The Problem with Solar Energy in Africa
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- čas přidán 22. 10. 2021
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References
[1] globalsolaratlas.info/map?c=4...
[2] ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statist...
[3] www.statista.com/statistics/2...
[4] energypost.eu/10000-sq-km-of-...
[5] www.pv-magazine.com/2019/02/2...
[6] climatepolicyinitiative.org/wp...
[7] www.eia.gov/analysis/studies/...
[8] www.brown.edu/Departments/Eng...
[9] iea-etsap.org/E-TechDS/PDF/E1...
[10]
www.researchgate.net/publicat...
[11] www.reutersevents.com/renewab...
[12] techstartups.com/2020/11/19/w...
[13] www.reviewjournal.com/opinion...
[14] www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...
[15] www.ise.fraunhofer.de/content...
[16] www.afdb.org/fileadmin/upload...
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150 million * 592 is a bit more than 8.9 billion $
God damn it I missed a zero. Ofcourse I would fuck up the easy calculation, because it's the only one I didn't triple check.
Lol
Yeah! It's horrible. Especially when you do that at an exam
@@RealEngineering happens to everybody. atleast somebody caught it.
@@RealEngineering I do that kind of shit all the time. It's a rite of passage for us engineers 😅
I’m in Australia and there’s a big factor that you’ve missed. Ironically, panels don’t work as well in extreme heat. Sun light = good, extreme heat = bad.
Nothing that more panels won't fix
@@DraRed73 Technically not wrong
Just put them in the shade ... duh
True.
They perform best in cold weather with a lot of sunlight.
Mirror-based solar energy makes more sense in desert/orbit (that doesn't mean solar towers only).
If only there was a magic rock, that when you put it closer to other magic rocks, it got really hot, and stayed that way for a long time.
Yeah, it's called uranium oxide.
That's hilarious u may be onto something 🤣
@@seths_ma6766 if we say the first rock is a man and the other rock is a beautiful woman i think you will get the heat you need , just saying
The only problem is what we do with the magic rocks
the responses to this comment are the dryest, most boring thing i've seen today. funny joke
This panel can put out close to 100 watts czcams.com/users/postUgkxOqI2yqX0XVrhR2BMJciTWrHJpG8FhJyg when positioned in the appropriate southernly direction, tilted to the optimal angle for your latitude/date, and connected to a higher capacity device than a 500. The built in kickstand angle is a fixed at 50 degrees. Up to 20% more power can be output by selecting the actual date and latitude optimal angle.The 500 will only input 3.5A maximum at 18 volts for 63 watts. Some of the excess power from the panel can be fed into a USB battery bank, charged directly from the panel while also charging a 500. This will allow you to harvest as much as 63 + 15 = 78 watts.If this panel is used to charge a larger device, such as the power station, then its full output potential can be realized.
In China they use solar panels in the desert along with planting small plants under the solar panel to fight against desertification. One woman who won the noble peace prize over a decade ago was a Chinese woman living in the desert with her husband. She and many others have found methods to plant in the desert. I'm hoping that with the amount of incredibly skilled and talented innovative brains in this world, can come up with a solution for a greener planet. We may not see them but they exist and are working very hard for a better future.
There was only won nobel peace price ever awarded to a Chinese, that was Liu Xiaobo. He was a dissident scholar and received his Nobel Peace price for human rights work in China - he didn't work on desertification.
Well said, but who buys that stuff in the bad quality? I might as well throw the money out of the window
@@bonito34worst case can be used by farmers for animals? Use the food for homeless shelters etc.
@@Asif24960 and what? Btw 1 ruble= 0,0099 €. Think before y act. Erdogan is not so daft!
@@bonito34 don’t think you quite get it. Clearly you don’t work in finance.
10:33 That is the happiest looking meter I have ever seen.
Damn ! you got an eye for detail .
@Kitan Mani SILENCE BOT
Is it just me or does USA power outlets look like surprised Pikachu face? 😅
I thought exactly the same. He has one job and he absolutely loves it.
LMAOO
10:27 - that is the happiest instrument I ever seen!
I had 5 years ago some Business with a startet from germany.. they convert shipping Containers into solar farms.. you just put them where is space, you unfold the system and connect the village or whatever usage you have.. they cost around 150 000 Euro per piece only.. but its a local solution..
Man I wonder how you get into business doing that. Sounds like a great gig
I was involved with solar in the UAE and sand was a major problem because the panels become ever so slightly damp with condensation in the morning and coated with a fine layer that had to be washed off. I seem to remember the efficiency dropped by up to 80%. It's the same problem with cars left out overnight. We were even looking at automated rinsing systems. It was a decade ago and I don't know if they solved the problem.
A retractable cover that auto closes at night and opens when it's sunny and dry? And the retractable mechanism has a soft wiper blade? I'm guessing smarter people have thought of this and found it unworkable.
8:40 how is the water heated to 500 degrees Celsius, I thought the highest temp water could get to was 100 degrees Celsius.
The main impediment to going green is conservative-capitalism.
Not saying I don't love that all of you here are thinking about efficiency. Ridding ourselves of the chains of unfettered-capitalism is just another way we can be far more efficient with literally *all* of our planets resources.
@@aylbdrmadison1051 Because people dont feel pressured to study/work more than they need to if they dont get extra benefit of that.
How about mounting the panels on axles that turn them upside down at night? Dew mostly collects on upward-facing surfaces.
The panels wouldn't be turned right side up until the temperature exceeded the dewpoint by an experimentally determined delta.
Beyond the technical and scientific issues, there's also the problem of energy dependence. Giving another country control over your power is insane.
And this is exactly why it won't work. Politics distroys everything.
@@canaryliina So what is your replacement for "politics" ?
@Yamile Magubeni It doesn't matter if they're developed or not. It's a massive security threat to have another country running your power regardless of who they are.
This is already true: Russia and Middle East dependence
@@definitelynotadam That isn't nuanced enough. Every time you add a supplier you've reduced your risk.
