I do this in most of my runs. I do a lot of conquest wars and gobble up my neighbors before turning everyone else into either a vassal or using my words and diplomacy turning them into valuable allies.
When you are playing tall, remember to leave unoccupied systems for megastructures. Spamming habitats may force you to steal systems for megastructures, and it probably wont be at a ideal location.
Use systems that have few celestial bodies for ring worlds and Dyson spheres. Black holes are by nature secluded so go ham if you’ve got one for a decompressor, or use them all for decompressors if you want to phase out mining worlds. Also, habitats all the way in systems with habitable planets. Except for rings on said planets, of course.
You can place habitats and megastructures within the same system. You can even go as far as having a megastructure and a orbital orbit the same planet. (I tried this in my recent game when playing tall). You can also build a megastructure in your home system if you are using the shattered ring origin since the game doesnt view it as a proper ring world allowing you to build a additional megastructure (dont know if you can build a ring world in this system, i doubt it).
Subterranean Mega-Corp is my favourite way to play tall. You have access to unlimited minerals, which in turn gives you access to unlimited Alloys, then add to that the market, and voila, you're snowballing before you know it. Branch Offices do the rest.
@@grottoguru6473 Branch Offices to offset the early research penalty from subterranean, then building into Mercantile for consumer benefits, thus removing the need to build factory worlds altogether, and it’s more of a role play thing for me too, lol.
Before the habitat rework I would have argued that spamming habitats is not playing wide because you would still have dozens of "planets" within your little corner of the map But now that we're limited to one per system that's no longer an issue
Aquatic is very good for playing tall. Your pops inherently produce more base resources, you can get to 100% habitability faster, and most importantly, the Hydrocentric perk lets you expand all your ocean planets (which is usually ALL your planets) 3 sizes very cheaply.
This is my go to choice for when I play tall. Hydrocentric might not be an amazing perk in standard gameplay, but when you're playing tall it puts in serious work. Oceans become more efficient at basic resource production than Gaea Worlds, and the research and alloys production still moves to Ecumenopolis and Ring Worlds anyway, just like it does with any other empire. Hurts Habitats though, so you need to pick up a second species somewhere along the way.
Flooding your habitats also is fun The issue would be getting enough ice though You may "only" need one per habitat and three per planet, but that's still hard to come by if you aren't pushing your borders much I guess you could build little outposts in systems with ice and then abandon them later on (or maybe sell them to neighbours for profit)
Fun fact: put that tier 10 ring world to "Ringworld" designation and get a MASSIVE 71% bonus to pop growth, and a 40+% bonus to all job production. While you can't specialize a ring world for alloys to the degree you can with an Ecumenopolis, you can sometimes match the sheer productivity, or even exceed, that productivity with that generic "Ringworld" designation and level 10 ascension. That is because the Ecumenopolis bonus is tied to the planet's class and not its designation. So ascending an city world doesn't build on the 20% productivity bonus of the planet's class.
I tried playing tall several times, but it always end the same. A system that's just outside the zone I had in mind that's too good to pass or an archaeologist site shows up so I expand. Repeat until my borders are large
Thanks for the updated 'how-to'! I've actually been playing a style I call 'The One Sector Project'. No development or colonization more than 4 jumps from your home system. While this might still seem like a largish territory, it really comes down to RNG and luck if the systems in your range can be useful. Especially in large and huge galaxies with more AI empires, having just one sector to manage as your territory is a simple restricting guideline to help minimize your empire size/sprawl. It also means you don't have to worry about having many science ships, because once you've researched every anomaly and archeology site in your territory, you can either decommission them, or keep one or two to assist research if you have tech worlds.
After i get the snowball going i just automate all my planets except one, that one is where is make the strategic resources, bc automation always goes bonkers on those breaking even the strongest economies
I generally just have templates in my head of what to do instead of automation, I just call a planet "energy" or "tech" and only focus on that and sufficient amenities. this makes it so I dont need to make decisions. And if my economy is good enough I just spam 5 districts at a time, then not look at it for 20 years.
@@magerehenk7579 Similar here, even the naming structure. When I load the game I go through my list of worlds, put lot more districts and other things into queue, then forget about them for the next few hours. The only thing I am really annoyed at is upgrading buildings, but that is where auto works for me. Turn all other options off and just leave upgrade buildings on, so at least the buildings are upgraded as the tech goes up.
One of the other viable strategies for playing tall is to actually be a Bulwark vassal of a more powerful empire. You get a very large resource stipend for your sugar daddy overlord which scales as your bulwark tier increases, and your military can scale up with the bonuses you get. The free tech options are pretty nice too.
Try making a little pile of compost at the foot of your bed every night. Keep your feet dipped in, and get lots of natural sunlight! Keep well watered. You should see the effects in no time! You are a plant right?
I always enjoy playing a tall Megacorp with a Shaterred Ring origin. Starts with less than 20 systems, enough to get crucial choke points, then rush science while you build some fleets to conquer 1-2 vassals. Once you have them, you can starts switching base workers for specialized ones, raising science even higher than before. Then you steam roll until you get mega structures, at which point all of my systems became either a ring world if there was no planets, a series of ecunopolis (I often have 6-10 total) and the rest of the systems was spammed with as many habitats as possible (was prior to habitat rework and even overload so my plan might no longer works.
@@ulruc That's the problem on single player. The AI still sucks after 7 years which is very embarrassing for paradox. To make things worse for them, there are 1-2 moders who fxied the AI economy and military behaviour with mods like starnet or startech. Grand Admiral AI is the normal difficulty on other strategy games. You can just relay, roleplay and prepare for 25x crisis, because otherwise there is no challenge in the game. On of the reasons why stellaris never had much players.
@@unimportant719 First of all, the more you scout and the more you can build a starbase in a chokepoint. Early on, they can stop a lot of fleets while you build yours. At the same time, you must split your resources between planets, research ahd fleets. Having researches means nothing if another empire can conquer you up.
Montu, I understand that low pops mean low empire size, but I have only twice as big empire size effect while having 7k pops. I think that is more impressive than just having low pops
Now do a video on how to play wide. I tend to play pretty wide and are a massive blob on the map but I still have several vassals and everyone is an ally to me. Perfect for declaring the galactic imperium.
Surprised nobody's talking about pacifist ethics for tall play. You lose the ability to wage offensive wars of conquest, but you get +5 stability and -15% empire size from pops per point of pacifism. Pacifism also gives a cheap edict that gives +10 happiness for even more stability.
"You might- and I can't even believe I'm saying this, take Mastery of Nature" How times have changed, eh? Once upon a time, Mastery of Nature was the pick to rule them all...
