The Deep Warp & Other CREEPY Mysteries | Warhammer 40K Lore
Vložit
- čas přidán 7. 07. 2024
- Use code WESHAMMER50 to get 50% off your first Factor box at bit.ly/3Y3ZPoQ !
It's finally spooky season my friends and you know what that means, it's a perfect opportunity to part 4 of our continueing look into the grim dark mysteries of Warhammer 40k's Lore.
Mysteries covered in Part 4. The Xenos species known as the Umbra. The mysterious disappearance of Arkhan land ( inventor of the space marine land raider). Is The Deep warp real? And what is written on the Grey knights Relic " the Terminus Decree"
⭐ Weshammer Merch store Here ⭐
shop.weshammer.com/
Special Thanks to my patrons over on Patreon
/ weshammer
Find more of my Shorts over on my Tiktok
vm.tiktok.com/TTPdhNbAva/
Join us over on DIscord!
/ discord
Time Stamps
0:00 Intro
2:12 The Umbra
7:58 The Deep Warp Theory
12:04 The Disappearance of Arkhan Land
15:58 The Terminus Decree - Zábava
Use code WESHAMMER50 to get 50% off your first Factor box at bit.ly/3Y3ZPoQ !
Malal in the deep warp: welcome to actual hell 🔥 🔥 🔥
Factor box isn't fresh. Any food you buy that has to be put in the microwave isn't fresh.
So it's like a single restaurant uber eats?
Just so you know, your comment section seems have become infested by bots. I keep "winning gifts".
@@Historyfrek4ever Ive noticed, I delete them as fast as I can and ban key words they tend to use, but so far youtube has not given us any tools to deal with them :(
I think the Deep Warp theory is solid. I mean, we already know that the warp is a lot more than just the chaos realms (Gork and Mork are warp gods, but aren’t in the chaos realms) so I feel like it would make way more sense that the warp is waaaaaaaaaaaaay bigger than what humanity realize
The Tyranid Hive Mind is in multiple dimensions, too goddamn big for the Warp itself. I think it being connected, if not rooted, in the Deep Warp is logical. Think, it's shadow can deny Gods the ability to see and snuff out deamons, to me, it's like the Shadow of a predatory whale spooking sharks, with the Ruinous Powers being said sharks.
Chaos Undevided got defeated by the Nids before. Yes, I do think the Milky Way is the first time the Hive Mind encountered the Ruinous Powers, but, much like an octopus feeling around with it's tentacles, merely found another prey item.
"BuT NiDS can't eat Warp TaiNTed..."
Tell that to Kronos, whom, in the Nid codex, can eat soulless, Warp tainted husks (not all Chaos infected things give Biomass, but the simple fact Kronos can eat more of it shows the Hive Mind is treating the Ruinous Powers as prey, adapting to devour a new food item).
Psychophages are a further step in this direction.
Considering the fact that the warp is by it's very nature feed by all types of things sentient beings do, have done and will do in the future (the warp pretty much ignores our concept of timeflow afterall) => it's bound to be damn near endless, and obviously full of unthinkable horrors.
On top of this:
We can't even begin to understand it, the warp breaks more or less all rules... hence even the "sentient beings" part may be an understatement. I mean would it be to farfetched to assume non sentient stuff can somehow leave a mark in the warp as well, a mark humanity simply has managed to encounter yet?
That's the thing with the warp, since we can't understand it we can't even overestimate in size/ influence. It's arrogant to believe we can ever hope to figure out the rules a place that makes it's own rules seemingly at random.
@@peterpan4038 It's like in number theory once you learn imaginary/complex numbers and see that the "Real Numbers" are only a single line along one of the axes, and all these other outcomes and layers exist. A cube root of a number has not one but three answers, just two of them are in the imaginary/complex badlands, off of the real axis, and thus invisible to us, like ghosts drifting in dimensions sharing our own space but not directly interacting with it other than casting shadows.
Creepy to think about, honestly.
Considering how Milkyway centric the Warp is, one could argue that the "warp" is the part of the realm of souls connected to it, while the "deep warp" is probably the part of the realm of souls connected to the rest of the universe.
@@LtAlguien yeah the stuff residing in the cold dark space equivalent of the warp have to be fucked and weird. there is no living creatures out there to have influence on the warp, for them to feed on, etc. the creatures there would be entirely alien and not something taking shape from the emotions of mortal creatures.
I love me some unimaginable horrors
The food he was hawking was a horror.
Me too
It’s not scary because it can’t be imagined though
Fuck yeah!
I'd like to, but I can't imagine them. 😔
Partial Spoilers
When it comes to the Terminus Decree, based on The End and the Death, there are passages that imply that if the Emperor dies, he would ascend to godhood and this ascension would consume humanity in the same manner as the Birth of Slaanesh. Thus, if all is lost, the Decree would be activated Big E's mortal body would finally expire and he would ascend to godhood at the cost of most of mankind. From there, Emp's godhood would have certain advantages and disadvantages for humanity, and the war would continue but again, it's a last resort.
if I remember correctly, the recently awoken lion meets up with a chaos lord who thinks keeping the Emporer in life support on his golden throne actually stops him from achieving his full godhood spirit in separated from him in the warp. if he does die he might resurrect and finally put an ultimate end to the chaos. but in the universe of 40K; a happy ending is nothing but a daydream for the imperial guards
@@alienvisitor8393 Big E ascending by consuming most of humanity would be anything but a happy ending.
It's how they're going to kill the series like Old Warhammer when it turned into Age of Sigmar.
Welcome to... AGE OF EMPRAR!
@@alienvisitor8393 There can be no end to Chaos as long as humans exist because they are the main ones tainting the warp.
