How Evangelical Readings Misunderstand Paul's Gospel
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- čas přidán 5. 08. 2024
- "I've tried to show in my work that Paul is actually a torah-observant Jew, and he actually has a very torah-oriented Judaism that believes in Christ, which is pretty logical,
because if you're going to go against the stream about a particular Judean murdered by the Romans, you certainly need to be an ideal Judean yourself. And you need a community that is not easily disparaged for rejecting torah and a torah-based lifestyle."
A Conversation with Mark Nanos in the Rector's Forum at All Saints Church, Pasadena, on Sunday, February 23, 2020.
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As a Christian with many Orthodox Israeli and American Jews as close friends....I thought this was tremendous! A million thanks for your work.
Replacement and Dispensationalism Theology has a lot to answer for !
It's so obvious when you shift your paradigm to understand that YHVH is an Hebraic God, not American, English, Australian etc. And with that foundation comes the thought and action process of the Hebraic manner. Galatians 3:29 says that when we are in Christ, then we are of Abraham's seed, and heirs to the promise... which is EXACTLY why we are grafted in to Israel, and as such become Israelites.
There is no separation, there is no replacement, there is Israel. And as such later in Romans it shows how the new believers that were told to learn in the synagogues on Sabbath must do the basics to be accepted by the Jews - refrain from immorality and idols etc - they would learn the rest later.
Today, 'Christianity' IS arrogant and haughty believing they have all the answers. Yet they have intermingled pagan traditions, and are far from Torah as you can get. And I mean true Torah, not the Torah that Yeshua and Paul preached against with the added rules and regulations that YHVH had not given and as a result the people were stifled. Getting back to Torah.... the modern church has blasphemed saying that Torah is now irrelevant and THAT is the reason why Yeshua says in Matthew 7:21-23 that MANY Christians that call him Lord Lord will be told to depart as they are practitioners of lawlessness.
Lea Greenall amen
Blessings to you Lea, my sibling in the Lord. I agree with much of what you say. YHVH has not discarded Abraham's physical seed and He cares about Israel.
In no way did Yeshuah teach against Torah or add. He was teaching not merely the written law but the oral law. The spirit of the law.
Btw, Paul did teach against Torah and is the false apostle of Rev 2:2 because he taught against the laws of Moses and the church that found him to be a liar was congratulated by Yeshauh in a rev..
all of Asia rejected paul.
@@marilynsamaniego4652truth. In Mat24, Jesus makes it clear that he will not be appearing in the desert ἔρημος to any man. He gives this warning in connection to false prophets and false Jesus Christs. Not just false Christs, false Jesus Christs: he expressly foretold that "many will come **in my name,** saying I am Christ. And shall deceive many." Many.
Interestingly, 1 Kings 19:15 calls the area outside Damascus the desert (midbar in Hebrew, ἔρημος in the LXX).
And the LORD said unto [Elijah], Go, return on thy way to the desert ἔρημος of Damascus: and when thou comest, anoint Hazael to be king over Syria.
Also interestingly, the King of Syria is a type of a antichrist.
I am a reasonable new Christian and read mucho as I try to understand. That includes even Daniel Boyarin a Talmudic scholar who writes about Gospels & New Testament. I have great interest in the historical late Second Temple & 1st-2nd century of belief in Jesus. I am grateful to discover Mark Nanos. I am too late in life at 79 yo to learn Ancient Greek and besides have no talent for languages. It has always been a question to me = Jesus was a Jew, but seemed not to be presented as such. I am grateful for Jewish scholars who wade into this period of history to give a fuller view.
When you say that Jesus seemed not to be presented as a Jew, which NT books do you have in mind? To these eyes, Matthew & Mark read extremely Judaic/Hebraic, in both content and format.
Interestingly, Jean Carmignac (acclaimed Hebrew/Aramaic scholar) was *convinced* for a diversity of linguistic reasons that our Greek texts of Matthew & Mark are, in fact, nothing more than literal translations from Hebrew originals. Sadly, he died before he could complete a large book intended to present his research.
But I digress. "Jesus was a Jew but seemed not to be presented as such." Are you thinking more particularly of John and the Pauline epistles? Just wondering... as I have very strong opinions on the subject you raised.
Cheers
Psalms;
4:8 You gave me joy in my heart, more than the corn and wine that abounded with them.
7:11 My shield over me is G-d, a savior of the upright in heart.
9:2 I give thanks to the One, with all my heart.
12:6 I am sure of Your friendship, my heart will rejoice in Your salvation.
18:9 The commandments of the One are straightforward, a joy to the heart.
21:27 Praise the One! Those who seek Him, their hearts will be revived forever.
14:26 Hope in the ONE: be strong. Thy heart be undaunted. Keep hoping in the ONE.
27:7 The One is my strength and my shield, with Him my heart is safe.
30:25 Be strong, your heart be fearless, all of you who wait for the One.
33:19 The ONE stands by the brokenhearted, He redeems the slain in spirit.
35:11 Extend Your friendship over those who want to know You, and Your righteousness over the upright in heart.
36:4 Rejoice in the ONE, and He Himself will give you the desires of your heart.
