Brake Cooling Scoops: Maybe not as effective as you think on a road car?
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- čas přidán 28. 08. 2024
- **UPDATED TEST: • Brake Cooling Scoops: ... ** After finding these composite brake cooling scoops in a box I wanted to put them to the test and settle my long-stewing curiosity about their effectiveness. I did this by using some old school air flow testing to see if they actually pick up any usable air stream on a stock-ish car with AC condensers and such in the way. The answer was interesting. I think on a "full race" car with a clean air path from the bumper to the wheel well, they probably do work. However, on an essentially stock car, it seems their effectiveness may be limited by their designed positioning.
UPDATE! I was wrong. The scoops do appear to work at least in my case. Real-world track test: czcams.com/video/Pu-pRbAkgOI/video.html
To be fair, you need to set up your GOPRO inside the wheel well and go for a drive. The fans can not move enough air volume to represent a car moving through the air. Air flow comes from the front or the car AND under the car. A better test is to put temp sensitive indicators on the calipers on the track since this is the only place ducts have any effect.
It's also been suggested I put a scoop on one side only and then get measurements in the pits as well. I may see what I can set up as a follow-up next time I'm at a track and have any "pit crew".
Lap of the World the only issue with that idea, is that *if* it works you're going to have uneven brake temps left to right and consequently uneven braking force, which is probably not such a good thing 😬
My plan would be to go out for just a few laps, enough to get things up to temperature, then take the measurements. If there is, for some reason a massive imbalance, then it would definitely be prudent to park and add the matching scoop and let things balance out.
Thanks for doing the vid! I've always wondered about this myself
This video is making me deeply reconsider my options haha
I’m wearing through front wheel bearings quickly on my 5x100 Subaru hubs, and conventional wisdom is to upgrade to BBK, 5x114.3 hubs, or get brake ducts. There might not be a noticeable influence on braking performance, but heat exposure to nearby components may be reduced
Please watch the follow-up video I did (pinned comment has a link). You might re-consider your re-consideration 😁
My understanding ( for a track car ) is to put a diffuser in the front splitter and have that air directed at the scoop. Thats what I am building on my car currently. I also have ducts in the bumper and I will point those to the deflector also. If my temps are too high I will build a backing plate and connect the ducting to it. FYI 2005 mustang.
I did do a follow up to this effectively debunking my own garage science. That said although the scoops do work, I'm sure proper ducting would be the way to go for maximum effect.
Yep. You have to collect at the chin or front grill.
"Am I wrong on the internet" 😂😂😂
Although the strings you used were a bit too stiff (old-school aero tests usually used a lightweight yarn), and the fans aren't necessarily indicative of airflow on a moving vehicle as mentioned in another comment, I think you've hit the crux of the issue. There just isn't enough airflow for the scoop to make a difference, at least in this particular application.
I would expect those types of scoops to work a little better if they were on something like an E36/46 M3, or the V8 RS4, where there is a semi-rectangular duct from the face of the bumper to the inside of the wheel well from the factory. If the scoop is positioned correctly, it could then slap (most of) that force-fed column of air over to the brakes. It still wouldn't be as effective as running a hose from a bumper duct all the way to the hub, or even better, to a backing plate, but I have a feeling it would be more effective than those factory ducts alone that just dump air into the wheel well at the inside edge of the wheel. Plus, you don't have the lock-to-lock restriction of all that hose in the fender well (or, like in my E36 with the Bimmerworld kit, removing the fenderliner-to-backing-plate section of hose after the track event is over). It's been a while since I worked on one, but I think the Porsche 951 has a duct-to-wheelwell and scoop set up similar to this from the factory.
I purchased an aluminum disk that goes between the rim and the hub with louvers punched in them that act like little fan blades to blow air on the rotors for cooling when the tire is rotating. They made a big difference, I have no brake fade now no matter how hard I brake.
That sounds interesting. Are those custom or an off-the-shelf part? Also please note I did re-test the scoops on an actual track and they do work in spite of my findings with this test.
Experiment setup would be much more assuring if you just measure the rotor heat with a temp gun and log it with and without the duct over a few laps
Yes, about that: czcams.com/video/Pu-pRbAkgOI/video.html 😅😁
I think that if you paired both a brake cooling scoop and an actual air duct tube leading from the bumper cover straight onto the scoop, you'd see much better results
Ducting is definitely the way, but as I found in my real-world re-test, even these scoops do make a real difference. I've linked to me busting myself in the description and a couple of comments here and there. I was happy to be wrong on this one.
go on a track and take the temperatur after 2 laps. then mount this flap and take the temperature to compare it :-) ! then you (and we) know what the effect is. greetings from germany!
Danke für den Kommentar! (I went to school briefly in Kassel and my wife and I were married in Waldeck). I do plan to do a "practical" test on these in the hopefully-near future. Either running one side on / one side off, or as you say back to back sessions measuring the temperature delta on set number of laps.
@@LapoftheWorld sounds very cool. I´m looking forward to it! Ich freu mich schon drauf. :-D
so i made some for my focus st and have them hanging maybe an 1.5” below the bottom of the car. maybe moving them into the undercar airflow may help
That's my theory. I tried mounting these "upside down" so they did stick down beyond the undertrays, but that created interference with the wheel with any significant steering lock. It's on my to-do list this year to run a real-world test with these guys.
Hey man, ST owner here too. Brake cooling is on obvious weakness of these cars, what did you find out? Any recommendations?
@@brandolifts7928 hey, they were better but you need to introduce real airflow. you can trim the rubber flaps around the wheel well underneath to let the flap work better. i ended up using brake cooling ducts from a c5 corvette and some ducts next to my fog lights. they are much better.
How about radiator/ac condenser ducting for daily use car sir?
Please find my updated video in the pinned comment clarifying via a "field test" that these things actually work (I was wrong here). With that said, I suspect you could probably get somewehre with any ducting that directs air to a radiator or condenser and/or prevents air "spillage" around them vs through them.
Fantastic
I know (assume) that those are not factory scoops. This weekend I will send you some pics of the 911 factory and gt3 scoops I have. I think if you just "adjusted" the position would actually work. #youtubecolaboration ;)
Definitely not factory. I had tried flipping them upside-down, but if I do they have some interference issues with the wheels/tires at any real amount of steering angle. Some of the scuffing on them is a result of that experiment.
@@LapoftheWorld I am sure we can find a way to make them work.
@@MystMotorsports Yup, 'just need to get them to a track for some real world testing
Yeah, Ridiculous like a Fox....
Lol... Wow that was some experiment... Why would you not baseline with them off doing actual breaking and heat test. Then put them on and measure heat after breaking. Smh
👍1) I was bored 2) I was wrong 3) I did a follow up at a track here: czcams.com/video/Pu-pRbAkgOI/video.html Cheers!
One thing I want to do is upgrade my backing plate. Later cars got more vents: i.imgur.com/tPO4TFz.jpg
I've seen people add holes and then use the dust shield to affix the outlet of a cooling duct. That's an option I've considered. Figuring something out could be an interesting off-season project.
the louvres are pointing down silly, open them up.
The louvers in the fender liners don't adjust (assuming that's what you mean). Also it doesn't seem to matter. Check out the follow-up video in the pinned comment. The scoops definitely do something regardless of stuff in the way.