Also I'd be careful calling deserts barren, yes even the Sahara. Deserts are huge carbon sinks in ways that arent fully understood by scientists. Its not just the underwater basins but also these huge crusts of bacteria that grow on the surface of deserts. Building huge projects like this destories those crusts. Theyre extremely understudied and theres definitely ways they interact with desert ecosystems that we just do not understand at all yet. I know the discovery of these systems is recent, but the way everyone describes deserts as barren is really troubling. Theres still an ecosystem there and ignoring that to treat it as empty land could lead to huge losses we dont fully understand the consequences of.
who paid you?
Ok this was new and i agree with you. Medelling too much with forests and water etc without knowing about them properly got us in the issue of global warming in the first place. Better be careful this time around.
They can use the power for desalination plus reforestation. Plus you can put solar panels a bit higher and do some farming underneath and help for dessert animal and plants to get some shade. Multipurposing this idea can save the region and whole world eventually but you need small steps of course. Also reforestation and farming will help with extreme heats which can decrease lifetime of solar panels and increase need for cooling systems.
Did you watch the video?
@@jerbear7952 Yeah I watched the video. Europeans want to exploit Africa again and I proposed a plan that will help both parties. Although they still need to fix energy transmission problem but it is a good thing Eu cant take all of the energy local government can use the leftover chunk themselves instead.
That would eventually doom the Amazon ecosystem…
@@pohkeee We are talking about African dessert. Amazon is pretty far away.
@@exosproudmamabear558bravo mam bravo 👏
I live in Kenya and solar here is incredible since there is no true "winter", its only sunny and rainy season so there is not less sunlight or less sun hours around the year
Yeah, solar works in Africa ofcourse. This was primarily a criticism of this new age imperialist idea of "extracting" solar energy from Africa.
@@RealEngineering What do you say countries like Japan, South Korea replacing LNG with Hydrogen(electrolyser) importing from Africa. How costly would that be?
@@aachyut7558 Right now? Insanely expensive, the idea of importing hydrogen from that far away makes little sense when you can just make it locally. I could see countries along the Suez Canal creating a hydrogen/ammonia fuel project to refuel ships though.
Same here in South India
Hydrogen long-term storage is still pretty problematic too, isn't it?
How many Ewan McGregors do they generate per square kilometre?
Going by current world wide production 1 Ewan McGregor per 510.072 million sq km.
@@RealEngineering Haha. That's plenty enough for the whole world's needs.
Excellent video, once again. Thank you.
They don't produce Ewan McGregors, they produce UNLIMITED POWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
2.45 EMcG/Sqm
@@bastadimasta E=McG²
Of course, what you want is a combination of solar thermal, and photovoltaic.
Use the PV panels to focus the heat onto the central tower, while also generating electricity.
Generating hydrogen with modular, mass-producible setups might make more sense in these areas. When you have energy to spare, it's not so bad to waste it in the conversion.
I guess just pumping large amounts of water from Mediterranean would be a challenge there, hence why it also makes more sense to do that closer to the Mediterranean.
Agreed. Use hydrogen to power the pumps. Hydrogen can also power ships to deliver hydrogen around the globe.
Dear Real Engineering Team,
there has been some confusion with Desertec and other organisations. As a director of the Desertec Foundation I hope to start a productive discussion about the Pros and Cons of the concept. Some information presented is outdated (for example the water issue has been solved with newer plants).
I send you a mail with some further information.
If you are interested, I can try to organise a visit to a more sophisticated plant. Then you can see the solutions in real life!
Holy cats, there's actually a Timo Bracht on Desertec's website, this seems legit :)
Would love to see the new perspective in a future video!
Interesting! I would certainly like to see this.
wew, this would be interesting.
@@vinceb8041 His account was created today, totally not sus.
Good outreach, Desertec team!
"watt hours per day" is an ingenious way to unambiguously express the average output despite its varying over the day.
Wait until you hear about kilowatt hours per day per megawatt (of installed capacity). Not sure how prevalent it actually is in literature but i found it funny when i read it before learning about dimensional analysis
would be even better to express it in watt days per day
Would be far better to do by annum, like Giga/Mega/Kilowatt-year. Reason being is seasonal changes in productivity.
It's... a pretty standard type of unit. We use MW•hr/ Day pretty often in my reactor design course
@@leerman22I encounter 'kilowatt-hours per year' frequently in the residential market
Wow I was totally mistaken about AC versus DC in terms of long term transmission. I actually thought it was the exact opposite, that AC was preferable over long distances. I specifically remember learning that in school as a reason why the US uses AC, the distances are longer. I've been carrying around that possible misconception for like 25 years lol. I'm going to have to look into it now and see if maybe I just misunderstood what they said, if they were wrong outright, or if something has changed since then that rendered what they taught me obsolete
Exactly the same for me. I remember being shown a video about early electricity generation and AC and DC competing against each other, and AC winning due to less losses and longer range.
your right still ac is way for higher voltage to go a long distance thats why you have step down transformers,
He referred to longer distances in sea, in which high voltage DC is preferred as AC cables in sea would result in capacitive losses. Over land, high voltage AC is commonly used
Actually that was the case until the means for conversion of DC to AC advanced. Transformers have been around a long time and made AC easier.
@@marnixh.5119 good to know
Ive never seen such a smooth and effective transition to a sponsor.
Also, great video!
Thanks
We recently did a short school project on Nigeria and ~40% of their population is off their grid/doesn't get reliable electricity. Using local solar they can support their people without heavily investing in grid infrastructure. Solar is a win internally in Africa.
Wow school project about a neighbouring african country of yours, how woke!
Problem is corruption would raise costs beyond the every day user could afford
Tell that to Nigera, not us
Let me get this straight, solar isn't expensive to people off the grid? Scince when isn't solar expensive.
@@SerpentInside The comment had nothing to do with wokeism.. I think you should take a break from politics if you are starting to see ghosts. Too much politics is really bad for your mental health anyway.
“My Desert, my Arrakis, my Dune.”
Bless the Maker and his water.
Hail Shai Hulud
who will be the one...the lisan al gaeeb
Desert power
Bruh I literally just got started on my journey and then sardaukar flew into my town. Needless to say, they denied us the hajj.
Very well done. This explains why simple "one assumption fits all" thinking so prevalent in US energy policy falls short. Thank you.
There is also huge problem of politics. Not only these regions are volatile, but Europe just afted this video released learned the hard way how dangerous it is to be energy depended on other country.
