The Problem with Modeling Amps like the Boss Katana
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- čas přidán 21. 02. 2024
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I just played a huge hall (2,500 seater). I played a katana Artist. Sound guy poked a little fun at first. But once gig was finished, he praised the sound. He stated couldn’t believe how it sounded! I love it! I also own several tube amps. Just my thoughts. No pedals and one cable. It allows me to focus on the song!
That's cool! I sold my only remaining tube amp and bought a Katana 100 MKII combo, not even the Artist. But I use it in panel mode, with my pedalboard. After four tube amps and not being satisfied with the sound of my gain pedals through those amps, I figured that the Katana should take pedals better. And it does.
I do live and studio work, and these translate to mics incredibly well. My KT50mkii gets more use than my Bandit 65 (with EV12L spkr.) and Hot Rod Deluxe.
I traded my Marshall in for stereo Katana Artists.
@@markdouglas8073 Nice!
I use my Katana mkII 100 the same way. No pedals, one cable, and the GA-FC foott switch. All I have to do is pre-program in Tone Studio and I’m good to
go in any live situation.
I used a Katana 2x12 mk 1 and GA-FC with no external pedals for a big UK and Europe tour with Mike and the Mechanics and it worked really well. For that sort of music I decided to get everything I needed from the built in fx. Just that footswitch and a tuner was strangely liberating.
You didn't happen to play at a nightclub in Hollywood called the Virgil recently did you?
We are absolutely spoiled as guitarists with options for equipment. An embarrassment of riches! We shouldn’t be complaining about anything.
Anyone that does should be locked in a room and forced to play a Crate. Yeah that will teach em.
Anything that emulates or is digital is not a spoil, it's an element of the modern, cheaply made world.
@@Thrive-Off-Grid- heck, I UPGRADED to an 80 watt Crate combo in the late 80’s from a small Peavey Rage. The Crate was amazing by comparison. I then upgraded to a Crate halfstack in the 90’s with a Korg pedalboard for effects. Didn’t move to decent tube amps until the late 90’s.
@@stephen3164 I had one I couldnt wait to throw that piece crap away. They sounded aweful. I heard a full stack no comparison to a Marshall
@@Thrive-Off-Grid - oh, I wouldn’t put the Crate solid state amps from the 90’s in the same category as a Marshall tube amp! But the Crate did the job. Back then I was doing a lot of scooped mids, and overuse of effects, so my tone was likely absolute garbage, but it worked for me at that time. It was a huge improvement from other cheap amps I had used.
To the same effect, cheap modeling amps sound great compared to really garbage options out there. You just can’t compare it to a $3k tube amp.
I’d totally lose my shit if I saw a wall of Boss Katanas at a Yngwie Malmsteen gig. 😂
If it ever does happen, the katana will treble in price the next day 😂
😂
I played for a living for 35 years and wish I would have had the Katana 2 x 12 I have now. I played Twins, Marshalls, Mesa, Lab Series, and JC120s. In my studio I have an ABY with one side my Katana and pedals, the other side a Nux mg30 going stereo into two 2 x 12s, and I mix the sounds and it never ever gets old to me. The only amp I would by now in my 60s is an Amplified Nation amp, just my thoughts.
I've had most of that stuff. I have had two Katanas. For me if I only had one amp it would be a Katana head. The built is speaker sounds great and is so handy.
I'm right there with you. I've owned Marshalls, Z's, Boogies, and I'm getting better tone, and having more fun..live and in the studio..using modelers. I still want an Amplified Nation ODS or Wonderland OD, just because, but it would be hard to tie myself down to a single amp now that I've experienced true freedom.
Lab Series, respect !
@@BobbyTaylor-io1od played through L5s, my bass player saw one in a pawn shop not long ago and couldn't get back in time to get it before it was gone . Great amps
Here's the issue: Big bands can still afford the best studios, where they have access to any amp the want. When it comes to touring time, they all use Kempers and such for both reliability, cheaper logistics, but more importantly - because they can profile the EXACT tones they used in the studio.
It's really going to take younger bands growing up with this stuff to keep using it after they become the new guitar heros. Heck, lot's of people are just playing into (computer) amp sims these days. I can see the profiler trend continuing because it's the best way to store the amp sim sounds from recordings..
Affordable attenuation will kill solid state.
Last summer I got to see Candlebox open for 3 Doors Down. It was Candlebox's 30th anniversary and their final tour. They had a wall of various tube amps and cabinets and sounded supersonic!!! the Headliner 3DD hit the stage afterward with a big huge pyramid truss stage with just the Drums on top. No Amps or speakers on stage at all (with their Kempers' hidden off stage left and right). 3DD sounded like a mono AM radio in comparison. It sucked! Kempers' might be great in the Studio, but they suck live!
Yea. As a bass player I'm getting some good tone out of my helix with one amp sim plus all my effects in one board.
'I took my amp on a holiday once' I love it, i want to see the pictures of you and your amp enjoy a nice holiday together
I'm not sure this is an issue for Boss... They probably sell per year more Katanas than all the tube amps combined.
To me, what gear artists are using is comparable to what shoes professional athletes are using. It's all business.
I’m a bedroom player with a Squier guitar and a 50 watt Katana. I’m very happy with it. If I was playing live with a band I would, of course, upgrade my gear. With the cost of stomp boxes, a pedal board just isn’t a realistic option for me.
@@peterwilson8039you’d be surprised how decent cheaper pedals are these days. I bought a peavey valveking combo for £80. You can’t beat a tube amp with a clean boost, that being said I’d love a jazz chorus too.
