1800 Super Easy Coil Winding - Serpentine Coils For DIY Generators
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- čas přidán 8. 01. 2023
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Boy are you trotting out these videos Robert you have the rains and we are going on a trip for sure ...i love this.
cheers mate
I had not heard of a serpentine version. Really enjoying these videos and thank you for sharing your knowledge. Always learn something from you Sir.
cheers mate
What classes have to taken to learn all the info in your videos? Engineering? Electrical? Or just a whole lot of trial and error? Common sense ain't so common anymore and is hard to teach... Your level of understanding and ability to explain to others is unparalleled. I applaud you sir, positive attitude and demeanor
I am a chemist mate - the rest I picked up along the way
Thank you for this video, the timing is perfect. Just as 10kg of copper is delivered. I so needed this
Glad it was helpful!
I am so impressed with your intelligence and experience. I usually learn fast but this is way above my understanding at the moment.
Wow, thank you!
A new lesson every day keeps me watching & coming back each day, learning something new to store away,to bring them out on a rainy day. Thank you. 👍🐝🌞
cheers mate
I love this man and his approach ! I always learn something. Thank you
Always an interesting new twist with these videos !👍
A teaser… wonderful! Can’t wait for the follow-up!!
lol - cheers mate
Thanks Rob,
That was a very interesting demonstration that caught my attention.
Cheers.
Glad you enjoyed it
Thanks for sharing this Robert. It answers a lot of the things I didn't understand.
Glad it was helpful!
Really interesting thanks! 👏
Glad you liked it!
Thx mate!
Happy to help mate
I can't wait to see what you have come up with for this.
Looking forward to see your next video.
cheers mate
I love this channel. My favourite on CZcams.
wow - thanks mate and thank you for taking the time to say so
I am learning more electrical stuff from you Sir. Shame my Covid-19 still knocking on my brain. Look forward for you to make more electrical discoveries to be shared with us all. Great work fella too.
cheers mate
Nice. I've never wound a coil like that. Can't wait for the next one.
cheers mate
Is this where we get into star layouts? Every time I watch one of your videos, I get 1000 ideas and want to run right out to my shop. Keep it coming.
awesome and yes lol
God
Bless
Mr.Robert.in.2023,
Sincerely Paul.
cheers mate and all the best to you in the new year too
Really interesting, thanks for sharing all of this! 🙂 👍
cheers mate
You just answered my curiosity about serpentine abs 3 phase coils
.
I would love to see a comparison between similar rectangle really trapezoidal shape coils
interesting way of winding coils for axial flux generators, thanks for the 101.
cheers mate
Time ago I made a small generator using a PCB with a zig-zag track pattern and a flat fridge magnet (those flexible ones that usually have images on them), but didn't work well, it just produced less than 80 mV, and was able to reach a power output about 30 uW. The PCB was 5*5 cm btw, and to produce the power I just simply rubbed the magnet flat on the PCB
Darn those cliffhanger endings
all in the best tradition of good old Saturday morning cinema club mate lol
I wonder how mathematical 'knot' theory plays into this. You could probably find a maths grad student and make some interesting optimizations on your design. I've printed your Arch-Turbine and I'm working on winding the coil, we get a decent breeze here with gusts going well over 50mph during 'severe' weather. Im excited to get this coil built. Thanks for the great designs, videos, and information!
@6:30 I loved it, Found you recently, but im a new fan 😀 Cya next time 😀
Another great video thanks 😁✌️❤️🤘
cheers mate
You're like a coiled spring generating all these videos 😁
lol - cheers mate
Very nice mate. Those little flat bits that did nothing always bugged me as a waste of conductor length. I suppose your little flat finger axial flux generator goes some way to solving that issue.
Thank you for pointing out the issues with copper overhang in a motor/generator. Serpentine coils do a great job of mitigating the issue with overhang. But there's a closely related way to wind a coil to reduce the issue of overhang even further, and that's to wind what's called a faulhaber coil.
The axial flux motor I made on my channel uses a flattened axial flux faulhaber type coil that is only two wires thick to minimize the airgap between the magnets and a slotless iron stator for zero cogging. The winding sort of resembles VVVVVV going around a circle. Then their are Dimond shaped coils.
Yes those two winding types are diagonal to the direction of motion. But they eliminate overhang and still generate a voltage proportional to cosine of the tilt × the length between bends. They are able to produce more voltage with less wire when compared to traditional circle, and square as well as serpentine coils.
I cant wait to see your next video and see what coil type you'll cover in it.
Well I hope you've not just ruined the next video for me....
