Focke-Wulf Fw 190 Pt. 1, design philosophy and features.
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- čas přidán 23. 02. 2020
- A lot of the characteristics that make the 190 a deadly fighter are difficult to quantify. It's not the planes speed, maneuverability or any other easy to measure performance standard. In fact, for most of the war, it's performance was only about average as compared with other front line fighters. What made the 190 special was the designer Kurt Tank's design philosophy which was unusual at the time, and that's the subject of this video.
As usual, I got a bit side tracked at a couple points, thus we cover some He 112 and Spitfire wing development history stuff.
Paddy's video: • Focke Wulf 190 AWESOME...
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Sources:
Focke Wulf: FW 190 in Combat: Alfred Price
Spitfire Story (2nd Revised edition) Alfred Price
Journal of Aeronautical History Paper 2013/02 "The Spitfire Wing Planform: A Suggestion
Focke-Wulf Fw 190: Workhorse of the Luftwaffe.: Jay. Spenser
Butcher Bird: The Focke-Wulf FW190 Edward Shacklady
Pilot's Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge
Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators
NACA report 487 Tests of three tapered airfoils based on the N.A.C.A. 2200, the N.A.C.A.-M6, and the Clark Y sections
Please consider supporting this channel on Patreon: / gregsairplanesandautom... - Auta a dopravní prostředky
This is the type of gentle and obviously historically informed American accent that British people like me love.
Usually I have to turn to British people to find someone nice to listen too! But Greg is excellent
@@Rift45 He sounds just like American Chess Grandmaster Hikaru Nakamura.
British people like our accents? I always thought it was just us Americans liking British accents ;)
Tulsa accent. T-Town, USA.
What does historically informed mean? I m a linguist so I'm curious.
I absolutely love the analogy of a racing horse and a cavalry horse. Having spent some quality time living on a tank in combat I gained a great appreciation for machines that are simple to maintain/repair, have redundant capabilities, and are generally overbuilt. It's one thing to say something has great capabilities; it is an entirely different thing when it has to work all day, everyday. I'll take the latter every time.
Agreed. That's why i love Russian design phillosophy.
"Build it rugged, tough, redundant and simple."
An American fighter plane is almost certain to catch fire and explode if it does a gear up "belly landing."
A Russian fighter plane can slide on its belly from one end of the runway to the other at 200 knots, spark like hell. But it will not catch fire. It will not explode. And it's pilot wil unstrap himself (american fighter pilots are strapped in and out by others) pop open the canopy, step out, and walk away in time for lunch.
EDIT:
here's a video of almost exactly that. A Russian plane goes on a takeoff roll, then retracts his gear without pulling up.
Click this link and skip to 5:00.
czcams.com/video/814kuAcpemY/video.html
As a usmc LAV25 crewman. I totally agree with you.
The FW 190's silhouette has the most beautiful form follows function feel to it than any other fighter of the war. Even standing still, the thing screams "attack!"
This is the best airplane analysis I have yet to hear. There is much 'feeling' to what the airplane represents, it's design philosophy and the minute description of really vitals for an aircraft, a very balanced approach between detail, focus and general characteristics. Hopefully part two will be of a similar quality.
Thanks TPath3, I hope you like Part 2, and I'm working on Part 3. I think you would also like my Turbo vs. supercharging videos, and my P-47 series.
As a licensed A&P mechanic in my mid-sixties, I really appreciate this video. My father, a B-17F ball turret gunner in 43-44, shot one down. Thanks!!
Your grandfather had a healthy set of balls. Those ball turret gunners were a very brave group of men..
We need to remember what they went thru..
@@johngault7329 , my dad :).
@@jameshajjar9040 what did he say of those days?
This aircraft, and my grandfathers description of it flying past his ball turret (B-17G), are one of many things that inspired me to become a pilot. This is one of the finest, if not the finest material on the 190 I’ve come across. Great work.
Again thanks for the shout-out and giving proper credit. If you have trouble with downloading footage, let me know. I could just send you some raw footage if needed.
Your videos deserve being shared more (with the appropriate credit, of course!)
Thanks Paddy.
Thanks to both of you! It is good to see gentlemen work together. I'm looking forward to part two where you might discuss the engine and it's advanced control systems....or the 190's diverse armament...fighter bomber, wilde sau, escort fighter, interceptor, its flight characteristics, its weaknesses and...and...and...I hope this will be a ten part series!
@PaddyPatrone I had watched some of your videos, but only came to know your channel because this Greg's video. Excellent channel. And... Subscribed!!!
@@waynebrinker8095 Totally agree
Prandtl is famous in fluid dynamics and aerodynamics and his contributions are well known in academia and the aircraft industry. His other contribution is the introduction of the concept of boundary layer theory which is used to estimate drag.
Kurt Tank's philosophy is the reason why the FW-190 is my favorite ride in WW2 flight sims. The Spitfire and BF-109 may have been an engineer's pride, but the FW-190 was designed from the ground up to be a pilot's joy.
Insert "military pilot's"
Mine is the P-47 but it didn't have nearly the level of automation that German planes had.
The Kommandogerat, the unit for engine management and control is a jewel in terms of concept and execution.
The plane that is almost universally regarded as a pilot's joy is the Spitfire- even Adolf Galland, when asked by Goering what he needed, said "I should like an outfit of Spitfires for my squadron."
@@TheSoundsage He was just yanking Herman's chain. See "The Most Dangerous Enemy". A bunch of romantics against an integrated air defence; a tactical airfarce (sic) tasked with a strategic mission. Swap the fighters, Jerry would still have been toast. It was a bloody pointless exercise as well. We did not say they could not come; but we did say they could not come by sea.
I was flabbergasted by the speed at which the 38 minutes passed.
That makes me happy to hear. I get a bit worried about video length.
@@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles Don't.