@@peterwilson8039 I actually sold my tube amp and bought a Katana 100 MKII, not even a Katana Artist. My pedals sound better through it, especially my distortion and fuzz pedals. I would gig it too, no problem! You just mic it and go.
I worked a a rock/blues festival during gasparilla and got to see a band that had no speakers on stage, (not even monitors) and guitarists used floorboard modelers direct to the board. Right after their set the next band that came on 20 mins later had tube amps, floor monitors etc.
Both bands sounded great out front and had really nice guitar tone.
Just got back from Nashville where i saw a couple of players using Katanas in the Honky-tonks on Broadway. They sounded great! And I cant imagine they'd risk their jobs on something unreliable.
Love my katana. It always amazes me when I plug into it how great it sounds. Currentiy using Helix native plugin with a FCB1010 midi foot controller..happy days.
I had a Marshall DSL20 and a 100W Katana. I left the Marshall aside to really spend a whole year with the Katana. I used the footswitch for clean/light dirt/ high gain. Everything was good with effects. Its a good platform that takes the complexity out of the typical high end units like Axe FX, Helix or Kemper. Its simple enough for beginners yet you can get the bigger Artist for gigging. Yet when I switched back to the tube amp it was obvious what was missing. Warmth, punch and clarity. There was a thinness to the Katana and I could not get a proper high gain out of it. So I went back to tubes. Maybe they are getting closer to replicating a tube amp's dynamics but so far for me they aren't there yet.
I totally agree. There's a sonic warmth with tubes that modelers just can't match. And a visceral punch that is lacking when you hear modelers played live. Close...but not quite there yet.
Distortion is one of the hardest thing to model properly because it's inherently nonlinear. Chances are if what you like about an analog thing is the way it misbehaves, you'll notice more of a difference when you try a modeled version of it.
@@maudiojunky It's also hard to replicate because every tube is a little bit different. A different copy of the same amp, or even the same amp with a different tube, could be very different from what you have in front of you.
@@mal2ksc Usually that comes down to component tolerances, which can actually be modeled quite easily if you have the rest working. But you're right that the gain and frequency settings for everything will have a tolerance to it in analog equipment. Capacitors are usually going to be +/-20% of their intended value at best in older equipment (if they still work), with resistors a bit tighter. Modern potentiometers are still +/-20%.
These tolerances are what you're hearing 99% of the time when someone compares Tubescreamer, Big Muff, Klon etc. releases. They hear something is different and claim a TS9 sounds different from a TS808 or that a hand-wired TS808 sounds different from a $20 Amazon clone, but it's all within normal variance for the same design. Variations in opamps or transistors will only affect white noise in most circuits, even swapping to vastly different components. One exception is the Fuzz Face, which is very sensitive to the gain factor of the transistors used.
Going back to tubes, small signal tubes come in as bad as 40% tolerance on transconductance, but even then it's going to be fairly circuit-dependent whether you even notice the difference between tubes. Cathode-biased tubes can be quite out of tolerance and have a minimal effect on the sound. Tube rolling is a basically pointless practice in most instances except perhaps if you find good JAN-grade NOS tubes built for high vibration environments to reduce microphonics or if you're very, very particular about the breakup threshold at one stage of an amplifier. Most well-designed circuits though will ensure the controls have enough range to make gain device tolerances irrelevant. This all assumes you're swapping the same type of tube - any assumptions go out the window and the circuit and/or tube may misbehave or be damaged over time by using a 12AU7 where a 12AX7 is supposed to go.
Cool video. One of the best (favourite?) amps I’ve played lately is a Boss Katana 100w head into a Waza 2x12 cab. Really liked it. Tried it into an H&K 2x12 cab with vintage 30s and it sounded great as well.
I use my Katana 50 as a clean platform and use drive pedals on gigs all the time. Also, last year I did a theater gig where we were provided Fender Tonemaster amps as backline, and they sounded great!!
Megadeth shows a wall of Marshall cabs on stage (empty) and the sound is coming from quad cortexes, so who knows?
I loved my Katana 100 Mk II head! When it was working…. Two years after purchase it died suddenly and then I got it RMA’d which I was super happy about because it was under warranty and seemingly fixed my problem. Less than three months later though it died again and it was outside the warranty period, so that was all she wrote.
I won’t be buying another because I just can’t take that chance on losing out on time and money spent… big bummer and has sent me back to tube amps even if just for the fx loop return for my HX stomp.
The problem is that they are much cheaper while sounding just as good as tube amplifiers.
Just as good is up for debate. Not that they sound bad because they definitely do not.
@@benallmark9671i would say they can sound as good as tube amp, but I doubt they will ever feel as good to the player. The dynamics of a tube amp are really tough to replicate via solid state
@@Squall6575 agreed
" *just as good as tube* "
It's a different sound. Usually much better than tube, but it can't get exactly there. A cranked tube is special. A part of it is how easy it is to get the right tone, a part of it is how hard it can be to play it.
Katana and other modelers are the other way around. It's hard to get the tone, but it's easier to play. But easier is not better. That means that *both* "easier play is not better" and "easier tone is not better" either.
@@Squall6575 " *The dynamics of a tube amp are really tough to replicate via solid state* "
No, it's not that hard to achieve. Nobody really want's it.
On a Yamaha THR there is a "voxy" settings, which is really sensitive. Absolutely *perfect* for practice, especially with a clean tone.
I'd bet decent money that it's the least used mode on this amp.
I have a katana head into a carvin legacy 4x12 with vintage 30s. Yes, even at .5 watts you can hang with a drummer and bass. I currently have it on 50 watt with master dimed and volume at just under 2. It's got the tone. I have used a Marshall JVM410H for a long time so I know good tone.
