Mesa Mark IIC+, III, and IV Compared - 3 Generations of Landmark Tones!
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- čas přidán 3. 08. 2024
- Today in Plague Scythe Studios, I pit my own Mark series amp against two of my bucket list guitar amps - the Mark IIC+ and Mark III Red Stripe!
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Listen to Siderum: siderum.bandcamp.com/releases
Intro - 00:00
Recording Setup - 00:52
IIC+ vs III vs IV: What's the Difference? - 05:27
Clean Channel Shootout - 09:23
Rhythm 2 Channel Shootout - 14:58
Lead Channel Shootout 1 - 19:18
Lead Channel Shootout 2 - 29:52 - Hudba
MY BODY IS READY!
Leon, I know you own a Mk IV. Maybe it's time to check out Mk III? I know you like John Sykes material and he did use a Mk III :)
The MKIII - the forgotten amp. Brilliant - thank you.
Even more unheard of - the 6 power tube Mark III Colosseum.
Wow this guy is like the "Metal Scientist". Keep up the great work!
Part electrical engineer, part historian, part shredder.
Absolutely love this channel man! These amps are killer dude. Please continue to do these! 🙏
The comparison I've been longing for for so long! Great job!
Hey man, love your channel! Greetings from Brazil! Keep with that great work!
One of my favorite CZcamsrs reviewing my favorite series of amps. What's not to love, great job!
It's my honor to watch your content. Keep it up, man!
Great video, great comparison, thoroughly enjoyed this.
Congrats on continuing the best content on CZcams. Damn dude, killin it! You should do a standalone video for each of the marks… basically do a walkthrough the manual and showcase the sweep of each control… just an idea. Rock on man
Brilliant rundown. Well done.
Perfect timing for this video haha. I’m picking up a Mark IV combo soon.
Oh man I ❤ your videos ..Greetings from Greece, keep with that great work! 🤘
Fantastic video. I love the MkIV, hell I love them all
Fantastic video!!
Awesome comparison! Thanks!
I chose a IV over a III as well, and have zero regrets. It’s my favorite amp I’ve ever owned. I recently got a V in a trade as well, and I prefer that one for death metal, but I prefer the IV for everything else
This must have been a really good time playing through all these.. just for the fun and to see whether the 2C+ is the diamond standard it's held up to be.. With the information that you've shared in previous videos, and a large dose of budget and want actually comes up for sale in the UK, I managed to get a very clean MarkIV rev B combo and I just love it. If it's worth anything, I'd say I'd trust your testimony on this topic over just about anyone on CZcams. It's technically minded and we'll informed, but is coming from a player's point of view and grounded in reality.
Perfunctory AF! You rock dude!
my favorite metal amp series... the mark. I like'em all. great vid. liked.
I liked the three amps... But that MK3 red stripe is sweeeeeet! It has the magic and THE SOUND!!!!
I own a III Blue Stripe and a IV. I think you're assessment of the difference between a III and IV is on-point.
Mark III has been an unsung hero of an amp and I'm glad you shot it out with the IIC+ to show that the III does all the II does and then some.
Do you prefer the 3 over the mark 4 ?
@@soundsokok It's so close, but I love having both.
Mk III has a bit more honk in the upper-mids that I prefer by a slim margin. It's 3-channel but they all share one row of controls making it difficult to gig if you need access to all three channels. There's a mod for that though.
The IV is a little drier and barely more compressed in feel. It doesn't have as much gain or treble on tap as the III (blue stripe) but has plenty for modern metal despite being 20 years old. Channels 1 and 2 share bass and mid preamp controls, but most Mark users keep those pretty low anyway and use the graphic EQ to dial in the tone. The rest of the tone stack is independent.
For the road: I'd take the IV for the flexible controls
For home/studio: I'd take the III for the slightly more open tone and gain, but only if it's the 85W with Graphic EQ -otherwise, IV all day long because they are all 85W and all have EQ.
That's my .02
What a great video. Thank you for putting this together. To be honest the differences (especially when not using a live cabinet) are so close that with a few tweaks only the corkiest of cork-sniffers would be able to tell the difference. Very cool. And great tones.