If I can suggest a Megacorp build to screw around with while leaders are all the rage: Overtuned Origin, taking Gene Mentorship, Quick Learners, Talented, Enduring and your -2 of choice. Knowledge Mentorship and Ruthless Competition for Civics. You will have absolutely absurd leader experience gain and upkeep reductions. You only want the +25% Leader Experience Trait and no other Overtuned. Save those for modding in later, when you have more leader lifespan techs, etc. Damn the Consequences will push that to +50% Leader Experience. Both Council Positions are +Leader Experience -Leader Upkeep, though one is just better than the other. Paradox confirmed to be looking into that. Your leaders are also operating at +1 level because of Knowledge Mentorship.
On the subject of vassals, it can be effective to create your own vassals from your own sectors, playing wide in the begining of the game and then deleguate your land to your subjects, switching to tall in the mid to late game.
I always want to do this, and then the way galaxy generation goes I can't make vassals without it being one random planet unattached to the others. My vassals just would be the equivalent of city-states at that point.
I dont care much for playing tall but im no good at expansion before the AI sweeps up all the good systems so this video's helpful for pointing out all the ways to maximize points out of my meager holdings
Lol, same, or a large gaia world, or a ruined megastructure, or the only black hole in the neighborhood, or a juicy dig site ... etc. There is always an excuse to grab "just one more system/chokepoint", and when the AI grabs it first, well, that means war. I also just generally snake around way too much while expanding and spend most of the mid-game trying to fix the resulting border gore and filling in the gaps before the AI does, which is why I'm always choked for influence. I really should stop doing that.
Can you do an up to date video on how to manage vassels. Mine are 100 loyalty but this get broken up by rebels and my entire game is such a border gore i'm actually considering peacefully transforming everyone's planets to space dust
Nothing says fun like psionic feudal distinguished admirals. Your emperor is an admiral that starts the game at level 3, as does your military leader. Then spam 3-4 tiny fleets asap and give them admirals. Then bulk them out. Select for admirals with resources for that extra sweet leader spam.
Adding onto the other tips for people -- if you like playing Gestalt Empires, then playing Tall can be super-fun for you, especially when you get around to the Galactic Wonders Ascension Perk. Hive Minds & Machine Intelligences simply DON'T believe in Trade Value, meaning that as a Gestalt Consciousness; your Ring Worlds, Habitats and Ecumenopoli won't have Commercial Districts -- they'll get Generator Districts instead, allowing you further stabilization in the form of being more capable of maximizing your Energy Credits directly. Even so, if you're Gestalt and have Galactic Wonders -- it's probably a better idea to make a Dyson Sphere for your Energy Credits, but KEEP IN MIND; you CANNOT construct a Dyson Sphere in a system with habitable planets, and if you were planning on terraforming additional worlds to maximize your living space, you will remove all Terraforming Candidate modifiers in the system, and every rocky planet/moon will turn into Frozen/Barren worlds upon completion (because you're putting the system's Star in a box) -- so, Ring Worlds might be a much better idea for maximizing your Energy Credits in the long run if you're Gestalt.
You can stack to 85% empire size reduction from pops (fanatic pacifist, beacon of liberty, psionic theory, two traditions and the greater goods galactic community resolution). In that sense small empire size doesn't mean few pops. I also believe stacking pop empire size reduction and conquering ringworld from machine fallen empire is the theoretical fastest repeatable tech build in late game
The problem with doing this is that you're locking yourself into picking pacifist and wasting a civic pick on beacon of liberty when you could have instead just picked the planetary ascension civic, finished harmony and made a holy covenant federation for that 70% effect increase on planetary ascension, which decreases colony, district and pop size contribution by 85% on the planet if ascended 10 times and increases the other beneficial effects too.
It's odd that you didn't mention inward perfection, which for a number of people is the platonic deal of tall gameplay: instead of expansionism you curl up in your corner of a map and play sim city, using your enormous unity income to ascend all your planets. Do you not consider IP to be a viable choice, given that you're not exactly going to be going around vassalizing other empires?
For me playing tall is some kind of missing exploration aspect. Yes, you still can research anomalies in neutral space, though you won't benifit from thi extra resource. But, for some reason, you can do archeology only in your space. Really think paradoxes should do something about it. Some kind of Archeology/Exploration agreemants for vassal, or trade deals throug diplomacy. May be even some kind of stealth archelogy.
I personally think empire size should be reworked so that systems and planets count for far more and pops counts for less. It's far easier to manage 1 planet with a large population then it is to manage 10 colonies with low population
Whenever I decide to play tall, prepare my empire carefully think it over and find the proper chokepoints, i find out, there is no empire anywhere around and my plan is gone. So dont plan on it, if you want to play tall! :D
Every game I start by saying I'm gonna play tall. 5 seconds later. Oh look at that rare resource deposit. System with 20 mineral deposit. 10 years later it's like I'm at a buffet.
could work not meta but its playable like ive had like 3 or 2 worlds but owned the galaxy and with this new update that is viable with megacorp as megacorp only means higher planet empire size not just higher empire size now
Whenever I want to play Tall, I always go for the habitat origin and build as many habitats in this one system, making sure to have Fortress habitats with ftl inhibitors at the entrances of my area. It's pretty silly to see a singular habitat hold off an entire fleet xD
Hey, could there be a detailed gameplay vod of the early game for this playstyle. I often find myself lacking capacity to expand pops while trying to play tall. Finding myself just walled off from scaling up in mid game while having 3-6 planets. I always feel like I'm behind due to not having enough planet specializations to fill all the gaps. IE: one alloy, one CG, one mineral, one credit world and that already leaves refinery world out of the picture or how should I build up my first planets in the first place during early game. Said mid game wall often culminates into me being too far behind to get ecunomopolis or ringworlds up and running in any reasonable time etc. or having enough economy for habitats to produce any meaningful amount of resources.
Just need now a guide on how to play wide. Really. There are so many videos on how to play tall. None on how to play wide. ie without vassal states or federation. Just pure empire.
I use to only play wide when I mainly played the huge galaxy size. But then I was basically forced to play tall when I tried medium and now that game is the best and most fun game I have ever played in and the first game I became a galactic emporerer (Hivemind with organic reprocessing + spamming ringworlds = fuck ton of alloys and naval capacity due to Fortress colonies in both ringworlds and habitats + unyielding and supremacy = I was the main force in fighting the 25x scourge crisis which the only thing stopping me from fighting the next crisis cause I picked all is that I can't find the last stragglers)
I've been playing tall Crisis for awhile now. It's honestly a great way to play though I will have to stop you at terraforming your planets into city worlds. You'll need those minerals that they provide and city/ring worlds don't provide minerals so don't build that many. Now you could get your vassal to pay you the minerals but relying on them for supplies is a weak point that I'd advise against. Furthermore you promoted shared destiny I have to stand against that you'd be better off with feudal society as not only will vassals not care if you have more of them but they'll also get additional loyalty generated from it while freeing up a perk slot for something else.