I plug straight into a tube amp. That’s all I need for any sound I want to make.
EVH says, let the amp do his work, it means the lovely tubes
OK grandpa
tube amps in today's world = marketing BS. I'm sorry. go ask your local competent sound engineer.
@@didierlaplaceEVH used lots of effects you have no idea what you’re talking about
Also he used modded amps. If you’re using a drive in the front of the amp you are doing a similar thing.
The CURE is using Roland CUBE cabinets or amps on stage. They blackened the bottom of the 'B' to make it look like and 'R'.
I don't know whether it adds value to their sound though. The sound system probably has more influence. It they kind of sounded warmer and less processed pre-2000.
Thre's also the widely used Roland Jazz Chorus amp but I guess that's not a modelling amp but it's the same manufacturer.
Just a wonderful, creative opening.
Gig what you like regardless of what any big time touring player uses.
I still gig a Line 6 Spider II on occasion and it works perfectly in the applications I ask it to perform in.
If you can't get good usable libe tone out of a modeling amp in 2024 it isn't the amp, it's the operator.
* live, not libe. Lol
For sure!
I got a Boss Katana and your preset pack after watching your vids for on it. I couldn't be happier.. Learned a lot from seeing how you set it all up was amazing!.. Just cut 8K a bit on the global EQ and it's a different amp
Love how you ended the solo with a Paul Gilbert Racer X era run. Per Nilsson uses a line 6 HX Stomp live.
If I were an up and coming artist who started playing big stages I'd probably go for a modeling board instead of a modeling amp.
Out of curiosity, why do you say that. Do you the tones are simply better or ?
@@benallmark9671 Just making a point that a floor modeler is better designed for a large stage than a 100 watt solid state Katana or a Mustang GTX. Having said that, even though I still own some nice tube amps I gig with a Katana Artist MK2 and my pedalboard. I love it. Of course you'll never find me on CZcams or Spotify, just at your local cul-de-sac block party playing 70's-90's tunes whilst people slowly drink themselves into dancing :)
@@allanb1402 nothing wrong with that. Enjoy it !
" *up and coming artist who started playing big stages* "
By that time he's got his sound already. Which he likely achieved with a standalone gigging amp.
You gig with a Katana? What if you went viral and blew up all of a sudden? That's the winning sound. Why wouldn't you continue with it, at least for a while?
@@bakters I can't really argue with that lol
I think there is a lot more Katanas being used than admitted. I have seen a lot of bands with Marshall gear on stage that appears to be on but a Katana was behind and miked out. They are becoming more common in the Las Vegas small night club scenes. I still have a Marshall but I don’t need it. I for one embrace the new light equipment that can be tweaked to pass as the super expensive high end gear. I was fortunate to test drive a Boss IR2 and was pleasantly surprised by how great it sounded. Im 66 and been playing since I was 16. Currently Katanas and HX Stomp are my go to. Let’s face it, once you Put a 57 or 121 microphone in front of an amp everything changes to solid state anyway. Pedals are solid state. Open your mind and you’ll experience the sky is the limit with out humping the gear everywhere. Cheers 🎸🎼🎶
I’m 24 years behind you; with age comes wisdom and, often, humility. We all know the tubes are sweet, but when our bodies start to tell us we won’t live forever, it gets easier to trade a 46lb. pedalboard and a 70lb. tube combo for a 10lb. multieffects setup and a 36lb. solidstate amp.
Thank you for sharing your view; I respect you.
@@jacobpittman1996 Thanks for being kind. Normally guys my age blast me for this point of view. Rock on and cheers
I own a Boss Katana 50 watt...and it kicks ass. It is light, sounds great, and mostly bought it for my son...for $200 at GC. When I was learning, everything cheap was garbage. What I had that was comparable was a Marshall valvestate 1x10(?)...and it was $450 back in like 1992. That is crazy expensive for a starting musician or kid. Cheap now is actually really decent. Even cheap guitars. $300 got you plywood with the Fender squire logo on it back in the day, and sounded like crap. Same price now gets you a pretty good starting guitar. Kids don't have to suffer through the same crap, and I'm happy for them! Boss didn't make these amps for the pro musicians, they were made for the rest of us. And I for one, love them for it. Obviously so do many others, cause they are selling like crazy.
I think a modeling pedal with complimentary software (eg. Helix and Native) paired with a good Speaker Cab with built in power amp is the future. Maximum flexibility and practicality, silent stage, loud stage, home, studio… does it all.
That sounds cool AF. What are some possible gear combos that would achieve this?
The best sound I’ve had from modelling & digital was when I used a Fender Twin Oxblood Tone master with the uafx Ruby. What a fantastic sound that was!
I spent my first decade of gigging with a Line 6 Flextone II head, which was essentially POD 2.0 with a 200 watt stereo power amp. With a good 4x12 speaker cab it sounded great once I figured out how to dial it in. I haven’t gigged since I got my Katana 50, but it just always seems to be lacking any “oomph” at higher volume. I even changed the speaker. I find myself most content with using a modeler as a preamp, then running into the effects return of an old school Peavey Bandit. Big heavy cabinets with big heavy speakers, even with a solid state power amp, just give the biggest, fullest sounds. I’m sure the katana head with a good cab would yield similar results though.
Never mind the amps, KEEP THE LES PAUL! So glad you have pulled the ebay listing
Is that guitar not the Sh!t?!
Great song at the beginning, what is it?