@@ricos1497 I don't know what to say. I've got an idea or two. I could be wrong or i could be right but either way, I'm still looking forward to Robert's next video.
Maybe you'd enjoy watching me build and test a motor on my channel.
I think of the diamond shaped coil as a variant of the faulhaber - which you are spot on with and is my next video lolol
@@ThinkingandTinkering And even more simply, both the diamond and faulhabor are variants of the serpentine coil.
@@ThinkingandTinkeringif it interest you I would sugest search Google for images with the terms "thingap motor". I'm immensely impressed with their radial flux faulhabor. My next motor build will probably be like that.
More on the diagonal. If we look at a radial flux faulhaber standing up, the closer the diagonal is to the vertical, the shorter the wire is crossing a given magnet, and results in a better volt per length of copper wire / a given rate of change in magnetic field.
To get the diagonal closer to a vertical, one can have a higher magnetic pole count on the rotor or one can make the rotor longer. I say, doubling the rotor length comes with the added benefit of magnetic fields crossing less than doubled the length of wire, at half the diagonal angle from the vertical.
@3:45 Im always afraid ill rub the coating off the wires when im experimenting, so i havent tried thigns klike you show have been tested.. I learn alot from you bro :-D Thank You 😀 What if the coatings fail, then the wires short and loss of power in the coil happens, probably correct?
@1:30 it doesnt recognize the wire as a current flow when its already within the field, thus proving that the wire must move across the magnetic fields to produce a voltage, not through them. Through them is innert...
Have you ever tried forging a copper ingot and then using a plate puller to stretch your own wire for your coil?
what size copper wire do you use to make the coil TIA
help i ran short on the enamel wire on my last serpentine coil is spacing recommended?
I have learned a great deal of knowledge from you Sir, I'm budget stressed of a disabled US Army veteran. Joining is so very important.
What gauge of copper wire used? Is the copper wire bare or with a thin plastic coating? How many wraps of wire?
What if you gave the inner and outer ends a 90° twist?
You could then generate there too.
You mentioned that serpentine doesn't help with the wast on the ends, however, circular couls have a top and bottom wasted and serpentine has either a top or a bottom not both. Would expect a 50% reduction of waste at the ends.
Could a disk with magnets put on the ends of the motor stator, bound with the rotor?
That is tremendously cool. I've been working on driving synchronous brushless motors as opposed to BLDC motors, specifically high frequency injection (HFI).
But apparently it's very expensive to wind coils for synchronous motors. I'm wondering whether your serpentine coils behave similarly to synchronous motors?
if you pull apart a microwave oven turntable motor you will find that is a synchronous motor and it is a single straight forward coil - I am not sure why you think coils for synchronous motors are hard to wind?
@@ThinkingandTinkering Maybe I have my terminology wrong. If you look up "PMSM distributed windings", you'll see they look like the coils you're trying to copy. What makes them special is that they overlap, allowing you to produce magnetic fields at any field angle and thus smooth, maximum torque anywhere between the three commutation phases. We use them in precision robotics and are very expensive.
The Faraday Disk is the solution
it really isn't
I suppose you could make a tube and wrap the coil outside around its length then have a circular magnet running to and fro inside like a piston. You could fix that to a heat differential engine and bingo. Magnetic fields are around the edges of a magnet so they would be very close to the copper wire that acts as a dielectric deflector.
yes you should - that was the idea behind the shaker torch
Sorry to break in with a question unrelated (maybe?) to the course of discussion and teaching you have been on lately, which I love. I just saw Adam Savage video visiting the Royal Society to observe the late David Jones "perpetual motion machine" with the manufacturer label "Dreadco"... the puzzle seems to be using many of the elements and technologies you have been teaching us or perhaps NOT? Have you presented on this interesting trick before? Thank you from the Cold of Canada.
I haven't mate - I know Daedalus but I didn't realise he had passed away
What about winding copper around a tube and passing a magnet through it. Maybe a magnet on each end reversing polarity passing it back and forth.
Do you have a simple specification for the copper wire, I would like to buy a real from Amazon ?
Robert, I do some metal scrapping. One thing that is becoming more common is electric motors with copper covered aluminum wire. Just wondering, if someone is wanted to use a motor to make a generator, does the copper/aluminum wire make a difference in out put?
copper conducts electricity better than aluminum, so when copper is used the wire gauge is smaller than aluminum, plus copper costs more. so when copper is coated on a aluminum wire it just reduces cost without compromising current loss. so to answer your question, there's no difference in output for copper/aluminum wire.
