The Darkest Doctor Who Story - Torchwood: Children of Earth
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- čas přidán 3. 05. 2024
- With the 3rd season of Torchwood, a new approach was attempted and has become one of the most praised series in the Whoniverse due to that. Russell T Davies took on a bigger role than he had in the previous 2 seasons, as well as bringing in Euros Lyn, who directed episodes of Doctor Who such as "The End of Time", amongst other episodes, to direct each episode. The story follows Torchwood during a global extra terrestrial crisis over the course of 5 days. Becoming a mini series for this particular story.
Torchwood is often referred to as a mature Doctor Who, and whilst the first 2 seasons definitely attempt that (to varying degrees of success) this season specifically is often referred to as one of the darkest stories within the Doctor Who cannon.
A great cast starring John Barrowman, Eve Myles, Gareth David Lloyd and Peter Capaldi, with excellent writing and direction, creates a 5 episode event that is utterly unforgettable. - Zábava
Children of Earth is what basically justifies the very concept of Torchwood. It's the perfect example of a story that could only be done in the Doctor Who universe but could also never be done on Doctor Who itself. This was a cast and crew firing on all cylinders and giving their all to every single episode and it's stunning that it worked so damn well
I was a Torchwood fan boy back then, and it had its share of heartbreaking moments. But Children of Men was on another level, it was gut wrenching, and it never let up, not till the end.
It certainly got the tone right. It approached the premise with sincerity and explored all possibilities within its time restraints.
for me, children of earth is one of those hauntingly incredible pieces of television that rarely come around, and this video reflects that perfectly, thank you
Do i hav to watch the show before i watch that episode or can i jus watch it by itself? I wanna watch this video but i don’t wanna b spoiled after seeing this comment lol
@@furkankocaman356 I would say watch the first two series of torchwood before children of earth (which is series 3)
@@furkankocaman356You'll be missing out on history and inter-character dynamics, so it won't hit as well but if you can't watch the earlier seasons, but not so much that this arc wouldn't be enjoyable.
Just stunning. One of the best pieces of TV ever.
Children of earth is what Torchwood is meant to be more than any other episode. A way to tell mature stories in a Doctor Who setting. It’s a masterpiece!
^This!
I've always said, Torchwood is Dr Who for grown-ups.
Gwen monologue in the beginning is one of the best stuff from NewWho
her crying at the end my heart was breaking
I need to rewatch it to confirm this comment, but as i remember, the only time Jack's daughter called him Dad in the whole series is that moment at the end when she was begging for her son's life. Previously, she just "you" him.
Her desperation to appeal to his sentiments for her son is heartbreaking.
When this was first broadcast, I was visiting my mom for the week. I told her I’d be dvr’ing this show and watching it on her living room tv, and she was fine with that. For one episode, she was sewing in her living room chair, and I was watching the scene where the cabinet debate how to choose the children. The one woman says, “Why do you think we have standardized tests?” Mom made me rewind that because she couldn’t believe she had heard something so callously evil. I had no idea she was paying attention, but Torchwood sucked her in.
See, this is why I despise Denise. She's sitting next to the PM, making these arguments. I can see this totally being the conversation governments would have.
What I cannot understand is the scene when Bridget Spears reveals the PM has been recorded. Denise promptly joins Bridget in a coup de etat, and ends up in charge. Excuse me Ms I-Will-Depose-You holier than thou. Remind me who said those kids she considered beneath her would be sacrificed and also sheltered her own family, in a discussion of the FAIR way to do this?? 😒
I'm more disgusted with her than the PM. She justifies her own BS but somehow ends up squeaky clean. Ugh.
Those are the conversations that would have been happening in 2010ish before everyone got their mind fried by Twitter, imagine the sort of shit they would be debating about nowadays in the contemporary political landscape.
@@RenoRebornEh, it wasn't Twitter. It was having a narcissistic dipstick for a president. Trust me, my mom was never on Twitter, and her and the rest of that side of the fam completely lost their ever-loving minds.
@@VeracityLHThat's one of the reasons why I appreciated her character, as well as many of the officials, despite hating them. If they are in charge, they can shield their own kids. Having the officials' children also be on the line added greater stakes to their internal power grabs. She needed to get people on her side by sounding like the voice of reason while subtly hiding her own kids.
@@RealBradMiller It was both sides of the aisle that lost their minds. It's been dem's vs GOP for over 200 years. Now it's something else entirely and social media did a damn good job at fueling it.
So wait. When Ten is going around saying farewell to the people in his regeneration before he regenerates, when he visits Jack is that literally right after this whole thing happens? That’s crazy to think about.