Though I really like the idea of green energy production potential to be new natural resource which country can sell and turn into wealth
North west Africa is stable though?
Rip Scandinavia on that first globe
Scandinavia is a myth!! Has anyone actually been there or met a Scandinavian ? There paid actors just like Australia.
Rip Fennoscandia
I just wanna know how they put a globe on a flat screen #TriangleEarthConfirmed
And nothing of value was lost
Eyyyy aspec
The Xlinks Morocco-UK Power Project, as it's known, will cover an area of around 579 square miles (1,500 square kilometers) in Morocco and will be connected exclusively to the UK via 2,361 miles (3,800 km) of HVDC subsea cables. 27 Sep 2021.
Reasons why this project would fail mainly because of the country's background, maintenance, location, distance, geography aren't feasible especially for customers in Europe. They just don't feel safe unless that country is Japan and located next door not separated by sea.
@@jayjay53313 if you're talking about cost, the plant could easily be scaled and Moroco can maintain them and the costs associated because it's financed by the state.
@@d.h.2509 It's more of trust and safety measures. Western Europe never felt safe with nations that aren't from their factions and influence, more towards political & religion factors. Say in case of war, rising extremism, anything serious such as boycott or sabotage would cause disruption leaving Europe in power outage
@@jayjay53313 well, how often do you hear about terrorist attacks and political instability in Morocco?
@@d.h.2509 So far it is neutral but European mindset of generalizing for safety precaution is there. It's just they aren't going to depend on country that they are doubtful of.
Big oil companies would never agree to this, even if it were possible.
There is also one of these towers close to my hometown in South Africa that has been running since 2016 called the Khi Solar One Power Plant with another one being built soon within the same province.
I have watched the desert dwellers work with solar panels. Deserts equal dust and sand. We are not there yet. Small set ups that are easily cleaned and maintained by the direct user seem to be a good option.
don’t underestimate the grasshopper storms in Africa.
The Moroccan coast has winds coming from the Atlantic ocean cool and without much sand.
the heat of the desert causes resistance
arizona native speaking.
That's why we need African emigration to stop and for them to start an industrial revolution, so their citizens could each own a house, with 1.5x + solar panels that they actually need, incentivized by a rebate or pure profit motive....provided that the panels actually work
Would seem like, even if somehow an automated solution can’t be identified, it would be totally economically viable to have a few guys travel around the solar farm wiping off the panels periodically.
As a Moroccan, I really hope for success of local electric production, it would be a gamechanger for the industry.
For the world
As an Algerian I dont think so
@@sisouhzl5645 why wouldn’t it be? We’re about to become the first car manufacturer in Africa and we’re already number one in the aerospace manufacturing industry, all those industries require a lot of energy.
We’re currently net importer of energy, and that need to shift as the industrialization of Morocco is growing too fast for the current production capabilities
We don’t have petroleum ressources so we need to innovate so
@@sisouhzl5645 my homie do be kinda jealous
Morocco has improved the grid enormously, but the pv idea is not fully feasible, as parts of morocco are too hot and would need more water
It's worth taking into account that the Saharan desert has a relation with the rainforests in South America and covering vast amounts of seemingly "useless" sand might result in natural disasters on the other side of the ocean.
Could you explain the mechanics behind that (or give a source to do it for you)?
@@SporkyMcFly I do not remember where I read it back then, but this article by NASA covers the same subject: www.nasa.gov/content/goddard/nasa-satellite-reveals-how-much-saharan-dust-feeds-amazon-s-plants
@@SporkyMcFlyczcams.com/users/shortsBpdvtsZwly0?feature=share a super short and brief introduction to the idea
@SporkyMcFly Winds travel across the Atlantic from West Africa to South America. Much of the soil in the amazon and South America originate from Africa. This has been known for a while outside of America. Like how West African sailors traveled to South America hundreds of years before Europe because the wind currents make it super easy. I don't why stuff like this is left out of history classes.
@@mr.grenade9497 I do not see how solar panels could disrupt any of that, but it was an interesting read nonetheless.
Solar energy in germany also has its problems. The energy output is unstable. Sometimes more, sometimes nothing. We have no possibilities to store the energy and we need to pay other countrys around to take the energy if we are producing too much. And also buy energy from them if the production is too low.
No possibilities to store the energy? Why wouldn't you just add a loop to a chemical plant to implement a carbonate 'battery' (fuel cell really) and also manage to situate storage around housing in the form of e.g. flow batteries? Maybe more water management structures are being built also which could accommodate some aq. flow batteries?
There are a couple of points left out, such as temperature, cost of land and intermittency based on location. Temperature is an efficiency factor for PVs and installing them in a desert where temperature goes beyond 45 C is not a very feasible idea. Cost of land in Germany is multiples higher than cost of land in Morocco. Finally, in Germany PVs energy supply will be more intermittent than that of Morocco's.
Just put them in the shade and temperature problem is solved. Easy.
@@lkytmryan Lmao best comment ever
European countries exploited TRILLIONS of dollars out of Africa = It was natural order of the world.
European countries investing back a tiny percentage of that money back = It is TOO RISKY lets forget about it..
Then some ''geniuses'' wonder why exactly refugees and illegal immigrants trying to cross into Europe while it is because they think Europe is the reason why they are refugees and immigrants and they are absolutely right about that...
@@ggoddkkiller1342 Go touch some grass dude
Bravo. All valid points.
Nuclear power: "Look what they have to do to mimic a _fraction_ of my power."
@@abdellahsbaa3751 but muh chernobyl
@@seafoam6119 But that’s not likely too happen any more as safety has Increased tremendously
@@therandomradonium1629 don't worry, he's just meming.
The amount of people I know who just call me a fallout fanboy when I mention that nuclear power is the future of our power grid is absurd
@@TG-Th3-T3rribl3 shut up fallout fanboy
On the winter solstice, the solar power in Algeria is about 277.9 watts per square meter in Algeria. Adjusting for capacity-factor, on that day in Algeria, a square meter would net about 1.3 kwh in a day.
In a 1913 issue of Scientific American, there is a story of a solar power plant in Egypt.
The Moltex molten salt nuclear reactor runs continuously while heating the same type of heat storing salt used in solar boilers. The heat is used to fill peaks in demand while the reactor runs continuously. Costs are cheaper than coal and you don’t need all the cabling of solar (any type) to connect the panels.