61:9 Always be safe with Him, pour out your heart before Him. G-d is a refuge for us.
68:33 Rejoice, seekers of G-d, revive your hearts!
83:6 Blessed is a man whose strength is in You, pilgrimages are in their hearts.
96:11 Light is sown for the righteous, and joy for the upright in heart.
5:56 About "othering" I think Jesus (Yeshua) who is God himself, was "othered" pretty hard (i.e. crucified). All mankind is responsible for that. It is the duty of all mankind to make amends to God for that "othering" by bowing to Jesus (who is God in the flesh). It was Jesus who led Moses and the Israelites out of Egypt. It was Jesus who is and was the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. It was Jesus in the burning bush. It was Jesus who gave the Torah at Mount Sinai. It was Jesus who denounced the scribes and Pharisees for pretending that there was a fictitious "oral law" that religious leaders could make up to suit themselves (and later codified in Talmudic writings). Jesus knew there was no "oral law" because he was the God who was there at Mount Sinai giving the Torah to Moses. These basic facts need to be locked down and acknowledged before we can seriously discuss St. Paul's epistles. Nevertheless, Mark Nanos deserves credit for coming before a Christian audience to share his views. I did learn some things from him. It is good to bring speakers who will challenge us, as long as we are allowed to challenge them back.
Who is “the God and Father of our Lord Yeshua Messiah” if “Jesus is God” like you say?
@@jaysonwilliams8991 Thank you for asking. The pre-incarnate Yeshua/Jesus, the divine Son, is often called the "messenger of the Lord/YHWH". Messenger is often translated as "angel" and we often think of a seraph or cherub or other created spiritual being when we read "angel" but "angel" or "messenger" is a role, not a type of being. The "angel of the Lord" is sent by the Lord and is also the Lord. The two are distinct persons, but one God. (This language got misunderstood by the "Jehovah's Witness" movement who think that Jesus is the Archangel Michael.) Anthony Rogers has done many great videos on the trinity in the Hebrew Bible. Here is one that is very much on-point to my comment. czcams.com/video/xAssdQiGxIk/video.html
banneryetwave I disagree with you, but I won’t argue with you. I believe Yahweh is our God (Deuteronomy 6:4) and the God of Yeshua (Revelation 3). I believe the Father is the Only True God (John 17:3), and for me there is only One God, the Father, just as for Paul (1 Corinthians 8:6). I believe Yeshua is the Messiah, the Son of the Living God (Matthew 16:16), the Mediator between God and men, Himself human (1 Timothy 2:5). I believe Yahweh God made the man Yeshua both Lord and Messiah (Acts 2:36). I believe Yeshua is Lord (Romans 10:9) to the glory of God the Father (Philippians 2:11) and that God raised Him from the dead (Romans 10:9).
I don’t believe in the trinity doctrine that was concocted by men influenced of Plato some 300-400 years after Messiah was raised and exalted. I do not believe in oneness/modalist, God is His own son mumbo-jumbo. I don’t believe the JW lie of the Son being an archangel.
I believe in Yahweh and His Messiah, Yeshua. (Psalm 2:2, Revelation 11:15).
@@jaysonwilliams8991 We agree to disagree. Blessings to you Jayson.
Jesus is not God in the flesh.
Galatians 2:16-21
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.
19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
So are you saying we don’t need to follow the law?
Are you saying we have to follow the law of Moses All 613 points of law not one soul ever kept ?
A moment of silence should suffice now :)
@@NuevaCriaturaValera I’m not saying we have to follow them. Should we.. yes the law is good for us. However Jesus made it clear anyone who teaches one to break the law will be least in the kingdom of heaven. Nobody said to keep all 613. Most only apply to certain individuals. Just like how you follow the law everyday which is way more than 613 only the ones that apply.
@@codyalexander3290 The law of Moses contains 613 points of law You do not mix and match which laws you decide to follow
The Eternally Saved believer in Christ is not under no law but under Grace by faith trust in the finished work on Calvarys Cross The death burial and resurrection of the The Lord Jesus Christ 1 Corinthians 15:1-4
If you think you are keeping any of the law today you are blinded by the god of this world 2 Corinthians 4:3-4
The law is a (curse)
Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law being made a curse for us for it is written:
Cursed is everyone that hangeth on a tree Galatians 3:13
@@NuevaCriaturaValera Daniel kept the law in Babylon the ones he could. So did many others. Also the law being a curse is in reference to what Moses said about the law being a curse and a blessing. Do you really think God gave his people a curse? Also the law isn’t just the 613 it would also mean you would have to deny the 10 commandments today.
unfoiutunatley you don't have someone to challenge you. of course they were reje3cted.
One body one gospel
The gospel is the gospel of the kingdom!
Jesus is going to return and set up the kingdom of God ON THE EARTH! God’s government ON THE EARTH! The Messiah died for his people! God resurrected the Messiah! The Messiah will resurrect his people at his coming! The destiny of the Messiah and his people is to be ON THE EARTH! The renewed restored earth! God also dwelling with them! Rev 21
Matt 24
14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be proclaimed throughout the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
Jesus said the Father is the only true God!
John 17
3 And this is eternal life, that they know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent.