She Destroyed An Entire Game
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- čas přidán 24. 08. 2022
- Android 21 Lab Coat was one of the most broken characters in fighting game history.
Her kit was completely unbalanced - and from casual to the pro level, Lab Coat 21 was an unavoidable terror that forced everyone to play her in Dragon Ball FighterZ.
The one question on everyone's mind was, why? Why would the devs release a character so obviously broken, and then go silent?
Were they trying to ruin their own game?
Thanks to Tyrant (@Tyrant_UK) for the interview.
Written by: Devin Coull (@Fake_DevinCoull)
Edited by: Andrew Faigal (@Brrrning)
Thumbnail by: Bennett Grainger (IG: @bennettgrainger)
Production Assistance by: Nicolas Buck (@nbuck12)
Hosted by: Daniel Rosen (@Daniel_Rosen)
Produced by: Alina Sotula (@ASotula) and Daniel Rosen (@Daniel_Rosen)
Footage credits: pastebin.com/fSsVMwiy
Music used under license from Associated Production Music LLC (”APM”).
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The devs only started to do something when big tourneys started outright banning LC21. I wouldn't say they listened to their fans regarding that
Nahh that's cap, they always released op characters and then nerfed them down people didn't wait for the nerds and called for bans, although I'm surprised they didn't nerf the debuff from 21% down but maybe soon, imo DBFZ is the most balanced fighting game imo
@@Justin-wx1pu and because they nurf them afterwards it doesn’t matter because we have already bought it
@@Justin-wx1pu Your first statement is also not true. The Broly's, Zamasu and a number of characters were severely underwhelming on release and have been buffed multiple times to be genuinely fun to play and better. DBFZ isn't balanced. All the characters got buffed and barely nerfed in this recent patch but it never shifted the meta. The top tiers stay top and the mid tiers stay mid with some additions.
Literally every fighting game does this shit. Even smash. They release an OP character for a while and then nerf him. I dont think they cared about her being banned, and i dont think they care ahout tournament times. Thats why sonicfox’s little tantrum sounds so dumb to me. As if theyre gonna sit there and wait to time the update. They dont give a fuck, they got jobs to do. They do the update, release it and move on to the next project. These arent fan modders, theyre people who work as developers for a company.
@@Justin-wx1pu idk I feel like Tekken 7 is one of the more balanced fighting games I’ve played. FighterZ feels too top heavy. Like there’s a good number of good characters but everyone outside of the top and high tiers kinda feels pointless to play. Like low and mid tiers in DBFZ have been a nightmare to play since I can remember, even casually
Edit: except videl that’s my home girl, I will accept zero videl slander
The moment I heard PERMANENT buff and debuff in a fighting game, I lmao'd myself out of existence.
I love Lab 21 but yes the perma buff/debuff shattered the game. Being able to combo into it freely was dumb af haha
who the hell thought of that
ikr. I would Have Been Perfectly Fine if It Had a Time Limit, Or if It Went Away On Hard Knockdown ( Or Even Switching Characters if We Want to Go That Far ).
fuckin this lol, when you realize that even when SWITCHING it doesn't go away
Shes not "gutted" she was nerfed from top 1 to top 1
Yeah, he was very misleading with his language multiple times in the video.
"Gutted" from must use no questions asked to number 1 mid diff
No way she is top 1
Vegito, gogeta 4 are better
@@izder yeah you definitely are not good at the game lol cause of you were then you wouldn’t be so clueless
@@ayovenom9906 eh not really those two are also fucking cracked
theyre very close to 21 albeit still behind
LC nerf literally made her from mandatory to still the best character in the game. She had the most usage in the game at top level so she definitely was not gutted.
Couldn't have said it better myself. The top tiers are the exact same, and even in the same order with 21 LC at the top and both Gogetas and Vegito right after. The only difference is not picking 21 LC is no longer throwing.
she got nerfed from best character to best character truly a tragedy
S/O to Yasha for being the only pro to never play Labcoat.
And the ONLY reason he didn’t switch was that before labcoat came out his team was already considered to be the best in the whole game
Have you seen him in Wanted?
He played her against Shiruydan and Gropis
Yeah but that doesn't change the fact that is because he's goated and he uses the best team in the game
MoldyBagel's video on Lab Coat 21 explains it pretty well, Arc System Works and Bandai Namco have demonstrated their knowledge of their game to be far too great to allow Lab Coat 21's stupidity to happen by accident, SHE WAS MADE BROKEN ON PURPOSE, and this isn't even the first time, in season one, they removed all the post super 4 way mixups and then gave it EXCLUSIVELY to GT Goku, SonicFox described it as "playing a different version of DBFZ" which you quite literally were, GT Goku came very close to being banned, but was nowhere near as broken as Lab Coat 21, even if the character gets nerfed later, most players will have already bought her to compete, besides, it's not like she isn't still blatantly the best character in the game.