@@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles most people I know like long vids. Just make them the way you think they will be the best product in the end
I watch your videos, and Drachinifel's, and a few others, for long form content like this. I basically treat these videos like full length documentaries. They've basically replaced my interest in documentaries, as I've already seen so many that I already know the basics on a lot of subjects... And a lot of traditional documentaries rarely delve any deeper than the basics, the suface level, generalizations, etc. Shows that try to squeeze all of WW2 in 40 or 50 minutes. Also, after I started learning subjects more in depth, I started noticing a lot more pop history documentaries that basically spread misconception.
Now that I'm a lot more interested in the nitty gritty details, I love watching channels like this. I also really appreciate the research guys like you do. I did a similar amount of research into early jet engines, when I wanted to know which was better: British, or German, or the Meteor vs ME-262 (One of the more muddied subjects). It was a lot of hard work tracking down original primary sources online about performance, and figuring out what it really means, rather than rants from opinionated gamers. I even thought about making a similar series to yours years ago on the subject to dispel myths and cover actual data. I can't imagine how much reading and researching you must do to pump out this much detailed content.
@@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles it seems that you are in the right track with your format.
I am sure that quite a few will actually schedule a time slot in their lives to watch your video. I know I do that, as it would be a waste to just having it running in the background.
I second all said about mainstream documentaries. They often just push established buttons to create sensation and add very little new information.
That he111 masquerading as an airliner.
For one row of long thin people.
Who exit via the belly.
Classic airliner design...
Well, it does get them quicker to the ground and you can service several airports in one flight without having to land. Typical German efficiency. ;)
I believe Ryanair could be interested, faster and cheaper turnover in the airports...;-)
Would have been a better airliner than the Do-17 "Flying Pencil!"
HiWetcam : Well, no it is the cheapest, and the less comfortable and flies to second grade airports, and it is worst than Easyjet...well popular tough...
@@hermannalberts6038
We really loved flyBe, real shame about them
Kurt Tank was a common sense designer. He used what materials that were afforded to him such as the BMW engine, and sub contracting the airplanes components to be built by different manufacturers. He came up with one of the wars best fighters, and was a vary good multi roll aircraft also. It didn't get the nickname Butcher bird by being a slouch. Once again thanks for the great video, I think it's great how you go into such great detail about the subject at hand. I can't wait for part 2.
The FW190 has always been my favorite German WW2 Fighter!
Many thanks for posting this video and I am looking forward for part 2.
Greetings from Guatemala!
I always wondered why Tank designed the 190 with so many electrically actuated features. As a “converted” electrical engineer, this makes perfect sense and demonstrates his forward thinking.
Just look what it did for the B-787: lots of batteries, lots of fires.
The word was "Dienstpferd", which translates directly to duty-horse or service-horse. Your reliable good friend that gets the job done and needs only little care. Love your content by the way.
Shared this with my girlfriend(biology and high school maths teacher.) She was fascinated and impressed with delivery and content.
All else aside, Greg, the Fw-190 is one of the most beautiful and intimidating-looking fighters of any time, and they painted it so well.
And the Panther tank was designed by Hans Flugzeug. I once saw a ceremonial smooth-bore artillery piece at Edinburgh Castle that had a plate on it that said "Camera" :D
Only just started watching Greg's work, and this is *really* good stuff.
Top notch content produced here.
Imo the Fw-190, Yak-3, & Corsair, are my two favorite looking planes of the type. I think perhaps because most books I had growing up were full of mustangs, spitfires, and lightnings and wanted more.
So when I saw the sleek Yak, the angular Corsair, and the Brutish fw 190, I fell in love.
Also love the Condor, I really wish it had been an airliner and allowed to develop.
And an odd aside on the Frise balanced ailerons. They were used on the Piper Warrior I, which was intended as a training airplane. They were too effective in countering adverse yaw, and the Warrior II reverted to conventional ones so the student could learn to use the rudder!
Now that you say that, I always felt the Warrior had an odd feel compared to some of the other Pipers, that may have been it.
Love these type of details.
While I just sell car parts, IMHO, Electrical systems has a slight advantage over hydraulics. Hydraulic systems are an enormous pain when they go wrong, at least compared to electric. They spill hydraulic fluid all over the place, special high pressure hoses and pipes and fittings need replacing. That, and spilled hydraulic fluid costs money, but "spilled" electricity is costs almost nothing and is easily manufactured on the spot. While electrical components are just as specialized as hydraulic ones, they are smaller, cheaper, easier to make and replace, and far more common. Electricity has standards that are more universal, amperage and voltage; two components may require different specs, but understanding what goes where and how is far easier than the hassle of hydraulic fluid compatibilities and different measurements of pressure and viscosity.
The upside to hydraulics is that it is FAR more intuitive than electricity. Pump builds pressure and velocity, more of these makes more power, end devices use this pressure and velocity and return slower and lower pressure fluid back to the pump. Resistance is caused by too small of a pipe or a blockage, and leaks are announced by drips and sprays and emptying reservoirs. Repair, while more expensive and time consuming once found, is far easier to find and understand and can be easily discovered before function is effected. Electricity on the other hand, its faults are usually only discovered when something suddenly stops working or catches fires or sparks and shocks are found.
Those are great points.
@@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles I appreciate it. Especially since it ended up being... longer than intended.
@HiWetcam Yeah... then there are some things that just work better with hydraulics. IDK if it's the power density, the longer design history, or the ease with which hydraulics can be made to self dampen.
I worked in subsea robotics for many years as a Hyd tech /supervisor - I have worked on both types in the same application as a general rule hydraulics have a level of reliability far better than the elec equivalent --also for the same power hydraulics were generally reckoned to be aprox 1/8 of the size.
@@martynrowse5638 In ROVs you can pump hydraulics down the umbilical as much you want for as long as you want to compensate for leaks and loss of power. But electrical is always more compact and reliable. An HPU is many times bigger and heavier than an electrical motor which does the same job.
Very good to hear about the mindset and intentions of the designer, one of the more interesting and oft neglected aspects of design.
