Liquid Culture: Inoculation of Bulk Substrate is Possible!
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- čas přidán 9. 09. 2024
- We’ve been trying to figure out how to inoculate bulk amounts of substrate with liquid culture for a long time to no avail. We’ve figured out a solution, and it may just change everything for us. Our Goat Mix seems to be the answer to this problem, at least for oysters. Our trials will be continuing, but we’re excited with this progress.
If you’d like more information about our Goat Mix, watch this video:
• Goat Mix: Our New Oyst...
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Your level of 'share the knowledge' approach is rare, and I'm sure you'll receive your blessings 10 fold for it.
Thank you!
Indeed
It's also really encouraging as someone getting into this as a hobby that there are people willing to talk about their business and share all of their successes and failures.
You’re exactly right . Majority tend to be an ass to newbies , forgetting that they too had to Learn . I’ve fallen in love with mycology
The original statement rings true to this day, all love 247365
I almost exclusively do liquid culture to sterilized master's mix bulk. I use a silicone sealant as a SHIP, and I put about a half inch of boiled popcorn at the top of my bag. I inject from above onto the popcorn. I found that I had mixed results injecting directly onto bulk, but including a grain layer to start the culture on has made it 100% success rate.
Yeh, it's the grain pocket I'm trying to get away from. It adds another step to the production process. Also, I wouldn't consider that LC straight to bulk. You are still using grain as the intermediate step. Though it's one part in the lab.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial Fair enough! Without the grain step, on a regular grain supplemented hardwood, I've had limited success.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial i was wondering why you hadn’t mentioned this in the video. Its definitely a tedious step.
That works great here too! Thanks for sharing :)
Have you tried this approach with Reishi?
I would love to see an update on this video if you have gone into full production with this method and if you are working on doing this with other strains I constantly dump LC on substrate piles in my yard I’ve done morel wine cap and gold blue and pink oyster and I have had a pink oyster pop up this summer so it can work definitely
I've done this semi consistently. Top inoculation helps and the more LC you use the better but adjusting the moisture level of the substrate to accommodate the extra from the LC is something I'm still working on. Just a disclaimer, I am a hobby grower so take what I say with a grain of salt🤷♂️🍄❤
It makes sense to me. You've been doing this with Master's Mix?
Well you sound pretty educated on the matter for a hobby grower.
Even if you used an entire syringe, 10ml of fluid wouldn't make a big difference, right? At 5lb blocks or larger the effects should be minimal
@@mansrevenge well, Andrew said that he uses 10cc of LC per bag of bulk substrate, but OP said that "the more LC you use, the better the results"; so assumedly, you could be adding quite a lot of extra moisture to the substrate. So, assumedly, you'd have to predetermine roughly how much LC you'll be adding to the substrate, and then factor that in to the preparation of the substrate so it's not too moist when you do go to add the LC in.
Just a fresh newbie here, but that's the understanding I'm getting from OP's comment.
@@MissBlackMetal It's a good assumption, but the quantity is negligible. 10cc of liquid + or - should have no effect on substrate consistency. Especially when doing bulk.
This is part of our sinister plan to get away from disposable plastic bags. Shaking is one of the biggest problems for hard containers, so we've been trying to find good ways to get away from it. Also need a good solution for the container itself. If anyone has any solutions that don't suck too bad, please let us know. Would be awesome to say goodbye to disposable bags.
5gal food buckets seem like a good candidate initially?
Benjamin erickson: I use garbanzo beans aka chickpeas. They shake up so, so so so, easy and rebound so fast that in less the two hours I see growth again.
Never beat a glass jar again,
use garbanzo beans my friend. 🍄❤️
Based on the McKenna jars tek only I use 1 gallon anchor hocking jars instead of mason jars. Check out McKenna jar tek.
Ok, my tek is based on the McKennna tek but I put 1/4 grain and 3/4 bulk subs in glass jars (wide mouth anchor hocking) and inoculate with spore solution. Now I’m going to use LC and fill the bottom 1/4 with straw.
Much cheaper and no more plastic bags. ❤️🍄
The sinister bags can be substituted with biodegradable bags. The main drawback is the cost is not really commercially friendly. The cost is quite expensive compared to the regular bags used. However, the foot print of the bags verse any other farming on a commercial level is quite large compared to mushroom farming.