The fact that she little brothered UI, both Broly variants and all of the fusions is just insane
Well UI was made pretty tame. They put more thought into his nerfs than everything in the last patch combined.
Lol
“If we make everything 21, 2121 damage, 21 buff, 21 debuff, it will, like fit with the theme of her name...”
“True. True. But it will also destroy the balance of the entire game...”
“It’s clever. I thought of it. WE ARE DOING IT.”
Not sure if it's mentioned but LC21 didn't even have to get the hit, due to the z change mechanic pretty much any any hit from any character on your team, you could switch into 21 and grab.
I remember you could land the unreactable light command grabs of Z-Broly and Goku Blue then OTG it. Fun times...
@@remuvs yeah, but literally no one did this especially on a pro level
Yeah I was thinking about this when he was going over debuff. Its crazy how he was talking about her being so damn good and still ended up accidentally downplaying just how good she was lol.
As far as I can recall.... Bayonetta was broken, hated and killed the game like this!
And months later, ultimate was released...
Wait...Dragon Ball Super Fighterz confirmed?
Rollback
META knight- shit was in his name
@@MrOz1705 like 2 years later
@@sonicrichardsrb oh yeah...i mixed up my dates...
My memory is outdated xD
We went from LC21 to the announcement of rollback in 7 months. Arguably the lowest point for the game and then the highest point in just over half a year. Bonkers.
The meta is still in a really bad spot, which makes rollback bitter sweet bc they basically confirmed this game will get no more balance changes.
@@foreverfirebird5712 yeah, meta still revolves around full screen fuck neutral buttons.
When a character is broken like this and makes the game unfun for both players and viewers the character should be banned in tournaments
Just the bayonetta stuff all over again
Nah
If SF3 chun is allowed, this is allowed
@@harrylane4 Not a good comparison, tbh. I’d say more or less Vergil/Phoenix in UMvC3 and even then, FighterZ can be very cut and dry w how combos can work sometimes.
@@harrylane4 At a high enough level, you will still see someone like Q or Hugo or Necro to absolutely demolish whole parts of a tourney with good parries and punishes. If you can get the punishes, you win a match in SF3. Low tiers may have not won the whole thing, but they have made quite the scenes. Kuroda(Q), Hayao(Hugo), (I couldn't read the name of Necro and Oro players I've seen).
Great video, really cool. I've always been a FG adjacent fan, just casually watching comps and learning about LC21 being so busted is so crazy. Love your nails, keep up the good work 👌
My main problem is I just hate playing seeing everyone use the same character
When I play matches online all I see is SSB Gogeta
they paid money to play whoever they want
@@dizzyb2309 true. And this is just not on fighting games. But practically every game in existence since the dawn of man. Hell, even Monopoly has a usage rate on some of those properties that are owned the most. Or even chess. Where the best piece is the queen. You know she's coming out and when she does your king is in danger
@@greenboyzgaming5607 gogeta, goku black and vegeto thats why i stick with yamcha, videl, super broly and cooler.
Gogeta Blue is one of the reasons why i dropped the game. That character is so boring to watch and yet you have to fight against him 8/10 times in online.
It’s just neat to see footage from such a range of content creators and people in the community throughout the vid :) And, yeah, she was just crazy. Still super good, but, at launch… Yeah.
Ik I was so surprised to see a seereax vid in the mix there lol
In all my years of watching pro dbfz religiously, I did not think that a "thescoreesports" video is where I first get to learn about Tyrant's full name
The funniest part of this whole story is the fact that Android 21 is literally an entirely new character that Bandai Namco & ArcSys made specifically for “Dragon Ball Fighterz.”
The devs *LITERALLY MADE AN OPAF OC,* and it is gloriously stupid. It’s enough to make me go into hysterics laughing.
Everyone says "my OC could beat Goku." But only the truly dedicated go the extra step to acquire an official licensing agreement to use Goku so they can make their OC beat Goku
They honestly need the dlc $$$
Sounds like Leroy
Thought you were talking about an android version.
@@WhyDo yo we got whydo in the comments???
Bayonetta: Finally! a worthy opponent!
Can't wait for another girl in glasses to break a fighting game's meta.
this game is still fire. community kept it alive and THRIVING during covid
Yup and every character is viable to play now. Obv some characters will be better than others but for new players that will join when rollback launches, they can play who they think is cool/fun to play instead of just playing based on tier lists.