I am not happy with the speaker in my Catalyst 60 - it is missing especially the high end. Would you have any suggestion for a better speaker? I am using the power amp and the speaker with my HX Stomp. I tried adding the 10 channel graphic eq to the helix patches to compensate for the very limited speaker response. It helped a bit, but not enough ....
Eminence is my favorite speaker brand. What kind of music do you play?
I decided to solve this issue correctly. Sold the catalyst and ordered the Fender FR10 😎@@deangullberry5148
Back around 2000 I played a Line Six twin solid state. I had to create my own line out for it. Not a modeling amp, but it did sour me on Line 6 because it tended to start sounding brittle once the temp went over 90F or so. My band at the time almost exclusively played outdoor events. I even had a guy from an audience come up to me and grilled me on it. Then he admitted that he was a sponsored artist of Line 6 and said by the 3rd hour he could hear the sound degrade and it was consistent with his experience. I have played the Line 6 solid state stuff indoors and it sounds good. I donated my Line 6 and a LP Studio to a lady that played better than me and sang better than me but never performed outside (but had played all over the world). I am sure that stuff is in a happier home now! By the way, I got a double hernia lifting my Mesa gear!
The problem I had with mine was onstage, with all the sounds on presets, if the boards vibrated enough and the master volume was nudged just a tiny bit, the volume changed drastcally mid-song. It was terrific for playing in the pit band for theatrical productions, where you were always next to it, and there wasn't a vibration problem, but I only took it onstage at a live gig once: that was enough.
I have had the K2 Head for years and running through a celestion redback 1x12 cab makes it an incredible go too package
Really nice playing. That sounded awesome.
I use the Katana head II with a Fender George Benson cabinet as a pedal platform. This has a Jensen C12K speaker that works really well with this amp.
Sprints are awesome. I was lucky enough a couple of months ago to catch their first NYC gig and it was fantastic. Also I think Weezer did a tour with the original POD’s back when POD’s were the cool new thing and it seemed like tons of people were using them and Amp Farm in the studio.
You're absolutely right, man! Great thinking. I bought Katana Artist like 4 years ago, I really like it, the Waza speaker on it. It's great on home, I removed the amp and made it to a head. Now using it on rehearsals and gigs, but maybe will go for something better. Weird things going with EQ and sometimes feels that it doesn't take pedals so well.
For home use John what does this head sound like with no cab. Many thanks
For home studio use, both the Katana and the Line 6 Catalyst are excellent using the cab emulated line out. I've recorded the Katana w/ a Marshall 2x12 GB cab/sm57 and set the cab emulated line out (using the editing software) to replicate the same. There's a difference but it's very insignificant, especially in the context of a full mix and with aspects of post-production. In my opinion, the Catalyst sounds better overall, but you can't import specific 'models' (i.e. Fender/Marshall/Mesa specific amps), it provides six sound palettes ranging from clean to high-gain (the high-gain sucks on the Catalyst, so get a good pedal if that's what your after and run it on 'clean'). But the Katana is much more flexible. Run it into a good cab if you can, and pair it with the DI signal, blend to taste, and you should find a sound that you're pleased with. Just one man's thoughts.
I took my Katana mini to practice once and put it into a dedicated pa speaker. Sounded incredible. Only thing was a bit off was the headroom and how it took pedals but sound was the important thing.
Apparently Katana artist is used in New Orleans prolifically and the most used as its so reliable. Andy James uses 2 in stereo😊😊😊😊
N.O. climate can play hell with any amp, valve or solid state. Pedals, too. It's no wonder players choose Katanas - they're inexpensive and durable and sound great.
Head is enough for home playing (without cabinet)? Or maybe 50W combo version suits better?
At home with baby in the house, the 50W would sit at its lowest power. Besides, he prefers his own speaker cab if he plays it out. The 100W head….Just a more versatile setup…?
The built-in speaker doesn't sound that good. It's just too small, it doesn't push much air. So it sounds thin. Hook the head to a 4x12 cab and you will be amazed.
For live performances, the Katana 100 combo is probably the perfect amp. It’s loud enough for most large venues that don’t have a dedicated sound system, and versatile enough for small venues (low power modes and all the in/out connections). I can even play acoustic through it.
Ive gigged my Artist MKII a couple of times. No complaints at all, though im still tweaking it, and how i program the foot switch.
I have a few modeling amps from different eras, though not the Katana (yet)! Recently, I've really liked the head version of the Line 6 Spider V MK II (240hc). Stereo outs to two cabs sound great! I understand that live gigs with modeling amps is part of the conversation, but I haven't experience with that yet. Wouldn't it sound as good mic'ed?
I think your final remark nailed it. If people are using modelling they're also going ampless because at that point you might as well save the weight of an amp and go direct.
I watched Plini live. No amps. Played thru neural DSP direct into PA. It was amazing
I’ve been using the Katana Artist head and 2x12 Waza cab in a classic rock cover band for a while. I actually find the cab and speakers to be excellent. I use it with the little back panel piece removed so it’s semi-open back. Closed it was very bottom heavy.
Metallica has been using Axe FX for years. Pat Travers uses a Helix. Nita Straus uses a Boss GT-1000. Sachel from Steel Panther uses an Amplifire. Periphery uses Axe FX, Testament uses Kempers. Devin Townsend uses Axe FX.
