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Tutorial Ep 2 of 2 - The Top Mistakes to Try and Avoid When You Begin Building Guitars
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- čas přidán 13. 08. 2024
- Welcome to Crimson Guitars czcams.com/users/CrimsonC... and welcome to another tutorial from Master Luthier Ben Crowe at Crimson Guitars in the UK. www.crimsonguitars.com
Following on from the previous video: • Tutorial Ep 1 of 2 - T... , so many people commented with their own mistakes, that Ben decided to make another episode sharing more experiences.
Chapters
0:45 Learn to recognise when you are tired
1:47 Beware in attaching the wings to the neck joint if not flat
3:07 Get diamond stones
3:50 A mistake is an opportunity to learn - don't worry
4:38 Don't put a single-action truss rod in upside down - or forget to put it in
5:26 Design the whole instrument
6:31 Don't forget to install the ground wire
7:14 Don't put the body on the bench you are working on
8:29 Don't rush anything - especially the finish
9:48 Measure twice then stop and think through your measurement
11:29 Learn not to jump the gun - don't rush out and buy tools
12:31 Make sure you are following the right plans
12:51 Don't clamp without a caul on both sides
13:32 Don't lay your work on a dirty table or mat
14:28 Make sure you rout your cavities on the correct side of your work
15:07 Learn how to solder correctly
15:15 Conclusion
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Stay tuned and stay awesome!
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Please continue to tell us about your mistakes in the comments below.
I'd love to see a "Horror stories and advice" series. Every now and then pick a couple of stories of mistakes viewers have sent in (or even mistakes that happen at crimson) and tell us how you would go about rectifying the mistake.
@4:20. i have been tagging along and working construction with my father since i was a toddler. im now nearly 40 and my dad passed last year, but one (of the many) sayings that have always stayed with me was that one. "the best carpenter out there make all the same mistakes as the worst one, he just knows how to hide them"
deth502 same here!
I worked with a carpenter for a number of months whom I learned the wonderful phrase, "A little caulk, a little paint, makes a carpenter what he ain't" from.
"That'll do is not good enough, especially when you're talking about joints."
I couldn't agree more.
Enjoyed this video and its prequel, well done. Our woodwork teacher drummed into us a variation on your advice... "Measure twice, cut once". Another one is "Buy cheap and buy twice". Applies to tools and materials.
Thanks for all your helpful work.
Would love to see a soldering tutorial from James! Love your videos (and James' camera awkwardness), and it is something I, and I'm sure a lot of other beginners have low confidence in. Cheers and build on!
"Precision of thought" --- excellent, excellent phrase and good advice. Dammit Ben, I've cut this thing three times, and it's still too short ... ;)
I have seriously learned so much from your videos....I'm a novice at guitars....I've done woodworking my whole life....been in rock bands my whole life....just started building guitars....I live in the US but want so badly to come take a class so badly from you!
when polishing scratches out of a very scratched non-standard scratch plate, make sure the buffing pad completely clears all the areas regularly or else one spot gets constantly buffed and then melts. Don't then try and flatten the bending hot plastic out with clamps when the wood protecting said plastic from the clamp isn't perfectly flat. et viola! one wood patterned area of non-flat scratchplate.
I usually quite enjoy wiring or rewiring my guitars. I just did a custom wiring on a cheapo SG the other night.
I switched the smaller diameter Volume pots to larger diameter 1's, swapped the Tone pots out for Push/Pull Switch pots, Tone 1 is Phase I/O & T2 is a Series Parallel switch.
I am awaiting the PIO Caps to put in, just used the old Poly Caps temporarily until the PIO's arrive.
I am also about to buy a Dominger Pickups "Desert Eagle" set to put in my Dean Razorback, & the pups from it will go into my cheapo SG, that also needs a refret. She ought be pretty nice when I finish her.
I want to put an SD Nazgul bridge bucker in my Yamaha RGX1212S, & have a kit SG guitar in storage to get back out soon & finish building with an EMG 85/60 Active set. I intend to make a "Goth SG" using a Black stain (I have a Dop Dyes Fabric Dye set that is UV Fade Resistant for that), then finish with possibly a Satin Shellac type finish (does the Satin Shellac type stuff guve a kind of "Pearlescent Sheen" that is more Matte, rather than High Gloss? Because that Matte Pearl type finish atop the Black-stained Woodgrain is what I'm after).