Need tons of sodium salts
Sure but the estimated cost is around 1.5 billion per gigawatt/h which is more then the cost of the solar panels and undersea cables talked about here. The truth is at this point almost every method of producing energy is cheaper then coal so a comparison to it is kind of redundant.
@@Ar-ye1cr which is incredibly cheap
Also molten salt if I'm not mistaken is highly corrosive and add radioactive to maintenance issues make this a dead dream. That is one of the reasons why the American trial plant was considered not feasible, again if I'm not mistaken.
GTFO with that nuclear BS.
Local infrastructure should always be used locally first.
Much more energy efficiency
This is a worldwide problem. Canada went on a crusade against its own tar sands which resulted in actually importing oil from countries who do things in a far less environmentally responsible way. It's beyond belief.
@@jasondashney California was shipping ethanol made from corn to Brazil and importing ethanol made from sugarcane because it takes less energy to make it from sugarcane.
I guess this is the argument you would get from people on the far right who do admit climate change is an issue that needs to be addressed. "Own solar panels first!" 😂😂
@@jasondashney sounds like California, they buy alot of power from other states so other states try to reduce their power consumption so they can sell it for more to California even though alot is lost to transmission
Right but you understand the issue with that line of thinking right? Noor III in the middle of fucknowhere uninhabitable desert is just fine. It would literally NEVER make economic sense dead centre of London.
Enjoyed the narrative and video. But wouldn’t the total costs also need to include disposal, or recycling costs of the solar and wind equipment after it meets its economic life?
We have recently learned how an autocrat thinks he can start a war and get away with it because his country are a key supplier of global energy. We would need significant storage and back-up plans to ensure similar autocrats could never contemplate doing such a thing.
The only way to stop wars is for every country to become self sufficient for energy, food, healthcare, construction, defense, etc. This is directly opposite of European Union policy of the last 4 decades, indeed the whole of the world has been engaged in building mutual dependence, under the misguided idea that people will act as a global community.
People in the liberal-globalist (Centre of the political spectrum, mostly capitalist with socialist trimmings) part of politics are very keen on this idea.
And then Putin, Xi, Trump and other psychopaths rise to the top of their respective governments and shit on the whole world.
A robust system MUST be able to stand against psychos and scumbags of every kind.
As the people of Europe have found out - buying your gas from a psychopath is not the best idea ever.
And i see of how those people can promote themselves as "We are Democracy" and can judge another people thing, rights and wrong with their only perspectives
More funny when they also forget that is their ancestors whos start doing the industrial revolution, cut all trees bu yelled at anothers development countries to stop deforestation while at the same time pretending to forget reforestation at their own land
@@syarifidayat yes, I agree with you.
@@dombaker1924 Here's the thing. You have two options:
1. Pay a lot for your energy and continue to think you are racially superior and can hypocritically lecture others.
2. Pay less for your energy and stop thinking you are racially superior and stop hypocritically lecturing others.
Decision, decision...lol
@@jp3630 you've lost me dude. The Russian government i criticised for committing these atrocities are the same race as me.
As someone who grew up in West Africa, it will come down government officials and how honest they are. Corruption even in the countries that are doing well (Ghana for example) is still present. Ask any Ghanaian about ECG (the Electricity Company of Ghana…also known as “Electricity Come and Go”).
Don't know which part you stay but electricity supply is constantly stable.
if we dont take it we dont deserve it back
@@vervetech9395 East Legon in Accra. Maybe the government/companies have changed their practices since 2005-2012ish, but for a long time, it was 24 hours of electricity, 24 hours off. We spent so much money on fuel for the generator. How can you export power to neighboring countries when sections of your own capital city goes without power?
Dumsor is real. As Ghanaians we need to stop looking at our corrupt government for solutions. The solutions will come from us the people not the politicians.
You will never get a grassroots solar energy buildup no matter what country or government system you use. Solar energy is prohibitively expensive and only exist because of government subsidies and a complete neglect in environmental standards when producing in China. A huge industrial base is needed to make all those panels and a huge investment that can only come from governments is needed to start the projects. Why should any government invest in Africa when the African governments have no safeguards to protect the project?
A very important factor to take into account when dealing with African countries is the level of corruption. Those of us who live in Africa know this fact all too well. Politicians line their pockets to such a degree that the country suffers. They don't take 10%, they take 90% and leave the country the rest.
For real, Nigerian here
Seems to be the case in all developing countries😢
Same in other countries. That is why in the US the top 0.1% own almost everything.
Guess you're not aware of the corruption in Western Governments or are you do think it's just "African countries" with corrupt as fuck governments?
Senator Joe Mansion in the US has taken MILLIONS from coal mining and is now blocking Green New Deal policies in the Build Back Better policy.
Boffwit Johnson, UK PM has funnelled £37BILLION to a private company, SERCO, under the leadership of Dido Harding, a Tory party member.
@@RichO1701e Bro you cannot compare compare corruption in developed countries with those in developing countries. I’m Indian, and the corruption here is so bad at all levels. You can avoid corruption in america if you want to; here it is a necessity to get anything done. Yet we don’t even get proper roads because of corruption. Also that developed countries have developed industries and an efficient and fair judicial system so corruption doesn’t hurt as much as it would in developing countries.
There is a CSP tower based plant being built in south africa as well, i have been there
It only has 100 MW power generating capacity though
The valve at 10:33 made my day : )
I work on solar sites in the northeast us where hundreds of acres of forest are cleared for photovoltaic solar arrays. It’s hard to see a solar array under construction and not think that the environmental cost is worse than the benefit.
That and in West Africa I think sandstorms will be a huge limitor in replace of clouds. Plus the heat variation from sweltering in the day, bad enough for solar panels as is, will be met with freezing cold nights after. Is it really going to last if you did put them there? That sort of temperature fluctuation, even over the course of an hour or two, ought to be detrimental to the electronic components.
Reson y humanity shoud go nuclear
@@UltimRoGuE Exactly! Nuclear is much cheaper in the long run, needs limited fuel input and uses a small amount of land to produce huge amounts of power!