I have had them all, still do, and sold them all back in the 80's working at strings and things in Memphis. the mark iic+ mark 3 purple and red stripe, mark 3 blue stripe and the last one mark 3 green stripe, they are all so close almost no real discernible difference between all of them. they are all the same amp with minor tweaks. Mike at boogie will tell you that. Even the mark IV was so close in sound, it just got more technical with some separate eq where the others shared the eq across the channels. it makes sense all of them being a mark series amps, if they were vastly different they wouldn't have just swiped each version with just a magic marker swipe or a black dot or a + sign. The big difference in the IIC+ and the Mark III was the third channel. Mesa got noticeably different with the Mesa badging vs the Boogie badges. The Rectifier series,The lone star, Road King,Nomad, etc came later and did sound different... The stiletto was probably the most different being EL34 based shooting toward the Marshall tone. Even my newer Mark 5 EL84 based amp sits in my studio with the older mark III'S and it too sounds really close even all these years later with totally different power section/ tubes. The petrucci amp is a modern Mark amp and you can line up all the Mark series amps and NO one in the audience would ever know the difference and most guitar players blind folded couldn't pick them out one from the other especially with the transparent EVM 12L black shadow speaker or an MC-90 black shadow. The IIC+ landed in the right time to become the flagship vintage boogie. Thats when 80's music was huge and that amp was produced at the right time for the players who made it famous. I would argue a Mark III purple, red, blue or green could have been used by the players who made the IIC+ famous and those albums and concerts wouldn't have sounded any different.
Great video. I have a 60 watt 84 IIC+ and its a beast. I dont gig it but I will be using for studio tracking. Like your video the C+ just has a vibe to it. Sometimes perfection just happens. The right combination of components and engineering creating an amazing amp that cant be re-created. Randall Smith and Mike B created a masterpiece.
Thank you, this helped me dial in my MKIII red stripe
RYYYYYAAAANNNN!!!! Missed you bud!
Just picked up a III green stripe, its mental
great video
Great Video 👍 i just picked up a MKiii no strip. Was good to understand the many version and how they are all similar.
Three Mesa Boogies? “Yes please” to any one of them ! Great job as usual 👍
Nice Job, I've owned all three and kept the Mark III Red Stripe :)
how tf am I subscribed to you and only just found this video lmao. 10/10 content
Man that Mark IV wins all categories for me. Sounds outstanding.
I agree. I was not expecting the Mark IV to be my favorite going into this comparison either.
Mark IIC+ for me all the way! There's that sweetness that the other two don't have.
You are getting my thumb up without even finishing the video!
Love em all. I'm really looking to get a mark v myself as soon as I can afford to get it. That mark V does it all.
Thats awesome!
You can not go wrong with mesa boogie... 🎸🎶
Very good video!!! I'm very interested in the Mark series! Thank you for the comparison and tone demonstration!
Cool good video thanks 🤘😎
Great video! Incredible density of information. Very well done Sir! Can you tell me how loud the amps should be at least for recording (D.I. out and mic) and or playing in an apartment for instance? I mean how much does the power section contribute to a full sound? I heard that this is not as critical with Boogies…
I think my favorite thing with the Mark III, to my ears, is that it's like a more mellow Mark IV and a more ballsy Mark II at the same time. If only IIIs didn't cost the same as a Mark V:35.
Something i'm kinda amazed by is how nobody really clones these amps. All the high gain clones focus on Marshall or the Soldano based circuits like the 5150, Dual Rec, or derivatives thereof (Bugera cloned the XXX/JSX of all things). I wonder if it's the EQ/amp dialing weirdness people don't want to deal with, and even then just more clearly labeling the controls would that trivial. You could even be literal about the EQ placement on the front panel of the amp and have EQ come before gain, and then label them PreEQ, then have a 3 or 5 band EQ in its normal spot. Add in MIDI switching and you'd be golden. You could probably do something like a Mark III clone without MIDI switching for $750 USD MSRP if you make it in (insert low labor cost country here).
