Could Mina Loveberry Have Worked? (Star vs the Forces of Evil Video Essay)
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- čas přidán 11. 09. 2024
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Yes. If she had a more intimidating appearance and a compelling story (I.E. A mentor figure radicalized after losing her friends of the MHC in BfM) she could have been way better than Toffee.
I don't know if I'd go that far. Toffee IMO was not only the best villain in this show, but also the overall best character.
@@roo1014 He was best villain, but best character goes to Tom, at least for me
@@danilomejiarua4521 Nope full agreement, since Toffee was out of the picture in Season 3 & 4. Tom was hands down the best and most lovable character in the entire show.
I think Eclipsa is the best character in my opinion.
@@sidneywilliams1944 She's up there with the best characters. She was always one the more interesting and relatable characters, her flaws weren't all gotten rid of but they never got in the way of her being an enjoyable character, UNLIKE OTHERS!!!!
Now that I think of it, the endgame villain should have been Queen Solaria herself. She could have filled the role of "hero turned evil" Mina had in season 4. And she could have had very interesting connections with almost all of our Queen protagonists:
-Being the mother of Eclipsa, a widely disgraced Queen, lover of monsters instead of a carver like her mother, and utterly opposed to her mother`s plans and ideal vision of Mewni
-If told properly, she could have been an amazing parallel to Star: A princess who liked going on adventure and having fun, with a human she took for her love interest (Marco/Alphonse) and a ruthless/possesive side that overtook her better qualities. (much like Star was heading towards at the beggining of the show)
-She could have manipulated Moon into conspiring against Eclipsa/Star. Moon was never happy with the transition of power away from her, and she could have been in a state of bitterness and vulnerability at the beggining of Season 4. Moon also lost her mother at a young age, and Solaria could have used this as a tool, presenting herself as the mother figure Moon never had. It would have given the infamous "Moon twist" a whole new meaning: Moon had to mature so rapidly she never truly filled the void Comet`s death left on her mind, becoming an all-controling queen for the sake of replacing that void with...well, the throne that was just taken from her.
In the thematic side of things, Solaria might have represented those we idolize but had a dark side (historical figures/parents who weren`t actually that nice), and coming to terms with the reality of those people being part of our history. Obviously she would have been the final incarnation of the racism and rewriting history themes across the show (heck, she could have been the one to burn the book of spells in order to re-write the history of Mewni, hunting down any monster-mewman hybrids, many of them hiding (Toffee, for example) or fleeing to other dimensions, as earth (maybe giving foot to the "Marco is a Mewman" theory).
It should be said that we never got a canon version of her death (only a vague statement by Eclipsa and the Book of Spells) so it could have been possible to bring her back (using demon magic, for example) of to be alive, somewhere.
Boy this show had so much potential.
This is all interesting stuff for sure, a competent writing team would've mined it for its full potential. I think the supplementary Magic Book of Spells implied that Toffee lead the nighttime ambush that killed Solaria. One of the staff, Ariel VH (AKA Hug_bees) posted some sketches on her Twitter page that implied a childhood friendship between Eclipsa and Toffee (likely ruined by her being her mother's daughter) that got scrapped.
yesss, damn why weren’t you on the writing team lol
That would have worked so much better
@@Rosemont104 So is that where people got the idea that Toffee was Eclipsa's 1st love? As well as Moon x Toffee?
Nothing hurts more than seeing a good show become wasted potential
Mina dedicating herself to killing Eclipsa and her family couldve been amazing drama considering both of their relationships with Solaria. She's willing to take out the daughter of her hero/surrogate mother because she sees her as a traitor. But they never even let them talk directly
I wish there was a flashback scene in the show, where Mina and Solaria are talking about Eclipsa. Mina could suggest that Eclipsa be put in prison, so that she could be used as an example of to other Mewmans who support monsters. Plus, Mina could have felt deep resentment and anger to Eclipsa for being an absolute traitor to her mom’s vision. But Solaria quickly shuts down Mina, assuring her that she alone will handle her daughter her way and giving Mina an order to never harm Eclipsa. Though Mina grudgingly obliges, but as seen in the show, she goes against Solaria’s order anyways. Had the show had a scene similar to the above scenario, this certainly would explain Solaria’s ghost giving Mina a cold glare and refusing to help rescue her when she was attacked by that horse.
@@StarViewer68 that definitely would've helped with the story. The show barely acknowledges the relationship between the three of them either. It's so weird there's not any Eclipsa flashbacks either besides maybe the Battle For Mewni special
@@StarViewer68 another good idea would be it was Minas idea to seal Eclipsa because MHC and the king wanted her executed, this reason would show that while Mina hates Eclipsa for what she did , she can never kill her , since she was the most precious thing to Solaria , in turn she and her child are precious to her , in general i think mina should have been treated like Simon/ice king
I have seen a theory go around that Mina killed Solaria, because Solaria mellowed out with age and started peace negotiations with the monsters. Mina saw no other choice, because in her mind, Solaria stopped living up to the image Mina had of her and the act drove Mina insane.
@@schwarzerritter5724 Damn. That's dark.
I will never understand why Mina was the final boss. She seems like a good SECONDARY Antagonist. But the main baddy? Nope.
And the fact that she and her army are portrayed to be so powerful that the only way to stop them is by destroying magic. Star is more than capable of destroying Mina and her army, but Star doesn't because she wants to end things peacefully and not kill anyone. Non-sense, Star has been shown to not care about the lives of her villains. And if Star is afraid of hurting any innocent civilians, the army is already doing that, and everyone would die if Star doesn't stop it. This is just like Homelander from The Boys, where the plane was going to crash, he leaves everyone to die because if he can't save all of them then he won't save anyone. But most importantly, Star just ends up killing hundreds of innocent magical creatures to end things peacefully. So Star doesn't want to kill the "bad guy" because she wants to end things peacefully so she commits genocide?
Because they completely lose control of the story due persuing shipping
Mina was basically meant to be symbolic of the Mewmans’ racism. She is a soldier from an ancient era, filled with old propaganda about how monsters are the enemy, driven mad by magic meant to turn her into a perfect soldier. She is both a victim of Mewni’s history of colonisation, and a perpetrator. She is the mistakes of the Butterfly family’s past come back to haunt them.
So thematically, having her be the final boss is a good idea. Unfortunately she’s also… incredibly un-intimidating .
@@cartoonishidealism582 kinda. Toffe is a way better final boss, he is the living result of the cycle of hatred mina is a victim with a backtory completely unrelated to the main cast so she cant realy embody racism to the level the show needed.
@@cartoonishidealism582 Agreed. Not to mention that her defeat was downright PATHETIC. At a moment of the story where it wasn't supposed to be funny.
She wasn't even a proper parody of Sailor Moon. If you got rid of the hairstyle, you'd never even know. She'd only work as a smarter villain's mook at best.
So....give her a magical artifact to constrast with Star's wand then?
I feel like the Sailor Moon thing was heavily filtered down by Disney to avoid copyright. Remember, when Nefcy first conceived the protagonists, Star was originally going to be a Sailor Moon mega fan and Marco her DBZ-loving rival.