@@jr-pl9kj thanks for the reply
not really mate
@2:11 What if you created a variable magnetic field that was setup in a way that many fields were weeved together, has anyone ever tested the efects of wires through weeved magnetic fields in differing elaborate layouts; where the wires move variably?
First thing that comes to mind is the large amount of copper wire that surrounds an old crt monitor or tv. It literally is ready to be turned into a serpentine coil. Great
😀I am not sure now if you mentioned it but could the serpintine simple have a v instead of a u shape to reduce the outer copper . Its 6am in the morning and i need to sleep 🤣
In the faulhaber coil vid he talks about this and he says that the angle of the wire determines the current so if the wire is at a 45 degree instead of 90 it makes about half as much current but there are gives and takes with all coils and I like this idea I'm planning one out as we speak. Good thinking about the angle thing tho. These vids are pretty cool.
i bet the one with out wast will be like a microwave turn table motor you know rob there are fridge comp motors made like that i think they are in some of the fridges that fail so bad when fairly new
the force produced would be the sine of the angle of the curved loop passing through the field
Such coils are sometimes referred to as wave windings.
Robert, wouldn't a zig zag coil be more effective than a serpentine coil?
@4:33 I think the wires would better perform if created to exactly relate to the magnets locations, and not around them... To be honest...
since when is a current measured as a voltage?
I wonder if a piece of iron could be used to bend the flux to make the wire useful as a generator, it works in my head, but physics is often like that, your brain thinks one way , physics thinks another!!
Awesome video!! ✌️
Since the movement of those outer and inner bits of wire are in tangential direction to the center of the generator, those wires can never "cross" the magnetic flux. And that crossing is an absolute requirement to generate any current (like he demonstrated at the beginning of the video). Orienting the wires parallel to the motion just does nothing. You'd need to manage to move those inter and outer turns further away from the center of the generator to make those bits generate any current. Which is physically rather challenging ;-)
no mate the angle of the wire to the flux path is what matters not the magnet overhanging or not
@@ThinkingandTinkering yes sorry, that's what i was trying to say.. my bad
Magnetically permeable material (such as iron) _can indeed_ "conduct" or "direct" magnetic flux.
But it will also "contain" the flux.
Similar to spreading pipe over your yard. It efficiently carries water to all parts of your lawn, but it will still need need to "leak" _(holes, sprinkler heads)_ to get the grass wet.
i made my surpentine coil, but when i try to test for voltage ,my multimeter reads only in ohms,and beeps alot, what am i doing wrong?
👍
Just when it got more interesting a cliffhanger happened, dang it. 😄
Well I just gotta wonder what that usage is for the "leftover" copper. 🤔
lol - in the best rendition of Saturday morning cinema club mate lol
Going to put a guess here before the next one drops. The fix will be to add magnets which are oriented to interact with the "wasted" coil segments.
Please do carry on some of us never took physics class.
cheers mate
If you get bored ( i doubt it will happen tbh lol) last year was a nightmare for me personally with the heat so i tried to make my own air conditioner. I made a rectangular box (6 in wide x 3in and 3 foot in length) at the bottom i had an airtight slot for the fan and at the top the vent. I then put 2 tubes going through the 6inch wide section, one at the top and at the bottom and wrapped plastic tubing around them going the full length. I made a hole for the end of the tube and intended to attach it to my cold water tap. I didn't go any further because i soon realised the plastic tubing would flatten were it went over the pipe and another reason was because i didn't think the plastic tubing would cool sufficently. I'm going to buy some copper tubing and try it again but i'm also wondering if picking up a second hand car radiator might be a better option. What are your thoughts on this Robert, do you think there might be a project for the future?
in the summer mate - no one will watch it now
I tried this with a very large copper car radiator once. It seemed to work well for a bit, but condensation plugged all the area between the fins preventing air flow. The condensation water wouldn't drip or shake out, ending that project quickly..
You might try spreading the new coil sideways like a series of overlapping ÒOOOOOQ
@@Dr.JustIsWrong Very interesting, that's something i didn't consider. A very nice suggestion with doing the coils sideways also, i guess making a spiral would be the best solution. Thanks very much i will try this in the next few months.
That will work for cooling and heating depending on water temp and a radiator should work for that. We used to run something similar while we watered the grass but you could run the water service through it before it is used in your house. Also I think you could put a small turbine on it and use harvest energy off the municipal water pressure.
@@ChillCat665 Thanks for the tips, i guess i better start getting this up and running as summer nears.
Oh Mr. Smith the suspense is killing me to what your going to do about it in part II
lol
The number of loops in a coil directly multiplies flux density.
Many small coils can easily out perform one large coil.
check your Lorenz's law emf=BLV sine theta
@@ThinkingandTinkering
B = 4πμ₀NI/ _l_ ?