Personally, I have had all the different versions of the Axe FX and have tried to play live with them. Not having to worry about micing up a cab is great, but I with the gigs I play, a cab is always necessary as I don't have IEMs nor do the PA's I usually play have very good wedges. I have gone hybrid. I use my my big old tube amp with a 4x12 cab with a Two Notes Cab M. That way I still don't have to worry micing my cab while getting a great FOH sound. Plus I still get the SPL and the interaction between tubes, transformers and speakers that just can't be recreated digitally. Sure it all sounds the same when recorded or run through the PA board but it doesn't feel the same and therefor it makes me play differently. Not to mention it just looks more rock and roll.
To add to your reply, as I enjoy watching live gigs in person and on tv. I always hunt out what the guitarist is using
Here are a few extra
Rick Astley guitarist using Axe-fx floor unit
Mcfly and Busted - Kemper
James Blunt guitarist - valve amps and pedal board
Jack Thammarat - Helix
James Wilson guitarist - Boss GT-1000
Devil's advocate here: you could get the SPL with a cranked Katana 100, so why take a heavy valve amp? (p.s. I use a Fender BDR, so I do know the reason!)
@@1man1guitarletsgoI have used my Axe FX into a Fryette PowerStation 100 with my Marshall 4x12 and it's just not the same.
@@corymoore5093 And there we have it: "it's just not the same". Absolutely. Unfortunately, there will be gigging guitarists out there who have never used proper amps, and who will therefore never experience playing the way we do.
John McFee of the Doobie Brothers uses a Helix Tears for Fears use Kempers into AC30 cabs
Saw several Katana amps in the wild in Nashville, sounded really good, and if I didn't see them, beer in hand and all, I never would have given a second thought to the tone, esp if the player was killing it.
I have a Boss Katana Artist MK2 and a bunch of tube amps (Fender Twin, Marshall JCM2000 TSL122, Fender Blues Junior) and I can tell you that if you a/b any of these with the Katana (because the Katana can make all of those sounds) it's hard to tell the tones apart. That being said, I'm not selling my tube amps because I like them. If I were ever gigging with an amp (I have a Helix so I don't really do that much anymore) I'd honestly probably bring the Katana because 1. It's way lighter than the tube amps & 2. It's more versatile than any of my amps.
When you say you don’t gig with an amp because you have a helix.. does that mean you use the host PA?
IDK. We went amp shopping for my wife's electric fiddle. I was thinking that since she just wanted clean tones that the amp wouldn't really matter. Turns out I was wrong. At each price point the amps sounded better and no two sounded alike. The final two were a Fender Princeton and Marshall Origin. The Marshall won. And it's not like she knows what a tube is, or anything about different amp companies.
I think the speakers are probably a big factor.
Since we have a Marshall amp I decided to get a Strat (used squire for $85). Haven't had an electric in years. Plugged it in and Instantly got all the kinds of classic rock tones I like.
Great point! Marketing snobism perhaps? Roland/Boss is an amazing company. Their marketing strategy is not focus on endorsing great stars over time and just for releasing purposes maybe? They just put their effort on making and developing great products instead; they know they will sell based on their reputation. Moreover they makes a bunch of other equipments (digital pianos, drums, synths, production gear, etc...), so is not just a guitar thing like other companies. A few great jazz and fusion musicians use them for some small gigs now and then (Mike Stern, Chuck Loeb R.I.P, Roben Ford, Alex Hutchings etc...). Roland Blues cube artist (i´d love to hear your take on them), Katana´s and Katana artist, Nextone Special are one of the most incredible and versatile SS, DSP amps i´ve ever played. Great channel by the way! Cheers!
Just a kemper right into the mixer for iem(making my own mix with mobile phone connection) and to the front of house. Best sound I've ever had live and consistent as hell
" *Just a kemper* "
I'm a nerd too, but kemper is just too much... ;-)
@@baktersI don’t think they mean it’s “just a kemper” I think they meant they use only a kemper and that’s it 😂
@@JosePineda-jn8jk As far as the sounds go, I'm fine with it. It's the interface that irks me.
@@bakters oh I see, I thought you were pointing to the price or something being too much because the person said “just a kemper”. You’re saying it’s too hard to fiddle around with. That’s fair and now that I use my HX stomp consistently for gigging I get what you mean. You want something as simple as possible and not a bunch of deep confusing menus.
@@JosePineda-jn8jk " *not a bunch of deep confusing menus* "
Yeap. And I'm a genuine nerd too...
One of the bands that I recorded a few years back, the guitarist is now using a katana for live. He paired it with a Marshall cabinet and it sounds legit for what they are doing. We’ve even recorded a couple of live shows and through some Midas pre’s direct into protools, you’d be hard pressed to tell who is using a real tube amp in the mix.
I will say, that fender has the right idea. People like the heritage and vibe of the analog gear that we know and love. It’s our frame of reference to know how something sounds, and what vibe it is going to give you. However they have missed the mark on pricing. In Canada it’s almost $1200 CAD for the tonemaster deluxe reverb. I can find the real deal on the used market for about 1400 any day. I guarantee they have a huge markup given they are just using class D solid state amplifiers and a digital preamp. It doesn’t really give you huge value and savings to go that route. Especially if you love the analog thing… they are unfortunately not always 100% replicas.
Best budget amp for any genre boss katana head with harley benton 2x12 cab with v30s
You mentioned Alan Holdsworth and his use of the Yamaha DG amps. Yes, he used the DG-80. I fell in love with the Yamaha DG series when they first came out, before I even knew he used them. In fact, I got my first DG-100 before they were even shipping through Musicians Friend and the like. I contacted a Yamaha dealer in another state who had gotten one in, and I bought it and had it shipped to me. After they ran their course, marketing-wise, Yamaha discontinued them. That's when I started keeping an eye out for used ones. I now have two Dg-80s (1x12), two DG-100s (2x12), and a DG-130 (head). I simply don't want to be without one. I'm 61 now, so I think I have enough to keep me going until I kick the bucket. :) I use a Behringer FCB-1010 MIDI pedalboard to change patches and control volume.