The only problem is any strategy for playing tall ALSO works EVEN BETTER for playing Wide. there is no TALL strategy that doesn't work better by getting bigger..
I disagree. After so many times of trying to keep my empire a bit limited in my playthroughs and this most recent campaign where I gave in to annexing vassals because the game put me right next to my friend who was just gobbling up literally everyone in 0 seconds flat, I find my empire is an absolute hot mess I can't manage to save my life, tech and traditions take an absolute eternity to come out, I haven't even been able to begin ascending my planets yet, and we're well into the midgame. My friend is also having a ton of issues managing his empire which at this point is like Rome at its height in terms of its size, and is just as dysfunctional internally. I never had any of these issues when playing tall, or at least somewhat tall. I never really strictly adhered to any arbitrary standard of what is tall vs. what is wide, so my empires were probably a bit wider than most people would consider "tall", but nine times out of ten I'd be vassalizing or federating my neighbors, not annexing them. The game was infinitely more manageable and fun to me, not to mention I got to interact with more game mechanics like vassals and federations.
I'd like a video about Vassals and Vassal-agreements. What are good agreements in general? Are holding on their planets good? I generall have no idea what to build there, so I go with "0" in my agreements because it improves loyalty. And it seems that I can most of the time only pick protectorate? It seems like how I handle my vassals seems to be severly lacking...
I'm late to reply to this, but after you start the vassalization you can negotiate the agreement later on and that's where you can specialize them. Prospectorium for resources, bulwark for military bonuses to you, etc. Personally I'll look at what traits their founder species has. If they have Intelligent I'll go for the research specialization, if they have resource traits I'll go for a resource specialization, etc. As for holdings, you might get a malus for having a number on holdings but some buildings can actually increase your monthly loyalty gain, things like aid office and the like. Holdings are literally you using one of their planets and their workers to work a job that gives you the output, sometimes at the expense of the vassal (which reduces loyalty) or sometimes a mutually beneficial one (raises loyalty). For instance, two of my vassals in my current game have Intelligent so I've specialized them as Scholariums and put Ministry of Science holdings on them. Research go brrt.
@@spikem5950 Thank you very much! I appreciate your response a lot and in my next playthrough I'll now be able to handle my vassals much more efficiently :)
crime megacorps are better than regular megacorps btw since if there is another megacorp in the galaxy try getting a commercial pact before they took all the good planets
This is the one thing that frustrates me about playing a megacorp. I hate it when an AI plays it aswel, they are always faster with finding the good planets.
Seems like you're sleeping on how effective spiritualism is for playing tall. Ascenscionsists/Gigacorp civic plus a spiritualist federation(holy covenant?) give a total of +45% ascension effect, taking that 61% to 92%. This affects both size and other effects. The civic, I can kinda understand not taking, other civics can be valuable too, but the federation type seems like a no brainer to me.
Cool, great video, now do it for gigastructures. Actually Montu I'd love to see you deep dive into stellaris mods. I'm aware of the issues but covering some of the lore/systems from the major mods would be a breath of fresh air. There isn't a lot of content like this in the stellaris youtube community.
The Tallest Build I had managed was a Voidborn Megacorb that initially only had 2 Star Systems and later took all of the L-Cluster and some systems with L-Gate Portals It was when Voidborn still gave you 3 Habitats. Don't think this would be possible in the newest Version of Stellaris. Only survived early game, because I allied with everyone I saw and focused hard on spacestation tech.
Megastructures are a staple of all Tall Empires, but it's clear to keep in mind that each Megastructure comes with its own building constraints, and that building the wrong Megastructure in the right place can really restrict just how Tall you can become -- especially when it comes to the Galactic Wonders. Even if you're desperate for Energy Credits and are seeking to build Reactor Habitats; NEVER BUILD YOUR HABITATS AROUND A SYSTEM'S STAR -- the Ring World & Dyson Sphere can ONLY be built around a System's Star, so you need to remember to keep that open if you're gunning for the Galactic Wonders. Mega Shipyards also can only be built in single-star systems, and the Quantum Catapult needs a special pulsar or neutron star to be built. Try to reserve a System with ZERO Planets for your Dyson Sphere or Ring World, and DON'T build Habitats there, either -- completing these Galactic Wonders will remove all Planets from the system (Ring World) OR make all Terraforming Candidates unusable (Dyson Sphere) anyway; building Habitats in every system prior to getting the Galactic Wonders Ascension Perk is an easy way to eat up all potential real estate for Galactic Wonders (the game won't even let you build them in systems with Habitats). Also, if you happen to get a Black Hole system; don't try to build Habitats there, either -- it's the only place the Matter Decompressor can be built.
I only play tall and I will tell you what I do one science one construction 1 to 3 planets usually no special planets and ring worlds leaders are not important habitats are required slaves and federations are not used but megacorps are used expansion traditions are not used same and mastery of nature is also not used
I prefer Clone Army Death Cult for playing tall. I focus my clone soldiers on unity/technology rush and alloy production while the vassals provide the basic resources. The sacrifice of pops gives them happyness so that I do not have to care about ameneties.
The vassal system in Stellaris is hella broke=[ You get insane recourses from them, once you get one you can just snowball your way to vassalizing everyone.
aka.. :P It is not a good idea to build 5 ring worlds, and only have those 5 systems. 'cause you can easily end up with 5,000 pops. D: Think of the food!
Just starting the video, hopefully this might give an option where playing tall is fun. Paradox constantly tries to kill playing wide when that is all I want to do! All vassals still broke AF where they will suddenly upgrade and then somehow you have to pay them 30%? I generally don't let them get large enough, or ditch them when that happens. Terrible mechanic.
Probably is helpful too, but the main reason to go aquatic is the bonuses you get from being on ocean worlds. You don't get those bonuses when on Gaia worlds (I don't think so at least, so feel free to check) and the bonuses to being on Gaia worlds for anything other than your pops, is too steep to pay when wanting to go tall since you need the other species to help prop up your econ. Not to mention, the best planet type in the game being the Ecumenopolis, you lose all your bonuses for sure when using that typing. So basically, helpful earlier in the game to for getting you set up, but as you get later and later, it starts being less and less impactful.
@sirix500111 right didn't think of that. I am really bad about not making migration treaties. I almost never play tall, I use aquatic and teraform everything i can into the ocean. i usually take one other race or even better synthetics i build and make them full citizens and let them live on my Eucomonopolis worlds. So often, j will only have my most advanced robots with full citizen rights to avoid uprisings and my main species. When I play spiritualism, I may have a lot of other species, but they are usually "prisoners with jobs," as montu calls them. I will have to try a real tall run soon, I love playing tall in ck3. I'd rather play CK3 tall than Map paint huge empires.