The people running these operations are simply stupid
@@OnlyGrafting that is only a question of targeted research. might be that the western consumer solar panel is not optimized for this or that this is simply not in the market yet.. in large scale i could not imagine that this could be the crucial cause. As an engineer, one thinks like this actually. I the marketing department of course they must strive for the compensation of efforts.
So what about Chile's massive potential of energy production in the Atacama desert (photovoltaic) and Patagonia (eolic)? Maybe the low local demand of energy may be a benefit for exporting stacked energy in the shape of hydrogen from water desalination electrolysis plants, specially considering that every in Chile is close to the coast. It's just the perfect industry for my country
A quick search shows that Chile's natural energy reserves are massively underdeveloped. Along with the deserts where cloudy days simply don't exist, you have all that coast line along some of the world's stormiest seas, which is perfect for offshore windfarms. Also, it looks like you have a huge amount of geothermal energy that is untapped. Looking at it, with the right investment Chile certainly could become the main producer and exporter of renewable energy in South America, and practically almost eliminate its need for fossil fuels.
We have Infinite Potentiality, and that's what I'm focusing my energy on
A lot of the southern 2/3rds of the country also get a ton of rainfall. Seems like it would be fairly cheap for Chile to nearly achieve energy independence through hydroelectric alone with enough investment, especially with droughts being fairly rare.
One of the issues he didn't address is the problems with the falloff of the efficacy of photovoltaics outside of +/- 30 degrees latitude from the equator caused by the increasingly indirect nature of sunlight in those areas. Atacama may be too far south and in sunlight that is too indirect to be as cost-effective as it needs to be there. It may be OK as a supplemental source, though.
I need to look into what Germany is doing, as they should be having some issues with this. The USA will learn this the hard way over the next few decades too... I worry it will hurt the reputation of Solar overall, which is not a bad technology. It just has limited use and is not the panacea those looking to solve the Climate/Energy issues hope it to be.
Honestly, we need to get solar panels into space where they are unobstructed and transmit the power back to ground stations on Earth via microwave, but that's probably about another 50 years off.
@@phoenix042x7 Atacama desert is within tropical or subtropical latitudes. It's also a mostly high altitude desert so sunlight will be less attenuated by the atmosphere.
The video of the lightning storm @1:17 is AMAZING!!!!
Algorithms: a couple of my fellow employees were taking a class called "Analysis of Algorithms" . We worked together on some of the algorithms. Both analyzing and deriving using calculus and advanced math. It was quite fascinating.
*Nuclear talking to Fusion*: “look what they need to do to mimic a fraction of our power“
*laughs in mutant*
Laughs in fusion always being 30 years away before it's viable.
Solar is just fusion from 93 million miles away.
Fusion doesn't even exist, nuclear talking a lone
Nuclear is the way to go!
Generation tends to be the focus, while transmission and storage have enormous engineering challenges as well. But advances for both are coming, too.
And how many decades before it is cost effective AND makes enough of a difference to go through the trouble of upgrading?
@@scout360pyroz These are kind of open questions, and the geopolitical factors of doing this in the Sahara are probably insurmountable. But costs do keep coming down, and effectiveness of the collectors improves as well, so it's certainly conceivable both of those questions will have a workable answer soon. I hope anyway.
@@justaguy6100 It is not just the cost to build it. It is the cost to maintain and replace critical parts (right down to the cable used) if something breaks or is destroyed.
You also have to bring much if not all of those parts over very long distances (sea or land) from the outside. That means the area's power is completely dependent on outside forces to maintain itself. That is a dangerous position to be in as a nation or group of nations develops and grows and gets rich.
@@scout360pyroz And the same holds true for every means of production. I'm NOT saying putting a grid on the Sahara is a solution, more because of the geopolitical hurdles really, the biggest current factor in thermal plants is fuel costs with the exception of nuclear and those are expensive to build and maintain, too. Add to that the danger and expense of disposal of spent fuel and the other dangers they potentially pose, it becomes difficult to justify, although new technologies have promise to mitigate a lot of those factors.
Whatever the startup costs would be, the fact you're getting the electricity without fuel cost will mean there IS a payback for implementing it at some point. It's at least worth consideration and study, even if doing it in the Sahara doesn't become the ultimate solution. OR we can keep waiting and hoping for that fusion breakthrough that seems permanently 20 years away.
It's not going anywhere without refined propetroleum products.... Still gonna need petroleum with your little solar panel fantasy
When I learned about Desertec, the big idea for energy transport was hydrogen electrolysis next to the panels in Africa and transport via tanker ship to Europe. I had hoped to hear about that idea aswell as transport via cables.
The efficiency loss of pv electric energy converting into hydrogen and using it for electricity outweigh the sun benefit of the sahara.
Or in short: it’s then more efficient to build the PV arrays in germany.
Does someone know how much photovoltaik in marocco produces in the critical months december, january and february (in comparsion to summer)? In these months in germany, they unfortunately produce almost nothing.
This is all fascinating. On the surface if someone said to me "let's turn the Sahara into a giant solar plant" I would think it's a good idea. You bring up a lot of good points.
Which, if you know what you're talking about, are all nonsense.
The idea isn’t to literally use the Sahara to power the entire world, but just to show that using PV cells, you’d only need a small surface area compared to the earth to power the entire civilization. Most of these PV installations will be very local, mostly on top of roofs of houses and buildings, and the remaining can come from wind.
Really? My first thought with that idea is always: yeah, good luck stabilizing that geopolitical hellhole.
@@hebl47 I agree how many half wit goons would it take to strip all of that equipment only to cluck it off for a few hookah hits 🤨
Watch: The Connections (2021) [short documentary] 💖
My question regarding solar is how long do the panels last, especially given the wind-blown sandy environment, and when the panels require replacing, what happens to the waste? There is a hell of a lot of heavy metals in solar panels. Who pays for the clean-up, or is it left to the poor African countries to deal with?
i read from somewhere that solar efficiency loss is 0.5% to 1% per year. However, this is only apply for our normal solar. Large scale plants like this one would be using a much advance version of solar panels
Take a drink every time Real Engineering says "problematic" to understand :]
Well, normally, the efficiency has depleted considerably by 30 years. Sandstorms badly scratching the panels will probably cut that lifespan down a bit. More expensive panels could be a bit more scratch resistance, but there's a limit to how tough glass can be made and it still conduct light well enough to be useful
No normally panels are still producing 80% of original by year 50. And it’s a lot less waste than disposing of say…an entire power plant or 50 power plants.
