Classic digital cameras with unique sensors.
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 26. 03. 2022
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Martin is the only guy who seems to really talk knowledgeably about the qualitative aspects of cameras - rather than just specs�
Thank you Don, trying to!
Yes itâs so refreshing. Camera manufacturers and CZcams shills do a good job of selling tons of crap that are necessary for 99 percent of people.
i agree with you , only thing i find desirable in modern cameras is IBIS , works with manual lenses , and better video . Doesnt have to be 4K , i am fine with 1440p , because to process 4K that i really dont need for im not a video maker , im a family shooter , 1440p is fine , even Full HD of my 6D is totally fine but it has no IBIS , if it had i would not look for a body at all , on the other hand i dont want to get rid of my 5D , don't want to get rid of my 6D , i want Nikon d700 or d500 , and even as it is now , i have a table full of lenses and bodies , 5D and 6D not being the only ones i have G1x , 550d , 600d and similar . Its literally hard and expensive to get lenses for all of them , but all of them have something to offer . G1x when im just around , and having something decent enough to take a picture , and so on . I am in need of a special cabinet where i can put my lenses and bodies , really no joke , because of dust , for now i have something like it where i use a towel on shelf and i put stuff there , but that is full , my living room table is so filled with cameras that my 15 month baby is taking pictures no joke , even knos how to use tilting screen , i have Canon Sx130IS for her for it is light , she struggles even with G1x , but knows how to turn it on aim it and shoot . Im really amazed by it , but it shows you my ordeal , i would like 1 camera and 1 lens to rule them all , but its just not going to happen .
What is your daily driver , i didnt try Fuji or Nikon , i think i will go for D700 or D600 and just a nifty 50 i use that 50% of time and its cheap , so to get me started . maybe i like nikon more .
indeed
Amen to that mate
This was posted on another D700 video by a user named Nikos Zochios so just copying and pasting FYI:
The D700 has the best colour accuracy and hue discrimination than any other Nikon camera.
The D700 sensor NC81338L (CMOS) has been designed by Nikon and has been manufactured by "Matsushita"
There are some factors that separate the D700 sensor from any other Nikon camera sensor.
About D700 colours:
What makes the D700 colours so special (including excellent skin tones) is its unique CFA together with a unique algorithm applied to its sensor. (different than the D3 and D3s ones)
After the D700, Nikon altered CFA filters in order to boost high ISO performance and fit a bigger number of mpx in the same size sensor. But this required making the filter less discriminating.
The colour discrimination of the specific CFA allows the separation as a unique shade of any single basic colour. Modern cameras' lighter CFAs simply cluster similar shades of a single colour.
So we are coming now to the most important of all the factors which is called "Tonal gain"
This is the D700's sensor pixel area (Photosite):71.70”m2 and this is-a an example- the D850 sensor pixel area:18.88”m2 That means that the D700 sensor has a 279% larger pixel area.
So, let's see why this makes the difference in dimensionality and depth we see on many D700 shots.
Light is a signal. This represents the tonality (colours, contrasts, details) of the subject. Its strength is defined by shutter speed and aperture.
Pixel area (Photosite) is an antenna that receives the signal so it affects how much light per pixel can be gathered. The larger it is, the more light can be collected by a single pixel. BUT, The size of the photosite defines its native signal gain as well.
For a camera to record the maximum amount of micro-contrast and depth of a good lens, it requires low photosite density for higher native gain.
Tonal gain is NOT a dynamic range.
The higher the native gain, the bigger is the gap between the peak of the gain and the noise floor over the same signal.-
Photosites exist at various densities within the size of the camera sensor. Higher megapixel sensors have a higher density and lower native gain.
The ISO defines the applied gain on the photosite so that it can receive a weaker signal. Increasing the gain raises the noise floor.
The Analog to Digital Converter (A/D converter) converts the gained signal into digital information. The quality of the conversion is influenced by Bit Depth.
The Signal to Noise Ratio firmware (SNR) separates the signal (the detail) from the noise (the noise) right before making the RAW file. If the converted gain is low, it will have a harder time figuring out the difference, therefore removing more signals.
So the quality of the TONAL GAIN matters greatly in final image-making.
The current ideal photosite density is 12mp for the size of a full-frame sensor (Nikon D700 - 8.5 microns is ideal)
One other thing to consider. When these classics came out, the manufacturers knew that to sell them to pro photographers, the output have to be familiar in quality to film in order to be accepted. Since then, weâve become accustomed to the âdigital lookâ rather than the âSilver/transparency lookâ and take that as the norm.
But if youâve shot film for 20 plus years in all sorts of formats, you still crave the film look.
I still have Canon 5D classic from 2006. From the business investment perspective, it paid itself off many, many times over. I had a client from 2009 who contacted me recently and asked for some additional photos. He said "I want the same look and feel we did originally 13 years ago". I showed up with 5D classic and 24-70L Mark I. The photoshoot went absolutely flawlessly.
excellent thats a great result
I have a Canon 1D MkIII, I bought it for the 24-70 2.8 that came with it. When for the fun of it ,I took it out with the lens to check it out, I was astounded at how the files look ever so much like Fuji colour slide film files. A lot of people remark this and the 1DsMark II and III are âclassic film look camerasâ. Iâve yet to try the 5D but I have the 6D and it is a wonderful low light instrument.
I wish I still had my iD3
Been using my Nikon D200 professionally for 15 years
I am on my 3rd D700. I made the transition to digital from the F4s. I bought my first D700 and used it for News. Then retired and had a break. I started again with another d700, and through lack of time, sold it. Now I am starting again with another D700. I have come home.
