The Leading Edge Of The Unknown In The Human Being: Ken Wilber
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- čas přidán 22. 08. 2024
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Exploring lines, levels, and stages of Spiritual Development and Integral Theory.
Ken Wilber is an American philosopher and writer on transpersonal psychology and his own integral theory, a philosophy which suggests the synthesis of all human knowledge and experience.
integrallife.com/
Science and Nonduality is a community inspired by timeless wisdom, informed by cutting-edge science, and grounded in direct experience. We come together in an open-hearted exploration while celebrating our humanity.
Fifteen years ago I read Ken Wilber's book "Sex, Ecology, Spirituality," and I still regard it as the most transformative text that I've ever come across. It gave me a model of understanding of the Kosmos in which we live, and I was finally able to relax into the brilliant theory of everything. It is a long, slow, pensive read, demanding of deep reflection on virtually every page. The rewards continue to be relevant. It will stay with me forever.
I will never get over the fact that I can push a button and read this book 5 minutes after reading your description which resonated with me. Thanks for sharing.
@@StephenDix Savor every page, brother. It will shift every pole in your being! Thanks for letting me know.
@@StephenDix Yes, I love that I can read a book on my computer or phone seconds after I hear of it and am inspired to read it. I also LOVE that I can carry my huge library with me when I travel because I've downloaded them on my phone, or read them on my computer!
Agree completely. SES, Theory of Everything synopsis were transformative.
Only its missing the logical mechanism by which reality selects itself from the witness conciousness. Aside from that, it can be pretty transformative.
I've heard this video 3 times in a row, thank you very much for being such a clear lens. It would be fantastic to bring these teachings to other languages.
There's no way I could ever thank you, Ken Wilber, enough for your work and wisdom over the decades. I named my son Ken in an attempt to at least show my gratitude. Since he's half Japanese, we used the character for Ken 賢 meaning "wisdom" as a way to recognize his namesake's defining quality.
You're a champion pal. Blessings to you and your boy on the Integral path.
i discovered that the brain/body is capable of setting itself Totally Free of fear, anxiety, sorrow, trauma, despair, loneliness, shame, guilt, confusion, addictions, and all other mental/emotional disturbances, once and for all, now and forever.
This gives birth to True Love, Peace, Happiness, Creativity, & Clarity, for the very first time.
Not the love, peace, happiness, that the I, the me, the self, the thinker, the mind, imagines it to be, which is a limitation, imitation, and distortion.
It is not temporary. It is happening in each & every moment of daily life, 24/7.
Search for my event: "The Hidden Power Within (How to activate it in 1 session)".
hi jacob, how do you discovered ?
Needs lots of deep healing work!
Can you tell me who the author is please?
Waking up and growing up.
Thank you Ken.
Thanks Ken. You have been one of my greatest teachers. A deep bow of gratitude sir.
Oh My Gosh! This has got to be one of Ken’s most brilliant talks. He really clarified so much for me in this talk. I can see that I had been forming some ideas that were judgements because I could not see the two different aspects of growing up vs waking up. I could intuit, but it didn’t fully make sense to me. Thank you, Ken! Amazing!
“It will be a photo finish”. Seeing Oppenheimer recently and with the war in Ukraine not going away Wilber’s words are prophetic. Alan Watts, Sadhguru, Ken Wilber are my heroes.
Ken is a brilliant and wonderful man. Integral Theory has literally changed my life. I am very greatful that I came across Ken's work.
modern society rejects god and man, and tries to put women as the new god haha,
New to Ken, but I've been exploring the path of non-duality in the last few months. This fellow showed me some stuff I intuitively knew was there, but wasn't quite mature enough to define. Seriously, thank you, Ken. I watched this twice so far
Wonderful. One of Ken's best talks in years. Really planting a flag in the distinction between real time(less) experience and the completely separate activity of reporting back to oneself on it is effective.
This is the most accurate description of the spiritual levels I’ve ever heard.
Incredible.
Such a clear explanation of spiritual experience colliding with maturity and awareness level. I wish I knew this 20 years ago!! Thank you Ken!
MUCH LOVE KEN WILBER!!! You have been the Einstein of our time, that's for damn sure!
Whatever that emplies.
Scholarly Understanding of Mankind’s Growth and Maturing Process 😊.
