Texture & Tone. Rel Classic 98 Subwoofer Review.
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- čas přidán 16. 02. 2024
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REL Classic 98: rel.net/shop/powered-subwoofe...
I have reviewed many REL subs but these are my 2 fav videos:
REL T7X Review: • REL T7X Subwoofer Revi...
REL HT1003 MK2 Review: • Best small subwoofer o...
All my REL Reviews: czcams.com/users/results?searc...
Test Equipment:
Preamp & Power Amplifiers:
Kinki Studio EX-P7: www.kinki-studio.com/ex-p7
Kinki Studio EX-B7 mono blocks: www.kinki-studio.com/ex-b7
Hegel H190: www.hegel.com/en/products/int...
CHoco Sound EMEI: www.kinki-studio.com/product-...
Emotiva TA2: emotiva.com/products/basx-ta2...
Pathos Classic One MKIII: upscaleaudio.com/products/pat...
Source: Bluesound Node 2i or Cambridge MXN10 Streamer
www.cambridgeaudio.com/usa/en...
(all music is hi-res streamed from Tidal)
DAC: Denafrips Ares II or Ares 12th-1
www.vinshineaudio.com/product...
Speaker & Power Cables: Maze Audio Ref4
www.mazeaudio.com/speaker-cabl...
(rest in peace Kent)
Interconnect Cables:
Analysis Plus Oval One RCA
Oyaide Tunami Terzo XX V2 XLR
analysis.plus/product/oval-on...
Your results may vary based on your ears, room, and associated equipment. - Věda a technologie
Hitting like before the review is released cause I know Nemo and Rel never disappoint! 🤣
hey what's up bro!
Hey Nemo! Waiting for your take on this sub. It looks great!
Legit do this on every video of his but don’t for any other youtuber
@@user-gf7kj5vj3p REL hasn't made a sub in BK since before youtube existed my man.
Always enjoy your videos. I recently had a demo of both the Classic 98 and T9X. The latter was on sale so it was a tiny bit cheaper. While I loved the Classic 98, I found the T9X better for a broader range of music. I also have it off to the right of my living room. If I didn’t have the flexibility of space, I would’ve gone with the Classic because it beautifully matched my Wharfedale Evo 4.3 speakers and my nice Vybe Furniture record console. Great review as always! Your reviews helped seal the deal on the Rel.
Wow your review is featured in the weekly newsletter from Rel! You've made a bunch of awesome videos since I started watching! My first video was the Buchardt s400 (mk1 version). Keep it up man! I really appreciate your opinions as you are also a subwoofer lover.
oh nice! I'm glad you enjoy the content!!
Nemo, this one looks like my Rel Strata III from 20+ years ago and at the time it was a really good musical sub. Of course times have changed but your review brought back some nice memories. Keep up the great work, I really enjoy your channel....
Thanks very much for your thoughts and opinion from my question.After reading your reply I was so enlightened that cleared my mind of some hesitancy in going for the REL Classic 98.Next week I am going to buy this REL 98 in one high end audio store here in toronto,ontario.I d say never ask never know. Thanks again and continue your help among audio people who are confuse. More power on you
awesome! I'm happy you found the vid helpful!! Are you going to demo other things also or just the Classic 98?
Great review. Totally looking forward to the S510 review. I’m curious on your thoughts for a 13 x 16 foot room. Great review!
“Fall asleep”, haha, I love a good nap!
The back ground music is killing me. Love the new mic, sound is good and screen is not distracting.
I like the music added to the background. I suggest lowering it just slightly, maybe -4DB
really? I can barely hear the music when I play it back on my laptop, what did you watch the video on?
@@NemoPropaganda i watched this video using my Nad Viso HP70 wireless headphones. Maybe it's a dynamic range thing with the headphones since you have a harder time noticing the issue I'm hearing.
@@Sir_Corgerus ah, yeah that's very possible.