5d classic for sure. 6D mark 1 makes my list. Those two are winners. I also enjoy the Sigma SD Quattro (just don't set it above ISO 100). And then there is the Sony A7RII--it has odd but lovely colors and a very particular image quality which I find attractive but hard to describe. good video as usual.
I love the D700. And also the ones which had those primitive 6 mp Sony CCD sensors like the D100, D50 etc... They're very limited in their use but if you have enough light and colors, with good glass they make magic. I think those sensors are classic.
Yes, I agree the D70 and D40 can perform magic under the right conditions.
In case of CCD sensor, Nikon did the D100, D70/s along with D200, which was the last CCD body for Nikon. D300 was a CMOS sensor. I bought the D70 when they came out in 2004. Shortly thereafter I made a business trip to Monterey on a twin prop plane. I had a seating by the window with an excellent view of the spinning propeller so I started taking pictures of it at different camera settings. At 1/8000s the propeller blades were tack sharp using 18-70DX lens. At slower speeds the prop blades were not disfigured curvature wise as would be the case w/ CMOS sensors. Color wise I love it to this day, however I wish I had invested in better single focal glass instead of a couple of low end zooms.
@@utube321piotr I believe the D40 had the same CCD sensor as the D70. They both give incredible colors and can be had used very affordably.
Pentax *ist D family have that same sensor. It's killer.
The Fuji X-Pro1 punches way way above its weight and I adore it. That sensor is insanely good. I love my Leica M9 also, and that CCD sensor just delivers a quality a really really like. But more than that, itâs the feel and use of both cameras that make them enjoyable for me. No bells or whistles, just turn on and shoot.
100% correct on the XPro1 or even XE1 (both have xtrans1 sensor) or how about the Leica M8 with it's CCD sensor? Or any Fuji camera with an old adapted manual lens (Helios/Takumar)?
The rendering of my Nikon D200 beats the D800, D810, D7500 and D500.
So for me the D200 is a unique classic camera.
it definitely is as everyone seems to rate it, ive never used it but i agree it must go in the list
I own quite a lot soulful old camera's and my absolute top 3 is:
1. Fujifilm x-pro1,
2. Nikon D200,
3. Canon 5D Classic.
Other cameras I own and really like are:
- Canon 6D Mark I
- Fujifilm S5 Pro
- Olympus E-1 & E-300
- Fujifilm X-T1
I loved your video Martin, thanks for the time in putting this content together. I still have my old Canon 1D mkiii which I use side by side with a 5D classic and I still cannot get over how fast the 1D autofocus is with USM lenses with middle point, focus and recompose. The colours it renders have a slightly "cooler" look to what i get from the 5D but definately in the same style. The 1D is the only camera I've had experience with an apsh sensor, but in good light its output RAW files are unlike anything else I've used. Ive used it for countless corporate events, portraits and product shots and providing you use it knowing its limitations, it still delivers paid results even in 2022. I've had my 1D since 2011 as a secondhand purchase, it now has close to 400k clicks and is showing no signs of quitting (saying that there is always a back up body closeby). I'm ripping my hair out trying to get the same "look" from my recently purchased RP, there are so many improvements in technology, but there is just no soul in these new mirrorless bodies:)
Such a good insight. Specs & features vs. image quality/feel. My recent experience - I just traded in my Nikon D500 for a D4. Iâm a sports photographer and the D500 had everything I neededâŠapart from image quality. The images were just soft and mushy and I just didnât like them when it came to editing and sending to clients. So I found a low shutter count D4 and Iâm very happy. I also have a D700 and the hype around the quality of files from that camera is real. So I agree - I can work around having fewer features and specs if I love the image quality. At the end of the day, thatâs all that matters. But letâs keep it quiet - it means we can pick up the great cameras cheap on the used market while everyone else is chasing the bodies with the great new features 90% of which they will never actually use!
yeah i think the D4 is probably right up there too just havent had much experience with it but what ive seen looks excellent, im glad you found whats right for you!
@@MartinCastein have you have had a chance to do anymore shooting with a D4 ? Interested to hear your thoughts as I think it will be right down your alley
@@marte1153 no im afraid not, im looking into the z9 at the moment because of its video + photo features. The d4 i think is one of their best ever though.
Finally someone who appreciates photography for what it is and not so technically in to what camera has this or that at the end of the day is the final product that talks by itself
Iâd put XT1 from Fuji too! The rendering and colours are quite magical, I like all the newer Fuji much less.
The Sigma Foveon Merrill and Quattro cameras are absolute classics. The colors and details out of those cameras are just mind boggling, especially printed large.
I also quite like the rendering of the Olympus 16MP sensors they started using in the E-M5 - my favorite camera in that range are the E-P5 and E-PM2. That sensor and processing engine is in so many Olympus Micro Four Thirds cameras. So underrated. The colors are very nice.
Love my Sigma DP1 Merrill. The image quality is unmatched. Unfortunately I don't use it as much as I'd like because the Sigma processing software is such a headache to use.
The Sigma dp 1,2 and 3 Merrill's are my really camera;s with unique sensors. A lot of not nice things included. I surprice everey time I see the results, so much details. Better then the camera;s you buy today. I own the 6D mark as well, great camera.
Thanks Martin for a significant insight into the heart of the matter!
Whilst I mainlined my 7D MKII & 50D for just about everything, I thought I knew everything about my four goto lenses. The 24-105/F4, 70-200/f2.8, 85/f1.2 & Petzval 80.5/f1.9.
Then I bought my first 5D Classic. I felt either like Alison going down the rabbit hole, or Rutherford when he split the atom! Somehow or other, the world moved under my feet, and like Neo, I knew there was no going back! It slowed me down, took me back to the basics and showed me the way forwards. Not many cameras do that.