This is the most insightful talk I have heard for a long time. The founder of the meditation that I practise took 14 years to make complete sense of his initial experience of enlightenment. I have taken over 30 years to follow the practice to gain that experience as I am wavering between the egocentric and globalcentric stages of growing up. However, there are signs of cosmocentric development and some subtle thoughts/benevolent desires today and finding this video confirmed that. ❤😊
Thank you Ken, for sharing such potent wisdom even when you're well into this elderly stage of your life. It still hits so clear and stands out from all other teachers.
Thank you Sir Ken Wilber, I am a long time fan of yours even since I read your first book No Boundary, which transformed my life. You have made a big positive impact in my life with your amazing books including "One Taste". This video was amazing, thank you for making time to share your great wisdom with all of us and making our world a better place for all of us and with your help in "Growing up" and "Walking Up" to our highest potential. With infinite Thanks. Randhir
An intelligent lecture, easily understandable and yet profound.
Ultimate joy is to stop here, to listen and learn from this brilliant mind.
Wow! Every time I hear Ken there's a big deep YES in my whole being. Such clear teaching, Heartfelt thanks.
This is the most profound and complete lecture which I have ever listened to . I will listen again and again as it’s dept is truly blessed . Thank you Ken . You are the Man . 🐝
This is awesome. but has no bearing on who you really are. Only on how you function in life. who you really are wont come forward unless you are ready or close to ready. Never the less this stuff is intense and necessary and I am thankful for this brilliance
Ken, I can only thank you in deep admiration for offering this gem of brilliance. It is the way of transcending from a human being to humanity and beyond.
I used to read Ken Wilber's writings when he and I were still breaking through to new awareness. In recent decades, though, he's become nothing more than a preacher, engrossed in his own worldview, enamored with his own arrogant superlatives, judgments and generalizations, and no longer on a path of learning and growing. I once considered him a mentor; now I think of him as merely famous.
Surely you mean Andy Warhol? Every person has fifteen minutes to celebrate their celebrity.
I have only now come across Ken Wilber's books from the 1970s and 1980s and they are really very helpful. When I see his new videos I have the same impression of him behaving like a preacher.
Once one of the devil's spies reported to his Master that there was someone escaping into freedom. "Don't worry," said the devil, "they will make an organisation from it, and then we'll catch them again."
Sounds like the difference between waking up and growing up, spiritually, as he discussed.
Great detailed info. Even some egoist Zen Buddhist and Dzogchen people could learn from this, because they are not equally developed in all the stages. Because some post modern extreme practitioners think any practice and meditation is forcing and not natural, since the ego studies, studies, practices, and strives for enlightenment. And the result is the self-centered functioning of the neurons of the human brain. Ego or personal identity, the story told by billions of neurons. And these modern thinkers mistakenly believe, what we really are, as pure consciousness, has nothing to achieve, no need for enlightenment, no suffering to be freed from.
Cảm ơn Thầy vì Trí tuệ, Tình thương và sự Cống hiến của Thầy cho nhân loại !
Dear Ken you are one of the brilliant minds in this field...I love the way you are honestly and compassionately able to deliver the message...
It was a challenging read but soldiering through "A Brief History of Everything" about 15 years ago changed my life for the better and I've always been very grateful both for the book and for my tenacity. When something shifts perspective on a deep level it is a real gift and I am very glad whenever I get the opportunity to hear you speak. Thank you so much.
I found a ken wilber reader at the thrift store. I've been hooked since, I've had these feelings of integrallness my whole life.
OMG...
Mr wilber I've heard your name but your not on my radar, but hail the gods someone who has managed to put it into words. Hallelujah
What Kim missed is that at some point. When you get to this point of ultimate waking up and ultimate growing up. It is a stage of integral thinking and complete selfless love that is still grounded in reality. The combination of these 2 might shockingly create a magic experience and the individual can literally with this heightened awareness along with his/ her integral thinking create magic. Which if we give it proper thinking it goes as a full circle. Where the highest of the highs can give you the power of not being hurt by a snake bite or turning water into wine. Which begs the question: what if these stories in all these religions are not really absolute myths but they are real events that happened with people who touched both the ability to wake up fully non dualistically as they had this integral thought processes ! Something to think about !
I decided to be happy and thankfull, to love every being made by god.
It works better every day.
Evil flees my presence since ever then.