@@jrcicirello Also, there are currently no biodegradable bags for mushrooms on the market yet. All listed as such as actually oxo degradable. Which is actually worse IMO.
The excitement that shows on your face shows your passion for the craft. Right on man. 👍
It makes it so much more enjoyable to learn all this.
Liquid culture to mastersmix of lions mane and combtooth work great. We have been doing this here at Fungified Farm for a year now. But our lionsmane and combtooth are pennsylvannia wild strains that we cloned. Never tried the commercial strains.
I've heard from many people that hericium works straight to Master's Mix. I haven't tried it just yet.
I learned a long time ago that pasteurized substrate behaves very differently from sterilized substrate.
So, it’s been a year. How’s this progressing?
I partially think the heating process from the pellet mill degrades the lignin to a degree and allows the mushroom to colonize easier, since they have to break down the lignin anyways. I wonder if this would work with non-pelletized straw. One person who got this to work is the infamous Agar on Shroomery who was able to colonize his "Myco Nitro" mushroom compost straight with LC. Good work
I've had this work well with Pholiota adiposa. Straight through the plastic, into the top of my mix (50/50 cherry sawdust & wheat bran), then tape. No SAB or flow hood used.
Hey! Glad to see someone else making this work! I do liquid culture to bulk with 80/20 sawdust and wheat bran mix (with a little added gypsum). I've made it work for Oysters and Lion's Mane so far but it's many weeks slower than grain spawn. Factoring is that I saved 2 weeks growing out on grain my bags are still 4+ weeks slower but the labor savings are great!
Nice, I've wondered if you can go straight to wheat bran like that!
Hey, how much ml of LC and how much substrate you inocculate?
@@GirafosaLijurosa I use about 20ml in a 5kg (~11lb) block. I've tried using less and it works but it makes myceliation even slower.
80/20 volume or mass?
@@paulhartzenberg9823 Mass, but it's not the substrate I'd recommend if you have access to better options. I'm in California where soy hulls are hard to acquire.
You’re the man, Andrew. Lots of love from Las Vegas.
Hi andrew i wrote you about it as a comment to your "Making a Grain Spawn Master using liquid culture and agar." video. i usually put dry rye into my substrate with 5-10% (dry weight) then pour the water in ,seal and put a frogtape at the future injektion spot. then pressure cook. my bags do hold the pressure and do not tear. after cool down i put the bags into my flow hood, lift the frogtape half way, inject LC in that steril plastic spot, and cover again with the frogtape, wich is still sterile at the sticky side. no need for alcohol. no need for for grain spawn. i do shake my bags afterwards and they colonize in around 12-20 days. works for me 100% . keep up the good work, bro!
The only issue I have with the grain pocket approach is that it is an extra step in block production. It might help save you from needing a HEPA filter, but it's more labor.
Thanks Andrew! I inoculated (5) 10-lb master's mix blocks with Ganoderma Sessile and all of them fruited successfully. Yield was slightly lower than what I would have if I would use grain spawn to inoculate. Although I think it is very practical to use this method for the kind of species that we don't grow very often like reishi, turkey tail, etc. Just to eliminate labor and time on preparing grain spawn. I would like to see the results of fruiting the oyster blocks in your video!
You are welcome, and I'll do an update in the next few weeks. They are pinning like crazy right now!
Loving this open source. Thank you so much for all you do💕💕
You are very welcome!
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial any update on this?
Also trying to keep it simple, testing dry sub, baked for sterilization, add lc to mineral water, bag all and done
I inoculate bulk with LC and seal the puncture with hot glue, it’s very comfortable.
Nice, what's your bulk substrate?
I got Black Pearl LC to grow on my bulk substrate. Hardwood and rice bran is what I used.
Interesting, I'll have to try some rice bran.
I try successfully with blue oyster, lion's mane and golden oyster. I seal the bag of master mix before the autoclave than injected just below the filter patch and cover with micropore tape. Never have any contamination yet.
Interesting, I have tried on Master's Mix many many times with no success.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial maple syrup base for the liquid culture and I check the bag two time in the first week. Work for me
How much mL LC?
I've been having some limited success with going directly from LQC to substrate. Granted, most of this is due to my being new and just not knowing any better, but this is what I did...