The FGC is one of the few success stories that happened during Covid it's honestly an impressive part of video game history.
@@user-sn1hf6oi6x it's great see that people get mixed by my wildcard fat buu. I ain't an expert but no one knows how to fight so he's my clutch up lol.
@@user-sn1hf6oi6x
Hahahahah… No. not every character is viable. Cooler is absolute ass
@@spiralanimations7736 as a cooler main i sadly have to agree to this ;(
So glad u guys are giving fighting games more coverage
I lost interest in watching Fighterz shortly after SSJ4 Gogeta dropped though I did see Lab Coat early on and thought she was braindead. I however was completely unaware that she was so busted that she damn near killed the game.
It’s crazy how even in its game does dbz have powerscaling problems
Take to heart this woman’s original and cannon name is Vomi.
For real???
The editor deserves a raise for this video, it looks like I'm watching a vice news style video.
Android 21 Lab Coat was pretty much the Smash 4 Bayonetta of Dragon Ball FighterZ.
Leroy Smith - "i see you're feeling yourself, that type of pride aint good for your health"
Please more FGC content. When y'all apply yourselves on it, it's excellent.
This game is good for being able to win with almost any character (although it will be a little harder) but then they added this character to the game and everyone had to play her to even compete
A skilled Roy can beat any Fox
This is how they sell DLC. It's all intentional, make more money at the expense of fun. Same thing happens in all genres of games.
It's another reason DLC is always a problem. But it's not going anywhere...
I wonder if Labcoat Android 21 is worse than Leroy Smith
Id say so. Ik leroy was everywhere in evo jp top 8 and top tier broken but lc21 was just even more broken just for the fact that he had that debuff. Made the games so boring to watch. Everyone had her on their team. This could very well be recency bias from me but I think she was more broken.
@@rikittu Yeah Leroy is busted but Lab Coat was insane
I'd say Labcoat is worse. Leroy was overtuned and is cancer to play against, but there are characters in the game that could contest him.
Labcoat, you can't do shit about her once she got that debuffs on you and the only way to level the playing field is to use Labcoat yourself.
Labcoat 21 stuck around way longer than launch Leroy. Which meant more time to ruin the game.
Always can spend time to watch one of your newly posted videos
Bamco is the dev and publisher that has mastered the art of releasing DLC in a busted state to rake in the cash or at the very least really popular in the competitive scene on fighting games. Leroy and Fahk in Tekken 7, GT Goku, UI Goku, ZBroly, LC21 and the fusions in DBFZ and most of FP2 in Smash (yes, Bamco helped in developing Smash). It's a scheme that guarantees money from those who not only are going to buy it but they HAVE to in order to stay competitive.
FP2 overrated as shit
The powers that be might of had 99% of the dev team working on the next game. Consequently there wasn’t enough people to patch the game in any sort of timely manner. Have heard anyone mention this possibility. It might not have been the devs simply being obstinate in the face of all this criticism.
"S- Tier".
Yeah no. She's still top 1 in the game. 🤣
Bandai just wanted to make sure that the world knows 21 is the best waifu in DB series
Waifus destroying every game they’re in be like
DBFZ players: you cant change the game drastically before a major tournament
LoL Players: first time?
Bloody hell, the Morde and Darius meta and even worse, the dreaded Ardent one, god, those were shitty.
@@TheRatedOniChannel exactly
LC21 was a silent middle finger from the Devs without giving us the middle finger
Wawa didn't start the fusion meta. Yasha did after the start of season 3. A year ago.
Wydm check again yasha only started the fusion meta with a17 but way before that wawa already play his main team now way back at the start of season 3
ArcSys has a habit of going near radio silent as far as updates go.
And Guilty Gear Strive now has Happy Chaos, and the devs are yet to do anything to actually knock him down 10 months later after taking over tournaments, winning EVO, forcing pros to abandon mains to learn him since he's not being touched, and generally being hated by the playerbase and fans, who groan and boo whenever someone is scummy enough to play him.
its actually sad how small fighting game prize pools are in comparison to other genres
They just said beam, it wasn’t just a beam, it was the fastest beam in the game
at some point it was like the community as a whole seemingly silently agreed to ban her from the game entirely. even as we speak its rare for me to find a lab coat 21 player. havent seen her in my matches in months and i hope it stays that way tbh
I see her a bit in ranked, and its usually people who don’t fully understand the game.
@@BGTournaments well now that she's not COMPLETELY broken some people are playing her again to get a bit of an advantage
The nails design is so cool m8
In the show Android 17 and 18 were busted in their timeline. It makes ton of sense for later version Android 21 to be even more busted.