At NAMM 2011 Bugera announced an 85w combo amp named the Magician, it was clearly a Mesa Mark clone (3 channels, 5 band EQ, bright and phat switches ecc.), based on some stores the pre-order price was around 700€ but it just never hit the market probably due some cease and desist by Mesa. The other Bugera amp based on the rectifier (the TriRec) also had some trouble getting released in the market with a delayed launch (I belive it launched in 2013 despite beign presented in 2011 but I could be wrong here) and discontinued in 2018. I guess it is possible for other companies to produce a Mesa clone with an affordable price but they dont want to deal with lawsuits and other problems
Mesa is pretty aggressive with its copyright/patents and such. They would make it a pain in the ass for anyone to make a knock-off. With the modded Marshall lineage of stuff, it's kinda like the situation how companies can make knock-off Strats and LPs, because those designs are so ubiquitous as to be public domain by now, but anything more unique than that and the lawyers have something to sink their teeth into. Of course there's irony in the fact that all these amp designs started life as modified Fenders in the first place, but that just goes to show how copyright/IP/patent law is kind of an inconsistent clusterfuck in general.
I totally agree w/ the tonality breakdown for the mkIII vs the voicing of the mkII and the 4. The mkIII has a cool old school aggression that the mkII doesn't quite have because it's a little on the darker side, which is also cool, but for the mkIV it definitely sounds more modern. There isn't a dud out of the lot because they're all pretty badass.....but its all about the mkIII imo
I'm not sure what they cost now but 7 or 8 years ago I bought a Mark III red stripe with the GEQ for $1000. I was in love with it but it was too much amp for hobby playing, ended up selling it for $1200
Where the heck are you seeing Mark III's the same price as a mark V 35?? If i saw a III at $2,199 that's a damn steal.
A very good video, i like. First of all. I've been dreaming on to own one these marks and now i have owned mark iii blue stripe for around two years now. And have to say, the settings always suprises me. It is so little things that makes tone so different.
This is a very good comparison because I think mk1 and mk5 are kinda out of these settings that these amps delivers out. The tones are very close between each others but what i think that the mk iv is most versatile between clean & lead channels. Mostly becaise they are separate channels but in earlier mk's they are not likely at the same way as does. Have to do some settings with compression between clean and lead with mk iii ilmo. Anyway, thank you this video and im continuing to drink 😁🤘🏻
So happy to have my Mark 2b and Mark IV ^_^
DUDE! my mark IV will arrive next week !
you will love it!!!
Love these amplifier talks. Educational. And both of us have the same degree and if the same age. Electrical circuitry never found a way to get in my head but you're explaining it so well even I get it.
Man when you were talking about how close the 2 and the 3 get to Metallica I didn't think too much of it, and then as soon as you flipped those settings around my mind was blown. That was it, that was the tone. Theres no question. I'm not sure why this was so surprising to me but I'm loosing it over here. That's insane lolol
Having looked at loads of Mesa Mark schematics, I feel like I want to clarify the settings:
IIC+:
Volume pull bright: 100pF-250pF (180pF is standard I think) capacitor across the volume pot. At medium volume settings, cuts out bass compared to pot at max and at low settings adds brightness. If you max out the volume control, this does nothing. Active in all modes.
Treble Pull Shift: Changes the treble capacitor in the tone stack from 250pF to 1nF. Brings the treble control frequency down 2 octaves. Only active on the lead channel.
Bass shift: Boosts bass with a large cathode coupling cap by about 6-10dB pre distortion. Active on all channels, but gets mushy fast on lead channel.
Master pull deep: Boosts bass with a large cathode coupling cap by about 6-10dB post distortion. Active and usable on all channels.
Lead Master pull bright: Boosts treble with a small cathode coupling cap (220nF) by about 6-10dB on second to last distorting gain stage.
the
theretheTreblechangesremained
treble
relabelledthe
aster pull deep always engaged as most people left this on all the time anyway.
ead master pull bright: identical to IIC+.
Presence shift removes low frequency feedback of the power amp. This is noticeable at low presence settings and is drastically reduced at high presence settings.