First, I put a dollop of high temp silicone on the side of the bag, effectively creating a makeshift self healing port. This is where I made the injection.
Second, I've only done this with Shiitake into a substrate comprised mostly of oak pellets, and with King Oyster into a mix of soft maple shavings, oak, & wheat bran.
In both cases, these were in an Instant Pot for 3 hours for pasteurization...which may give you an idea of the size of the bags (they're smaller).
Third, the growth has been rather slow. In the case of the Shiitake, it's been almost 2 weeks, but there is definitely mycelium growing. The KO showed growth after about a week and is definitely going faster.
Fourth, and this is really showing that I didn't know what I was doing...I used 100 CCs of culture, not 10.
Oh wow, so maybe Master's Mix is possible if you use enough LC?
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial Either that or it only worked because I didn't know it wasn't supposed to work.
@@padoco73 Lol, I've had a few of those myself.
Actually, not knowing what you were doing is probably better, because the shroomery board experts all agree that 80-120 cc's is best for having more successful LC to Bulk Sub inoculation.
Yes yes yes , had luck with GT , manure ,coir ,potting soil. Took forever due to temps being on low side
Great info...Thank you! Any recent updates on the process?
I’ll give it a try. I’ve got some different liquid cultures kicking around. hey man, I’ve got a thank you for that secret you shared about the slicing of the bake open for better pin set. I was having such a hard time getting Bluestone fruit over the summer and then I cut kind of how you did it I did three lines almost like a square and Shernoff I got the blues to come up then I did it with the pinks and I’ve got flushes like never seen before. Thanks dude it change the game for me.
Yeah, I’m just getting started at this. The initial start up wasn’t bad for all the stuff I purchased. I think I got a fair deal on it all and I’m already thinking of expanding. Now I’m only doing this for personal consumption. i’d really love to get a couple more 5 x 5/10 and find a few chefs interested in some fresh fungi. I’m gonna try my best to get a few different species ready at the same time and then go out in the city of Toronto where I am about an hour and a half north of, and hit the streets and see if I can find a few clients I’ve only got one 5 x 5 tent. To use at the moment but I’ve got a spare room that just needs to be sterilized. I was using my 2’ x 4’ tent and using the 5 x 5 as a laboratory for a while. We all have dreams and wishes minus to find some thing I love to make an income that I can live off of. I’m so tired of not enjoying going to work. if you find something you love that can support you. That’s real magic.
The mushroom gods must be smiling upon you for helping everyone propagate them😎
Not exactly bulk but I did 10 ml lion's mane LC to about 5lbs sterilized rye .5 micron filter medium bags from Shroom Supply. I believe I sterilized for 120 mins @ 15PSI. I got 2 meals worth for me and my wife, not sure of weight. Hope you find the magic mix. I appreciate your wisdom, I'm very thankful for you!
Thank you for sharing!
Inovation award of the day goes to you man good man.
Ta-Da!
I’m mixing a new batch of LC from my oysters and wine caps right now just to try out in a week or two.
Maybe I will try a McKenna jar approach but I’m going to use 1 gallon anchor hocking jars instead of mason jars. Pack them with straw heavy bulk substrate and inoculate with LC.
I hate using plastic bags so if you haven’t heard of this here is a quick run down on the tek:
Glass jars, 1/2 full of grain.
Once colonized and consolidated you pop the lid on front of a flow or inside a SAB and fill the jar almost full with substrate. Allow it to consolidate again, then casing layer, and finally fruiting conditions.
Ok, my tek is 1/4 grain and 3/4 bulk subs in glass jars (wide mouth anchor hocking) and inoculate with spore solution.
I have had great success and it could rid the industry of plastic bags once and for all. 🍄❤️
Yeh, I don't really like the glass jars when I tried them as fruiting containers. Too much to get the myc out.
Hi there. Thank you for good and usable content. I have had great success on Cannabis waste. It is legal to grow here in South Africa, so I started trying to compost and use the waste in a waste none production system. I take the wet (fresh) bio waste, pasteurise it, ad it to some pasteurised kraal manure and course compost mix (I pasteurise the ingredients separately, for no other reason than logistics). I then inoculate with liquid culture (a distilled water and 4% honey mixture). Within 4 days I see mycelium growth on the Cannabis. Note: I always mix the parts well, then add a layer of cannabis bio waste wich have been dried thoroughly on the top then drizzle the LC over from the top. Under ideal circumstances I have had a personal best of 20 days from inoculation to pinning. Though the norm is 30 days. This is done in a Southern hemisphere coastal area with a relatively stable environmental humidity of 75% and temperatures ranging between 25 and 27 Celsius.
this sounds like an amazing idea for people who grow both. Any chance you would make a video of this process???
