It would only be fair to give a little context to [PERFORMANCE] segment: 1. "3-click occlusion" comment - Unity offers a very basic level occlusion optimization, but it only works well for static objects. Yes for KSP they are very few of these things and they might even use this feature. Here what pissed me off was the obvious lack of more appropriate OVERALL occlusion culling that I demonstrated. 2. "kerbal is still drawn, even if it's inside the pod because ....the pilot camera" - While looking into renderDoc i was searching where this scene is being made and didn't find it. All i found was in HUD drawing segment the camera get rendered as a PRE-PREPARED image. This leads me to believe that they DO NOT...yet , render actual models, but just use some kind of '"animated image" 3. LOD - this is partially used, most notably in foliage and trees on planet, but it's such a minimal, unimportant detail that i chose to omit it. HOWEVER LOD requires separate lower-detail-level models to be created 1st before this feature can be implemented. This usually is not done at the start or middle of development, but rather near the tail end when majority of optimization takes place. HOWEVER Yamiks is angry cuz it's been 4+ years in production before "EA launch" and now 12 SINCE launch and yet there is still no sign of it it seems. 4. "Small Performance improvements" - YES i get it that on launch performance was worse.... reason I use "small improvements" is in context of more finished game. I'm sick and tired of coddling these early-access/unfinished games with "oh look, compared to launch...." NO. you asked FULL PRICE and TRUST of the customer, so expect harsh critique! As I mentioned: BEST of luck to Dev team, but progress looks very slow in grand scheme of things! p.s. Yamiks is also sick and tired of EA/unfinished games being shat out... without any indicator of how LONG this "unfinished" period will take. YES deadlines are stressful, but when you take in money for a shitty product : it's only reasonable for customer to ask : "well... when will it be DONE then!?"
Yamiks thinks highly of Yamiks. Yamiks is amused. but to give ya serious answer : it's just a bit of fun really...you know Yamiks is a character right (for most part)?!
So... about the drawing of the Kerbal and why it's a high poly model without an LOD: What I'm guessing is that at some point, they might be wanting to use an imposter rendering technique, where you render to the area to a buffer, but then don't rerender until a set period of time and use the buffer as a cutout. Granted, why this isn't in at the moment is a bit confusing, since even Second Life uses this, and has been a feature for about 10 years. Also, I think the reason the Kerbal is being drawn is because the window of the cockpit is transparent, so we have a costly alpha draw. We also see this with the helmet, where the head is drawn first, then the helmet, due to the glass. So you basically have 3 drawcalls all because of transparency, and a tasty alpha on alpha action, which GPUS LOVE. Also, drawcalls are CPU bound, which adds more delay to the GPU, because next to no one is using mesh shaders.
In my opinion all these things will be addressed (or not) after they reach their goals, while in Early Access I think it is very unlikely that they will do anything of significance to the performance.
Reminds me of Cities skylines 2's issues. They were rendering every citizens teech inside their mouthes that were composed of thousands of polygons, even when you were zoomed way out above the city. Maybe its a good thing that unity committed seppuku to itself.
glad I never paid for it. I remember when it came out, I was just like "...this is KSP with 1/8th the features". I bought KSP1 when it only had like 15 parts in it. Difference was, it only cost $5...
This sounds very much like the story of Cities Skylines 2, which I think has finally broken me of my habit of pre-ordering unreleased games at full price. I had to learn eventually.
You know, I rarely do pre order these days, with a few exceptions, Everspace 2 got my early access money and it turned out okay, Baldur's gate 3 was an no brainer and possibly the hardest 3 years of my gaming life not to play it during EA and it turned out spectacular, so when KSP2 arrived in EA the sequel to one of my favorite games, it was an no brainer.....sadly it just proves your point correct and that not even the greatest of Developers are immune to the Kraken.
Yamiks, you are the best Latvian CZcamsr I have ever watched (to be honest, I have never watched another Latvian CZcamsr). Most of all I like your Latvian humor, it’s just something incredible, I’ve never heard such jokes from anyone!
I have played well over 1,500 hours in the first game. 1,558 hours on my steam account, and countless more on my friend's PC. I don't even own KSP2, and plan on buying it either: When it's totally finished, optimized, and a reasonably good experience, OR, when it's 90% off.
Same. Every few months I check. I was thinking about buying it after seeing recently positive reviews. Then I watched this video, and im gonna give it another couple months.
I hope they can get the performance under control at some point ... before KSP2 launched I only wanted two things from it. Better performance and better performance with mods either due to better performance in general or better mod support/integration. Performance for me was always the thing that was the limit in KSP 1 ... I know there are some guys out there who power though and launch large ships with 1 fps but I never could and after some time it just gets anoying when you constantly have stutter in the VAB when you add or remove parts since the things recalculates. If they dont solve these issues I see no reason to play KSP2 really since I can have colonies and interstellar exploration though mods in KSP1.
I noticed that I couldn't use the hardware based video encoder "NVENC". It appears that KSP offloaded a lot of computation to the CUDA cores or something else which shares resources with nvenc. Switching OBS to software encoding works, or dedicating a secondary GPU to video encoding.
Well, hold on. I'm not super experienced at game designed, but isn't the kerbal being rendered over their in the upper corner? So of course that needs to be fully loaded up.
But most kerbals look identical. Why does the cockpit need to be rendered at all, instead of pre-generating a .gif file of every kerbal face in every cockpit, which is then superimposed onto the screen? Hell, why not make it two part, so every cockpit has a background bit and a kerbal bit, which are then layered?
@@JRexRegis because it’s responsive to what’s happening. Like I think there should be an option to turn that view off and thus trim that from active rendering and just have a low LOD model in place. But with them there there is a reason that a higher model is being rendered
With most of the kerbal covered up in the corner, most of the model doesn’t have to be rendered in full detail, plus because you never see the backside in the cockpit, the model could be a specific LOD one with high front res and low rear res.
And now the whole team all got fired. Take two has been greedy since day one (so set on keeping all the rights to themselves that they poached the entire dev team and caused a 6-months set back). Now they simply cancel the project after "discovering" that you can't just do top-down development on a game like this one.
As someone who gave Squad or whoever the fuck makes this game now a chance back when the console version was released, the schadenfreude of seeing just how catastrophically bad this game is feels great. Us console KSP1 players had a version that was so bad Microsoft and Sony blacklisted it from both of their stores, and Squad in their infinite wisdom decided to get another company to port it. And surprise surprise it was another fucking disaster. Bugs that have been in since launch are still in the game almost a decade later! We were lucky to get an update once every 2 years. So it brings me a bit of joy to see the PC players experiencing a modicum of the suffering we on console did due to this garbage company.
I finally said "fuck it" and bought KSP 2, I was mainly concerned because my CPU is still an i5 4690k, but surprisingly it ran great. GPU is a 3060, but I really expected the CPU to just tank the performance since it's a very demanding simulation game. Honestly with the career mode I'm fairly happy right now. I was never doing insane stuff, so from what I see so far the game generally has what I want it to have.