@@marthatjarks6047 What are you on, and where can I buy it? That must be a hell of a drug if you think solar panels are still 80% functional after 50 years of use.
Heat can be used as energy storage by heating the melted salt to make the station operational at night
Two things that are critical in the delivery of reliable electricity is diversity and redundancy. A minimum requirement is N-1 redundancy which means you have to design a system to be capable of maintaining supply even if you lose any single element in that system. So in oversimplified terms this means you need to have roughy double of everything. So the huge quantities spoken of in this video amounts to roughly half of the real requirement. This requirement is not just for protection from equipment failures… you also have to be able to de energize and isolate system elements for repair and maintenance without requiring heinous long outages. So there’s that.
Also, it is risky to have all of your eggs in one basket… for obvious reasons. So if Europe were to depend on a single supply from a solar farm in Africa… Europe would not have sufficient diversity of supply sources to be able to survive a disruption… Europe would require a multitude of diverse sources in different locations to have security.
Look at the trouble Germany is presently experiencing from becoming dependent on Russian natural gas without first achieving a durable economic and strategic alliance with Russia… this is but one example of too many eggs in one basket.
So there’s that.
Also solar power is intermittent and can only supply during daytime and favourable weather… therefore it can only support daytime peak loads not base load. So there’s that.
People who fantasize about a world powered exclusively by direct solar are living in a utopian dream.
Ironically, fossil fuel based power generation is also solar power. The ultimate source of the potential energy stored in fossil fuels is from the sun. This stored solar energy is released as heat energy through combustion. So this idea that you cannot store solar energy is not true. Nature has been doing this for millennia.
As MechE student and Moroccan citizen, this video was soo informative!! Thank you!
It would be neat to somehow be able to combine water desalination AND power generation in those big towers.
Diablo Canyon already does this, and has been for decades.
Why bother. Separate facilities are more efficient. As long as you have cheap power from the one it is better to place a desalination plant where it is needed. It is easier to move electricity then salt water. Trying to make facilities to do both will just result in inefficient facilities to do either.
czcams.com/video/KdFIHecZDfc/video.html&ab_channel=TerraMater
@@logdog6762 Mind if i recommend you some
science-channel and general-education-youtuber?
Just because the learning shall never end and for no other reason?
@@nenmaster5218 .
Ive never thought about electrical grids as machines; I really appreciate that perspective.
I involved in programming for about 4 years ago for the reason that you specify, but to be honest I have hardware thinking more than software thinking, algorithm developmen is a specific area for specific people ^^
Nice to see a YT channel taking a broader, more realistic view of technological 'solutions' for a change.
one of my professors calls engineering: the law of returning misery
this channels shows why
European countries exploited TRILLIONS of dollars out of Africa = It was natural order of the world.
European countries investing back a tiny percentage of that money back = It is TOO RISKY lets forget about it..
Then some ''geniuses'' wonder why exactly refugees and illegal immigrants trying to cross into Europe while it is because they think Europe is the reason why they are refugees and immigrants and they are absolutely right about that...
The countries of Africa can still use solar for their own power needs. Sure, it may not be able to save Europe's power needs, but at least it means clean renewable energy in poorer countries that tend to have lax environmental regulations and use carbon-based energy.
You missed the part about Europe wanting thr power for themselves.
Africa definitely don’t wanna spend the extra to maintain and build the solar network for now
Most ‘renewable energy’ tech is trash today
Lax environmental regulations, but more naturally sustainable living. Countries with the biggest carbon footprint and waste in general are not in Africa.
Algeria is very best for energy
@@abzigwe3656 1st world countries caused all the damage and now want to put the blame and demand regulations on developing countries.
I can be wrong, but I think you should have similar production in Almería, Spain, and the infrastructura is already there.
no way you referenced burning man ahahah I love it
Greetings from Morocco!! I love your content!!
Been wanting to visit Morocco for a long time. I will get there once this pandemic has blown over more. Gorgeous country and lovely people
You're most welcome!!
@@RealEngineering You're very welcome
@@RealEngineering Would be great if you did the insane engineering of Al Boraq while you're at it (the cheapest hsr in the world I think).
@@chunchunmaru3644 It's a TGV train.
I see a really awesome game like Factorio or a mod that focuses on electricity generation and distribution in a more complex and realistic way. This is fascinating stuff. Enough so that I feel I chose the wrong career.
Wil you be applying for another degree next year then? Do it! It's almost always possible to make time.
just replace
Dyson Sphere Program
The joke is Factorio teaches you solar is pretty lame even if it's artificially easier in the game.
You need to cover half the map with solar, and a quarter with batteries - even though nights are shorter in Factorio. Meanwhile, nuclear power gets you there with 1/50th of your base..
@@IvanTre Nuclear requires fluid calculations, so if you go big with nuclear you're going to slow down your game a lot
just build a large mirrored dish to aim and reflect light at a solar powered dish. it's convenient because both will be as big in length as two sky scrapers.
We are actually doing a case study on the noor 3 facility in my first year engineering maths class! Very amused I came across this over breakfast.
Algorithms😂
I have nothing but respect for your honest critique of these over simplified _"easy clean energy"_ ideas.
He is still not telling us the truth its africa why can't they use that energy the same reason it's not safe to build there
Agreed. He's clearly concerned about global warming, but he's not afraid of it to the point of overriding his analytical attitude and clinging to every purported solution to it.
Interestingly, the math errors that I've seen commenters call him out on all happen to make the green energy idea in question seem _more_ plausible, not less. (e.g. by underestimating the cost of transmission by a factor of 10) I think this demonstrates just how well the rest of his analysis is put together--he's still convincingly making his case despite occasionally shooting himself in the foot.
@@jackjhonson5757 No genius, third world countries such as the North African ones don't have the technology/engineering and finance to build such plants. Have you considered that?
These "ideas" are still cleaner and more sustainable alternatives than fossil fuels-based energy. Just because there are challenges doesn't mean we shouldn't convert.