I know right. If she was a parody of sailor moon there would be more references to the anime.
@@Gemnist98 You can still make jokes and references like giving her a dog instead of a cat. She could have a boyfriend named Tuxedo bag. He has a paper bag over his face.
@@Gemnist98 Who was the Evangelion fan? Tom? Jackie?
It's interesting that the spell for these warriors requires drops of lizard blood - like they stole the lizard people's immortality to make themselves immortal. Sometimes, I wonder if the royal family's "Mewberty" ability was something stolen from an actual species of monster Butterfly...
It wouldn’t be surprising tbh.
Also, one of the many plotholes caused by Daron's lackluster writing in the second of the half of this show is the Solarian Warrior Armour. Where the hell did she get all of that, it was hard enough for her to get her own set I doubt she just fortunately found literal other hundreds. No, the answer to this one isn't magic, if the suits of armour were made of magic, they would've disintegrated in the finale, but they didn't.
@@roo1014 she didn’t think things through, so not surprising
Not suprising but, New headcanon
@@roo1014 maybe they werent made of magic but Powered by magic, like they créate a huge armor and then cast a spell to make it indestructible so when the magic was destroyed the armor stay the same since only the magic that made them indestructible wore off
I think Toffee should've been the endgame villain and it revealed he was manipulating everyone the whole time. My headcanon is Star swallowed some of the corrupted magic in "Toffee" and Toffee was subtly manipulating/possessing her the whole time. That would explain Star's rude and annoying behavior towards everyone, her jumping towards Eclipsa's side, advocating for monster equality, and fulfilling Toffee's ultimate goal of destroying magic. Mina could have been a fake out villain, until it was revealed that Toffee was playing everyone and was using Star to usurp Moon and gain access to the realm of magic. Then Cleaved would have been Moon and Eclipsa destroying magic to stop a Toffee-possessed Star, meaning Toffee still ended up winning in the end. Season 2 showed there was SOME part of this when Star was using dark magic and her eyes turned green when feeling negative emotions. And Toffee even says "it isn't over" before he's killed but nothing ever comes of it. The whole thing could've been a really cool twist, and it explains Star's behavior in S3-4.
The show dropped vague hints that Toffee could've split himself in two magically and one half was in fact working through Marco of all people. Even as far ahead as the latter two seasons, the writers implied that he was still in Marco somehow. Marco suddenly says that "he hates magic" for some reason in that Booth episode and then in "Mama Star," it seems an eviler version of himself talks through him while he's under the influence: "You don't even know what you want," which could possibly call back to "Mr. Candle Cares." In that same episode, Marco even says, "I didn't want this," which is what Toffee said back in Battle for Mewni.
That or actually use Toffee’s own boss Seth.
@@brandonlyon730 Seth of Septarsis would've been a fantastic endgame villain. I can't believe the show failed to mention him even once. Why would you give away such major info in your book and then not do anything with it in the show. Daron treated Seth like a "fun fact," Toffee's master, the overlord behind Moon and Eclipsa's mothers' deaths and the character behind the entire overarching plot is not a "fun fact." This would've been the best continuation for the story and they did nothing with it.
Yo that wouldve legit been the plot twist of the decade
Great idea it would be great if they did that except have the ending not involve murdering millions and instead destroying or subduing toffee and then apoiligising to the monsters of their misuse of magic.
The biggest tragedy with Star Vs is how they used barely anything from the book. Like what's the point of having it if you don't use half the characters inside it? I mean if you didn't read the book, you wouldn't even know who half the queens were when Star and everyone were destroying magic.
Oh wow, I didn't even know there was a book, it sounds interesting.
@@kitty3999 The Magic Book of Spells, to be percise. Something like Journal 3 they sold for Gravity Falls.
The fun part is they mention their big villain, Seth, who was Toffee's boss and a person, responsible for the death of Solaria and Moon's mother, only for Daron to brush him off at the Reddit AMA as "Nah, he's dead".
@@OverLorD768 Thank you for the explanation!
It does sound very interesting! And wished it was a better focus in the show more.
I felt like they could easily have entwinged Seth and Toffee once Eclipsa was a focus and the reason why Toffee hated magic.
Might try and find the book myself~
Mina could have worked if the story didn't try to whip away solaria's role in the whole genocide and instead just say minas just crazy
Ikr?
No. If you just say “Mina’s just crazy and always has been lol”, you make it seem like racists are born, not made. That those who are racist always have been and those who aren’t never will be. Terrible lesson.
@@a_person5668 clearly there was a miscommunication, i mean that in show (the book does not count since you shouldnt have to rely on youer audiance doing homework) by having moon tell mina shes "not well" as a last miniute expination its the story trying to say mina is mentally ill rather then a racist.
And by not going into solarias part of the minas genocidal background instead having solaria turn her back on mina and recocencil with eclipsa is the show trying to claim solaria was entirly innocent after all "mina's just crazy and taking anything solaria wanted too far"
I have seen a theory go around that Mina killed Solaria, because Solaria mellowed out with age and started peace negotiations with the monsters. Mina saw no other choice, because in her mind, Solaria stopped living up to the image Mina had of her and the act drove Mina insane.
@@schwarzerritter5724 I think it was already confirmed that Toffee's boss killed Solaria
Festivia not being a Butterfly was a huge misstep on the writers part. It didn't really add anything to the world beyond a quick "BTW, it's actually this". After the reveal it's largely ignored. Maybe this was supposed to be a setup for a plot in a hypothetical fifth season, but it didn't seem to fundamentally change anything like with Ms. Heinous being Eclipsa's daughter. If anything, Festivia should have been Eclipsa's younger sister. But that's just my two cents.
Well, it's the only reason S4 happened. Star felt guilty about her erasure from history and decided to give the crown back to an actual royal.
Agreed, but I didn’t mind either.
Screw festiva
I thought it was going to be revealed that festivia was jushtins daughter or something
Not to mention how it doesn't make sense. In royalty when one line can't be on the throne they go to the closest blood relative and Eclipsa had an Uncle, Solaria's brother and he looks very alike Festivia and after Solaria becomes Queen he just dissapeared ??? What would make the most sense is after Solaria's death and Eclipsas dissapearence the closest butterfly would be her uncle and then his future kids. The book even says he was very dedicated and talented
I feel like she could've worked out if they reiterated just how much solaria messed her up. If you look up the spells, not only did they make her immortal, they pissed her off super bad and hypercharged every one of her senses to the point literally everything is probably hell. Imagine if we got an episode after meteora where she's just a normal girl with no magic and she tells star that she literally can't control herself and doesn't want to do this but by the end her magic starts up and she flies off. Makes her sympathetic and would actually help reinforce that getting rid of magic is a good thing
Dang, that sounds like it would have ripe for a Baldur Feels Cold kind of scene.