@@alienvisitor8393 My guess is that Age of Sigmar is practically what they were doing with the terminus decree and maybe something they were considering to do with 40K but ended up doing with Fantasy instead.
I like the idea that the warp is truly like a massive body of water, infinite and amorphous and the gods and realms of chaos that we know are just eddies and whirlpools on the surface. Ripples from a trillion trillion little souls splashing into the surface. The gods are mere fish gobbling up the swarms of little bugs disturbing the surface. And there's always a bigger fish.
@@a-blivvy-yushow tf did you manage to do that
@@garethmcguinness377 Same way you did? I clicked "reply" and typed my message then clicked the second "reply" button to send it? What's weird about that?
@@a-blivvy-yus oh lmao on my screen your comment is just blank, it looks like you managed to submit a comment with no characters lol
@@garethmcguinness377 That's probably because the message I typed was ""
'
The Umbra sounds similar to a fragmented C'tan, but obviously isn't since they're warp based. Makes sense that an Old One would act similar to a C'tan.
Their appearance reminds me of the two spheres from astartes
Vashta Nerada! Remember that they still retreated when a BIGGER horror of the universe (to his ENEMIES at least) appeared
@@EASY7356 Those were Yu'Vath IIRC
no, the main body of the ctan just hides in the warp. That's why the umbra appears near the warp
@@thebluegremlin C'tan are gods of the material world. They and their magic do not interact with the warp at all.
This actually makes me think Kairos experienced the deep warp or something on that level when Tzeentch threw him into the Well. And the reason the other GDs didnt come back was because they were consumed by the entities and energies that lie within. Kairos made it out barely and was essentially cursed and we still don't know what he witnessed in there. Oh and to top this off.. Tzeentch somewhat believes that's not actually Kairos.
Edit: for the part behind Tzeentch thinking Kairos is an imposter, you'd have to do some digging through lore videos and lore pages as I can't find where I heard or saw it, if anyone can find out if it's true or not that's be great as I don't wanna consider myself crazy just yet.
You're telling me that Tzeench thinks it's possible that Kairos was destroyed when it went into the well and the thing that came out was just an impostor or a clone?
@@pootisbird7280 It's a possibility for sure, my other theory is the head that lies is actually a Deep warp entity that acted as a parasite to take control of Kairos and used his form to escape the well which can be the actual reason Kairos survived, the parasite found a suitable host out of the all the GDs that came through. The parasite tells lies to gain power while Kairos tells the truth to stop this power gain and possibly reveal it's intentions to the other GDs and Tzeentch in the form of his ramblings as he is driven mad from the Deep warp and being infused with the parasite but is able to retain his consciousness just enough to keep it from taking over completely which could result in the parasite becoming more powerful than Tzeentch and taking his place as a Chaos god as we still don't know the full capabilities of something that would come from the Deep warp especially if the gods don't go anywhere near it.
@@pootisbird7280or even crazier: he could be possessed, just like the demons can possess beings from the material plane. Deep warp entities could be the demons' demons.
@@LordValdomerol I need to go get drunk or I'm gonna be thinking about this all night.
Is there a book all this is in? Especially the part that Tzeentch is having suspicions?
The crazy thing about the deep warp is because people think it might be there, when you go into the warp, it *will* be there because every idea is embodied in the Warp.
That’s not how it works, brother. If it were, every faction would just imagine a paradise and then hop into the warp to enjoy it.
The Shape of The Nightmare To Come heavily featured the Deep Warp. It was home to things like ancient Eldar war machines that were more chaos creature than machine, and things too old and powerful to be called daemons. One even became another Chaos God. There were also "hellsubs"; hideously corrupted Imperial Blackships that accidentally dove into the Deep Warp and got given the business by the creatures that live there. And at the very bottom and center was the Nex; an entity that is such an atrocity of existence that even saying it's name causes you to spit up blood and turn the paper you wrote it on into spiders.
Apparently the sequel of The Shape Of The Nightmare To Come, "Age Of Dusk" confirms that the more Chaos gods emerging, the more the Nex will rise out of the Deep Warp. Which utterly means all of existence will dissolve as the last Chaos God would awaken. Hence, "Revelation" (literally the compassion of the Emperor) and his allies have to reach the Well of Eternity, and this is also a problem for the C'tan, who want to kill Revelation to take that power for themselves to also stop the Dissolution. It also managed to transform Drach’nyen into a Deep Warp entity after it murdered the Hamadrya during Abaddon and Huron’s fight (Who, in this case is empowered by the Chaos Gods, so Huron was beating Abby quite badly before literally having his organs collapse)
I actually remember reading the fanfic and it’s sequel. In the sequel apparently, the holy numbers of the Chaos Gods are a countdown to the Nex rising. Should it ever rise out of the Immaterium, all of existence will dissolve and become one with an unknowable, alien and boundless horror. The Nex’s forces also managed to influence Huron through Hamadrya, and why Huron grew much stronger to the point where he could fight Abaddon, who tossed Drach’nyen to kill Hamadrya, only to get badly brutalized by the Chaos influenced Huron. (Honestly as much as I love Huron, Abaddon kinda wins in a physical fight)
Guess that means even the Chaos gods are somehow *afraid* of what will happen when the last being ascends into Chaos God status.
the Umbra seem a lot like the things that trapped and teleported the Retributor Astartes in the Astartes short film.
I thought the same
Those were something else, got this form archwarhammer but the things in Astartes lined up with the Yu'Vath pretty perfect.
I thought that too, but then I listened to him for more than 5 seconds. They acted nothing like the Umbra or their supposed capabilities.