Thankyou for covering one of my favourite planes, love the horse anlage, it reminded me of one about the typhoon. It has the temperament of a stallion and the handling of a cart horse.
I live in Columbia, SC right next to our local airport Owens Field. The other week I saw an FW190 in the back corner of one of the hangers. I couldn't believe it. I've been waiting on the door to be open again so I can ask the owner if he'll give me a tour. I'm watching this video so I can have an idea about how it works and impress the owner with my "vast" knowledge of his aircraft haha!
I’m just finishing up A&P Schwerin and working as a mechanic. I love these videos because of all the similarities I see in general aviation aircraft. Thank you Greg
Well done, Greg, as usual. Excellent background information, and - since my Dad was an F6F combat pilot - I couldn't help noticing the similarities between the design philosophies of Kurt Tank and Leroy Grumman: make the plane pilot-friendly, rugged, easy to maintain, straightforward to operate, and so on. While a few Hellcats did fly a handful of missions over southern France after D-Day, to my knowledge, the FW190 and the F6F never met in combat. My amateur's hunch is that any dogfights between the two would have been very interesting, and more than "interesting" for the pilots involved.
Ray Schoch the FW-190 would have won thanks to better climb, speed and roll rate. Not having to lug around naval gear helps.
@@smithy2389 You're likely correct, at least in the main. The FW190 weighs about 500 lbs. more (empty) than the F6F, but the climb rate is significantly better (I'm guessing the FW190 is much more aerodynamic). On the other hand, the F6F's wing loading (37.7 lb/sq ft) is significantly less than the FW190's (49 lb/sq ft), so its roll rate and turn performance might have been (I'm neither pilot nor aeronautical engineer) just a bit better than the 190's - enough to keep it in the game for at least a little bit if the fight was under 20,000 feet. Yes, the Navy hardware imposes a weight penalty, not least of which is that missions generally covered longer-distances, so more fuel was required. Hellcats carried 150-gallon external fuel tanks so often that they eventually became standard equipment, in addition to 250 gallons internally. The Fw190 A-8 (the only model I have easy access to figures for) carried 169 gallons internally - obviously not intended for long over-water flights. After his combat tour in 1944, Dad flew the F4U-4 during the last year of the war, training for the invasion of Japan that never took place. The Corsair was about 50 mph faster than the Hellcat, with a climb rate of about 4,400 ft/sec., so it was a better climber than either the FW190 A-8 or the F6F, and I've read (no direct experience here) that it had the best roll rate of any WW 2 fighter (Greg may have alluded to that in his video on the Corsair). Blah, blah, blah. As I said, you're likely correct, and we'll never know…
HiWetcam the 190 supercharger was more sophisticated because it was a variable speed unit enabling full throttle from sea level to 20,000ft. Greg has already gone through German supercharging.
The merlin 60 used a two stage supercharger with aftercooler. That is why those aircraft had excellent high altitude performance. The Hellcat had a single stage supercharger and was optimised for low altitudes used in Pacific theatre.
In terms of roll rate the Corsair had best roll rate of any allied fighter but the FW-190 was always regarded as the king (although a lot would depend on airspeed).
www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/fw190/ptr-1107.pdf
HiWetcam F6F-5 was in service two years after the A5. So not a fair comparison. You’re right about the supercharger my bad but when compared to the F6F-3 it doesn’t make much difference.
It is true that Prandtl developed the theory of the elliptical wing, based on minimum induced drag considerations. But he actually was disappointed that this theory did not solve the problem he really wanted to address: how birds and insects fly, and how to build aircraft in a similar fashion. His minimum induced drag research was published in 1922, but he would also develop the "normal distribution (bell-shaped)" lift theory based on minimum structural considerations, which helped greatly with the design of tailless flying wings. This would be published in 1931, I believe. It is important to note that the elliptical wing is only "ideal" if minimum induced drag is the consideration. The normal distribution actually is better for minimum total drag, IIRC. Great video, great channel, wish this existed when I was an aero student.
justcarcrazy also the Spitfire has wash-out which sort of ruins Prandtl purist approach.
Man this guy should have a podcast just like his channel, this stuff is so in depth, keep up the good work dude.
I've been waiting for this video. It was worth the wait. IMO this is your best episode. The FW 190 was my favorite fighter of WW2. Didn't get the publicity of the 109. As an electrical engineer I agree with Mr Tank's philosophy of using electrical vs hydraulic systems. Your P 51 schematic of the hydraulic system demonstrates the complexity of hydraulics ... the system looks horrifying for performing maintenance. Plumbing, seals, pumps .. potentially flammable liquid. Give me electric systems anyday. The radial engine with the unique cooling .... the visibility .. the very looks of this fighter makes it one of the best. Thank you for this video. Bravo to your demonstration and teaching skills.
I have the impression that a radial engine draws the centre of gravity forward and hence the wing forward for support.
If so, the aircraft will be shorter and the pilot will have a slightly wider view.
What do planes and tractors have in common?
Push rods are a king.
Hydraulics leak.
Cables snap or get stuck.
Push rods just work.
My Harley shifts with "pushrods".
@@thebobs9343 Harley that shifts? Impressive! ;-)
Some West Germans still believe that we used to push the moon in East Germany with push rods. ;-)
Dude, a radial engine can only use pushrods, and any aero engine of the 40's didnt rev past 4000 rpm, so pushrod was good, now try that on a american car that should go to 7000 rpm and you will start to see they fliyng to the moon.
essentially all inline aviation engines since ww1 are overhead cam. Since the crankshaft to valve distance could change dramatically due to temperature variations during operation, engineers worked to minimize the length of valve stems, pushrods and rockers so that the variation wouldn't negatively impact valve lift or duration. The most efficient way to do this was to use overhead cams and eliminate pushrods entirely.
Your videos are fantastic. As a aircraft enthusiast born in 85 I watched endless aircraft documentaries on TV, built models and read books. Your in depth analyses give so much more insight and I appreciate them very much. Keep up the good work!