Maybe not immediately after, but certainly while Jack is wallowing in his survivor guilt. The Doctor is giving Jack permission to enjoy live again by introducing him to Alonzo (who is also dealing with survivor guilt).
@@VeracityLH"Alonze Alonzo"
Wait hold up, I have watched doctor who countless times growing up but only watched torchwood once when each series was new and I don’t recall the whole jack leaving earth at the end so always was a bit like why’s he in some space bar now, makes so much sense now you’ve mentioned it. Ouch
@@benroyle4431 you should watch Torchwood man I skipped it for years then saw my grandad watching it, aslong as you dont mind cheesy effects and some bad CGI it's great especially since it can get much darker than Doctor Who I still remmeber that last 3 parter In the final episodes that was a great ending
Edit - again* thought you meant youd never watched it
@@Killthefishsome cheese effects and bad cgi is just British television brother, it's part of what we're here for😂
regarding your comment regarding children of earth feeling actual after living threw COVID, it happened before, with the AIDS Crisis, and RTD is a survivor of this period, he's seen friends die from aids back then and the government not caring
It's also part of why he has been so forward about LGBT representation in the series. He watched us die unseen, and now he puts us in all of his media.
Watching the army drag those screaming children away...my jaw was hanging, hairs stood up, no breath in my chest. This series is one of the only things that has ever made me feel truly horrified. Seeing the boy hooked up, still alive, still awake, a tear rolling down his cheek...omg 😢
In the cell with the 456.... OH that was sickening. I was in tears, and damn near threw up... It was on like donkey kong after that.
I was a distraught early teen watching this and it broke my heart to think that decisions like this have to be made... I couldn't understand how they are supposed to protect children and they just handed them over.. I think it's when I first realised that we are nothing in the bigger picture...
And the reason why it hurts so much is that we could see governments doing this.
And to think there are people who believe Russell T. Davies can't do dark.
Those people must never have seen Years and Years (not to mention COE).
Obviously not as dark as this, but midnight's a great example of Davies doing dark.
I don't think he can do entertaining. Not anymore.
I wish he could.
He sure can’t anymore. He sold out.
@@Lorgar64He can though
I just finished showing COE to my mother yesterday and she was genuinely so upset, traumatized, shocked but also so impressed by it. Imo its a masterclass in mature sci-fi
6:40 "The government, being the ones who destroyed Cardiff Bay."
Unwittingly perfect critique of urban planning/social cleansing.
The Torchwood novel Twilight Streets included a potential future of what might have happened in the bay after the Hub had been destroyed. Amazing book. Most of the 19 TW books are.
@@VeracityLH I was not aware of this, thanks for the tip. x
The fact that Jack pretends to know nothing about what's going on during Day One, he's walked around acting like he's not a monster. If The Doctor could have been there, I'd like to think they would have been furious with Jack & his actions all those years ago. He did what he did to those orphaned children because he felt they wouldn't ever be missed, loved, cared for & I'm sorry, but Jack Harkness had no right to do that.
Maybe not. But he bought them decades of time that they wouldn't have had, otherwise, and tbh I'm not sure the Doctor (who is not only guilty of similar actions in the past, but probably could've prevented this story scenario in the first place, lets be real) would have any right to make that judgement. There's no way the Doctor did not KNOW what happened in Cardiff. Why they didn't get involved is what's unclear (running theory apparently is that it's one of them badly explained fixed points the new series introduced?)
It was a terrible thing to do, but Jack made the only choice he felt he could at the time.
There's reasons why 10 didn't want Jack to travel with him.
@@grey8288 Yeah and it's probably not just because he felt 'innately wrong' because he's immortal
@@grey828810 wasn’t any better than Jack, be fr
I'd genuinely go as far as to say that John Frobisher is one of the most tragic characters of the entire Whoniverse..
And I think it's amazingly written poetry that the Twelfth Doctor is (if I'm remembering correctly, anyway) the incarnation that later said (possibly paraphrasing here), "sometimes the only choices you have are bad ones, but you still have to choose" - whether it was intentional or not, I really feel that it echoes back to Frobisher
Frobisher isn't why the Doctor regenerated into Capaldi, though. The doctor never met him. The Capaldi character he DID meet was the one from Pompei.
@@AndrewHalliwell I know that. I meant that it was something the viewers and fans could associate it with, if that makes sense? I'm terrible at trying to explain my thoughts, so I'm trying to word it as best as I can 🤣
I once read about a connection between all three characters.
