Advanced Sci-fi Civilisations Too Stupid To Really Exist Ep.16 - Panem
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Who's next?
1. The Demons (Cowboys and Aliens 2011)
2. The Pakleds (Star Trek)
3. Bregna (Aeon Flux 2005)
4. The Machines (The Matrix series)
5. The Thermians (Galaxy Quest 1999)
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The Machines (Matrix) could be interesting.
please 4. the machines (the matrix)
The machines (Matrix)
Diet Skynet
1 that movie was stupid
"We join our heroine Katniss, a rebellious teen who rages against any and all authority figures" while showing her throwing objects at a cat.
So a certain Twitch live streamer -wink-
Are you doubting the authority of the cat?
What, you don’t see cats as an authority figure?
Let’s face it, Buttercup was the real dictator
KAT
I
NESS
XD
The problem with including gladiatorial combat is that most gladiatorial combat wasn't to the death. Gladiators were professional fighters, almost like modern MMA, and while there were times when they fought to death, most times it was just to blood. Some even gained fat so they could take a bigger cut, hence more blood, without threatening their lives.
A bunch of barely trained teens wouldn't put on a very good show.
the only people that were put to death during the games were criminals. gladiatorial deaths during combat were often accidents or that were really heated spats
As an academic historian of Ancient Rome, you are exactly right.
That's why the game masters manipulate the game to try and make it more entertaining.
@@stefanmakara373 In the same way a Minecraft admin just spam spawns a bunch of Withers because they can.
@@Mariodash23 At least then it'd be more interesting than the Hunger Games.
The actual Hunger Games werent made to keep the districts afraid of the capitol, they were made to literally pit the districts against each other. Can't organize against your oppressors if you are confused about who the villains are.
Not really tho considering they are forced to do it.
@@dreamsprayanimation Look at Panem and compare it to the real world. It's quite the allegory, the districts (nations) are pitted against each other while the people causing it live in luxury. No one fights back because they rely on the state for organisation
@@joshuabroaders6248 You really think so?
You think because one kid from one district killed another kid when they were both kidnapped and forced to fight to the death in the greatest waste of budget created by man, that the two districts they came from would hate each other?
How about any two that come from one district? There's supposed to be only one winner, you know. Would the killer be forgiven for his cold-blooded murder of his fellow citizen of the district he came from?
Here's the thing.
Everybody knows what the Hunger Games are. Complete nonsense, even in-universe. You can't blame anyone except those engineering the situation, who are untouchable. There's no misdirection involved. The Capitol doesn't talk about how this district screwed that one over. They just take their children and make them fight to the death.. The districts can't exactly fight each other because even if they do hate each other's guts, they have no militaries of their own. No ways to screw each other over.
They have neither the reason nor ability to turn against each other. They just watch as their kids die every time the Hunger Games come along, where all they can do is just stew in their own hatred and misery.
That is actually great and insightful, would you be interested in making contact with a random inspired person from the Internet?
that explanation would make sense if the capitol did it tru subversive means, but since they do it by force and with a lot of propaganda, even regular folk can see that this rivalry is artificial and only for the benefit of the capitol
Snow was sadly mistaken about one thing: hope isn't the only thing stronger than fear. There's also hate; you get enough people in society hating you, they won't care what they have to do to take you down. While it's true that hate far from the best option, in desperate times it's better than nothing.
that's kind of what happened in vietnam. There are interviews and historical assessments showing that a lot of the soldiers of the north vietnamese army weren't die hard communists but just apolitical/pro-democracy people who ended up joining the communists because of just how many damn bombs the US threw at them.
At some point you can have no hope for change and still be willing to give everything to either make it stop or die trying
That's why you lost the Galactic Civil War,a mix of ppl hating you and ppl hoping for a return to the Republic
Also the only true God Emperor is The God-Emperor Of Humanity not you Palpy
"An alliance built on hatred is a fragile alliance at best." Kreia from KOTOR 2
@@gregoryschweitzer1735 That is also shown in the Hunger Games
Hate can be a fantastic motivator for the right circumstances. Speaking from experience. And on the other side is love is also a fantastic motivator for action as well. Depends on the person and circumstances
The real fantasy of this society
Is that it lasted 75 fing year
That is about the lifetime a really oppressive regime.
Soviet Union had similar lifespan. China will probably last at least that long
Soviet Union endured 70 years, so...
By the way, your profile is cool as fuck, where did it come from?
@@mariano98ify Because outside the USA no other country challenged them
Panem is a stupid civilization that definitely deserved to fall apart, but honestly I feel like that’s the whole point, and I personally feel like it’s a sign of good writing on the author’s part. The dystopian government didn’t fall apart just because our heroes stood up, it was because the whole system was bloated and unstable. All it needed was one match to light the fuse and send the whole thing tumbling down, which is honestly the mark of a good dystopia.
This is why the books are so good in my opinion, even after all this time. It shows the natural progression of a rebellion at the hands of a cruel and bloated system that only cares about the upper class. Panem was doomed to fail because of its own callous nature.
Yes. But that doesn’t explain why it remained to long in power. People have rebelled against much less…
@@Anonymous-vr6ph there may be a few answers to this. Mostly coming out of the prequel book (I had only read the plot, not read the book as im not the target audience anymore) of the trauma panem took after the first rebel war. We get a glimpse of the capital starving when the rebellion came close to destroying it completely but due to the shear amount of lives lost, logistics and geography, rebellion's lack of education with district 3 being closer to the capital and being quashed easily (probably also with the help of some districts that didnt rebel like district 1 and 2 (also maybe 4 by switching sides as they also tend to get that special treatment)) would lead to a capital victory with 13 succeeding. We also get a little more insight into the contract the districts would sign which would lead to the hunger games... which was just as much devastating to the districts as it would be to the capital (with the original plan likely to rebuild the districts that fought on behalf of the capital and eventually to rebuild the districts who rebelled). Now its unclear if the districts had other jobs before the first rebellion yet district 5 being closer to the capital would probably be forced to become the energy sector with the majorly modified hoover dam. The capital was not even aware of the first couple of hunger games as it was a school project of snow and a character in that book as a capital revenge plot to inflict the most pain on the districts. Its clear the first 10 games do not go well for snow and he wasnt sure they would go on until the 11th game were tributes were treated much better and the propaganda was exactly what the capital wanted to eat up. The districts never recovered and grew up following the same propaganda
@@Anonymous-vr6ph Have you lived on Earth, honestly non of his criticism makes me think too stupid to exist, the "to exist" part being the sticking point" You know we live in a world where people sell other people, have whole systems of Government where someone literally inherit leadership roles. I mean what exactly is more absurd than things that have actually and still actually occur in the real world?
@@tinamoul Agreed. I don’t think it’s too stupid to exist, I actually think it draws various lines to our current world and history. But at the same time there are some aspects that are not really well thought and which would probably never happen or appear in our world. For example the Economic structure of the 13 districts. It is unstable and absolutely ineffective to produce only one good in one district and like one producing and working with wood. It shifts the balance of power to particular districts that inherit valuable resources like coal. If just one district that for example produces coal or smth would revolt, the entire economy would collapse. Thereby making it way more likely for certain districts thinking about using the power they have through their resources and using it against the system to get better living conditions or smth.
@@Anonymous-vr6ph I agree with you about the Economic system. A better way to have depicted the Capital losing it's manufacturing might, would have to just use the analog that occurs in the real world. Make the wealthy Central District company owners slowly over time outsource their manufacturing to the other districts to exploit the cheap labor, until one day they realize, most of the people keeping our lights on and keeping us fed are from these districts.
TLDR
Don't make the resource control something that was designed, but something that has occurred over time through corporate greed and labor exploitation
Gale also lost the love triangle battle for being the mastermind behind the evil double bombs that killed Primrose. He effectively killed Katniss' sister via war crime.
not really, though the movies suck enough as adaptations that you'd never know
What!?!?
I mean is it really a war crime if the Geneva Suggestions I mean Conventions don’t exist anymore
@@johnymustacioI never fucking knew till these comments what the fuck holy shit
the thing ive always had a problem is that beetee made those weapons too and she holds no judgement against him for it.
If you look at Roman history many many emperors were actually stupid enough to run their country like /b/ and then got couped by Generals with veteran legions. So this is a relatively accurate depiction of how Roman succession worked.
Praetorian Guard moment they where the biggest cause of emperor assassination yet no one ever abolished them
@@aoki6332well they are the army. How could you abolish your army? And if you abolish your army whats preventing them revolt right away? You just fired all the soldiers, no one left to protect you.
@@royhuang9715 the Praetorian Guard where not a army they where never mean to be one only a small group in charge of the Emperor Protection they just become so corrupted that they became the CIA
@@royhuang9715 and the army was still the Legion be that logic the us army is the CIA ?
@@aoki6332more like the SS. They were wild
They did get the girl a gun and it became Divergent.
True.
@@concept5631 I like to call Divergent The Gungirl Games.
@@mikevasquez1103 Fair.
Nice
divergent is even dumber, in terms of worldbuilding, it's set in chicago or something but the great lakes next to it is apparently a swamp for some reason????
You could have a field day with the civilizations and villains from Maze-Runner or Divergent. As a matter of fact, the whole YA-Dystopia-genre could probably pay your bills for an entire decade xD
Kinda glad that fad is over.
@@GhostLink92 me too. It was entertaining for a while, but then it became annoying.
YA?
@@InitialPC I think it's an acronym for Young Adult.
@@mightymartin4854 Exactly
The reason katniss ultimately ended up with Peta and not Gale was because in the book it explains that Gale invented a new type of bomb for district 13. One of those bombs killed katniss's sister. After that katniss blamed Gale for her sister's death and had nothing but pure hate for Gale.