I bought the game, but the performance and lack of features is just to frustrating to play. The most frustrating thing is the lack of any indication on when these features will come. Hope this game will get to the promised point, but fear that if that happens we have ro wait for a while
I wanna give my 2 cents on the things you showcased at the 6 minute mark. The reason the kerbal is being constantly rendered is because its needed for the cockpit view. I am pretty sure the 1st game rendered the kerbals in a separate buffer and rendered them with a lower framerate. I think you put way too much emphasis on the geometry complexity of the meshes being rendered here, while I agree its quite surprising they do not utilize any LOD system for smaller meshes, your average modern gpu can handle rendering tens of millions of polygons without problems. Trees having no LODs/bilboards and high poly meshes? Thats a big problem. A kerbal having an average polycount for a game character? I dont think thats a big deal. What I think is the main culprit of the performance issues is what you mentioned earlier, the shaders made for rendering planets and props were not written competently. Or theres some debug code somewhere in there that they forgot to remove, which is iterating over large amounts of data every frame :D
Additionally I wanted to add that occlusion culling is quite an expensive culling method, I would definitely not recommend using it for something like this, as the overhead required to calculate what needs to be culled could outweigh the overhead you save by culling those meshes.
I agree with your point that millions of triangles can be drawn, however this is only the case for larger triangles. If the triangles get smaller and smaller on a per pixel or subpixel level, drawing them can have a huge impact on the performance. But personally I think that the terrain generation could be optimized greatly.
I thought that at first too..... BUT cockpit-view animation is NOT a model, but a GIF basically. Check renderdoc, it's rendered on HUD in VEEERRRY short time.
What exactly does the sequel offer that the original with mods doesn't? What was their motivation or reason, other than money, for making this? By this I mean usually you make a sequel when you can offer a big enough upgrade/new features, unless your EA of course.
the goal was to provide a better core/engine then the first game. A game that could go way further then with features and mods then the first game could. That was not really achived yet.
as long as they have the time they will get up to date with the new engine and it will be sick. planet seeding i bet. we will get many years out of this one as well
@@TheYamiks well yeah, right? Unless you're doing so much multitasking (not sure how badly your capturing affects you) that you need all those cores. As far as I've seen the best processor for games is ryzen 9 in most titles and intel 900 models for a couple other specific titles.
yep i blame publisher almost exclusively for the early shit-fest. sure they eat up costs, but what a banger would have it not been if KSP2 came out and was simply GOOD from the start!?
@@TheYamiks i really appreciate your work. The more you praise these corporations for their "comebacks" with their unfinished products the more encouragement this behavior gets, remember intercept games isnt an indie game studio. I believe it's mostly our fault as gamers because we are too stupid with bad memory and easy to win over.
Sad, I think I will make a rule to buy games only after 3 years of post launch development (and never preorder!!!) How many years it took Cyberpunk to be playable? the same with No man's sky? It was deffinetly more than one year. So KSP 2 could be playable and worth our time in 2 more years (if it will not get abbandoned).
It's a shame that they won't even refund people for the game but that game company for you. 60 bucks for a game that doesn't really run too well and then a year later Studio shut down.
So what amount of space do you think storing the terrain of a planet would take in memory? Since you're so incredulous about the idea of procedural generation. Of course, others have solved similar issues, but in general you can't generate a planet's worth of terrain and then just store it, unless you have an insane amount of memory available, so you have to try to tile it somehow. Or perhaps you can tell us how it should be done?
Occlusion does not work like you are describing Yamiks, Occlusion only works on STATIC objects, basically objects that do not move, such as maps and stuff like that, Unity will then "cook" the position of each mesh (bacause it wont move) and then it can detect when an object is occluded by another or not. There is no Occlusion for DYNAMIC objects, only Frustrum, but that is not the same thing as the occlusion culling you are talking about. But I do agree with you that they should just disable the Kerbal toon object since it is not visible at the moment, but just know that, it is not just a 3 Clicks operation to do that.
....WHAT?! i think you need to read a little more on what occlusion culling is mate. for context : YES static item "cooking" blah blah blah ... is simplest and 1-click affair today, but that's NOT THE ONLY ONE. dynamic object culling still is a VERRRRRY important one as well, thou that one you do need to code in and that is also what i mentioned in the video!
@@TheYamiks No, not "1 click affair today" you are wrong. Yes dynamic object culling is important, but it does not work as you THINK it does. Yes I know you mentioned it in the video, but I think you are OVEREACTING on this, this is not the issue with the game's performance, and I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT! I know precisely how Occlusion Culling works in Unity and I don't give a damn about how it works in other game engines. Unity occlusion culling only works automatically in Static orbjects, OR dynamically in Frustrum. ANYTHING ELSE you need to code yourself, yes, it is possible for you to code it yourself, but ITS NOT A FUCKING 1 CLICK AFFAIR in UNITY!
In my professional opinion the issue with the performance is the Draw Calls, and yes they could optimize the Poly count on their meshes and reduce their textures to 2k resolution. But I don't think they will do any of that while the game is in Early Access, expect optimizations after their goals are reached.
That helmet/kerbal reminds me of the hyper detailled tiny toothbrush model in Yandere Simulator. It's a bad practice though and it might hint at the issue being present elsewhere, but realistically, that one model by itself is not going to affect performance at all. I can totally see myself directly insert that detailled model in a project in this situation (not sure what to make of that though), on individual objects like that it pretty much doesn't matter.
Kerbal mesh makes sense, after all, you are watching it in the top right corner all the time 😅 But yea, seriusly unoptimized in some areas and it seems to me like its almost deliberately, to make easyer implementation of new things. They know what they are thinking... roll out was what it was and here we are now
watched some sci-fi, got the itch to launch some stuff, typed ksp2 review... a year! wow time flies, hope there's good news!! ...disappointment... don't even care anymore. just hope another developer takes note and makes the real ksp2. p.s. any recommendations for a good space sim? i play 4x and like it, not really into citizen or elite. looking more for ksp1 experience. i know i know, just mod that up i guess. but just in case there's something else. the truth is out there.
the original developers of KSP1 are gone and are currently working on a Model-flight/RC simulator. they come from a strict coding and simulator first school of thought. This, especially the ridiculous rendering showcases a deeply, deeply loose and undisciplined approach to development from the new team. in many ways the ease of use of new gamedev tools lets them get away with too much. a "features first, fix it later, look how nice it looks" kind of development. the Crunch and pressure and lack of experience clearly don't help either. F U Take2.
Welp they got all laid off cuz Nate Simpson’s mismanagement and lack of income btw he has had a history of “serial grifting” every single game he touched and this game is no different they lied to us this whole time and now take two has laid off all 70 of them and they are sending out job applications :D they have killed kerbal for good not just ksp2 but any future for ksp… we’ve waited HALF A DECADE FOR A STEAMING PILE OF DOGSHIT
I kinda wish NASA and ESA would have dropped support of KSP2 or at least distanced themselves from the game. That would have been the wakeup call Intercept Games and Take2 needed given how much of an educational tool the game is. But they'd probably just not care so idk. I just don't see KSP2 having a Cyberpunk 2077-esque Redemption Arc. The game is a sequel to an indie darling that was far more stable and playable in it's early years in 2011 and 2012 than even now and as stated twice, it ruined KSP1's player base as well. The game will be done in what? 7-10 years? You could have developed an entirely new IP in that time and not despoil KSP. But Hollywood and AAA game studios only want safe bets so it would have done regardless. Plus by the time the game is done it'll be horribly dated from what it could have been unless they keep updating which version of Unity they use like KSP1 did
They released it into early access way too early. The appropriate EA release would be if it included the features of KSP1 but not the new features like base building and interstellar yet. Instead they released it with even basic features like science and re-entry heat missing. It was a very early alpha build. To release it in such a state tells me the studio ran out of money.
Hi, I agree the game needs more time, hopefully they will have the budget to fully finish it. (I think the helmet is rendered in full detail, because in the top right corner you can see it up close and in full detail)
I'm not an active gamedeveloper anymore and even I could've written that optimization culling in about A WEEK. This is proof enough of how bad planned and lead is this project. I guess the devs were forced to improvise until the game reached this point of unstability.