The 12th Doctor having taken the appearance of the citizen from Pompeji (Caecilius, IIRC) is canon.
The other connection is that Caecilius was a distant ancestor of Frobisher; and the latter one`s final fate was the universe`s way of balancing Caecilius and family having been saved by the 10th Doctor.
@@deavacui2825that’s an amazing theory, like the universe itself is balancing itself out. Life for a life type thing
Sometimes I wonder why people bother learning to use language to communicate when geniuses like you will just invent shit to reply to.@@AndrewHalliwell
This devastated me when I first watched it in 2009 and part of the reason was that, even then, the actions of the politicians felt absolutely plausible.
And the additional tragedy (exemplified by Frobisher) that so many of the deaths were pointless. Frobisher killing his children, then his wife, then himself... And then it turns out the aliens don't take the kids after all. All the people to protect the secret .. and then it comes out and the world knows about it anyway.
The Ballad of Ianto Jones makes me cry every time I hear it. It’s one of my favourite songs from Doctor Who! And that montage at the end with it! I’m not even watching the show and it’s making me cry.
Personally, I am a massive fan of darker stories and this is just perfect for me. As much as I complain about character deaths, I bloody love it when a show has the confidence to do so. And that’s what this series is. The consequences really hit! They weren’t afraid to kill off their most loved character, killed off other characters major to the plot (including 3 named children), and destroyed the hub. I do think this is what lets Miracle Day down as it doesn’t really feel like Torchwood without the Hub or Ianto, but god it works for this!
Also, I absolutely love the fan reaction to this series. It was such a nice surprise to hear that there is a literal shrine to Ianto, that is still going years after his death!
Great video! Deserves more attention!
You could say that Capaldi is in the Thick of It
Thinking back on this I remember one scene in the government meeting where they decide on what 10% they will choose. They agree to keep their own kids safe. One obnoxious woman then goes on to ask about extended family (nephews, grandkids, etc...). The PM says "Don't push your luck" and she said "Do you really expect me to look my brother in the eye after this if his family is affected?"
Now, post-COVID, this scene is outstanding as the gov forced everybody in the UK into lockdown. Many families were unable to attend funerals of loved ones and had to cancel operations or weddings - all the while the gov were having house parties on Downing St. Just like in this story, those in power making sure the decisions don't affect themselves.
It’s amazing… when COE first aired, I absolutely hated it, and what they did to Ianto. It came at a time in my life when I wanted and needed happy endings, so it destroyed me. As an adult, having done some healing and developed a deeper understanding of writing, this has got to be one of my favourite pieces of television. It’s a masterclass in foreshadowing and moral dilemma.
Years ago reading Lovecraft introduced me to the concept of non happy endings.
I feel similarly tbh. I think as a doctor who fan I was used to thinking of the shows in that universe in a more optimistic way. (Not that I was naïve to the complexities of reality. Just that in my mind, this series was part of a universe that was *supposed* to be feel more... optimistic. Like if I were to make a hopeless-hopeful scale of fiction in my head, it would be edging steadily towards optimistic with the occasional foray into 'doomed'.)
Even the first couple series of Torchwood, while a lot more serious and dark, didn't really do much to dissuade me of the idea that this fictional universe was supposed to be ultimately Good, or at least trying NOT to be evil: after all, sometimes the Doctor lost too.
But Torchwood was indeed created to demonstrate what happens when you don't have a quasi dues-ex-machina character running around fixing everyone's problems at all, When we're stuck between an unyielding rock and an unthinkable hard place.
Although... the lack of a hazmat suit when you know you're going up against aliens like that was, uh... a pretty stupid choice, on their part.
if u haven’t seen house of the dead (audio story i think that’s what it’s called) gives ianto’s story so much more depth it’s the single best torchwood story imo
@@radiish1239 That was an excellent conclusion to the whole existence of torchwood, I felt. It was nice that we got that.
Is it just me that still tears up when rewatching children of earth?
I can't. Even this analysis, had me in tears and sick honestly. I saw it the once, that's all I have it in me to do.
Not just you. This story still manages to churn up so many emotions in me
Watching COE after my husband died is a whole 'nother experience.
It's like when COVID ended and the government said we had gotten through the worst of it. And then we find out that while we were all locked in our homes they were having office parties and taking home massive bonuses and never once thinking about the people who sacrificed their lives to save others. Or the sacrifices made by others to save others. All of us giving up our right to go outside whenever we wanted. Giving up our right for a lot of things while they pocketed money and partied up in downing street
The "if i had a nickel' meme when applied to how many times Peter Capaldi has played a separate character in the Doctor Who universe would get you 4 nickels. This man loves this series.