Still I visit a baptist church, but yes I know we have to climb alle stages and we will try to become as integral and aware as The Lord, Isa, son of man, the master, Elohim, just names...LOVE AND PEACE and may everybody start to think with your hearts! we love Kens wisdom. The world needs it, especially now.
Everyone is an O in the name GOD.
Gods Only Dude.
PEACE AND LOVE 🧿
Gracias Ken. Hace unos 40 años leì tu libro "El espectro de la conciencia", y creo que ha sido uno de los mejores libros que he leido. Gracias !
Thank you, Ken.
I am so grateful for what reading the works of Ken Wilber did for me. Integral Theory reconfigured my hardware, in a rather profound way. I began adult life as a seeker... I feel now more like one waiting for the revolution to begin.
Do you really await "revolution"? What should it Look like? All kinds of revolutions mainly had been accompanied with a lot of deaths alongside ..
I hope you do not mean that Kind of..., or?
@@uweburkart373revolution is the only way for change in the current system as reform can’t be possible with new technologies that allow for more state surveillance. The current system is decaying and we could see more civic conflicts occur and possible revolutions
Extraordinarily profoubd, useful, important, inspiring, motivational, and humbling; all at once. Thank you, Ken. This is exactly what I needed.
I will give credit where credit is due and this presentation deserves just that. Good job, Ken!
LINES are Key to connecting all people to the Lattice of direct Understanding. The reason is that there are so many facets of skill that push us through personal levels of growth. The connection is in finding those simple behaviors that all people do repetitively so that the activity in moving nearly into involuntary response, yet still a learned or consciously managed behavior. Then stepping out into personally unique specialty. Then taking the step of approaching these big platforms of cultural and social significance like religion and political mode of interpretation. What are the things we do every day, chart the LINE of taking a dump for instance. You will find that people have reached very accelerated 3rd tier actuality within this LINE. They already understand that everyone does it. They will use facilities in public places and have shared rules that leave these facilities up to a global standard that have complete inclusivity, even with Baby changing stations and family rooms in certain places. We have gender identity and sometimes fluid rules gaining purpose on a global geo-political-social debate as to the certain privacy afforded to an individual on the interior of a bathroom to take care of business on their own terms without judgement. Could you imagine if practicing a religion was met with the same degree of respect for the autonomy of the individual? The reason this is likely true is that humanity has been perfecting bathroom behavior for 1000's years longer than religion and politics. In integral we have been attempting to find the common thread with the new trends that have only emerged recently in Human Evolution. On some lines of innate behavior people have already moved beyond early stage integral but integral itself is a LINE that only recently emerged, a line looking at lines, while other more commonly stationary lines have driven the statistical model of definition for the sake of simplification. We must meet each-other in those lines that have established a COMMON LINE, so common it seems obvious and annoying to take seriously, discuss those emergent traits that define that pathway of skillful adaption an purpose within that line that is translatable to these other tracks of experience. Talk to people about their take on Driving and you will find them to have achieved very High scores in waking up on that LINE and you will not be teaching them anything that they do not yet know, but finding the common ground of more inclusive actualized tendency and expectation in a line like driving that is itself evolved to the furthest edge of human evolution yet ever achieved. People are already awake we have to find them where their eyes are uniquely open and the rules they follow within that line are established beyond the common push of more stagnated lines. Telling everyone that only less than 1% of the world is integrally evolved is only pointing out there knowledge and application of the INTEGRAL LINE of APPLICATIONS themselves. By approaching each other at our furthest line growth we can begin to look into the discrepancies between the lines and really find out how a person who can use a universally public rest room has a problem with respecting another religion, yet they will enter through a green light on any street without attempting to run the car next to them off the road.
Thank you wonderful lecture - read your book Brief history of evrything 10 yeras ago - and continue reading always so inspiring
I am here. You are awesome Ken. Big hugs.
You talk about waking up and growing up, which I FULLY understand. What about f'ing up? The bulk of humanity is in the depths of THAT right now
My part as a writer, cartooning, sharing a way to communicate the very thing you are speaking of, after a lifetime at 67, just reaching that magical time of life, I agree and support what you have said, and continue to explore what growing up, communicating what wii learn, all the "I"s together that help us take mankind and reality to a new level. That is why many of us are here as I see it, volunteers in great holographic world Wii create, a matrix that few understand Wii are here to manifest. What comes next depends upon our ability to integrate the feminine back into leaders in a balanced way rather than the past views. Thanks for your talk. Great to hear. The Book of Wibblry and Wub is the story, a satire of what happens when someone human brings these messages to Earth, the resistance to solutions that cost the messengers their ability to live a normal life, nor to ever to desire to do so. Wii came in with a gift, many for some, and a duty to use them to help manifest a future that is ever better, and I still believe that is possible, even moreso given the present destruction that will lead to the next level, higher I believe. Wii will see soon.