From what I remember (having only watched a video on the books versus the films) while Peta and Katniss do end up together it isn’t happy and Katniss is basically dead inside from all that happened.
@@thomasraines1396 She ends up happy with Peeta actually. They both still have PTSD from what happened but after being against children for the fear of everything happening again Katniss comes to a point where she has two kids with Peeta after five to ten years and is still in love with him and says though it is tiring to still try to keep herself together life was so much worse before.
@@selcandagtr8565 oh alright thank you.
@@selcandagtr8565no she can't love anyone or be happy. They are two shells of people just existing. Not happy at all
@@highlandus she's as happy as can be after everything. the text supports my statement, her agreeing to bring life into this world is testament enough to her hope for the future of the world. i'd like to know why you think that way though?
I have read the book and I always cringed when I heard people say "Katniss is a role model".
Like especially for the books.
Spoilers ahead
Katniss is what actually happens when someone with no real heroic qualities is forced/made to be a hero by others while going through an obscene amount of trauma. I mean yes she volunteered instead of her weak and sick little sister sure, but everything that she does is for her and her family to survive. She is not very altruistic, forgiving, particularly clever or tactically gifted. I think she literally says something along the line of: "I'm not a hero, I'm just a girl that know how to use a bow and arrow." In the third book she risks the lives of her whole team and her best friend just so that she can kill Snow personally. She also voted to keep the Hunger games going but throwing in the people of the Capitol instead. She didn't even really know if Coin did the bombing she just couldn't see the difference between Snow and Coin and didn't care. In the end, she only has a loose grip on reality, frequent nightmares and only Peeta can understand her. Like not everyone is or can be a hero, they can be forced but that breaks people. I found that to be very refreshing take for a YA novel of all things.
Edit: SNOW NOT SNOKE *Facepalm* I can't believe I wrote that
@@lukamilosevic661
*points and laughs*
she only voted to keep the hunger games going for the capitol children to make it seem like she was in coins side. that’s how she lowered coins guard and was able to kill her
@@isaacwhy1178 Right, I was about to say, ha ha. Katniss is a very selfish character (the prequel novel about Snow even highlights several parallels between the two of them), and I agree with most everything in OP’s comment…except Katniss’s hunger games vote. That was a trick on Katniss’s part, not a genuine desire to prey on Capitol children. And with the assassination of Coin, the Hunger Games don’t go forward anyway.
I'm not entirely on board that only "heroes" can be role models tbh, I think that creates unreasonable expectations in people. Katniss is flawed but that doesn't disqualify her, there's enough to admire about her.
@@lukamilosevic661 how can you spell the n word without youtube deleting it?
Now this is a civilization that's been in need of a roasting for some time.
Amen. I'm so glad this episode's out.
It's the United States 50 years from now. Just use "California" or "New York" instead of Capital and there you have It: people who look and think weirdly, have no clue of what scarcity means, and are completly oblivious to what the government is doing.
TBH, the district system seems to be put in place to prevent revolts. One district revolting prevents it from getting everything it needs.
@@the11382 Oh I get the reasoning behind the district system. But ultimately the regimes oppressive policies and poor planning just guaranteed it's own eventual destruction.
@@bigbangrafa8435 what an ignorant thing to say. You need to get out of your little bubble because you sound incredibly stupid making massive generalizations about millions of people
"I've got a bow... none of this makes any sense."
Nice one
"I have an army."
"We have a Hulk."
She's basically Rambo but she (surprisingly) has less character
@@kimkillillasfuq8212 Its not surprising since the book (especially the hunger games part) is pretty close of rip off from japanese cult classic Battle Royal (and the book of same name). Quite often when they don't have ideas of their own for the story they also lack character creation or anything else that needs creative skills, inspiration and imagination (there are exceptions ofc.. but sadly Hunger Games hasn't struct much).
@@samamies88 I liked the weird aesthetic and unusual names in Hunger Games. I'll give it that degree of credit
One thing to clarify - the games are not thought of as to simply negate a rebellion - but to avoid that the districts band together and rebel.
A simple rebellion of a district is easily dealt with, but by putting up tributes from all districts this should also have them to be not supportive of each other.
But how? The capital has to outsource all of their resources from the districts, including food, electricity and nuclear weapons. Have fun ordering starving soldiers to shoot civilians.
we know, it's just that it doesn't make any sense because to everyone in panem it would be obvious that those youths are forced there with no possibility of escape or survival unless they kill everyone else there. Under such a massively repressive and violent government, i doubt it you would just never ally with another district because their poor kid forced to kill other kids ended up killing your poor kid forced to kill other kids.
@@navaryn2938 it should galvanize the districts against the capitol for exactly those reasons. you'd have to be genuinely crazy (or brainwashed, to a level that doesn't seem possible given the lack of investment and the constant brutality and poverty) to believe District xx is responsible for killing your child when everyone has to be coerced to participate by the capitol's soldiers.
@@navaryn2938 And yet, unionization efforts in the real world are stifled by this exact same idea. Hide wages, keep workers competitive, assure them that the moment they band together they'll be shut down. People really go off on the capitol for being comically evil, but it's not as if there's no logical framework to the concept. It's just taken to an extreme to make a point to the demographic the books are written for, which I think if anything makes it pretty poignant.
@@navaryn2938 some of the districts are treated better than others (namely careers), and some significantly worse (like 12), and hunger games showcase that inequality. Sure some of the kids are from extreme poverty, but not all of them, and the tributes from the wealthier districts do train for it and treat it basically as an extreme sport. And those from the poorer districts get food for their families in exchange for tesseracts. Also, if the tribute happens to win, they and their family will be set for life
Panem isn’t an ironic name. Panem means, roughly “as long as you keep people fed with bread, they won’t care what you do” mirroring how the capitol is kept happy, and ignorant
I mean, that's still ironic
on the Coal thing, you DO need Carbon (IE Coal) for the manufacture of a lot of things, particularly steel. It can also be used in the making of chemicals and Plastics.
So Nondescript Sci-Fi Future still relying on Carbon-based resources isn't _that_ far-fetched.
Also panem isn't actually all that advance when it comes to technology.
They do seem to be masters of biological manipulation, creating dozens of incredibly dangerous creatures and weapons.
And honestly the panem's military, is very much out dated with it clearly not being propperly maintained and they use conscripts wich is a shitty idea when you think about how 90% percent of your populace hates you, we know this to be true since the peacekeepers in district 12 are people from 12.
Also I doubt the panem has a propper military, they have a police force but lack anything in terms of heavily armoured vehicles and a pathetic air force.
If the oil has run out, coal can provide the hydrocarbons for the chemical industries, as well as limited liquid fuels.
@@pringlelingle6827 I think that writers did not know how real Militaries work.
@@MrChickennugget360 most likely true :)
@@pringlelingle6827 to be fair Panem doesn't have a military because it doesn't need to. It has no external enemies so the closest thing it has to an armed force is military police on steroids, which begs the question:
why dafug does Panem possess weapons of mass destruction (including AA guns and missiles ??) and then outsources their production to a far away region (which basically gives it huge leverage against the capitol).
Most real life dictators give extremely generous benefits to their military (and police) to prevent them from defecting but ensure that the high command is extremely chummy with the leader to prevent coups
When you realize the entire plot of the hunger games could have been undone by a 10 second delay on live tv
When fucking twitch streamers with an audience of a couple dozen can figure this shit out but a country ruled by professional manipulators can't...
I mean it's a rip off of battle royale.
@@wreathofpalmaria That too
@@wreathofpalmaria well exept that they came out before battle royale was a thing
So no
@@awcy6902 the first battle royale was released In 2000 8 years before the first hunger games book
The games existed to breed resentment between the districts not necessarily the capitol while keeping them fearful. A theme in the second movie is "remembering who the real enemy is." At face value, it is the districts against each other which is why it was effective until the revolution
yeah, but stealing their children to let them fight in a gladitorial arena would give them even more reason to band together because all districts have the same interest: "I don't want to send our children to die". What the Capitol should really do is divide and conquer. They should pit the interests of the different districts against each other creating infighting to make it easier to rule them. I know the games are supposed to do exactly that, but in reality they do the opposite... in the real world they would unite the districts.
Important to remember that some of the districts *did* actually support the games, trained for them rigorously, and viewed them as a badge of honor to play in. They very much viewed the others as competition and it played in to the ultimate enemy (The Capitol) being largely ignored for in-fighting. Meanwhile, District 12 was left intentionally weak.
It's assumed that everyone in Panem was against the games, but in fact, it's quite the opposite.
I've only seen the movies but my take was that President Snow was just old and bored and having a rebellion would give his life some excitement.
Oddball really changed a lot since that time his gang stole $16 million dollars worth of gold. Now he calls himself President Snow. I wonder what his war buddies would think of that. XD
#21
Raise the entrance age to 18, then order the contestants to fornicate with each other, nobody dies! Have an audience vote on the winner. Gods above how can you ruin pulp entertainment so fucking hard like they did in Hunger Games. Porn, it's porn, not blood.
@@teslashark How about not holding them at all…
@@Ballin4Vengeance porn makes money
That old man from Squid Game be like
Panem: is based off of bread & circus.
Also Panem: Does not provide bread nor proper entertainment for most of its people.
It just works.
'It just happens ok stop thinking and feel righteous anger against your parents.'
The entertainment is the hunger games, genius
In truth, it feels like the entertainment only works for the Capitol.
@@kat8559 not very entertaining.