@@howardmurphy8019 right? And imagine if we got a scene where solaria just kept pumping her with spells and she kept trying to break out but solaria kept telling her "stay still, doctor's orders"
This is probably nitpicking, but I feel like they should’ve changed her design/outfit. It feels too goofy to be intimidating. Plus it would have served to show transition from a joke to threat.
Started dressing like Solaria would have made sense.
I like her design tho lol
well the point is that she's supposed to look like Usagi from Sailor Moon where the show kinda gets it's inspiration from.
It's minor (and rather insignificant) but I have always thought there was a missing scene in the monster temple arc. When we see Mina in butterfly castle, her remaining boot is gone. Back in the Monster temple, when she was trying to get away, Star's beam went around her boot. I think we are supposed to assume it got pulled off when Mina broke free. But we don't see that.
no I definitely agree, that's a big reason why so many people weren't able to take her as a serious threat. its a small change but it would've helped. I assume the writers didn't think they needed to do that since she already had the solarian transformation which should've served as a threatening design
I think she could have worked as the season finale villain. If they didn't include that stupid thing with moon helping them with the solarian warriors. Because in the book we learn her origin and how she became super powerful and immortal.
There was a lot of missed opportunities with Eclipsa's spells in dealing with Mina and her army. I mean; Eclipsa's Black Velvet Inferno spell managed to defeat the one who one-shot Mina; someone remind me if she ever tried it on the Solarians? If the spell worked in a similar way to how it worked with Meteora, it'd revert all the Solarians to their non-powered forms at best. "Worst" case scenario; it'd kill them, or turn them into babies. I have no idea if she could cast one of those big enough to effect the whole army, or if it was a one-at-a-time deal, it still seems like something she should've tried. What about the "kill an immortal thing" spell she taught Moon? Destroying all magic was an extreme that could've been totally unnecessary in the long run if any of those spells could've had a just as final effect on Mina as they did on almost everything else they were ever used on.
I never understood the whole point of Mina, at first she just seemed like " oh she's been underground hunting monsters so long she's crazy now but other than that she's harmless " and then they just tried to make her a villain out of nowhere? Honestly I would have been fine with them making someone else the big bad enemy like bringing toffee back or Solaria
I hate the way the show ended and I hate that Eclipsa didn't stay queen in the end. I almost felt like they tried to make her an incompetent ruler so the "illegitimate" line stayed on the throne cuz they are the poster children of the show and they gotta have Star become queen. There was a lot I felt started to flop in the show the closer it came to the end. Moon annoyed me a lot on her high horse, to tell Eclipsa to leave the kingdom for good like the literal Dimension actually and she can't trust her, for what? Cuz her husband is a monster???
Personally I think the best ending they could have gone with? Mina "Wins" in driving the Monsters out of Mewnie, Star and company end up saving them by taking them to Earth where they should in theory be relatively safe...probably by way of opening a well placed portal under the cliff they were gonna be thrown off of. (Perhaps a now Redeemed Ludo and his siblings providing backup at a key point in the battle which buys her just enough time to do so.... )
Then we get to the corruption of the Realm of Magic.... Well we get a frantic call from Her dad revealing that something is wrong with the realm of magic as he and Globgore went there to get away from Mina.... He then goes goofy before he can elaborate on it further.... We get Star and company going there to find out what's up.... When they arrive they see a fearful Mina and Globgore working together to defend Star's loopy dad from the corrupted mill-horse.... (Much to Star's confusion.... Though Mina is verbally berating Globgore blaming him for the current corruption while they fight against the larger threat, and promising to finish him off next once this is all over....
Star not out of an out of character hatered of magic but genuine fear that the only way to stop the Millhorse is with the Whispering spell resorts to that... Realm of magic starts to go boom, Eclipsa realizes then that it was HER dark magic that is doing this and that she needs to die for magic to be saved.... She sacrifices herself to save the realm of magic....
We then end on a bookend of her telling the story of her time as queen to a "fourteen" year old Meteora as she and Marco's little sister sit on the couch in the Diaz residence....
Marco comes crashing through the window, and tells Star to hurry up with the wand passing ceremony.... Cue Mina's scared one eyed Raven bursting in to attack them... Star casually blasting it out the other window before tossing Meteora her wand and saying "Anyways, your mom kind of left the Kingdom in a bit of a mess after that and thats why you and your dad moved in next door.... Here's your Wand.... and if you need any help reclaiming your kingdom you can always count on me and Marco to help."
Cue the opening theme song as we get one last fight as we pan through Echo Creek as we see the giant bird chaseing Marco all through Echo Creek.... We see that Buff Frog and his family have also migrated to Earth, all of the supporting characters as adults, Mermaids now populate the rivers.... generally a lot of the same stuff we saw as a result of the merged worlds only this time with it being time-skip the implication is that this was just the natural consequence of Star and her friends/enemies interacting with Echo Creek for at least a decade as opposed to a full on dimensional merger.... (The town just becoming weirder over time because a bunch of monsters and interdenominational refugees moved there....)
@Minnion this is way better than what we got
YES
She actually had a lot of potential, for a redemption arc specifically. Her remaining loyal to Queen Solaria and going against the current Butterfly royalty was actually a really awesome idea. There's no debate on this, but Seth should've been the series' endgame villain. I guess they did an okay job of tying Mina in the racism plot that stretched for a season longer than needed, but again why was she the endgame villain? I think she could've been a secondary antagonist in Season 3 along with Meteora, and she could've redeemed herself by joining the Mewman forces and accepting that monsters are people too, when our characters fought Seth to save magic and Mewmanity, and also rebuild a better, more united Mewni. If this specific scene had arrive earlier, like the beginning of season 4, Solaria's spirit showing love and compassion for Meteora and accepting monsters and Eclipsa's fondness of them, despite her past pursuit to eradicate them.
I also didn’t like the end of the story was destroy the magic. It always felt forced in to me.
@@RosePierce. It IS forced. They did that to stop Mina, but since they didn't kill or imprison her, destroying the magic didn't fix anything. What if she discovered guns? They just caused a larger and more destructive genocide!
@@roo1014 It’s also illogical countless people are going to die without magic anyways. She successfully destroyed the main source of power on countless planets. She cut countless people off from her families and friends. Ponyhead should be disabled for life along with everyone who uses magic to get around. All to stop one genocidal bitch who by the way shouldn’t have gotten that powerful regardless. Moon helping her and betraying eclipsa doesn’t even make sense.
@@RosePierce. This show really could've been great and it was such a tragic shame to watch it come undone.
@@roo1014 I definitely agree I loved the first 2 seasons and I enjoyed the third. I’m sad that it came apart.
If she was more or less "killed off" as far back as the Season 3 finale, then how did they think Mina could be an effective endgame villain? Other than that, she was a plot device for other characters to react to or despair over.
because the thing that "killed her off" is a baby now and theres nothing else in the world similar to that aside from toffee who is also dead
mina was that villain every one forgot about and just randomly shows up towards the end.