In religion like mine, it simple says "we are all sinners, how good or compliant be might seem to behave.." as long as we do not accept the (= "absolute") laws of God (the absolute source of everything = non-duality) and respect (= praise) him and obey him, (disrespect = seperation) we are doomed and end in "hell".
All this is already described in the Bible = the holy scriptures, just with"old fashioned" words. But all the same😊
Incredible learnings in this video
Ken, I Thankyou sincerely
Very clear! Thank you.
Wonderful, to see and hear Ken share these insights. Peace and Love :)
I love Ken Wilber's books. As an elder though, his appearance reminds me of Hunter S. Thompson.
I thought he looked like a psychedelic Andrew Klaven. Which is a wild idea.
@@marcus8710 the doctor from Minnesota ... yes there is a resemblance
Thank you Ken. This speak is very inspiring to listen and to take action towards waking up and groving up process. Take care Ken
Ken shares that the first stages/"glimmers" of insightfulness of cosmic care started around 650 BCE. I agree with this. But we can know that perhaps this was even earlier at around 15,000 years ago with the first Yogis in India, and of course indigeounus and shaman from other lands. The Axial age without the doubt is an amazing time in human behavior and evolution. Let's consider we are in an Axial 2.0 (Post materialism, Post intelligence growth spurt). Thoughts?
So happy to ponder this wisdom, thank you sir!
Thank you for bringing this information to the surface for us to consider and hopeful strive for.
Brilliant insight! Life changing. Thank you Ken.
Ramakrishna was way ahead on this, insisting that all the major paths could lead to awakening and having practiced them to prove it.
Yes! Him and Swami Vivikenana are amazing teachers. Swami Sarvapriananda and his brother and sister monks have some amazing teachings.
18:29 doesn't seem to support these claims
Such a grounding message in our brave new world.
Dear Ken, I love and follow your thoughts for years and am convinced that you are a genius!
But as a psychologist, I have to add that you forget the "cleaning up" dimension in the healing and integration work. As soon as little kids or even babies have to dissociate pain, trauma, maladaptive relations and disfunctional bondings, the person can not grow, develop, and mature in a normal way. Those dissociate ego structures become your own enemies, you hate yourself in others, not because you are still in an archaic stage, but because you never cleaned up your childhood trauma. Have a look at Mr Trump. First, he needs therapy, that the development of his growing up stages! The world today is not only stuck in earlier stages but deeply traumatised for centuries. Let's include the dimension of healing!
Correct … and the understanding of waking up - growing up will ensure that both sides are healed together!
I believe Ken covers that elsewhere, his overall formula is~ Waking Up, Growing Up, Opening Up, Showing Up and Cleaning Up
Would be radical technocratic...
czcams.com/video/2mROP49BeJc/video.html See also "Integral Spirituality" Chapter 6: "The Shadow and the Disowned Self" and "The Religion of Tomorrow" Part Three: "Dysfunctional Shadow Elements in Development".
Ms. Popper, that is where all of these awareness gurus are sadly lacking, in the how-to part. They skim it but that's all. Many people don't do it because they don't want to relive the trauma. But I found, from experience, that you have to go through the trauma and come out clean on the other side. It's like being lost in the Sahara desert and going through the thirst, the heat, the sand, the exhaustion, the fear, the anxiety of wondering if you will come out of it alive. And just when you've given up hope, you see an oasis in the distance. You then use your last bit of strength to reach it, then you backslide into distress because you begin to wonder if it's real and not a mirage. At this stage many people give up. But some of us keep going and we reach the oasis and it's REAL! That is what it feels like to rid yourself of childhood trauma. What I'm trying to say is, the only way to get over it is to go through it. It is a thick fog of pain and it is scary and you don't know if you're strong enough to do it, self- doubt all the way through. It is the same with getting through relationships. This is one of those times in your life when you should be completely focused on the task at hand and it's okay to be a little bit selfish.