Very nice.. can’t wait for the s510 review
Thank you very much for the great review. Looking forward for your 10" Subs review
Thanks for the great overview of the Classic 98. I am trying to choose between the Classic 98 and the KEF KC62 for my small-medium size room. My use is 50/50 music/home theatre on 2.1 setup. My speakers are Totem Sky Towers (maybe soon to be upgraded). I love the looks of the Classic 98 (it would fit well looks-wise) but I think the KC62 might be more versatile across various uses? Do you have a preference for one or the other?
oh man, those are two niche, really unique, and really different subs, unfortunately I'm not familiar with Totem so I can't really make a suggestion in either direction. I have both of them here but I don't even know how I'd make a comparison between the two. The KC62 is a modern marvel of technology eeking out crazy extension from a tiny enclosure while the Classic 98 is a nod to old fashion craftsmanship, quality, and sound. I'd maybe wait until you upgrade your speakers, enjoy that for awhile, and then revisit the subwoofer topic.
Thank you kindly Nemo,, 🌟🙏🌟
When i was significantly newer to the hobby than i still am, i looked at driver size, extension spec, and wattage, in that order. Bass was bass.
Awesome review as usual :)
How does this compare with HT1205 (v1)?
the originaly 1205 is tonally neutral and mostly invisible when setup properly, it doesn't add anything except bass while the Classic 98 exists to add something more than just bass to the mix. If you want more tonal nuance and warmth, the Classic 98 will do that. If you want to keep things neutral the 1205 MK2 would make more sense.
Love your vids love your style nemo, but this time the background music was to distracting, maybe have it super quiet next time. Sorry to say. Hope to see you review ubr62, they didn't suit me, be intresting to see what you think? Keep up the good work 👍
we're experimenting, we'll see what happens but I will never be able to make everyone happy, some people say my videos are too simple and not engaging but if you make the video over the top some may find it distracting. I just mess around and have fun with it.
Just unboxed a Classic 98 and began intergration.
Its amazing using all vintage equipment.
Can't wait to really dial it in over the next week.
Speaker to be paired separately of course.
OHM Walsh 1's
Sansui SP 300's
OHM H's
ESS AMT 1 B's
Vandersteen 2C i's
Never used a sub in this room.
that sounds like a great system!!
Compliments on the background tunes. It definitely adds a touch of class to what is already a class act.
I've been called many things but this might be the first time I've been called classy :) thanks!
Great video, as always! I’m leaning towards the Classic 98 over the T9x for my Wharfdale Lintons, as I love a full-bodied, warm sound. I can currently pick up a T9x (open box) for 2/3 the price of a Classic 98 though… Tempting, but I’m doing my best to hold out for a sale on the Classic 98 :)
T9X is a great sub!
@@NemoPropagandaended up buying a Classic 98 at a discount, so just waiting for it to arrive now! It’ll be my first subwoofer :) Thanks for your review.
@@Z4d0k nice! hope you enjoy it :)
@@jerryjohnson4625this is my first subwoofer, so I don’t have anything to compare it to, but I’m loving the Classic 98 with my Lintons! I’ll never be without a subwoofer again. It has provided another layer of depth to the sound that has noticeably improved music and movies. It’s a clean, full-bodied sound that isn’t muddy at all. It’s got good drive, but with a smooth leading edge and no boominess (no idea what the correct terms are), which is a great match for the Lintons as they share a similar sonic signature to my ears.
One thing to note as a complete noob though, was that initially I was disappointed as the sub sounded bloated and slow. Turns out that was simply because I had it in a corner and right up against the wall. Now that I’ve moved it out of the corner and about a foot off the wall, it’s exactly what I’d hoped it would be :) Also, I initially had an issue with a constant hum, despite connecting the high level connectors the way REL suggested. Turns out my Leak 230 amp grounding screw didn’t work and there were no large chassis bolts, so I connected the black wire to left speaker negative and now it’s silent.