@@kat8559 the operative word here is "proper".
katniss was a child who grew up to quickly to take care of her sister so I think calling her actions "selfish" just shows zero empathy for her
That's not how empathy works. You're thinking of sympathy. Empathy would recognize her behavior as selfish and afraid. It only means being able to identify with emotions in others, not understand their origin or give them a pass. Some of the most empathic people in tbe world are sociopaths and predators because they easily pick up on how other people are feeling. Yet, they are not sympathetic towards them at all.
I mean, Katniss is passive. She resists to join the rebellion for 3 or 4 movies, so it's hard to root for her. She's the worst type of a hero.
@@mishynaofficial People who resist things aren't passive. To resist is the opposite of being passive. Passive people quietly go along with what others want them to do. Katniss was reluctant to participate.
When I first read the Hunger Games, I didn’t think it made sense that the Capital could survive so long when they rely on the districts for everything, and they would fall apart if even one district stopped contributing. Then I realized the 1% exists
That means nothing. The real world isn't organized into districts.
@@NerdilyDonejust classes
@@jonathanwilliams2320& the classes are dependent on each other.
Businessmen can’t run their equipment without workers but workers can’t work without businessmen’s equipment.
The problem with the Capitol is they don’t actually provide anything to the districts, the districts are self sufficient.
The hunger games would have made a lot more sense if instead of only being in the capitol the Regime established itself in each district making wealthy areas in each district and allowing the inhabitants of each district the ability to join them if they follow the rules, that way there would be too much infighting between rebels & turncoats for the rebellion to start.
If by 'the 1%' you are referring to politicians, then, hell yeah, spot on. If you mean business men and women who provide us with 95% of the goods and services we want at - self-evidently - a price we are willing to pay, then I think the point was missed.
I like the way the deadly decadent Capitol in this seems like it's a parody of Hollywood.
Or the same can be said of whatever the Right-wing version of Hollywood is.
This kind of dystopia transcends political/Ideological frames... all become this as their logical results
@@dragonmaster613 man that's a lot of projecting you're doing there.
More like D.C.
@@dragonmaster613 i love how it's immediately assumed that someone criticizing hollywood being a shithole is doing so as a right-winger when hollywood has been a shithole for at least the past 80 years
@@Vooman apparently you can't hate rich coastal elites without being a conservative. Whoda thunk it
All of this stuff is why the writer said she intended the novel as a standalone work. The more she wrote the faster it unravelled.
Even as a stand-alone story it’s fucking awful...
@@FrankCastle-tq9bz have you read the book? the first one isn’t too bad
@@livispuzzled Nope and I do not intend to.
@@FrankCastle-tq9bz lol then you can’t properly call the series shit when you’ve only seen the movies. the books are SO much better
@@FrankCastle-tq9bz bruh moment
*listening to people explain why Panem is a terrible exploitative system that is ripe for labour strikes and revolution, and isn't clever enough in its totalitarian ways to stand up to said revolution"
me: thats...thats the point.
It dosent matter if thats the point because the writting and world building sorrounding the premise is not that good. The capitol and the hunger games are illogical to the point of breaking any sense of immersion.
@@loopygordoReminds me of another Country
Oh North Korea
Which is been going on for 77 years
Or the Roman Empire
Yk the thing that lasted 1000
Its supposed to be a stupid system that has gotten worse with time
However much like irl shit the fact this pits the districts against itself helps the Capitol not get all the Flak
Like 1 2 and 4 are hated by the other districts for that career pack and are often left in the dumps because of it
1 2 and 4 all gain from the system in a way and would see eachother as rivals
So they would want the system ongoing(more in the case of 1 and 2 its clear 4 is a 50-50) and are more likely distrustful of eachother
Literally anyone saying its so immersion breaking is brain dead
@@fate8718 Despite the whole thing, Rome is not Panem, Rome openly declared itself to be an empire, its control was military. The games in the arena weren't an attempt to pretend they weren't that, they were strange entertainment for strange tastes, and punishing conquered enemies was part of that. Panem is something else, people in Panem have to have a certain cruelty towards themselves, the flying games are a puncture, not a grotesque Olympics, it's worth remembering that in the original games everyone sort of died. The inspiration for this is The myth of Minotaur and Theseus. People let this happen, it just doesn't make sense, if the districts united just once, or just half of them, their entire regime would end, especially with that bizarre economy where each district specialized in basic items.
Ikr lol
To be fair I think the series was more about ideas and philosophies rather than an actual practical system
*"Your country's name is bread!"*
As a latin student this has bothered me for a long time
Ironic, is it not?
And they can't even get that right
Even France did not dare.
Honestly the "winners round" is easily the stupidest possible choice...
"Hey so people love the two lovers that overcame all odds and won together, let's kill them."
Yea I am sure that's gonna fly over super well, people are already rebelling, maybe don't add fuel when the country is already ablaze.
I don’t understand the point of these games in the first place - how does pitting a bunch of randomly selected kids in a death match going to stave off a rebellion? It’s like the “underpants gnomes” from “South Park...”
1. Pit kids in death match
2. ???
3. Stability for the regime!
@@FrankCastle-tq9bz At least with the games in general I can kinda see the angel.
Entertain the people, give peopel a chance to fight for a better live in luxury.
I mean it's still kinda stupid, Roman gladiators were not selected randomly from the population and most of the time didn't even get seriously injured (way to expensive to have your few mio fighter just die)...
It's heavily implied in Catching Fire that the third Quarter Quell was just a setup to kill off Katniss and Peeta before they started a rebellion. It's still kind of a stupid idea since that would just turn them into martyrs (and also it didn't work lol) but at least they had their reasons?
@@FrankCastle-tq9bz I'm pretty sure it was meant to crush their spirits? Something about showing them how powerless they are, I don't know. I think there's an explanation somewhere in the books.
the gamemaker was revealed to be working with the rebels. he might've come up with the idea to stir up outrage among the populace, and convinced snow by saying it would kill off katniss and peeta.
"your country's name is bread"
In all fairness, we live on a planet named Dirt.
Its...kinda worse when you name your country after a latin phrase, while simultaneously demonstrating you were too illiterate to understand what it actually meant.
@@TheThebigicePretty realistic for Fascists to hastily copy a Latin name
small nitpick at the end: a large reason (at least in the books) katniss went for peeta was because the bombing of the children (which included katniss's sister) was gale's idea and so she didn't like him for that
Anyone else remember when the guy who plays President Snow was presenting a Kids Choice Award and he started throwing blueberries at the audience? 😂
Are you serious?
@@michaelknox3715 Yeah it was like right after the first movie came out!
omg i remember watching that on tv 😭😭
What a chad
Honestly that's kind of funny and he's an absolute lad for doing that.
Speaking of gladiators,they could have had the hunger games.if people signed up instead of being chosen for rewards,money,or FOOD!
Well gladiator pay a lot and really good food in their time
And they rarely kill each other because it's too expensive kill trained slave
@@murder1625
Very true. I recall reading somewhere that free men sometimes fought in the arena too, for honour or money. If killing an expensive slave is bad, killing a free Roman would be suicidal, so fighting to blood was likely the norm.
@@freman007 only criminals were sentenced to death fights or other activities in the coliseum that resulted in death.
Roman gladiators were proud of the whole thing, even if they were slaves, because they made a name of themselves. Hunger Gmaes are just sadistic without the pride or the quick fights
That "if it weren't for the baby" moment gets me in the books and films. They send 12 year olds to the slaughter. But much like the real world, least US, we can't handle the thought of a pregnancy threatened, not even about the young woman they think is pregnant. It's brilliant but reveals some truly disgusting stuff in a series already built on a disgusting society.
Yes, it's really disgusting. In this series and in reality so many people care more about the well-being of an unborn child instead of that of the mother. I don't understand how people can just disregard a person like that.
@@b.h.4249 Because it's about a warped sense of possession rather than a genuine care for the fetus. Once that fetus becomes a young kid and then an adult, they're more meat for the meat grinder.
denial of life can be seen as worse than ending one short it's not the first that always comes to mind people can have perfectly valid reasons for liking things you have a perfectly valid reason for not liking
@@marley7868 I'm not sure I'm following you.
As far as liking or not, not sure anyone likes any life not lived. I'm just addressing how interesting a contrast that children murdering each other is entertainment, but it's a scandal if she's pregnant when someone murders her. Then suddenly sending her to be potentially murdered is questioned. That's what makes the society disgusting.
But it does parallel real world's protection of pregnancies even when newly born children immediately are without basic needs or unprotected from harm.
@@SabrinaRina I mean fair enough capitals case would you be suprised there all to drunk and dumb to have thought it through?
Yes the system of panem is horrific, unfair and unstable... that's the point. The districts rebelled before and lost then they introduced the hunger games, of course people were afraid to fight back again as well as being indoctrinated from birth
I think the argument is this system wouldn't last even a year before someone rebelled,how it last for so long is a mystery
The point is that the whole country seems like it's designed to churn out rebellions. Supplies are only gained thru certain districts which means if a single district rebels well no more of that resource ig, such as 13, why tf would you outsource your military might? And then 13 rebels and the Capitol let's them continue to exist with the giant arsenal? Just ready to swoop in the next time a rebellion happens? This on top of the fact that the hunger games are almost guaranteed to get the other districts to unify which would honestly be enough to defeat the capitol even without 13. The games are likely a huuuuuge expense and broadcasts brutality few are willing to put up with, and it allows the oppressed to opportunity to gain political power and influence. And that's not all of it, the video explains it much better. What the video is trying to say is that Panem would never have lasted as long as it did. It wouldn't have gotten to is 10th hunger games let alone 75th with how it's designed
@@kolyashinkarev7366the same could be said for countries like North Korea, and yet that country has lasted 70 years so far.