I'd like to suggest, that when a keen, attentive, passionate photographer picks up their first REAL classic camera, it's like love's first kiss, by which most others will be compared and found wanting.
Big problem now is how to successfully convince my wife, that an X-Pro 1, 6D 1 and 5DSr are a good idea! :-D
haha excellent, well you know what the trick is, you need to test if she can tell the difference between a 6d and a 5d and if she cant then you can probably get as many as you like. :D
If you can get your hands on a Sony Alpha a700- the files are beautiful! 12mp crop sensor⊠itâs one of the few Sonyâs that still had the Minolta DNA
I once used a Canon 6D to shoot an art show featuring 18 artists, each with an average of 2 paintings. It was a freebie shoot for a local non-profit. What colors! It was such a sumptuous experience going over and editing my files from that one. I still remember one painting I photographed (at an angle and with a little of the artist in front of it, so as to protect the artist from piracy) had a large swath of something like robin's egg blue. I had no idea that a camera could so nicely reproduce such vivid color.
This is kind of funny. I think I'm falling down the rabbit-hole on digital camera sensors. And I watched a couple of your vids on the 6D and the 5Dc. But what's really funny is that I first started becoming interested in people's thoughts on older cameras because I bought a Fujifilm XE1 about five or six years ago which has been my main camera. And guess what sensor it has? Xtrans 1 - same as the Xpro 1. Now it's probably even more of a pain to use than the Xpro 1, but I can't doubt the results (part of my thing was that I've never enjoyed editing and I wanted to try the all jpeg workflow which I've been enjoying). It also kind of killed my film shooting as both the experience, the workflow - shooting slides at least - and the results are close enough.
Anyway, so then my old man goes mirrorless and gives me his old... Nikon D600. So I'm rather delighted that you highlighted these two sensors which are my main cameras currently.
I guess my question is: how much is this wildly subjective? Can we ever pin down a particular camera more than to say that lots of people love the results? A lot of the young folks are _wild_ about the early CCD sensors. To me they're still rubbish. Not filmic at all - which is why I used film for anything serious until 2006. Blown out highlights. Awful muddy skin tones. I saw a vid of someone saying the Nikon D100 has the best sensor of all time and I'm like, you must be joking. It was ghastly. But then... eye of the beholder, right?
So finally, my recommendation: at the end of 2005 the Nikon D200 came out. And I used it a lot and finally could trust a digital camera to not make me regret not shooting on film. That's got a great look, IMO (between base and 800ISO of course). I could really make that look like film - which was and is till to some extent a priority. And it handled great. Just the pokey viewfinder was unpleasant. That _is_ a CCD sensor that looks amazing but it captured nuanced skin tones and didn't give a sharp cutoff to bone white highlights.
just bought the canon 6D mk1 recently and absolutely love the images from it more even on really high iso compared to my sony A6400
Thank You for using your considerable experience and expertise to pass this useful summation onto us.
My pleasure! You are welcome Dezmond!
I went from using canon 5Dmk2 and 7D for semi pro use for 5 years, both great. But then I jumped to Sony A7R. The live view, focus peaking and large MP files were a great addition especially with older eyes. But after moving onto the Sony A7Riii A7ii A7iii and the amazing A9, I never enjoyed using them even though they were very good working tools. And they never gave me the colours of canon. The Sonyâs were a bit clinical and the menus are really heavy to negotiate in my opinion. So I recently bought a used 5Dmkii and love it. Itâs my favourite digital camera of all time. And I have tried most other brands.
In the right light at low ISO - I love the files from the Nikon D2X and D2Xs. And what a wonderful pro body to use. All the accessible buttons and controls at your fingertips.
Worked with them in studio setting for years!! Flagship DX camera. Almost wish the fuji S5 had that body. Viewfinder doesn't feel DX by any means.
Ive owned d7000, d610, and presently, d4s. Hands down, the d610s image quality was always exquisite.
Same here. D850 D610 and D7100 are mine. The D610 is just beatyfull
Canon 5d mark ii with canon 300mm f4 & 135mm f2 does amazing. The color and detail is just awesome! And the overall rendering or the photos are so good. Also the 6d is great as well.
Thanks Dakota, i love the 135 f2 not used the 300 f4 before, thanks for your comment!
Great video I love hearing all your experience with different cameras ! So valuable
Thanks
Glad you like them!
I've owned both D600 as well the D4s; both provide outstanding images. The D4s is a different animal as far as capabilities, but the d600 images were stunning. Thanks for taking the time to do what you do.
I sold my 6D last year and have regretted it ever since. Love my Fujis, but boy do I miss those 6D files.
They are special arenât they, very very nice files.
Hi Martin, great video on classic sensors and their unique rendering. I too love the rendering and color palette of the Canon 5D classic and Fujifilm X-Pro1 cameras. As a portrait and sometime wedding photographer I've been using the Nikon Z6 camera with the Nikon 24-70 f/4 Z lens and Nikon 58mm f/1.4 F lens. The color rendition and rendering of skin tones are simply beautiful. I love the vintage Canon file as well as the new Nikon Z6 files. Thanks so much for the stimulating content.
Some of the best pictures I have are from an old Canon Powershot Pro 1 bridge camera. The combination of that CCD sensor and the L series lens produced some very good results. At only 8 megapixels.
Wow Martin! Those are awesome portraits. Very beautiful.
Thank you so much đ
Great advice. Thanks Martin.
Glad you enjoyed it
They have to keep spoon feeding us something new and sparkly to maintain sales and this has continued since the advent of digital technology.