I wish Yamaha would have kept them going and added more features. Though they were a first-generation modeling amp, they are an incredible amp, in my opinion.
I don't have any "digital modeling" amps in the traditional sense but I do have an Orange Super Crush and a Laney Lead Top, both are which are solid state and I've generally found my favourite way to use them is also using them as pedal platforms on the clean channels. You still get their underlying sound coming through but I prefer the response and you can tailor the sound a lot more to whatever suits your needs. It's a bit ironic really considering modelers tend to be designed to have lots of bells and whistles but I feel like sometimes letting the pedals do the work into a solid sounding foundation works out really well.
I have a Super Crush as well - its an amazing amp - Its ridiculous really, how good it is for $400.
I've gigged my mk2 head more than 5 times and I love it live. I use a vertical 2x12 with eminence man o wars, which is the key. I actually like it a lot live, but not so much in the studio unless I'm doing clean or lighter crunch tones. It does the thing, and thats all it needs to do. However good speakers are a must.
I gather quite a few bigger bands use Kemper amps but still have walls of Marshalls simply for the look. Pretty sure Steve Howe of Yes has used a Line 6 combo live and I recall seeing Earl Slick playing with Bowie using one of the early Line 6 heads and cabs.
I saw Sprints play last night in Amsterdam. No Katana on stage, just Fender amps and an Ampeg for bass.
Been running a board with stomp boxes based around the Tone X into a Fender FR-12 and it’s been nothing short of incredible. I play relatively big stages and it’s been brilliant.
does your FR-12 have the hiss problem? That's what's holding me back.
@@GearAGoGo There’s a little noise but nothing unmanageable and certainly less than when I was/do gig tube amps. The only space I could see it being remotely problematic would be close micing in a recording situation. When I’m recording I go into FR just for some room volume and send my board/modelers to my DAW. Truly a revelatory experience! I love my tube amps and still play them at home but this rig has been an absolute game changer for me! Happy to share details of my exact rig 🤙
A friend of mine runs a katana, but he swapped out the speaker in his combo to a red Celestion … sounds great live in his cover band
Is your friend running the 50w katana or the big 100w?
Changing the stock katana speaker is not a smart thing to do, just in case anyone else is thinking of doing it. This dudes 'friend' aside. Give it a google.
@@powerboon2knot clear. What’s the issue?
I was checking some guitars in a booth which had a Katana and Blues Junior. I used the Katana 'cos it's very available in shops. I got some decent sounds with the guitars and tweaking the Katana. At the end I just plugged into the Blues Junior with all the tones at 12 o'clock and it had the sound I was trying to get on the Katana. I plugged back into the Katana and I was still getting an over-bright sound that I was trying to dial down. The problem was in the upper mids. If I dialled down the Katana it was cutting too low on the upper mids, so it went from bright to muddy with little in between. The Blues Junior was cutting the top but leaving the upper mids so the detail was there, without the shrill top end. If the BJ hadn't have been in the room I'd have been none the wiser. The Katana is just voiced brighter than the BJ and you can't always dial it out to suit.
Bob Mould used a Pod on a couple of albums.
I'd use a digital modeler (HX Stomp and upwards) instead of a modelling amp. It just seems like landfill to me.
I like modelers for pure ease of use. I dont use a crazy amount of effects but I use enough that hitting 3 switches quick enough to change separate pedals just isnt feasible. The fact that they all pretty much sound amazing now is a nice bonus.
I think you are right. That's why kempers and axe fx units do well. Famous people play these things . So, modeling/capturing devices without a speakercab don't have this problem. But when it is a modeling amp , we want it to be that cool looking "real "Fender "tube thing or vox or marshall etc
I bought a boss katana 100 watt mk2, the clean tones sound beautiful, the distorted- crunch/ lead/brown sound a bit thin and synthetic but it's ample for my needs
I'll just say that I love my Katana 50 MKII combo, and I employ it much more often than my Princeton reissue. It's so easy to get to what's in your head with just the amp, but it also delivers pedals so well. Most surprising is I'm not tempted by anything else currently. Maybe the Marla SV10, one of the most straightforward low-wattage amps available at the moment - and it's waaay less than a grand.
Thank you...
Thank you for getting to the heart of these products, which is if anyone (of note) uses it. I see CZcamsrs raving about pedals all the time, yet is it in their pedal board? Nope.
I think it’s a very versitile amp
I suggest the matching cabinet
I had the head thru my old 4x12 it’s was nice but I got the matching 2x12 more definition and bass
I love my Katana 50 its does everything I need.
Heres my 2 cents…
I got a katana a few years back, as i felt i improved i “moved on” to a couple tube amps purely because its just what you do right….
I then needed to free up some cash so sold the amps and went back to a katana - and i haven’t been unhappy with my sound at all. So perhaps artists dont use katanas mainly because its just the done thing to use other established tube amps and nothing to do with the actual sound or quality of the katana.
I have a Katana MII 50 that I bought a couple of years ago for band practice. It's very versatile, sounds great, and is much lighter to lug to practice than my Marshall. I still love the sound of my Marshall with one of my Les Paul's but it's not really that practical for band practice in a small studio. Also I can control the volume of the Katana much better than the Marshall which sounds great when it's cranked a bit but is just too loud for many small venues. I am not sure how the concert scene is in your area but here in the US most touring bands on large stages are using modelers like the Kemper or Line 6 Helix or the Fractal Audio systems. There are usually no real amps on stage and all sound is controlled by front of house to either stage monitors or in-ears.