@@destroyerofturtles5024 yes, north Korea is a dictatorship, but it's a lot different then panem, in north Korea propaganda actually works and it doesn't create unrest to strike fear into the population, North Korea is a stable dictatorship (also before USSR broke up north Korea was a decent place to live, because it was sponsored by communist block). Real world is much more complicated then a drama novel for teens
@kolyashinkarev7366 North Korea has lasted for over SEVEN decades. The USSR, Spain lasted decades. The USA had chattel slavery for over two CENTURIES.
Human beings find ways to mistreat each other and make it last
.
Honestly, if the Capital wanted this system to work, they would stop treating its citizens so harshly...
That's not how a totatalerian government works
@@WAMTAT Well competent dictatorships tend to offer the citizens a reason to support the leader, it has been done in history. If you bring and offer security, jobs, food and even I dare say personal freedoms on the local level. Well people would side with you and put up with you on a throne. Especially if your offering this after a time of conflict and struggling.
Augustus for example painted himself as first citizen a equal to his peers in theory and the man of the people. He even made their lives easier as well, and well painted the Senate as the bad guys (to be fair though this Senate was corrupt and ruled like oligarchy in "freedom" in name only wrapping). He also improved life as a whole, let people do what they normally do, bring down corrupt and start the Pax Romana for the Romans after decades of civil wars and conflicts.
Snow's biggest mistake was not being the dictator, is biggest mistake was not using the idea of hope something he understands and painting himself as the bringer of it to the masses. If he had even one shred of long term brains he would actually made things better for the districts and won their love and seen as great when compared to the tyrants before him. He did not even need to change to much either, only a few things like not murder their kids in a blood sport, or better food rations or even proper housing.
I kinda wonder if they were always like that? I can see that they might've started off better, built up the districts and then gradually descended as the rich and powerful migrated to the capitol and demanded more and more luxury until the other districts became prison factories. This would also be why (and how) D13 rebelled.
True. Terror is art that hard to master. Too much, and people got apathy, too little and it lost it meaning... they should learn it from the Roman Empire.
@@WAMTAT
Reality is much more complicated than that, and in a way, less exciting. Most enduring totalitarian governments have a rather strong grassroot support, which is the reason that you don't see much attempt at rebellion against them. The people are also more likely to tolerate some oppression if they're also facing external threats, such as invasions. One good case study is in one of the declassified CIA document on Cuba, about removing Castro. They concluded that smuggling weapons into Cuba and "arms the Cubans" wouldn't work because average Cubans love Castro. Ironically, the best way for a government to maintain their power without wasting resources on trying to upkeep the order is to appease poor people as much as possible.
I kinda feel like Snow was the greatest rebel leader ever. the guy was so blatantly incompetent and negligent, that the end game was all but done.
After watching this I almost feel like he had lost control of everything intentionally. What better way to bring a system down than mismanagement.
@@certain_sloth
He was supposedly dying so maybe he didn't trust his right hand to rule so wanted to destroy the government to keep society from becoming stagnant.
@@beastwarsFTW I agree. It seems like he was leaning in to the collapse and going through the motions. Some people can sense the winds of change and know that putting up resistance does nothing. SPOILERS for the the anime legend of the galactic heroes. The original ruler in the show is shown to know that his grandson is looking to usurp him and lets it happening. Citing the same reason you did. If I’m remembering this correctly of course.
I think him being an unconscious actor in the collapse is the the best read even if not authors intent.
They should of cast Joe Biden as president snow he has the same level of competency.
@No one Here Cool story lady. Leave your parents basement and tell it to them.
I love the part where you point out that watching the Hunger Games live would be boring as hell once the starting battle is over.
The reason the leader of district 13 stood close enough to katniss that she could be easily killed is because in the book it explains that in her arrogance the leader of district 13 thought that they were friends. Thinking they were friends the leader of district 13 thought katniss would never harm her. But at the last second katniss realized she was as bad as snow and that things wouldn't change under the new leadership.
Whoever founded Panem must've been that guy who quotes in other languages despite not speaking them. They named their country after a Latin phrase without understanding it's meaning. Bread AND Circuses. Keep your people entertained AND fed, and they'll be docile
The capitol people were fed.
IMO that’s the point, they had circuses (shallow entertainment to keep people distracted) but no bread (food and more specifically, safety). However, the the bread and circus theme is pervasive throughout the series and used in different ways, so my analysis is one of many.
the capitol had the bread and circuses and therefor remained docile and the districts were forced into docility by being made to provide the capitols bread and circuses through fear and control
@@Baileeisntfunny that's the problem. Panem et circenses is supposed to apply to ALL your citizens, not just the elite. You can't starve your majority working class and expect them to remain docile
@@dipdop9734 but they only truly view the capitol residents as citizens and everyone else as slaves. they’re controlled by fear. the capitol is practically a separate country in control of these other countries. the capitol gets bread and circuses to control them and the districts get the hunger games to control them. and the capitol believes that they do feed the districts or at least wants them to believe they believe that because they’re ridiculed for rebelling against the government that “provides for and feeds them”. also the parallels between the country being named after providing bread and then naming the games after the fact that the districts are hungry
The funny thing is they could have used the hunger games far better by simply publicly framing the tributes for a crime. They could maybe even give the other district-members the choice to spare one of the two. By that the capitol would display the "protection" they provided, while keeping the entertainment aspect with less public unrest.
...Have you watched The Running Man? It's not exactly the same idea, but it's similar.
@@SpongesonicPictures No, actually.
Is it worth checking out?
@@niemand6916 It's a bit corny (It's an Arnold Schwarzenegger movie after all), but it has some interesting ideas, so yeah, I'd say give it a watch.
Deadman Wonderland.
That's basically Deadman fucking Wonderland. In that anime/manga they have a PRISON where they force inmates to run a murder obstacle course for the entertainment of the public. I think there's even a thing where publicly they say it's not real, and the public can be like "Oh it's just theatrics and stuff, it's JUST entertainment" but they deep down do know it's real they're just lying to themselves to indulge in their sick fantasies.
They strap poison collars to the inmates necks and they can only stop themselves from dying for a while by obeying.
Really the only flaw in the system is some of these inmates are separated and then given, sick blood based powers. Even THEN they still have the poison collars on so if they rebel they'll very likely still die before they can accomplish anything. Plus the prison has a super powerful Deadman in their pocket as insurance. Oh, Deadman is people with blood powers.
Deadmen fight each other in cage matches, normally to the death, and the winners basically get to live like kings for as long as they keep winning, encouraging them to get better while still following the rules. Its been ages since I've watched the show, but it's a shit ton better than this poorly written crap.
Well yes the whole thing would be a lot less likely to start rebellions if the tributes were adults who had been arrested for some sort of crime against the state in the past year, and simultaneously showed the other districts their neighboring districts are full of shady people and you shouldn't trust them over the capital.
25:11 I just realised, That's the point. The book is about a YA girl with a bow who topples a dystopian regime, so it needed a regime so inept it could actually be toppled by the girl with a bow.
I believe Katniss to Snow was his Lucy Gray coming back. A poor pathetic girl from District 12, whom he admires enough to not lie to. And Snow has been lying all of his life, he is who he is because of lies.
I wouldn’t say Snow loves Katniss, he is above that, he has outgrown love, but he admires her, she brings out the youth in him, she reminds him and takes him back to a time when he actually really loved and that is why, yes Snow wants and needs Katniss to die, but in the end he is satisfied with her survival.
A Batman and Joker kind of thing, as Heath Ledger’s Joker said: -“You complete me.”
Until the day, I thought Panem was some how a reference to a airline, or the Panama Canal, it was just the word bread this whole time.
I thought it was short for Pan-America.
@@Nukestarmaster short for pansexual-Americana
*Peter Kropotkin enters the chat*
YES!
Another Episode!
I waited way too long!
But dont worry, i will not sue you for long Wait because
i proudly proclaim: I'm no Karen! So i do NOT want to talk
with your Manager!!
@@creed8712 The Hunger Gay.
I'm writing books and just can't wait for one of the societies I've made to be on here. The thought brings a tear to my eye.
Liking critics and listening to their words is the first step to not being noticed by them.
@@leiderhosen7110 maybe he's making sure his society is as ridiculous as possible
Good luck, hope to see your work on this channel someday.
If you get publicly roasted on CZcams, it means you're famous enough to justify someone spending days of his life on your work.
So, i wish your books end up being roasted on this channel! Good luck my friend!
@@stegosaur9812 Observing every mistake and making sure to do every single one of them
It’s important to remember there is a ton of hubris in those in power in these stories. They don’t think it’s possible for a rebellion to happen because the poor districts aren’t capable of it in their eyes, and they enjoy oppressing them too much to stop.
The real reason Panam is terrible is how they forced MoistCritical to fight against them! After that happened they truly had no chance.
I'm not sure but I heard the hunger games books never really had too much focus on the love triangle until some of the editors decided it needs the thirsty twilight fangirls in.
I mean it's what Hollywood does. look at V for Vendetta It could not be ANY MORE clear in the Book that Eve is not a love interest for V. She is only his successor. and they turned that shit up to a 10 and made the "evil government" unessarly evil by killing its own citizens when its the fact the people did it to themselves in the book that makes it much more horrifying and necessary for V
I read the books, there is no love triangle. There is 1 page where she and Gale kiss and she's confused, and there is 1 page, in the final book, where the boys talk about who she might choose. But she herself doesn't focus on it at all, and it is never about choosing. The situation is girl having a friend who is in love with her, and is happy to be just her friend if that is what she wants and that's that- and her also having a friend who is guilt tripping her into being with him. That ain't a love triangle.
i’ve read the books multiple times. the first and second it’s not too prominent but in the third it’s a bit more important? i mean gale and katniss kiss a few times but she doesn’t see them as any more than friends, whereas she cares and loves peeta. there’s not too much of a triangle in the books
@@livispuzzled I would also say like the third book hits the nail on the head about how she feels about boys, she is just like scarlet in gone with the wind, a survivor. So much that the boys even talk about it. It's probably the best moment in the book when Katniss basically thinks she doesn't need either of them.