@@Alastarr1 Admittedly there could still be a connection, remember the Yu'Vath use tech mostly based on the Warp, which actually does sound kinda similar to how the Old Ones were masters of the Warp, and their science seemed strongly based on it (seeing as they were left on the backfoot when they encountered the C'Tan, beings who's power is pretty much entirely based in mastery of material reality). Maybe Yu'Vath based their tech on surviving traces of the Old Ones, or they developed their tech along a similar path.
The creator of Astartes actually clarified that the entities the Retributors encountered were strictly a homebrew creature, and any likenesses to existing creatures in 40K were coincidental.
As for The Terminus Decree, I heard a theory that it is an instruction on how to create a new Emperor. What I mean is that there is a ritual described where ancient shamans combined their souls to create the Emperor and the Gray Knights would repeat it.
Doubt it's the craziest idea, and in Warhammer craziness and likelihood are somewhat inversely correlated.
Makes sense given all Grey Knights are psykers, which that's what shamans in ancient Terra were.
Not Just the grey knights, if the astartesphage be used, they could fuel the ritual with every loyalists astartes and primarchs still avaiable and maybe even the emperor, allowing either a nee emperor to rise or at least the current emperor to reform, with the custodes holding the invasion of the demons from within terra, while the whole thing is done
But as a result, a new age of strife would take place, unless there be just a few billion or even a few million humans left, enough to kickstart a new human era with a new strong emperor, making the terminus decree a last resource, only to be used If the empire be reduced to just the sol system or even less
And lets be honest, for an empire with a território of over a million planets and trillions of citizens, be reduced to just a couple of planets within a system, It is enough to call it a emergency 🧐
It would be used if GW decided to reaet 40K.
Big E dies, allowing the destruction of Terra by Chaos invasion from beneath the throne.
The Grey knights , being psychics, perform the ritual to merge souls. Maybe with whatever non insane psyker is to hand.
Big catastrophe, Imperium sundered, and the game’s storyline ends.
New product is launched. The new Emperor is some sort of character or force within the new product’s lore, as the Shattered Imperium of the 42nd millennium struggles to survive with either no psykers, or every one is.
Big E was created by a mass shamanic ritual.....deep lore somewhere
Ya know I actually hadn’t heard of the Deep Warp theory before. But now it’s an irrevocable part of my head cannon hehe. There’s something compelling about the idea of those deepest, darkest realms that are so distant yet so close, so inhospitable yet so unavoidable. They’re always down there beneath the impenetrable black. They wait with deathless patience for the next battered soul to drift silently into their embrace. I imagine a place so inaccessible that only the most intrepid explorers equipped with ancient technology lost to time could ever hope to gain even the slightest glimpse of it. A place unlike the warp we know. A bleak and cold and silent place so far removed as to be almost completely untouched by the material realm. The perturbations from the shallow warp above do not reach its depths. The turbulence and chaos in the sea of souls gives way to stillness and quiet. Gods do not tread here for this is not their domain. But it is here where all that is of the warp will inevitably descend. It is the entropy of all things, a realm of figments. It is the oblivion that comes before life and after death. It is where the final thoughts of conscious beings and the carcass of their memories go to be at last forgotten. But even here, even in this emptiest of blackness you are not alone. You’ve seen the corpses of dead gods. You’ve drifted past the twisted remains of ancient, sunken void ships. But there is something else, something you can’t see. You can’t exactly describe it or explain how you know it’s there. Perhaps it is the figments of what once was your being slowly drifting apart. Perhaps it is the last disturbance mustered by a soul in the void beginning to imagine true oblivion. But something is here. Something unknowable to mortal minds. And it’s getting closer.
Perhaps something primordial that is the source of the warp & realspace. The entity could be the Cosmic Serpent Dromlach that the Eldar Harlequins & Saim-Hann look up to all the while considered to be the demiurge Yaldabaoth that mankind believed in in ancient times. Who knows though right?
Unknowable to mortals....
The Tyranid Hivemind is beyond human comprehension and the Ruinous Powers. Also, in multiple dimensions because it's too goddamn big for one! An Eldritch super predator.
I dunno if it originated in the Deep Warp, but I seriously doubt it is not present there. Could easily be one of the Deep super predators, whether it's native there or not.
Either way, the Ruinous Powers, Big E, all things, are seen as either prey or Pests to the Hivemind. Would also make sense why the Shadow in the Warp does what it does. When fish see a large, predatory shadow, they scatter or hide. Very similar to the Shadow in the Warp snuffing out deamons and making daemonic activity more difficult, if not outright impossible.
@@BobelPop Or much worse The Old Gods.
Head *canon
Maybe the Deep Warp is where those unknown entities that caused the Halo stars come from. Maybe the presence felt at the Halo Stars is indeed a Warp, but a different kind
My head canon is that the terminus decree contains a super intelligent AI based on the emperor’s psychology. It explains why it could be so ridiculously powerful, basically a reconstructed STC, but only able to be used as a last resort.
My head canon has always been that the warp does have pocket dimensions/realms where the gods can manifest and have entire kingdoms with solid matter and constructed things. And between the gods' realms are pockets created by the imaginings and dreams and nightmares of living beings. Somerealms last forever and grow. Some last only as long as a single person's dreams.
Warp travel is just skimming along the upper "pond scum" that accumulates at the surface. Deep deep down is where the oldest and most unimaginable things exist.
You're technically correct. The Chaos Gods are twisted manifestations that was born, actually born because of all the spiritual/emotional energy that was harnessed in the immaterial give birth to such incarnations.
Now what about actually true living Gods that have no actual beginning? Maybe the actual eternal Beings that even the Old Ones wouldn't dare to utter actually exist and they can end The Chaos Gods with a blink
This is remind me Perimeter Geometry of War.
It's not a Warhammer, but the concept almost same.
The Infernals for example.