My biggest issue with the game is the not that it was incomplete on release and its stagnant development. It was the year the devs spent making videos about how its better than ksp1 in every single way
It sad that we know that top manage have mismanage their game and dev for hiding player for this game. You can blame the person and the contracts. They thought the got rich for release for but still broken. Reason is Noob team and the not the creator didn't knew about the next version 2.
When are devs gonna learn that we don't like paying full price for a half finished product? There's Early Access, and there's flat out just not ready for launch. Pun intended.. "but we'll start accepting money for it!" It's up to us boys! Eventually, we just simply won't buy games at launch. Hell, I already don't. Nope.. never again! I wait like min 6 months, then look up reviews and see where it's at. That's actually exactly why I watched this video! Because patch notes can be vveeeeery misleading. So I do appreciate the update! Untill I think it's satisfactory.. or close enough to be worth the money.. in the focken wish list it stays! Fcuk your launch numbers! You fcuked that up, not me! Deliver what you promise! I want a finished product for my finished transaction. Not demanding perfection from an EA title.. that means kinks are still being worked out.. but functional is one of my demands. They're just abusing the siht outta that online updating, and have been since it became industry standard. I'm done trusting devs that I'm buying a playable product.. because 99 times out of 100 it's just not. They can lie and make excuses, but I really don't care anymore. Would they care about the reason I only gave them half the money? Don't think so. Only we can make them stop this bullsiht boys. I understand.. we're all excited and want it now.. but we both know we're just gonna end up bitter, disappointed and, we're gonna end up doing that waiting anyway.. so why not just hang on to that money untilit'sin an acceptable state? Look at Payday 3.. they pm just killed their franchise because they pulled similar BS.. and they're already selling DLC! For a barely (in some cases not functional) game. See yall in another year.
Thanks for the insight! I didn't think my old PC was that bad... It still played most games great! But not KSP 2! I finally upgraded on a budget. I can't tell a difference in KSP 2. While I play KSP 1 on a junk laptop thats so old, it shouldn't be running windows 10! LOL
j'ai tellement de haine envers les dev de KSP2, les gars ils avaient juste à combiner tous les mods de ksp1 dans un truc beau et stable et nan, ils ont """arnaqué""" leur communauté jusqu'au trônions, au lieu de nous sortir des trailer mensonger claqué au sol, ils feraient bien de garder leur argent pour payer les dev et arrêter de promettre la mun, quand meme le read me est buggé. Cancer sur eux pour avoir tué la meilleur licence sur l'espace, et dir que j'ai eu mon job actuel en parlant de mes 600 heures sur ksp, je suis dégouté, je les hais
Thanks for making this video. I've put about 1k hours into KSP and I've been thinking about buying this one. Seems like I should wait until they iron out some more bugs.
It's almost impossible the roadmap could be delivered if the game is not fully optimized. Just building a simple rocket and the game FPS is below 10. Imagine trying to get a space station or a outpost. Really sad. Even KSP with a single core CPU is doing better doh
All they had to do was deliver a decently performing/looking game with multiplayer. Just sandbox mode, with basic parts. Everything else they could've worked on afterwards and mods would've filled in lack of content meanwhile. Instead performance is ass, the biggest feature (multiplayer) is at the end of the roadmap but at least it looks better I guess so that's something? I wish they just focused on getting a good core engine from the get go. Would've been a completely different launch.
I'm talking about "versus ACTUALLY APPROPRIATE performance". if youŗe happy that instead of 5FPS you get 10FPS: good for you, but being SATISFIED with such low levels is NOT alright with me!
@@TheYamiks it's not 5 Vs 10 it's more like 5 Vs 50, especially with as part numbers increase (which you obviously didn't test). Go watch Matt Lowne's video comparing release build Vs the current one and how he launches the craft in the first build and just leaves because it ran at less than 1 FPS.
@@TheYamiks went from "unusable" to "enjoyable". 50 FPS is more than enough to enjoy KSP to it's fullest. Ofc the more the better (and I'm sure we will see more massive improvements) but saying that it's "small improvements" is ridiculous. Odyssey couldn't get that kind of boost since it released.
@@yarost12 lol that's when I realised this video had no interest in being made in good faith. Yes KSP 2 has been pretty disastrous and it's bizarre how rough it was, but to say that current day performance is basically equivalent to launch day is outright dishonest. It honestly feels like Yamiks didn't even play the latest release. Graphics, performance, everything really is massively better. Plus he went on a rant about how the Kerbals are rendered when you're flying your ship even though the idea is that you can look through your ship's windows and see them? Definitely feels like he's just trying to milk the KSP hate train still tbh. Made me unsub.
Forgot this game existed tbh. Played the first one... Loved it... Then found out about them collecting and selling peoples personal information, whether it was true or not, uninstalled. Then saw the dumpster fire of this one at launch and honestly forgot about it. Goes to show that a couple of missed steps if not handled correctly can really destroy all yours and your staffs hard work.
Once all the shit went down with the developer before the release I was already gone in terms of interest... I check back every once in a while to see if it's worth getting on a sale or something... Sadly doesn't look like it yet.
sure it sucks that it wasn't released in the state that it should have been in. And that it still should be in a better state than it is right now. But i have lots of fun playing KSP 2 and i play it almost every day. I didn't fully agree with everything in this video, like i feel that you kinda glanced over the fact that so many bugs have been fixed, like wobbley rockets. otherwise i really enjoyed the video.
i refuse to believe they're redrawing the terrain every frame. i'd sooner believe they're switching out LODs every frame, which while still inperformant, is not nearly as bad
Why? This is exactly what '"procedural" means. You don't store the meshes but generate them on the fly. There is almost constant and may be high processing cost involved but you can have virtually infinite detail (otherwise not possible due to memory constraints). In KSP you can visit every centimeter on each planet. Such scale almost prohibits storing geometry if it's to be very detailed.
Hi Yamiks, whatever reason the game is slow is probably not because of the stuff you found DISTURBING. You actually can find this info in tools like render doc if you spend more time looking through it, but most of the time it end up being some boring stuff like large amount of unbatched draw calls repeated between color passes, so I suggest to not even bother. Like HALF of the video is about performance, lets be frank, you could just have said it is slow, shit on the developers, and go on to the next topic. I was actually surprised about you knowing about tools like renderdoc, and also scared, because when people bring it up, you are either about to have a nice technical discussion, or hear the most braindead nonsense for the next minutes. ABSOLUTELY FREAKING OUT about stuff like unculled geometry, unecessary polys or _checks notes_ "calculating depth buffer" (???) just tells that you (how can i put this nicely?) still didint looked through deep enough for the issues. Those kinds of performance problems are always due to the bigger picture, not specifics (unless we are in a yandere simulator toothbrush situation). To people that actually works with this stuff, it just sounds like arguments from someone that is either really excited about knowing how to pull up a graphics api trace, or likes to hate on anything it finds. I know its not your plan to actually do unpaid work and find out what is wrong in the game, but the emphasis you put on the problems you find, and the solutions you gave make it sound like you think you know better than the devs, I know its not you want (hopefully), but its what it sounds like. Don't get me wrong, I love the rants! but this aint it
At least in Kerbal 2 they have "Game Developers" and not those nerdy "Programmers" as in Kerbal 1 who only care about optimization and nerdy stuff like "rendering" the game at a playable framerate. Maybe a few competent programmers would have greatly improved the performance at launch. Or a basic understanding of computers, data transfer and storage. Anyways I would have loved for Kerbal 2 to succeed, but without a timeline for the second update I really have no hope left.