Man, you do an excellent job, too, btw. Top notch work. I love it!
Mate, I'd love to work for/with you, but am Australian, so it ain't really feasible. LOL
I bet you're a great boss, & definitely an excellent teacher.
I am learning sooo much from your videos. Thank You!
I am actually also a self-taught multi-instrumentalist & home Audio Producer currently working on recording a few of my Chaos songs.
I combine a lot of Classical with various genres of Extreme Metal for my own interesting flavour & unique style. 🤘
When building a neck from scratch, out of a blank, NEVER do the fretboard leveling / fret job before having carved the back at least roughly!
Just to be on the safe side, and especially if it's a one-piece maple neck. Always do the rough carving first, which is even more important when you're removing a larger amount of wood. Then allow the neck to "settle" (for the lack of a better word), because it may want to release some of its structural "tension" - thus changing its shape.
I ended up having a roller coaster type of fretboard once, because i did it in the wrong order. The neck has even developed a slight bend toward the treble side... a very, very unpleasant surprise indeed!
(It was still usable, after some extensive fret leveling, but far from perfect aesthetically...)
Absolutely right about the mistakes life is a learning curve.A friend of mine managed a glass replacement company.His theory was if we are not breaking any glass we are not selling any glass.
It's 02:06 and I laughed loud enough to unsettle my neighbour's dog. Bravo, Sir!
Soldering electronics etc. by James => PLEASE deliver. Definetly not my strength. I'd so appreciate a bit of help in a video tutorial. I made a bass with soap pickups and a musicman control plate and I have a lot of issues with shielding and even with the diagram followed i'm not sure what i did wrong, squeeking etc.
Ben, totally agree with experimenting first on something cheap. On of my first fret levelling and reprofiling jobs was not good; fortunately I realised this when I tried to play the guitar, so it was a simple case of removing the strings and finishing it off properly. It was my own guitar, and it was a Chibson. Had it been an expensive instrument belonging to a customer the story would have been different because he would have noticed the mistake not me. With luck he would have brought it back and I'd have put it right. On the other hand he could have decided I was incompetent and taken it somewhere else, in which case I would then have lost the customer, plus any referrals.
Funny you brought up nevk angles. Just put an Ibanez 450 dx neck on an Ibanez 370 body. The neck angle went down toward the body. A shim on the bridge side of the neck heel made the neck way to high. Only 2 solutions. File out the cavity or file down the bottom of the heel. The heel sounded easiest. I got lucky. Glad I checked kept checking after filing a small bit. It doesnt take much to make a drastic change. Having a floyd rose adjusted with the pivot points sticking a half inch or more high is an epic fail. I'm not planning to build guitars from scratch any time soon. Kits are kind of costly. I am finding it better to get scrap parts or beat up old guitars cheap and completey customising/referbishing them. Love your videos. Get tons of good tips and info. I'm sort of the opposite of you as far as wiring and electronis. I do custom electronics or whatever. Used to get called to help a friend who was a world famous guitar manufacturer in California to do electrical. The most interesting thing in his shop was how he made the machine to make conical/compund radius necks. Simple but genius. Using go-cart wheels for the sanding belts was part of that genius. Back in the 70's you didn't just go out and buy these things, you made your own.
I bought some alcolin from you to adhere a burr walnut veneer to the top of a tele build.After 3 days in a veneer press and a couple of days further drying stained it with your stunning stains.The stain seemed to pass through the veneer and broke the bond so the veneer lifted in places.I ended up removing the veneer which was quite easy.On the head stock I had used Gorilla glue which wouldn't come off and I had to sand it off.On my second build I used gorilla to stick a flame amapa veneer,same process,stunning stains again and the veneer stayed flat.
Drill a big enough hole for the size screw you're using to mount the bridge, strap button etc. particularly if using a powered screwdriver. A snapped screw in a newly finished body can be a real downer!
This video is coming at the right time. I'm already modifying my first guitar and will be moving into building soon.
A soldering video would actually be super helpful.