What if they made the mastery of nature, have a penalty to too much empire size at the trade off, of having a special district like plus one size to any district in +'/.15 or something like that.
so in traduction playing tall is just having vassals to be as large as playing wide and stacking bonus that you try to have regardless but with the limitation of having your name in very little
Yes. Playing tall is effectively like playing as the Papal States. You're Rome, biggest, richest and most influential city in the world, but your borders don't extend past that at all. Despite this, your hegemony extends so far out that all of Christendom is really your empire in all but name, they're just self-governed.
I have no idea why are you calling habitats tall. Its even less efficient then actuall planet, only difference is that you have a bit less land and so its much more eazy to defend, empire size penalty mostly goes frome nomber of planets and pops. Really tall bild is going into ecumenopolis and ring worlds.
lol Expansion seems so counter intuitive, since it's the tradition about going wide and grabbing lots of territory/planets I don't think that 1 district as a finisher is worth the investment for tall.
What makes expansion great is actually the empire size bonus for planets and districts. Combined with imperial perogative means you'll be at - 75% empire size per colony. If you have 10 colonies, that means you'll save 80 empire size (reducing tech cost by 10%) this is probably more potent then the research bonuses from discovery or the research Ascension perk.
@@jasonquigley2633 Yeah good for going wide. But 10 colonies is a bit much to still call it tall. But also not as strong as you think. You reducing the malus, not the tech cost. So instead of 88% more tech cost for example you'll have 80%. This ends up being 4,5% less tech cost.
@@Fallenangel_85 it depends. The closer you keep yourself to 100 the more potent it is. I have a game in 2270, where I have 7 colonies and about 200 pops and 150 empire size. I'd say that's working quite well. The key long term is to push most of your pops onto a small number of planets that you can ascend, which can push per pop empire size to nearly nothing. You then use your other colonies just to grow pops and then you migrate them to your big planets. So you could have 10 or 20 planets, but 3/4 of your planets only have 2 or 3 pops on them.
@@jasonquigley2633 That's how I played tall back before habitats got changed :) But a huge part of your Empire size comes from Pops already. Domination would get you -10% empire size from pops, which will become pretty strong over time and the ability to go Hegemony. Harmony gives another 10% less from pops. Which will all stacks with ascention and other traits.
@@Fallenangel_85 With Psionic theory, Harmony and Domination you get -30% from pops. 10 level of ascension, enhanced by harmony and the civic gets you ~-70% more. Governor skill also gets you another 10-20%. So there are multiple ways to get to -100% empire size from pops on individual planets. Aptitude also gives your governor -2 empire size per level. If you can eliminate the empire size from pops on your main worlds (and realistically, you probably won't need more then 500 pops to beat grand admiral AI, and those can fit on just 3 or 4 worlds), then your main source of empire source remaining will be systems and colonies. So it's absolutely possible to stay for the majority of your game at under 200 empire size.
Why be tall or wide when you can be tall AND wide
Or put another way, be thicc
Exactly
That's called obesity.
Everyone knows it's GIRTH that matters.
I do this in most of my runs. I do a lot of conquest wars and gobble up my neighbors before turning everyone else into either a vassal or using my words and diplomacy turning them into valuable allies.
When you are playing tall, remember to leave unoccupied systems for megastructures. Spamming habitats may force you to steal systems for megastructures, and it probably wont be at a ideal location.
Use systems that have few celestial bodies for ring worlds and Dyson spheres.
Black holes are by nature secluded so go ham if you’ve got one for a decompressor, or use them all for decompressors if you want to phase out mining worlds.
Also, habitats all the way in systems with habitable planets. Except for rings on said planets, of course.
@@drunkengibberish1143 Its been a while but wasnt there a limit of 1 decompresser empirewide? I dont remember being able to make more than 1.
@@cheato1163 i think the contingency relic allows a second one? But that is very late game.
You can place habitats and megastructures within the same system. You can even go as far as having a megastructure and a orbital orbit the same planet. (I tried this in my recent game when playing tall). You can also build a megastructure in your home system if you are using the shattered ring origin since the game doesnt view it as a proper ring world allowing you to build a additional megastructure (dont know if you can build a ring world in this system, i doubt it).
@@Lethal_Virusringception
Subterranean Mega-Corp is my favourite way to play tall. You have access to unlimited minerals, which in turn gives you access to unlimited Alloys, then add to that the market, and voila, you're snowballing before you know it. Branch Offices do the rest.
Btw trade is dead
space dwarf megacorp ftw !
@@JeRicotta ROCK AND STONE
I'm confused how that goes with megacorp?
@@grottoguru6473 Branch Offices to offset the early research penalty from subterranean, then building into Mercantile for consumer benefits, thus removing the need to build factory worlds altogether, and it’s more of a role play thing for me too, lol.
Before the habitat rework I would have argued that spamming habitats is not playing wide because you would still have dozens of "planets" within your little corner of the map
But now that we're limited to one per system that's no longer an issue
Except with the habitat nerf of 3.9.3 (on top of the habitat nerf of 3.9) the play habitats is to spam them in every system, essentially going wide.
@@franslair2199 that's still less colonies than previously
Also if you're playing tall you don't have many systems in the first place
Before I'd consider habitat spam as "deep". Your empire still bloated, but inwards. Now it is much closer to tall build.
@@Rybakov22bucket empire fr
Aquatic is very good for playing tall. Your pops inherently produce more base resources, you can get to 100% habitability faster, and most importantly, the Hydrocentric perk lets you expand all your ocean planets (which is usually ALL your planets) 3 sizes very cheaply.
I guess maybe this should be called playing "Deep" rather than tall? :P
This is my go to choice for when I play tall. Hydrocentric might not be an amazing perk in standard gameplay, but when you're playing tall it puts in serious work. Oceans become more efficient at basic resource production than Gaea Worlds, and the research and alloys production still moves to Ecumenopolis and Ring Worlds anyway, just like it does with any other empire. Hurts Habitats though, so you need to pick up a second species somewhere along the way.
Flooding your habitats also is fun
The issue would be getting enough ice though
You may "only" need one per habitat and three per planet, but that's still hard to come by if you aren't pushing your borders much
I guess you could build little outposts in systems with ice and then abandon them later on (or maybe sell them to neighbours for profit)
@@letsplaysvonaja1714war is a great way to garner ice, do it on fringe systems and take easy resources.
@@schroecat1 How about just go for genetic ascension and 'modify' a subspecies for dwelling in space?