Apart from the lack of volume bright (which can very easily be modded back in) the lead channel is pretty much identical to an IIC+.
The clean and lead channels of the IV are on the whole very similar to the IIC+ values. In fact I believe that a lot of the differences between the IIC+ and the IV can be traced back to slight differences in the power amp feedback loop, e.g. more is done in the IV to suppress very harsh high frequency tones than in the IIC+, which people could fine more aggressive.
V Lead channel:
Volume position is fixed to about 7 with the 180pF bright cap enabled (how I run my III, sounds good and that control doesn't have a lot of usable range with the bright cap).
Treble pull shift is always enabled (good, for me it almost always sounds best like that).
Bass shift is off (good).
Pull deep is enabled and changes between 4.4uF and 15 uF for IIC+ mode and IV/extreme mode respectively (slightly changes the bass cutoff frequency).
Lead master pull bright is assignable with the switch.
Presence shift is disabled on the IIC+/IV modes and enabled on the extreme mode.
The V's rendition of a IIC+ is very much a consensus V, in the sense that many IIC+ were opened up and the component values were measured. But the power amp still tames some of the harshness that the IIC+ has.
Finally, simul-class is not as important as people make it out to be. Most people will not get near to the maximum output power of the amp, especially metal people who like nice defined bass. In this region, the tubes will be operating on class A anyways, so the differences between all the difference simul-class modes are just from a slight change in negative feedback strength, more than the tubes themselves.
Interesting information. Where does the S O B rate in this mix? Mine's a wood and wicker all the options 12L speaker, 60/100 watts, reverb. No E Q from factory.
@@sparkyguitar0058 The $SOB is just a simplified Mesa MK1without reverb. Quite far removed from a IIC+ or anything of that lineage.
@@stefanozurich Mine has reverb inplace of mid. What I like most about S O B is simple to play, simple to repair. Some of these newer Mesa's just are a clusterf_ck inside. Stacked boards and cheaper parts than need to be. I understand it's a business but R Smith it was your business and there are some screwed up logic in the way they do things. And it won't get better now. I'll keep my history but won't buy more new stuff.
@@sparkyguitar0058 Sure, but for many people like myself, we're willing to to give up some reliability for some of the best metal tones ever created. No matter what pedal you throw at a MK1 or SOB, it wont sound like a IIC+.
@@stefanozurich When I got this 10 yrs ago I contacted the Mesa about the amp and it's characteristics. Real happy with a Mark 1 style. Also liked back in those days actually calling the factory and talking with names I know from history of Mesa.
This was stupidly interesting to see/hear. I had a Rev A MkIV rack mount that I regret selling almost every day. I have a JP2C now which is bloody fantastic but definitely a little different than the IV.
LETS FRICKIN' GOOOOOOOOO.
Liking the vid dude, quality has definitely been turned up yet again! new cam? :)
Actually no, I suppose I'm just more consistent with the lighting in this room! A new camera is on my wishlist though.
@@PlagueScytheStudios well, either way its looking good! :)
@@PlagueScytheStudios another question - have you ever tried the small Randall Diavlo Amps, like 1w or 5w?
@@PlagueScytheStudios Just got the ax8 and I’m having a weird clipping when I use a lot of distortion when the strings ring out after a while it crackles out instead of the sound fading out when like a normal amp. Even when I try to chug or palm mute it just can’t do it, it sounds super thin and palm mutes just don’t sound right at all.
I don’t have this problem with any of my free vsts I can get really good tones with the free vsts kinda disappointed the ax8 doesn’t sound right would you happen to know what could be causing this?
I have a Mark V and I love it. I sold my Mark I reissue around 2007 and I always regretted doing so.
Nice Santana, very fitting
Yes I also noticed that on my mark iii+, when you increase the master it feels like there is more compression on the lead and r2 channels even if the volume is the same.
Pure flex considering the used Mesa tax got a boost after the Gibbo acquisition (might've been temporary). Seriously incredible tones! The Mk. III Red Stripe did it for me, but I'd take any without the side by side.