I get that you don't want to shake....but if you do, you get your time back! I do 1 shake after 10-12 days, then 10-12 days later. I use the mycelium density as an indicator. Then i get my oyster from LC inoculation to fruiting in about 30 days. But i did my shaking manually, more of a gentle crumble of the top layer that has growth from the LC, then gentle mix. I don't know how the mycelium would do in a tumbler, since it's not protected inside of grains. next experiment...
Yes, this is very similar to the way I do it now. And time back isn't a concern if I've got plenty of incubation space.
You'll be the first to know if I have any success with this method! I'm about to try brick cap (Hypholoma sublateritium) on sup. oak sawdust. One reason being that they take a long time to colonize grain, but run quickly through nutrient broth, agar, and sawdust. I can't thank you enough for you're inspiration!
Please do let me know!
I LOVED IT ¿have you been using direct transference of the liquid culture to bags since this video?
I've tried this a couple times. I put a layer of cooked oats over the top of hydrated masters mix, put a spot of rtv silicone pressed down with packing tape on top of the bag. Pressure cooked for 2.5 hours. Used a syringe through the silicone to spray 10ml of lc on top of the grain. Broke it up and shook it after 14 days. Fruited it after another 14. I tried this because I don't have a flow hood and thought I would eliminate possible contamination this way.
This yielded around 16 oz first flush on 5lb blocks (I was average about 25oz using conventional methods). There were lots of aborts. And both blocks I tried got contaminated with trichoderma before second flush came in.
Very nice. I've definitely seen it with the grain pocket.
Shade, why do u think you got lower yield and more contamination? Have u found any way to fix those issues? Thanks
@@tims.440 I think the lower yields may have been because the mycelium moved on into the bulk substrate before it had gotten as much nutrients out of the grain as it normally does. Not sure why the contamination kept popping up though. It's been awhile since I've tried this so I'll probably take another crack at it soon.
@@shadetreephilosopher5568 ah. Maybe you could put the grain on the bottom rather than top, and inject thru bag to bottom grains.
I've grown Hericium on Hardwood sawdust and wheat bran, pre-sealed my bags and PCed, inoculated via LC syringe through plastic and cover with micro-pore tape (Might switch to a non-breathing tape because the filter patch doesn't need help in my opinion). I normally inject a few different spots to try and speed up colonization. My first run I did all of my work in a still air box, but second run I did it in open air (In my messy bedroom of all places) just being sure to heat sterilize my needles and clean my injection spots with alcohol and I've had no contamination issues.
You've had pretty good results with this? Is colonization time a lot slower compared to gain spawn? Although I guess consider the time it takes to spawn the grain and then go to substrate may not be much different.
@@jefflambert7513 I have since built a laminar flow box and have been using the traditional grain spawn method and I do have more robust grows when using Grain Spawn but my first several flushes of Lion's Mane were using the technique listed above. You can increase colonization time by using more LC if you have some to spare, but the colonization speeds are definitely slower than grain spawn.
I've had success with LC to bulk using sterilized and supplemented straw in PP5 quart containers. I havent tried bags for this, it's just too messy to work with the straw in large quantities. Colonization times were similar to grain inoculated in the same fashion with LC. The substrate was finely chopped straw and whole wheat flower. I've have not had the opportunity to try straw pellets, I havent found them locally yet. I can barely get HWFP out side of 2 months during winter, I had to agree to buy at least a pallet a month from tractor supply.
You might could try it with Pine pellets. I don't know if it works, but it's in every Tractor Supply I've ever been to. Mushroom Media Online also sells the straw pellets and ships them.
Some years ago I attended a mini course of mushroom cultivation. The guy explained that he had to put some glicose (literally white sugar) on his woodchips blocks to make the mycelial run faster...
I am very inspired by your videos, as soon my test phase ends, I will be building up a THOR like yours.
Appreciate so much for you sharing all this knowledge with us.
Thank you so much!!!