What the f are you talking about? It's a massive team, hiring 1-2 more programmers wouldn't have changed anything. > Or a basic understanding of computers, data transfer and storage. Do you have any? You should apply, you'll surely fix all of the issues
@@yarost12 Yes, I have knowledge in these fields, but that should not matter here. They chose to release a product for the full price, full knowingly that the performance was not optimal while beforehand boasting about wanting to slay the kraken. It does also not help that they had a "massive" team and delayed the game for a few years even though the original release date was sometime in 2020. Having a large team working on this game for a long time and still releasing a poorly optimized "alpha" for 50$/€ just screams bad management. Also regenerating the terrain in every frame is really bad, and I do not believe that they would not catch such a mistake, however sending a lot of data to the GPU as well as not using different levels of detail for the props just screams that the some part in the management between the artists and programmers was not optimal. In my own projects I also experimented with procedural generation and I can tell you that in Unity too it would be possible to generate the terrain geometry for example on the GPU as well using geometry shader and new mesh buffers. Keijiro Takahashi even build a marching cubes algorithm with exactly these shaders and buffers. It is not hard to adapt them for planes, octrees/quadtrees and to build the geometry (at least for rendering). The meshes for collision detection could also be computed on the CPU in lower resolution to reduce the cost, and even the procedural textures, should they not use tri-planar mapping, could be generated on the GPU by using RenderTextures. Ok, it took me about half a year (as a side project) to get a working system which was also performant, but for real, if I can do that as a small side project and build a relatively efficient procedural system, I wonder what they were doing over all those years with a huge team of full time employees. Sure, there is a lot of other stuff to work on, but if they change the release to "alpha" a few month before release just to excuse the bad performance, then they really dont care imho
It's getting better for sure, performance is way better with my mid spec gaming laptop (lil toasty though as these laptops are) I over doubled my total playtime in the week after the science update and I've been around before that hell of launch. I have no doubt it will be better in the future. Right now it depends on your tolerance to random bugs that you need to f5 f9 to fix, also the AA isnt that great atm. The science update in december marked the beginning of the upward ascent to redemption after it was already on a steady slope up.
The game has zero potential. It does nothing new,its in the same engine as the first, same limits. Essentially you can play a better version using KSP 1 and mods. KSP 2 is a a dead game
I think with the state of the game, how awful the launch was, and how even now a year from release it still hasn’t matched up to the original, he’s justified in ranting on about something he’s passionate about, especially when people willingly ignore issues with the game. Keep in mind that this game was also supposed to bring in more players to the franchise, and instead almost halved the player count on steam.
I always return to Ksp1 after a couple of years,thinking "this time I'll learn this game"but after 20 hours of being unable to even reach the orbit I just rage-quit,telling to myself "I'm never gonna play this shit again".And here I am after 2 years again trying and rage-quiting again,...This game is truly something,..
Therefore, instead of all sorts of ineffective CEOs, testers, managers and other management positions, you simply hire one SUPERRIOR LATVIAN and your business will go uphill.
I really don't understand why they released ksp2 in an early access state I love ksp but I ain't buying until it's in a finished state, been there done that bought the t-shirt with ksp1
@@IvanRodriguez-tl2zr did you even read my comment? I'm well aware of the state of ksp1 when it came out but that was a little bit acceptable for a first game there's no excuse for ksp2 they shouldn't have rushed it out before it was a functional game
Jet engines all have jet/rocket engines settings for some reason. This causes a hilarious bug forcing jets to randomly reverse thrust at takeoff trying to use nonexistent rocket components. Cant launch a single jet. For 50 bucks that's a downright scam
It would only be fair to give a little context to [PERFORMANCE] segment:
1. "3-click occlusion" comment - Unity offers a very basic level occlusion optimization, but it only works well for static objects. Yes for KSP they are very few of these things and they might even use this feature. Here what pissed me off was the obvious lack of more appropriate OVERALL occlusion culling that I demonstrated.
2. "kerbal is still drawn, even if it's inside the pod because ....the pilot camera" - While looking into renderDoc i was searching where this scene is being made and didn't find it. All i found was in HUD drawing segment the camera get rendered as a PRE-PREPARED image. This leads me to believe that they DO NOT...yet , render actual models, but just use some kind of '"animated image"
3. LOD - this is partially used, most notably in foliage and trees on planet, but it's such a minimal, unimportant detail that i chose to omit it. HOWEVER LOD requires separate lower-detail-level models to be created 1st before this feature can be implemented. This usually is not done at the start or middle of development, but rather near the tail end when majority of optimization takes place. HOWEVER Yamiks is angry cuz it's been 4+ years in production before "EA launch" and now 12 SINCE launch and yet there is still no sign of it it seems.
4. "Small Performance improvements" - YES i get it that on launch performance was worse.... reason I use "small improvements" is in context of more finished game. I'm sick and tired of coddling these early-access/unfinished games with "oh look, compared to launch...." NO. you asked FULL PRICE and TRUST of the customer, so expect harsh critique!
As I mentioned: BEST of luck to Dev team, but progress looks very slow in grand scheme of things!
p.s.
Yamiks is also sick and tired of EA/unfinished games being shat out... without any indicator of how LONG this "unfinished" period will take. YES deadlines are stressful, but when you take in money for a shitty product : it's only reasonable for customer to ask : "well... when will it be DONE then!?"
Why refer to yourself in third person?
Yamiks thinks highly of Yamiks. Yamiks is amused.
but to give ya serious answer : it's just a bit of fun really...you know Yamiks is a character right (for most part)?!
So... about the drawing of the Kerbal and why it's a high poly model without an LOD: What I'm guessing is that at some point, they might be wanting to use an imposter rendering technique, where you render to the area to a buffer, but then don't rerender until a set period of time and use the buffer as a cutout. Granted, why this isn't in at the moment is a bit confusing, since even Second Life uses this, and has been a feature for about 10 years.
Also, I think the reason the Kerbal is being drawn is because the window of the cockpit is transparent, so we have a costly alpha draw. We also see this with the helmet, where the head is drawn first, then the helmet, due to the glass. So you basically have 3 drawcalls all because of transparency, and a tasty alpha on alpha action, which GPUS LOVE. Also, drawcalls are CPU bound, which adds more delay to the GPU, because next to no one is using mesh shaders.
In my opinion all these things will be addressed (or not) after they reach their goals, while in Early Access I think it is very unlikely that they will do anything of significance to the performance.
Reminds me of Cities skylines 2's issues. They were rendering every citizens teech inside their mouthes that were composed of thousands of polygons, even when you were zoomed way out above the city. Maybe its a good thing that unity committed seppuku to itself.
They just fired the entire intercept games division in Seattle. REST IN SHIT KSP 2
Frfr RISH KSP2
glad I never paid for it. I remember when it came out, I was just like "...this is KSP with 1/8th the features". I bought KSP1 when it only had like 15 parts in it. Difference was, it only cost $5...
damn! yeah sounds like life by you situation XD
This sounds very much like the story of Cities Skylines 2, which I think has finally broken me of my habit of pre-ordering unreleased games at full price. I had to learn eventually.
Never pre-order. Categorically
damn CS2 is bad too? that's a bummer
@@l4dfanatic11 similar issue too. rendering peoples teeth inside their mouthes even when looking above the city.
I bought both Star Citizen and Starfield... I just loved Freelancer as a kid and apparently I never learn.
Once a preorderer, always a preorderer
We could have had greatness...