I mean that’s book marketing
“What? Can’t handle a few bombs?” in reference to super strong underground stronghold
YES!
Another Episode!
I waited way too long!
But dont worry, i will not sue you for long Wait because
i proudly proclaim: I'm no Karen! So i do NOT want to talk
with your Manager!!
I think you may be missing part of the point here. Panem was always going to fail. The books explore this inevitability, maybe not flawlessly, but I think interestingly enough.
The hold the capital has over the districts was always precarious, and the leaders, like Snow, and later Coin, know this. Snow was simply trying to delay this, but even he discusses how a “small spark can become a flame” so easily in this society. It’s not a well-crafted society and I think this is known, especially by the power players in the book. But it is brutal one so a revolution is not as easy as “just dying for this cause rather than another”. People often stay complacent to avoid harm coming to them or their loved ones, until inspired to do otherwise. There was revolution brewing for a while, but no strong enough lynch pin to set it off across districts until the act with the berries. But in the prequel, we see that this is not the first ever act of rebellion, just the first that ended up working. After all, one of the strengths of the Hunger Games was pitting district against district in order to foster resentment, rather than unity against a common enemy (we see this clearly with the “careers”).
Katniss was never trying to start anything, as she repeats over and over. Katniss was simply trying to protect those she loved and was trying to be better herself, but she accidentally became this spark. Coin, amongst other characters, later exploited this small act. Katniss’ role in this revolution was nearly entirely incidental, as she could hardly be described as an “enthusiastic” leader of this revolution. This just goes to show how precarious everything was. Perhaps 75 years is unbelievable, but this society was never going to last if someone can accidentally topple a government with an act of love.
Again, the Hunger Games series is far from perfect and there are flaws within the writing and world building. But it’s supposed to be a commentary on the inequity of our own society, and typically in these commentaries, authors use exaggeration to make a point. Do I think Panem is realistic? Of course not. Do I think it says something interesting about our own world? Yeah, I think it does, at least imperfectly. It’s not really about the precise logistics of the world, but if you choose to nitpick at the detriment of your own enjoyment, then that’s on you. I think much of your criticism completely misses the point, and could kindly be described as “reductive”, but perhaps actual nuance is not conducive to your CZcams views.
You got offended for no reason. it’s not that deep. he doesn’t care about you or know you.(this is not an attempt to gaslighting)
And before you say you’re not offending. whether that’s your your intention or not that’s how it came across. so I don’t care about your intentions. again, not trying to gaslight you.
@@Cheese23145that comment was not offensive whatsoever it was just criticism my dude. You can agree or disagree with the comment but anyone has the right to criticize someone's opinion?
Thank you for mentioning the small population and size of the nation. The US originally expanded because there was so much land. Lots of people in Hunger games could simply go off and farm somewhere and live free. It wouldn't be easy and they'd probably have to abandon modern technology, but there's little reason to take the crap. There's too much land to patrol.
The majority of the districts are either open air concentration camps, or taken care of and brainwashed well enough that they are willing to stay. 12 is an outlier for being possible to get through the fence
It probably still is a lot of land, but in canon due to sea levels rising parts of the us are underwater
What people forget is that is exactly what the western US was like in the 19th century. Barely any civilization passed the Mississippi. People who acquired land via the Homestead Act were left largely to their own devices with little to no law enforcement or government services to support them. In the Wild West the law was mostly restricted to small towns with a sheriff and some deputies. This was the case even as late as the 1930s. It wouldn’t be till the national highway system was constructed that some of the more isolated communities became more connected. In fact many remained relatively isolated until telecommunications and the internet arrived
Isn't the wilderness filled with mutated monsters? And that's without considering what would happen if a coal miner just decided to walk into the woods one day.
Oh it's literally that easy is it? No, no they couldn't, because the peacekeepers would've shot them dead for illegally leaving their districts.
"Cut out our tongues or worse, we wouldn't make it five miles."
0:39 "we meet kaktniss, who rages over any and all authority figures"
*shows katniss raging against a cat*
The cat was the real head of that household after the father died and the mother fell into chronic depression. 🤣🤣
tbf cats are pretty cool, and with how things are going in that universe, i wouldn't be surprised if a cat was actually the guy responsible of the household
"Give that girl a gun..." XD
"And give THAT man a shield!"
@@louisduarte8763 i have a Lasgun,some grenades and a bayonet,that is enough for a guardsmen.
Give everyone in this fucking movie a chainsaw axe and tell them to shout “WAAAAAGH” at each other as they go at it in a melee - makes just as much sense as what actually happened on screen and it much more satisfying...
@@Spartan135 You forgot faith in Big E, krieger. Now you'll live & won't be taking part in the next battle as punishment. XD
@@skepticalmagos_101 *sad gas mask noises*
Made it to 7 minutes of this video and realized you’ve not read the books or you’re clueless about human nature. Your analysis shows why history repeats itself.
Spot on. Plus, he misrepresented lots of characters and elements of the story to make his arguments.
Oh my god i couldn't finish this video and have you seen the comments 😅😅😅
This video didnt mention the obvious flaw in the reaping ruleset.
Every district must offer a tribute every year, one male and one female. They are picked at random, but a volunteer can override the entire picking proccess. Why arent all districts training carrers then? Sure, they are agains the rules of the Hunger games, that never stopped districts 1 and 2, and winning will bring a boom to your entire district. But its not even that the most exploitable part.
It is revealed that there is a rule that you can afford extra rations by putting your name multiple times on the reaping picks, both Gale and Katniss did that. If every elegible candidate also did that, they all get extra food with no increased chance of being reaped.
Wait, there is more.
The volunteer rule makes the higher chance of being reaped moot. as they can just get a volunteer and override the entire pick and everyone just gets more food for no extra risk.
You can say that if that actually happened, the capitol would just change the rules. But that just proves the current reaping rules were exploitable and stupid.
I’m pretty sure that all these repressive dystopian governments are designed to anger the audience and cause sympathy for the main characters, with little to no regard to the logic or sustainability of those governments. I suppose many of these governments have to built around a fatal flaw as well or else the underdog rebels wouldn’t stand a chance.
the question, has any dystopian governments made sense? Real-life or fiction?
@@Psy_Ro eh, not really. Even the Galactic Empire from Star Wars didn’t quite make sense (I would definitely call the Empire a dystopia)
@@Psy_Ro Thats the thing about "dystopian" governments. They are literally bad by definition. lol They are either ran with extreme inefficiency, or ran with brutal efficiency. But when its ran with brutal inefficiency is when we got issues.
Nope obviously you have never read Huxley
@@ChefofWar33 but brutal efficiency is in itself inneficient.
If Machiavelli was alive he would laugh in Battle Royale Stephanie Meyer's face
Just a side note that was probably pointed out before, but when Romans were thinking of a "circus", clowns had nothing to do with it. A circus was a race track for chariot races, like the circus maximus in Rome.
Media Zealot: Can somebody give this girl a gun?
Katniss: *proceeds to shoot down a plane with a bow*
Suzane Collins seems to be pretty good at writing characters, yet she doesn't seem to give her worldbuilding the needed attention.
Don't get me wrong, the Hunger Games books, and to an extent, the movies, are still pretty good and fun to read/watch, but the more you pay attention to the world, the less sense it makes.
I feel like she did decently well in world-building for Gregor the Overlander
Her characters are alright, but...
I feel like sometimes she lets the plot get ahead of things and pull the characters along. Book two is the best example.
Everyone has a secret plan to get Katniss out and use her as a symbol of revolution. They can't tell her, though. At the end, it's a big reveal setting up for book 3.
From a dramatic tension standpoint, this makes sense. But from a character standpoint, it makes the protagonist the *least heroic* character in the story. Everyone else is actually working to oppose the capitol, while Katniss is just going along and trying to survive.
well, she did a quite decent job when it comes to politics, history, and realistic nastiness of regimes because most YA novels miss those fundamentals almost entirely or simplify them to "evil guys rule the country, so we are sad and edgy because we can't live with our love interests because of the evil guys" trope.
@@roryschussler i think that decision is actually the most realistic. katniss is a teenager who was forced to compete to the death not once, but twice. her character is never meant to be the hero of the revolution (it’s a subversion of the chosen one trope). her only goal throughout the series is to keep her family and friends safe, and even that she can’t do because war does not spare anyone. she never intended to start a revolution and the people in power (coin and snow) only use her as a spawn for their own political gains. i think that while that decision is unsatisfactory to the readers, it’s the most realistic one.
@@originalname530 Maybe that's a good point.
But they don't give a really good reason not to tell her anyway. The Panem Bureau of Intelligence is monitoring her so closely that no one can get word to her, but it's possible for everyone else to spread around and coordinate their plan? There's no clear reason she wouldn't have gone along with it, and Peeta not making it out was a fluke failure at the last minute.
I was working at Academy Sports store when these came out.....the massive amount of pink bows we sold was unbelievable
Girls have a hard on for archery
Lol
Curze, you are the god damn Night Haunter. And you were NOT on Nostromo selling pink bows! Stop that shxt right now, and get back to leading your Night Lords. You know how their murderous gene stock tends to become... excessive, when you're not holding the leash.