Pompeii, Frobisher, and 12... what am I forgetting?
the monks and 456 storylines are eerily similar, interesting that Peter Capaldi’s Doctor absolutely refuses to give the monks what they want when thought about next to John Frobisher (a man who has 12’s face) being willing to give the 456 what they want until it involves his kids and then he does the worst thing a parent could do…for absolutely no reason at the end. When 12 implied that he chose his face bc of Pompeii im always like that’s great but also Frobisher?! Totally understandable that his doctor would feel so low that he would take Frobisher’s face as a reminder of who he doesn’t want to be. And Jack’s Doctor would totally know about the 456 even though he leaves the humans to it.
I had wondered if there was a connection between 12 and Frobisher that played into 12's look, but A: I don't think the doctor and frobisher ever crossed paths, and B: it feels a little TOO dark to have doctor who ackwoledge COE.
(not trying to "well ACTUALLY 🤓☝🏻" you or discredit/hate on your opinion, just my own thoughts haha😅)
Watching Children of Earth, I've only done once... It punches you in the soul and demands to know, what kind of person you are. And I'm good with the once. Its possibly the greatest Doctor Who adjacent series and if you're a parent.... Ouch.
Is it good? It's gods damned amazing.
But I could only watch it once, it broke my heart and it gave me hope and just blitzed everything. Everyone that came out was scarred for life and that includes I think a good portion of the audience. But they swung for the fences with this story and knocked it out of the park.
Also I think directly addresses the question, If the doctor is there to save the day, why he's not there everyday they're needed. Knowing that the TARDIS is sentient do you really think it would bring him into that. It would kill his faith in humanity.
This is as close to watching it twice as I've been. I think I understand what you mean by punching you so hard in the soul.
To be fair, the Doctor that Jack knew most of the time was the same Doctor who almost died transfixed by watching thousands of children burn in fire while listening to their screams. He would look upon Jack's choice with disdain, but also understanding in how that choice feels.
I watched this when it first aired and it was dark then. I watched it post Covid & it’s even darker now after seeing seeing how our govs globally did make those decisions in regards to the elderly and the Disabled.
Elderly eh they can go
Even darker if you know about the theory regarding what the government is doing with all the illegal immigrant children that go missing all over the world...
@@RabbiB0Yu can go lad
"The children create chemicals."
"The chemicals.... are good."
That line stuck with me all this time.
adrenochrome...because its real.
@@cmbaz1140 No.
To me, Decker gave off similar vibes to Ash in the original Alien. He seemed obsessed with the 456, almost to the point of admiration. And while he does assist in fighting back at the end, there's a sadistic glee at the cruelty of the situation which really made me squirm while watching.
I’m glad people can appreciate this now because I remember a lot of the loudest fans at the time were really really harsh.
My buddy was one of the writers of Children of Earth and since he was the most available online he was getting the most horrific DMs for months. Ugh. It was a weird time to be in the Torchwood fandom.
when i was 9 years old, i was a huge doctor who fan and desperate to watch torchwood. i didn't listen to my parents who told me multiple times it wasn't like doctor who and i was too young to watch it and snuck it on one night when i was supposed to be asleep. unfortunately, this was the episode i watched, the very end of it as well and it upset and scared me so much i had nightmares for weeks and was too scared to watch torchwood again until i was in my late teens… it's genuinely one of the darkest things i've ever watched let alone episodes of torchwood
I haven't watched children of earth since it came out, but I remember my mum and I looking at each other in absolute horror and disbelief multiple times throughout that last episode. Even without having all 5 hours fresh in my mind, seeing that final scene with john frobisher and his family again almost broke me. Peter Capaldi's outstanding performance from start to finish was such a huge part of making that story as impactful as it was.
(Also for anyone that didn't know, Ianto's loss was felt so deeply by the people of Cardiff, a dedicated Ianto memorial at the site of the Torchwood entrance by the dock is still in place and visited to this day!)
Not my absolute favorite Torchwood story, but one of my top 3. A few notes:
• Frobisher & Co are not with Parliament, they are with the Home Office. A small but important detail. These are not elected officials (except for the PM); they are the government cockroaches, surviving each elected government, heads down, doing their jobs. The pencil pushers. The ones who get things done while the politicians campaign and smile and wave. That's why Frobisher, Spears, and Decker are different. And why they are considered expendable.