@@SHVRWK and why is that look at Vietnam and Malaysia its clearly not religioun
Rather than relying in transmission lines, why not use the electricity locally for something that is energy intensive (Mining and Refining, Magnesium via electrolysis, Methane via Sabatier Process, etc.) then transport the products.
Hydrogen production as well?
Because the local country may lack sufficient infrastructure, educated population, economic and political stability to support an industry that consumes such amount of electricity efficiently. Very few countries around the world can. Look around the world, very rarely do large electricity producers and consumers to be in close proximity of each other.
@@ericchen5744 "less educated"
More like room temperature IQ
@@constantinethecataphract5949 Wooo boy
@@lazergurka-smerlin6561 its true tho
I wonder how well just plopping some solar convection towers like they’ve got in nevada and such would work. Fewer reflectors would be needed due to the high heat of the area. I’m not sure what sorts of migratory birds would be affected by that though.
it's still steam powered, makes me chuckle 🙂 x
thankyou for sharing this..
it could be practical though to spread probably largely decentralized solar power systems (like for one household or one village) through desert and desert-adjacent inhabited areas to replace wood and charcoal for cooking, and also provide some electricity for electronic devices to aid in education etc.. I hear areas like the sahel have long had a problem with trees being cut down for firewood, when they are desperately needed to hold off desertification and graze goats and such. countering desertification locally by use of solar power probably wouldn't make a difference for the climate, but it would help to reduce the displacement of people in those areas, which is generally going to be a huge worldwide problem in the coming decades. it would also be nice in that it would empower poor people, whereas the plans to export african solar power to europe would as usual benefit corporations and corrupt officials. well, the solar power would probably also be routed to some nearby cities, but certainly not to villages in the middle of nowhere.
Not only that, but if they had some larger solar plants they could desal and pump the water for farming, de-desertification and generally for people to use
Watch: The Connections (2021) [short documentary] 💖
@@BenQuigley Good point.
With free energy running desalination plants, they could reclaim much more inhospitable land than a solar farm takes.
The plant was never to help Africa
@@azqqzed7893 So let's make that.
I think we learned that relying on energy from people who view us unfavorably did not work out the first time. And the distribution of the energy was much easier.
Do north africans view the west unfavorably ?
Russian moment
europeans have yet to learn this lesson. europe still thinks ravaging Africa will continue to work in their favor. watching this backfire like the "Russian incident" should be an entertaining spectacle to say the lease.
It's more a question of relying on energy from a single country. I doubt that Europe would have to make fewer concessions by importing energy from Australia or the US, compared to Qatar or Saudi-Arabia, or in this case Morocco or Algeria.
Few countries can thrive without relying on global trade. Self-reliance can be very costly, and interconnectivity makes wars less attractive. But relying on any one single player is a bad idea, no matter how favourably they view you at the moment.
@@poondaddy9992 yea isee this and think "dont africans need this power also? and its their country, funny how these anti immigrants dont want people in their countries whilst stealing the resources from the very same unwelcome people. leave africas power to the africans, who's making the profit from this? does it go to africans? doubt it.
This is a really interesting video, though I was expecting it to be about why solar energy isn't being used to provide clean and affordable energy for Africans. Of course, "the problem with using solar power in Africa to provide energy to Europe" isn't the catchiest title. I'm really glad you addressed the ethical concerns and the echoes of imperialism, problems which many fellow scientists and engineers tend to overlook.
As an African I would sell to europe and then use the money to built more to help lift my country as well. You go where the money is
The transition into the Brilliant sales pitch was too smooth
Solar’s main advantage is that it’s super easy to connect locally.
Locally produced, locally used.
It’s like having a water source in your backyard: it’s super easy to use that water, but it would be very difficult to transport it
A water well is a good analogy, a power well
@Sleeper 1
That’s a good analogy.
@Sleeper 1 😂 do you have any idea how big the batteries would have to be? Literally bigger than the cities they powered 👍🏻
@@fioredeutchmark If you look at systems for powering single homes, it is possible to extrapolate. For a large home, you might be looking at something the size of a small closet (think Powerwall).
Wells don't break down every 5 to 10 years and require routine maintenence
We should be careful about the operating cost of PV. I worked in the KSA for a year and although skies are clear, there's a lot of dust in the air and there's an issue with water needed to keep the panels clean so they can maintain their efficiency
The wind coming from the Atlantic ocean is pretty clear from dust.
@@karstenschuhmann8334 alot of dust and various minerals have been known to make it across the Atlantic from South America. (basically stuff from the Amazons) pretty incredible when I heard about it. I have not idea how much salt is in the air
@@darwinjina Sure, that is true. And in every region without rainfall, some cleaning of panels will be needed.
But it is a big difference if you need to clean once an hour or once a year.
@@karstenschuhmann8334 did it become that frequent in Africa? I guess that with lack of water was unsustainable. I found even with raining season I need to do some cleaning.
@@darwinjina I would guess it depends on where in Africa you are. You have all kinds of weather in Africa. But here we compared the center of a desert with the Moroccan coastline.
Thank you for touching on how these discussions keep focusing on how Africa can benefit Europe when Africa has been beaten, bled, and sold to do that very thing for centuries. In order for this to work it should be about how Africa can benefit Africa and build up security and peace within the continent and THEN begin to export and benefit other nations/the world. That way, the solar economy will be secure from the frequent conflicts and instability that plague Africa today as a lasting impact of colonization and imperialism that persists till now.
This concentrated solar plant looks exactly like one in Sahara movie (2007). But in the movie they used it to super heat and "vaporise" toxic waste, lol.
3:05 let's not forget about economy of scale and the fact that each interconnection could be scalled up. The UK has 6 GW connections to france, and a new 1.4 GW interconnection to Norway that measures 720km and required €1.4bln to build.
True that's what i was thinking about . Specially if you let them do the work . Cause it is a lot lot cheaper .
Purely in terms of financial cost, it's really not much compared with other infrastructure costs. And once built, it's RELATIVELY cheap to maintain, compared with roads, railways, mines, oil processing plants etc with huge returns in terms of material transport costs (coal, oil, gas), less air & ground pollution.
The ONLY real problem is greed, politics, religion and the aggression between countries... humans just don't like each other! 🤔
China is building HVDC lines to the tune of a dozen GW. Achieving the same thing in Europe is difficult due to narrowminded NIMBYism.