PS: do you send cultures/petri dishes to another country? Here in Brazil I could find only one place with my most desired species that is lions mane... But he is currently out of stock...
That's all interesting stuff! I wish I did ship internationally but best I can do right now is Canada and Mexico.
Salve irmao, como tá indo o processo pra ti?
I’ve put agar into coco coir,vermiculite,and gypsum,and it worked lovely!
THE GOAT mix. oh man, that is great!
Gonna try it with cubensis variations i have straight to my "GOAT" manure mix.....will update here
Thank you for your service. If manure is necessary this might be boss tier for Pans.
Cubes dont need manure...just coco and verm
Yes they are my friend.....The yields are on another level.
Sounds like a good trial.
@@bulldogcottone5595 Yeah but afaik LC --> coco/verm bulk sub doesn't work
I have done this by using a handful of oat grain thrown in the bag with the bulk sub. place it in a way that it sits on the side of the bag somewhat buried. inject through the bag is you did and hit the grain "pocket", mycelium jumps from grain to sub with full colonization in 4 to 5 weeks. Black Pearl Oyster ME Strain, HWFP+20%Bran. Nice vid, keep rockin
-Sam Springhill farms
I've seen people do this before, and I've followed suit. The big thing I have is that it's an extra step and takes time away during the bagging process.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial Your very right. It does however cut out the need for a flow hood. more labor tho... but i think its a good option for small scale growers
Dude! I'm thinking this should be on the news or something. This is huge!
Well thank you. Not sure about all that, but I think it's good news for the community for sure!
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial
Yeah, I was probably overly excited. The tek is always improving. I remember when PF Tek is all I knew. One day, we'll order spore syringes that will fruit in themselves.
I tried this once and it was a disaster lol but I was pretty green. I know why it didn't work. I didn't pc my bags long enough. I'm using a barrel now to sterilize and my contam has dropped dramatically. I'm actually phasing out of mushrooms not a strong market where I'm at, but if I can do this that'll save me a lot of time and energy just for my own personal usage. I'll have to get some of these straw pellets when I'm out of soy. I'm excited about that mix. Straw pellets are really easy to get a hold of than soy. Masters mix has been awesome, but as a hobbyist now I don't want another 1/2 ton bulk bag laying around lol thanks for the great content and info looking forward to seeing more info and trying this myself
I think the straw is replacing the wood pellets not the soy hulls.
The straw replaces the sawdust. I'm working on a replacement for soy right now.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial I'm going to have to listen again because I thought it was the straw that replaces the soy? Sorry i misunderstood
Just a heads up, because it wasn't entirely clear for me, Straw helps bulk innoculation take hold...
I've kinda thought straw makes a good addition to my mushroom grows in the past because I can add ammendments like lime water or other non-organic ammendments without overwhelming the sawdust/protein source Mix.
The fact that it adds a route for fast colonization makes it sound like a mandatory addition, at least for fast growers, to me..
I have made 5# bag of MM with millet soaked for 24hrs and about 1 lb millet on top pc & inject through bag 10ml LC on top. Worked pretty well but I did mix after grain growers in.
I usually just put an inch to a half inch of grain on top of the block and then squirt the liquid culture on it once its pressure cooked. It works. Im a never grower so I havent seen fruiting yet off any blocks Ive done except a lions mane block. But It seems to colonize well and I think I figured out that the wood pellets I was using were bad and probably not sterilized during packing. Lots of cobweb mold.
Pretty cool. I've pressure cooked my steril bags while sealed and they blow up too much and become very weak. But have had some mycelium growth of shiitake and oyster when poking the bag with my liquid culture syringe.
very nice.
I know I’m late to the party but this is the only way I have done it… didn’t realize it was unique. I only grow 10 pounds a week but I didn’t have a lab or super clean space to work out of. I just sterilized my sealed bags injected near the top and then resealed the bag below the injection site. It’s definitely slower in my experience but it works.
Clean Lc is the hardest part. Ive done reshi and oysters on sterilized masters. Both were slow though. Gonna get those straw pellets
Yeh, eventually clean LC is no problem to produce in quantity though. So it gets easier.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial u guys are really doing great things. The personal touch on SM is probably the most time consming, but to someone like me, its the really cool. Equality as cool as growing mushrooms.