The Classic 98 sounds wonderful with my Linton 85's. Had it 6 days now and I love it. Bass is so Rich and looks very nice w/ the Wharfedales.
Any chance you'll be reviewing the Sonus Faber Gravis ll soon? I was 50/50 between that and the T9x to augment my Kef R3's, but now I'm slightly leaning towards the Classic98. There aren't much decent reviews on the Gravis.
I'm not familiar with that one, looks like white labled T9i.
It is very similar to the T9i. That is why I am so interested in how it stacks up to the T9x and Classic98. It has a bit more power and goes a little deeper than those two. Would be an interesting comparison.@@NemoPropaganda
The comparison between T9x (which I own 2) and S510 would be great. For my previous speakers - Dynaudio Contour 20 - Rel suggested T9x, but I upgraded to Fyne Audio F1.8 (which I lilterally love) and the speaker pairing tool suggets S510. I guess I blended my T9xs very nicely but would love to hear your thougts if it is worth the hassle to bring S510 for a test to my place.
email REL with you room dimensions and see what they say, if they still recommend an S510 and the cost is not an issue absolutely check one out. I love the T/x range and I fully expected the s510 would be the same simply with more extension but it's so much more. Much larger sense of scale, much more definition in the transients, I could list more but the simple fact is the S510 is a strong step up from the T9x which is hard to imagine until you experience it.
@@NemoPropaganda thanks. Yes it is a strong recommendation from Rel to go with 2xS510. The only thing that stops me is that they were released 5y ago. S3 / S5 (a predecessor) were replaced after 5y. It makes me wonder if by the end of the year or in 2025 they might release a new model. So you go either with a new model or get a nice discount.
@@Cameyo85 ah yes, that is always the struggle with tech. With my OLED TV's i made the decision to buy at the end of the year knowing the new one would be coming soon but feeling more comfortable with the discount on the out going model. It's hard to make decisions like this but its personal for everyone and depends on how much of a discount you get on the outgoing model. I remember series HT's end of life sale was absolutely incredible but I have a feeling if they update series S the outgoing model will not be discounted too much.
Looking forward to your Rel comparison video! Another video idea would be downfiring vs. front firing subs
I don’t have vintage speakers and I don’t listen to vintage music. I have a Olympica Nova 1 and listen to recordings from the mid 90’s onwards. Lots of chill out classics & lounge with vocals but not edm. How does the classic 98 improve the mids and soundstage compared to the T/9x? Are the differences subtle? I heard another reviewer say that the bass is much softer than punchy
Tough to answer my bro because one mans subtle difference may be another mans night/day difference. If you're stuck between the two I'd strongly suggest a dealer demo if possible.
That is a very nice looking subwoofer. Shame it's downfiring (i like to see the drivers) but still, very very nice.
Will match my Devore O/96 but they are still new to me and I'm undecided on adding subwoofers to them
that's smart of you! I think it's a good idea to understand what you have before making any changes.
Hi, how does this compare to the KEF KC 62? I assume they are very different. I have a KC62 today that I normally use for my LS50 Wireless with good result. I also have a pair of Sonus Faber Electa Amator 2´s and I think that the Classic 98 would be really good with them, would you agree ?
yeah they're totally different, the KC62 is all about crazy low extension out of an incredibly tiny form factor while the Classic 98 is more about texture and tone. I think you'll appreciate the contrast, each one is good but totally different subs.
Love the adjustments on the background being mostly static. Good compromise. However, the tunes distract from what you’re saying. I think it was better without. Had to stop the video. I thought I had some music still on in the background. :)
Just the classic 98 and I am planning to buy another one the moment we move to another house nearby.I really fell in love wit the classic 98 because of its color same as my ULD15 walnut.By the way it stop working normally since last night. The velodyne authorized service shop here in toronto advice me to retire it just relegate it as coffe table.I turned down his advice to buy another velodyne sub.I know the quality velodyne product quality after they discontinued the ULD series.But during their hayday they are the best.The saying goes if your subwoofer is not a veodyne ...you are not getting the right bass.M and K sub is the only viable competitor then.Now I am giving you a hint of my age a seniour retired and 70 yrs old and I still wanted to enjoy my next 10 yrs wit audio...Thanks again
nice, hope it all turns out perfect!! You're not wrong about the new velodyne, it's not the brand it used to be at all...