Fun fact: put that tier 10 ring world to "Ringworld" designation and get a MASSIVE 71% bonus to pop growth, and a 40+% bonus to all job production. While you can't specialize a ring world for alloys to the degree you can with an Ecumenopolis, you can sometimes match the sheer productivity, or even exceed, that productivity with that generic "Ringworld" designation and level 10 ascension. That is because the Ecumenopolis bonus is tied to the planet's class and not its designation. So ascending an city world doesn't build on the 20% productivity bonus of the planet's class.
note: branch office increase a little bit the empire size, but definitly worth it
11:15
I just noticed the Caravaners in the lower left corner there. Good to see they took the defensive option!
😂😂😂 wow
Lmaoo that's one hell of a choke point
Number 1 priority for me when playing tall is building matter deconpressor and dyson sphere. After that every empire is the same economy wise.
I tried playing tall several times, but it always end the same. A system that's just outside the zone I had in mind that's too good to pass or an archaeologist site shows up so I expand. Repeat until my borders are large
You always could take the system to dig, then abandon the system to keep empire size low.
Or continue expanding and say you play tall by having only 1 galaxy 🤣
Thanks for the updated 'how-to'! I've actually been playing a style I call 'The One Sector Project'. No development or colonization more than 4 jumps from your home system. While this might still seem like a largish territory, it really comes down to RNG and luck if the systems in your range can be useful. Especially in large and huge galaxies with more AI empires, having just one sector to manage as your territory is a simple restricting guideline to help minimize your empire size/sprawl. It also means you don't have to worry about having many science ships, because once you've researched every anomaly and archeology site in your territory, you can either decommission them, or keep one or two to assist research if you have tech worlds.
Definitely giving this a try next time I play. I got quite tired of Stellaris because during the endgame I have so many worlds to manage.
After i get the snowball going i just automate all my planets except one, that one is where is make the strategic resources, bc automation always goes bonkers on those breaking even the strongest economies
I generally just have templates in my head of what to do instead of automation, I just call a planet "energy" or "tech" and only focus on that and sufficient amenities. this makes it so I dont need to make decisions.
And if my economy is good enough I just spam 5 districts at a time, then not look at it for 20 years.
@@magerehenk7579
Similar here, even the naming structure.
When I load the game I go through my list of worlds, put lot more districts and other things into queue, then forget about them for the next few hours. The only thing I am really annoyed at is upgrading buildings, but that is where auto works for me. Turn all other options off and just leave upgrade buildings on, so at least the buildings are upgraded as the tech goes up.
i'm just trying to (as a new player) build a fortress state where i can hold off all three crisis
@@magerehenk7579 exactly me.
How to play tall:
1)open step ladder
2)place laptop/monitor at top
3)climb
4)enjoy
What about playing wide
Get food, get thicc. Conquer galaxy. @@aneural
@@JacopoSkydweller ✓overfeed population
✓ enforce thickness
✓???
✓profit
Will do!
@@aneural That's a widescreen triple-monitor setup.
@@aneural
1. Get a wide table
2. Get multiple monitors
3. Stack them side by side
4. Profit
One of the other viable strategies for playing tall is to actually be a Bulwark vassal of a more powerful empire. You get a very large resource stipend for your sugar daddy overlord which scales as your bulwark tier increases, and your military can scale up with the bonuses you get.
The free tech options are pretty nice too.
Challenge: Play tall like this but without vassals.
Megacorp >w
Mega Corps + Energy economy focus.
You just buy all the alloys you need from the market and focus heavily on trade.
@@MatthewChenault you could also outsource your combat power to mercenary enclaves which you only hire when war is actually at the door
Me: I am going to play wide this game.
Literally 2 or 3 jumps in any direction: Death.
Me: I should see if Montu has a guide on playing tall.
Tall + Wide = "It's not just big... It's large."
Now tell me how to be tall in real life 🙏
Try making a little pile of compost at the foot of your bed every night. Keep your feet dipped in, and get lots of natural sunlight! Keep well watered. You should see the effects in no time!
You are a plant right?
*plantoid, I think they prefer to be called Montu 🪴🌱
Legend has it that after this wonderful, Alex has grown to be a tree at blistering speeds.
@@MontuPlays based plantoid
No
jokes on you i already always take mastery of nature cus i like maximizing planets
I always enjoy playing a tall Megacorp with a Shaterred Ring origin. Starts with less than 20 systems, enough to get crucial choke points, then rush science while you build some fleets to conquer 1-2 vassals. Once you have them, you can starts switching base workers for specialized ones, raising science even higher than before. Then you steam roll until you get mega structures, at which point all of my systems became either a ring world if there was no planets, a series of ecunopolis (I often have 6-10 total) and the rest of the systems was spammed with as many habitats as possible (was prior to habitat rework and even overload so my plan might no longer works.
I stop working with habitats due to low habitability that said if you have robot pops to throw onto them that works just fine.
@tylerbanns9515 if this was for me, no, i play on grand admiral with crisis at 25x
@@ulruc That's the problem on single player. The AI still sucks after 7 years which is very embarrassing for paradox. To make things worse for them, there are 1-2 moders who fxied the AI economy and military behaviour with mods like starnet or startech. Grand Admiral AI is the normal difficulty on other strategy games. You can just relay, roleplay and prepare for 25x crisis, because otherwise there is no challenge in the game. On of the reasons why stellaris never had much players.
How you defeat AI early game?
I am new and have not got it yet i usually just sit in my corner and build my megastructures
@@unimportant719 First of all, the more you scout and the more you can build a starbase in a chokepoint. Early on, they can stop a lot of fleets while you build yours.
At the same time, you must split your resources between planets, research ahd fleets. Having researches means nothing if another empire can conquer you up.
Montu, I understand that low pops mean low empire size, but I have only twice as big empire size effect while having 7k pops. I think that is more impressive than just having low pops
Can you explain that? How could you have 7k pops and less than 1K empire size?
@@wastedthyme-thegame he's playing the imperium of man
Now do a video on how to play wide. I tend to play pretty wide and are a massive blob on the map but I still have several vassals and everyone is an ally to me. Perfect for declaring the galactic imperium.
Surprised nobody's talking about pacifist ethics for tall play. You lose the ability to wage offensive wars of conquest, but you get +5 stability and -15% empire size from pops per point of pacifism. Pacifism also gives a cheap edict that gives +10 happiness for even more stability.
How do you get vassals as a pacifist though?
Diplomacy?😊
Using vassals is just another way of playing wide to my mind: you are just outsourcing your empire sprawl.
My man delivers intelligent content, on things I enjoy watching & playing.
This is why I'm a fan 👏👍
Npc
@@reginaschmid1685 Bot, you mean? No, I usually play as Spiritual or Egalitarian, so no Robo ascension for me! 😆
(Did I pass your captcha test?)
@MurseSamson you said that thanks generic that's why
"You might- and I can't even believe I'm saying this, take Mastery of Nature"
How times have changed, eh? Once upon a time, Mastery of Nature was the pick to rule them all...