But instead we got this. Never pre-order!
You know, I rarely do pre order these days, with a few exceptions, Everspace 2 got my early access money and it turned out okay, Baldur's gate 3 was an no brainer and possibly the hardest 3 years of my gaming life not to play it during EA and it turned out spectacular, so when KSP2 arrived in EA the sequel to one of my favorite games, it was an no brainer.....sadly it just proves your point correct and that not even the greatest of Developers are immune to the Kraken.
Yamiks, you are the best Latvian CZcamsr I have ever watched (to be honest, I have never watched another Latvian CZcamsr). Most of all I like your Latvian humor, it’s just something incredible, I’ve never heard such jokes from anyone!
hehe well thank you!
Yamiks, you can't hold a full price game to full price game standards. That's unfair >:(
I know right?!
How dare I!?
I have played well over 1,500 hours in the first game. 1,558 hours on my steam account, and countless more on my friend's PC.
I don't even own KSP2, and plan on buying it either: When it's totally finished, optimized, and a reasonably good experience, OR, when it's 90% off.
Same. Every few months I check. I was thinking about buying it after seeing recently positive reviews. Then I watched this video, and im gonna give it another couple months.
Well, I guess you're never buying it now
@@testaccountpleaseignore2653 Nope :(.
Woah, i know they wanted in cockpit views on demand, but dayumn, we aint even close to that yet!
I will buy it when it is done.
I hope they can get the performance under control at some point ... before KSP2 launched I only wanted two things from it. Better performance and better performance with mods either due to better performance in general or better mod support/integration. Performance for me was always the thing that was the limit in KSP 1 ... I know there are some guys out there who power though and launch large ships with 1 fps but I never could and after some time it just gets anoying when you constantly have stutter in the VAB when you add or remove parts since the things recalculates.
If they dont solve these issues I see no reason to play KSP2 really since I can have colonies and interstellar exploration though mods in KSP1.
It is very playable actually
I noticed that I couldn't use the hardware based video encoder "NVENC". It appears that KSP offloaded a lot of computation to the CUDA cores or something else which shares resources with nvenc.
Switching OBS to software encoding works, or dedicating a secondary GPU to video encoding.
5:27
And every FF14 1.0 veteran screamed in terror and without knowing why... Yoshi-P had the urge to say "Nightmare."
Its been a year and it still needs a lot to catch up to ksp 1
Well, hold on. I'm not super experienced at game designed, but isn't the kerbal being rendered over their in the upper corner? So of course that needs to be fully loaded up.
But most kerbals look identical. Why does the cockpit need to be rendered at all, instead of pre-generating a .gif file of every kerbal face in every cockpit, which is then superimposed onto the screen?
Hell, why not make it two part, so every cockpit has a background bit and a kerbal bit, which are then layered?
@@JRexRegis because it’s responsive to what’s happening. Like I think there should be an option to turn that view off and thus trim that from active rendering and just have a low LOD model in place. But with them there there is a reason that a higher model is being rendered
With most of the kerbal covered up in the corner, most of the model doesn’t have to be rendered in full detail, plus because you never see the backside in the cockpit, the model could be a specific LOD one with high front res and low rear res.
i never appreciated how much i used fuel creation until i didnt have it now i am just waiting till i have drills and isru again before i play
This game will never be what they promised. Wouldn't surprise me if they even abandon it all together.
Salt I love it
They won’t abandon it
Why should they? If the game really is so inefficient as seems it must be possible to improve it right
And.... It's Dead!
@@johnathonmitchell6782 nope
i think theyre focusing on one thing at a time, and its probably easier to optimize at the end
And now the whole team all got fired. Take two has been greedy since day one (so set on keeping all the rights to themselves that they poached the entire dev team and caused a 6-months set back). Now they simply cancel the project after "discovering" that you can't just do top-down development on a game like this one.
As someone who gave Squad or whoever the fuck makes this game now a chance back when the console version was released, the schadenfreude of seeing just how catastrophically bad this game is feels great. Us console KSP1 players had a version that was so bad Microsoft and Sony blacklisted it from both of their stores, and Squad in their infinite wisdom decided to get another company to port it. And surprise surprise it was another fucking disaster. Bugs that have been in since launch are still in the game almost a decade later! We were lucky to get an update once every 2 years. So it brings me a bit of joy to see the PC players experiencing a modicum of the suffering we on console did due to this garbage company.
So... better than ED: Odyssey?
Or should I still buy KSP 1 instead
Ksp1
i like both, but KSP 1 and wait for more updates first before deciding if you want to buy KSP 2
I finally said "fuck it" and bought KSP 2, I was mainly concerned because my CPU is still an i5 4690k, but surprisingly it ran great. GPU is a 3060, but I really expected the CPU to just tank the performance since it's a very demanding simulation game. Honestly with the career mode I'm fairly happy right now. I was never doing insane stuff, so from what I see so far the game generally has what I want it to have.
I bought the game, but the performance and lack of features is just to frustrating to play. The most frustrating thing is the lack of any indication on when these features will come. Hope this game will get to the promised point, but fear that if that happens we have ro wait for a while
I wanna give my 2 cents on the things you showcased at the 6 minute mark. The reason the kerbal is being constantly rendered is because its needed for the cockpit view.
I am pretty sure the 1st game rendered the kerbals in a separate buffer and rendered them with a lower framerate.
I think you put way too much emphasis on the geometry complexity of the meshes being rendered here, while I agree its quite surprising they do not utilize any LOD system for smaller meshes, your average modern gpu can handle rendering tens of millions of polygons without problems.
Trees having no LODs/bilboards and high poly meshes? Thats a big problem.
A kerbal having an average polycount for a game character? I dont think thats a big deal.
What I think is the main culprit of the performance issues is what you mentioned earlier, the shaders made for rendering planets and props were not written competently. Or theres some debug code somewhere in there that they forgot to remove, which is iterating over large amounts of data every frame :D
Additionally I wanted to add that occlusion culling is quite an expensive culling method, I would definitely not recommend using it for something like this, as the overhead required to calculate what needs to be culled could outweigh the overhead you save by culling those meshes.
I agree with your point that millions of triangles can be drawn, however this is only the case for larger triangles. If the triangles get smaller and smaller on a per pixel or subpixel level, drawing them can have a huge impact on the performance.
But personally I think that the terrain generation could be optimized greatly.
I thought that at first too..... BUT cockpit-view animation is NOT a model, but a GIF basically. Check renderdoc, it's rendered on HUD in VEEERRRY short time.
What exactly does the sequel offer that the original with mods doesn't? What was their motivation or reason, other than money, for making this? By this I mean usually you make a sequel when you can offer a big enough upgrade/new features, unless your EA of course.
the goal was to provide a better core/engine then the first game. A game that could go way further then with features and mods then the first game could. That was not really achived yet.
Fricken star citizen full visuals run better than this
ksp 2 doesnt have a new engine, they're still using dogwater unity.
jesus christ i wish i knew about the LoD issue holy fuck
More KSP 2 hate..
@@IvanRodriguez-tl2zr i have the game and I love it, but I can't deny that it runs like gravel through a fucking oil filter
@@IvanRodriguez-tl2zrit deserves hate.
as long as they have the time they will get up to date with the new engine and it will be sick. planet seeding i bet. we will get many years out of this one as well
Threadripper isn't the best choice for avoiding cpu bottleneck on games tho...
ORLY?!
@@TheYamiks well yeah, right? Unless you're doing so much multitasking (not sure how badly your capturing affects you) that you need all those cores. As far as I've seen the best processor for games is ryzen 9 in most titles and intel 900 models for a couple other specific titles.