@@Scrimjer
girls can't have hard ons
those are men, Cap'n
Girls can hunt, as long as it's pink
Great video but there are a few mistakes
1. The capitol believed district 13 to be dead, after a smallpox pandemic so no they didn’t just leave them there
2. The hunger games wasn’t meant to make the districts afraid of the capitol ( well it partly was) but instead to blur the lines of who is the bad guy and distract the districts (ik it’s dumb)
3. The capitol didn’t and doesn’t only use coal for energy it’s just a part of it, there is another district that also deals with power as seen when the dam is blown up and Capitol lights go out. Along with district 13 who also used to create nuclear power.
I think that’s about it if anyone reads this feel free to correct me
Honestly, it is amazing that Panem lasted for more than 75 years. You would think such an inherently unstable organization would only last a generation or two before being overthrown if not by rebels then by a series of dictators offing each other.
Slavery lasted over 400 years
The _Hunger Games_ series is one of those things that you like on the first viewing, but every time you watch it you notice more and more flaws and like it less and less.
My first ex was obsessed with it. Went to the cinema to see it. Yeah... it sucked
I personally couldn't even get through the second book.
@@Nukestarmaster i dont read too often (not that i cant read, more that i struggle with focus) so i dont know how bad the stories are.
Also like hell did the author think up the comcept independantly to casino royale...
@@mrslinkydragon9910 Do you mean Battle Royale? Because I can't see much similarity with 007.
@@Nukestarmaster yup... not that it matters at the end of the day qs ive already made a tit of mtself lol
Panem, the civilization in which technology is apparently just magic.
But we can't use it to turn our country into Sweden for some reason, despite that being a proven way to eliminate the threat of rebellion.
@@kevincrady2831 You know Sweden uses Free Market Practices - alongside a set of really expansive Taxes, right? Just asking. Honestly - after reading Stieg Larsson's Lisbeth Salander books - I hate Sweden (mainly about the fact that courts can declare you incompetent and pretty much indefinitely have you owned like a b*tch).
@@rustym.shackelford5546 Well, sure. Sweden, along with a number of other countries, has Capitalism combined with a comprehensive social safety net. The latter has made them secure from the threat of a Revolution of the Proletariat and enabled them to have billionaires without guillotines.
Given Panem's magical technology, which they apparently use solely to sustain an industry of teenage gladiatorial combat, they could have done the same sort of thing even more easily. The people in the Capital could still have lived in splendor, just as the people who fly to Davos in our world do, without the risk of being toppled by a girl with a bow and arrows.
In short, as long as the rich and powerful don't grab ALL the marbles, they can pretty much reign secure from popular revolt.
@@kevincrady2831 Good point.
@@rustym.shackelford5546 you know Sweden also uses socialist practices right? Just making sure you aren't on of those idiots who says that Sweden doesn't have socialist policies
Its a miracle that Panem is able to stay somewhat afloat between two rebellions though even more so that the districts didn't go for a second round a year or 2 after the first rebellion
As I have seen others theorize, I don't think the hunger games were meant for the districts since why would seeing their kids die brutal deaths pacify them? it would only make them more angry. No, the games was for the capital and to distract the population with drama and death so they don't start thinking of how bad they got it too really.
My guess is that Snow thought that the districts would be so starving and broken that they would be unable to do a proper rebellion and the promise of reward for the victors would be enough to keep them in check.
But overall, how this society lasted as long as it did is stupid. If the mistreatment of the districts was a new thing then fair enough but from my understanding in the movies, it is not. It has always been terrible in them. I would have given Snow's regime 2-3 years tops before falling.
It wasnt like that though, because the districts had just lost a war when it started
I remember one dumb civilization where everyone has to be ignorant of humanity's past with the exception of one person whom the elites regularly consult so they can expect certain outcomes and plan accordingly.
I forget what the book/movie's name is, but I remember how dumb it was that the people in charge were surprised when the MC started to become rebellious after he gained memories from civilizations better than theirs.
Edit: it's "The Giver"
Was it The Giver by any chance?
Sounds like The Giver
Yea it's definitely "The Giver"
Thanks, appreciate the help.
as much as I love the giver their society was doomed to fail eventually
Tuvok was an incredible successor to Spock as the Star Trek Vulcan voice of reason.
Agreed!
01:13 Your planet's name is Dirt 🏔🌏
When people are hungry and worried about their next meal they are not thinking about revolution
That's all they're thinking about. Every single revolution was carried out by hungry people
"...rages against any and all authority figures."
Throws chinaware at the cat.
Seems like a fair call by Katniss to be honest.
That cat did suck
You leave the kitty alone
the duality of man
Cats are the ultimate authority figures, after all.
That transition into the square space advert was fucking smooth
12:15 “They’re like a good guy version of Hydra just waiting for someone to properly organize them.”
The Hunger games was actually really good to show what Ptsd looks like to kids that is how I learned more about it growing up
Next, please do the Handmaiden's Tale, the stupidity of Gilead government vs handmaidens
Putting Handmaids into the colonies is so fucking stupid
You can understand why, in a world where women are mostly barren, women who could bear children would have great value, but the mistreatment of said women would detract from their function as the future of the human race.
But modern writers seldom have the ability to understand the real implications of the scenarios they create.
@@freman007 Yup, ironic is that the writer was trying to warn her own kind (the feminists) to no go too far or a Reagan type (yes she based Gilead on Reagan's revival of patriotism and Christian sense after the image was brutalized in the late 60s and 70s) dictatorship will take over...... yeah hand maidens would be treated like goddesses, hell some wouldn't even be hand maidens and be straight up married.
But consistent world building and realistic expectations and resource management are kind of the first things on the chopping block if you are writing a shitty propaganda hit piece.
@@crocidile90 why no artificial insemination?
@@frostycarrots9826 cause it wasn't in the bible. The reason those are called Handmaids is because there was a custom that if your wife can't give you kids, you bonk her handmaids and if they have kids they consided to be from your wife. The bible is kinda fucked up.
ad Point 2: "Panem provides a pipeline for rebel talent allowing highly skilled revolutionaries to infiltrate every level of their society."
That's false, firstly because the "pipeline" is a pipeline towards death (23 of 24 "revolutionaries", which are really just unlucky teenagers, get killed in each Hunger Games), and secondly because according to the book, "the children of victors get reaped at a much higher rate than predicted by probability." Katniss suspects that this is conducted by the Capitol by manipulating the number of name slips in the bowl to achieve maximum drama (victors must mentor their own children in the Hunger Games).
I suspect this is done to kill the children of victors as fast as possible to prevent them from becoming revolutionaries, because children of victors may inherit physical and intellectual superiority and receive (political) wisdom from their victorious parents, all of which makes them priority kill targets for the Capitol.
I loved the hunger games books and films as much as I loved this video, the more I love something the more I love picking it apart and laughing at it.
Panem not working out in the long run is very much intended by Suzanne Collins who actually has not left any plot holes in her books. Flawed concepts and people existing doesn’t make the world-building bad. I feel like most people in these comments haven’t actually read the books or lack reading comprehension skills smh
Good video, a nice compliment to the one Templin Institute put out, "The Most Incompetent Dystopian Government."
Too be fair, a live delay wouldn't have done much when Peeta dropped the pregnancy bombshell considering the event was done in front of a fairly large live crowd. Even if they cut the feed people would've talked and it would've spread like wildfire.
Also, if the Capitol can seemingly produce hordes of genetically engineered muts for the purpose of killing, why the hell can't they make hordes of genetically engineered cows to, you know, feed people?
It's not about whether they "can". It's a matter of....why would they? The people in the Capitol have so much food that they make themselves throw up just to eat more.
Genetically engineered cows are expensive.
@@Jacob-ge1py AND HORDES OF GENETICALLY ENGINEERED DOGS AND MONKEYS AREN'T?!
@@Freesorin837 How are you gonna protect the food you do have without the super monkeys?
The Kingdom of Bread and their methods for national loyalty is the equivalent of big banks in the middle of an economic collapse saying they can't fail because they're not supposed to.
Also, Tuvok is, thanks to these videos, becoming one of my favorites for commentary on stupidity.
only if you have a very basic understanding of reality.
Isnt this exactly what happened in real life?
@@Psy_Ro Yes. That's why I used it as a comparison.
@@Psy_Ro no
After all of this analysis I started to think that the author is actually GOOD at building her universes because well she clearly built her world to destroy it eventually. It wasn't about to function
The fact that district 13 was ruined after one single attack was dumb af though
Are you talking about the original district 13, or the new one?
So the whole time no one in Panem just went “nah, fuck this” and only had a national revolution because of a 16 year old edgelord?
Honestly don’t even understand how I enjoyed this as a teen.
The first book is great. I chose to not read the rest lol. Can't be bothered with the whole rebellion plot.
A lot of people tried starting rebellions. Katniss was never portrayed as an "edgelord". She volunteered for her sister, as the only volunteer district 12 ever had up to that point. People sympathized with her. And the fact that the Capitol citizens were so invested in her and the relationship to Peeta also made them attached to her in a way. How she treated rue literally caused an uprising in district 11. When she accidentally "rebelled" with the nightlock berries they had to change the rules of the games to keep the capitol citizens happy and from then on the capitol targeted Katniss. Most rebellions before that happened in the factories where it was one district trying to have an uprising. By Katniss publicly threatening the Capitol (accidentally), all of the districts had a reason or a spark for a revolution together at the same time which is way more impactful (not all of them rebelled obv)
Told my girlfriend to stop giving birth while I watch this.