In the old days, we bought something like a canon AE1 or an Olympus OM1 and a bunch of lenses...that was it!!
They all took 35mm film and performed relatively the same! The skill was down to knowing the camera and " seeing" the photograph!
I bought a Canon 6D (Mk 1) about 10 years ago, and have loved it! I've looked and been tempted by Canon's newer, more modern offerings like the R6, with their amazing focusing systems and whatnot, but... I'm very used to using my puny, single central focusing point (usually with back button focus) on the 6D, and it generally works great, and I love the output from the camera for reasons that are hard to put my finger on exactly. Another "classic" camera I would nominate from an even more bygone era would be the camera I purchased back in 2007 that got me started and set me on the path to buying the 6D. This was the old Canon Rebel XTi. This camera is primitive as all hell by modern standards, but there's something about the picture quality it puts out that really works to my eye. Your video got me wondering whether it might just be the "big pixel" thing that I like. The XTi is only a ~10 megapixel camera on an APS-C sized sensor, so... yeah, maybe it's that coupled with Canon's vintage color science? Not sure, but you can buy Rebel XTi's on eBay for under $100 these days, and as long as you're prepared to put your back into working it, you can get terrific shots from these things.
What an awesome and refreshing view on cameras. I loved both my Nikon d600 and d800 but I totally agree about the files. I'd take the d600 any day. Have a great day mate đ
Excellent video Martin. Two Camera sensors that made me speechless are The Olympus E500 (Kodak CCD), And the Minolta Maxxum 7D .
Love this channel.. I am still blown away by the first Gen Lumix gf1.. something about the color but also on black and white straight out of camera!
I have the Canon 1ds mk2, released even before the 5d classic... wonderful colours.
Used Fuji XPro-1 for few years. Very fine files and renderings.
I have the 5d, and 5d2, and agree with your assessment on the classic and it is a superb camera. Out of all the modern cameras from Sony, Nikon, and even Fuji, I used, I think the Fuji S5pro produces the most pleasing portraits and skin tones aka film like.
I think you helped me nail why I like film photography so much - I can choose the best handling body, and change the âsensorâ after 36 shots to whichever one I like the best. Assuming itâs still in production.
Fully agree with you about Fuji, I have an X-Pro 1 and love the images, I like the X-T1 with that second generation sensor but after that, nothing has ever really appealed to me.
Iâve been binging your channel because I canât decide between a 5d Mk 1, 2 or a 6d. I like the more earthy colours from a mk2, I like the price of the mk1 and I like the idea that a 6d will last me longer and is easier to use. Such a difficult choice!
you just need to collect all 3 over time, thats the real answer haha
@@MartinCastein Yeah! That's very true. I finally went for the 5D as my first (and a return to Canon since my 40D back when that was new and still the camera that has contributed the most to my top 20 portfolio) and paired it with that lovely looking 40mm f2.8 - ÂŁ300 for my first full frame camera and first prime lens is incredible value!
What's interesting with this (like with film stocks) is how subjective this is. I had a the Fuji X-M1 (with X-Pro1) sensor. I get why people like them (the color rendering is unique), but later I used the X-T20 and X-Pro2 and I absolutely love the output. In terms of noise it seems to maybe have some in common with the Nikons you mention, but also I found the tonal graduations, rendering to be gorgous. The colors too, though they are far more subtle than the X-Pro2 sensor.
I've eventually upgraded to X-Pro3 and I do like it generally, but the X-Pro2 for simply had way better rendering ovreall. I've learned to treat the files in Capture One to get something close to what I want (only using noise reduction on color helps) but so far I haven't managed to get images that look as good as X-Pro2 did to me.
I wish more photographers talked about this, because I feel like so many camera makers focus way too much on features and not enough on *rendering*. So thanks for bringing light to that!
Agreed on the D700, one of the few I wish I still had. Probably my favorite digital camera to use and my favorite output is my Fuji X100F; just gorgeous files and a joy to carry and shoot. The original and the S were a little wonky, but Fuji nailed the F. It's certainly not a pro workhorse, but for travel or family stuff or a fun backup on assignment work it's hard to beat.
Thanks Shawn!
Love these videos. The original A7S is my favorite at the moment, with interesting results that appeal to me.
Glad you like them!
Super video Martin keep up the good work. I am looking at a 5dmk2 that is pristine. Thanks for the info.
Glad it was helpful!
Hello Martin, congrats on the channel and for the classic camera videos! They are great! In a world where everyone moves to the latest and greatest cameras and lenses I prefer classic cameras such as Canon 1DX and 6D Mark 1. I have bought Canon 5D Mark II in 2017 when I have started to work as a pro wedding photographer and used the camera for many years, then in 2019 I have bought the Canon 1DX (first version).
But here I wanted to talk about the Canon 6D Mark I, this is a camera I own for several month only, I have found one with 12.000 shutter count with full box and it just works and focuses great with the central focusing point. There colors I find it very great and classic and being a camera from 2012 it doesn't matter for me it is basically brand new and I will use it side by side with my 1DX.
If there was a day where I wouldn't want to bring the 1DX with me to a professional photo project I would definitely bring the 6D Mark 1 with me and I could guarantee that my clients would not see the difference with this camera from 2012. Of course you have to have experience with photography to obtain good images with any camera especially with an older one that has limitations.
The camera that I have also owned first when starting professionally and starting with Canon was the 5D Mark II, I also loved the raw files and the color palette out of it, unfortunately it started to have severe back focus after 150.000 shutter counts and it wasn't ever truly repaired at Canon Professional Service,I don't know really why, I have bought another 5D Mark II last year but kept it for a few months and sold it this year because of the severe back focus and I didn't want to invest in repairing it anymore.