I’ve seen nearly no one myself using/endorsing these modeling amps live but I have noticed a huge uptick in Helix/Kemper/QC’s played live. Dustin from Thrice and both guitarists in Hot Mulligan are using modelers live.
I've been gigging a Katana Artist mkii combo (the one with the better speaker and forward-facing controls) for the better part of 2 years now, coming from a series of decidedly pedestrian tube amps. While it's certainly a different experience, I don't feel like I took a massive step backwards in terms of quality, of either tone or build. It's actually stood up fairly well to the rigors of gigging, to this point. Short of a mismatched amp cover, I don't baby the thing.
Looking at the current crop of (slightly upmarket) competitors, (Hot Rod Deluxe, DSL40CR, AC15, etc), some of which I have experience with... I would say it compares reasonably well, depending of course on what the user needs. Not better, but comparable. Which maybe is another angle to the main point of today's video: We don't really see too many Hot Rod Deluxes/DSL40CRs/DSL20H/production-line AC15s on *PRO* stages, either. DSL100s, sure... upmarket AC15s, sure... maybe the occasional HRD in some genres... but the numbers are not overwhelming. So I think a lot of it might come down to the lower price point of these products (Katana of course included), not just tube vs modeling. Food for thought.
I use my Katana largely in the same way that Mr. Cordy does... as a pedal platform. The thing that's great about the Katana, though, is that it also has smorgasbord of built in amp tones and effects. So, if I need a specific thing for some random tune that my pedalboard doesn't do, I can fall back on the Katana's own capabilities. It's a nice option to have. The line out with speaker sim (which is something that is not on offer in many of the more "entry level" tube amps I referenced earlier) is also a crucial part of my rig. All that flexibility and capability is what makes me stick with the Katana for live.
That said.. am I keeping my (again, rather pedestrian) tube amps? Yes. Yes I am.
I was being so long-winded there that I forgot to mention... I took a cruise with the fam recently, and there were multiple house amps for the various performance areas on the ship... every single one was a Tone Master Twin. That caught my attention a bit.
Hi there, great playing ..have you gigged the Katana?
I work mine professionally all the time, and thats with the Katana effects ..hundreds of gigging musicians like me with our tube amps in the garage gathering dust coz we're sentimental and dont want to part with them 😂
I think the katana is brilliant - I am not a wine taster sort of guitar player and my ears are not in the best nick but I think they are really good.
I used one (212 100w) with The Waeve which has two saxophones and a violin and my partner on keyboard so a plexi with 2x412 would be daft in the smaller venues we play.
It took my pedal board really well and I found the GA-FC pedal invaluable for “get out of jail sounds” like reverb, delay , phaser/chorus and a drive (this is where I discovered the blues driver pretty much) I would also stick in a expression pedal to increase the gain on the blues driver to 100% and get the 2 Rats at least nice/Fripp type thang and another to increase the chorus rate…
It’s good too because you can dial in your actual gig tones at home and then chuck it n the car and off you go to soundcheck without having to make too many adjustments .
I don’t use it now because I tried out the victory V30 deluxe for a bit and now I am experimenting with going with Helix and a new powercab 212 plus so I can get some nice far out stereo effectage business going.
So my band support Elbow soon on some big shows and it will be interesting to see how the helix set up does.
But basically all this stuff is good and very usable but I am a sucker for convenience and I guess this stuff is convenient if nothing else.
I love my old Marshalls (almost vintage now!) but somehow they are like grumpy old men and not as much fun as all the weird and wacky things we can do with modellers now…
I could easily have carried on using the katana live forever if there wasn’t so many other things to challenge it and people on CZcams bringing my attention to loads of cool’s stuff!!!!!!!!! 😡 😂
Oh and for many of the shows last year woth the big band I used a tone master super reverb along side the Marshalls just for extra cleanage when needed…blah blah blah x
I need to try the expression pedal with the Katana a bit - Delay/Reverb mix and the GAFC...It really does seem to me to be the cheapest all-in-one type thing that is actually good enough to gig?
@@johnnathancordy without the GAFC pedal and the abilty to connect a couple of exp pedals the katana wouldn’t be half as addictive.. I mean it’s wouldnt be that much different to taking out at tube combo and a pedal board really.. the katana isn’t that light at all either.
I think the funnest most convenient thing as an alternative to a katana is probably a helix/modeller and an FRFR type jobby
I’m pretty impressed with the new powercab 212 + compared with the old standard one I have
I am also running it with the Line 6 link (AES cable)so powercab can be controlled within the presets if’n you like - I’m actually just using the derailed Ingrid and dual cab set up with top rolled off to around 6k like yourself and using a cab block…
the powercab 212 plus is quite a big lump though.. but you don’t have to be Geoff capes to lugg it around and - well- I have a roadie! 🥸
Bought a katana 50 and it paid for itself in a couple gigs. Still earning money years later. CZcams lies to beginners all the time, there is no soundman or pa at the gig that is going to put a mic on your amp or take your direct signal. You're bringing the mic and the pa and the sound man. And the band members with DUI's. Probably the drummer, got room for his drums? And if there is a stage with a PA , Your way past thinking about what you're going to bring to a gig or you're crashing an open mic and should just bring your guitar and a very simple board and the guy who owns the pa likely will not want your ir loaded in ear monitor bullshit no matter what it cost.