I like to think that the sentient beings in the materium have demons in the warp that are created from their thoughts and can posses them and otherwise terrify and terrorize them along with other unspeakable horrors.
And all of the demons and chaos gods of the warp have created their own set of demons that can posses them or terrify and terrorize them who live in the deep warp. It's horrifying to be honest. The thought of demons created from the thoughts, fears, and impurities of demons, distilled one layer deeper into hell.
@@Unit-3475please do expand on this, I'm really curious.
@@atashgallagher5139
Well, it's quite difficult.
The complexity level of this game lore of can compete with Dark Souls.
That account by that madman actually made me start a bit as the clues slotted themselves together and suddenly hit me with the fact that he somehow learnt this from a friggin *Keeper of Secrets* , like holy moly, the planet that guy was on was so close to being doomed!
Bro was a self-admitted heretic, he probably had enough favor to not get turbo-owned on the spot
That man I think learned it from the chaos god slanesh
the fact that the terminus decree may be a crucial part of the golden throne and still no custodian knows about it or its content is honestly rather unsettling
I love the idea of "deep warp." I presonally would love to see a story about ship getting accidentally being knocked into it.
Bertruer's voice then: "Welcome to my domain. Behold, the shape of things to come. The time has come to escape your prison and drive mankind into Darkness. Your darkest fears will soon be realised as your soul burns in Hell! [echo: Hell! Hell! Hell!]. There is nowhere to run. I am everywhere, and you will NEVER find the thing you seek."
Not to spoil too much, but “Death of Integrity” kinda fits that bill.
I'd wager it to be hell of a short story. They entered the deep warp, they died, the end.
the umbra being a single old one's soul broken into pieces is just the coolest concept and the main reason i think the orks are the same. one old one soul divided between billions of individuals so he could not only fight but also pretty much ensure he would survive the war in heaven.
I like this but I’d like to thing they are the combined souls of two old ones. Gork and Mork
@@LordOffal but what if there is more than 2 old ones. what if there is 5. gork, mork, pork, fork, and work
@@yogsathoth79606. You really gonna forget Cork?
Gork and mork might be old one constructs or bits of old ones themselves, but we know pretty much how gods work, believe it long enough, becomes real. Eldar knew how this worked enough to make their own gods, and we also pretty much know that orks are just the descendants of something called the Krork, which were all like, primarch level or above orks. Eldar back in the day were more powerful still, and just kept killing a bunch of krorks in culling campaigns, which I guess only left the shit ones.
@@yogsathoth7960 okay... This is cannon for me now... All the old one's names ended in "-ork" XD
So if the well of eternity could be a gateway to the deep warp, is that greater daemon (kairos) that tzeentch threw into it saw the deep warp and is now completely crazy?
Kairos is still nutty, both heads.
@@jedediahcoulbourne1791 yes kairos that’s what his name was
Didn’t tzeentch just keep throwing kairos into the well because nothing happened and he’d just pop right out until the final throw where kairos came back out completely batshit insane with a second head?
@@Wetbread88 yes, that’s what I mean he was throwing him into the deep warp until something bad happened to kairos
@@Wetbread88
Or good, according to Tzeench.
Speaking of the deep warp. Actually, warp has three layers. The lowest level of the lowest layer actually is the place where Imperial void ships used to travel. And chaos gods exist in the third layer.
But there are some descriptions that there is some eldritch realm beyond the warp. It was described as void or absolute void.
Magnus had a glimpse about this place and even Chaos gods could not comprehend the true scale of this place.
Yes, it was a place where the true form of the god Ynnead existed.
Perhaps a place where the gods/spirits (egregores & tulpas) manifest in birth & reside in death. Maybe even reforming as another being like it was a form of reincarnation. Who really knows though.
@@BobelPop
It's indeed really interesting. And despite that, we also know that gods of chaos themselves are just avatars of their true forms(yes, every depictions we have seen about them are just their avatars). Their true form are abstract forces that lingers the reality itself. Yet, we are still didn't get any information yet about where these abstract forces resides.
@afryanmahendra2055 Probably at that point, it's incomprehensible.
It'd be funny if during tDAoT Korne could just on his þrone, þen a random void ship just blipped in and flew past his face, only for it to blip away a few seconds after.
I like to think that the Terminus decree is instructions for a ritual that would close the eye of Terror but also cut all of humanity off from the warp meaning no more faster than light space travel for anyone who doesn't have a webway. I like to think that that was the emperor's plan in the first place create the webway and then seal the warp so that the chaos Gods could never affect Humanity again.
Yes, that's what the Golden Throne was supposed to be used for. But Horus ensured that we can't have nice things.
I always imagined the Terminus Decree was a device that would somehow destabilize reality and end the universe. A sort of mutually assured destruction type scenario.
Yeah me too, I kind of imagined the terminus decree could be a gigantic reset button, the big thing to me is it has a leader of the grey Knights, Space Marines whose expertise has A LOT to do with the warp, that makes me imagine whatever it is would probably have to do with the complete and utter destruction of the warp, which sounds GREAT on its face, until you realize that the shock caused ty the opening of the great eye killed billions, ifnot TRILLIONS of people. and disrupted almost the entirety of the known galaxy. I could see the Terminus decree being something of the kind of destruction to where basically there's no surviving it, it would be like setting off an atomic bomb but on a galactic scale, anything that didn't die immeidately would be twisted out of shape and destroyed by pure warp pollution.