Looking forward to the day the ElectraDyne appears on the channel.
Lol, yeah. I bought my Mark IV combo eight years ago for 50% to 30% price it goes now.
OH MY GOD!
The 60w Mark IIC+ was not only class A (that would be the 30w mode on the simulcasts amp), they were only Class AB to get their 60w.
Great video. Do you have much experience with the Mesa 50 Caliber Plus? How would it compare to these?
The onboard Graphic EQ was a big part of the guitar sound on Justice according to what I have read. Wish the Mark 2C here had it.
These amps seem to be secret weapons , as long as you know how to use them.
Good job man. I added a RHYTHM 2 VOLUME, on my long chassis 89' MK3 green stripe. It needed it. I also had put the channel 2 footswitch from the front to the back next to the channel 3 footswitch jack. No clue why it wasn't done that way to begin with. The Green Stripe is the one. More refined than the others. It's still just as pissed off... I feel they lost the magic with the MK4 and up. Still a great amp.
Your channel is AMAZING Jesus
Keep up your great videos, man from nazareth
Have you tried Tmirando?
is it possible to use 6L6s in the middle and EL34s on the outer sockets of a Mark V? What are the benefits in not using the same tube type on all 4 positions? Keep up the good work!
absolute killer. The C++ is cream of the crop of tones if you can find a good sim of it, I use bias amp 2's sim of it as I can't find a comparable tone for it.
btw, in Mark V it is the Volume 1 (aka gain) that it is fixed, and the gain is really the lead drive of mark II, III and IV.
Not only, but the mark V also has the input bright, deep pulled out, while you have control on the lead bright with the bright/normal switch.
The extreme as I understood it is really removing the negative FB hence increasing the output volume and high shrills.
but this should be present also in MK IV right (presence shift)?
I think ever amp in mark series sounds great. Hey, have you ever played through a mesa f series amp? I've been really trying to get my F50 to sound like a mark IV with eq pedals. I'm getting some decent results but there is only so far you can go when the gain just doesn't sound the same.
Lead channel pulled sounds killer. Kind of gritty like a marshall but way tighter and more defined.
That a Mark III really does it for me
Amp Jesus is back ! :-)
Hi. Thanks so much for this demo! I have a question, can your Gargoyle amp achieve the sound that's close to a Mark III? I've been considering getting one of those from Ceriatone.
Really cool! Are you running pairs of el34s and 6l6s in the iic and iii? It looked like the iv had four 6l6s in it.
I think you should check out Jim Lill's new video on where does the tone come from in an amp. It's a fascinating look at whether bias, tube types, or rectifiers, etc actually affect the amp tone or performance. He does a great job at breaking everything down to their minutia.
Yep fantastic video, further proves so many of the concepts I have been parroting for years. With the same speaker cab and a couple graphic EQs, a good distortion circuit can sound like damn near anything.
Excellent video! Very instructive. I have been wondering something... if you would be able to answer this, on the MARK IV config for the Lead Channel shootout 2 (Harvester...), is on "Mid Gain/Pentode/Simul" mode? I guess you are playing with EMG 81 on the bridge... Kind Regards!
Correct on all accounts!
@@PlagueScytheStudios You've got one of the best Metallica AJFA tones on the whole net. Without paraEq! Wow! I know that the IR takes a big part..but damn... the level of analysis you went with your MARK IV is amazing. I'm a proud MARK IV owner too. I will never sell this piece.
@@PlagueScytheStudios Curiously, Mesa Boogie recommends Harmonics/Simul/Triode for a more IIC+ proximity in sound. Also on your Metallica Mesa Boogie years video seems you recommend to follow these guidelines... I'm just wondering why did you choose the Mid Gain/Pentode/Simul options this time..
I have 2 mesa boogie mark 3 blue stripe heads..love em
I m in the market to buy one. would you sell me one ?
Hey Ryan, I've seen your video for gearland channel and I loved it of course!
I saw that you were using the THD Hot plate as attenuator (reactive I suppose)
How do you compare it as sound transparency to the Captor's attenuator, which your had before?