HI, I ve been using my Velodyne ULD 15 walnut in color for the past 20 yrs plus and I can hear its nearing its end. I am not sure if you were born already when this sub hit the market.s there any way you can compare this sub to the REL classic 98.By the way my next sub will be a REL.Your thoughs will be highly appreciated.More power on you
I will always apprecaite people thinking I'm younger than I am, that sub is close to the limit of my life but I was alive :) So that ULD15 was $1800 back in 1989, not cheap by any means!! With that said it's unlikely that a 10" will be able to play as loud or have the big sense of scale that the larger ULD has. With that said the little Classic 98 may bring you a level of texture & tone that the much older (and tired) ULD15 simply can't. Since REL is so widely sold I think it'd be worth your time to visit a dealer and listen to one. If the Classic 98 doesn't sound big enough maybe check out the S510 or consider a pair of classic 98's or T9X. Dual 10's are about equal to a single 15" and while a pair of Classic 98's are $2800 that's still cheaper than your ULD15 would be in todays money. Hope that helps!!
Which REL makes the best coffee table or foot stool
Coffee table? For sure a pair of 1510 pushed together, foot stool is gonna be the t7x with a nice cush pillow on top lol
What sub in the market has similar tonality with this but at a cheaper price ?
only one I can think of is the REL T5x, it's not the same of course but it's similar.
i think i'm going svs pb1000 :))@@NemoPropaganda
Off topic but would you review a soundbar?
no I wouldn't, I'm just not interested in them personally.
@@NemoPropaganda nothing wrong with that haha
I heard about this sub from rel, asking about sub for my Quad ESL speaker. Powered with valve amp. After this rewiew I think even more about it. See like coparing kawasaki and harley davidson for vintage guy... And before Esl's I use sealed speakers all my life. Is that woofer cleaner in bass like sealed speakers compared to basrefflex. OK I know there is good basrefflex speakers but I can hear that f. hole in box anytime 🙄
the classic 98 is sealed so there is no vent. Vented subs can have a bit of overhang, the Classic 98 does not have overhang, it's notes just have a little more bloom and it's tranisents are a little slowed down in favor of more bass texture & tone.
Captain Nemo, what are you thoughts on class D vs class A/B for sub amps? ☮️
I don't really have any thoughts on that topic. For the most part I view subwoofers as a complete unit and don't pay much attention to the collection of their parts unless something is problematic or really stands out.
@@NemoPropaganda That’s fair enough. My concern is that I’m contemplating a purchase of a pair of Rythmik F12’s and they are offered in the F12-400 Affordable with a 400 watt class D amp and the standard F12 with a 370 watt class A/B amp. I’m sure either will do their job, but one will do it better, most likely the standard version I would hope because of the higher cost. Just don’t know how much better without an A-B listening test, which will never happen in my room.