Rip ksp 2, long live ksp 1
Despite the company telling them to release early, this is exactly how kerbal 1 released
And that makes it alright?
Did the company not collect revenue from ksp1 to fund a BETTERdevelopment of the sequel?!
@@TheYamiks I don't know the fine details of it, but apparently the publishers pushed heavily for an unfinished early access release
@@VonMedkerbal 1 was made by one guy, if not few select individuals......
yep i blame publisher almost exclusively for the early shit-fest.
sure they eat up costs, but what a banger would have it not been if KSP2 came out and was simply GOOD from the start!?
@@TheYamiks i really appreciate your work.
The more you praise these corporations for their "comebacks" with their unfinished products the more encouragement this behavior gets, remember intercept games isnt an indie game studio.
I believe it's mostly our fault as gamers because we are too stupid with bad memory and easy to win over.
Sad, I think I will make a rule to buy games only after 3 years of post launch development (and never preorder!!!)
How many years it took Cyberpunk to be playable? the same with No man's sky?
It was deffinetly more than one year.
So KSP 2 could be playable and worth our time in 2 more years (if it will not get abbandoned).
It's a shame that they won't even refund people for the game but that game company for you. 60 bucks for a game that doesn't really run too well and then a year later Studio shut down.
So what amount of space do you think storing the terrain of a planet would take in memory? Since you're so incredulous about the idea of procedural generation. Of course, others have solved similar issues, but in general you can't generate a planet's worth of terrain and then just store it, unless you have an insane amount of memory available, so you have to try to tile it somehow. Or perhaps you can tell us how it should be done?
Maybe if they watched some videos on how to fix the game the entire team wouldn't have been fired
Occlusion does not work like you are describing Yamiks, Occlusion only works on STATIC objects, basically objects that do not move, such as maps and stuff like that, Unity will then "cook" the position of each mesh (bacause it wont move) and then it can detect when an object is occluded by another or not. There is no Occlusion for DYNAMIC objects, only Frustrum, but that is not the same thing as the occlusion culling you are talking about.
But I do agree with you that they should just disable the Kerbal toon object since it is not visible at the moment, but just know that, it is not just a 3 Clicks operation to do that.
....WHAT?!
i think you need to read a little more on what occlusion culling is mate.
for context : YES static item "cooking" blah blah blah ... is simplest and 1-click affair today, but that's NOT THE ONLY ONE. dynamic object culling still is a VERRRRRY important one as well, thou that one you do need to code in and that is also what i mentioned in the video!
@@TheYamiks No, not "1 click affair today" you are wrong. Yes dynamic object culling is important, but it does not work as you THINK it does. Yes I know you mentioned it in the video, but I think you are OVEREACTING on this, this is not the issue with the game's performance, and I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT! I know precisely how Occlusion Culling works in Unity and I don't give a damn about how it works in other game engines. Unity occlusion culling only works automatically in Static orbjects, OR dynamically in Frustrum. ANYTHING ELSE you need to code yourself, yes, it is possible for you to code it yourself, but ITS NOT A FUCKING 1 CLICK AFFAIR in UNITY!
I don't know why we are talking to each other like a bunch of Klingons but alright 😆 lmao.
In my professional opinion the issue with the performance is the Draw Calls, and yes they could optimize the Poly count on their meshes and reduce their textures to 2k resolution. But I don't think they will do any of that while the game is in Early Access, expect optimizations after their goals are reached.
The answer of the question in 1:13 is: NO, IT IS EVEN SHITTIER.
2:13 you're time warping, that's why
That helmet/kerbal reminds me of the hyper detailled tiny toothbrush model in Yandere Simulator. It's a bad practice though and it might hint at the issue being present elsewhere, but realistically, that one model by itself is not going to affect performance at all.
I can totally see myself directly insert that detailled model in a project in this situation (not sure what to make of that though), on individual objects like that it pretty much doesn't matter.
Kerbal mesh makes sense, after all, you are watching it in the top right corner all the time 😅
But yea, seriusly unoptimized in some areas and it seems to me like its almost deliberately, to make easyer implementation of new things. They know what they are thinking... roll out was what it was and here we are now
no... it is NOT.
i checked renderdoc and at no point i found that image being rendered beyond a SINGLE draw-call....meaning that it's a GIF
This happens you you hire developers that focus on passing interviews rather than improving their skills.
watched some sci-fi, got the itch to launch some stuff, typed ksp2 review... a year! wow time flies, hope there's good news!!
...disappointment... don't even care anymore. just hope another developer takes note and makes the real ksp2. p.s. any recommendations for a good space sim? i play 4x and like it, not really into citizen or elite. looking more for ksp1 experience. i know i know, just mod that up i guess. but just in case there's something else. the truth is out there.
the original developers of KSP1 are gone and are currently working on a Model-flight/RC simulator. they come from a strict coding and simulator first school of thought. This, especially the ridiculous rendering showcases a deeply, deeply loose and undisciplined approach to development from the new team. in many ways the ease of use of new gamedev tools lets them get away with too much. a "features first, fix it later, look how nice it looks" kind of development. the Crunch and pressure and lack of experience clearly don't help either. F U Take2.
What software produces the performance overlay? Looks good
MSI Afterburner. It does GPU tuning and overclocking as well.
For fuck sake.. this shit is still in early access. Released completely unfinished game.
Welp they got all laid off cuz Nate Simpson’s mismanagement and lack of income btw he has had a history of “serial grifting” every single game he touched and this game is no different they lied to us this whole time and now take two has laid off all 70 of them and they are sending out job applications :D they have killed kerbal for good not just ksp2 but any future for ksp… we’ve waited HALF A DECADE FOR A STEAMING PILE OF DOGSHIT
@@SmellyT03zI wonder if he takes the same group of useless devs everywhere he goes.
I kinda wish NASA and ESA would have dropped support of KSP2 or at least distanced themselves from the game.
That would have been the wakeup call Intercept Games and Take2 needed given how much of an educational tool the game is. But they'd probably just not care so idk.
I just don't see KSP2 having a Cyberpunk 2077-esque Redemption Arc. The game is a sequel to an indie darling that was far more stable and playable in it's early years in 2011 and 2012 than even now and as stated twice, it ruined KSP1's player base as well. The game will be done in what? 7-10 years? You could have developed an entirely new IP in that time and not despoil KSP. But Hollywood and AAA game studios only want safe bets so it would have done regardless. Plus by the time the game is done it'll be horribly dated from what it could have been unless they keep updating which version of Unity they use like KSP1 did
They released it into early access way too early. The appropriate EA release would be if it included the features of KSP1 but not the new features like base building and interstellar yet. Instead they released it with even basic features like science and re-entry heat missing. It was a very early alpha build. To release it in such a state tells me the studio ran out of money.
Saying "aplha" means nothing. The game is already past alpha and rsnting does not speed up game development.
Is the kerbal inside so they can just use a camera for the little portraits? Either way, awful optimizing.
Hi, I agree the game needs more time, hopefully they will have the budget to fully finish it. (I think the helmet is rendered in full detail, because in the top right corner you can see it up close and in full detail)
I'm not an active gamedeveloper anymore and even I could've written that optimization culling in about A WEEK. This is proof enough of how bad planned and lead is this project. I guess the devs were forced to improvise until the game reached this point of unstability.
welp, lets see in another 12 months 😂
"Do not disappoint me like today again"
Wow were you unaware of the bombshell that happened a month after this video lmao
yeah i was literally like WEEKS away from that news dropping... what timing I have!