I wanted to buy a good used attenuator and THD Hot Plate seems to be on the cheaper side of the market as of now.
thanks mate!
The Hot Plate is THE way to go. I plan to feature it in a Sound Check in the future. In short, you can't even tell it's there unless you dial up the deep and bright switches. The Two Notes sounded brittle by comparison, as if it was stacking too much inductor reactivity on top of the speaker's natural power amp influence.
@@PlagueScytheStudios thanks mate I trust your judgment!! I plan to get a suhr rl to complement it asap
32:28 what is that riff you’re playing here? It’s beautiful! Sounds like if Phil Collins learned to djent lol
The growl on the mark iic+ with the harvester of sorrow is crazy, I have a mark iv rev b and I would love to get a tone like that I just can’t seem to do it.
I got excited for the mark II C+ but without the GEQ my excitement was a bit less. Mesa has a mod for the Mark III that is considered a C+ mod. I almost bought a Mark III for $800 3 years ago. I wish I would have grabbed it but I am happy with the mark iv.
Nice. I have a MarkIII blue stripe from 1993, and I had an 83 MarkIIc (converted from a IIb) before and the R1 doesn't break up like that no matter how high I dial the input gain and using emg's.
Then you might have weak preamp tubes
I own a Mark2 a, a MarkIVa, a studio pre and a quad. The markiv to me is more difficult to dial in properly than the rest, but it is a very capable amp. The 2a is just a magical old amp with its own character
Cool video!! I think maybe my 1995 MK3 Green stripe is closer to the Mk2C+ than the red stripe.
- Black Stripe (1985): These are distinguished by either the absence of a marking, a black dot, or a black marker stripe above the power cord entry. Early Black Stripes retained the same power transformer as the IIC+, which is easily distinguished by its larger physical size than the later-introduced Mark III transformer.
- Purple Stripe (1986): The second revision was the "Purple Stripe" Mark III, which featured a purple marker stripe above the power cord. This amplifier was voiced with a more mellow lead and crunch modes, with slightly reduced gain.
- Red Stripe (1987): The third revision was the "Red Stripe" Mark III which featured a red marker stripe above the power cord. The amplifier had increased gain over the purple stripe, and lead mode circuitry almost identical to the IIC+.
- Blue Stripe (1988 - mid 89): The fourth revision was the "Blue Stripe" Mark III which featured a blue marker stripe above the power cord. The amplifier was voiced so bright, it is considered to be the most aggressive Mark Series Boogie ever introduced. The power amp was also altered to mirror that of the IIC+.
- Green Stripe (1989): The final revision was the "Green Stripe" Mark III, which was only available in a Simul-Class format. It was identical to the Blue Stripe, except for the wiring of the Class A power amp tubes, which were switched to Pentode operation instead of Triode for a 10w RMS increase over previous Simul-Class amplifiers (15w/75w) making 25w/85w. Mesa ultimately ended the Mark III's production in the company's largest marketing failure, since it overlapped with production of its successor, the Mark IV, which was introduced in 1990. Mark III's were still in steady production around 1994, and finally ceased as late as 1997, 11 years after its launch.
I'd like to see a Single Rectifier vs Dual Rectifier comparison.
Jpc+ is incredible. I still love my mark4
I had a Mk iii head like the one there. And a few other Boogies. Excellent Amps all of them although I do find them ‘tweaky’ they can do anything you throw at them. I used JCM 800s and 1979 JMPs 100 watt heads before.
All savage AF
The IIC+ without the EQ has a different circuit to the EQ version, so it's not just the same amp without the EQ added. Something to bear in mind. Good video, I find my IIIs have some interesting differences. I have two Mark IIIs modded either to, or very close to IIC+ specs. Took a loooot of research to do right! There's a really easy great mod you can do to give the amp a voicing switch on the middle push/pull that also brings the circuit much closer to a IIC+ preamp, though you lose R1 but who cares about that on a Mark III really?
Ya I am pretty sure that aint a iic+ the iic+ had multiple differences including the eq.