*comic relief, she was never really villain for real
Honestly A major glaring issue the Show had, was how it treated monsters as a whole. Namley that it was SUPER inconsistant about it. Early on Monsters were well. Monsters. They were evil. Talked about being evil. Enjoyed being evil and lived the way they did by their own choices. Let's not forget, that early on, during their many adventures, Stara nd marco ran into tons of random monsters that looked like monsters and just roared or yelled and treid to attack them on sight just beacuse they were there and for no real reason.
For a good chunk of the show, the way monsters were portayed was that yes. They were evil by nature AND by choice. The monsters Star could mainly get along with, were by admission teenage monsters in a rebellious phase who were rebelling against their parents by choosing to NOT be evil. Which again, implied that monsters were evil by nature and by choice.
Tom's demon half was basically stated or at least implied to be the cause of his anger issues and bad habits till he reinged it in.
And Meteora when she embraced her monster half clearly changed to be much more evil and even somewhat dumb, once again implying that monsters are, evil by nature and enjoy being evil.
ALl of this put together, tells us something important. Monsters are, despite apperances, not nearly as put down or oppressed as thehy seem. The way they are treated is how they should be treated for the most part as if they weren't they'd just destroy Mewni.
THis is very important as, it also provided an interesting context to the Magic High Commisions actions. When they gave away meterora, if we use all we have above and their resoning, namley that they didn't want to give a monster acess to magic cause they felt it would be really bad?
It's actually not that crazy or bad that htey did this. It makes sense in a way. And when meteora was the living embodyment of WHY they were so afraid of it. She wasn't dangerous beacuse she was a monster. She wasn't dangerous beacuse she was a mewman. She was dangerous beacuse she was both and that made her incredibly dangerous and powerful. Their fears were justifed in that sense.
However, rouphly around season 3 forward but espically in 4? You'll notice the compelte and utter lack of the monsters from seaosn 1 that were evil and enjoyed being evil and attacked everything on sight. Suddenly monsters are just reasonable, normal people to. When that was NOT the case at all previously. It was trying to tell a story of racism and how the other side really isn't so bad. But in doing so it was ignoring what it was building up.
I could go on how this ties into Mina but this is already pretty long so if anyone is curious just says o and i'll get into the rest.
The reverse uno card take on the monsters in later seasons, if done by a competent writer, would of been epic. Instead, we got the cognitive dissonance you just described.
@@Dave102693 You mean like if seasons three and four would have revealed docile monsters that possess no interest in any evil monster activity?
O
o
@@ejm1225
i think yes, like, some monsters chose to be evil but others do not
Mina was probably dismissed from service and never got to meet Star.
After all Moon didn't really kill the monsters, she just scared them off.
Mina probably wasn't satisfied with that and kept on waging war.
The writers didn't know what they were doing. It was the worst way to end the series. Mina was a stupid reason for star to get rid of magic.
Mina was really incompetent as a final villain and a terrible one. She never really follows her own plans. She was a complete idiot.
She could have work if Mina was going to attack other dimensions for her own personal gain.
Not to mention Mina could just find nukes and kill all monsters that way. Additionally now that Earth and Mewni are fused, there are over 7 Billion humans who likely hate monsters, so in the end everything that happened in seasons 3 and 4 was completely pointless.
@@YujiUedaFan If Mina was smart. Mina is so stupid and crazy and now weak. She can't come up with a plan. She never follows them. She only got so many warriors and almost killed the monsters because Moon and the MHC gave that. Without their help, she couldn't have done it herself.
@@AH-is5yg I mean if she's that dedicated to hating monsters, she'll trick humans into going to war against them and use human "magic" to end them all. That way only an EMP can stop her and even then there's still bows, guns, lances, spears, maces swords etc... Mina isn't the one screwed over here, it's Star and co.
@@YujiUedaFan it would be hard for her since she is insane.
@@AH-is5yg I mean plenty of insane people have been in power before.
The thing is, it’s a theory that star’s family, starting from festivia, are actual butterfly’s, but not in a way you’d think, in the episode, back to the wand, were the past queens show them selfs , we see festivia and jushtin embracing each other, for the entire scene, and if you look closely, they look similar, the hair colour, the fabulous glamour look, the eye colour, in Justin’s chapter, it’s said after his sister was born and her was no longer heir, he helped out going on missions across meiwni , the theory is that jushtin met a girl on pie island and fell in love, starting a family, yes, festivia might be the great great so grand daughter to jushtin, as the long period of time between him and Eclipsas imprisonment, so when meteroa was switched, the mhc somehow found a baby , festivia, that was unknowingly an actual butterfly, then crowned , so in simple terms, star is Eclipsas some great x 10+ cousin/and or nephew, idk how that works completely xd.
Thoughts?
That... actually makes sense.
You mean Niece
I doubt Moon or Star could fire Mina at any point she'd just use her *'I swore allegiance to maniac murder queen, not you'* justification,
Mina could had worked as an interesting final boss - she had an interesting backstory, poor and at the 'bottom of the food chain' until she worked for Solaria and was the only surviving warrior out of her entire army, gradually lost her sanity by the time she met Star, but still had her TINY moments of sanity even after Solaria had overhyped all her senses and emotions (Her sad and bitter "mud sister" - her somewhat regretting going after Star at the end of her introduction episode).
I was surprised Mina came back for S4, but given how dangerously capable she is when she goes into 'warrior mode', her racist mentality and blind loyalty to Solaria, she could had been a well-written villain. But nope, she didn't get the 'Meteora treatment' where she was a comical, at times annoying piece of work until her character becomes more unhinged, her backstory gets fleshed out and she becomes a serious threat - but no, Mina was just a goofy menace all the way who GOT AWAY for her attempt on literal GENOCIDE on the monsters in the finale, still mouthing them off and walking off.
Like WHAT - how is letting Mina, who, while lost her warrior mode, off while she's threatening that she'll never stop having "good ideas" seen as a "hurhur funny moment". Those ideas could be spread like wildfire among humans who are quite literally PLOPPED to deal with monsters and that's already a dangerous threat she posed. Mina was quite possibly the first villain that was FREE TO GO and THAT was the nail in the coffin for the show's finale - it couldn't even tackle it's final boss properly, and it made practically every character (except Eclipsa and River I guess) just plain unlikeable.
Well she probably died in that forest she walked into right at the end. Could of died to the monsters in their.
I think the reason she didn’t recognize Star was because her mind snapped (probably something to due with PTSD and having lost purpose often war) and was dumped on Earth (either because she was seen as a useless asset or in hopes that she would find help on Earth) before Moon was pregnant with Star and never knew Moon had a child.
Now I feel bad for her
The destruction of magic would have been amazing, if Toffee's plan all along was to corrupt magic dimensionwide so that it had to be destroyed.
In Season 2, he corrupts Star's wand and puts her in a near death situation hoping she'd awaken her butterfly form, which would directly connect to a dimension of magic and so the corruption would spread there through Star.
That way not only are Mina, the Mewmans and the Monsters victims of magic but so are those who use magic or are magic. If season 4 leaned more on that, Mina could've also worked out as a tragic victim (with of course more backstory on her and how she was basically tortured in the experiments and brainwashed) and Star would feel responsible for letting Toffee's corruption towards the source of magic.