Good
I'd have rung the hospital to get the doctors to tell her to hurry up with it & I'll catch up with them when we're both finished personally unless the hadn't got in the ambulance yet & was being noisy ofc
alpha energy
Push the kid back in so you don't lose a bit of your nephews' life.
Hell yeah. Good vid btw my food poisoning tremors are calming down. Keep on barfing and shitting brothers!
This is the problem I have with some of the young teen dystopian fiction novels, these societies seem to be written with the intention of them failing rather than focusing on how a society like this could possibly function. It isn't just that they are a totalitarian dictatorship on paper, they have to flag wave this fact at every opportunity even when there is absolutely nothing to gain from it.
What made 1984 such a great inspiration for a dystopian society that still holds up today is that Ingsoc goes out of its way to limit public knowledge of disasters or any instance where the state is seen as wrong. Their operations to quell dissent are covered up so well that no one truly knows how many have disappeared. In order to unite and distract the masses they create a common enemy to direct their hatred onto and those who may know the truth are in constant fear that they will disappear one day and could get turned in by their own friends and family. These methods effectively kills any rebellion before it can even form, there aren't any silly loopholes the plot can exploit for the sake of the protagonists.
Now maybe that makes an antagonist that is too powerful for the protagonists to stop but that's up to the author to modify how powerful this totalitarian government is. However they do it this government should not look completely clueless in how to control public opinion.
Even Airstrip One eventually fell, as well. It's not something that happens in the main story, but the Newspeak appendix provided with many copies heavily implies that Ingsoc isn't around anymore at the time it's written. So even as good at snuffing out dissent as the Party is, the crippling ineffectiveness of EVERY other part of their regime killed them anyway, most likely.
@@TheAngryXenite I like the theory that Airstrip One is *all* the Party actually controls, and that they're really just isolated from everyone else, while propagating an elaborate fantasy to sell to the Proles and Outer Party in order to maintain control. Think North Korea, but on steroids.
Eventually, another nation decides to check up on the UK (Airstrip One), finds out how horrible it is, and the Party is promptly dismantled.
I know I'm a couple years later responding to this video (thanks, algorithm), but my favorite parts of videos like this is the opportunity it affords me to see just how many people don't read for comprehension.
Personally I think that Panem wasn't too stupid to exist. It was however too stupid to survive for long. Just ends up collapsing under the weight of its own excess and greed.
Reminds me that I'm happy when I made a nation in my DnD campaign I made sure that they were both a despotic authoritarian regime that used religion to control everyone.. but also had free schooling, health care, and social programs to ensure the happiness of its citizens. You don't need to suppress opposition as much when your citizens do it for you.
simple idea of superiority, propaganda-censors , meritocracy, fanatical council, kill obstacles. rewards for economic and social growth of the state and punishing excessive corruption.
that is easy to solve... create a simple and easy-to-believe idea that makes your group superior to others. make sure that those who share racial, religious or economic cultural superior traits with you are rewarded in all aspects of life, make sure you have a very good propaganda system that censors and indoctrinates the ideas that are needed. make sure of your leader in turn use meritocracy as a way of gaining power and wealth among the leaders of your force. put in charge a group that are either fanatical or competent enough to know that betrayal is death, and finally kill someone when it is an obstacle or a threat...
This will be a momentary success since it will spend resources without renewing... but if you want to succeed as a system for many years or decades, you just have to add rewards for your select group for economic growth and social welfare of the state and punishing excessive corruption... it is the difference between Venezuela and Singapore
That's even easier to do in DnD.
Don't destroy the church, cause they actually CAN HEAL WITH ACTUAL MAGIC.
Yeah that's a pretty good way to keep people happy so long as you maintain influence with that religion.
Long B. huey be like
It’s always fun watching these dives into civilizations that by narrative design are meant to fail, and see how they would. Usually we get the general narrative way that the author created, but sometimes we get those good extra bits that the author/creator never really intended like how Panem is so dependent on its districts that if one were to strike it would completely stunt the whole system. Like clearly this was suppose to be a weakness/flaw, but it gives so much power to one district (any that produce power, raw materials, or food). Seriously if the food district were to rebel that would just destroy the entire civilization.
Like seriously, who taught that giving a district (9) nearly all of the food production, was a good idea? It doesn't even need to rebel to create problems. One bad harvest, one dry summer, one cold and long winter, one plant disease, and the entire nation, even the Capitol, probably starves. Seriously, it's like the Capitol didn't even think this through at all.
@@fede98k54 also District 13 with weapons (including nukes and AA weapons) and District 5 with the entire electric grids (which for some reason rely on just 1 hydro dam). Like except for weapons, why not have Districts provide necessities mostly for other districts (under the watchful eyes of the Capital) instead.
If they fail the quota (for example due to famine or draught), other districts will gang up on them and the Capital will swoop in as saviors with nuclear energy + food made of genetically modified crops (they can just say that it's hard to manufacture those to prevent districts from begging for them every now and then)
If they exceed the quota (for example: excess steel or food), they are heavily encouraged (not forced, otherwise you will end up with an uprising) to donate them to the Capital in exchange for "special benefits" exclusively from the Capital
Districts will be too distracted by regional feuds and competition to pay attention to the Capital
It's a long time thread necro but while I agree with some of your points, on the whole I have to disgree with
"Seriously if the food district were to rebel that would just destroy the entire civilization"
Honestly my gut feeling is that isn't so. Firstly because the Districts have somewhat overlapping jurisdictions so there isn't just one "food district" (District 4 is Fishing, District 11 is general purpose Agriculture, District 10 is Livestock, and District 9 is "Grains" (how that is different from District 11 IDK). So a single rebellion in the system wouldn't completely gut the Capitol of what it needs, especially in food since they can probably draw in resources from the other districts.
Moreover, I honestly think a rebellion in the "Food district" or one of those would be one of the EASIER to quash, precisely because it could be spun so easily as a threat to the other Districts as well as the Capital but is also rather underarmed. So get together a bunch of legbreakers from the Capital and the more militarized Districts and quash them flat in a relatively lightening campaign (since farmers and herders can't exactly flee to the mountains with their fields) and confiscate the food.
That may sound far fetched, but it's pretty much exactly what the Bolsheviks did several times over in places like Northern Russia, the "Black Earth" districts of what is now Ukraine and the Northern Caucasus, and so on, and with similar methodologies. The Bolsheviks constantly bled out the countryside in order to bolster the power of the cities, and responded to threats to the supply with extreme violence. Which is fairly easy because while the cities couldn't feed themselves, they could manufacture lots of stuff like guns, bullets, artillery, and poison gas. And because the farmers couldn't STOP growing food if they wanted to live*, the government could simply swoop in, shoot the "rebels", and haul off the food.
* A bunch eventually DID give up trying to farm in order to stay alive, whether it was because they'd eaten their seed grain or had it confiscated or just decided to burn their little remaining crop iin order to keep it out of the hands of their murderers, but by that point effective resistance was over.
@@vandeheyeric I get where you’re coming from here, but with what these things are making if one of those 3 were to fall or rebel it would most likely destroy the whole system. Now I’m saying 3 and not 4 like you mentioned since general agriculture would most likely be none human consumable produce like animal feed, cotton, natural fuel, hemp, etc. where the only thing really connected to food would be the feed that gets stent to district 10. It’s far less that there are other options, and more that these things are all probably equal in production and worth so if one were to fail that would be a third of the food production lost. Obviously if a district were to rebel it’s not likely that they’d get completely destroyed though with how things were going in the books that does seem to be the capital’s solution to anything is complete destruction or at best severely crippling.
Again there’s really only 3 places making food, and even then it’s most likely that district 9 being grains would actually be the most impactful on said food production so if just that one fell it would destroy their food system. That said if they’re all equal in productivity then that means if any were to fall, have a natural disaster, or rebel then that’s a third of your food stock gone, and there probably wouldn’t be a way to have the other 2 districts pick up that slack. This is actually a real life thing where certain resources being set in just one area can cause problems of dependency. A great example is in Georgia there was a bustling black truffle trade that got completely destroyed because of a tree blight that destroyed the truffle orchards there. This was a major spot for truffles in the south, and has caused a large shortage of local truffles in that area.
@@metronicmagician1816 "I get where you’re coming from here, but with what these things are making if one of those 3 were to fall or rebel it would most likely destroy the whole system."
Oh agreed. Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying this system of GREAT or particularly productive. But it does mean that you would probably need a system failure on a much wider scale than just one of the districts rebelling in order to topple it.
(And apparently the Capital managed to put down a united rebellion of all 13 Districts except for a sorta unofficial peace with District 13? Yah, I imagine there's a big reason why the author never elaborated on how they managed THAT, because even my devil's advocate ranting struggles).
But in indicates that if one district- even one making a really important one like Grains- rebelled the Capital would have some means to isolate the rebellion from its possible allies, mitigate the damage, and muster a force to crush it and fairly quickly. If the Capital can keep the lights on and its designated henchmen fed for a few months on either surplus or stockpiles from the still-loyal districts it stands a good chance of weathering the storm long enough to win (and again, apparently it managed to win one pan-district revolt and last way longer than it should have against another...so...IDK?).
It's not a healthy mindset for a government to have towards its own nationals and it's notable that the Soviets were driven to a similar attitude by hard core ideological beliefs (while the Romans simply favored a more equitable Socii/Allied Status backed up with one hell of a stick). Snow just seems to be doing it for kicks (which admittedly fits with his character and some real life dictators but is hardly the most practical).
Honestly I think a big issue is that the Capital doesn't really seem to have a good system for dealing with complete localized collapse like you say with the truffle problem, or if they had to wipe out one entire district.