She is still the best character and is either required to play, or two fusions to counter her. You can probably guess what the best team is lol.
What's worse is she was nerfed from top 1 and essential to play, to still top 1 by far but you can now win without her.
But the top tiers are unchanged since last patch.
my mans argin with the cameo
I men in years i don't think the game is going to be stuck in the Fusion meta, Melee it's a good example of how a game without any patches can still develop the Meta for decades i mean the Smash Bros meta 5 years ago is different that todays meta, so yeah when players start to develop strategies and stuff then the meta will shift, obviously like with Fox in Melee Lab Coat 21 will be the best character but there would be new strategies and teams to bet her.
Pfffff.... Melee?... Melee is way less balanced that Fighterz ever was. And its meta didnt evolve that much. It was Fox on top the whole time with an ocasional Marth, Falco and Shiek here and there. Maybe a mericle Jiggly Puff once in a whle. That game was never designed for 1 vs 1 competition and Sakurai even admitted it. The fans of the game made it that way.
Arcsys aren't known for balancing. Remember their Sailormoon fighting game?
I like how they cut off before sonic fox put on the furry head lol
What really turned me away was the debuff labcoat was given. No idea wtf they were thinking with that
That wasn’t just the issue it’s the fact it never went away even after she died
About time we had another FGC video
Anyone saw the irony when the video was talking about Wawa destroying Labcoat21 meta while wearing a jersey with “21”? Poetic.
Mouldy Bagel made a hilarious video covering this situation
Devs releasing an overpowered villain every single DLC, then nerfing them...
So like every single arc of DB...ever?
UI shouldn't even be in the conversation with GT, Labcoat, S1 Cell/A16/ etc. UI is just a more practical and consistent Adult Gohan, but with really really good assists, and even then he was mostly played on point. Now he's pretty damn rare, and they barely nerfed him. Compare that to the murder they did to Roshi, who is a decently similar character.
DLC is an issue in fighting games, but only Bardock, GT Goku and LC 21 over centralized the meta. Vegito and Gogeta blue became meta with balance patches not on release. The characterization on the video is completely false.
IKR, Lumping Gogeta Blue with UI goku and GT goku as "powerfull characters" that shaped the state of the game on the release is mind boggling at the very least.
That koichi fight was legendary, I was sweating beads watching it.
I knew this video was COMING. The channel has done a similar video with all B.s. characters in the Fgc. Unfortunately it Finally it came to my favorite game 😭
"I don't know what banday was thinking"
Sales, they were thinking about sales...
It was literally buy the character to compete or struggle against her every 8 out of 10 matches...
Her Super that Buffs her team and Debuff the Opponents sounds like a special condition in a Challenge battle or Extra Mode.
Great video 👍
Love when you guys do FGC content
You'd think that after the "Leroy Smith Situation" that happened in Tekken 7, fighting game developers would think twice about making broken ass characters.
But clearly that wasn't enough lol
I love how DBF has had this problem with almost every DLC character save a few. LC21 just broke the camels back.
DBZF Players had to deal with 20+ Broken Characters
Smash Players currently complaining about 3 characters
dbfz never had to deal with more than one busted character. smash is just a juvenile community in general. they are trying to get steve banned and steve has won like one major event.
@@ubadman1 gt goku pre season 3, season 1 android 16, bardock when people learned of 4-ways after level 3s, UI just being op as hell, LC21 with debuffs, fusions with their insane power and combos, Z Broly being top 2 (behind labcoat) and having double level 3s, Kid Buu just being a master of all. Yeah, only one character. We’ve probably had almost every roster character be broken OP at one point. though i will agree that smash is juvenile lol
One is a team game, one is not
Dbfz only had like one busted character, everybody else was just good. Smash definitely has fighterz beat in dealing with broken characters and it's still true to this day.
Edit: actually forgot about 16. So maybe 2 or 3 if I wanna sneak in gt Goku. Bardock wasn't broken, he just played the game better, same with Fusions, Broly, Ui goku and kid Buu. If you play sf, Luke is like them where he's clearly the best, but he isn't broken. He just plays the game better than everyone else
@@samirbelica2358 can we stop pretending UI was really out here like that, he only had that fucked up L starter and S hitbox and 214H, he was pretty normal outside of that.
Glad to see Doto and SeeReax gets the credit ^^
love the nails man !!
Thumbnail looks like what her Bad End would start like…
One of the most broken in history is definitely too overkill to describe 21.