If you are using good glass and your classic camera is working great such as Canon 6D mark I, Canon 5D Mark II, Canon 5D classic, Canon 1DX then you don't need to invest in a new body, but that is subjective, I am coming from film photography and in my honest opinion a good classic sensor and good lenses are a best option and investment, you can save allot of money and don't be tempted to get Gear Acquisition Syndrome.
My current line-up of lenses are Canon 24mm 1.4L MkII, Canon 35mm 1.4L MKII, Canon 85mm 1.4L IS, Canon 100mm f/2.8L macro, Canon 135mm f/2L, Canon 70-200 f/L USM and Canon 400mm f/5.6L USM. It took allot of years and searching and finding the best price for these lenses second hand but they pragmatically help my business as a wedding photographer and as also for selling printed and stock art.
Do my eyes shine when I see a new Canon R6 or R5 on our local photography shop? Yes it does, but for the foreseeable 5-7 years future I would not sell my 6D or my 1Dx and even after upgrading to mirrorless I would not change my EOS L lenses -> these lenses are just perfect.
Cheers and Happy Christmas!
Thank you for this, its always interesting to read other peoples photography gear journeys like this and I agree with you. I think the latest cameras come into their own though as soon as you want to add some video into what you are doing but other than that im not seeing anyone do anything that hasnt been done before,. though they might be having an easier time doing it i suppose but they are really paying for that.
@@MartinCastein Hello Martin, you are right, good point on this, the newer Canon cameras have good video quality, so if you are thinking of doing good video work then you need a Canon 6D Mark II, 5D Mark IV or the EOS R cameras which are great for video work. Me personally I am a photographer and I doing short videos for personal use and I am happy with the video from my 6D and 1DX.
I find myself going back to older equipment for that look. I just picked up a Aja Cion used for a steal and it baffles me how this camera didnât last. Low dynamic range aside its skin tone rendition is rather unique
i wonder if some cameras just pick up a bad reputation or something for one feature that didnt turn out well and then that sticks, not sure but get that kind of a feeling. Thanks for the comment :)
I enjoyed your comments and insights. I am not a pro but I received a 5D mk1 for Christmas 2 years ago. With the Canon 50mm F1.8 it adds interest to mundane shots that is very unexpected. Its main drawback is the weight. When I am out and about (slowly) the Canon 55-250 is on the Rebel 2ti which doesn't have 5D magic but is a good performer for an amateur. I also have a Panasonic ZS 8 which is a good travel camera and does nicely. Checked out the X Pro 1 price and I too would need an additional lump of money to buy it.
Love your review. Having seen other video's of you, I agree it is all about the colour and rendering.
thank you!
Great video! I think the Fuji S3 and S5 pro are super underappreciated. Those and all of Sigma's Fovean sensored cameras are some of my favorites.
Ive heard a few people mention these before, never used them nor any of the fovean sensor cameras, id like to try.
yeah they're real workhorses. one camera I never need to worry about over/under exposing. the range of control in post is crazy for the time it was made
Great rundown⊠Thanks! I would also add the original Fuji X100. The Bayer sensor in that one was brilliant.
Nikon d5. Combination of high tonality with Nikon finally getting highlight rolloffs well from Canon classic cameras and foolproof autofocus.
Olympus E-1, E-300, E-400 and E-500 have kodak sensor and produces very nice images.
Canon xsi. It was my first real camera. The files had an amazing look to them.
Really appreciate your insight on 'looks' over clinical/technical perfection. I'd love to hear your thoughts on 'classic' lenses and the looks they produce as well.
Iâve been thinking about doing this
Loved this, I've been thinking a lot about the "filmic" look everyone loves from the original black magic pocket camera. It was a fairlight sensor where the BMPCC4k was a sony sensor as are many modern consumer cinema cameras.
yeah i think this is one of those things where you have to think about what you need most, or maybe its a case of owning both and choosing as and when to use either. Thanks for the comment Aaron
It's a shame sony dropped their F23 era look. Golden age of digital cinema made around then IMO!
The X-Trans 1 sensor for Fuji is definitely a classic. Iâd like to put in an honorable mention for the Bayer EXR sensor of the original ASPC Fuji X100 and 2/3â Fuji X10 (same sensor). I have the X10 and itâs a wonderful pocket/travel camera. The images almost look as though theyâve been painted.
switched fom Nikon to Fuji. (Xpro) a few yrs ago And besides that I just bought a Canon 1Ds MKII last week because it realy has a classic look
My old Eos 1D mark 3 from 2007 delivers fantastic images
I really like the Olympus OMD E-M5 the Panasonic Lumix GH2 is not bad also it has a Panasonic sensor. I believe the GH3 is when Panasonic started using Sony sensors.
Great work. I like this channel!
Thanks! I like it too....
Thanks for this video, Martin. I have ongoing appreciation of your respect for & usage of the "older" DSLR cameras. I've acquired quite a collection of the Nikons now. I don't have the D600, but do have 7 others ranging from the D200 to the D500, including a couple FX models. The D90 was the first one I picked up back in 2015. I suspect that because of it being my initial experience with DSLRs there could be a measure of risk of this coloring my perspective/judgement. But when I look back at the images I have captured with it, I do try to be objective in comparison. The rendering from the D90 has been impressive for me. Don't know if you've used it much or not . . .
I haven't had a chance to use a lot of cameras, but I own a 5D3, whose files I like. What I particularly like though is using it with my older 70 - 200 f4 IS L lens. The combo of those two pieces of gear give me photos the look of which I love.
that 70-200 f4 IS L is superb and an absolute bargain at the price.
