic over and over again.
They did bring back MkII in the Scrapnik Island comic.
@@jadendafinger *WE KNOW.*
But that's just a comic.
And it doesn't help he made a stupid SMBZ reference, too.
@@RoseSupreme Oh, you mean in the games then?
Also the SMBZ ref was silly.
So~ one thing I've wondered since the original Sonic CD, why did he have white eyes in game? His sprite had red so it wasn't a colour pallet limitation.
Either to make them a bit more visible or just an slightly earlier design
So if you didn't know the point behind metal not acting like the old metal is because he's looking for an excuse to try to escape😅 there's a bunch of fan theories going around about how metal is actually sonic and how eggman had killed everyone else and sonic tried to put himself back together but in some point he realizes that he cannot do anything else so sends his core back in time and it's here where we presume in the ark where neomatel finds the core in one of the Temple
This is where it diverges into many more examples of the theory but I'm sticking with the main theory
He absorbs the energy being low on power but then since that core is the same core he realizes and decides to check it out receiving code and messaging about what will happen but also incorporating into his design the metal virus making it to where he can regenerate and this is to the point where he gets extra missing pieces of the puzzle from the regeneration in specifically it has some line code inside it too which will state out the fact that eggman did not create metal what was the creation of Sonic teem
Truth be told I know the theory is all over the place but it's somewhere to start at least but if you tried digging deeper you would find about 50 of the different theories that all lineup but we're messing with a broken timeline already so you can't expect it to all make sense
But it's also touched upon the core theory and would make more sense from this video
czcams.com/video/jYdxXGz8A5I/video.htmlsi=awT1UpbfWYPLYPtG
If you continue that special version of metal I think you called a chaos metal
I can never seem to get the name of it
The reason it was a one-off was because of what it really is that was the full theory put into power neometal metal chaos metal what do you get when you fuse all of their Best traits nothing good I'm telling you this now nothing good
But there is a fun design out there that does fuse all of them together that was made several years ago and I feel like we have not seen the end of this seriously how many one-off characters are there
The fact that I agree with this whole video gives me comfort knowing that Metal got SERIOUSLY underhanded… he was a great idea, his concept, the rivalry, the fact that he can do everything Sonic can, to the point where he actually won sometimes, to being nothing more than a souped up Badnik… makes me feel bad for him. I hope he gets some sort of recognition later in the future.
I’d like it if it happened, but I can’t see mental in the new movie without dragging the story
First time I saw him he takes things seriously I like it when he was the master mine on sonic heroes🎉 6:40
What themes did you use for the start of this segment 2:18 ? This is my jam!
"Work it out"
Thank you, bro! I look forward to more of your content!
The metal sonics/mecha sonics do need some more love. But they have also been around forever. I kinda want to see a return of Silver Sonic. Archie Comics gave him 2 new versions that were pretty awesome and i like that they were also massive. Though a Sonic sized one with a new personality would be fun. I could see a Silver sonic with stealth abilites, a spy unit as a fun twist to him and even one that pulls off an Emeral and trys to learn everyone's abilities or at least analyze them to be used for upgrades or other badniks. Metal also needs to be kept consistant personality wise. Keep him smart.
3:28
Tbf, they both have Metal for Nostalgia bait. Just one is more appropriate for the game than the other.
Metal sonic always has been my favourite villain and character
Aside from CD, Heroes, the Super Neo Metal arc and the Metal Virus saga Metal Sonic has just been lame, those 4 time are the only ones in the canon where he was compelling and worked well. He's been used in so many spin-offs and short stories/comics in which he was pathetic and nothing more than a minor inconvenience. Every time he appears for no reason and just loses to Sonic and the gang it just diminishes his impact as a villain, Metal has no screen presence now, when he shows up I just sigh, crack my knuckles and think "OK, let's get this over with loser". I bet most people don't even know he's canonically part of Sonic Colors and that you beat him 6 times in a race in that game, plus he gets clapped on the Rise of the Wisps short film.
TL:DR: For me Metal became lame due to meaningless overexposure. It doesn't help either that he's being treated as a joke a lot of the time, like in the IDW Classic special and Mania Adventures' Holiday episode.