Hard to believe humanity has a weapon of that scale, the necrons having it?, I can imagine it after all they had galaxy rendering technologies that they destroyed and the celestial orery was deemed safe compared to the others in the height of the WiH agaisnt the C'tan, weapons that literally broke causality and Szarek decided to erase from the memories of everyone in fear of what they would be used for
@@Aureonw Thing is getting a weapon of that level is easy, the question is whether to use it. in our world we have enough nuclear bombs to destroy our entire planet several times over, and we make mor eevery day. The issue is that the moment you do that the world is done, there's no going back. Even the Necrons backed up after all the stuff that happened from the war in heaven. Lets not forget golden age humans made ships that could devour ENTIRE SUNS. From that perspective having a weapon that could destroy probably much of the galaxy seems not that odd to me especially when you consider the fact that the Emperor has knowledge of the golden age
I would disagree, it would be extremely pointless, even by imperium standards. "If we can't rule the galaxy, nobody can" thinking fits someone from chaos, but the emperor just wouldn't care. If humanity is screwed anyway, who cares if the necrons, eldar, or whoever will rise up as a domintant faction? So no, I think it would be more likely a last resort tool, that can potentially save humanity from almost any threat, but is incredibly risky, and/or comes at a great cost.
This sounds the most likely to me.
Kind of like the Halo rings, something that would obliterate all of humanity and take out most, if not all, the galaxy with it.
Side note: Most countries have similar last stand style concept in real life.
The deep warp would be a great place for like an even more cosmic horror themed faction to emerge from containging enteties even the four brothers know to fear.
Halo/ghoul stars could be a point where those entities start from where reality and the deep dark link sometimes permitting utterly alien beings to invade the material realm
Malice would be perfect for this.
Can you even call Slaanesh a brother?
@@warlordgorgutzz I've heard he can take on female and male and hermaphrodite forms all at once. He also has names such as she who thirsts and often people refer to it as her in their lore videos so I think with slaanesh it's a matter of preference.
@@warlordgorgutzz
Slaanesh swings both ways and has both genders xD
0:02 - fish
It would be great to have a deep sea exploration submarine type novel of the deep warp. Even if it doesn't answer much, 40k plus submarine bottle plots and tropes would be really fun I think.
I do love the deep warp theory. It just opens it up even further for unknown horrors.
I like to think thats were Russ ran off looking for the Tree of Life - where Valdor originally went before becoming the King in Yellow - and where Corax was transformed into the ‘greater imperial Daemon’ he is today - it would fit so well! (Plus it can be where the Watchers in the Dark dip into to travel instantaneously and why even warp creatures fear them… ‘they walk through The Deep without fear - no thanks’)
@@alexanderklimek9354Didn't Leman go after Magnus? Did he get lost chasing his tail in the warp?
If the Warp that we know is merely the shallows, which itself is we are certain is the collective of all life in the galaxy. Then would that mean the Deeper Warp, would draw power from a far larger swathe of life; maybe that of multiple galaxies. What if the Warp is not contained within our galaxy only, but its connections to other galaxies is hidden under the Deep Warp like two lakes connected by an underground cave. With the absolute deepest layer of the Warp, connecting the entire universe.
If the 4 Chaos Gods we know are the apex predators of this shallow, the Tyranid Hive god could be a predator of this Deep Warp. Hence its influence over multiple galaxies and its power that far surpasses our Chaos Gods here in the Milky Way. Like an Orca is to a reef shark.
pretty interesting, I just dont think chaos and the warp are the samething.
I actually love this idea
That makes sense. The Deep Warp could be interstellar space, with other pockets of Warp for other galaxies.
Warp connects multiple universes. I source from warhammer fantasy and Uriel Ventris books from early 2000s
@@emberframe6994they literally are though, there’s never been a question about that in the lore. The chaos gods are warp manifestations of the emotions and souls of the material world. Go watch some basic warp/chaos lore videos.
One of the better 40k lore videos I've encountered in a while. Just the right amount of cosmic horror and spooky mystery.
I’ve often wondered why the emperor wouldn’t want to let himself die and this explains it very well
the terminus decret being something that would destroy the known galaxy to purge the warp of all its demon, sacrificing the imperium to save the souls that would overwise be claimed by the warp could be a cool thing.
I guess if the terminus decree gets activated, so will the Eldari Rhana Dandra. End times indeed.
The problem with the idea of the Terminus Decree being basically a Warp Reset button is that for it to work you’d need to wipe out all Psychic life in the Galaxy to prevent feeding energy to the Warp Daemons/Gods. If no life exists thats smart enough to feed the Warp all the daemons and Gods would probably fade to nothing in time. Some would probably accept their demise like those faithful to the Emperor but some would fight tooth and nail to resist like the Drukari or the Orks.
Sounds like the plot of Halo
I think that the Terminus Decree is an ancient music box popping up a Rick Astley figurine dancing to the melody of 'never gonna give you up'
The ultimate rickroll
*all Xenos and chaos daemons explode from being rickrolled*
I'd like to think the Rangda came from the Deep Warp; and that's why they were so utterly indescribable, horrific and nearly invincible.
It's a cool thought!
Yes, I like that. Bring back more of Rangda xenos.
I like to think that the terminus decree is a self destruct device that will destroy the entire empirium in a magnificent blaze. Reminds me of the famous verse "do not go gentle into that goodnight. Rage, rage against the dying of the light"
The Terminus Decree is most likely a bio-weapon. Created by Basilion Fo, it is a viral weapon, capable of exterminating all Astartes in the galaxy, loyal or traitor. It was one of the contingencies organised by the Sigillite. One of those, I think, is dabbed "Terminus". The Emperor calls the weapon "Terminus sanction".
Man you could write entire sagas about that library alone. What an awesome concept. Also the Terminus Decree is a Jack-in-the-Box by Tzeentch.
40K mysteries and cosmic horrors are my absolute favorite Warhammer topic
I like to think the Terminus Decree is one of two things that are not even mutually exclusive. Either its a massive hail Mary style final gambit Malcador put in place to gamble the survival of humanity with in its darkest hour when its all or nothing time and we just gotta go all in on our options even if they might backfire and kill us too, or a giant table flip designed to take whoever pushed us to the brink down with us if not take everything with us.