@@SHREDTILLDEAD What do you mean?
@@user-ic3ul8pm1s just because someone says iic+ doesn't mean a thing. The differences are in some preamp board components the boards themselves (which may or may not make a tonal difference to some only electronics engineers would know) and the effects loop and specific transformers. No one knows if they have a iic+ unless they actually look inside the amp and check these , even then the iic+ sound everyone likes is a combination of a bunch of different things some not even having to do with mesa. Some are simulclass , and people like petrucci prefer the non simulclass 60 watt heads. It is said the circuit is completely different in non eq versions due to the lack of a capacitor in the graphic eq circuit creating a faster attack without it. Some people claim this attack is still there if you run a eq through the effects loop ,but others claim it does not sound the same as onboard graphic eq models due to the circuit differences between using it in the loop. Only experienced builders would know what the actual amount of mix is of the signal in the graphic eq. The iic+ is a huge myth , except to people who have owned some of the factory ones loaded with all features. Still The most popularized sounds you want from them over vintage 30's will come close but not exact unless you have condensers and ribbon mics at your disposal. I think the synergy iicp comes pretty close , but all I have for reference are recordings of a real iic+ , and I also have an amp that has the same transformers as the 60 watt iic+ heads. You can get close with the mark v but hardly anyone knows the secret to getting it on there.
Pull Deep is (supposedly) backed in an fixed to the deep setting on the mark IV as well as most of the modern marks (except the IIC+ mode on the V unfortunately)
You make want to drop my life savings on a good boogie amp. 🤪
Hey man when you used the mesa 5 band in the loop, how did you have the volume of in and out on the pedal version set? That was confusing when I looked at buying the pedal. Cheers!
Both the in and out volume were set to noon (unity gain). They're handy tools to compensate for volume differences when dramatically boosting and cutting those 5 band frequencies, but I didn't use them since the Mark III and IV on-board EQ lack that feature.
@@PlagueScytheStudios so awesome man. Love your channel been following since your RG100es video. Thanks for your hard work!
Oh man. What is that song at 31:40? Sounds amazing.
That would be mine, Custos Hominum!
siderum.bandcamp.com/album/children-of-the-stars-remastered
I’ve got an early Mark IVB head and a 2003? Mark IVB combo. The rhythm 2 is really hot rodded on the combo. They sound different for sure.
Ryan, another question for you.
Simulclass Mark IIC+ and III have EL34 class A triode.
What was the configuration of the Mark IV? Harmonics or MId gain? Class A pentode or Triode? Presence shift or not?
(I know, more than one question)
thanks!
I indicated if Mid Gain was engaged or if Presence was pulled in the subtitles, I chose whichever sounded closer to the II and III in the context of that riff. I kept the IV on Pentode the whole time, and Simulcass for all tests except RHY1 which was Class A. I didn't have enough room to fit all that in the video haha
@@PlagueScytheStudios thanks Ryan, definitively a great video!
Let me know if harmonics + triode is getting you any closer to the Mark IIC+ :)
In order to have a budget mark IIc+ I went the quad pre + simulclass 295 route, but I'll definitively snag a MIV sooner or later!
keep up this kind of videos!
How do you feel the fluff 2c plugin compares to the mark series amps?
The Pull Fat on the MKIV is exactly the same thing as the treble Pull Shift on the MK II and MK III, it switches the same components. Also JP actually used a Quad Preamp on Images and Words, just shows they are close enough most people can't tell the difference in a recording.. everyone thinks its a C+!! Still have my MK3 Blue (fav) and Quad, sold the MKIV.
I've been watching this video many times while dreaming of a Mesa Boogie. Now, in December of 2021, I am a proud owner of a MKIV and it amazes me everyday.
I am thinking of putting a quad of JJ 6L6gc in it. Anyone wanna share if they've done that? Bit nervous the amp won't like the change from the Groove Tubes 6L6 it came with.
my mark IV came to me with 4 mesa 6L6's...after a while i decided to change it up, so now i'm running 2 mesa EL34's in the outer sockets and 2 tung-sol 6L6's in the inside ones...you can also use 5881's in place of 6L6's...cheers!!!
oh, and these amps have their bias at a set level, so the change in tube brand shouldn't do a thing...and the EL34's can ONLY go in the outer sockets...