Oh and also agree with soldering, many people don't do it properly. Fortunately my first job was building circuits and there were no PCBs in those days so I had it drilled in to me.But I have seen an otherwise very good video on CZcams, about how to wire up a Strat, and the guy was melting his solder straight onto the point of the iron, and carrying it to the joint, every time. (I won't embarrass him by posting the link).
Lesson 1: When troubleshooting a problem step back and look at the instrument as a whole and look for the simplest explaination for an issue first. Lesson 2: Make sure your neck is completely screwed in.
Story: After watching several CZcams videos on guitar setup for a year, I decided to try it on my MIM Strat which hasn't seen the inside of a shop in 12 years. I took it all apart cleaned it up, leveled and dressed the frets, and put the neck back on. I had masked the frets and didn't remove the tape before reattaching the neck and some of the tape was in the neck pocket and wouldn't come off. It was nearing dinner so I rushed took off the neck, removed the tape, put the neck on, applied a coat of oil, and left for a bite. I came back later in the evening and strung the guitar and found it was fretting out at the 7th fret. I tried adding my to the relief which got me a couple more frets. I upped the action which got me one more fret. Finally I thought it was my fret job, so I took a litle more off from the 12th fret down. That didn't work, so I did what any beginner would do, and took some more off. Still no good. At this point I had the bright idea to actually research the issue, but to no avail. After a week of looking around I was holding the guitar in my hands, about to give up and take it to a proper shop, when I finally noticed the neck wasn't proper secured in the pocket. After tightening the screws all the way the instrument played beautifully (especially above the 12th fret).
I don't usually say this about your work but,this guitar is beautifully built. Bravo my friend.
I found it
Telecaster is a nice guitar because there "forgetting" a ground wire under the bridge is actually correct :)
I agree with the fellow whose advice was about laying everything out before you touch tool to wood. i built a Firebird-type guitar with vibrato based on a neck-through blank, not realizing that it would have zero neck angle even though the Firebird requires neck angle for the TunaMatic + stoptail setup. My choices were: 1. Junk the whole thing and start over; 2. create neck angle by planing the lower bout off; 3. using a zero-angle-type bridge, and 4. removing the fretboard and shimming its entire length up. Options 1, 2 and 3 required changes that violated Firebird specs, so I chose option 4, and it worked out all right. But I didn't enjoy taking the fretboard off, and I very nearly ruined it in the process. And creating the shim to underlie the entire fretboard was a feat of engineering in itself.
When shielding your control cavity, make sure your electronics don't ground out on the foil. Or what to do if it does.
Was redoing an Epiphone SG I bought as a project guitar, and shielded the internals. Plugged it in, and nothing afterward. Heart sank through the floor. I'm in IT, so troubleshooting comes second nature to me. Volume pot was too close to the side of the cavity, and was touching the shielding. Some electrical tape on the side of the pot later, works like a charm.
This happens to me every time I mod a guitar. I should have learned by now
10:00 Yes.. In fact, sometimes you can be SO focused on one task/area that you can forget to step back and evaluate the whole thing. Always rethink ^^
i remember doing a structures(metal repair for bullet holes etc)on aircraft if you made a mistake the instructors favourite comment was"mike that stands out like a racing dogs bollock" never forgot that guy or what he taught me
+1 for learning to solder properly. I recently bought an inexpensive LP copy with shockingly bad soldering (& other issues, LOL), so the tone controls didn't work at all...
I'm planning to pull the whole thing apart, then treat it as a kit guitar to try & get it usable.
I just received my Japanese rasp file. A great tip and a great tool, it's easy to control and use. It also removes a lot of material quickly as you said it would.
Loving my new addition to my CG tool collection.
Thanks Ben :-)
+dogboygerry I love those rasp files.
Bens advice is right but when it comes to the rasp file I say just get it, i guarantee you will find uses for it.
+BobTC22 Yeah ! That saw rasp Shinto makes is *just* amazing !
If only they'd find a way to build a curved one..
Hurray! Thanks for the mention! :)
ha.. I decided I was done with work for the day so I figured I'd do something more productive.
In the comments of the video preceeding this one, I spent probably 45 minutes vomiting out this and that about my early and ongoing experiences guitar building... and only THEN I noticed this one and the Buying Basic Tools vids were available. :-)
The other post is holding up so far, hope it doesn't seem too redundant after I watch some more of your content. :-/
Enjoying these and finding them useful so far. Thank you for posting this material.