Good video
If they wanted to get existential, Metal's arc going forward could dive in to his existence as an artificial copy whose primary purpose is to destroy the original. What is it like to exist as basically a murderous dark mirror? How does it feel to have your entire existence defined by this one specific individual you're supposed to kill?
My favorite metal sonic stories are the ones where he goes his own way or acts independently of Eggman. Sonic heroes, the sonic OVA, and Shard from the Archie comics spring to mind. I even like Chaos sonic from Prime because his ego and desire to “rebrand” shows a level of desire and personality outside of just following the chaos council’s orders.
Aside from the above instances, I’ve usually found metal sonic to be a bit overrated.
I liked Metal best in Sonic Heroes when he was above Eggman in command
sonic in general has an issue with it's villains since it sticks with Eggman similar to Mario with Bowser
I think Metal should have a arc where he splits off from eggman completely and create his own metal empire so that whenever we take a break from Eggman there's another robot overlord to fight against
I didn’t get to read all the comics. They look good though!
I think that metal will make another appearance in the comics where he gets tired of losing and gets a power boost and he's able to fight better
I think they should bring Neo Metal Sonic or something like him back
Metal sonic was really cool in CD and in heroes he did amazing
so to cut it short he got downgraded from eggmans second in command to just another boss fight that you battle quickly fight and then forget about like the egg dragoon or the death egg robot
Ok he is right on metal sonic after heroes but we can all agree that heroes made metal sonic asomwe his goal and motive are fantastic the only time he great is just heroes and the idw comic the battle of angel island
You know what I would love to see from Metal Sonic? I'd love to see him wanting to be better that his organic counterpart in every way to the point that he directly defies Eggman and acquires power for his own sake rather than Eggman, breaking away slightly from the Eggman empire and evolving independently from Eggman's influence. I know we got that in Sonic Heroes, but I feel that could be expanded and taken further. Maybe along the way his personal journey could prompt him to ask questions about what makes Sonic, Sonic, maybe even discovering a side of Metal that we as fans (and the characters themselves) never thought was there.
Of course the cold, intelligent and merciless aspects of Metal is kinda what I really love about Metal
Heh, u think Metal Sonic had it bad in IDW Sonic? I'd say he had it worse in Archie Sonic from constantly getting destroyed or blown up. Well, specifically, the one made by the 2nd Robotnik, the original Metal Sonic aka Shard, is a whole other different story. At least Metal was handled a little better in Archie Sonic's new timeline
The funny thing about Archie Metal Sonic was that he was the only version of Metal Sonic who was actually more powerful than his version of Sonic.
We saw him humiliate both Sonic and Sonic's even faster evil counterpart Scourge with ease (albeit not at the same time)
metal sonic is favorite character and i still my favorite!
For the longest time, Metal sonic has always been my favorite sonic character ever since I first got into sonic as a whole. Originally it was simply because I had a weird obsession with robots and I thought his design was the coolest of them all (which I still stand by, shadow is overrated af and I still say he's practically the personified blueprint for every angsty pre-teens edgy overpowered oc plz no stele)
However the more I grew the more I grew to love him as a character because despite that expressionless menacing Visage and the more often then not, silent foreboding lack of speech, he always showed massive potential, not just as a villain, but the potential to be one of if not the best written character in all of the franchise (which isn't that hard really as most characters in sonic aren't exactly the most deep in terms of motives and development tbh...)
So let's start with the villain aspect of him
Metal sonic, from a purely villain standpoint, is pretty terrifying.
He was made as the protagonists copy (before the term "fake hedgehog" was thrown around more then bead necklaces at a parade) that alone is a scary thought with sonic basically being one of the most powerful characters in the sonic universe. But metal took it a step further. He wasn't just sonics copy, but he was built to be sonics BETTER. In every conceivable way. Faster, stronger, more durable, he could fly, he could utilize abilities not even sonic himself had like the black shield, his chest laser, electrical charges and more. And if that wasn't broken enough, he eventually developed the ability to adapt. Learning and copying the abilities of other characters. (Not quite to the degree of Emerl, but pretty close)
There's a reason in the majority of media, sonic is RARELY if EVER able to beat metal sonic on a 1v1. There's always some third party or factor that results in metals downfall. Be it Eggmans gate at the end of sonic CD, or sonics numerous allies.