@@cyclistman6358 personally I bought the F12SE with a/b amp because I wanted the piano gloss finish. The F12-400 was designed for people that wanted an F12 at a slightly lower price so they replaced the AB amp with a class D unit. If you can afford the more expensive version I say go for it, that's the truest expression of the F12 but if money is tight then go for the class D version. It's still a rythmik sub so it's gonna be awesome either way. You can either afford the a/b version or you can't. If you think about it that way it really simplifies things, IE, get the one you can afford :)
@@NemoPropaganda After doing more research I’ve decided to purchase a pair of the F12G’s. GR Research designed paper driver. Designed as a dedicated music sub and will be perfect for my music only system. Lighter driver than the aluminum driver in the F12 for superior definition, transient response and handles a higher crossover point better as well, according to their site. I’m subbed to Danny’s channel at GR Research and he knows speakers and speaker design and I trust he’s designed a killer driver for this sub. He also has a detailed video on setting up the Rythmik amps. $2,380 to my door, for the pair with the upgraded spikes. That’s the price for one decent REL! I know you’re a car enthusiast, as am I. My current machine: 2017 MK7 GTI SE, dual clutch trans. Nicely modded by me. Lighter after market wheels on Conti DSW+, Z rated rubber. Stiffer rear sway bar (reduces understeer), Bilstein street performance dampers with lowering springs, about an inch + lower than stock. Various intake mods. Drilled and slotted rotors with performance street pads. She’s light at around 3K lbs and handles like a go cart on the street. You can push her hard into the corners and she doesn’t squeal or moan, stays composed. She loves it! The DCT is very quick and I only drive her in full manual mode all of the time with the paddles and floor shifter. You gotta row your own, even with the DCT. She’s quicker on the street than most, and will easily pass cars with a flick of the paddle and nudge on the throttle. Turbo spools up quickly and builds torque down low thanks to the intake mods. My first German performance car and a great street GT car, a twisty back road racer and a bit of a sleeper, which appeals to me. I think I heard you mention a BMW M series in one of your vids. Sounds interesting! Details? ☮️
@@cyclistman6358 respectuflly I'm not interested in talking about GR or Danny and I believe the correct version of the F12 is the metal cone version desgined by Brian himself, do what that information what you will. That sounds like an awesome car, I don't have an M4 myself but I probably mentioned one in some kind of analogy, I've had a ton of cars but my current one is a 2018 Audi S7, I've had it for 6 years now and I love it so much I can't imagine driving anything else. I had it tuned for awhile with resonator deletes but have since returned to using the stock ECU software and put the resonators back on. Only mods are a custom sub in the trunk, 21" 2pc wheels, CETE air ride controller, and the oem audi german front plate delete.
Nemo.... please tell me your getting the Buchardt sub.....
I requested 2 🥳
Wich subwoofer is best for music?
it doesn't really work that way, it's like asking whats the best car for racing.
Can I run off my power amp as pre hasn’t outputs? Thanks
yes
What about B.K. ELECTRONICS for this kind of sub ?
I don't think those are really available outside of england. I tried emailing them a few times but got ghosted.
@@NemoPropaganda They are available but it is true that they are kind of absent when you try to contact them.
@@user-gf7kj5vj3p Are they as good as REL to you ?
@@user-gf7kj5vj3p that was like 30 years ago.
Thanks for the review. Made for the "vintage or 'modern' vintage listener"? What does that even mean? Is that the same as "old listener or 'progressive' old listener"? Old being 40+ yo? 50+? 60+?LOL So you opine as to who it is made for, but why is it made for them? Is see you are presenting from what looks like a home theatre setup. So is the C98 geared toward the home theater or music audiophile? (both are very different) I suspect the C98 is for the pure music listener ('vintage' or not, except for perhaps electronic music as you indicate). I also suspect most home subs are targeted/consumed by the home theatre audiophile. Stereo music 'philes want subs to fill out lacking low end to existing setups (like small stand-mount speakers). I *think* the C98 is more suited for music philes and not home theater users who want/need that "PUNCH." That is what I think but I can't find many C98 reviewers that comment on those aspects. Thanks again!
vintage listner means you have old vintage speakers, modern/vintage means you have new style vintage speakers like KLH model 5 or something by FYNE Audio. No I do not have a home theater setup, my room is 2ch stereo only. All my subwoofer reviews are judging the subwoofers performance for 2ch music application, it's all I focus on.
V Vandersteen?
that would be a great match too!