Personally I like the idea that the Terminus Decree will shut down the Golden Throne.
It suits the "this might save the Imperium, or it might end it" vibe that the Terminus Decree has.
Shutting down the Golden Throne destroys the Astronomicon, and probably the Sol System with it, casting the Imperium into chaos.
But it also allows the Emperor to be reborn, if you go with that theory, and to not have his power sapped by the Golden Throne.
Hence they haven't used it yet because right now having the Emperor back isn't worth the price. But in a hypothetical doomsday scenario where Terra is doomed anyway? At that point it'd make perfect sense and the Reborn Emperor would thus be the best hope to seize apollo's chariot and drive the Imperium's sun back across the sky.
The 50k fanfic has some deep warp elements - a Black Ship was stuck in the warp, so decided to go deeper. It was very well written.
Lorgar abandons the Chaos gods and becomes a disciple of the deep warp in WH50k.
@@headlibrarian1996Lorgar the gold digger realise there's a much bigger and more powerful god out there and immediately jump ship
Explain about 50k
@@cosmictreason2242 someone wrote fanfiction about 50K. It was great. Then someone wrote fanfiction about 60K. It was less great, but still worth losing a half day of work reading the wiki.
@@zaer-ezartlorgar was fooled by a cosmic Lamborghini and like the gold digger he is immediately jumped in.
I thought the Warp was a realm ruled by the chaos gods now i find out there is a section in the warp that they cant even gods avoid
I didnt know either, I knew there were entities of the warp that aren't aligned with any of the chaos gods. But I didn't think there were several layers beneath the shallow warp.
The deep warp must exist, and yes i am a fan of lovecraftian horror. Predators of the predators in the warp is something wh40 needs the most.
The Predators of the Warp are already prey to the Tyranid Hivemind, as is Big E. The Hivemind is described as being more massive than Slaanesh by an Eldar, spanning multiple dimensions and, on top of that, Nids have defeated Chaos Undevided before. I think this is because, ultimately, the Chaos Gods are too human.
As products of emotion, no matter how twisted, they are tied to mortals. The Hivemind has repeatedly proven itself to be beyond human compression, and therefore, beyond the power of the Chaos Gods.
I've been looking for this comment! Necronomicon Ancients should be in Deep Warp!
The terminus decree is instructions to flood the warp with massive amounts of Zima. Something that would repel even the dark gods.
Like the drink?
That's Disney evil! 🤣
You remain, to my mind, the best Warhammer youtuber. Continue to appreciate your upbeat vibe when discussing the grim dark that is so often wonderfully grim and beautifully dark.
Good God, I want more of that Land lore. I really want to see what would happen if a Primarch or Perpetual went hunting in that library.
The Terminus Decree is the activation sequence for turning the Golden Throne into the largest bomb to ever exist, which would destroy the entire Terran system (and probably even more).
Average Necron weapon (its purely for reconnaissance)
Or maybe turning the golden throne into a dreadnought
supernova pipe bomb
It's more likely the Terminus virus, which when unleashed, will kill all the Astartes and Primarchs in the galaxy, loyalist and traitor.
I think not, because Necron already have THE BOMB, it would be too lame to have another THE BOMB as a last resort while it just a mapping tool for other race
Another good description of the endless depths of the 40k universe, deepest oceans of the warp are unheard of, or are their realities so alien that so called 'informed madness' is used to navigate its full potential. May be the this great sea is all, and the comprehendible reality of existence out side the warp is just a fleeting foam from tiny island breaking waves.
Assuming the metaphor doesn't break down here, what about how reality itself is supported? How does it stay above the waves? Is it like something that naturally floats to the top for some reason, or does something firm hold it up that the warp itself seems largely unable to undermine?
The surface and deep Warp are described in Eye of Terror as well, a lot of very good descriptions of warp travel in that book.
The greatest mystery is something hinted at in the old lore, the Beast, the Unnameable One, the vast singular God of Chaos of which The four great gods are nothing more than facets. All those who dare plunge too deep into study of it are carried off by daemons.
Can you give source? I am interested
@@billyherrington5112 the original Realm of Chaos book, Slaves to Darkness, page 15 on the Chaos pantheon:
"Some claim that Chaos has spawn an infinite number of Gods who constantly struggle amongst themselves for mastery over all. Others say that all the apparently diverse gods of Chaos are nothing more than different aspects and manifestations of one being: The Great unnameable one, He Who Must Not Be Named, The Great Abomination, The Lord of Chaos, The Unspeakeable Shapeless Beast and numberless other titles.
The mortal sages and mystics who dare to theorise and debate upon the nature of the Beast only succeed in attracting the unwholesome attention of the creatures of Chaos. Many wise men have been carried, alive and screaming, to the charnel houses of the Chaos Hells, there to writhe in endless debate with the flames and the Daemons of torment."
@@temmy9for someone who is unnameble that guy sure has alot of names
@@temmy9his real name is John Chaos
That Malcador left the Terminus Decree to his Grey Knights is a hint at its contents by itself. It's Warp-related, specifically requires Psykers to implement, possibly ones with a genetic connection to the Emperor, and even knowledge of it cannot be trusted to the Custodes. Only reason for the last one, I feel, is that it must concern The Emperor and acting against him in some way that the Custodes would never allow.
These videos where you tell a specific short horror story from 40k or make a list of 5 of the scariest creatures in 40k are my favorite of yours, Wes. Horror in Warhammer is so good when done right.