Kurt Tank was the most legendary aeronautical genius of the WW2.
His right hand man Hans Multhopp was taken to Britain as prisoner along with all the documents of FW 190. Multhopp’s experience and engineering skills have been extensively exploited by the British..
20:31 in model airplanes we call this feature "Exponential" done by computer mixing. Amazing that the Germans had that in the FW-190
I can see why it's called that. In flight simming, you can usually set up a control sensativity curve for your joystick that accomplishes the same thing. Never started messing with it till trying to fly extra 300s in FSX or play competitively in War Thunder sim mode.
Anyway, it looks like a graph with an exponential curve (like, Y=X²) when you set it up to deflect a lot less close to the deadzone, and not ramp up till the stick is near the end of its limits. Planes like the extra 300 in FSX, or the fighters in War Thunder sim mode, really need this. Otherwise, aiming guns will be a chore of constant over correction, snap rolling too far on accident, and pulling back on the stick to turn immediately stalling you out.
Not an unusual feature.
@@hatman4818 y=x^2 is not exponential
This guy is so homely and humble.Stumbled onto this by accident and now I'm hooked!
Having just finished building a 1/32 scale model of the FW190 I found this video fascinating.
So thank you sir.
Awesome video with technical details. I love it! Thank you very much. Loving fw190-D
Best channel on youtube. Love the in depth analysis explained so clearly, must take a lot of time to present this content... it's appreciated.
Keep up your sidetracks, they are what make this channel unique and interesting👍The fact that your videos are long and well researched because they are based on extensive reading has actually motivated me to start reading up on the stuff I used to live on (history and philosophy) once upon a time. Now I don't know how many channels really motivate people instead of just getting them their pastime kicks, but yours sure as hell is one of them....!!!
I tend to put your videos aside, Greg, until I can give them my FULL attention and never have I been quite as rewarded for doing so as with this video. What I most enjoyed was the time you took to establish the *context* of the 190 so thoroughly. As one commenter noted, never has 38 minutes passed quite so fast and left me keenly wanting more. Yeah, we're all geeks on this channel in a fundamental sense for being so enthralled by a subject that's becoming ever more esoteric. But that's a legitimate source of pride 😉
I love your explanations, detail, and sensitivity to the personalities involved in these machines.
Judd Peterson, son of Major Richard 'Pete' Peterson of the 357th FG flying various P-51 versions. In your video of the comparison between P-51 and Me109 performance, I commented on a dogfight my father had with an Me109 in which they got tangled in a counterclockwise, Lufberry chase circle, and he successfully utilized the lowering of his flaps to create greater lift in his P-51 and cut the radius of the circle smaller. That allowed him to gain on the Me109 and ultimately catch him in the circle and down the enemy plane. During later debriefings to learn and share how to get out of a Lufberry chase successfully, there was further discussion about how to deal with an enemy fighter pilot who might be employing the same flap strategy. During this discussion, one conclusion was that, if the enemy plane were a FW190, then you wouldn't have to worry about their similar use of the flaps for better lift in a Lufberry chase circle. Because the FW190 has "split flaps" which do not modify the aerodynamic shape of the upper face of the wing, they cannot generate increased lift and, therefore, cannot be used in a tight Lufberry chase circle to shorten the turning radius by increasing lift. Something my father was advised of during those debriefings.
I absolutely appreciate all the time and effort that goes into these thoroughly researched videos. I’ve always been fascinated by WWII aircraft and the technical detail you give these magnificent warbirds is just fantastic. Great work as always. Cheers
can’t wait to learn more a bout that engine, i’ve always found that the control system (what little info is out there about it) is very interesting
Excellent Greg. I vastly appreciate the time and effort you put into these vids. The content is superb. I have learned so much and my admiration for all things in aviation..has increased. Good day and I look forward to the next vid in the series.
Can't wait for part 2. Always love Greg's videos, so many interesting tid bits and insights.
awesome video greg, learned a lot man thanks for your work on it.
Thanks GS. I love your channel, and I noticed you added some WW2 dogfighting, nice work.
According to my uncle Hap Kennedy (Spitfire triple ace) the Spitfires elliptical wing design was such that it began to vibrate before stalling completely. This KEY characteristic allowed Spitfire pilots to fly to the edge of a stall in a turn without worry...they just backed off their pull on the stick slightly if vibration occurred. Thus they were able too get the most out of their Spit in tight turns. He could pull G forces to the limit of the human body. Thus he was NEVER out turned in combat! In other aircraft pilots had to carefully monitor speed and leave a considerable safety margin lest they snap into a stall, with fatal consequences frequently.
As usual, great in depth technical analysis! Nice to see a full size replica 190 flying as well. Can't wait to see Ep, 2!
hello Greg, thank you for your brilliant work.
on the elliptical wing look for the Brothers Siegfried & Walter Günter ; they used this design since the mid 20´s .
Pilot of the Fw190 in the Video was sympathic Alsacian Marc Mathis; died in 2015 test flying a homebuild aircraft of his friend
Gruß Linus
I duff my cap to that man, must of been in he's 90s. RIP Mr mathis
As somebody who has actually worked in aircraft design, the whole idea of "copying is shameful" in industry is just absurd fanboyism from armchair aviation enthusiasts. Yes, Supermarine absolutely copied Heinkel, there is no doubt in my mind that is exactly what happened because looking at existing solutions and applying lessons learned prior is a core part of advancing engineering and making a successful product. But Supermarine, nor any other company that made elliptical winged aircraft could never admit that because it would look bad from a PR perspective.
Science, and by extension engineering, is not a competition, it is a global collaborative effort. Everybody gains from sharing info. Building on what already exists the the very soul of engineering as a whole. It's the *companies* that are in competition, not engineers, and they have a vested interest in promoting the idea that other designs are in some way "shameful" because they used things another company pioneered.