You finally make it through the gray fog of pain and on the other side the sun is shining brightly, there are flowers blooming in the grassy meadows; the birds are singing and you begin to wonder how you could have ever been in that thick, gray fog. And that injured little creature that you were no longer exists. Also an extra bonus is you will never go back, you will realize these weren't things that you did, but that were done to you! Accept yourself, care about yourself, and take care of yourself.
Stay well stay strong stay cool 😎😎😎.
Not all Christians are boxed in. But we have to accept the fact and the teachings of Lord Jesus. Many Christians are not out to convert others to their belief and solely to their belief. The more we accept Christ or the principle of Christ the better off we are
exceptional great talk. Good points on social media, which basically arrests many people into lower developmentphases. I think the takeaway is making these developmental phases less game-able. A good solution is transitioning from social media (people/companies screaming at public walls) to social networking (more personal circles, connected thru reallife events or fediverse apps like mastodon,peertube,pixelfed,fish etc).
tnx Ken, 4 throwing light on my confusion about religions appearing 2b simultaneously source of wisdom & ignorance, love & hatred, ....
Interesting. My first break through experience was when reading "Psychologie in der Wende" with chapters from Stanislav Grof and Ken Wlber and I had a profound experience in the morning at 3AM reading about trans-personal psychology written by Ken Wilber. It was during that experience that I felt the total connection with all beings and it was by that experience that I knew it was nothing about an entity I call me. So I cannot align with the introduced separation of spiritual experience and maturity as in my case it seem to come together inseparable.
How can there be a profound experience of unity and still an ego utilizing it as a kind of a super ego decoration? Wouldn't a strong ego identification be a solid obstacle to even have such an experience?
On the other hand the introduced separation is a solid explanation to me that there can be such a thing like highly spiritual developed evil. It is a good explanation why black magic and its followers can exist which have a profound insight into the human psyche but using it only to achieve advantages for their own groups still in a mind set of being separated from the "others" they seek to dominate and coerce to obey their orders.
The thrive for power requires a mind which is fully convinced about the separation from the entity it wants to have power over. Thus in my mind the thrive for power which evil always seeks was something which must lag certain spiritual insights hence to me highly spiritual beings kind of couldn't engage into evil acts.
I am willing to learn!
To me it is simply due to the fact that such personalities (and also pure immaterial entities - called "ghosts" - residual emmanations of egoic unsatisfied beings ) have deficiancies of being "unwhole" (= unholy) and therefore try to "steal away" life-energy from others in order to try to gain "wholeness" with unethical means..(manipulation, lying, decption, deceiving, killing, robbing, raping and abusing or non respecting of the others Integraty etc. So all what we normally call immoral. Spiritualty without morality is useless and satanic that's the lesson to me!
He has not only practiced/studied Indian spirituality but he has good knowledge of at least 4 major darshan shastras and few Upanishads too .. gr8 man
Wow! Thank you so much.
He goes to great ends to speak of the unspeakable - Namaste 🙏🏻
I love him so much! Thank you Ken.
Thank you for this new level of awareness through the insight of the understanding of level of growth and its implication in human actions🙏🏼
It will be interesting to see, feel and create a way of communicating that will help and sustain the willingness of growth within those divine beings “trapped” within the “younger” growth level in a present state.
Gratitude for your contribution of understanding 🙏🏼💜✨
In the current state of the world with its permanent conflicts, just to name the few that are most prominent, like Ukr-Rus-war, Hamas-Israel, Armenia-Aserbaijan, Lybia, Sudan, Jemen, etc..
You would think, how can Ken be on such a meta-level, right? But try to go deeper in his analysis then you understand that he describes what the evolution of spirituality that is helping to propagate peace in the World! Thanks Ken for helping us understanding the bigger picture and the path we have to take to arrive at a more peaceful humanity.
The understanding of the relationship between the devotee and the Spiritual Master is of great importance since it is the basis of all spiritual traditions, prophecies and teachings.
If people didn't fully study my Teaching on this matter they might tend to associate and even identify it with some of the traditional exercises. . . in such traditions as the Advaitic tradition. And there's a tendency in the Advaitic tradition to develop this kind of "talking school" approach to Realization. And therefore it tends also to legitimize the point of view of certain kinds of advocates who can be read, and even heard in public. Who "preach" to people about consciousness and call them to identify. . . merely to identify with it. They try to talk people into identifying with consciousness, or merely to relax their minds and so forth, and settle into a conscious state, that doesn't have any particular reference to the body-mind, although its still associated with it practically.