I have a 5d 1 with the 80-200 f2 it's a beast, but I take out the fuji s5 at night
A very underrated and often overlooked camera is the Pentax 645z. Compared to the newer Fuji GFX series itâs a dream. Iâve always found those cameras to be slow to auto focus and the colors are cold.
The Pentax and the lovely glass puts out a beautiful warm rendering especially for portraits. As itâs a DSLR body I find the focusing similar to my old Nikon DSLRs.
A few people really loving the pentax 645 on here. Maybe one day i will get to try one.
@@MartinCastein Yes prices heavily dropped (ignorance) Great system, lovely japanese glass. 645 lens are cheap
Awesome review as always đđŒ.I've been on the hunt for some classic cameras for a year or two now and I've been able to lay my hands on 2 out of 4. Talking about image quality over specs and all these cameras are indeed really awesome one of which you've talked about constantly 5Dmk1. So far i did get a Fuji X-E2, canon 5Dmk1 and now going for nikon D700. I've got my eyes on the nikon DF but it's quite pricey at the moment. You're absolutely right on the fuji. The xtrans1 and 2 have the true DNA of fujifilm.
Thanks Victor, yeah the df is a good camera for all the hate it got for its controls it does seem to hold its value remarkably well. probably because its actually good. just need a lottery win so i can get all these cameras.
@@MartinCastein my pleasure đđ». And yeah the df really holds its value people are beginning to embrace that. I literally do need a lottery win as well sirđ.
I shoot a Nikon D500 for wildlife but most of the time when I'm out I'm using a D750. Not so old/classic, but my favorite lens on their is the Voigtlander 40mm f2. Not only the results, but the feeling of taking shots with it is just ... I can't explain it. It's very compact too. The latest tech is not always the best experience.
Great discussion!
I think the Canon 5dsr falls into this category. I had a Canon 6d several years ago, and the 5dsr has the look of the 6d with more megapixels.
I have a Sony a7riv, and it is an amazing technological achievement, with dynamic range that will knock your socks off, AF that is incredible, IBIS, etc, however, (to your point) I am never quite happy with how the files look.
I bought a used 5dsr for a relatively small amount of money, and I absolutely love it. The dynamic range is crap next to the Sony, high iso canât match the Sony, no eye AF on the Canon, ease of use goes to the Sony, and I could go on and on. On paper, the Sony is absolutely superior - until you look at the files. I love the files coming out of this Canon to the point that I am seriously considering selling the Sony and lenses. Crazy!
Hahah well donât rush into anything too quickly you might well be right about the 5dsr thanks for your comments!
I have the 5D original, and the x-pro 1. The x-pro 1 focused so slowly with the original firmware I found I was limited to basically 1 lens, and I could have a short conversations waiting for it to lock on. My first people experience I shot indoors no flash at a wedding anniversary and the lights there really left me with no choice but to shoot at 6400 and plan on black an white. It did a nice job, the video with those still is still out there if you ever want a link from those years ago.
Best wishes! (I am liking the 5dsr also. 6D great in low light.)
This comment got held for review for some reason so only just saw this. Thanks for this I know the x pro 1 was very slow on the first firmware itâs improved a lot since then thankfully!
Just found this, after watch many of your videos, and especially like your classic cameras, me as a newbie D300, then D7000 - D300 started acting badly, now looking at the D750 simply for the flippy screen. Keep the videos going.
Oooh the Fuji (Nikon) S5 Pro churned out gorgeous files, regret selling mine. Great video once again, cheers!
everyone keeps mentioning this, i feel like i missed out!
I swear they did put something special in the old cameras like the 5D series, 6D. The images are beautiful.
They did didnt they.
I still love the look from my 10mp Pentax K10d with its ccd sensor. It doesn't have the greatest dynamic range but when the light is right for our there is a richness to it that cmos sensors can't quite capture.
I was wondering if anyone would mention any Pentax cameras, i have heard good things but never tried. thanks for you input Jeffrey.
@@MartinCastein You absolutely should! K100D is rocking 6mpx and K10D 10mpx Kodak sensors with very nice color science. I love my photos from K10D, and it works with old PK lenses, especially well with the ones that have A setting and contacts :)
I had a 5d MkIII because I was required to have a full frame camera when I worked with a real estate photography company. It was a beast that got too much attention in public and I was gravitating towards a Fuji X 70 for it's portability and retro controls. Long story short, even used they were very expensive at the time, even though they were several years out of production. On a lark, I purchased an Olympus (micro 4/3) EPL5. Paired with the Panasonic 14 mill (28 full frame equivalent) and it's flip up touch screen and even smaller size fit the bill. The EPL 5 was released in 2012. It had fewer mega pixels than the 20 mega pixel micro 4/3 sensors today (16) but the images it produces I prefer over the flagship EM1 Mark II I bought years later. I don't know why, but my best efforts fail to produce files that I like as much.
Thanks for sharing this Robert!
yours is the best photography channel on entire youtube i also have a photography channel and i love your content a lot
thank you! i doubt i have the best photography channel on youtube haha but its nice of you to say so
@@MartinCastein i really love you honest and unbaised content, most other channels are agenda driven or brand driven
Pretty much nailed it. New gear doesn't mean better results. Having taken time off photography (for good behaviour - I used to shoot video and photos for Canon and Nikon research projects amongst other tech companies for GfK) I've come back to it. I used to use the Panny GH1 due to it being the only all rounder at the time - surprisingly good dynamic range and character. I'm looking at the older cameras and sensors, bought a d90 to get my eye back in, again great dynamic range and light for travel. I'm loving the look of the d700 and 5d classic and agree they just have something that other newer cameras don't. Saying that I think I'm going to go with a fuji s5 (based on the d200 body so super tough) and a d700 to my eye they are both still winners. I'd be interested to see your workflow? BTW, I'm hooked keep it up. đ
Thank you, i really would like to try a fuji s5 everyone raves about them but ive never used one. I will be producing more on workflow and so on later in the year. Over the next few months i wasn to do a lot of vlog/behind the scenes of shoots and also start making some teaching material too. :)
Yess do make one about lenses
Hi Martin, love the channel and fast becoming addicted.