@Nixod I agree with you about engineers that need to improve on each other designs...But there is a lot more to a wing than its plantform shape !! I believe that the Supermarine engineer just say the truth about their wing section being much thinner. After all lifting line theory, which is the theoretical basis behind "elliptical" wings, was published in the 1920s.
In fact, for an aerodynamicist, a wing is "elliptical" if the lift is distributed in an elliptical fashion along its span. This can be achieved using any combination of section, plantform shape, and twist... The wings on a PA-28, a 747 or an A380 are all "elliptical" in this sense, because it is the most efficient design.
However, I do not think it is appropriate from the video author to try to judge on this kind of topic if he does not really understand the science behind it.
@Confederate Nationalist Wasn't that more to do with area and loading? I think it is as much, if not more, about the pilot than the 'plane. By the time the Tempest got into the fight, the Luftwaffe was way short in all areas.
It is refreshing to read comment like this on youtube under war machines video. As an engineer i totally agree and we were even taught in our first year of the university, that inventing something already invented is the stupidest thing engineer can do.
@@michalmilko8347 totally agree don't spend time reinventing the wheel!. Concorde and Concordski both performing in the same environment, at the same performance envelope, both looked remarkably similar, aerodynamics are not worried about who uses them they work the same for everyone.
@@szut88 I agree completely.
Luv the way ya say Have a Great Day at the end . . I will because of watching this
Ever since I built the FW-190 Airfix model, I have been fascinated by the apparent paradox of it simplicity, the poor performance of its rated specifications, and the many Allied and Axis reports of its superb performance. If ever there was a plane the belied its specifications, it was the 190. Thanks, Greg, for finally making everything make sense.
Dammit Greg, I will be busy at school when this premieres.
That all said, I will be eager to watch this long awaited video. From the description alone I am eager to see what you make of Kurt Tanks philosophy that resulted in a remarkable fighter that.
Hi Cannon, I'll be sure to check the comments well after the premier so if you have a question, I'll be here for you.
I'm watching it right now
Thank you Greg for making this video! It is one of my favourite planes and I appreciate the effort you put it to give us information that we do not usually hear/ is harder to find. More of this would be wonderful!
Thanks Zayn, there will be much more of it.
@@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles As an early aerospace student this videos are part of the inspiration for me. Its very interesting to look at the solution people develop at these times where the competition is high. I like the breakdown and analysis these provide
Greg, I enjoy every one of your uploads, both aircraft and automobiles. But, I've really been looking forward to this FW-190 series. It's always been one of my favorite single seat, piston driven, fighters. Thanks for all of your time and effort! Semper Fi, TreeTop
Video is about the Focke Wulf 190
10 minutes in and its talking about the wing shape of the Spitfire and the He-112
Theres still 20 minutes left
And theres a second part of it
God ive been looking for a channel like this for years.
Greg, Outstanding Presentation! It is great to watch the segment with a high level of technical description as well as pilots' perspective. as a pilot myself I greatly appreciate the knowledge and pictorial representation of the key points that are discussed. I thought I knew quite abit about the 190 series but I realize there is still much to learn about Tanks' approach to designing a very "user friendly" high performance airplane.
Thanks Rich.
There are some comments about the Heritage Museum's FW-190D. Last I heard, it has been restored to a sort of museum flying condition. Virtually everything is restored to 'stock'. And the high performance Jumo engine is in perfect running condition. However, it is not Airworthy or flyable. This is due to very understandable reasons... Late in the war, which Germany was losing, the expected lifespan of an airframe was very short, and due to critical raw materials shortages certain parts of these 'late war' aircraft were fastened together with glue, or with iffy fit and finish, as corners were cut to meet production goals. I believe that this aircraft *could* be made Airworthy - - but it would have to be rebuilt differently(better) such that it would not require the equivalent of complying with numerous A.D.'s every 5 or 15 hours, which is crazy in the modern world. Truthfully the only realistic thing to do is spend $$$$$ and build a replica using superior construction techniques. Cheers ;)
+Daniel Johnson I think it is fine that the D-13 stays on the ground. And while it was restored again to a better standard I think it would need more work to actually be certified for flight. Doug Champlin had a lot corrected including new electrics and new fuel tanks, etc but I think there is more to do. There are two or three Fw-190D-9 projects that are in progress or just starting, but those owners are not in a particular hurry to finish those projects soon. Jerry Yegan's Flugwerk Fw-190D replica may get a proper Jumo 213 soon and fly as a replica.
They are not certifying it because it is too rare to fly. It has nothing to do with the nonsense reasons you propose...
once again Greg, you have managed to answer most questions that have been nagging me concerning most systems covering my favorite fighter. An all around aircraft serving the needs (right place, right time) of the typical fighter pilot, and doing it quite well.Thank you.
Thank you Greg that was fantastic I really enjoyed the research and knowledge you uncovered about Kurt Tanks engineering design philosophy behind the FW190. I felt that wonderful glow you get when you learn something new, I for one will certainly appreciate the engineering in that aircraft than I ever did before, together with Kurt Tanks design work. I,m looking forward to part 2 Greg, cant wait !!
Dienstpferd = “Horse which serves”-> Horse soldier ...
Literally a "service horse".
Brilliant guys, thank you!
Workhorse is a better translation
phunkracy : I may disagree: Workhorse = Arbeitspferd (Common word in german but not the word used by Tank) . Dienstpferd is a horse which is drafted for military service and is currently on duty. (Yes Horses were drafted !)
A work-horse may be a translation? In Denmark we still have very heavy horses pulling beerwagons from the wellknown Danish Brevery, "Tuborg", during summer when tourists come to Copenhagen and may see them in town, delivering beer to restaurants and shops!
Who would dislike this video? To me, this is some of Greg’s best work. Looking forward to part 2.
Someone expecting video game cheats.