•Alice doesn't get her talent and instinct only from Jack. Her mother was also Torchwood, one of the rare TW agents who didn't die young. Alice knows what her future with Jack is because she watched her mum live it.
•I can never rewatch the meeting in which the governments decide the who and how the gift of the children will be delivered to the 456 without focusing on Denise (sitting to the right of the PM). She instigated a lot of it. the choosing of those who "make less contributions," the poorest, the low scoring, the "dregs." The special status of kids related to those involved in the decision making, etc. I despised her almost as much as the PM. I have never understood how she ends up in charge when the PM is exposed and deposed at the end when honestly she is jyst as bad.
•Ianto was always a hostage to fate. The Reset story of TW series 2 was meant to be Ianto's death and resurrection and it would have made an interesting story! But RTD changed it to be Owen's story because Owen was such a hedonist, and for him to no longer be able to eat, drink, and shag was more dramatic.
•The subtly in Ianto's death is amazing if you pick up on the small things. When realizing the 456 had released a deadly virus into Thames House, Jack holds Ianto as long as he can before collapsing next to him. At that moment, Jack wishes he were as mortal as Ianto. How do we know? Because for the first time, Jack does not gasp when he revives. He just quietly inhales and opens his eyes. Every time before, thousands of times by this point, Jack has come back desperately gasping for air. This time, he had hoped he wouldn't come back.
•Gwen's call to Rhys telling him to stand down, that it's over. Rhys was originally supposed to stay dead in End of Days, the finale of series 1, but Kai Owen had become a fan favorite. How different Torchwood would have been without this man.
•Jack and Lois in jail, with Jack never answering Lois' question: What do we do now? Jack Harkness the immortal man is out of ideas.
•Love the scene where Gwen tries to console Ianto's sister and finds out how little she really knew her friend. Really, how much did ANY of TW agents know each other? And the thought that always rings through my head: Ianto died aged 26. 26 years old. Torchwood has no retirement plan; they rarely need one.
•From "Croeseo i Gymru" to joining the citizens resisting, PC Andy is a BAMF. Full stop.
•John Frobisher's fate. Peter Capaldi is an acting god. You understand everything Frobishher thought and did through the entire thing, and have such empathy with him. This one reason why Bridget Spears is my favorite character, because I see him through her eyes. Just brilliant, both of them.
•The whole climax, my god. My husband and I had totally opposite reactions to Jack's choice. My husband was completely horrified and angry, at the time he felt COE had ruined Jack's character. I said I would have made the same choice, but at least I would have a choice that Jack couldnt. We watched COE with our 17 year old daughter, and asked what my choices would have been. I replied, "I love you with my whole heart, but yes, I would have given your life to save the millions. I wouldn't have been able to tolerate the reverse. And remember, no other child was available in time either. The choice I would have made that Jack could not? Suiciding afterward."
• My husband said the Doctor would never agree with Jack's actions. Oh yeah? The guy who sacrificed his entire species? I think the Doctor of all people would have understood.
•Jack's departure. You totally get Gwen's view, you totally get Jack's view. And since at the time it truly looked like this would be the end of the show, could there have been a better ending?
RTD, bless you for this story, certainly among the best of Torchwood. Glad to see you back in the Doctor Whoniverse my man. Cheers.
Sorry this turned into its own essay, but COE certainly deserves it. 🤓.
This was such a spectacular series. It functions so well as a standalone, and it had my husband, who had never seen any sci-fi or Doctor Who in his life, on the edge of his seat, binging until 5 in the morning. The action sequences in the final episode with people revolting and the police officer defecting to join the small rebellion had me in tears as much as anything else in this piece.
This series was the darkest thing in the doctor who universe and it shows how accurate the government could be given the situation. Watching it as it aired broke me and even now I can't watch it again not out of fear but out of mercy on my emotions especially when Ianto dies.
The 456 only wanting kids for drugs essentially is just awful and makes them even worse and possibly even the worse alien in the universe. The characters are broken and Jack leaving earth to get away from the pain of everything that happened makes so much sense. Too much pain it's best to leave and completely start again. Frobisher makes so many sacrifices and unimaginable decisions and it's horrible to be made the scapegoat by a corrupt government and the fact he takes his own life along with his family was the only escape.
That last part with Jack using his grandson as the beacon and him shaking with blood pouring out his nose. The fact all the characters in the scene apart from Jack look away as it's happening really shows they can't bare to see what they have done while Jack looks and he will never forget or forgive himself for it
As a blind person, the fact the UK government just decided, yep,, we're throwing away disabled people, doesn't surprise me at all.
Hell, it's hard enough to get a job in the real world so yeah, this is very acurat.