She has sort of like the prince of shrek the third problem, it makes sense that they wanna be the main antagonists but the way they are written and how they act can make them compelling henchmen or 2and lieutenants, but don’t make compelling main villains.
One thing that could've made the series finale work, would be if the big twist was that Mina could've prevented the assasination of Moon's mom but didn't because she wanted the war to continue. Heck her admitting that she would've killed Moon's mom herself if Toffee hadn't been faster. That would've perfectly shown how far Mina and the magic high commision had fallen and would've created a much better "My god what have I done"-moment for Moon. I think the storyline would've worked if they had given it a few more episodes to play out instead of spending so much time untangling the utter mess the shipping of that show had become.
Here's what think, (TLDR; Mina should have not been portrayed as she's racist because she's crazy. She should have been portrayed as a tragic figure who was radicalized by racist manipulators. Also the final villain should have been the MHC as the masterminds with Mina being their tool to carry out their plans.
First I'd like to say I don't like that they conflate Mina's violent racism with her mental un-wellness. People who suffer from mental illness are statistically more likely to be the victims of violence and not perpetrators. Portraying people like that as dangerous is a shitty trope that's perpetuated harmful stereotypes, made people less likely to seek help, and if you're going to write a character like that. It should be done with nuance and understanding. Also Racism is illogical but it doesn't spring up from being mentally ill.
Let's talk about where Racism can come from and how to portray Mina's un-wellness with nuance.
First, that scene where Mina is inspired by Solaria and the queen pulls her out of a bad job? Let's keep it going. Lets see Mina as a hopeful recruit and watch how horrible the spell actually is and what it does to her. Let's watch Mina's life as a soldier through out the ages. She and her soldier friends are made to fight monsters all the while being fed speeches about what they need to protect.
Protect the traditions of Mewnie
Protect the culture from being changed.
Protect the innocence of children from being exposed to ideas that may or may not be complex to them.
We don't HATE monsters but...
Years stretch on of her being told all this. The speeches only change slightly from battle to battle. Mina's friends gets killed off over time. The status quo is kept. It doesn't serve her needs. The higher ups say thanks and ignore her during the times she's not useful. The fear instilled in Mina never quite goes away. This is where her racism springs from, where the cracks in her stability comes from. She protects what she's been told to protect and fears what she's been told to fear.
Who's been filling her head with this stuff? The magical high commission. Their racism comes from their desire to keep the hierarchy they've set up. They benefit from the system. Them at the top, the royalty under them serving as figure heads, the people whom they've made complacent enough to not rebel, and the monsters at the bottom to be used as scape goats whenever necessary.
It's not Mina who's come up with the idea to kill Eclipsa and replace her family with Moon's. Mina is just their weapon who will get her hands dirty for them, and Moon goes along with it, believing their lies about how this is for the good of everyone. Until finally Moon realizes just how little control she has.
I think instead of Mina threatening to destroy all of the monsters that triggers that moment for Moon. It's that the MHC has decided to execute Eclipsa's family AND Star and all of her friends and allies along with them. They explain that Moon can produce another heir, or they can just find a way to replace Star with someone else like they did with Meteora, etc. At this point, the MHC has already decided the 'rebel princess' won't make for a good figure head queen in the future and thinks it's best to end her now.
Moon freaks out and tells them no, but she can't stop them. Then the queens escape leading to the final episode where they go to the realm of magic to destroy everything (But THATS a whole other bag of worms to deal with.)
(I do think a lot of hints were there, that this is what they were going for, but it should have been leaned into and fleshed out more. It wouldn't have the jokes though, or at least not as many.)
They could've handled Mina like Ice King/Simon in Adventure Time.
There's also the fact that she's been around since Eclipsa was a baby and probably would've noticed Eclipsa's MONSTER kid being swapped out with a peasant and yet, regardless of whether or not she would've supported the swap, said absolutely nothing about it, despite seeming to have diarrhea of the mouth.
Considering she still had her sanity in the war room flashback, I can't even write this off as "oh yeah, maybe the MHC did something to her after the bloodline switch"
if she agreed with the swap and understood that they were trying to hide it from people she would keep her mouth shut. shes crazy but she's not stupid
@@chickennoodlegamer915 I can see what you mean, but it seemed that as time went on, she let more and more slip either because of a mental break or because she thought it'd benefit her (which, considering how insane she gets, her idea of what would and wouldn't be beneficial is likely warped) and I would think at least some of the information would have slipped sooner than it actually did.
You bringing up that we used to think Star and Meteora/Heinous were cousins just made me think of how much I didn't like that twist of Star not being an "actual" Butterfly. Mostly because, in the grand scheme of things, it didn't really amount to anything besides arguably taking away a little more of the evidence that fans had to consider Eclipsa as morally grey. Just saying, I feel like they could have kept Star as Eclipsa's descendant and it would have changed very little when you think about it.
um no, when you think about it the only reason star gave the throne to eclipsa was cuz she felt like she didn't deserve it because it wasn't rightfully hers. without that twist there would be no season 4. meteora would've been defeated and then there would be no driving force left in the narrative
Badly written or not, Mina is still terrifying due to her sheer unpredictably and insanity.
When you think about it, they never gave Mina enough substance to be the main villian. They should have given her more than she just met Solaria one day and joined her. Maybe she could have been a child brought in by Solaria in order to train Mina, and then you could explore that as we went through the series. Her story always just felt so “well it kinda just happened!” We could have explored the idea that Eclipsia brought shame to her mother, and Mina would have also felt that same shame. Mina just had the potential to be an amazing antagonist, but she was never given the story or tools in order to do so.
Yes, given if they would have actually taken the time to build up her character to be more than "mewman good monster bad, I'm a nutcase teehee."
I think parts of Mina worked, the flashback while very short explained a lot and felt terrifyingly real.
if you ask me season 4 had a ton of problems and a better villain wouldn't have changed that.
For all her talk of getting rid of monsters, Mina and her warriors are the much bigger threat to Mewni than anything else Star has ever faced.
I don't know about that. Meteora actually beat Mina herself and sapped swathes of the kingdom of their souls.
I think part of Mina’s hatred of monsters was the fact that her husband was killed by monsters
When she first appeared, I really thought she was Star's sister who was hidden from her.
In the future, do you think you could talk about Jasper and how they kinda wasted her character after she got corrupted
. . .
No thanks. Everyone has already talked about this to death. There’s nothing more to say.