Was that THD hotplate in use or just sitting there? Isn't that a resistor based attenuator?
I didn't use it in this video - I pulled that footage from another video I'm working on with the IIC+.
I got this explanation from Andy Marshall, the designer of the Hot Plate:
“There continue to be a number of people who vocally insist that the THD Hot Plate is not a reactive device. I can only think of two reasons why someone would make this claim:
1. They don’t understand what the word “Reactive” means
2. They don’t understand how a Hot Plate functions
Let’s look at the first possibility. Reactance (the noun on which the adjective “reactive” is based), is defined by Wikipedia (an acceptable source for this purpose, as it’s easy for the skeptical to verify) as follows: “In electric and electronic systems, reactance is the opposition of a circuit element to the flow of current due to that element's inductance or capacitance. Greater reactance leads to smaller currents for the same voltage applied. Reactance is similar to electric resistance in this respect, but differs in that reactance does not lead to dissipation of electrical energy as heat. Instead, energy is stored in the reactance, and later returned to the circuit whereas a resistance continuously loses energy.”
This definition is incomplete, but it’s a good start, and will work just fine for the purpose of this post.
If you understand this definition, you see that it is impossible to build a purely reactive attenuator, as it would not be capable of reducing the amount of energy sent to the speaker, thus defeating the entire purpose of an attenuator. Along the same lines, it would be impossible to make a purely reactive load, as it would have no way of getting rid of the energy. An attenuator or a load has to have a resistive character, at least in part, in order to dissipate electrical energy as heat or light.
This leads us to the 2nd possibility, that the person doesn’t know how a THD Hot Plate works. The Hot Plate uses a series & parallel network of inductive resistors to provide the baseline reactance and to dissipate most of the energy. If we were using only non-inductive resistors, and we didn’t have the capacitors and inductor that we use, then it could be argued that it is purely resistive, but I don’t know any attenuator that uses only non-inductive resistors.
Secondly, the Deep switch adds a significant inductive reactance to the network, and, in the process, also gives a low-frequency bypass around some of the series portion of the dividing network both allowing the speaker to get more bass energy and simultaneously allowing the amplifier to “see” more reflected reactance from the speaker’s own voice coil and the motion of the cone (in the bass range), thus also changing the damping of the circuit in the bass frequency range.
Thirdly, the Bright switch adds a significant capacitive reactance to the network, and, in the process, also gives a high-frequency bypass around some of the series portion of the dividing network both allowing the speaker to get more treble energy and simultaneously allowing the amplifier to “see” more reflected reactance from the speaker’s voice coil and the motion of the cone (in the treble range), thus also changing the damping of the circuit in the treble frequency range.
This doesn’t even address the more basic question of “Is a reactive attenuator or load better than a purely resistive one?” That’s a whole other kettle of fish that I hope to go into at some future time. The answer is not straightforward.
If this doesn’t set the record straight, I don’t know what will.”
Oh damn I'm hankering for a Mark III now. I had a Mark IV A but it gave me option paralysis... as well as being just brutally loud even for gigging.
I have Mark IV and I am contemplating replacing it with.. Axe Fx 2. It just want something simpler (sic!) and out of the box. And it's loud as f* for my room playing.
(I set it to triode, tweed and can only play at master volume setting 1)
@@reav3rtm It was hard to get a tolerable volume for local gigs too. Fantastic amp, just built for bigger bands than I have ever been in 😄
@@reav3rtmDude, just put the output level on about “1” and then adjust the volume with the Master and you will have a great tone at low volume. That’s what I do and the tone is amazing. However, my amp is mark IV rev a and I use a Marshall 1936 combo with 8 ohm, so that might make a huge difference is you are using another cab. I get perfect bedroom levels with these settings. At least when the amp is used in tweed mode.
I have a mkIII black dot...it's rad.
Forgot to mention. I share same opinion with that ir sound.