Make sure your router bit is in the right place, take the nut off feed the bit all the way through the collet and tighten it GOOD.
If you like to plan stuff with cad for example it is good to draw every single effing bolt, nut, tuner, screw and part where it need to be. When i was designing my third guitar, i drew in the measurements and placement of the bridge.. but not the bridges mounting posts... Now when you open up the control cavity you can see a third of a mounting post sticking out.... :^D
I have ocd tendencies therefore i can never say "that'll do", if fact nothing will ever do and i totally agree about full scale plans, which are actually fun to make. I only build a few guitars a year and make them all at the same time, therefore plans are essential, otherwise you might do what i once did and cut the end off an already prepared fingerboard, thinking it was the one i had to cut down for a 21 fret neck. Sad.
Thanks for sharing. Better to learn from someone else's mistakes.
thank you Ben. yup tired equals mess up
Heh.... precision and accuracy are not the same things... The story about measuring twice and milling on the wrong line shows this: the hole is precise all right, but in the wrong place.
Rushing doesn't pay, that's the truth: if you don't have time to do it right in the first place, how will you have time to do it over?
i will be in touch about a double cut away t type. great video from a premier builder
Hi Ben, loving the videos as always. I found another CZcams resource that deals with the dark art of guitar electronics, schematics, pickup configuration and custom wiring mods. Have a look at benja toneworks. Just thought I'd share with the class.
Have a great day all :-)
Sorry it's Breja ToneWorks
Yes you are and all are right. I am starting out and patient and forward thought.
I am currently building my first guitar and a mistake I just made was to use water thin ca glue to glue in my string through ferrules. I had my body sitting on some bench cookies and the glue went all the way down the holes and glued the body to the bench cookies. I was planning on finishing it today but instead, I had to sand it down again and now I am waiting on paint to dry.
I am sorry - but you have to admit that in years to come this will be a very funny story. I hope the build goes well from now on. DC
Seymour Duncan has great wiring diagrams free on line.
For anyone else that sees, this is true. Now, you can even punch in pickup, pot, cap, etc info and it'll generate a custom schematic for you.
I am wondering about Printable Hemp Fibre guitars... ?
I'll just leave that thought there for ya! 😅
How much is your jumper buget?
Experience is learning from your mistakes. Education is learning from other peoples mistakes.
Remember; if you have the time and money to do a job twice, you had the time and money to do it right the first time.
I'm going to write these on my wall! B
Sometimes you just have to risk it and build outside of your comfort zone or you will never get better. I do subscribe to having full scale plans though.
Halloo there!! I'd be willing to bet my shares in MPs that you'll be surprised at a comment on a 4+ year-old video!! That being said, the blessing *AND* curse of PooTube is like the slogan for Las Vegas: "what is posted on PooTube, *stays* on PooTube"!! -- Was reviewing a few of my research-type viewed vids and came across the pair of gems from 29 Jan & 05 Feb of 2016, which I re-watched (you're welcome!) just to see if I could predict what knowledge might have escaped my narrow-minded grasp the first time 'round..... All valid points and good advice, but every time you mentioned the "measure, measure, cut" mantra, in the back of my (mostly) hollow skull I would hear my ol' Irish Granddad saying, thru sideways grin, "There's only TWO ways a job can be done; *right*, and *again*!!" -- Also, the "measure twice, cut once" mantra has another line: "cut long; you can always sand or file, but they quit making wood stretchers a decade ago"!! (Oh; and in one of your 2016 vids, either the 29 Jan or one about "the cost of tools to get started building guitars", you said "I miss my shed"..... Well, you have a new one now-- don't disappoint!! Blessed Be, & Peace!!
I messed up a guitar by drilling through the body when drilling the holes for the pick up screws. Measure twice cut once is still new to me ;-)
I had a router bit come loose and went way to deep, all the way, while I was routing the LP selector switch hole.
+christopher berthelet That makes my 2mm small hole a lot less bad. Man that sucks!
I do actually have the same problem with router bits coming loose in my router. I just keep on checking them every 30 seconds.
It was on a black&decker router, I still have it I just use more force to tighten it when I use that router. I actually recommend that we use plunge routers for ease of use and better control of depth. And yes I check it frequently just incase.