I picture in my head a better conclusion to the show:
Star and the rest of our characters engage in an epic war to save Mewmanity and magic from extinction from Seth and his forces. Star destroys Seth and magic has been saved, but also greatly damaged/weakened. Mewmanity and monsters come together and plan help rebuild a better more united Mewni, and all our characters from other dimensions, including Marco, must return to their dimensions as portals will temporarily disappear from existence as a result of the weakened magic. Marco and Star have a heartfelt goodbye, Marco returns to Earth and Star returns to the people to help begin the reconstruction of the city and the palace. We cut to a couple years in the future where Marco, his parents, friends and every other Earth character celebrating the birthday of his and Jackie's child (who I couldn't pick a name or a gender for) when eventually Marco spots a white monkey on the fence. He rubs his eyes to assure he is seeing right when the monkey has vanished and he finds a scroll sitting atop the fence. The scroll is an invitation to the bestowing of the royal wand on Queen Star's 14-year-old daughter Capella Butterfly taking place later that day. Marco, Jackie and their child, also Janna and Mariposa who were secretly stowawayed, arrive at the location listed in the scroll on Nachos. They go through to see an even larger and more glorious Mewni. After some exploring, seeing more Monster/Mewman partnerships and couples, they're eventually escorted to the palace by a grown up Meteora. Marco sees Tom with a little boy struggling in his tail, after Capella, Tom and Star had a son named Antares. Eventually Star shows and throws herself into Marco's arms. We meet everyone else, Moon and River who arrive from the countryside, Glbogor, Eclispa, Rhombulus, Omni, and Heckapoo who are all now one "Magical High Commission." Later, everyone gathers in the crowds around the palace and in the surrounding towers for Capella to give speech honoring the new Mewni and Mewnans and Monsters live as one, and remembering those who lives they long remember and honor for fighting for peace and salvation on Mewni. Tarps fall to reveal statues of not only all the previous Queens of Mewni, but also Seth and his loyal Comrade Toffee, who despite their evil actions, were fighting to protect innocent peoples as well. The final shot is of Capella receiving the wand, it changing to suit her, and raising it into the air to shine for all the people to see as she elevated in her butterfly form, where finale the ends, and the credits roll.
Sounds much better then what we got.
@@Dave102693 Thank you! If only I or anyone who could agree with me were given Disney's and Daron's permission to rewrite seasons 3 & 4.
@@roo1014 Np. I wish people on the crew were as half as competent as you are.
Also, don’t bet your hopes on a redo. It is what it is.
I believe that instead of getting rid of the magic they should have temporarily revived solaria and have her undo the invincibility spell
I think Mina's first appearance works, they do a great job of giving you the sense that something is deeply wrong with Mina, and that Star could have easily gone the same way.
I think if they focused on that, how Star's friendship with Buff Frog challenged her beliefs and how Star's friendship (FRIENDSHIP) with Marco kept her grounded, and that these relationships in Star's life kept her from becoming Mina.
Instead of Mina just becoming a personifaction of racism, she could be a dark foil to Star, showing how Star's traits, endearing traits, could become corrupted with isolation and zealotry.
Instead, we got a personification of racism whose status as a foil to Star was quickly dropped in favour of just being insane and racist with a backstory that kind of comes off as an excuse for her being evil rather than the way a real person developed into Mina Loveberry.
I kinda want to make an au where I rewrite this part of the series with a better Mina plot and magic still exists.
I'm intrigued
@@Noobmasterdp if I do end up making it, it will take a while to make.
I loved Mina's backstory. It had so much potential, but oh well.
This is like making Team Rocket or The Pilaf Gang into a higher threat status than DIO or Frieza. I mean it could work in a “nobody saw it coming” kind of way but they really flubbed it and we all know why.
I mean they kinda did that for Team Rocket in Best Wishes, but it never went anywhere
Mina Loveberry discovering Solaria betrayed her and then getting trampled by that evil horse, who in turn Marco anticlimactically judo flipped, is on par with Bio Broly with how much of a failure the climax was…
…Everything else about Mina is actually worse than Bio Broly in how much of a disappointment she is in the entire Star vs The Forces of Evil series.
I just recently saw the ending for the second time like wasn't there water at the bottom of the cliff ? They might get badly hurt but I don't think they die ? Heckapoo could teleport them to a different dimension ? They chose the option that made no sense and came out of nowhere.
I have a small theory that Mina was actually thrown through the coo coo barrel before star was born and star adored her through the glory stories she was told from her babysitters the royal guards, They do seem like the type to idolize her and tell tails about her grand battles and explorations, Or Mina was taken out when star was close to being able to make memories however Mina went through something that made her lose marbles, like she got thrown into a mountain and ended up with brain damage due to the brunt force of it. So, while star would be able to remember her it would be tainted by glorified from childhood memories.
This finale really turns into a bigger dumpsterfire the more you think about it
She would’ve worked if Dana didn’t release the Irl copy of the Magic book of spell which the 4th season was based around. That book dropped more lore that could’ve been explored in the series
I got a svtfoe story you may like. I made the rebooted story & lore that gives everyone (even pony head😒) a great character trait and moments, Mina's story started in the spider kingdom where Solaria save her and ask world you like to change all thing for the better? Mina was taken from a homeless girl having to work selling silk fabric to living in the kingdom as a warrior in training, taking lessons from a super knight and Solaria herself.
Some time passed...
Mina's body is ready to taken the solarian curse, it nearly killed her as blood flying throughout the room, magical energy sending Shockwaves and the kingdom about to break apart until Solaria running in to hold her in her arms and put up a magic shield to protect the people. After a hour both was found naked in a destroyed room, when they wake up they found out that Mina was the most strongest solarian warrior of the 40.
Some time ago Mina was taken to mewmen holiday party by Solaria to dance and to be by her side.
Some time passed...
Mina found out about the fisherman and was okay with it knowing that she changed over the years of battle slowly losing her mind with the power she holds inside, but no matter what happens by their for Solaria.
Theirs more...
I think it is possible for Mina to have been a good villain or a secondary villain with just a few tweaks to the series.
Firstly have the first encounter with Mina be the same. Mina is crazy, but that's only because she has spent hundreds of years on the frontlines battling and war. Mina has no clue how to live a normal life as a civilian.
The first fight Mina gets into with the others have her be incredibly strong, skilled, and show she is incredibly smart due to all the years of fighting and honing her skills.
The scene with Eclipsa and Moon going after Meteora have Eclipsa tail them and have her be the one to attack Meteora instead of Moon. The two engage in a fierce battle where Mina gets the upper hand and she almost kills Meteora and is only stopped by interference from Eclipsa, which allows Meteora to blast her with a soul absorption blast. Moon then trys to subdue Meteora out of fear of how powerful she is and the threat she presents to the kingdom, so basically the rest of the events of the episode play out the same.
In the final season they should have brought Solaria back as the final big bad in someway and Mina serving under. In this season I think it should be addressed on how Mina was basically seen as a weapon and tool by both the MHC and the royals and never as person. Have Star and the the others show Mina empathy and eventually have Mina turn against Solaria and put a stop to her. No destroying magic.
In the end Mina could maybe find a new purpose in life.
I just felt like there was a better use for this character and I think this series deserved a better ending.
Any thoughts?
The more I listen, the more Mina's demon voice scratches my ears
I really hate the tendency of cartoon characters to just let the villains walk away after the fight is over. Even in cases like this where she was depowered, it still doesn't make sense. You don't need superpowers to be a serial killer. You just need the personality & resourcefulness, both of which she has.