Chances are, if metal took the idea to re-activate every other sonic robot and/or robotic version of other characters, or just got put into a 1v1 deathmatch against sonic with no external factors, he could very well win. Sonic heros showed us just a fraction of the potential metal is capable of. But sadly now he's just a joke. No better then your average badnic. A punching bag for the cast as a whole.
But this is all just surface level villain portrayal stuff. Let's get onto the real meat of the matter (or... metal, in this case.)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The criminal misuse of Metal Sonic's character.
Metal may not seem to have that much of a character at first glance. He has no facial expressions, no real goal passed whatever Eggman tells him to do, and rarely even a voice.
However... that hasn't stopped moments of personality peeking through the cracks of his cold robotic exterior
Metal sonic as a character, is an impossible tragedy.
Let me break it down for you.
Despite everything, metal is a deeply troubled individual. He was made as a better version of sonic. His soul purpose to beat sonic. His whole goal in sonic heros was to prove HE was the REAL sonic. But despite everything, he lost.
He was forced to realize... he's just a copy. Not only is his entire point for existing a lie, but he never could live up to his purpose of beating his nemisis.
He's stuck in this perpetual loop of trying desperately to validate his existence. His purpose for being. But he can't. It's probably the worst torment imaginable. Being constantly stuck in someone else's shadow to the point where you yourself are nothing without them, you can see why he has such a hatred of sonic, one thats gone long passed the point of "just because he was programed to". Because by design, he is nothing without him. Everything he is is derived from sonic. Even if he did win, even if he did beat sonic, he would still be haunted by his own meaningless existence and lack of self.
You can see glimpses of this dilemma when shadow extends his hand in peace, offering Metal the chance to become something more then just a weapon. Or when Metal battled Shard for the last time, he hesitated striking the killing blow once shard told him there could be more to life then just "priority one: hedgehog"
But ultimately... he never could escape that shadow. He never could manage to move on and find his own purpose. His own self. Be it because of being unable to let go of his hatred, and/or because of Eggmans programming or otherwise preventing him from doing so.
That's the true tragedy of metal. Something nobody really seems to utilize.
I feel if given the chance, metal could become a force for good. He could become his own being. His own person, and step out from being just an accessory to sonic or Eggman respectively.
But sadly... till then, he's just another punching bag. Just another badnick. Just another one liner contrast to sonic, all in all, Just another joke...
Edit: Another thing is despite everything, metal probably feels indebt to Eggman for his creation, hence why he sticks around.
It's like darth vader and Palpatine
Metal has nothing else. Even if Eggman can be abusive, controlling, and manipulative, where gamma had birdie, omega had team dark, and shard had his own gang of freedom fighters... metal has nothing.
Hence why he feels committed to Eggman despite hating him at some points. That's all he knows. That's the closest thing to a purpose he has.
It's honestly sad.
The chad
He always come back even though he gets beat up, never giving up
In Sonic 4 Metal got his own 4 level playable episode, and chased Sonic throughout the game for three different fights. I wouldn't say that appearance was "just thrown in". He was a major part of the story there.
He was also the core antagonist in Knuckles Chaotix, appearing throughout the game and serving as the final boss.
Now, Generations, Mania, and Forces he only really served as a one off boss fight, true. And in other games his appearances are often relegated to just Easter Egg, or a multiplayer character, but I wouldn't ignore Chaotix or 4 as both really did utilize Metal.
Little does he know chaos sonic comes back next season
to be fair regarding the comics, I think its just that Metal was never needed for the stories the writers wanted to tell. For the imposter syndrom arc where Metal was being beaten by surge and kit. Metal was not the main antagonist, Surge and Kit were. So it makes sense that they are the most threatening force in their own arc. To have Metal be this high threat that demands attention would go against the story being told. And the writers did go out of their way to equip Surge and Kit with the tools to counter Metal without being objectively stronger, which is smart if you want to avoid power creep. This can also apply to chaos sonic where he shows up and plays a role, but just isn't the priority. Afterall, metal being the be-all-end-all for antagonists would limit the story being told.