My biggest issue with the game is the not that it was incomplete on release and its stagnant development. It was the year the devs spent making videos about how its better than ksp1 in every single way
Damn its already been a year
It sad that we know that top manage have mismanage their game and dev for hiding player for this game. You can blame the person and the contracts. They thought the got rich for release for but still broken. Reason is Noob team and the not the creator didn't knew about the next version 2.
geometry is cheap these days, rendering an extra kerbal or helmet won't make an impact
until ksp 2 reaches the levels of modded ksp 1 there is no point in buying it.
When are devs gonna learn that we don't like paying full price for a half finished product? There's Early Access, and there's flat out just not ready for launch. Pun intended.. "but we'll start accepting money for it!" It's up to us boys! Eventually, we just simply won't buy games at launch. Hell, I already don't. Nope.. never again! I wait like min 6 months, then look up reviews and see where it's at. That's actually exactly why I watched this video! Because patch notes can be vveeeeery misleading. So I do appreciate the update! Untill I think it's satisfactory.. or close enough to be worth the money.. in the focken wish list it stays! Fcuk your launch numbers! You fcuked that up, not me! Deliver what you promise! I want a finished product for my finished transaction. Not demanding perfection from an EA title.. that means kinks are still being worked out.. but functional is one of my demands. They're just abusing the siht outta that online updating, and have been since it became industry standard. I'm done trusting devs that I'm buying a playable product.. because 99 times out of 100 it's just not. They can lie and make excuses, but I really don't care anymore. Would they care about the reason I only gave them half the money? Don't think so. Only we can make them stop this bullsiht boys. I understand.. we're all excited and want it now.. but we both know we're just gonna end up bitter, disappointed and, we're gonna end up doing that waiting anyway.. so why not just hang on to that money untilit'sin an acceptable state? Look at Payday 3.. they pm just killed their franchise because they pulled similar BS.. and they're already selling DLC! For a barely (in some cases not functional) game. See yall in another year.
jesus, terryfing that such basic stuff is absolutely fucked. Did they outsource 99% game to some small indie company?
No, thst is just a straight up lie.
Thanks for the insight!
I didn't think my old PC was that bad... It still played most games great! But not KSP 2! I finally upgraded on a budget. I can't tell a difference in KSP 2. While I play KSP 1 on a junk laptop thats so old, it shouldn't be running windows 10! LOL
i just watched the video about occlusion and culling and i gotta say i think the rant is really kinda fair (as a layman)
"Missing" features. Ummm.. I think you misspelled future DLC.. bet money.
j'ai tellement de haine envers les dev de KSP2, les gars ils avaient juste à combiner tous les mods de ksp1 dans un truc beau et stable et nan, ils ont """arnaqué""" leur communauté jusqu'au trônions, au lieu de nous sortir des trailer mensonger claqué au sol, ils feraient bien de garder leur argent pour payer les dev et arrêter de promettre la mun, quand meme le read me est buggé. Cancer sur eux pour avoir tué la meilleur licence sur l'espace, et dir que j'ai eu mon job actuel en parlant de mes 600 heures sur ksp, je suis dégouté, je les hais
Please do this with citys skylines 2
I've had some suspicions
when you got to the helmet i actually had "jesus christ". How do they fuck up this badly? that could be fixed in a weekend!
Thanks for making this video. I've put about 1k hours into KSP and I've been thinking about buying this one. Seems like I should wait until they iron out some more bugs.
UE Nanite resolved it another way
Well everyone got kicked so we can kiss good bye to ksp 2
It's almost impossible the roadmap could be delivered if the game is not fully optimized. Just building a simple rocket and the game FPS is below 10. Imagine trying to get a space station or a outpost. Really sad. Even KSP with a single core CPU is doing better doh
All they had to do was deliver a decently performing/looking game with multiplayer. Just sandbox mode, with basic parts.
Everything else they could've worked on afterwards and mods would've filled in lack of content meanwhile.
Instead performance is ass, the biggest feature (multiplayer) is at the end of the roadmap but at least it looks better I guess so that's something?
I wish they just focused on getting a good core engine from the get go. Would've been a completely different launch.
Welp... I guess I'm waiting for another year till they optimize the game, if at all. 😅
"yes the game plays a little bit better" bro it's a night and day difference versus the release build, what are you talking about.
I'm talking about "versus ACTUALLY APPROPRIATE performance".
if youŗe happy that instead of 5FPS you get 10FPS: good for you, but being SATISFIED with such low levels is NOT alright with me!
@@TheYamiks it's not 5 Vs 10 it's more like 5 Vs 50, especially with as part numbers increase (which you obviously didn't test). Go watch Matt Lowne's video comparing release build Vs the current one and how he launches the craft in the first build and just leaves because it ran at less than 1 FPS.
@@yarost12 yeah... like I said : small improvements.
still below what is "OK" or even "good".
@@TheYamiks went from "unusable" to "enjoyable". 50 FPS is more than enough to enjoy KSP to it's fullest. Ofc the more the better (and I'm sure we will see more massive improvements) but saying that it's "small improvements" is ridiculous. Odyssey couldn't get that kind of boost since it released.
@@yarost12 lol that's when I realised this video had no interest in being made in good faith. Yes KSP 2 has been pretty disastrous and it's bizarre how rough it was, but to say that current day performance is basically equivalent to launch day is outright dishonest. It honestly feels like Yamiks didn't even play the latest release. Graphics, performance, everything really is massively better. Plus he went on a rant about how the Kerbals are rendered when you're flying your ship even though the idea is that you can look through your ship's windows and see them? Definitely feels like he's just trying to milk the KSP hate train still tbh. Made me unsub.
Forgot this game existed tbh. Played the first one... Loved it... Then found out about them collecting and selling peoples personal information, whether it was true or not, uninstalled. Then saw the dumpster fire of this one at launch and honestly forgot about it. Goes to show that a couple of missed steps if not handled correctly can really destroy all yours and your staffs hard work.
SPAAAACE
Once all the shit went down with the developer before the release I was already gone in terms of interest... I check back every once in a while to see if it's worth getting on a sale or something... Sadly doesn't look like it yet.
why are you not on there staff .... they ow you a package for solving there problem
sure it sucks that it wasn't released in the state that it should have been in. And that it still should be in a better state than it is right now. But i have lots of fun playing KSP 2 and i play it almost every day. I didn't fully agree with everything in this video, like i feel that you kinda glanced over the fact that so many bugs have been fixed, like wobbley rockets. otherwise i really enjoyed the video.
i refuse to believe they're redrawing the terrain every frame. i'd sooner believe they're switching out LODs every frame, which while still inperformant, is not nearly as bad
Why? This is exactly what '"procedural" means. You don't store the meshes but generate them on the fly. There is almost constant and may be high processing cost involved but you can have virtually infinite detail (otherwise not possible due to memory constraints). In KSP you can visit every centimeter on each planet. Such scale almost prohibits storing geometry if it's to be very detailed.
Thank you Star Citizen from curing me from pre-orders.
Glad I never purchased KSP 2!! I even stopped playing KSP 1!
Great video, came here to see if it was worth buying now. See you next year when MAYBE it is :) Really want the game to succeed, nothing like it
Hi Yamiks, whatever reason the game is slow is probably not because of the stuff you found DISTURBING. You actually can find this info in tools like render doc if you spend more time looking through it, but most of the time it end up being some boring stuff like large amount of unbatched draw calls repeated between color passes, so I suggest to not even bother.