I've got a 5D classic which, in the right circumstances (down to my technique, or lack of), does produce a certain 'something'.
I had a D600 back in the day and have kicked myself ever since for getting rid of it. I liked the output, but not in a way that I can, specifically, quantify.
I also had a Fuji S5 Pro, which had a, kind of, 'painterly' output that was pleasing (something in the way Fuji lays out the pixels, maybe). It was only good for specific uses such as landscapes or still life (never did portraits with it), not sports as the buffer was next to zero in RAW and it was slow in FPS.
I feel like the 6D might be an interesting possibility.
been using the fuji xt2 and really loved it for a while, but as I've advanced and nearly perfected the use of that camera I feel it lacks a lot. I decided to buy a canon 6d. Im really happy with the results
Have to absolutely agree. Camera manufacturers always do so well on the first generation of a new line of camera and I think your shortlist is bang on.
I feel similar can be said for video, I still think there is a special look to 5DII footage. Same goes for the 1DC and to an extent the Panasonic GH4.
thanks for this Dan, interesting to hear your views on these cameras too!
@@MartinCastein I definitely think there will come a point where those cameras will get to a point where prices will start rising again due to their "modern classic" status. I think it's already started with the X-Pro 1, I bought one in 2015, sold it around 2017 then regretted my decision. I bought another in 2019 and I it was definitely more expensive. I think they are now beginning to get hard to come by in good condition.
@@danwright7389 I noticed this! the xpro 1 has definitely started to rise. The hope for me is this signals to manufacturers that they should focus on this aspect of cameras, in a way i kind of blame youtube a bit for the specs wars. Im going to get another x pro 1 at some point. i feel i have to own one really.
Nice one mate, got to love the fuji although you are making me want to look for nice cheap D600 lol, the lens video will be something to look forward to
Hi mate hope you are well! hahaha yeah the fuji is fantastic. been sat pricing everything up for a few different cameras and its not going to happen lol but still yeah would be great, probably doing a video on the xpro 1 next.
I think you'll love the Fuji X-T1, give it a try. Great content!
I donât have an X-Pro1 but do have an X-E1 which has the same sensor and processor combo. Love it. The second X-Trans sensor/processors are also cool: X-T1 and the like. Leica has some older cameras with fantastic rendering, check out some Digilux 2 files and other old Leicas with Kodak sensors. Also Olympus EM5 mark 1. Agreed: colour and tonality rule. Along with dynamic range. Generally older CCD sensors seem to be more âfilmicâ and pleasing than more modern CMOS sensors.
X-e1 is basically the same camera different body, I liked the xt1 but mine just fell to bits with rubber on the outside and the dials coming off and In The end smoke came out of it and it dried my 128gb sandisk memory card. đ€Ł Fuji wearing interested unfortunately. ÂŁ450 to repair. I know what you mean about the ccd sensors a few have mentioned them.
EyEâm on the same wavelength, which is why I shoot with Fujifilm (a pair of X-E2s, my favorite Fuji model & sensor) for APS-C , aSony A7II for my Full Frame Legacy Lens shooting (I have a fairly substantial collection of mostly m42 screw mount Takumar glsss, amongst others), and just now getting into micro 4/3 with an Olympus E-P3 (in the Mail as I speak). I do believe you missed a classic DSLR from the era of which you offered your picks, that being the one I recently picked up for the very reasons youâve touted, that being the Pentax 200D, the last of the CCD Pentaxâs, incorporating the 10 megapixel sensor the Canon 5D and others had at the time (from what Iâve heard). Same sensor as the 10D, but in a body I prefer.
Great video Martin, and very encouraging as my two main cameras until recently were the D600 and 6D mk1, YAY! I succumbed to the very affordable 5D mkiii a few weeks ago, but the files coming out of it aren't really 'doing' it for me!
Donât worry about the mark iii itâs still an excellent camera and has Better ergonomics and better for events because of that đ
Retired on to Olympus Em1 mk iii. Plus most of the lenses .
Travel - non sus . Commercial quality- and published .
I did Pentax MF plus others , L Lens Cannon , but feel comfortable with Olympus
Excellent video and real world review of what I refer too as Legendary cameras. You helped me quantify why I liked these certain cameras output. Nikon D700, and Nikon D610. Color and image quality difficult to beat. Also the Nikon D300, 300s. Similar output to the D700âs. Have you seen anything on the Pentax K7. Pentax is doing great things with digital. Pentax K7 is maybe a midrange camera, but the color and tonal quality produced by this little gem is incredible. I sold mine for a Pentax upgrade to a Pentax K3. Excellent images from the k3, but not the same special legionary look produced of the K7. I have never found out if they changed the sensor, but definitely the processing after the k7? I wound up buying another Pentax k7.
Thanks for this Joe, i dont have any experience with Pentax but people keep bringing this up and asking me about it so there must be something to it!
My favorite is my Z9 from Nikon - i really like the colors and details⊠i coma from D200 - D800 - D850 - Z7 - Z7 II - but the Z9 is really a lovely beastâŠ.
Thank you for the great video, very informative and educative.