I love these stories so much. Endless amounts of some one’s creativity and a unique universe and it makes staying awake during a long drive easy cause I’m enthralled with this universe
I love that there always seems to be more and more unimaginable horrors in this universe! Having that sense of dread of beings even more ancient and malevolent than the chaos gods is very intriguing
One of your best videos yet, the deep warp theory really enforces the cosmic horrors in 40K better than the chaos gods, as it applicable to daemonic entities of Chaos to even entities which operates beyond mundane level, not just to humans, even the quote of even Emperor can't even explore the deep warp also interesting as whatever happens there could be potential ploy to shake up the settings entirely, that is if it's even possible for GW to make models out it
Or if GW would breaks conventions dares to thread beyond Tabletop conventions starting from their Black Library books after "The End and The Death" series concluded to wrapped up loose ends and even gives more glimpses of pre-Old Night eras, whatever happening during 10.000 years prior to 40th Millennium and what's to come in 40th Millennium's future, unfortunately it would need the writers to be more organised and have way more unified agreement on important lore bits to not creates more plot holes, and expands the Cosmology of The Warp and beyond, even whatever in the deep core of Ghoul Stars and Halo Stars regions is something which would make even chaos gods akin to Tzeentch gone mad and loose more parts of his essential substances
I always thought the terminus decree was basically instructions on how to turn the golden throne into a psychic bomb, taking all the emperor's power and making a feedback loop, not unlike a nuclear reactor going critical, erasing all life in the galaxy and the warp.
First of all: Great work as always! I really enjoy these lore videos you do.
here's a extra headcannon theory from me.
My headcannon is that the deepwarp is inhabited by primordial Warp Gods like Death, Life, order, Chaos itself. Beings which makes the Chaos Gods look like insects. They don't interfere because they find it beneath themselves to do so, and/or are in a hibernation like slumber. And the Chaos gods, don't do more because of a fear that doing too much might wake up one such primordial.
I also like to think that the deep warp realm and those extremely powerful gods aren´t just limited to the Milky Way galaxy, but they are the whole universe representation, basically
Like, actual gods that were involved in the creation of things, and/or actual embodiments of concepts. Whereas the chaos gods, are literally just the biggest demons, and pretend to embody concepts, but really just embody how we *feel* about those concepts, and don't exist if we don't feel things.
So, I know that this is meant to be all serious, Grimdark and Lovecraftian, but having read that, I'm not picturing a group consisting of representations of Chaos, Time, Space, Nature and Civilization who are currently bumming around pretending to be seiso idols.
Interesting. Kind of a mirror of the vampire lords in the world of darkness. Ultra powerful beings worshipping their progenitors, who they are scared shitless will awaken and devour the world.
My favourite theory that the tyranids are deep warp beings
Can you imagine if the terminus decree was turning the emperor and the throne into a warp bomb that spreads out the psychic emanations of the emperor throughout the warp and destabilizing it. Probably destroy Terra and the milky way but it's definitely one hell of a way to go out
Hahaha, I like that idea. 😂
Madmen having all the answers is a pretty common trope in grimdark. So my money’s on the Umbra being fragments of powerful dead being slain by Slaanesh.
In my opinion, the Terminus Decree is a "W.M.A.D.", possibly something akin to the "Stellar Orrery", that rends the fabric of reality itself. This would explain the "only open at the end" instructions, as if humanity is already doomed and dying, whats more human than taking the enemy out along with us? Whats more human than refusing to go silently into that night?
Idk, it just makes the most sense to me 😂
Ghoul Stars / Halo Stars could fit nicely as region where deep warp sometimes seeps through spitting out all sorts of terrible. Would be nice to have a possibility of that there are beings far above the chaos gods (would be nice to see them humbled for a change), who could flip the universe on a whim just couldnt care less (maybe one that thinks tyranids are the best for shrimp cocktails and is harvestng them en masse ~fleeing tyranid theory speculation~ also a way out of *ultra OP tyranids*)
it would be very cool if the Deep warp existed, simply because it adds that layer of horror that 40k should have and it being a place that even the dark gods are afraid of is really interesting.
Any thing that delves into the Eldritch makes me fascinated and I love that Warhammer has the creepy, unknown disturbing Eldritch side to it.
One possibility of what the terminus decree could be is that It's emperors true name. As in the lore it says that whoever speaks it is granted the power of the emperor himself.
Imperium: thrillons of people on different planets
Emperor true name: ajdazgadtyiij
Some kid: makes random online game name
Other player quotes his name on voice chat
Gets granted emperor powers
James Workshop
October is my favourite month for lore because of Weshammers annual horror themed episodes. I’m a big Halloween guy so this is extra fun for me lol.
Your spooky vids are my favorite ones. Love me some grimdark horror beyond human imagination haha
I have never played a Warhammer game but listening to Weshammer talk about the lore is always enjoyable.
I became fascinated with the 40k lore about a year ago and wish I had more time to read some of the books. These videos give me what I need.
i love the idea of the deep warp and how the main 4 and most daemons are the surface and conscious thoughts we have
Imagine if terra is under siege from tyranids and they use the terminus decree, only for it to wipe out the space marines that still remain fighting off the hoards. Just one massive shooting themselves in the foot moment.
Pretty sure it was designed for chaos specifically.
The one guy who knows it seems to be the only one with the jurisdiction to use it, I'd think the odds of failing to appropriately diagnose the situation are pretty low if they also know what it will do.
But that's just if they actually do like I think. Maybe I'm wrong.
I love the cosmic horror, 40k needs more of it as over time too much has been explained.
The Deep Warp is 100% a thing. I mean, it's probably not going to be called "the deep warp", but the warp is largely unexplored, so there should be more to it.