I think you hit on it right at the end. People have figured that if they are gonna use modeling, why bother with an amp. They can get it all on their board in one pedal’s space, now.
The first amp besides my little Peavy Rage, that wasn't a broken down glitchy POS, is my Katana 100w 2x12 combo. I like it a lot. I'm still figuring out what it can do .
Wait, don't lots of people use kemper live?
Modeling amps should just be a laptop dock with a studio monitor as the speaker and the dials and volume knobs should just be midi controllers to control the parameters on the software running on your laptop. Locking the computer into proprietary hardware devices makes these types of apps very inflexible. Imagine something that looks like an amp, feels like an amp, but you can plug the actual software into it via your laptop. That’s what modeling amps should be.
At that point, why not do it all over Bluetooth with a tablet on a music stand? That's a lot more convenient than a laptop now, and should be plenty of control surface. I agree with the basic idea, I just don't think a laptop is the appropriate "front end" for most people now, when a decent phone or a $100 tablet is up to the task.
I had a Katana Artist MKII combo and it sounded alright. Sold it but now I’m thinking of getting the head. Sucks that the Artist MKII amp head doesn’t have an internal speaker like the regular MKII. But I also need the options for different speaker cabs
I've been playing out in a fairly low volume situation, and I need to travel light. I've been using a Boss ME80 into a 15 w Roland Cube, and I can get it to sing once I get dialed in. Mic it up and we have monitors and mains as well.
I have many tube amps that I've collected over the years. It's kind of been my thing. I am not a professional and rarely play live. I recently picked up a katana 100 head and paired it with the boss wazacraft 4x12 cab. This combo is Loud!!!!! I could damn near play with a drummer on the .5 watt mode and get away with it. It sounds great. I think the built in reverbs aren't as convincing as a spring tank, a good reverb pedal like Strymon big sky, cxm 1978, etc. They are usable though. The amount you get for the money is amazing and is definitely why they sell so many, but I feel they do everything at 90% give or take. When I pair any good tube amp against it (64 fender bassman, mesa electradyne, mesa jp2c, evh 5150 III, friedman be100, hughes kettner, even blackstar, etc.) It loses but only slightly. Really that says a lot and it should lose to these much pricier options. I think that's why most artists aren't playing them because it's just almost there but not quite. They are completely gigable and it would be way less hard to swallow if a theft event happened with a prs se and a katana than a Core line with a jp2c. It's literally 90%+ there. I am really impressed by what they are able to offer now days at such amazing values. After watching this you have reminded me that this head has a 5" practice speaker which I have never used and will now try out. Great video, Thanks.
I had an Electra Dyne Jeremy! Cool amp. The other thing I feel like the Katana competes quite well in a way that most amps don't - like a decent Clean tone, with decent crunch and drive too has been the whole ethos that Mesa etc have chased for years to varying levels of success right?
It’s all about snobbery and status. I’ve been using a Vox ToneLab LE for years and it sounds great. Get compliments on my tone all the time.
Nice opening track! Melodic!
Love the LP tones
Love my Fender GTX50 Mustang 50 watt single 12.
I play at home and jams.
No pedal board. Couple of small effects processors. Only get battery powered stuff except amp itself.
Also have a Roland Street Cube and Blackstar Fly 3. Good travel size and battery option.
Keep it simple.
I don't need to fill a hall.
I was just thinking the same: had the katana 50, the zoom G5n, original line 6 pod, sold it all..I just bought the pod go now. Indeed none of my hero's use these things. I only used it to record and and home practice. Still loving tube amps more. what ever they say: it-is-NOT-the-same!
I admit, what nudged me over the edge when getting the AxeFX II was seeing them in Metallica's touring rack.
But I was already heading that direction and was just deciding between Kemper and Fractal.
I've used that Boss Katana head right next to a Marshall head in a rehearsal studio on the same cab and the sound quality between the 2 is unbelievable. The Boss kicks its arse.
I'm reading below in the comments people praising the Boss amps saying how pleased they are with them, and Boss are doing very well selling them, so why is it a problem for you that you don't see some big names using them at big shows? If it sounds great it sounds great. I don't need to see anyone famous using them for me to accept they're good. I just use my own ears for that.
...and Steve Howe of Yes has completely gone Line6 Helix and just bringing his guitars!
I had the pleasure seeing them in 2013 and Steve’s setup was a Line6 Pod HD500 (floor) into two DT50 212s, and that was it! He also used a Variax guitar (model 500, I think) on a stand for sitar tone, and, I believe, for 12 string tone as well. I couldn’t complain about any of his tones whatsoever :) - it was an amazing show! There’s also an interview with him somewhere on CZcams where he talks about this particular setup.
The Eagles used Line 6 Flextone at one point. A few are using Ax Fx Metallica and Def Leppard. Satchel from Steel Panther uses Amplifire multi effect
Always enjoy your posts. I’m across the border where we put jam on first😂 I saw a band called Styilyano in Exeter who sounded massive with I think Helix . Do,you give lessons 1-1 ?
Nine Inch Nails was using the Vetta stuff. They're probably using Helix now. I'm pretty sure Robert Smith uses Katanas now. He was using The Cube.
I saw The Cure last year and I saw a Cube on stage
@@EzraMF lucky
Robert Smith used a Line 6 Spider V head on a recent The Cure tour
My 100 watt Katana always had the same harsh sound no matter what the setting. It just wears on your ears after a while. I got an AxeFX and gave the Katana to a buddy.
I play a Fender Super Champ XD which is a hybrid amp and has to be one of the most underatted amps ever. I wish Fender would bring those back.
I have the same amp. Absolutely fantastic.😊