If I can suggest a Megacorp build to screw around with while leaders are all the rage: Overtuned Origin, taking Gene Mentorship, Quick Learners, Talented, Enduring and your -2 of choice. Knowledge Mentorship and Ruthless Competition for Civics. You will have absolutely absurd leader experience gain and upkeep reductions. You only want the +25% Leader Experience Trait and no other Overtuned. Save those for modding in later, when you have more leader lifespan techs, etc. Damn the Consequences will push that to +50% Leader Experience. Both Council Positions are +Leader Experience -Leader Upkeep, though one is just better than the other. Paradox confirmed to be looking into that. Your leaders are also operating at +1 level because of Knowledge Mentorship.
Only seconds in but it seems like a great video already Montu!
On the subject of vassals, it can be effective to create your own vassals from your own sectors, playing wide in the begining of the game and then deleguate your land to your subjects, switching to tall in the mid to late game.
I always want to do this, and then the way galaxy generation goes I can't make vassals without it being one random planet unattached to the others. My vassals just would be the equivalent of city-states at that point.
I dont care much for playing tall but im no good at expansion before the AI sweeps up all the good systems so this video's helpful for pointing out all the ways to maximize points out of my meager holdings
Everytime I start a game "This time I will play tall....ooohhh Relic world mine mine mine must have , its only 10 jumps away"
Lol, same, or a large gaia world, or a ruined megastructure, or the only black hole in the neighborhood, or a juicy dig site ... etc.
There is always an excuse to grab "just one more system/chokepoint", and when the AI grabs it first, well, that means war. I also just generally snake around way too much while expanding and spend most of the mid-game trying to fix the resulting border gore and filling in the gaps before the AI does, which is why I'm always choked for influence. I really should stop doing that.
Can you do an up to date video on how to manage vassels. Mine are 100 loyalty but this get broken up by rebels and my entire game is such a border gore i'm actually considering peacefully transforming everyone's planets to space dust
Does having around 50-60 systems on a 1000 star map count as being Tall?
Nothing says fun like psionic feudal distinguished admirals. Your emperor is an admiral that starts the game at level 3, as does your military leader. Then spam 3-4 tiny fleets asap and give them admirals. Then bulk them out. Select for admirals with resources for that extra sweet leader spam.
Adding onto the other tips for people -- if you like playing Gestalt Empires, then playing Tall can be super-fun for you, especially when you get around to the Galactic Wonders Ascension Perk. Hive Minds & Machine Intelligences simply DON'T believe in Trade Value, meaning that as a Gestalt Consciousness; your Ring Worlds, Habitats and Ecumenopoli won't have Commercial Districts -- they'll get Generator Districts instead, allowing you further stabilization in the form of being more capable of maximizing your Energy Credits directly.
Even so, if you're Gestalt and have Galactic Wonders -- it's probably a better idea to make a Dyson Sphere for your Energy Credits, but KEEP IN MIND; you CANNOT construct a Dyson Sphere in a system with habitable planets, and if you were planning on terraforming additional worlds to maximize your living space, you will remove all Terraforming Candidate modifiers in the system, and every rocky planet/moon will turn into Frozen/Barren worlds upon completion (because you're putting the system's Star in a box) -- so, Ring Worlds might be a much better idea for maximizing your Energy Credits in the long run if you're Gestalt.
I always play so tall and wide that you could call me a whale.
You can stack to 85% empire size reduction from pops (fanatic pacifist, beacon of liberty, psionic theory, two traditions and the greater goods galactic community resolution). In that sense small empire size doesn't mean few pops. I also believe stacking pop empire size reduction and conquering ringworld from machine fallen empire is the theoretical fastest repeatable tech build in late game
The problem with doing this is that you're locking yourself into picking pacifist and wasting a civic pick on beacon of liberty when you could have instead just picked the planetary ascension civic, finished harmony and made a holy covenant federation for that 70% effect increase on planetary ascension, which decreases colony, district and pop size contribution by 85% on the planet if ascended 10 times and increases the other beneficial effects too.
It's odd that you didn't mention inward perfection, which for a number of people is the platonic deal of tall gameplay: instead of expansionism you curl up in your corner of a map and play sim city, using your enormous unity income to ascend all your planets.
Do you not consider IP to be a viable choice, given that you're not exactly going to be going around vassalizing other empires?
For me playing tall is some kind of missing exploration aspect. Yes, you still can research anomalies in neutral space, though you won't benifit from thi extra resource. But, for some reason, you can do archeology only in your space. Really think paradoxes should do something about it. Some kind of Archeology/Exploration agreemants for vassal, or trade deals throug diplomacy. May be even some kind of stealth archelogy.
Build starbase, dig the site, abandon the outpost.
Harmony and the ascensionist civc will further increase planetary ascension effects
I have never understood in Stellaris having a bunch of people making science harder that's like exactly the opposite of how innovation works
I personally think empire size should be reworked so that systems and planets count for far more and pops counts for less. It's far easier to manage 1 planet with a large population then it is to manage 10 colonies with low population
Whenever I decide to play tall, prepare my empire carefully think it over and find the proper chokepoints, i find out, there is no empire anywhere around and my plan is gone. So dont plan on it, if you want to play tall! :D
Tall mega corp empires = space venice
VOC
Both Mastery of Nature and Expansion tradition scale with how many planets you have - they’d in theory be better in hands of wide player.
The same is true for everything in tall. Anything tall can do, wide can generally do better. Except empire size.
@@MontuPlayssome bonuses don't scale better with more planets though. You should focus on those when playing tall
I love things that are titled like this because I can tease my shory friends by just sending stuff to them.
Every game I start by saying I'm gonna play tall. 5 seconds later. Oh look at that rare resource deposit. System with 20 mineral deposit. 10 years later it's like I'm at a buffet.
My problem is I want to play Australia, that is to say massive territory but few planets/low pop. Whch just don't work.
could work not meta but its playable like ive had like 3 or 2 worlds but owned the galaxy and with this new update that is viable with megacorp as megacorp only means higher planet empire size not just higher empire size now
Whenever I want to play Tall, I always go for the habitat origin and build as many habitats in this one system, making sure to have Fortress habitats with ftl inhibitors at the entrances of my area. It's pretty silly to see a singular habitat hold off an entire fleet xD
Hey, could there be a detailed gameplay vod of the early game for this playstyle. I often find myself lacking capacity to expand pops while trying to play tall. Finding myself just walled off from scaling up in mid game while having 3-6 planets. I always feel like I'm behind due to not having enough planet specializations to fill all the gaps. IE: one alloy, one CG, one mineral, one credit world and that already leaves refinery world out of the picture or how should I build up my first planets in the first place during early game.