Spitfire fanboys
Another supurb production Greg. Thank you! By far the most informative, engaging, perceptive work i've seen - online or in print. You provide what to me are fresh perspectives and new detail in your videos, even though I've had a life-long interest in the more technical apects of aviation
Link been Facebook posted :) the man who makes these videos is a very good teacher he keeps the technical details as simple as possible but not to simple and will try to push your understanding curiosity farther
I've always found the Fw 190 an interesting type, especially given it's performance whilst having a radial engine and the aerodynamic profile associated with that.
Thanks for another thoroughly researched and informative video.
The difference in drag between radial engine aircraft with their profile and the drag of an in-line engine aircraft like a P51 or a Spit is less then you'd think it is, I saw the drag numbers on a P47 and a P51 from the NACA tests and wherein it's been a while and I can't quote what they were I was shocked to see how close they actually were.
If not for the FW-190, 200+ engineless Ki-61 frames would have stayed on the ground. Instead, with a Mitsubishi Ha-112-II radial engine, the Ki-100 became a successful Imperial Japanese Army interceptor. czcams.com/video/1efXdEUjC_w/video.html
People tend to overstate the drag difference between an inline engine and a radial engine, after all the fastest prop plane during this era (both prototype and production) was the XP-47j. It only had the same amount of power as the P-47M and P-47N yet was able to hit 505MPH (not that shy of an ME-262). Really the factors of airplane speed are such that you really can't put so much weight into just one factor.
@@doc7000
One thing that people don't realize about in-line engine planes is that they have to have some sort of scoop for their radiator which causes drag, people only look at the nose of the plane and think that's the end story but it isn't.
And before anyone even goes there that whole "meredith effect" thing is a myth, the NACA reports from test flights show that.
Another myth is the "laminar flow wing", NACA tests showed that the benefits from it were not only negligible but what little benefits did come from it are completely negated by any imperfections in the wing such as from manufacturing and even bug strikes completely cancelled what little effect it had.
@@dukecraig2402 There were some attempts to do away with the radiator scoop and use "evaporative cooling" - but it never made it onto a combat aircraft as far as I know - and of course then the jet engines came in.
Ooooooo the 190, this will be a blast to listen to as I get home from school
Only after your homework!
@@spottydog4477 Spottydog 4477 still lives! Waiting for a release from you. Great stuff.
@@thebobs9343 ahaha - Thanks, yes I must do something...all the best!
The elliptical planform came out of Prandtl’s analysis determining the minimum induced drag for a given span. This yielded an elliptical Spanwise Lift Distribution (SLD) and was basically correct; however, Prandtl himself recognized that an aircraft is a tradeoff between weight and drag. So, he used the same lifting line theory and changed the optimization from minimum induced drag for a fixed span to minimum induced drag for a fixed root bending moment. This yielded a parabolic SLD. This parabolic SLD had about 15% greater span and even lower induced drag than the elliptical SLD. The really interesting thing is that even though the Spitfire had an elliptical spanwise chord distribution, it did not actually have the “optimal” elliptical SLD. Why? Because if an elliptical wing has no twist, then every section along the span is just as likely to stall at the same angle of attack as any other, meaning that the smallest asymmetry would make roll-upon-stall behavior unpredictable. Supermarine gave the Spitfire washout to ensure a progressive stall from root to tip, maintaining both dihedral effect and roll control. This meant that the Spitfire was not only forgiving during low speed maneuvering, giving it’s pilots the confidence to go there, but also allowed for a lighter structure because the actual SLD was closer to the ideal parabolic. Interestingly, both the Bf 109 and FW 190 had unpredictable behaviors near stall, putting their pilots in a less comfortable position.
Awesome content Greg, truly one of the most in depth and enjoyable channel on YT! Thank you, sir:)
14:23 "Dienstpferd" could be translated as service/duty horse. And thanks for all the great content its really enjoyable. Greeting from switzerland
"Labor horse". In english, this is usually expressed as "workhorse" -- a 'jack of all trades' or multi-role aircraft.
You beat me to it i should have read a bit further before posting, Gruezzi aus Hirzel, 8816
Dienstpferd means an all-purpose, every-day, multi-tool horse in contrast to a fancy full-blood racing horse or a toy for rich-mans daughters.
But they didn't design their tanks like that fortunately
The correct English translation would be destrier. Not exactly a draft horse as it is not bred to pull anything but a heavy riding horse bred to carry a knight in armor at speed on a battlefield or on a tournament ground.
The engine cowl design development is a fascinating story and is one of features of the Fw-190 that was copied in other designs like the hawker sea fury.
A special video on the Fw-190 cooling spinner design and subsequent cowl design development?
graham hufton
The bearcat also shares some passing resemblance to parts of the 190. Could be inspiration, could be they thought of it already and saw a plane using it and decided “k, now we know it works, don’t gotta test it too much”
@@spindash64 Wildcat>Hellcat>Bearcat, Grumman's own special sauce. I'd be interested from the under-cart perspective, rate of descent and what-not, if you could carrier qual an FW. Probably a more likely carrier fighter than the Seafire.
@@stevewatson1640
That’s true. For what it’s worth, the P-51D actually underwent carrier trials, and while it wasn’t a perfect fit, the USN was satisfied enough to consider the ETF-51D project for more serious production before the capture of Iwo Jima made the idea unecessary.
The 190, meanwhile, definitely seems a solid carrier plane basis, and if the Kreigsmarine ever got the Graf Zeppelin, a modified 190F probably would have been the backbone of their AirPower:
Resilient engine that can run high power at low speeds without overheating
Rugged landing gear that can survive multiple rough deck landings
Short wingspan allows for multiple 190s to be fit into a carrier, even if folding wings weren’t part of the design
Really, its worst traits for Carrier landings would be worse forward visibility than the 109, and rather hard stalls. And both of those could be dealt with, especially since the 190 was burly enough to survive a hot landing
@@spindash64 The Mustang is listed as such in "The Pentagon Paradox", I didn't know about the Iwo Jima detail though. "Forget it, it's a 'Frank' mightn't have been a thing around Okinawa with P51s on flat tops! Thanks for the info.