@@pyroparrish2783 thank you, and SM?
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial Social Media.
Thank you for sharing! Long live mossy creek
You are welcome!
I've watched a lot of videos done in the philippines. I'm not the most fluent in tagalog, but I understood half of it. They'd take 50 gallon drums and use them steam sterilize mushroom substrate. They'd wait till steam came through the hole in their lid and then time for four hours. It seems to work for them. It might be a cheaper route for new people to try just buying a 50 gallon drum with a lid, building a stand, and then burning wood or sawdust or even burning oil or ethanol or propane to heat the water. I think I'm going to try that rather than use my small pressure cooker cause it's really small.
This is awesome. Congratulations and thank you for sharing. 🙏
Thank you, and you are welcome.
I always wondered why people bother with those grains.
Andrew, you could go direct with pouring directly on too if your substrate before closing your bag then also inoculate by injection towards the bottom as well.
I have been doing this with Master’s Mix for some time now. Not sure why you are getting contamination on top of your atmospheric steam processed bags unless you are not running your sterilization cycle long enough. Maybe use sterilization indicator strips in a few bags towards the top of each run like we do. Just ideas being thrown out there for you.
We use an Eric Myers style DIY sanitary stainless steel drum atmospheric steam sterilization style system. Not sure if you are still using your trough style steamer. Now for the clincher. We can pre-sterilize our grow blocks for use later and still have nice clean no contamination blocks 6 weeks later. This has proven a great asset during these extremely cold nights (-18) due to our steamer being outside and running our water source off the outside faucet.
Your trials with the GOAT mix is fantastic and have talked to Seth as well as placed an order to run trials here as well. Yes, I will share our results with you and the community as well.
Keep the stir bars spinning and making that LC,
Joe & Darlene at NWA Urban Mushrooms
Hey Joe, I absolutely could do this. That said, I'm getting contamination on top as a failure of the filter patch. It isn't on all bags, just two of them. Pouring on top would work better I think. Please do share your results! Keep Spawning Culture!
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial same issue with filter patches. 11 out of 100 have contaminated in the last 2 weeks. Have a call into Unicorn. Not sure if there was a problem with that set of 100 or what. Have not had that issue before. Will let you guys know about pouring direct since I just inoculated 20 bags yesterday.
I can confirm that Lion's Mane LC to MM works
Nice, I'm trialing it out right now myself.
You're the best! Thanks heaps for your contribution to the tree of Knowledge 🙏🙌
Well thank you.
Thank you so much for all the wisdom I’ve absorbed from you! I will help spread the healthy knowledge along
Thank you!
I am so going to try this. Thanks Andrew!
Do it. You are welcome.
Yay! This has been described by Stamets for years. The key is clean LC! I plan on cutting the bag and essentially pouring from the jar to the bag.
I would disagree that clean LC is the key. I tried the same LC on Master's Mix and Goat Mix. Goat Mix was the one that it took to. Master's Mix just doesn't take LC well.
Always innovating, and trying to evolve the game, love it
Thanks, love me some Yelawolf too!
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial" the creek is where is all meets homeboy"
Today I'm sterilizing a bunch of substrate to play with. I'm going to try inoculating Piopinis (beech mushroom) right into the bag (5 lb masters mix blocks). I'm saving some of what I have to put into a jar to grow more mycelium juice. I've heard you can grow them on cardboard logs, so I'll probably play around with that too.
I just had this thought today and you answered my question. Thank you. I will try out Maitake for my experiment.
Is there a follow up video to this one??
How is this experiment going?
I want to know, too!
funny i was just starting to try this myself for our small business, thanks for the info Mossy!
how it works I saw everywhere ppl said is not recomendable, bc mushis need grains as food, but ppl who said that only grow cubensis so they can develop well on wood or coir itself, maybe that what everyone said that. but we grow medicinal and gourmet mushies so they directly eat the lignine on wood, so how it works for you?
Have you considered putting in a dab of RTV onto the side of the bag to create a self-healing injector port? Tape isn't sterile, it would make sense to put a series of RTV dots on the bottom of the bag, layer straw on the bottom of the bag, followed by a layer of grain, then the substrate in the packing phase, then inject into the straw layer through the RTV ports with say 2cc of LC each to spread out the inoculation over a larger surface area.