Increasing N will increase your B in: *_BLV sin Φ_*
Have you been following the PCB motors on CZcams? Where the coils are printed using multi-layer PCBs. Just a thought?
Also, the Harmony (small scale) wind turbine (which changes its exposed surface area to match wind speed) might be of interest?
I have seen them mate - cheers
Why do you use a bundle of wires for each phase, rather than a flat single peace? Hope that makes sense? If it does the same thing, could one potentially paint, print or forge and hammer a thin but wide and flat peace in place of the bundle of wires?
Could you simply use your highly conductive graphine paint and print a design for each of the three coils of wire perhaps onto a suitable structure? Lastly, what if the suitable structure above was 100,000+ permiable dielectric material?
It is not a bundle of wires but a coil of enameled copper wire. This is basic physics more windings in the coil = higher voltage output. As he explains in the video, even a single strand of wire can behave as a coil, so a single piece of copper would act as a coil, but would yield next to no voltage. Remember electricity is a two part equation of voltage and current. Also bigger coil = greater intersection with the magnetic flux (remember this is a 3dimensional flux around the magnet) = higher energy output
the emf (or voltage if you like) is dependant on the length of wire (Lorenz's law emf=BLV Sine theta) - a bundle of wires gives you a lot of length in a small physical space - B= strength of magnetic field, L = length of wire, v = velocity of wire and sine theta is the angle the wire makes with the field - if you muck about with those 4 things you can improve a generator
@@ThinkingandTinkering oh I see! 💡 Ty!!!
@@ET_AYY_LMAO ty!!!
Amazing. Why is this not widely used? Is it so much more difficult for machines to wind or what?
It is already used in electric motors and generators, I have seen several motors wound like this in a cylindrical fashion instead of a flat circle. This particular arrangement is as he mentioned useful in axial flux generators, a specific flat arrangement of coils and magnets.
@@ET_AYY_LMAO Neat. Learn something new every day. Thank you for your answer!
it is used mate - quite a lot - things take time to catch on I guess
What diameter copper do you use ? And what kind of tattoos is that ?
Coiless flux generator, is that better than a flux capacitor?
oh yes lol
Hey Robert I watch 1799 a couple a days ago. I went to comment but discovered that video was TAKEN DOWN????
What happened???
I want to say thank you for opening my eyes ....
Input as opposed to Output
I did a small re-edit mate and reposted it - cheers
Your website is down. And can’t find your designs to buy anywhere
you don't buy them - i give them away
I've always wondered why someone has never invented a system like this to somehow attach it to busy railway lines to generate Free Electricity from the vibrations trains create.
Some trains (especially freight trains), are extremely long, extremely heavy and create very large amounts of vibration. I'm surprised nobody has created some form of hollow lines or pressure pads filled with coils and magnets to utilise those unused vibrations.
you just did mate lol
Just a question of topology, isn't it ?
Does thicker wire produce more current? What would a copper pipe do?
no but it can handle higher currents.
no mate the thickness of the wire has nothing to with it - if you generate more amps you need thicker wire to handle the current is all
@@ThinkingandTinkering Morning Robert, have a wonderful day mate thanks for answering :)
🤔 ... an outer housing lined with magnets in an alternate sequence relative to their perpendicular counterparts?
try building it
@@ThinkingandTinkering Hahahha, that's the trick isn't it!? 😂 I have a feeling you're going to show us one of those awesome cages that redirect the angle of flux, as to achieve induction on the outermost portion of the coils. 😜👍 But time will tell! Can't wait for your next vid ✌️ Thanks for everything you do Rob!
it`s called flemings right hand left hand rual
but why not simply extend the width of the magnets until they cover the coils completly?
Use metal car rims with holes
While I've heard that there are no stupid questions but a great many inquisitive idiots, I won't let the risk of such title dissuade me!
While this method of a single serpentine coil would surely save a great deal of the time in hand-winding multiple coils, I'm trying to wrap my head around a way of still using "magnetic gearing" that is, a different number of coils as magnets to better match the torque and rotational speed of the prime mover for the best power point without physical gears and their (even if it's only a few percent) frictional losses.
Could anyone point me to a resource for a way to still accomplish this?
Rob, you have my continued thanks for helping to keep me TnT.
If you're ever across the pond in this fine State of South Carolina, you've dinner and drinks on me.
mate - if I do get your way I will take you up on that lol - cheers
@@ThinkingandTinkering Just don't try to tour the whole country in less than two months. We've a bit more and area than many expect.
Still, the best food is in the SE quadrant!