Said mid game wall often culminates into me being too far behind to get ecunomopolis or ringworlds up and running in any reasonable time etc. or having enough economy for habitats to produce any meaningful amount of resources.
Just need now a guide on how to play wide. Really. There are so many videos on how to play tall. None on how to play wide. ie without vassal states or federation. Just pure empire.
Just get vassal then integrate them.
I use to only play wide when I mainly played the huge galaxy size. But then I was basically forced to play tall when I tried medium and now that game is the best and most fun game I have ever played in and the first game I became a galactic emporerer
(Hivemind with organic reprocessing + spamming ringworlds = fuck ton of alloys and naval capacity due to Fortress colonies in both ringworlds and habitats + unyielding and supremacy = I was the main force in fighting the 25x scourge crisis which the only thing stopping me from fighting the next crisis cause I picked all is that I can't find the last stragglers)
I like to try to get as big as possible, but then funnel most of my pops onto a couple of planets
I've been playing tall Crisis for awhile now. It's honestly a great way to play though I will have to stop you at terraforming your planets into city worlds. You'll need those minerals that they provide and city/ring worlds don't provide minerals so don't build that many. Now you could get your vassal to pay you the minerals but relying on them for supplies is a weak point that I'd advise against. Furthermore you promoted shared destiny I have to stand against that you'd be better off with feudal society as not only will vassals not care if you have more of them but they'll also get additional loyalty generated from it while freeing up a perk slot for something else.
I often play tall just because i find the spinning plates of 12-20 planets to get a bit boring. I can DO it I just get a tad bored.
please do a guide on how to play wide next!
Ok, I’ll do it, in Lgate
The only problem is any strategy for playing tall ALSO works EVEN BETTER for playing Wide. there is no TALL strategy that doesn't work better by getting bigger..
Not anymore certainly.
I disagree. After so many times of trying to keep my empire a bit limited in my playthroughs and this most recent campaign where I gave in to annexing vassals because the game put me right next to my friend who was just gobbling up literally everyone in 0 seconds flat, I find my empire is an absolute hot mess I can't manage to save my life, tech and traditions take an absolute eternity to come out, I haven't even been able to begin ascending my planets yet, and we're well into the midgame. My friend is also having a ton of issues managing his empire which at this point is like Rome at its height in terms of its size, and is just as dysfunctional internally.
I never had any of these issues when playing tall, or at least somewhat tall. I never really strictly adhered to any arbitrary standard of what is tall vs. what is wide, so my empires were probably a bit wider than most people would consider "tall", but nine times out of ten I'd be vassalizing or federating my neighbors, not annexing them. The game was infinitely more manageable and fun to me, not to mention I got to interact with more game mechanics like vassals and federations.
I'd like a video about Vassals and Vassal-agreements.
What are good agreements in general?
Are holding on their planets good? I generall have no idea what to build there, so I go with "0" in my agreements because it improves loyalty.
And it seems that I can most of the time only pick protectorate? It seems like how I handle my vassals seems to be severly lacking...
I'm late to reply to this, but after you start the vassalization you can negotiate the agreement later on and that's where you can specialize them. Prospectorium for resources, bulwark for military bonuses to you, etc.
Personally I'll look at what traits their founder species has. If they have Intelligent I'll go for the research specialization, if they have resource traits I'll go for a resource specialization, etc.
As for holdings, you might get a malus for having a number on holdings but some buildings can actually increase your monthly loyalty gain, things like aid office and the like. Holdings are literally you using one of their planets and their workers to work a job that gives you the output, sometimes at the expense of the vassal (which reduces loyalty) or sometimes a mutually beneficial one (raises loyalty).
For instance, two of my vassals in my current game have Intelligent so I've specialized them as Scholariums and put Ministry of Science holdings on them. Research go brrt.
@@spikem5950 Thank you very much!
I appreciate your response a lot and in my next playthrough I'll now be able to handle my vassals much more efficiently :)
crime megacorps are better than regular megacorps btw since if there is another megacorp in the galaxy try getting a commercial pact before they took all the good planets
This is the one thing that frustrates me about playing a megacorp. I hate it when an AI plays it aswel, they are always faster with finding the good planets.
Seems like you're sleeping on how effective spiritualism is for playing tall. Ascenscionsists/Gigacorp civic plus a spiritualist federation(holy covenant?) give a total of +45% ascension effect, taking that 61% to 92%. This affects both size and other effects. The civic, I can kinda understand not taking, other civics can be valuable too, but the federation type seems like a no brainer to me.
Cool, great video, now do it for gigastructures.
Actually Montu I'd love to see you deep dive into stellaris mods. I'm aware of the issues but covering some of the lore/systems from the major mods would be a breath of fresh air.
There isn't a lot of content like this in the stellaris youtube community.
My favorite way to play Void Dwellers.
The way you ask for likes is always so nice haha i wait for them to pop up and see what you're going to say. have a nice one
The Tallest Build I had managed was a Voidborn Megacorb that initially only had 2 Star Systems and later took all of the L-Cluster and some systems with L-Gate Portals
It was when Voidborn still gave you 3 Habitats. Don't think this would be possible in the newest Version of Stellaris.
Only survived early game, because I allied with everyone I saw and focused hard on spacestation tech.
How do I ascend? I have three ascension perks and plenty of unity, but the button is greyed out (no red text explaining why though).
I watched this a few days ago, and just watched Green Peace in action before this rewatch.
Very different the 2nd time around.
I seriously was just wishing you had a video on how to play tall.
Why have few pops when can fanat pacifism and stuck up other -% size from pops.. And general -% and - empire size things
Man I wish playing wide, they kinda made it impossible to expand without having vassals when they updated how empire size works
Megastructures are a staple of all Tall Empires, but it's clear to keep in mind that each Megastructure comes with its own building constraints, and that building the wrong Megastructure in the right place can really restrict just how Tall you can become -- especially when it comes to the Galactic Wonders. Even if you're desperate for Energy Credits and are seeking to build Reactor Habitats; NEVER BUILD YOUR HABITATS AROUND A SYSTEM'S STAR -- the Ring World & Dyson Sphere can ONLY be built around a System's Star, so you need to remember to keep that open if you're gunning for the Galactic Wonders. Mega Shipyards also can only be built in single-star systems, and the Quantum Catapult needs a special pulsar or neutron star to be built.
Try to reserve a System with ZERO Planets for your Dyson Sphere or Ring World, and DON'T build Habitats there, either -- completing these Galactic Wonders will remove all Planets from the system (Ring World) OR make all Terraforming Candidates unusable (Dyson Sphere) anyway; building Habitats in every system prior to getting the Galactic Wonders Ascension Perk is an easy way to eat up all potential real estate for Galactic Wonders (the game won't even let you build them in systems with Habitats).