Update would be great
Squirted liquid Shitake over pressure cooked Paul Stammets mix. Works well! I have gotten it working with as little as 2ml lc.
I actually recently bought a big bag of some oat grains from a feed supply store and didn't realize they didnt have the husk removed and I was disappointed till few days later when I realized i can probably inoculate them just like that and fruit them right away since they have all the extra nutrients from the husk.I am trying lions mane right now.We shall see how it goes.
Yep, I buy mine as Whole Oats. Still have the hull.
Are you just trying to avoid shaking and spawn to bulk proccess? If so you could try doing a small layer of your spawn in your bulk bags and innoculating that after sterilization..
No it totally works been doing this instead its not just oysters 😊
Just to clarify, this is only rice straw pasteurised, when you said it did not work for sterilization method...... Is that the learning .... I mean that this will work only with rice straw and only if it is not staralized. I draw a lot of inspiration from you, and if it is according to His will I too will start a mushroom farm soon. Thanks again
This is wheat straw.
@@bbqpelletsonline thanks. 👍
I've actually done the same experiment with lions mane and pink oyster. I inoculated on 1/14 and they Re both doing great. They lions mane actually has made my biggest top fruit I've had yet. I also don't have a hepa filter but have been running an ac infinity carbon filter.
How did it turn out? And how much liquid culture to substrate did you use?
Hey, I'm also looking into doing LC to bulk. How long did it take from inoculation? Do you think it would significantly speed up the process if you doubled, or tripled how much LC you used?
Thank you for sharing, you guys rock!! Congrats on the success.
I'm not a professional grower but always wondered if that is a good way to do it especially the fast colonizing species!
I knew there had to be, just never could figure it out with good results. Seems pretty plausible now.
Thanks for sharing your research.
I have done it with enoki last month , at this moment the entire top got colonised, but at the top I have put a layer of wheat berries, I going to shake it in couple of days
Yeh, I've seen it done with the grain pockets. But you still have to shake it in, so it doesn't really save me any labor there is what I was thinking.
First time growing pink oysters for me and that’s how I did it, and it started pinning last night , I folded bag and rapped with a few rubber bands to keep air out and steamed for 90 mins let cool and injected through front of bag and sealed with micro pore tape. I only did it that way cause I didn’t want to contaminate anything as I did it from my bedroom
No grain pockets or anything? Just straight to bulk? What was the mix that you are growing on?
I have problem with straw. It does take off but it so easy to contaminate and dry up in my bulk sub.
So cool! Thanks!!!
You are welcome!
You know I have been thinking on something else.... Has anyone done any studies on feeding the blocks after the first flush. I am new and been following you fro awhile but I can't help but think that the mycelium is using grain and the soy husks etc as the primary food source and the substrate bulk more as a house to live in.. it seems to me maybe we could bump up production by injecting sterilized malt extract into the block after the first flush and maybe more... What do you think or has any one tried this that you know of?
Nice! Thanks for sharing.
You are welcome.
We are busy doing LC to blocks as well for some time now,
We mix sterilized grain into the block and then steam it.
So far oysters seem to be the only one to work "well".
(The problem is it needs a quick burst of nitrogen, for them to grab hold of before they can eat the master mix)
Interesting, thank you for sharing that.
I've recently innoculated a load of shoeboxes of cococoir and vermiculite with like a jar of liquid culture... tried to mix it really dry so it wouldn't be too moist when I added the LC but seemed to have gotten it damn close to field capacity. I's been a little slow but so far so good.
Wet Sub = SLow Growing
Yeah. I tried mixing the substrate up with a litre less than the recipe suggested for a 650g block... but as I said, seemed to be very close to field capacity before I added the LC. Wasn't like a smoothie or anything.... just a touch too moist
So it colonized ok... eventually.... but it basically didn't fruit.... there was no nutrition in there at all.... schoolboy error!
Looking to do this as well except directly into hard containers if at all possible. I'd like to steer away from as many single use plastics as possible
I'd be interested in whether you could just swap a percentage of hay pellets into a master's mix to give the LC a foothold. If so, that would lower the cost of the inputs significantly.