Do you just sit there clicking around for 20 minutes before you can find the comment button
@@fixthisdogBruh bruh bruh
...
Have you heard about screen readers
@@fixthisdog My god that would be horrible, no, I just press b for button and find it that way.
And after the ultimate sacrifice John became the doctor
In a way, yeah. You're right, He absolutely did.
And he ran away just like he did too
I've never watched Torchwood but after my partner told me a smidge about this ep when we saw your thumbnail I HAD to watch, and...I'm speechless.
This was peak torchwood. The formatting of having 5 episodes mon-fri exactly how it plays out in the show? Amazing. I Hope one day we can get back to this level & the show can make a comeback
Great video! Children of earth really messed me up when i first saw it, because watching capaldi unalive his family just felt like such a real reaction to a no win scenario. The pacing and threading of the narrative through each episode answering just enough questions while leaving others unanswered really hooked me in and kept me bingeing this til the end. Jack is a supremely flawed character, but that is what makes him so interesting to watch. You really did great with this analysis! More people should be on this, def deserve more views 🎉
FINALLY! A COE video essay. Youd think thered be lots, but there are barely any!
“Sometimes, The Doctor must look upon this planet in shame”
What a brilliant line
The thing is this story ABSOLUTELY raises the question that most of Torchwood dodges by being kind of lower rent and lower stakes stories...
WHERE IS THE BIG GUY
You're telling me the guy who makes it his business to bodyblock all alien crap from Earth never checked out this incident?
He goes ham on Sontarans just for being dumb warmongers but doesn't have anything to say about the species who wire children up as endorphin drug machines?
The TARDIS takes him to the most ridiculous off-beat stuff but it doesn't feel like dipping out of the timestream to save billions of children?
🤨 You right.
Children of Earth - possibly the most chilling TV I have ever watched. Unforgettable.
I think torchwood had so much potential and this showcases the best of it I still think about the show all the time and it changed my way in thinking
Thank you, I read the synopsis of this before and noped out of it quickly- anything involving children getting hurt is too much for me. Just watching this this is enough to make me tear up and watch fluffy videos just to stop being sad and horrified. If I probably watched the full episode, I might break down and have nightmares for weeks
This is amazing, how does it not have more views
Probably because Harry's Moving Media did the *exact* same thing a few weeks earlier. Even with some of the same points.
For me, its the pause between the three gunshots and the last one. Its a moment that is only horrifying.
it was a powerful show; I remember crying for Peter Calpadi's character.
The portrayal of politicians was exactly how these people think. Frighteningly realistic.
"Sometimes, The Doctor must turn away from this planet in shame." Or whatever... Such a huge point for the recent past.......
But, this series was so intense, loved it, I could only watch it three times yet...
All the actors in this series did an amazing job. For such a B show, it's spectacular.
I may need to watch it again.... A fourth hit...
Please consider Miracle Day? I know it's not popular but I genuinely think that like a lot of really good scifi-horror they presented a very simple premise (nobody can die) and took an in depth and horrifying look at how that would reshape society.
I know I shit on Miracle Day a little bit in this video, but from memory I absolutely don't hate it, and would love to get round to discussing it at length at some point
Miracle Day was awful top to bottom because STARS got involved. Ruined the whole thing, top to bottom. Probably why we didn't get more torchwood after.
@@TheMsLourdes STARZ involvement definitely lessened the quality of the show and it more than likely did have an affect on the shows return but I believe most of the reason it ended up being cancelled laid on the RTD taking time away because i don’t think it was ever like a concious decision to can the show, i may be wrong though 🤷♀️
Miracle Day was such a disappointment after the masterpiece that was COE. I honestly think COE is some of the best television I've ever seen--not just Who-related, not just SF-related, but the best television ever.
The premise was great. The execution, not so much.
"Children of Earth" is one of THE BEST Sci-Fi stories I have ever seen.
I believe this series has to be one of the best written, acted and direct pieces of televised media ever produced! Its been my favorite for years, the acting is realistic and tragic, the 456 are horrorfying and have one of the best voices ive ever heard, its gritty and the politics are done in a way I've never quite seen before.
And the ending... they win but they also really don't! Amazing series!
That recap edit you do at the end, got me man, after everything, you got me!
Given how chipper Jack has been since re-appearing in Miracle Day with 13, I feel I'm missing a Big Finish Audio which is just several minutes of Jack and the Doctor, talking.
Where the heck was The Doctor during Children of Earth? What do they say to Jack to console him? Does the Doctor even know it happened?