Also, if you happen to get a Black Hole system; don't try to build Habitats there, either -- it's the only place the Matter Decompressor can be built.
What were your 1st and 5th Tradition Trees?
(1)? - (2)Aptitude - (3)Supremacy - (4)Unyielding
(5)? - (6)Politics - (7)Harmony
Ist es Kannibalismus wenn ich ein Apfelbaum mit Apfelsaft begieße?
Do you recommend conquering sectors and then releasing them as Vassals?
I only play tall and I will tell you what I do one science one construction 1 to 3 planets usually no special planets and ring worlds leaders are not important habitats are required slaves and federations are not used but megacorps are used expansion traditions are not used same and mastery of nature is also not used
Where do you get the storage capacity from?
I prefer Clone Army Death Cult for playing tall. I focus my clone soldiers on unity/technology rush and alloy production while the vassals provide the basic resources. The sacrifice of pops gives them happyness so that I do not have to care about ameneties.
when is the leader rererework coming anyvody knows it?
3.10 I believe, so whenever this next DLC comes out! Maybe November, possibly December?
Your uploads are amazing and very appreciated 🙏 thank you
Tall to me is having only your first 3 planets, but you can have as many generic systems.
The vassal system in Stellaris is hella broke=[ You get insane recourses from them, once you get one you can just snowball your way to vassalizing everyone.
The british guide
6 colonies? Okay, start with a ruined Ringworld, get Fen Habbanis and the Rubricator, maybe Keides... yeah, reaching 6 isn't unthinkable.
aka.. :P It is not a good idea to build 5 ring worlds, and only have those 5 systems. 'cause you can easily end up with 5,000 pops. D: Think of the food!
Noted, you play tall by roleplaying the british empire.
I ... Ugh...
Well you're not wrong
@@MontuPlays HAH you know it
Just starting the video, hopefully this might give an option where playing tall is fun. Paradox constantly tries to kill playing wide when that is all I want to do!
All vassals still broke AF where they will suddenly upgrade and then somehow you have to pay them 30%? I generally don't let them get large enough, or ditch them when that happens. Terrible mechanic.
Wouldnt aquatic be good for tall since you can expand the planetary sea?
Probably is helpful too, but the main reason to go aquatic is the bonuses you get from being on ocean worlds. You don't get those bonuses when on Gaia worlds (I don't think so at least, so feel free to check) and the bonuses to being on Gaia worlds for anything other than your pops, is too steep to pay when wanting to go tall since you need the other species to help prop up your econ. Not to mention, the best planet type in the game being the Ecumenopolis, you lose all your bonuses for sure when using that typing. So basically, helpful earlier in the game to for getting you set up, but as you get later and later, it starts being less and less impactful.
@sirix500111 right didn't think of that. I am really bad about not making migration treaties. I almost never play tall, I use aquatic and teraform everything i can into the ocean. i usually take one other race or even better synthetics i build and make them full citizens and let them live on my Eucomonopolis worlds. So often, j will only have my most advanced robots with full citizen rights to avoid uprisings and my main species. When I play spiritualism, I may have a lot of other species, but they are usually "prisoners with jobs," as montu calls them. I will have to try a real tall run soon, I love playing tall in ck3. I'd rather play CK3 tall than Map paint huge empires.
Become space Singapore.
Authorian, Pacifist, Xenophile and Thrifty.
With only Utopia how viable is pure Tall as in max 5 planets minus habitats
Most of the time playing tall I get the Leader of the Imperium and the economic leader of the Galaxy. It’s my favourite playstyle😎🤓
Paragons tierlist when ?
What if they made the mastery of nature, have a penalty to too much empire size at the trade off, of having a special district like plus one size to any district in +'/.15 or something like that.
Are you going to do a remake of wide Empires ?
How do I play wide, though?
Gonna have to recommend aquatic
so in traduction playing tall is just having vassals to be as large as playing wide and stacking bonus that you try to have regardless but with the limitation of having your name in very little
Yes. Playing tall is effectively like playing as the Papal States. You're Rome, biggest, richest and most influential city in the world, but your borders don't extend past that at all. Despite this, your hegemony extends so far out that all of Christendom is really your empire in all but name, they're just self-governed.
@@spikem5950 yes, but you don't have you chad name in big all over the place
Why are your megastructures yellow?
I'm not wide! I just got big sectors...
hmm what mods would work with that i wonder?
I have no idea why are you calling habitats tall. Its even less efficient then actuall planet, only difference is that you have a bit less land and so its much more eazy to defend, empire size penalty mostly goes frome nomber of planets and pops.
Really tall bild is going into ecumenopolis and ring worlds.
lol Expansion seems so counter intuitive, since it's the tradition about going wide and grabbing lots of territory/planets
I don't think that 1 district as a finisher is worth the investment for tall.
What makes expansion great is actually the empire size bonus for planets and districts. Combined with imperial perogative means you'll be at - 75% empire size per colony. If you have 10 colonies, that means you'll save 80 empire size (reducing tech cost by 10%) this is probably more potent then the research bonuses from discovery or the research Ascension perk.
@@jasonquigley2633 Yeah good for going wide. But 10 colonies is a bit much to still call it tall.
But also not as strong as you think.
You reducing the malus, not the tech cost.
So instead of 88% more tech cost for example you'll have 80%. This ends up being 4,5% less tech cost.
@@Fallenangel_85 it depends. The closer you keep yourself to 100 the more potent it is. I have a game in 2270, where I have 7 colonies and about 200 pops and 150 empire size. I'd say that's working quite well.
The key long term is to push most of your pops onto a small number of planets that you can ascend, which can push per pop empire size to nearly nothing. You then use your other colonies just to grow pops and then you migrate them to your big planets. So you could have 10 or 20 planets, but 3/4 of your planets only have 2 or 3 pops on them.
@@jasonquigley2633 That's how I played tall back before habitats got changed :)
But a huge part of your Empire size comes from Pops already.
Domination would get you -10% empire size from pops, which will become pretty strong over time and the ability to go Hegemony.
Harmony gives another 10% less from pops.
Which will all stacks with ascention and other traits.
@@Fallenangel_85 With Psionic theory, Harmony and Domination you get -30% from pops. 10 level of ascension, enhanced by harmony and the civic gets you ~-70% more. Governor skill also gets you another 10-20%. So there are multiple ways to get to -100% empire size from pops on individual planets.
Aptitude also gives your governor -2 empire size per level.
If you can eliminate the empire size from pops on your main worlds (and realistically, you probably won't need more then 500 pops to beat grand admiral AI, and those can fit on just 3 or 4 worlds), then your main source of empire source remaining will be systems and colonies.
So it's absolutely possible to stay for the majority of your game at under 200 empire size.