Thats not to say that he doesn't have potential thats being unused, or that their using him in ways that diminish the impact he has. But I think its very obvious what the writers wanted and why they use him in the way they did.
I’m just sad that the other Sonic bots don’t appear as often because of him. I wish Metal, Sage, Silver/Robo and Mecha could all appear all alongside each other.
oh Yes my favourite killer machine is finally getting some attention
Maybe the next movie will change this
Maybe with a New design metal could be more loved. Since sonic's design is appearently all about Christmas, why not make metal Halloween purple and orange with pink eye! Hear any takers?
Not gonna lie, back when I played Sonic & Knuckles 3 on my Megadrive (Genesis), I thought Metal Sonic was the final boss of Knuckles' story part, the one using the Master Emerald to gain super form. It's only when Sonic Adventures released on Dreamcast that I learned it was Mecha Sonic, and Metal Sonic was actually the bad guy of Sonic CD, a game I never managed to put my hands on. What I learned from this video is that the character is much, *much* more defined in the comics, and since I only acknowledge the games as canon, this lead to Metal Sonic fans having expectations way beyond my own. I do consider the character as a very powerful antagonist, but because so many characters are now able to reach Sonic's speed easily (Shadow, for one), his main quirk is not at valuable at it once was.
I hope the movie will make metal sonic him again
I really wish they would build him up as a bad ass villain again
Maybe time for Metal to get a permanent upgrade into Chaos in the main games.
First to see this awesome video
Currently, the only things he can learn are his neutral sister Belle and his ally sister Sage. All the more because neither of the two sisters are belligerent.
He needs other metal series like metal knuckles and metal tails debuting in super stars and metal amy As pointed out by daniel barnes
I only partake in the games. My opinion is that specifically Metal Sonic is over used and just kinda thrown in often as a, “hey remember that race in Sonic CD?” Or “hey remember metal sonic? Fight him cus.” With no real impact to the story and no sense of, “wow he’s a threat.” Most of the times.
I liked it much better when every sonic game, there was a newer model of ‘anti sonic’ robot. The tiny silver 1. The upgraded normal sized silver 1. Metal sonic. Than mecha sonic from Sonic & Knuckles (my personal favorite design) which used to be that silver sonic or so i heard. TECHNICALLY shadow counts as an anti sonic robot too. And than yes the 1 upgrade to metal sonic in Sonic Heros.
Seeing these differing, advancing robots to be anti sonic was epic and ever changing. From a doinky little robot who served almost no threat. To several who could rumble with sonic or match his speed. As well looked more and more like the real sonic (besides Mecha’s eye bar).
Also in ascetics & story Metal Sonic was made sleek and fast with the purpose of racing, not fighting sonic. Where as the others were made specifically to fight sonic. So it just kinda bugs me when they use un-upgrades Metal Sonic to FIGHT sonic instead of race him. I think mecha should be used in fights and metal in races. Giving us a bit more of variety.
Maybe even give them new moves, weapons, something. Some sense of, “oh cool he’s upgrades!” Or “i didn’t expect that.”
#NewViewer BTW💙💚♥️🖤😎
Do by any chance make what if vids about Sonic??! I’m sure people would live these because Star Wars What iFs are not now. (There’s already plenty of What iFs for Dragon Ball Z do why not Sonic What iFs??)
Welcome. And I haven't made any types of those yet but I've thought about it.
As cliche as the body-swap plot is, I think it’d be pretty awesome to see with Sonic and Metal as the recipients.
There’s a question. What happens when Metal learns what being the “real Sonic” means? And how does Sonic work a Metal body?
metal is my fav sonic character
In sonic forces Infinite had Metal's usual role of the dangerous right hand of the main villain
What's even worse in forces is how they did chaos.
They showed Chaos in the opening scene and mention him a few times, but did nothing else with him, there isn't even a boss fight. Considering Chaos is an ancient diety who can destroy entire nations, and alot of knuckles' lore comes from Chaos. They really can't just make him a lesser side character