I feel the Drama you could get from this, the devastation and anger that The Doctor could feel for a former companion hearing what he had to do before being confronted with the old "What was I supposed to do?!"
i don't know if you really can give a reason except "fixed point in time" to explain away the doctors absence. Maybe something like the crack in time in season 5 erased the event from time. It's hinted in Eleventh hour that this happened with the events of prior DW seasons and therefore Amy doesn't remember them.
Whenever anyone says that they're thinking of or planning on watching Children of Earth, I tell them to have a pile of hankies or a full box of tissues ready next to them, because it will break their heart into a million pieces.
Such an incredible bit of television. Completely deserves all the praise it gets and more. Great breakdown and analysis.
I have only seen the first couple of episode of Torchwood. The way you explain this story is so moving and I can’t wait to watch it even knowing how hard it will be. You did an amazing job!!
Absolutely bloody outstanding review! Loved this programme. It gave me nightmares. Bravo. So well presented.
Absolutely astounding piece of televisual art. Not just one of the best Who-niverse stories, but one of the best stories of any show. Absolutely worth watching once, hard to watch again.
The fact that he chooses to kill them, that was brutal, because we all know that was actually mercy. But in the end pointless because in the end all those children wasn’t sacrificed.
It's like the ending to the Mist. Though thought necessary at the time, ultimately they could have lived.
Torchwood doesn't get enough credit. it's often silly, but it deals with quite a lot of more mature stories really well, and the silliness and maturity complement each other. Doctor Who's tragedies are always wrapped up in big events, but Torchwood's tragedies are typically more grounded. they deal with the side effects of living in a sci-fi world as humans who can't compete on an interplanetary scale. it doesn't entirely indulge in cosmic horror but it takes cues from the powerlessness that the setting entails. The Doctor is incredibly powerful, and when he fails it's usually because the enemy is more powerful
Torchwood never stood a chance against the fairies. they can't fight causality or travel freely through time. they do their best with the understanding that it's rarely enough, and they can't run away from the human cost in the aftermath. there are a couple of stories in series one and then a good few in series 2 that deal with their relative powerlessness and ways of coping in the face of this that are brilliant and just couldn't be done in Doctor Who, and i think that's where the show is strongest. Children of Earth refines this and delivers a truly brilliant and haunting story and i always stop before rewatching it because it's done too well and thus ends up depressing me. i don't then go on to watch Miracle Day, but that's definitely not because it's too good
Great video! Nicely done! RTD at his best and a science fiction story that stands on its own... although it's a harrowing watch.
How utopian that world leaders would need an excuse to systematically harm people. Or even talk like they'd all take their share of the burden, instead of just deciding to snag all the kids from the congo or something.
I watched torchwood between doctors 11 and 12 and it really killed Doctor Who for me. I loved Torchwood and Ianto was my favorite character. I never watched the rest of the show after this and I never went back to Doctor Who. I don't know, none of it was the same anymore. This randomly popped up in my recommended this morning and its been almost a decade since I watched any Doctor Who and it seems through word of mouth to have started to die around the same time.
Great video, came back to it today and realised u somehow don't even have 1k yet, not often such a small channel makes something so good I want to rewatch it, will def sub to see what u make in the future.
GG on vid blowing up, def deserved ♥♥♥
The fact Captain Jack murdered is grandson to kill the 456 and hand over 12 child over to 456 in 1965, just shows how dark his character can be if he has to be to save Earth! Also John Frobisher killing his self and his family instead of handing his children over to 456 is very dark but a great story telling too!
Yknow honestly I don’t believe the doctor would forgive Jack for that it seems like a big writing error that seemingly nothing changed between after that
this was a wonderful video essay!!
It's incredible just how _devastating_ two words can be; "the hit" was enough to turn an already nightmarish scenario into one that makes you ashamed to be a human. It's the fact that humanity was ready to sacrifice tens of millions of children to satisfy a creature's drug addiction, and was doing it _purely_ out of fear.
Great review Jack. The snippets from The Thick of It were perfect lol
Such a wellmade video, and great comentary! Keep it up, swear down... one of my new favourite youtubers :p
Great video, you deserve alot more subscribers.
Absolutely one of the best stories i've ever seen on television. It takes an absolutely wild concept and grounds it wonderfully. All the best sci-fi is an examination of the human experience and this takes that and runs with it.