I was thinking the same thing, but in the context of modern balance maybe that isnt so far fetched? Like yeah, she isnt a petshop or anything but characters that fundamentally broken, that change the fundamental rules of the game, dont really exist in modern games (outside of steve ssbu i guess). But a single character that was so far ahead of everyone else, especially in a tag fighter, to the point of being must pick for every team is pretty unprecedented
@@Clickstop24 steve? Lmao he's not petshop broken
You sure?
I didn't search this. Apparently, the algo needed to show me DBFZ in its final form.
hope the best for the dbfz community.
I cannot believe that people still didn't figure out the reason why Labcoat was released in that broken state, and it's super obvious. It's because they wanted to promote the movie Dragon Ball Super: Super Hero. Android 21 is a Red Ribbon Army character, and the whole movie was about the Red Ribbon Army. On top of that, look at when Bamco and ASW announced they were gonna nerf Labcoat 21 and when the patch actually came out. They announced it in May and without giving a date, then the movie came out on June 11, and the patch came out on June 29, two weeks after the movie was out. It's just common sense.
I was looking at CZcams. But it was laggy and i only saw the name of the video. I assumed you was talking about smash 4 bayonetta.
android 21's meta was defeated by fusion meta, and the video ends with gogeta blue defeating her, literally the end of a dragon ball saga goku and vegeta needed to fuse to take down the enemy
It's sad that two of my fav fighting games Dbz fighters, and Ssbu both got a broken dlc character dropped as the last addition with no further balance updates
The DLC releases were planned like the sagas in the anime series. New, bigger, and badder enemies. Then either the community takes them down or the devs step in to end the saga.
What did you expect? It's not the first time Bandai releases a Pay to Win character
I think games like melee have shown that given enough time a community will either police itself with bans to things like wobbling or just being able to have the discussion like they did with puff and ledge grab limits and I feel like if fighterZ sticks around long enough, people will figure out some insane things or they’ll just decide as a community that some characters are lame and just not play them all that much anymore, especially if they figure out solid counterplays to the top meta characters. Can’t wait for the video in like a year on whichever low tier main runs through a tournament bracket with a team full of like bottom five characters or something XD
Yeah just wait a decade for that to happen...
@@measlesplease1266 eh maybe, but they already banned lab coat once so I feel like they’ll be more mindful of characters or team comps that kill the game. If it ruins viewership or just becomes the only thing people see in top 8s either the community will just play something different because they’re sick of it or they’ll limit or ban characters if there’s no solid counterplays
Except then there's Brawl with Meta Knight, and Smash 4 with Bayo. It doesn't make sense that Melee is as balanced as it is and that is part of the beauty of it. You can't really compare things to Melee very well when there's really nothing close to it in many aspects (like being a 20+ year old fighting game, that has next gen versions, yet still has a very large and competitive tournament scene). That and the fact that Melee didn't have a single balance patch with the exception of the changes made to the PAL version...and people don't even use that version as the tournament standard. So, if you have to ban something as a community in a game that had multiple balance patches that feels like a really bad sign.
You know these are fighting game clips when they reference Sonic Fox over and over again. Hahaha.
I understand why Sonic fox didn't do it you can't change meta 2 weeks before a tournament
didn't Wawa just won against Nitro's 21 at the last Evo?
oh.. it's included on the vid. sorry bout that 😅
Here's why arcsys put her out. Easy money and the fusion meta. 1. She's android 21, the simps will buy her up instantly, 2. She's an original character meaning they can make any moveset imaginable to beat the fusions, and because of that 3. People will pick her up immediately
No further explanation was needed beyond simps buying her instantly. 🤣
I feel like one more last balance patch, alongside the rollback, to iron out stuff a bit more would be the perfect final patch.
Keep the FGC content coming!!!!
I kinda miss the mini documentaries with amazing voice over
Don't think i don't see you with that clean Johnny Shirt
Now thats a character that can BEAT GOKU
Anyone else starting to see a trend in the characteristics of the dlc characters who ruin a game's meta?
never thought i would see a thescore esorts video on dbfz
The nail polish killed me
I don't play much Fighterz but this looks pretty much exactly like the bayonetta issue in Smash 4. And that issue wasn't fixed until ultimate came out.
7:45
Never played the game and only watched it a few times but this sequence was incredible...
i remember the day lab coat came out... i uninstalled then next day. still havnt reinstalled
I got the game DB FighterZ and played it only a little bit but never wanted to dedicate myself to getting good. So I stopped playing it quite soon after. But I have to say, DB FighterZ is underrated. Great game/genre and a great spectacle if you know what's going on.
A PERMANENT buff AND debuff??? I've never even heard of a permanent buff in a fighting game before, and she can give both with a single move?