Sepearation Anxiety/The Herd Bound Horse
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- čas přidán 29. 09. 2019
- Some strategies for helping horses with this common problem that is part of the natural herd instinct and need for leadership, safety and comfort. Try our Online Video Library FREE 7-days at truewesthorsemanship.com/vide...
Man, it's good to see someone FINALLY demonstrate this with a horse that's actually buddy sour. Sick of watching training fixes for this using horses that aren't at all herd bound. Good job!
Glad you enjoyed! I often use horses that are having problems or don't know what we're working on for that reason. Lots more videos here!
I used to ride my horse in the pen with my buddy sour mule and trot around quickly then leave the pen and the mule would get relief when his buddy left . But one time i grabbed a little branch just to block the mule from zipping by too close and kicking out or something but then the mule went and picked up a 5 foot long stick in his mouth and started chasing us around!!! I laughed so hard i could barely stay on. Mules are so creative.
Eventually though , he got to where i could leave and go ride and he would stay in the pen without stressing too bad. Just amazing animals they all are.
I have, in the past, had to totally remove a horse to a location all by themselves. No horses around at all.
The key to doing that is to insert yourself as the pasture mate. Plan on spending a lot of time at the stable if you decide to do this though.
After about 6 months, they all learn to look to me for their companion.
After putting them back in the herd, they all will still display those old tendancies but they have a new coping skill to help them deal with separation. Behaviors under saddle are considerably easier to correct when they are looking to you as their partner.
Having the horse "with you" is very valuable but sometimes it's difficult to teach. Especially for people that aren't natural leaders.
Mark Rashid's book "Horses Never Lie" helped me with natural leadership, especially where horses are concerned.
😊😊😊
Thank you for a crystal clear demo of rewarding desired behavior!
It's good to see real world anxiety in action. I'm new to horses (my husband's not) and my old gentle mare is buddy sour...but now I see that she's not nearly as bad as it gets. If she were like your palomino, I'd give up because I'm too inexperienced. I think I'll have to do this sort of thing off the saddle because I can't really ride yet, which is probably why she prefers the gelding's company over my company. The past two weeks I've been religious about tying her up, fully grooming and leading her around. Her friends follow, but I hope this helps her trust me more each day. Again, thanks for filming the anxiety and not just the end result.
You bet. The better your communication, the more she can trust you. Have you checked out my Horsemanship Playlist?
You need to teach a horse to lead out in the wide open so your training needs to begin with leading them out and, when they become anxious, lead them back. This teaches them there is no need to worry because you will bring them back. Once they get used to the long walks in hand, they will easily transition to riding out. This way, your horse doesn't associate you with having to decide between two things both of which they don't want to do.
His voice reminds me of Mr. (Fred) Rodgers 😊 very patient.
thanks so much for this video, I've been dealing with this the past few days with my 5 year OTTB and my 20 yo OTTB. we've just moved to a new facility and the 5 yo gets upset when he has to be worked away from the other horses. this is new behavior for him as he didn't act this way at our old boarding barn. will definitely try this technique.
Super cool. Wasn't aware that this was a thing among horses. The horse really trusts you! Thanks for the video
Love it. Excellent instruction.
Thanks! I'm looking forward to trying this
Two very nice horses. Your patience with the worried pally is great to see. Thanks for sharing.
hallyandhidalgo thanks for watching! If you’re interested in more videos check out Online Video Library at truewesthorsemanship.com
I like stepping off my horse in all kinds of places too. I've never pulled the saddle, but I just recently started pulling the headstall to let them munch on grass for a bit. I really like your channel!
Good stuff. Thanks for following along!
Really nice video--concepts, causes, positive results!!
this is great... looks alot like New Zealand where you are.
Thank you so much for the video. I just purchased a horse which moved to a different state with us and is the only horse (so far!) She left behind her 4 month old foal and two barn mates and she seems very depressed. Just stands around all day. We are in the process of buying another horse for a mate. I hope this will help her. Your video confirms that (horses) are happier in herds! Thank you
They sure are - that would be a big change for her!
I really enjoyed Your demo here Ben in a natural setting, well done !
Thanks Mike!
Just found this channel . Love it
Glad to hear it! Lots more content on Facebook and Instagram.
Ty 😊
See your using a hackamore never used one but about already started three colts just in a training halter under saddle not riding just my young kids. like the raw look and it looks pretty simple. Thanks for the video one of my colt has separation anxiety and love to see all the training videos she does the same thing pulled away from the herd even if she's just walked up to the house she wants to get back to her buddy. My other colt just turned a year and he doesn't do that I can take him long distances from the herd and as you said if they have a strong leader they are more relaxed. Thanks for a good video🤗
crosscountrygl thanks for watching and for the feedback. The hackamore is a unique piece of equipment that can be incredibly effective with the understanding and preparation for horse and rider. We are working on an Intro to Hackamore series for our Online Video Library right now!
Nice video and instruction. Enjoyed watching.
Patti Criss thanks for watching!
Love how his mate just stands the whole way through that lesson. Awesomeness
Glad you enjoyed. Thanks for watching!
How do you get a willing participant to help you? I tried this but the other horse got annoyed and just kept leaving us 🥴. Would you suggest typing the other and still trying to work in the vicinity?
Great video! Thanks
Thanks for watching! Please subscribe so you don't miss anything.
Thank you! #1, you started with a horse who was actually already anxious, which is much more realistic. #2 you validated everything we are doing and reminded me that horse cannot get relief with his buddy, only away from him. I am very, very fortunate to have a very experienced trainer and I trust her implicitly. Which brings me to another point ... how come all the videos I find on this subject are men? Where are the women trainers?
Great video and explanation!
Thanks for following!