There are many such advocates. I've spoken about Krishnamurti from time to time, he's just one. There are many such people these days. They all have in common, a call to people to do something like the. . . exercise of logic recommended in the Advaitic "talking school". They call upon them to identify with Consciousness, presently, to believe and affirm that the essence of the being, the consciousness behind thoughts and actions is presently and always already identical to Brahman or the Transcendental Condition. Therefore, merely by involving yourself in this kind of analytical exercise, you can presume that you are enlightened, or that you have achieved Jnana. That's not at all true. The same kinds of advocates are also busy telling people that there is no real purpose for a Spiritual Master, except to bind yourself to another ego and so on.
The reason they can so easily dismiss the Spiritual Master is because they have already dismissed the whole process of spiritual practice. And all that's necessary for them is this kind of analytical effort of identifying with Consciousness. It is true that our own consciousness, that which is at the root of attention, is ultimately, even inherently, identical to the Transcendental Being. But this must be Realized to be so. And it cannot be Realized to be so until energy and attention are free for that most profound and Radical Intuition. It's not merely factually so. It's not factually so that Atman and Paramatman or Brahman are identical. It's not factually so that Nirvana and samsara are the same. By definition these are opposites. Nirvana and samsara are actual or absolute opposites of one another. That's how the two terms arose in traditions. They indicate two entirely different states of existence, one Transcendental and the other conditional.
Well, in the Buddhist tradition, this formula developed eventually, that the
states that are Nirvana and samsara are the same. Well, this is a confession of Adepts. This is a confession of Realization. In the case of Realization it is True. In some profound, paradoxical sense. But it is not factually true. It's true only in the case of Realization.
Likewise, in the Advaitic tradition, in many places in the Hindu tradition, we hear the proclamation that Atman and Paramatman, or Atman and Brahman, are identical. This is not factually true in the original development of these terms. They were meant to indicate complete opposites. They are Realized to be identical by Adepts. The equation is Realized to be true, or the Truth in the case of an Adept. But not otherwise. The equation is not factually true, it's only true by virtue of Realization. So you cannot, merely by inverting upon the self-essence, identify with the Transcendental Being. To invert upon the self-
-
essence is merely to continue the act of Narcissus (the ego act of identification with a separate self). It is to meditate upon the self-essence, the essence of the ego, the root consciousness of the ego. Until the ego is transcended, that's all that's at the base of the "I" thought.
We may have some sense, some intuition of that which goes beyond the limit of self-contracted consciousness, but we cannot Realize our identity with it, apart from the fullest development of spiritual practice. In fact, therefore, it is a heresy to claim that Atman and Paramatman are the same, or that Atman and Brahman are the same, until you have Realized it. It is a heresy to declare that Nirvana and samsara are the same. Its a ridiculous claim except in the case of Realization.
Spiritual Understanding in our discussion is not to be equated with a kind of "talking school" conceit, or the presumption of the ego, that wants to be realized immediately without having to go through the hard school of purification, liberation, and awakening. Spiritual Understanding involves the transcendence of the ego, or conditional attention and this develops by stages - it has a number of forms. . .
The reason for this is that the ego is not merely some superficial notion. The ego applies to every single aspect, every part, function, state, relation, and condition of the self. There is no part of the manifest self that is not characterized by the ego or self-contraction. It's not merely a superficial part of you, underneath which there is this eternally free essence which you should identify with. Even that essence underneath it all, that fundamental sense of self-consciousness is a fraction of this total character that is the ego or seperate self. This total character must be understood and transcended. In every feature, function, part, relation, state - waking, dreaming, and sleeping - this consciousness that is identified with in the "talking school" is nothing but the bare consciousness of the waking state, or attention apart from objects. It is not, in any sense, a practice of enlightenment or enlightened understanding; it is simply egoic consciousness. That egoic consciousness in all of its forms must be transcended for any spiritual understanding to awaken.
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What Is The Conscious Process?
Vandana Shiva is a great example of a cosmocentric woman.
He's exactly how I imagine an alien would be...