Like HALF of the video is about performance, lets be frank, you could just have said it is slow, shit on the developers, and go on to the next topic. I was actually surprised about you knowing about tools like renderdoc, and also scared, because when people bring it up, you are either about to have a nice technical discussion, or hear the most braindead nonsense for the next minutes.
ABSOLUTELY FREAKING OUT about stuff like unculled geometry, unecessary polys or _checks notes_ "calculating depth buffer" (???) just tells that you (how can i put this nicely?) still didint looked through deep enough for the issues. Those kinds of performance problems are always due to the bigger picture, not specifics (unless we are in a yandere simulator toothbrush situation). To people that actually works with this stuff, it just sounds like arguments from someone that is either really excited about knowing how to pull up a graphics api trace, or likes to hate on anything it finds.
I know its not your plan to actually do unpaid work and find out what is wrong in the game, but the emphasis you put on the problems you find, and the solutions you gave make it sound like you think you know better than the devs, I know its not you want (hopefully), but its what it sounds like.
Don't get me wrong, I love the rants! but this aint it
You cant stage while time warping
long story short, dont buy it? stick to the first one? XD ok i can do that
I think the game has a lot of promiss. But even today, i found the game frustratingly buggy.
just look at the video and was thinking of it but need someone thought for up to this point and well. for me... still dose not worth my $50
Any chance you could analyze DCS too ?
im just a rando enthusiast, not a proffessional. you got same expertise as i do at this stage : so give it a go!
not new engine, same engine
I wonder if KSP 2 failed to be spiteful. I bet Nate Robinson/Simpons doesn't even exist.
7900xtx no probs and i want the kerbal rendert in my rockets get over it
At least in Kerbal 2 they have "Game Developers" and not those nerdy "Programmers" as in Kerbal 1 who only care about optimization and nerdy stuff like "rendering" the game at a playable framerate.
Maybe a few competent programmers would have greatly improved the performance at launch. Or a basic understanding of computers, data transfer and storage. Anyways I would have loved for Kerbal 2 to succeed, but without a timeline for the second update I really have no hope left.
What the f are you talking about? It's a massive team, hiring 1-2 more programmers wouldn't have changed anything.
> Or a basic understanding of computers, data transfer and storage.
Do you have any? You should apply, you'll surely fix all of the issues
@@yarost12 Yes, I have knowledge in these fields, but that should not matter here. They chose to release a product for the full price, full knowingly that the performance was not optimal while beforehand boasting about wanting to slay the kraken. It does also not help that they had a "massive" team and delayed the game for a few years even though the original release date was sometime in 2020.
Having a large team working on this game for a long time and still releasing a poorly optimized "alpha" for 50$/€ just screams bad management.
Also regenerating the terrain in every frame is really bad, and I do not believe that they would not catch such a mistake, however sending a lot of data to the GPU as well as not using different levels of detail for the props just screams that the some part in the management between the artists and programmers was not optimal.
In my own projects I also experimented with procedural generation and I can tell you that in Unity too it would be possible to generate the terrain geometry for example on the GPU as well using geometry shader and new mesh buffers. Keijiro Takahashi even build a marching cubes algorithm with exactly these shaders and buffers. It is not hard to adapt them for planes, octrees/quadtrees and to build the geometry (at least for rendering). The meshes for collision detection could also be computed on the CPU in lower resolution to reduce the cost, and even the procedural textures, should they not use tri-planar mapping, could be generated on the GPU by using RenderTextures.
Ok, it took me about half a year (as a side project) to get a working system which was also performant, but for real, if I can do that as a small side project and build a relatively efficient procedural system, I wonder what they were doing over all those years with a huge team of full time employees.
Sure, there is a lot of other stuff to work on, but if they change the release to "alpha" a few month before release just to excuse the bad performance, then they really dont care imho
Just because there is no immediate timeline does not mean you should give up hope. Patience is so rare nowadays.
I was about to ask a friend if the game was any better, i guess not
It is a lot better, if you stop hyperfixatung on everything thst makes you angry.
@@IvanRodriguez-tl2zr who said i was angry? Im more dissapointed
It's getting better for sure, performance is way better with my mid spec gaming laptop (lil toasty though as these laptops are) I over doubled my total playtime in the week after the science update and I've been around before that hell of launch. I have no doubt it will be better in the future. Right now it depends on your tolerance to random bugs that you need to f5 f9 to fix, also the AA isnt that great atm. The science update in december marked the beginning of the upward ascent to redemption after it was already on a steady slope up.
it is better but i still wouldn t recommand it to anyone
have things improved ? > NO
there i saved you 10min.
Give them some more time! The game has so much potential. I have a beefy GPU so it's playable, of course I miss the lack of fuel transfer ability...
The game has zero potential. It does nothing new,its in the same engine as the first, same limits. Essentially you can play a better version using KSP 1 and mods. KSP 2 is a a dead game
games dead lol
Any mods to bring the ksp2 space center to ksp1?
If you're going to make overly negative videos about KSP 2 only, may as well just ignore it and focus on something else instead of ranting on forever.
especially if he has to nitpick such details and lie... the game is a garbage and he still needs to find bs to explain it.
I think with the state of the game, how awful the launch was, and how even now a year from release it still hasn’t matched up to the original, he’s justified in ranting on about something he’s passionate about, especially when people willingly ignore issues with the game. Keep in mind that this game was also supposed to bring in more players to the franchise, and instead almost halved the player count on steam.
Lol. Keep coping
This has aged so well.
The studio just got permanently shut down and all devs got canned.
But yeah, this video was too negative for the flawless game
😏
I always return to Ksp1 after a couple of years,thinking "this time I'll learn this game"but after 20 hours of being unable to even reach the orbit I just rage-quit,telling to myself "I'm never gonna play this shit again".And here I am after 2 years again trying and rage-quiting again,...This game is truly something,..
Give it a chance in a year or 2, it is fsr from a lost cause.
pos game, well deserved
I played the game since 2017 KSP one this game has been in development since 2017 in KSP2 is still a massive disaster
That is just incorrect. Just ignore every update and say the game is the worst for the 50th time.
Bro you have a great CZcams voice. I’d love to see more videos with this format in the future
even I,myself, claim i got SHIT voice.
But thanks and no worries : i shall keep on keeping on!
Therefore, instead of all sorts of ineffective CEOs, testers, managers and other management positions, you simply hire one SUPERRIOR LATVIAN and your business will go uphill.
I barely get out of the bed in the morning and make silly videos... the fuck i know of leading a team or bureaucracy.
@@TheYamiks SUPERRIOR LATVIAN DNA gives you powers that you yourself don’t know until you try!
lol, the one Latvian TO RULE THEM ALL!
If only it was thst simple. It is not.
I really don't understand why they released ksp2 in an early access state I love ksp but I ain't buying until it's in a finished state, been there done that bought the t-shirt with ksp1
I guess we will just ignore that KSP 1launched in early access with much less content.
@@IvanRodriguez-tl2zr did you even read my comment? I'm well aware of the state of ksp1 when it came out but that was a little bit acceptable for a first game there's no excuse for ksp2 they shouldn't have rushed it out before it was a functional game
@IvanRodriguez-tl2zr that's no excuse, now they're a developed by a fucking triple A studio
@@IvanRodriguez-tl2zr just let it go dude. Everyone but you is disappointed in this game and it’s for a good reason.
Jet engines all have jet/rocket engines settings for some reason. This causes a hilarious bug forcing jets to randomly reverse thrust at takeoff trying to use nonexistent rocket components. Cant launch a single jet. For 50 bucks that's a downright scam