Being purely a hobbyist; I use both Canon 5D Classic and 5DII. These are the two full-frame DSLRs I own, love both. However, the images produced by the Classic are real mind-soothing, no question about that. I shoot landscapes and street scenes with it and simply love the outputs. Though I'm not an indoor photographer nevertheless; did try it little bit for casual shots at friends and family gatherings indoors. Again, the images were outstanding.
When it comes to reliability, focusing and raising the ISO; I always use 5DII.
Reliability because, I bought this camera new back in 2018 and found it never malfunctions. So, I'm confident enough to take it to any places whatsoever. I don't use its video option neither, do I record videos frequently. When I do record few short casual videos; I use a handycam or smartphone. On the other hand, I bought the Classic used a year ago and always little worried that it might malfunction any time due to its age (my camera is in good condition but certainly it was manufactured long time ago)! So, don't take it with me to distant places for photo opportunities.
Focusing feature of 5DII is stronger than the Classic despite having same number of points.
ISO range of 5DII is way higher that the Classic and I do crank it up quite high when felt necessary. These days, noise removal is rather easy with AI applications retaining details.
Footnote: In order to get the best results; 5DII must be shot in RAW first and then process the images with appropriate software. BTW, just out of curiosity, I used this great camera tor shooting static wildlife subjects; it didn't let me down. The images came out beautiful after processing the RAW files. My main camera for wildlife shooting missions is; 1D Mark IV while 7D remains as the backup body.
Thanks again.
Thanks for your comment Quazi!
@@MartinCastein, thank you also. You know, I've always maintained, bigger pixels capture more light and produce cleaner images with less noise. Perhaps that's the reason why images from 5D Classic, D700 and A7SIII are unbeatable.
But as the gimicky megapixel race took over, the whole photography world was thrown into a chaos. Ironically, many pro photographers support the high pixel count!!!
I agree, there is definitely something to it, all the large sensor to megapixel ratio cameras have that thing going on with their pictures. Photography world is obsessed with all the features you can easily write on the side of a box.
Leica M 8 files look awesome esp black and white
5D classic all day long.. feels good and sounds good when the shutter goes off.. proper camera.. love your stuff.. keep up the great content.. Iâd be interested in what your thoughts are around editing.. cheers mate!
Definitely the 5d classic, what sort of thoughts around editing?
I think Lightroom and all of that is so good that you can resurrect any image⊠those images you showed in the video seemed to me to be subtle and maybe not so much messed about with.. how do you approach it?
Hi John, it varies a lot, sometimes i edit a lot sometimes a little, it really just depends what look im going for but i think its important to be able to edit well. I think its very much for me that i have an image in mind of how i want the picture to look and then work towards that.
Great video! I use D850 and Z6II for wedding and other paid photo sessions. Really like them but I never use them for my own work. I like cameras that has a more unique output. My absolute favorite is the Leica M8, the rendering and colours are stunning. Sigma Sd quattro h, foveon sensors always has that special look. Olympus E-1. And a few days ago I purchased a Pentax 645d. Is the handling better on the Fujifilm gfx 50s, witch I also have, compared the the 645? Absolutely but the feeling of the Kodak medium format ccd is way more special. As you see, my favourite cameras all has a Kodak ccd or a foveon. Nothing for high iso or sports...thats were my Nikons come in handyđ
Canon 6d is still my main camera, and it probably will be until it dies which i doubt will happen anytime soon
In terms of classic Iâm a Nikon hard core user so I can only comment about Nikon cameras. So classic for me is Nikon D3, D3s(personal favourite) then D700, D4s. The D600 was my first full frame camera body and I did use it for the weddings and landscape only. But since I tried D3s, D4s and D700 I never pick up D600 again for my wedding work. I just love those 12mpx sensors in D3s and D700 and 16mpx from D4s. The output is amazing. Then I completed my collection with D850, D5. They are great but I wouldnât call them classic. So I still shooting weddings with D3s, D700 and D4s.
Thanks Rob, that was interesting, ties in with a lot of experiences ive heard from others too.
Depending on purpose I agree. I still primarily shoot the X-70 from Fujifilm with their second generation technology. The reduced dynamic range adds a nice contrast that you can't get with later lineups. So long as I'm okay to zone focus on the street or travel, I'll shoot anything that spits out a nice file untouched. As soon as I need that 2% edge like eye auto focus or tracking for portraits and sport, or events, I'll side with the gear does matter crowd.
Yeah thatâs it, depends on purpose for sure. I didnât try the x70 before I will look that up!
@@MartinCastein Like anything Fujifilm, it's an acquired taste. It's trying to emulate the feel of positive film. So it's not as situationally flexible as the 5D classic or the Nikons, but if you enjoyed Velvia 100 it gives a similar vibe. High contrast and rich colours, but never really great for portraits, unless you're really going for a "look". It's a great sophmoric camera for experimenting with composition, layering, and colour theory, but beginners and advanced photographers are generally turned off by fighting with the baked-in aesthetic.
Nice video on an interesting topic, Martin! Sticking to full frame, I have a 5D mark ii, and an A7r, and I got such a good deal on a D700, that I couldn't resist it, but I believe that troika makes sense in a way, and I'm curios to see how the D700 performs.
Hello from germany...
I use the 5d, 1d mkiii, Nikon d700, Sony R1, Leica digilux 2, Canon Powershot G6, Pentax K10 and Olympus E1.
Great cameras yesterday, now and in the Future.đ
Thatâs a nice collection! Hello from London đ
This is the episode I've been waiting for !
D600 best camera I've ever had and I've had them all, D800, D4s D3s D810 etc . I'm getting another now the price is so low.
The d600 is such a good deal now, the oil issue and focus point grouping thing made people miss out on one of the best cameras around. Good for us though for prices!