+christopher berthelet I had that happen to me once when I was fairly new to using a router, and the grizzled old guy I was working for showed me a tip: slide the shank of the bit into the collet as far as it will go, then pull it back out about 1/8 of an inch (roughly 3mm.) Then tighten the collet as usual. Most bits have a slight radius where the shank meets the cutting head, so pulling the bit back out of the collet a bit before tightening it ensures the collet is tightening around the shank of the bit and not that radius.
+Mark Lindsay Thanks for that tip!
HELP! How can I remedy this? And why did it happen? I feel like it shouldn’t have been an issue. But.. Here’s a fun mistake: routing roundovers on body, the bearing on the bottom of the roundover bit left a nice line around perimeter of body where it rode along when routing. And it’s been ridiculously difficult to sand out. Is this a common problem? It’s a first for me. And not my first time using a bearing bit router.
Another great video.
Thanks Ben!
It took me 2.5 years of going to college to get electronics, given the basic stuff can be learned in 1.5 years of focused studying.
When I work on a left-hand guitar I have a small sign that says LEFT that goes wherever the instrument goes to remind me.
Dude, if Stewie became a luthier, you would be him... Or he would be you... 😂
Use color coding for your lines
Ben could you do a video on fret spacing? I've looked all over CZcams and all I can find are people saying to use a jig or a fret calculator if you do this video you might be the first to give a real explanation. thank you for all your videos and all your inspiration .
What would you like to know?
If you want an explanation about the way notes relate you can use google and you'll find a ton of information!. Here's one good explanation: musicmasterworks.com/WhereMathMeetsMusic.html
If you combine this with frets it's actually quite easy. You shorten the length of the string and therefore the frequency will increase. This will increase the pitch.
The mathematics are pretty complicated. It's easier to print a full scale template of the scale neck you're building or just go to the Stewart Macdonald site and use their fret calculator. Nothing to it.
Ben actually does mention this a couple times in some earlier videos, some of the books he has have charts for spacing of different scales, and he's marked them up because of an "error" reading it when he built his first guitar... I think if you look up the Crimson podcast where he shows his first guitar he explains it.
Hello there,
You mentioned 2000 grit diamond stones. I haven't encountered them yet. Usually they increment 300, 600, 1200 or something similar. There is also 8000 grit which is said to be closer to 3000 or something like that. If you only have a stone that is around a 1000 than what you mention is a problem otherwise not really I think.
I also have a fancy water stone 3000/8000 but it needs constant attention from my coarse diamond stone so I'm thinking of just not using it anymore for final honing and just use leather strop.
You also say diamond stones are expensive which could be true but depends on what you are comparing them to. One can buy a set of stones (300, 600 and 1200 grit) for around 120 pounds.
Anyway, I guess anyone has its own taste. Now go and flatten your water stones again :)
Thanks
+Petar Bogdanov He only uses diamond stones. He stopped using water stones for the reasons I wrote above.
Great videos man, ive been sitting here cleaning up my guitar and levelling my frets listening in to your tips.. really useful stuff.. Any tips for getting scratches out of a varnished maple neck fretboard, im too scared to attack it with wirewool and all that fine grit sandpaper.. is there a particular car polish or something i could use (available in uk) that doesn't cost the earth and use my dremmel or drll with buffer pads? thanks again :)
Depends how deep the scratch is. You could try any car rubbing compound for a shallow scratch. Brands I use are meguiars. Idk if it’s available in the uk. But any one will do really. Option B: drop fill it with more laquer, or possibly water thin ca glue, tape off the surrounding area, and sand it flush. Or tape a razor blade on both sides, only exposing the middle, and shave/scrape it flush. Gluboost is a product commonly used for filling small imperfections. It would work for this.
I tattoo from 1:00 pm till 3:00 am then build guitars till 7:00 am then get up and do it all over again and build guitars from 6:00pm till 6:00 am on sundays and mondays. If you want to get good at junk you gotta put the time in.
I dug two holes because the first one wasn't big enough. I'm going to learn to solder, honest.