Interesting that they used a class D instead of a class a/b. Really makes me wonder just what the hell the difference really is for subs using different amps. Even stranger that they would do it with a sub like this, with the idea being vintage style for vintage guys. I'd ASSUME they'd be looking for class a/b and full size dual high level in/outs for proper speaker wire/banana plugs (or even spades? Idk), but i don't really know much about that so I'm fully aware how far my assumptions are carrying me here.
could just be that they were trying to keep it within a certain price point, that often is a major factor. AB is much more expensive to produce.
@@NemoPropaganda i suppose, i'd love to ask an engineer how much different it made if they tested it. We gotta normalize systems to conversate with engineers in companies.
How it's for home cinema?
it's fairly compact so it's not going to shake the roof of your home off but it's still a proper subwoofer so it should be admirable. Though if theater is your focus I think you'd be happier with a pair of HT 1003 MK2.
@@NemoPropaganda it's more like 33/33/33 music/gaming/movies in small room. But hear you. I like how this sub looks
@@TimofejNenarokov i would for sure do a pair of 1003 mk2 in a system like that, trust me you won't regret it, games can have some awesome bass so it's more like 33% music and 67% tv duty is how I see it :) That's basically how my upstairs system is.
@@NemoPropaganda thank you!
I am both types of customer 😂 😂
If you are both types then I think you will enjoy T9X more :)
Hello Nemo, I really like your reviews and you have the amazing quality to clearly explain how something sounds!
I have found a subwoofer black hole on youtube and I need the bassmaster to clear it out. 😁
I'm a two-channel listener.
Now I have a REL T/7x that I really like, except for the room modes I have in my living room. I recently heard from Buchardt Audio they released the SUB10, a subwoofer with room-correction built in! A few hours of googling learned me that MartinLogan and Paradigm also have subwoofers with built in room correction.
So, the big question, how do they sound? Do they really improve your room modes or not? Are they high quality like the REL ones or are they just a cheap sub with some gimmick on them? Do you know any other brands who do this?
I can't think of anyone else to ask this to but Nemo Propaganda...
Thanks in advance
Hi bro, can you add a second sub? That usually helps tame room modes for most people. If not a sub with room correction may help but no it will not sound the same. Nothing sounds like a REL except another SQ sub like Rythmik but that's really it. I have never heard a DSP sub that sounded like a rythmik or a REL, part of their amazing tone comes from not using DSP. However if the room modes are very bad I suppose it's possible you're not getting the best out of your REL and it is possible another sub with room correction built in might actually sound better since you'll be able to get it setup better. The only way to know is to actually try it. I have not heard the buchardt sub yet so I can't comment but if I had to guess I'd imagine it will be more inline with something like the KEF KC62.
@@NemoPropaganda Thx for your clear answer and the time you're willing to take to answer me.
Maybe I'm thinking the wrong way, but how does another sub help with room modes? If you hear for example a room mode of 40 Hz, then two subs will even add more bass?
@@user-qu9pi5th7t I feel that my job is to help point people in the right direction but I leave the technical stuff to the dealers & manufacturers. With that said I would suggest you reach out to REL directly or the dealer you bought your REL from, I feel it is their job to explain these things :).
I understand the market but not for me won't match anything in the my room
nothing wrong with that.
I'm not sure that what im watching this on is anything close to flat measuring, but what i can say is that if it is, you may want to very much considering turning down that background music. My experience watching was that it was fighting you for my attention being at such similar volumes. I liked it, it will take some getting used to though. In my opinion i felt that the laid back music mixed with your lean, slightly speedy review style was a bit of a clash. Maybe something slightly more in tune with the pace and energy of the video could help, but this is definitely an opinionated nitpick. Lowering the music volume could legitimately fix all of it, or keep it from drawing attention to itself enough to matter.
a few people said the same thing but the volume of the music is super low when I listen on my phone or laptop, I think its way louder for people who use headphones, I dunno, I'll mess with it though.
@@NemoPropaganda could just be the frequency response of your laptop, you can try the video out of your phone speakers and tv system, focusing on setups/devices people are likely to use to watch your vids.