Boy you have a whack imagination 😂
Extremely useful talk, thank you! Imagining someone having a spiritual awakening at the egocentric stage and the problems associated with that reminds me of the famous Jung quote, “Beware unearned wisdom…”
I recall many teachers over the years say mental institutions and hospitals are full of people that "think" they are jesus, buddha etc.
Your comment reminds me of the movie Dream Team… great movie, LOL!
There was this story I heard about this Guru in India who had a brother in a mental institution. On one occasion while the guru was visiting his brother, the brother said "you know its unfair, you say you're the Self and people honour you, but when I say it they put me here" and the guru says "yes, but when I say It, i mean there is nothing but the Self in all beings, but when you say it, you mean only you"
I dont know if anyone heard the controversy recently about theologian David Bentley Hart and his book Ye Are Gods? Apparently the title originates from a quote in Psalm 82,6 that Jesus points to after the Pharisees accuse him of blasphemy.. when claiming he's the son of God. The Psalm says "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are achildren of the most High" So the implied meaning is Jesus is saying I've realised it, you haven't.
But the Christian backlash about this is comical, they engage in all kinds of obfuscation to deflect from the bleeding obvious and they are basically putting Jesus into the position of the mad brother, the one who goes around saying only he is one with God. It doesn't do Christianity or Jesus any favours...
It happened to me I became a magician 😂
Stunning
This is why meditation practices are key. Without skill in meditation one never gets a chance to acquire direct experience, and without that, the theories mean little.
Ramakrishna, Ramana Maharshi just to name a few did not seem to ever had meditated before they had a direct experience. So this can not be a general rule.
Very important talk. Thank you
This is so remarkable. One of the most inteligent humans is speaking.
Upbringing, education, and (yes) brainwashing, will reinforce Stage 2, but the $64 question is how do they manage to arrest development? I think simple fear and insecurity must come into it. Stages 3 and 4 require a degree of leisure and detachment.
just wow! It makes so much sense. Recognized myself immediately
How do we not know how to deliver ourselves from hell? It’s like everybody had all the knowledge but it’s just right now we’re open to it.
I wish there were captions and/or a transcript!
Dear friend, tnx a lot; once again u've eased some of my tension concerning this person that is referred to as myself & its relation to other ppl, sentient beings & Mverse.
Wise words ! ❤️
I have started listening to the “Gateway Experience”, and feel as if it’s an accelerated way to get your brain in a meditative state. Whether your ready for it or not.
Practice practice practice, that's key. In a sphere of protective light.
Create a REB Early on. Resonant Energy Balloon.
Keep your energy high...intend this, so it will be.
Relax into training.
Let go of Beliefs...systems of belief. They are prisons.
Keep it turned on.
You intend it's properties.
Kudos to Ken from Luxembourg (Europe)!
We are one...yet everyone has their own experience
I love it! "Growing Up" Exactly why Krishna warned against giving his teaching to the unworthy Ie - not grown up!
The claim that stages are a recent discovery and that no religious tradition has stages is false.The "Three fold division" in Buddhism, which may have existed since the beginning of Buddhism, divides the Noble Eightfold Path into 3 stages: 1:moral virtue, 2:meditation, 3:insight/wisdom. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_Eightfold_Path#Sila-samadhi-prajna
The Hindus call this same 3 fold division the Margas: Bhakti Marga, Karma Marga and Jnana Marga... although generally it seems most hindu sects have forgotten that the Margas(stages) are different from the Yogas (styles of meditation such as bhakti Yoga, Karma Yoga, Jnana Yoga, Kundalini Yoga etc).It seems that this concept of 3 stages is part of the inherent structure of humans.The first stage involves learning a model from authority, development of faith, feeling & passion to look deeper, and moral injunctions (religion).The second stage is entirely different because here one makes the shift to look within using subtle effort, meditation, to quiet the mind and emotions, one seeks authority NOT in the external priest but in inner vision.The third stage (still pre-enlightenment) is where the subtle effort of meditation has been successful, the main activity at this stage is to rest in Being beyond effort.
These divisions are one of my favorite teachings and they precisely describe practice AND what we see in the world.Religion where people are moved by passion, learn a moral code and take conceptual instruction from authority is certainly a first stage.But... unfortunately religions do not emphasize the need for meditation, to discover reality within.And... meditation is not a goal in itself, the subtle effort is transcended.