Both the Soviets and Romans (among others) solved the problem by basically using semi-forced resettlement, picking up a mixture of volunteers and conscripts (if not enough volunteers were on board) and shipping them out to the affected region for resettlement. It's a major reason why Eastern Ukraine and Crimea so ethnically and culturally Russian now, and why you can see some Roman annals records snap right from from "City A was conquered and sacked by the Legions" to "the Inhabitants of City A was granted Roman Citizenship"
(Which probably means the original people of City A were completely exterminated or enslaved, and the city was resettled by Romans.)
The problem is the way the Capital treats the Districts, the Blood-Harvest of the Games, and the sort of deep sense of inferiority means I doubt this is going to go as well as most resettlement programs did historically. What Capital Civilian is going to be willing to move out to the provinces?
What people forget about totalitarian governments when writing a fictional one: most give just enough freedom to keep the population happy enough.
I will say, a refugee from North Korea recently commented on the first time she read the hunger games after she escaped and she said how she was completely shocked that someone almost completely copied the country of North Korea in the novel (minus the hunger games)
Wasn't that lady a con artist? I distinctly remember a fake North Korean defector was exposed as a liar after she made outlandish statements like that.
Edit: Her name is Yeonmi Park, yes she's been exposed multiple times for lying about North Korea for clout. That "Hunger Games" comment was just another lie.
Yeonmi Park is a grifter
One that could be a good combo of "Villains" and "Civilizations too stupid to exist" would be Voldemort, Grindewald and the Magic World of Harry Potter.
If WW2 weapons show a threat to them and they are still trapped In at most early XIX century technology, a muggle with a pistol would easily eradicate them.
Because I don't care how powerful your wand Is, humans can't react and talk fast enough to Protego themselves from lead.
That misses the fact that muggles outnumber them by a factor of 10,000:1 and their weapons have much more effective lethal range.
Voldemort would maybe take over a small town or two due to having the element of surprise, but as soon as an actual army got involved they would be completely overrun and exterminated. They couldn't take one country let alone the world.
@@leiderhosen7110 One country lol. They couldn't take a freaking school even with governmental involuntary assistance.
if they ever decided to step foot onto america and word got out of their existence and hostile intentions, pretty sure a bunch of excessively armed muggles would gladly go hunting
also, artillery spam, but it’s probably not going to get to that point
@@TheOneWhoHasABadName I mean they can just send a couple police trucks and use teargas on those people, not much of a problem
If the Wizards were smart about it, they could have a fairly decent chance. Start by using Imperius to control the Muggle leadership. Since they have teleportation, and magically-hidden locations to strike from, they would be able to avoid combat except when they had certainty of winning. With Polyjuice, invisibility cloaks, and illusion-type magic, they would be able to infiltrate, spy, and sabotage at will. With powerful area-of-effect spells like Fiendfyre, they could teleport in, cast it to destroy a location, then teleport out. They would be better off using an 'Invasion of the Body Snatchers' type strategy (infiltrate and take over Muggle power structures) rather than trying to go toe-to-toe with Muggle military forces.
On the other hand, powerful Muggle governments like the U.S. would almost certainly have secret agencies that knew about the Wizards, with some Muggle-Born Wizards on their payroll. They would get eager defectors when somebody like Voldemort was running amok and Wizard governments proved unable to stop him. Since the Pure-Blood Wizards are largely ignorant of Muggle technology, they probably wouldn't be aware that their visits to Presidents and Prime Ministers would be recorded by hidden cameras, so their Imperius attacks would be caught in the act, and the Muggles In Black would swing into action.
The Wizards would have to be considerably smarter than they're portrayed as being in the books to have a chance at winning (e.g. smart enough to learn about Muggles, technology, and science, and infiltrate M.I.B. type organizations before launching their attack). A Pure-Blood aristocracy like Voldemort & Co. would fail, by driving Muggle-Born Wizards into the arms of Muggle governments, so any serious attempt at conquest of Muggles would have to have broad-based appeal ("Every one of us can live like royalty!").
Still, with clever leadership and the advantage of surprise, the Wizards could make it interesting.
The author named it after 'bread and circuses' for obvious thematic reasons, though in the world of the book it also helpfully can be derived from 'Pan-America' perhaps.
And thats why it only lasted 75 years. Rebellion takes a long time
When I first read the book, everything was so decrepit and in such an advanced state of decay. Then there were glimmers of high technology, but really just relics, or things so important to the capitols rule they ensured their continued existence. Everyone had a tv, like a crt, because they needed to see the state mandated programming, but the district's are practically wastes. I imagined the capitol to be something akin to ancient Athens with lamp posts and telephones, probably wifi. But not the super futuristic technopower like seen in the films (esp. The later ones) They had hovering aircraft, trainlines and computers, but not far else. I think that works better with the premise. The capitol emerged as the strongest block following an apocalyptic war, they conquered the remaining people's of North America with sequestered arms left over from the old world and feudalistically collect. There isn't anything inherently high tech about the hunger games story, tv cameras and an electronic control room for the games.
Each and every time I see something "Hunger Games"- related, my mind immediately goes back to "MUUH PEETAAHH!", also to hilariously obvious annoyance on JLaw's face through the entirety of those last two movies
Whenever I think of the Hunger Games, I think of the shipping wars that somehow boiled over into general culture.
Can we please stop with the bloody love triangles, it makes the most toxic of fandoms.
@@Nukestarmaster Oh yeah, can't forget about bringing that fucking cancer straight into the mainstream
@@Andriej69 Honestly, I was in grade 7/8 when it was popular, way too many kids picked a "team" in that stupid triangle.
@@Nukestarmaster I was already 22 when first movie released and this mass hysteria was even more annoying cuz of that
Recently rewatched this series and my first thought was literally about how the whole plot could have been prevented if the Capital improved the day-to-day lives of the Districts instead of wasting these resources on propaganda and an annual murderfest
It's all just the result of lazy writing. Insufficient research plus some keyboard time and lots of connections in the publishing industry and voila! We got a book for teenagers. Works like a charm. : )
Especially with all that untapped wilderness and low population. Just take down the fences and raise the bizarre caps on production and it mostly resolves itself. Why are there so many unemployed people when there's clearly work to be done and you seem to have a command economy anyway? Why are you artificially creating shortages? It's not just greed and neglect and the capitol enriching itself at the expense of the districts. They seem to be going out of their way to make the people impoverished and miserable for no real reason but to be dicks.
The “othering” that results in societies like Panem is historically accurate. The World is headed there right now. When a group of people is looked upon as lesser, there is no “treating them better”. Ideology rules.
You could said that about many governments throughout history
yeah, good thing the real world doesn't have those kind of lazy writing and the ruling class improve the day-to-day lives of the working class.......wait a minute
I have many issues with this logic, so please hear me out
1) We’ve seen governments like this exist. No one is claiming it’s a good system, or that it can survive for long periods of time. Alma Coin is just a different type of Snow, which is often what really happens in a rebellion under this system-there’s a subtle shift and a new dictator takes charge. Those in the rebellion were smart about how they manipulated Snow, but in the books Snow was smart too. The attitudes of systems like this is simple: make the people so desperate to live for the smallest scrap of hope you offer that they will fight and kill each other for it. The first book clearly shows that, and then it all falls apart because the people got more hope than the government wanted them to have. It was a power scramble based in controlling the people by fear. Panem fell because everyone in each district rebelled. Yes, it’s a fragile system. Yes, it was destined to fall, and yes it seems easy when we read the books and watch the movies. But war is hell, and rebellion is always risky, even when the dictatorship is fragile. While The Hunger Games are not the most eloquent of books/movies, they still showed that teamwork and group rebellion is powerful. The story of Katniss takes place near the end of Panem’s life; Panem was already dying, and Katniss and Co simply delivered the final blow. In Situations like this, how many people died in the 75+ years before this to get Plutarch in position? How many gave their lives hoping someone like Katniss would stand up to Snow/the dictator one day? For examples from our world look at Iran, Syria, and other countries often classified as 3rd world. Think of all the rebellions that have occurred that were stamped out by governments those of us in 1st and even 2nd world countries would call weak. These systems exist, and they are effective. The hope comes from the fact that no government can live without the support of its people, and when you control people through fear they get mad sooner or later, and the system is fought. The trick is having a rebellion led by a competent, non-power hungry leader, which is also a rare find, sadly.
2) Of course Panem follows Rome! Roman art, lifestyles, war tactics, and leaders have been glorified in western and modern society. Any society that is seeking to publicize itself as “good” will mimic the ideology of the “golden era”, which for Panem is Rome. That is a perfectly logical thing to do. Killing children to strike fear into their parents as a control method is an often effective tool. It is sick and twisted and evil, but it works. Threatening people’s families to coerce them into doing what you want works, especially when you feel all alone, which is what Panem does to its citizens.
No one, and especially not me, is saying this is an ideal system. It’s a downright evil system, but it is effective for those who want to stay in power for their lifespan and care not for what happens when they are dead. And when the leaders use fear to control the masses so they (the leaders) can live in luxury, the system can only survive for so long. There will always come a point when death is the only option, so you may as well rebel. The video got that right, and the key is getting everyone to rebel at the same time, which is what Katniss and Co managed to do, kinda by luck. It’s not perfect, but the books/movies portray a system that exists already in our world, and mocking it as unrealistic is merely turning a blind eye to people who are dying to be able to say “this is an unrealistic show. Such a terrible government could never exist.”
Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk, and I hope you leave with your own critical thinking skills to question everything.
The most unreal thing is that the district 2 controls most of the army but didnt demends an equal life style as the capitol or just do a coup
No we didnt see in real life governements taking power an relative stability with that many or name one