Seth/ Solaria clearly should have been the main final villain. Mina was cursed to be that way. One of the side effects of the spell put on Mina, is the inability to be reasoned with. No one could literally logic things out with her because of Solaria’s Spell. Why they gave her a redemption with no build up makes no sense. She should have at least apologized to Mina, bare minimum, instead of leaving her to be abandoned. She was everything to Mina, and left her alone. No other Solarian warriors left alive either. The show wants me to see Mina as an irredeemable baddie, but she’s not. She could have been such a well written character. The hints were there, like with the flashback. Guess, it wasn’t meant to be.
I think it would’ve been really interesting if we got a mini series based on all the Queens from the spell book. Especially with stuff like Solaria, Seth, the Magic High Commission etc. There were certain parts of the book that you had to understand to better understand Season 4 which imo is poor storytelling. I shouldn’t need to hunt down/read a book or Twitter thread or whatever to understand the show, just put it in the show if it’s important to the narrative.
She could've worked... as the muscle/second in command for a more interesting and threatening villain. Have the queen she served get brought back to life and have her start her crusade again.
solaria needed more backstory
I feel like she'll possessive with Eclispa
It also doesnt help that she was defeated offscreen by season 3's villain so its hard to take her serious as the show's final villain
Man these videos make me sad and nostalgic. There was a point when Svtfoe used to be my favorite thing to watch on tv. I cant believe how bad it ended and how much better it couldve been. Ive seen a good deal of these kind of videos and every single one suggests a better ending then the one we got.
Sometimes I feel like the makers of this cartoon had like no plans after toffee's death, and when they where told to make more episodes they just didn't know what to do
I mean, now thanks to Star cleaving Earth and Mewni and NOT CAPTURING MINA, she just made Mina THE endgame villain
I love how you talk about the actual problems and just about Star Vs. good content thank you!
I always thought that it was dumb they couldn't beat Meena, like they literally didn't have to beat her, they could just have imprisoned her on a different dimension and used skywine's spell to destroy a dimension
Recently discovered your channel and i’m loving it. I’m looking forward to more content in 2022
"If you think Mina is a good Final Boss villain, then you're as COOCOO COOCOO as they come"
As the final boss, I don’t think so. She’s got a palpable motivation, but she wasn’t really established much in the narrative prior to Season 4 to warrant that. She would have been better as a mid-season finale boss IMO.
My personal preference, going off of everything from Seasons 1-3, is having the MHC be the villains. We already know at that point that they were behind the historical revisionism and facilitated all of Mewni’s racism for the sake of eugenics, and with Season 4 revolving around Star trying to remedy that, the MHC would have the most problems with that. It would give the writers the opportunity to flesh out Rhombulus and Omnitraxus as characters, show Hekapoo’s growing allegiance to the good guys via her friendship with Marco, make Lekmet relevant from beyond the grave (or perhaps before it…), and establish Glossaryck’s true motivations better.
The first thirteen seconds, holy hell that was genius!
With star having the monster and mewmans party some of the monsters could have thought why would we trust ppl that have hurt us for years and what if it’s a trap. That could have been a good way to show someone on the monster side disagreeing with it. U could also have someone who still wants to fight mewmans on the monster side
I feel that Mina had some good potential and was wasted. Mina probably had a good and interesting history that I really wished had been flashed out.
Mina was the first solarian warrior created by Queen Solaria, so she has a connection to both Solaria and Eclipsa. I would have liked seeing some flashbacks and interactions between these three characters. Solaria taking Mina under her wing, traing her, and turning her into a solarian warrior. We could also have Mina being a babysitter/friend to Eclipsa growing up. Little by little we see Mina become a solarian warrior and lose her mind and rationally becoming Solaria's ideal warrior to destroy monsters as well as drive a rift between herself and Eclipsa. Eclipsa becomes horrified and disgusted with what her mother has done to Mina and the other solarian warriors. Mina who has become completely loyal to Solaria's ideals now hates Eclipsa.
As for the final big bad it should have been a computer or robot that had Solaria's memories and Mina would loyally serve it as it's second-in-command. It would been a more interesting conflict as well as serve as a better final conflict. You could have Mina come to her senses and have her turn against the machine and fight alongside Eclipsa and the others redeeming her character.
I’m super convinced Mina was supposed to be a one note character and was never supposed to appear again after that episode. Then again I also though that about Heinous but in that case I’m glad I was wrong since Meteora is a genuinely amazing villain/threat. Regardless I assumed Mina was just supposed to make fun of and satirize the “Magical Girl” genre (her appearance does take lots of inspiration from Sailor Moon). If they did want to make her the villain they should’ve expanded more on her backstory in the show rather than one shoehorned in flashback. And also, while a bit nitpicky, change her design a bit. Maybe have her wear Solaria’s armor to show just how much of a threat she is even if it’s just in the final few episodes.
If it were up to me, I’d make Rhombulus the final big bad. If they’d written Moons betrayal of Eclipsa a bit better this could’ve worked. Out of all the MHC he seems like the easiest one for Moon to manipulate and she does in “Cornonation” basically making him free Globgor. The rest of the MHC seem to hate Eclipsa for no real reason plus having one of the members of the highest authority in Mewni turn out to be a villain would be pretty amazing. Perhaps as Moon continues to manipulate him he begins to actually believe what she says and brings it to heart ultimately betraying her and learning a crystal spell that can’t even be broken by the Crystal Pulverizing Spell dead bent on re-crystalizing Eclipse any Globgor. It’s not perfect, but would’ve been way more interesting
Personally, I wanted Season 4 to be about Mewni civil war between Seth and Monster Supremacists, Mina with Mewman Supremacists, and Eclipsa and Star with their faction of monster and mewmans. Basically, the story is overall the same except with Seth coming out of hiding and growing a faction of monsters who hate Mewmans as much as Mewmans hate them, even Eclipsa and Star. This would also at least give Moon more reason to side with Mina given how her own mother died and the fear she has that Seth will kill Star. Eventually in the finale, Mina and Seth plan a grand attack on each other and Eclipsa and Star who are actually aided by their monster and mewman friends and soldiers and manage to defeat the two showing how unity will ultimately triumph over division.
I never noticed before but I think the sound the door made when the prison guard slammed it was actually foreshadowing that the room was just Spongebob. It's the same sound that happened every time Flats punched him. Weird to hear foreshadowing in the stress dream of a character in an episode of Spongebob.
I don't think Nina was meant to go the way she did, but she was never meant to be one and done, at the end of her episode you see her lamenting the loss of her Mud sister, there was definitely this sense of all consuming loneliness about her but we weren't sure where it was going, would she be redeemed would she go down a darker road seeking Star's attention, there was possibility... Until they actually did something with her and changed her motivations.
Also not for nothing, but she didn't have to know Star, she was very clearly already unhinged when we first saw her, she could've already been on leave since before Star was born and the Royal family was just still touting her image around as political propaganda.