Non Chaos-aligned Warp entities is my favorite 40k topic
Your spooky vids are always amazing Wes
Youve definitely taken over the 40k horror scene on the internet sincr i hwvent seen anyone do it the way you do
The Terminus Decree is probably something extreme and weird, with benefits but a massive trade-off. Perhaps instead of shutting down the Golden Throne, it overloads it, and the resulting psionic explosion converts all of humanity into pure warp entity, perhaps a single deity
The deep warp keep bringing the thought of the jar of dirt&sand. Like you have a big jar of different degrees of dirt from gravel, dirt, sand, rocks, etc. Where if you shake it enough, the bigger grain floats to the top and the smaller grain sinks to the bottom. That shaking of the dirt and sand is just the great game to the chaos gods.
INCREDIBLE!!! You just give me a total new perspective on the warp i've never thought before.
Your work is awesome! Please continue.
Who wants Weshammer to do a collab with LoreCrimes?
Can Wes do a review /homage video to Bruva Alfabusa please?
14:36 "Libary." 🫥
“Not much scares me, but that that thing, that thing, scares me”
Khorne probably when taking a look in to the deep warp……probably
I love the battles and war and all but it’s this kinda stuff that drags me back into the setting. Questions on questions on questions and theories abound!
Thank you for this WONDERFUL video! We need a video on the mysterious mother of the Primarchs Urda and where she currently is in the current universe.
I think she permanently died in the Horus Heresy when she got stabbed by a special chaos blade
You know that shit really really hits the fan, when even the chaos gods fear something. 😂
My personal headcanon about the Terminus Decree is that it contains the true names of the Chaos gods and instructions for a ritual that once you utter the names, the four explode in a cataclysm that destroys all chaos which also has the effect of killing all sentient life in the materium. Basically a reset button for both the warp and the real space
I think of a deep warp as an ocean of decomposed psychic energy toxic enough to be unhabitable by any creatures,akin of how dead biomass is compressed into oil and coal under the tectonic plates.Tyranids though..they might be able to dive here in the far future.
Regarding the Library,i guess it's a Void Dragons' shenanigans.
I'm always learning new things about the 40k universe, great video!
The end is at hand. The Terminus Decree is opened.
Inside the box is a handgun
I've been writing my own 40k iceberg chart and the very bottom has the Deep Warp.
ngl the deep warp is a concept that i hope is further explored... it makes sense since the warp is a reflection of living creatures collectives consciousness that there is something that reflects people's collective un-consciousness and things live there that are beyond understanding
I always thought that warp is uncounciousness manifested
I always enjoy when distinctly Lovecraftian goodies show up in fiction
I love to think the terminus decree is just a letter to guilliman from the emperor, who forsore this moment and it just says "my son......kill me now" thus releasing his full potential to the warp.
And that the emperor planned on all human life being killed and that somewhere he has a hidden human breeding facility that will activate and humanity will start from level one with the emperor as their true god and all existing 40k characters will cease to exist
Another mystery:
What happens to the first Megir of the Death Specters?
What is the Throne of Glass (Shariax)?
What was in the vision granted to Merrin Corcaedus by the Emperor?
I think one of those deep warp entities looks like a Terran child, a very young girl that entered and left Slaanesh Palace unharmed and disappeared without a trace.
Wasn't it the Tzeench's maze that the child passed through with a dog in her arms through?
@@Aureonw To be honest I only heard something about this once, it was about only two people who survived entering the palace of Slaanesh, one of them was a little girl.
It might have been the same child, not sure. (I'm a warhammer40K noob, just like the setting. Absolutely do NOT want to live in it though!) 😊
@@hans-joachimtenhoope1744 If you find yourself in it and are not in a high born situation (Planetary lord heir or one or some other high class job) and you are enlisted to being part of the world manpower tithe for the astra militarum hope you are fighting Tau and defect to them preferably choose the farsight enclave if possible use your noob knowledge that is still miles ahead more advanced than anyone else in the verse bar the gods and perpetuals/necrons to arm the Tau enough to defend you from the subsequent witchhunts that WILL happen due to future seers noticing everything changed because some random person simply started existing while you taste a advanced society's tech, hell maybe even find a person to stay with and have fun.
@@hans-joachimtenhoope1744it'd be hilarious if it is the same kid. Just imagine this child going through the realms of each respective chaos god and just left unharmed leaving them confused asf.
Again, a really awsome and informative video!
Love your content so much and always brightens my day when I see the notification.😊
It wouldnt suprise me that their probably quite a few unique warp species and the followers of the big 4 probably keep em down to a minimum where they can.
In whale fall even the skeleon is consumed until nothing is left...
Seeing the warp sounds like (and it's occasionally called) the ethereal plane, the "deep warp" seems to be other people assuming GW is using some of the same cosmetology as other fantasy settings
Love the deep warp theory.
It's fitting, believable and utterly horrifying 👍
The Terminus Decree is a set of instructions written on a piece of paper in a wooden box kept in Malcador's tomb. It's not a device. It's a set of instructions that have a chance to either save the Imperium or doom it according to the description.
the monkeys with tails reasoning is actually pretty clever
I mean not even 30 years we thought velociraptos were huge and didnt have feathers.
The umbra could be deep warp entities that pop up occasionally like deep sea creatures and spook the shit out of people
They could also be a 5th or 6th chaos god’s creations/daemons (6th if malal/malice is real)
I recommend you to read something about Dark King
I would actually counter that the deep warp is just a theory. As you read in the Path of Heaven. They travel along a path, if I remember correctly, beneath the warp to reach terra. Which implies there most certainly is layers and depths to warp. If a deep warp actually exist, we really don't know. But there is relevant concrete lore to support this.
PS! I do wish you could include spoiler warnings for the latest books in the Siege of Terra series 😩
3:40 You know the shit has hit the fan when a COMMISSAR orders a retreat.