Bloody brilliant video for a brilliant season of a brilliant show
omg i love your content. great video!! made me realize that i need to rewatch that seaon XD
This entire video can be summed up with *boss, you killed a child!*
With the whoneverse starting I really hope we got more great dark spin off seasons like this one
I was teaching when this came out and I remember sobbing through a good chunk of it. Revisiting post Covid is a brutal reminder that art imitates life. Some of the best writing for television to date.
easily one of the best mini series ever made
"They then try to kill Jack."
Oh, so they're idiots. That's.... impossible.
i suppose that’s why they sealed him in the concrete tomb
This season really had me not only disturbed, but angry at the same time with a hint of sadness. When children are hurt or even threatened it just had me having to take a small break to just compose myself. Honestly one of the most brilliant seasons in NewWho imo
I’m kicking my lil bros ass rn
The sad thing is that John Frobisher and his family died for nothing.
I'm so sad that this doctor who universe died some years ago, and probably will never come back in any meaningful shape or form.
I had little hope before, but:
"The timeless child" probably was the final nail in the coffin.
Torchwood s1 and s2 was kinda mid, but still way better than today's doctor who 😢
I do not think I can re-watch this ever again. I am not sure even if I want to remember this story. I remember being glued to the screen when I watched, but I was left so shaken and disgusted when it ended and that is something I do not want to experience again.
Subscribed… this fooken beautiful lad 👏🏾 yes!
Great video ! The first thing I think of is the game “High on Life “, never noticed it’s basically the plot of COE
I watched this as it was coming out, and, dear God, it was one of the most impactful shows in the entire Whoniverse. That should have been the end, and the end of Jack. When he came back there was no sorrow, no hatred for the Doctor for leaving him alone to deal with this threat, nothing. It’s as if they erased this from his timeline, and never looked back. And that is sad, because, as you said, this season was perfect
That ending montage was sick.
Chidren of Earth and Miricle day are the only times ive seen other members of my family have an interest in the universe of Doctor Who. Sitting down to watch eatch episode. I think the more adult approach was pretty well done in these 2 special seasons because both could've almost been one offs not tied to doctor who or torchwood at all (with some tweaks). It was well advertised at the time if I recall correctly.
I remember watching Children Of Earth when it went out live in the summer of 2009 (I was 15). The 456 is one of the best original villains to come out of the whoniverse. 🙌
Until that point I had never watched Torchwood before and I didn’t watch the first two series until I bought them on DVD along with Series 3 (Children Of Earth). I never bought Series 4 (Miracle Day) on DVD because in my mind Torchwood officially ended with the series finale of Children Of Earth when Jack teleported away. In my mind Miracle Day is retconned. 👎
While Rex, Esther and Oswald Danes were by no doubt great characters in Miracle Day it’s plot was poorly executed and it ruined/retconned the reason for Jack’s immortality: He can’t die because his death is a fixed point in time (five billion years from now) not because of his blood. If that were true his daughter Alice and grandson Steven would’ve inherited his immortal abilities. 🙄
Years after first watching it there was a lot that I forgot. I just had vague recollections of the story beats, and a few scenes... but that final Frobisher scene stuck in my head like glue. I never forgot that part. The door closing, the 4 gunshots... it hits soo hard.
Man, i havent watched this in years but this really makes me want to rewatch it
Torchwood was such a good show. I need to find it and watch it again
This video is a masterpiece
I unfortunately watched Children of Earth when I was like 13 and it still haunts me, thankyou for reminding me of its existence i shall not sleep tonight
I watch this series at least once a year, probably more often than my favourite Who. It's mostly brilliant, the Torchwood trio are at their best, the supporting cast great and Capaldi giving us one of the best performances in Who history.
Great video! One small pointer, you might wanna mix the background music a bit lower next time. Sometimes it’s like it’s fighting with your voice for dominance of the mix, it’s a little distracting. That’s all, though! Keep it up!!
I remember watching this as it was first airing and being absolutely hooked on it despite not being the biggest fan of Torchwood in general and I remember being utterly horrified by just how twisted everything was. I never rewatched it but whenever I was reminded of it or just thought back to it I always felt sick remembering that final episode, it left that much of an impact on me.
Oh man, I LOVED Torchwood 15ish years ago! I really had no knowledge it was connected to Doctor Who at all. I don't actually have any experience with Doctor Who, nor do I wish do even start down that rabbit hole. I feel like I've forgotten most of this show besides some big beats and set pieces, so maybe it's time for a rewatch.
I specifically remember a hidden entry by a fountain, and a pet pterodactyl?!
@@RealBradMiller Apparently I've forgotten more than I thought.
The episodes airing daily over a week and each episode being set over a single day just made it feels even more oppressively grim.