CRUDE OIL PRICE IS VERY MUCH HIGH.IT SHOULD FALL TO 65$ TO 55$.......
@@dragon.fromindia3235 but at any price, the Oil industry has had $Billions in Govt Tax Subsidies every year for decades, plus the on going cost of environmental & health damage. Oil, has been GREAT, we depend on it, but it's time to see it's true cost to us, not just the cost at the pump. (and yes, renewables are being subsitied too, now, as it's still being developed.)
This video is brilliant - thank you for explaining the high voltage AC and DC vs distance cost comparison and PV vs solar thermal costs.
European countries exploited TRILLIONS of dollars out of Africa = It was natural order of the world.
European countries investing back a tiny percentage of that money back = It is TOO RISKY lets forget about it..
Then some ''geniuses'' wonder why exactly refugees and illegal immigrants trying to cross into Europe while it is because they think Europe is the reason why they are refugees and immigrants and they are absolutely right about that...
It is not brilliant, it is you who are silly.
They should be all over roads and canals. Think road usually means house or something using electricity and canals loose water were already trying to move somewhere to evaporation but if we cover or float panels on the canals it reduces evaporation.
high voltage cables are expensive. Instead of multiple lines of cables u can make 1 line of gas pipe, turn the solar energy to hydrogen in desert and pump the hydrogen wherever.
Decentralize. Any other option will screw the consumer with inflated prices and lack of innovation.
Put panels on your home coupled with battery storage. Preferably in the form of an electric vehicle. Selling to consumers drives competition. The capacity goes up and the price goes down. Recent drops in panel cost are a real world example. Not an estimate.
Decentralization is also a strategic move for national defense. An attack on the grid is ineffective if most people are not on the grid.
Absolutely right , from the middle of nowhere in Thailand rice fields. 4 panels 4 battery's 5 years of grid 😇🙏😘 inverter 2k. My home in the avatar.
nailed it. especially the lack of innovation, as no central authority would want to scrap that which they spent a fortune on, and bet the farm on
if u install 1 solar panel the energy companies will add what you saved to your bill
I'm all for decentralization in principle, but how would you handle the infrastructure and storage? Infrastructure by definition cannot be decentralized, and many storage solutions benefit from economy of scale. So either you skip infrastructure, which means self-contained systems and a lot of wasted power production when you yourself are converting it inefficiently, or you need a central organisation to manage the powerlines and converters.
Whos gonna control the current, you?
I studied this a few years back. The biggest issue solar companies faced in Africa was crime and sabotage.
cant expect that to be mentioned in a video where the last 1/3 is a lecture about energy justice lol
Yes. If copper wire is stolen in very wealthy countries, why not poor ones?
@@choreomaniac theft of copper conductors in South Africa and general corruption has caused the implementation of stage 6 loadshedding
@@geraldarnie4034
Well, that and people in the power company being appointed based on racism rather than skill. If you reject a quality engineer because he happens to be white and instead and get some ANC gang twat who barely finished highschool, only speaks xhosa and steals money from all projects you're not getting anything done.
@@cqwiii Based
To be fair though, if a developing Africa could just source their own energy from solar generated in the desert, that would be pretty amazing already.
Anyone know the song in the background? I swear I’ve heard it before in a Mazda commercial.
General gist is that we need a total comprehensive solution that combines not just the energy resources itself, but also energy storage, transmissions and smart grids.
Correct. The solution? Fossil fuels and nuclear energy.
Best to avoid the one size fits all approach or idea, we love falling into such a simplistic thought process.
Diversification is key in generation and storage. Reliable, consistent solar generation of the desert will be critical going forward, but should not be considered a monopoly.
Agreed, and I like your DH Comet profile picture. 😎
Just like financial investments :)
But how are you going to keep the sand from building up on it and dulling the glass panel from wind erosion???
Interconnections are usually categorised by how much Voltage they transfer, not MW
I sometimes play a game in my head where I try to guess where exactly the transition to the sponsored segment starts. It's usually at some point when the narration starts rattling on about knowledge in general. I miss the time before sponsors where so deeply integrated into the video itself.
Thanks for the idea, I'll try this too!
Try using the -> key to zip past what bothers you.
@@johnsmith1474 or even the L key, if you're feeling courageous
Alllaahhhhh Africa
Mad warlords, UN corruption!!!!!
STAY AWAY!!!!!!!!!
@@lucasrem1870 Libië was doing fine before the USA and Europe started bombing. And electricity is easily transportable as H2
Morocco use this plans to use it locally as main goal, minimizing the cost of importing oil by 50% or more is the objectif, there is also wind energy. I think they did a good job.
Great point. Also, the transfer of wealth from urban renewables consumers to rural renewables producers is an underreported story.
Combined solar powered hydrogen (electrolysis) and desalination plants could, I think, carry the cost of transmission infrastructure (sea-water to, hydrogen from).
The fact you mentioned Imperialism makes this video far better. You nailed it. That is the crux of it all. The developed nations engage in resource predation and export our waste to the same nations we steal from. The developed nations can save themselves on their own soil, but choose not to.
But long term storage and energy transfer are decades behind. We can easily produce the energy necessary to power the planet, we fail to use it effectively as well as store and transfer it. In 2019 alone the USA lost roughly 68% of its energy produced simply from energy loss from transfers. We have the produce 3x times as much to meet demand, thus pushing pollution from out 80% fossil fuels to triple production. Nuclear energy (Gen IV Fission) and eventually Fusion should be the backbone with wind and solar being the supplementary energy sources for localities.
The push for solar as the king, as well as Wind, is a marketing and political farce to delegitimize the safest form of energy production... Nuclear.
But in large, this is an outstanding video that earned its thumbs up simply by the fact that you saw the bigger picture. Predation of the Industrialized/Developed Nations. We can help build a better future without having to steal. Helping others within reason. A Global Government is not necessary, we can be a collective of different ideas and still work together.
i've been watching you for years !! watching a video from you about our country means a lot !!
"lots of love from Morocco !!!"
10:32 the power meter looks like a goofy smiley face 😀
I saw it too and immediately went hunting for a comment like this one. :)
The facts presented are for overhead lines for comparison of ac and dc. The cable dynamics are very different.
Volt drop's correction with Step up transformers.