I'm not quite sure if this is along the lines you are going for.. I have had success with preparing and pasteurized coco coir/ vermiculite, to field capacity and mixing it 50/50 with prepared/simmered WBS. Jarring them like a BFR cake and pressure cooking for 90 minutes at 15 psi. After inoculation it thrived and colonized quickly. Once birthed there was no need for further substrate and produced some monsters. This might be a small scale of your attempts.. say it was done to the scale of using bags🤔. Just throwing this out there! Love your videos and shared knowledge!!✌
I've done the same thing before but coco and oats instead. It did work.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial is this the same idea you were/are attempting, or did I misunderstand? Either way any shared knowledge is a new channel ✌
Thanks for the great videos!!! We just had a bag of grain that had green mold growing at the top. Why does that happen? Or more importantly how do we prevent it from happening in the future?!
I had 3 all in 1 grow bags spawn + grain and 1 contaminated but other 2 it seemed like they had rapped growth on the sub and the spawn but I will try just sub in a week let you no how it goes
Update? Howd it go?
Well done brilliant👍👍
Thank you.
I made few little bags with sawdust mixed with grounded wheat and corn(about 1-2mm pieces), sterilized in the pc and inoculated with lions mane LC. They are already fruiting.
I am also in testing for a one step LC inoculation on pasteurized substrate for lions mane. I dont know though what is a reliable recipe, to have fast growth but also not too much nutrients in order to contam.
I will also try the bubbling lc tek but I dont have the materials yet and I still have to experiment with what i have.
Thanks!
oysters grow on ANYTHING. I'm looking for doing this with cubes.
From 1:40-2:40 he talks about straw, but he keeps mixing up his words so I’m confused. He talks about sawdust pellets, grain and straw and it’s unclear what he means because he switches his words. Maybe he misspoke?
“It is literally the straw.” 2:09
“And we ran out of sawdust pellets.”2:19
“And he through some on top.” 2:24 (meaning straw?)
“And when I came in and inoculated them, I sprayed the liquid culture over the grains and the pellets that were there....the straw took off way faster than the grain.” 2:26
Can you please clarify? Thank you for the great info!!
Thank you for sharing this!
good content. keep it up!! 👍
I'm actually about to try this. I was thinking the same thing
Ur amazing bro game changer o posted it on all fb group related to mushrooms I have fungi farming group on fb I run mainly in India and western Asia they been asking this question forever I just posted it and sent a video to all these farms in India and Bangladesh I stay in communication with, Thanks so much for all the information it’s golden!!!!🤯🤯🤯🤯🙏🙏🙏🙏🧠🧠🔬🔬🍄🍄🍄🍄🖖🏻
Thanks!
Bless you for sharing
Thank you.
Love your videos my man
Has anyone heard of or tried using sugarcane bagasse as a bulk substrate? I've reviewed multiple experiments resulting in higher yields using it but, I don't see anyone using it or selling it?
Good one!
This is how commercial bottle production is done also,cause you can't shake those bottles esspecially.
And I think there are studies done that you should use closer to 50cc. I'm thinking about trying a ladle and sterilizing it with a torch
I'm hearing this from a couple of other people. Apparently you need to use a lot more LC with wood base than with the straw perhaps?
Great video, as are all of your videos. I find them very informative and I have learned a great deal about mushroom farming-especially how much work is involved. I am planning on growing some for our family so I watch and read on mushroom farming as much as possible - and I like how you are very precise in your operations
I have a question for you. I noticed that some of your fruiting blocks have air in them and others don't. Is the goal to get as much air out of the bags or is some air necessary?
Thank you, and yes I try to squeeze as much air out as possible while the bags are fruiting.
So, you want to grow on Masters using LC. While using pasteurization temperatures with less contamination. Obviously we don't want to add more nutrients to make it easier for bad guys to get the upper hand. What about your water source? Correct me if I'm wrong but in Mycelium running wasn't Paul using 1Tbsp per gallon of 3% Hydrogen Peroxide to reduce contamination when working with wild species in nature with success. After all isn't H2O2 the same thing that mycelium crates to prim its own way? It'll breakdown at 176 f / 80 c. The added oxygenation through your substrate couldn't hurt, and might save you a mix.
Just a thought
I find H2O2 to be very interesting, but we haven't played with it much just yet. Though, honestly I've always like the reliability of heat.
@@Mossycreekmushroomsofficial I was thinking And, not or.
But since your video The Good Funguy found this dude (Drmyc.com), and might start tests soon