Man!This narration is as beautiful as the subject matter!Its like a genial, genteel professor has taken me aside to explain the finer points of a rugged, practical yet refined WW2 war horse of an airplane. Thank you!
Impressive on both info & presentation fronts. I learned more about “der Würger” in this video than from anywhere else - can’t wait for part 2! Only Greg can keep me interested in flap, aileron & rudder control systems
Another jewel of a video.
Many thanks, Greg.
Once again, thank you, SIR Greg. There was a lot of stuff I had never known before, and I used to think of myself as an expert on these things. How wrong was I.
Here from Greg, who recommended you and rightly so. Subscribed immediately after I saw the 109 DB605 low passes. What a sound!
"Dienstpferd", literally "service horse" - or "work horse", if you will.
Correct. It's pronounced "deenst-pferd." In German, both letters of the "pf" are pronounced, so the sound is "pf" - exactly as it's spelled. Sounds strange to us because it's not a sound used in English. So it's "pf," both pronounced, with the "ferd" part pronounced like the name "Ferdinand."
"Dienst" is also found in another important term from WWII - "Sicherheitsdienst," the SS intelligence service, AKA the SD.
@@davegrenier1160 your pronounciation advice only makes sense if you prononce ferdinand in the german way if you could do that you wouldn´t need the pronounciation advice. ferdinand in english is pronounced quite differently not like the german pferd at all. i emphatise though since there´s no pf sound in english you just have to listen for examples online dict.cc usually has prononciation examples for almost every word
Symmetrie Bruch
So F-urd as the English way, and F-ehrd or Fayrd as the German way?
@@spindash64 yup pretty much but like i said listening for yourself is usually the way to go www.dict.cc/?s=pferd
@@symmetrie_bruch As a German I would write it for English native speakers "deensed fared" since we here in the north (I'm from Bremen, the city the FW was assembled and now parts of the Airbus) dont pronounce the "pf", we just say "f"
In conclusion: in the city they made the FW 190 they said: "deensed fared" and it means a horse as how the police or cab drivers use it. A "work(ing)" horse, if you will.
As a point,the I.Ae. 33 "Pulqui II"was a jet aircraft designed in Argentina by the Aerotechnical Institute and built at the Military Aircraft Factory. The famous German designer Kurt Tank, together with the Argentine engineer Norberto Morcchio and a team of Argentine/German collaborators, had a capital participation in the project. Only five prototypes were produced between 1950 and 1959. Then he worked on aeronautical developments in India, before returning to Germany in the late 1960s to work as a consultant for Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm (MBB). This is the last copy of the Pulqui II, exhibited in the National Aeronautical Museum of Argentine. czcams.com/video/j00FKDc-f60/video.html . Greetings from Argentina.
So much research and work was put in this video. Made it interesting and fascinating. Great job, sounds like a lot of the design features are somewhat still in use. Bravo to the plane designers.
Great job Greg and I'm looking forward to part 2! I bet you raised some blood pressure with the wing discussion.
My favorite WW2 fighter, in all its forms all the way to the Ta152. Difficult to find a more versatile platform that Kurt Tank's masterpiece.
I never thought I'd hear the 190's performance described as "generally mediocre;" so I'm charged up to hear about that in part 2. Thanks Greg for another remarkable video.
A lot of the claims about it's performance are in relations ship to early Yaks and the Spitfire Mk V. As newer enemy planes came out, the tables turned a bit, so on average, yes, the 190's performance was about average among front line fighters.
@@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles Mmm, maybe, maybe not. While there is some merit to the fact that the performance of later war Allied aircraft was improved - I think a lot of those tables being turned on the 190s was more due to the fact that by 1944/45 German pilot training was nowhere near the quality of the pre-war and early war standards. That and the fact that the Germans were being numerically overwhelmed on all air fronts. As I believe Stalin said "Quantity has a quality all its own."
Wow I do have little chills thinking about that plane... Used to fly it pretty competitive in Il-2 with a squad.... The A6 and Dora's were always my favorite. Such a mean machine... (sadly I bought the x52 HOTAS... And it really does not work well for presice inputs...)
I always liked the design, it's got a quite a utility flavor to it. And for sure the versatility of it is pretty stellar for a German plane in WW2....
Oh and mg151/20 ftw 👌
Nice Video, looking forward to part 2.
an excellent run down on it seems a rarely discussed aircraft. i learned much. particularly the rod/bell crank and bearing systems for control surfaces. additionally, the electrically driven worm gear drives for sub systems. keep up the great work.
Greg, thanks a lot for another very interesting, well researched video. Recently you featured the Ta-152, now the Fw-190 in multiple parts - both being my favorite birds it's a joy to follow your channel.
But allow me one bit of criticism. I wish your videos would be louder somehow (the former sound engineer in me advices to bring the microphone closer to your mouth which will bring your voice up and reduce ambient noise plus room reflections) and, in the case of this very video more consistent in volume (after 35:40 it becomes nicely loud again). Luckily your good narrator's voice is very, very intelligible which balances it out a bit.
Again, thanks for the good videos and the channel.
King Fonk Greg’s mentioned before he’s not dealing with the best audio setup, especially given that he records a lot of these while traveling... and he needs to travel light.
I absolutely love your videos and I really appreciate how you work things out. I would really love it more if you could improve your sound quality. Not easy when you're recording in hotels between trips, but some consistency and compression will go a long way. I usually get to hear these videos in the morning and with the kettle or microwave found, you're too easily drowned out. Keep up these! They really are fantastic
Wonderful job great amount of ybinhehd
This is why I love BMW. The technological leaps they make in everything, have been astounding... from Bi-plane to Airliners in a matter of years
Thank you very much for the in-depth video. I've never been a fan of the Fw-190 series, I've always thought they looked awkward. However, I never understood why, exactly, they excelled, particularly on the Eastern front, which this video did a good job of explaining. I look forward to following this series
Today, 24 February (1898) Kurt Waldemar Tank was born (died on 5 June 1983)...