I know the feeling! B
Hey Ben, do you sell wiring diagrams you can follow without a degree in electronics?
ok this a old video, but i will say i am not entirely sure its the glue. my brother used gorilla glue on a 3/16-1/4 inch zebra board, used clamping block of wood to clamp it, didnt protect it with anything, when he went to unclamp it, he ripped off chunks of the zebra grain, the glue seeped through the wood grain and glued the block to it, i am wondering how u clamped the fretboard. id experiment again with it, go step by step, see where u might have made a mistake
Can you simply ground a wiring of a guitar to a screw somewhere inside the control cavity? Or does it always need to be grounded to the bridge?
It has to be the bridge, the point is to ground the strings basically.. B
@@CrimsonCustomGuitars thanks man. Love your show. You help me avoid air of mistakes.
i made it into the video, and yes that was a friend and not a 'friend' :P I would love to start building myself though
It relates to the old chessmaster's saying: An amateur tries to make better moves, a master tries to make fewer mistakes.
is there a cnc machine worth buying for around $500?
I don't say "That'll do".. I say "Good enough for the boys I go out with"... but never when I'm in my workshop!
It may be wood like joinery. But it's really like engineering, precision matters to the max.
When you make a mistake, and you will lol, try to make small mistakes.
It's all fun n nightmares. THINK before you do anything. get 3 conformations from your mind and NO you are doing it RIGHT. But you fuk up if it's your first. small things can be fixed big things it's money down the drain. There is never a rush in this game.
If you actually made a mistake, make it a feature 3:-) this happened to me a few times :)
i thought that you were wearing chainmail for a second haha
My mistakes, rushing the project. Luckily it's usually on my own builds.
Use dust collection especially if you use the same area ie. A garage or shedshed, for sanding as well as painting and finishing. As my father taught me learn from other peoples mistakes, there are more of them, try not to repeat them and learn from your own mistakes for you are certain to make whole new mistakes other than the ones you learn from. Thanks dad but as far as new mistakes I depend on God's grace that's why I learn from other people what not to do as much as what to do. Oh and seek wisdom pray for it and most importantly receive it and use it.
Cutting 2 left sides.
Full scale drawings are a must and if you can't draw it, you probably can't build it.
Very good point, I may quote you on this :)
Are you saying that those of us that suck at drawing should abandon the idea of building? Or, we should hire someone to draw for us?
+JB Red - I am not referring to a free hand work of art. I simply work with a yard stick and lay down straight reference lines to create a side view. Many people buy templates and follow them.
Good to know. I can't even draw a decent Snoopy. I figured there was no reason I couldn't follow someone else's diagram or template. Just wanted to clarify what you were getting at.
+Dave Lembo i hope you are wrong,if you cant sing it you cant play it, i would have given up playing thirty years ago best regards
Did you put on that sweater just so you'd have something to stick the microphone to?
Is "you'd" an accepted English contraction in the Queen's English?
Nimbly Where I'm from we use you'd. (I'm also from South East part of The United States)
Cole Williams Oregon. You'd is acceptable in American English.
you'd be surprised
NEVER POUR BOILING WATER ON YOUR HANDS
If you know how to shield the daylights out of the guitar, you can lose the bridge ground, and won't matter. My worst mistakes are not knowing when to admit, "I have f'ed this up too much to use, and I try to use the part anyway. It's hard to toss a top back or sides in the bin, but if you screwed them up, throw the damed thing away, suck up your lost time & money and make a new part. You are just sabotaging the entire job in the early stages.
Hey cool, i made it into a video :D
I never work on a guitar when I am tired or drank too much coffee. . .
🤕,,, and safety first!
There's always time to get it right the second time...
Absolutely, this is after all a hobby that grabs you and will not let you go! B
You will screw up, at least occasionally, even if you are experienced and know what you are doing.
The one about the milling machine makes me think. ERASE your mistake
how about you ask all of your employees about their biggest mistakes in guitar building? ;)
This guy should spend his time at Shakespearean drama rather than inflicting it on the viewers. Just tell the top mistakes new builders make and skip the repeated iPhone checking and posturing.
It looks like you're wearing chainmail.
LOL "If you are tired, you shouldn't be using an edged tool". You think that would be obvious...too many stupid trips to the ER. Bwahahaha
It must be the Italian in your heritage that causes all those fkups i bet.
DONT GET YORU HEAD TATOOED