To be honest; ya can bring back Dr. Jelly Goodwell and be no difference except make her more senile then usual or hell could've kept both King Spiderbite and Queen Spiderbite for a different route or like you suggested before one of Queen Moon's Relatives like; Etheria for her own different motivates. *OR* If some of you wanted Toffee *so bad* how about we raise the steaks and bring Seth back as well and might have a few Interaction between two and Seth hogs all the spotlight for himself and later Toffee somehow still has a change of heart despite still being right about killing magic to begin with all along minus the jumpscare near the finale from the portrait.
no. I dont want to write a whole essay on why none of these would work but they all have their own issues. jelly goodwell liked monsters just not in the right way. she also had no power, something mina did have. bringing toffee back would've been stupid repetitive and it would've came out of nowhere. having Seth as a villain for season 4 would've gone against the story season 4 was going for completely.
Nah. Having Toffee be a henchman turned good is unnecessary.
From what I hear Seth could have carried the story just fine.
Please do a video on eclipse. Even though she wasn't perfect. She was still a great Queen. Who was just trying to bring peace 💜
25:50 on that note maybe a better fix is they finish the spell to only target solarian soldiers at the cost of the butterfly family's magic(their magic alone) so it still kinda climatic sacrifice but not consequently killing the beings made of/rely on magic to survive. No more magic for Moon,Star,Eclipsa,etc or the children come after them. Been awhile since I watched svtfoe not too sure how well it would fit but thought it could be a better alternative.
Your video analysis on characters are pretty good. I am glad to have discovered your channel ever since the video with Oona. Thank you for doing these. I'd like to hear about your thoughts on the Septarians one day (even though they're just Toffee, Rasticore, and possibly Seth) or others you think you find interesting.
The discrimination against monsters was always an important plot of this show, so it's fitting that the last villain would be the personification of racism (especially considering the previous main villains were all monters). However, I think towards the end of the show, the writers realized they didn't have a good villain who could fulfill that role. So they tried to make Mina work, because she was the closest thing they had, but they forgot to tone down her craziness for the serious scenes.
I feel like General Yunan from Amphibia is Mina done right
Solaria would have worked because the build up and how dangerously powerful and evil she is
Mina found nukes and kills everyone offscreen. Erasing magic because MAGIC ARMOR is so dumb and now everyone in the SF universe is likely dead.
Mina works best a side character with a supportive role
I feel like an alternative they could have done for the ending was that the magic high commission could have worked if moon didnt turn out the way she did and betrayed. I feel like the only reason they did that was so that the bad guys get to use magic/a magic wand. So I feel like it could have been better instead of moon being the one to take the wand from eclipsa, maybe the MHC created a wand for Mina herself to use. A custom wand that she used to master magic to fight eclipsa, and in the end it was too much that she has magic that star decided that the only thing left to do was destroy the magic so she also no longer has magic.
This is just my personal endings though, kinda half baked and probably has some holes but it could be cool.
I feel Toffee should've never been dead and could've been the endgame villian because he was a much better villian than Mina and Moon would make no choice to kill Toffee instead of letting Star kill Toffee due to a promise she made to Eclipsa when she was a teen,to avenge her mother and let go of her past by getting rid of Toffee for good.
To the end: the reason she seems so different is the Solarian spell. The spell itself required you to physically break that individuals mind for the sake of combat. And Mina being the first experiment faced the worst of that mind warping. With the magic gone and the spell over her mind is no longer chaotic and as it was. But dispite that her ideologies stayed the same, hence the speech. Mina had a lot of flaws in how they wrote her but that ending scene did a great job showing what part was the spell, what part was Solaria's influence and what part was Mina herself.
With the good ideas speach, maybe the magic she had made her partially insane, so when the magic was gone she was more focused. Or when she was magic but normal her mind was broken bythe magic and became blood thirsty when she powers up
Mina could have worked as a character and villain, not a ending villain but a big threat to Star and the kingdom.
If the show was more free with writing and no network rushing the show out the door all of the characters could have been amazing in their own way.
According to an AMA with the creators after the finale, they knew well in advance they were only getting four seasons.
I always have found her backstory pretty tragic
Personally I think Mina had all the makings of a perfect villain. She has a compelling backstory. She was the mc's idol at one point. Her design and quirky personality make her a great parallel/foil to the mc.
She was a Crazy war general that has been experimented on and has radical tendecies, she could have been better that Toffee, but the writers are not good.
All very good points. Really shows the importance of re-reading the scripts, they should have hired you as a script editor.
I think she could have worked given she had to be written probably but I like to believe there are no bad ideas only bad executions
I am a little surprise they didn't really go I the tragedy of the character. Like it seems like she was the o lying soldier left doing her time. And the magic and experiment left her crazy and unpredictable but, they left her like that in order to have a weapon to use. And everyone is ok with that. There could have been a breaking point for her character to lash out at both human and monster because of the things she did to feel included. Tbh, It did seem like the magic and loneliness what made her crazy.
with a HUGE rewrite that could have been Stars reason to kill the magic
Why would you make a joke villain an actual threat? It would be like if the Ameboae Boys held the Mayor of Townsville at gunpoint.
They made Ludo work and forgotten all of the ingredients.
Rewatching the show with a friend, maybe it's because of her use as the main villain in the show's awful final arc, I found a lot of scenes with Mina to be a chore to sit through. She's not threatening and I didn't think she was funny.
I originally thought Mina killed Solaria.
Motherhood mellowed Solaria out, kind of like River and Globgor bounding over being fathers, and she started peace talks with the monsters. Since Solaria stopped living up to the image of Solaria Mina had in her head, she had no other choice but to kill Solaria.
I think maybe if you cut a lot filler in both season 3 and 4 and rewrite a whole bunch of stuff, there was a chance to make this story work again as well add a proper endgame. perhaps the first half of season 3 could’ve been the whole Meteora, Globgor, and Eclipsa plot where she becomes Queen then the second half could be the Mina plot (minus moons involvement, let’s say someone else is providing her this power) where she not only wants to kill all monsters in Muni but to the whole multi-verse and you can have some of her forces already spreading out to attack a bunch of other helpless realms, giving Star and crew better justification to destroy magic. But come season 4 not only is Toffee still alive but after being presumed dead for centuries Seth the king of the Septarians come out of hiding and they have access and built technology involving warp gates where they can cross travel across other universes without magic. Rather then moon perhaps he and toffee were the ones secretly gave Mina her magic powered army as a long term plan to manipulate Star and the butterfly’s to destroy magic forever as it is one of the only things that can bypass there super regeneration (that is not magic in nature but there actual biology like how the horse heads still fly after magic disappears) and kill them, but with magic gone, their whole species are basically now invincible, the high commission would be go, and all the realms would now isolated without easy means to communicate or unite forces together. Seth, Toffee, and there hyper regenerating armies, with their technology based warp gates finally goes to war with the entire multi-verse to conquer it all. And to subvert the whole thing, Star realizes her mistake and she, Marco and there friends would have to find a way resort magic again and to somehow stop Toffee and Seth and there conquest of all of existence.