Kurt Tank was probably one of the most giftet airplane designers of that time? Sadly there isn't a book about him!
@@finncarlbomholtsrensen1188 If you have German: Kurt Tank - Konstrukteur und Testpilot bei Focke-Wulf
Wagner, Wolfgang. - Bonn : Bernard und Graefe, 1991, 2., durchges. Aufl.
RIP
im hype for this. enjoy listening to these while playing flight sims. keep up the good content greg!
"Talk to me Goose!!!"
War Thunder?
Bojan Ivanisevic because I want to get shot down by red starred ufos all day. 😂
@@bojanivanisevic1072 lol flight sim
The Fw 190 variants is one of my favourite airplanes, great! Keep posting 👍👍👍
I think you've covered plenty of stuff I've never seen or read before already. Enjoy your work a great deal mate, well done again. Thorough,detailed and interesting.👍
45 waitng, 90 likes even before the video is viewable.... :-)
Edit: and the video is great as usual and well worth watching !!
Hi Greg,
Firstly thanks again for yet another brilliantly detailed video. I love the mix of fact and informed opinion. I’m impressed by the variety and quality of source material. And finally I very much enjoy your delivery, both in coherency and with the occasional dash of dry humour.
On that last point of coherency I’ve noticed on most of your videos your voice seems to be a bit quieter (audio at a lower level) than most of the others on CZcams. Occasionally the audio levels jump around a bit too. So I did a little bit of measuring, because I record audio for a living, and in this video your voice averages about -29LKFS which is about 5dB below the standard for the USA. This isn’t the end of the world and is easily fixed by just turning the volume up a bit. However later in the video between 23:39 and 34:41 the level drops to -39LKFS which is very quiet.
Anyway the long and short of this is I’d like to help you tweak your recording/production process so the audio quality is up there with the excellent quality of the content. I’m fairly certain this shouldn’t cost you any money as there are plenty of tools available for free on most platforms. And of course, only if you’re cool with me doing this.
What are you recording your voice overs with? (Inbuilt microphone on phone, tablet, laptop or is it an external microphone)
What video editing software/app are you using to put together the videos?
If you’d rather do this in private instead of getting a public tutorial I’m happy to do that too. Alternatively I guess I could make my own CZcams tutorial on levelling and normalising audio… How hard can it be? ;-)
Regards
Grant
Audio Engineer
Sydney, Australia
Hi Grant. Normally I record on my cell phone, the last three videos have been recorded on an Ipad, which doesn't seem to work as well, but I left my cell at home, so until I get home, it's Ipad or nothing.
Greg's Airplanes and Automobiles Thanks for the reply Greg.
Will put my thinking cap on and investigate the best ways to get consistent levels on iOS devices.
Do you use iMovie to edit your videos?
And do you put the photos and film in the timeline first and then do the voiceover or do you do the voiceover and then drop the photos/video in afterwards?
@@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles Hullo again Greg,
I've done a 5min tutorial on voiceover microphone technique on a phone/tablet.
czcams.com/video/IyliQEmSUqM/video.html
To sum it up, get close the mic, but there is a little more detail than that.
Recorded totally on my phone apart from one bit on my iPad for a comparison. And totally edited in iMovie. Having listened to myself I really do need to work on not saying "aaaah" while waiting for my brain to catch up with my mouth. I'm sure you know the feeling. Anyway I hope it helps and I'm looking forward to part 2 of the Butcher Bird.
I once worked for a warbird restorer/mechanic who either had a theory or had read about the 190 being direct inspiration for both the Sea Fury and the Bearcat - that they even looked similar from the side. I guess I can kinda see some resemblance looking at the Fury, but I don’t know…has anyone else heard this? Almost seems like someone seeing something in a cloud, whereas I see…a cloud.
Speaking of the Sea Fury, I worked on a restoration project on one, what a tank! The fasteners were interesting as some were British Standard (BS sockets), along w another one or two ‘standards’ - BA, I think, was one. I guess I just thought maybe they’d use metric, and it made me wonder what Japan and European mfgs used as their systems of measurement.
Anyway, a deep dive of the Hawker Sea Fury and another on it’s Bristol Centaurus (maybe another on sleeve valves) would be neat.
Excellent! Thanks for the Vid! Looking forward for more parts in FW190...Cheers!
Always had a special interest in the FW-190 (and the P-47) because they just looked like they were MADE to fight. How interesting to learn how that was indeed central to Kurt Tank's design philosophy. Wonderful research.
The p47 was developed based upon operational research of air combat data. Pilots were extremely surprised to be assigned a plane with such characteristics, but odd things like a roomy cockpit, heating, automated controls, and lower noise levels in addition to easy landing and ruggedness were deemed more important that manuverabilty.
I had to strain my ears to ear you Greg, Very interesting
I recall reading years ago that during a visit to England in early 1943 Leroy Grumman was so impressed with a captured 190's design and performance he had the then on the drawing board F8F redesigned and made smaller, bucking the trend of ever larger and heavier fighters.
The F8F was already planned to be a lightweight fighter interceptor. thanlont.blogspot.com/2011/02/conception-of-f8f-bearcat.html
I admire the FW-190 greatly, but it was simply a well executed and well packaged design rather than a revolutionary trendsetter. The engine/supercharger control system is new, but allied designs were coming out with different levels of automatic boost control as well.
Great video, Greg. Cheers from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.
When I was a young person, fascinated with anything airplane, tank, ship, etc. the FW-190 mostly caught my attention due to the apparent ramp-up in firepower from the Bf-109. Will you address the decision to use both MG-FF and MG-151 20mm cannon?
I'll get to it.
It'll be the MG34/MG41 thing, same as the DB601/BMW801 thing; not enough to go round. For all his belligerence Fritz is rather crap at managing wars