For example, in the modern teachings of neo-advaita and non-dualism, ideas from the 3rd stage such as "you are already enlightened, there is nothing to do", "the world is an illusion or does not actually exist" and so forth.... these are advanced 3rd stage suggestions which are preached by charismatic authority (modern priests) but they are received by an audience at the first stage. There are numerous ideas here about the ending of meditation which IS appropriate for the 3rd stage, but when people at the first stage hear "meditation is bondage" (astavakra Gita), those on the first stage fail to take up meditation to still the mind and then are trapped on this level of thought failing to discover the inner reality as a direct experience as Being.
I like your reply. :-)
I think we study the same curriculum. Or at least partly. The one thing that I think you may have missed in the beginning was his definition between "learning" and "growing up", which he then really seems to focus on the difference between the two of. I think that specifically is what he's saying has not been there before. His description of the two paired together in one thought structure.
Which is all that all religions are is thought structures. An explanation, or at least one's best attempt to explain the divine.
That being said, I'm with you in the sense that these are things that have been explained previously, but with different words. And maybe without such distinction between just these two thought constructs.
I keep immersing myself in different teachings to see what sticks. Ramakrishna and Vivekananda seem to have had a great grasp on things as well as their predecessors in the Hindu religions.
Have an awesome day!
This whole theory is very fascinating and useful and is very similar to some ideas Ive been exploring as I am studying for a degree in philosophy.
As such I do have a couple questions.
1. Would it be fair to categorize spiritual intelligence as, the understanding of how the self fits into and interacts within the larger universe/reality and/or understanding of one’s identity in relation to change?
2. How would certain neurodivergent minds be affected within this system? Like for example I struggle with a strong presentation of ADHD of the variety where I am always lost in thought rather than active in my environment. I find on the spiral dynamics spectrum I resonate with the descriptions somewhere between green and yellow and understand and idealize parts of turquoise but I feel like due to the executive functioning difficulties ADHD causes its hard for me to reach that turquoise level in practice because it requires an immense amount of self control and not simply self awareness. Even the emotional dysregulation that cones from this executive dysfunction can often drag me down during conflicts to meet people on the lower levels even though I know that isn’t the way to approach the situation and that I don’t want to be acting that way.
In other words when I am expressing the core ideals I hold I am very deeply thought out part in thanks to my ADHD always compelling me to explore the ideas and patterns I come across and so my internal view and beliefs come off as yellow or maybe turquoise but when it comes to action in the world I can’t quite reach turquoise and if provoked will often find myself slipping into anything from red-green.
Just an interesting observation within myself that im curious if anyone has insight into how this might affect others on a larger scale.
Thank you
darling perfect Ken
Wishing you a HAPPY BIRTHDAY 1-31-23
Always Grateful to you🌸 Victoria from Boulder 2002 Love you!
Very good! It's like anything else...if you haven't EXPERIENCED it what you have is merely your 'opinion'. It needs to be a meld...
Amazing and essential information which I hope everyone can realize in this lifetime.
Is the transcript/text from this lecture available somewhere? I find it not so easy to hear, I like to read aswell
Thank you Ken for "spelling it out" as we say in the UK.
Very well presented and reasonable. The application of your framework to spirituality and politics is obvious. I also see this framework appearing in the rapid advances and fundamental obstacles faced by theoretical and experimental science particularly in fields of biology and quantum theory. It might be well applied to the evolution of corporate governance and global commerce. Thanks Ken.
THANK YOU!
Thank you so much!
So true. Infinite mind for thinking. Love forever. Have fun.
An extremely clear and very helpful presentation. Thanks, Ken! So far as I know, only Judaism and its two historic offspring, Christianity and Islam, have the 'Our way or the highway - to hell' exclusivity. The Roman empire didn't; the gods of newly incorporated people were simply interpreted as analogs of Roman gods. 'Ah. That's your version of our (say) Jupiter.' If that's so, the Romans were early adopters of a higher stage of spiritual development! Their non-negotiable demand was paying taxes - just like states today. Plus ca change.
How to dissolve Spiritual Ego 101 😍
Enlightening and profound
Would love to see Ken chat with Joscha Bach and Jason Reza Jorjani. Rather than what looks like reading off a teleprompter.
Love Ken but he can move into the background and be more effective as a consultant.
Classic. Thanks! Spiral Dynamics is another model to envision such concepts, particularly second tier.
This might have been posted 5 days ago but I could have swore I 've seen and heard this video before?