Standing offer.
What do you mean by "axial flux"?
put it in a google search
@@ThinkingandTinkering
google didn't tell me what _you_ meant..
@3:20 when you passed we didnt see the screen of your monitor for verification... arg
Please can it generate 220v?
yes
We didn't co er this in physics. We built a "hover craft" and covered independent motion. It was sub parr
dear sir, I was came across a CZcams video it was foreign. I think the guy was Serbian or Argentinian or something but he took an induction heater and he produced electricity with it with a magnet coil he said, do you know how because I can't find the video anymore. He literally had the induction heater on took a ceramic iron, ferrite magnet with wires wrapped around it, and all he did was held it next to the induction heater and as it got close over top of the copper coil the wires sparked between two points he had set up
Why not make the bends a simple single sharp angle and decrease waste?
why not indeed
@@ThinkingandTinkering
Because electrons don't like corners?
I believe the angle of the wire determines the current so if the angle was at 45 instead of 90 it would make 50% less current but would save on copper. His Faulkner vid explains this I believe but I wonder the same thing
If people need some custom coils, they can send me the materials and take care of all of the shipping, and I will wind up to 24 coils one time for free.
But by all means, be sure that you have the return shipping so you get everything back.
No strings attached, no hidden games, just offering a one time free service to people who want some precision coils wound.
This is one of the very few things I can do to contribute to the community of DIY researchers, inventors and tinkerers.
If the mandrels need to be custom cut and built, to a limited extent I can build custom mandrels, but if the coils require epoxy, special materials for shielding, etc, this will be up to the person who wants the coil.
If this is confusing, message me and I can explain at length.
that is a really kind offer - I know what that takes and it is very generous too - cheers
@@ThinkingandTinkering I've had this custom hand built coil winder for 15 years now, and its just sitting here, so I think it would be potentially useful to people to help them start their experimental journeys in some cases.
Also, it gives me a chance to feel like I am contributing more than just feeding out technical information and random ideas to people.
You see thentional diverentional displasmends do to conditions above and below and i between😍
When the wire is olrady inbetween and you move themashermend is in a diverend strings pressend jad not as implayeble as electricity 🎁
🙏😍💜
🖖🌈🍀🌻🍀
Make a tred of diverend thikness and than do again over the lengt of the wire you wil masher the diverentional do to the diverend thicknesses of the wire inbetween the magnets
Output is dictated by speed, no.turns on the coil, and magnetism. The missing factor, for me, is working out what torque you need to keep a generator turning. I attend with bated breath.
emf = BLV sine theta mate - it depends on length of wire, velocity and strength of field oh angle the wire makes with the field
If you moved the wire closer to the speed of light, it'd probably move the electrons..
lololol - yes probably now try and do it
@@ThinkingandTinkering
Yeah, it didn't work out too well..
Now I've gotta patch the wall..
and the neighbor's wall..
and their neighbor's wall..
and their neighbor's attic..
and their neighbor's attic..
and their neighbor's roof..
and their neighbor's wind generator..
Science is expensive
Strange that water and electromagnetism have very similar terminology. Currents, waves, banks, serpentine.. and old architect has volts, arches, cathedrals/cathodes?
indeed mate - I guess it's pretty much the same concepts involved
@@ThinkingandTinkering could it also be that the old architect and water systems were technology?
So can you just run a bar say one inch long of copper every cm around the wheel not connect any of them then have horse shoe shaped brushes on each side staggered from the right to left side so when you spin it the graphite brushes complete the coil in rapid succession left to right couldn't you then use thicker copper for higher amperage output plus graphite is cheap have a dozen brushes staggered left from right around to complete the circuit and just straight copper rods between magnets inside I wish I had the equipment to build it and see please test it for me I'd love to know if it would work my brain says yes.
I am sorry mate if you want to test it you will have to build it yourself
First I just have to say you are top notch! A few times a go you Rob talk about gear and before that about speed before that the law of Physics! Now I come with a comment! And it might be what in Sweden called speed we called it fart! In higher speed a better outcome of energy you say double speed give back eight times! But then we lift a few Questions about this we touch the scary law of physics! Now over to alternativ VAWT a Savonius slow in action but high i torque a Darrius high in speed and low in Torque and all between! Take Darrius if the middle rods for fasten the blades was shaped like V:s a Savonius way to get them work easier and one of the cheapest way to! But it slow down the Darrius a bit like a lower gear but how much? Then you do this kind of coils we work from center of the Windmill! as a motor I buy the Idea! to gear up the speed! But still we must alway se all ideas as good idea to the day something say otherwise! 🥸