This is helpful, thanks. I’m glad you’re pointing out that it’s natural. In my intro to the horse world it was talked about as a problem. That’d be like tying a humans hands and saying “this human has a problem, he/she doesn’t like having their hands tied.”
Your Barista thanks for watching. It becomes an issue when we don’t set it up the best way and/or provide the direction and leadership that the horse needs, not just in that moment but in all the moments leading up to it. Of course, there will still be horses or situations where it may still present itself because it is natural.
i guess it's quite off topic but do anyone know a good site to watch new series online?
@Bruno Ricky Flixportal
@Bronson Alec Thanks, I went there and it seems like they got a lot of movies there =) I really appreciate it!!
@Bruno Ricky You are welcome =)
Wow you're awesome!
Rose Ault thanks for the kind words. If you’re interested in more videos check out our Online Video Library at truewesthorsemanship.com with a free 7-day trial.
I’m at a loss. I moved my yearling and 18 year old mare from 24/7 shared turnout (just the two of them) to a barn where they are in the stall at night (they are stalled next to each other and can see and interact) and out together in a a pasture during the day. However, now my old mare won’t stop pacing the fence line in their new pasture. My yearling is with her in this new pasture and she will quietly much on her alfalfa unless my old mean mare decides to herd her around a bit before going back to the fence pacing. I don’t even know what she is herd bound too at this point. She’s always disliked (but tolerated) being stalled so can’t imagine she’s herd bound to the stall. I’ve right two different pasture on the property, and she paces in both of them. When I only owned my old mare and not my yearling this was never a problem.
I like it.
Thanks so much it worked with one of my horses, I was wondering with one of my super buddy sour horses has a heart murmur and we can’t work him very much and I was wondering if you have any suggestions of how to help his buddy sourness
This is great! The horse that mine gets anxious leaving isn’t mine so would be tricky to do but I can work something out
Glad you found it helpful!
Thanks , do you have some long reining tips please
I love your video. But my problem is I just bought this horse. She now will not leave my gelding, which I've had for 13 years. He did share pasture with two other horses, but I sold them due to health reasons. Now he constantly calls her when I ride him out. He will ride out alone, but as long as he can hear her, he will not shut up. She just will not go. She will actually start crow hopping. I've had her for a month now and have not gotten a chance to ride her away from him yet.
We’re looking to get our first horse. The one we’re looking at is a total kid horse mare at 12 years old. Starting to get nervous she’ll be like this. Specially because she’ll be solo.
It is common, but there are a lot of ways to help address it.
Really helpful, thank you. I have a very nappy nervous mare, who does this at shows particularly, when her friend is there. On her own, she's a dream! I will definitely try this technique, it makes a lot of sense to me.
Please can I ask, do you have any ways to deal with this in the turnout field though? Same mare will gallop around endlessly when her special friend is taken out of sight, even though she has a companion in her field.
Thanks for watching - glad you enjoyed. Is there a way you can add a little more separation on a regular basis? Posturing them separately at times if you can and moving one every day somewhere else to a pen or be tied up for awhile. They just need to get used to the idea of being apart a little more frequently.
I notice that you rub and scratch on that palomino instead of patting or slapping. Good idea! Humans might appreciate a pat on the back, but to horses it's really not so pleasurable, in my experience.
Subbed. 👍
I agree completely!
I've got a horse that dose this but no way to separate eny ideas
What about if when you're trying to work them around their buddy and they start to just really throw a fit and become dangerous
What exactly is "sepearation" anxiety? Is it the fear of the pomaceous fruit known as the "pear"? I guess resolving that would entail chopping down any pear trees in the area.
Excellent video, thank you. What do you do though if the horse who has to remain at home is running around and calling to the other one. Viento (I think that’s his name) just stood quietly.
Lesley Carter it may help to work with some similar approaches but with two riders working at the same time.
Thank you Ben
I am working with a 19 yr old stdbrd cross mare and a 20 yr old shetland crossbred mare that have constantly been together for 14 or 15 yrs. Rly hard but gettin there🙂
That would be a challenge! Lots of creativity, consistency and time. Improving leadership will strengthen your partnership and their ability to trust.
Very helpful. What about when the buddy that stays back has the problem. My mare completely looses her mind to the point of injuring herself.
I would try implementing things gradually like pasturing separately at times, working them within sight of each other, and taking each away and then back for gradually longer time periods.
Do you have a back up rain or something on that horse? Otherwise why is there more than two ropes going from the head back to the saddle area?
Thank you so much for sharing this! I have a mare and gelding (her foal) that I am not able have separate areas for them yet. But they do have the buddy sour issue. They will stand tied separately but whiney, paw etc. Now the riding work zones- Would you ride one with the other tied and only work the 1 horse for that day or would you and then swap them out? Thank you again for sharing this information!!
Robin Ruby you’re welcome! Thanks for watching. You can always swap them out and ride the other one.
Thank you so much!!! Looking forward to more videos!!!
Robin Ruby you bet. If you’re interested in more videos you might enjoy our Online Video Library. Lots of different subjects and skills covered and you can try it for free at truewesthorsemanship.com
My horse can work with being across the fence or a 2 paddocks away from the herd but when I’m riding her she doesn’t leave the herd and she just stands still no matter what I do? She’s a 9yro ottb mare. What should I do? I’ll try this strategy but any extra tipsL
That brown horse is just chillin.
He's highly motivated by food...😄
How did you get the other horse to just stand there?
The ground is really impressed where your horse has been stressing, from one point to another. Looks like you have allowed him many days to stress by himself. 🤔. Lucky horse, good man/rider, in this regard, no bit.😊
No, he wasn't stressing for many days. But he is very athletic, so had done a lot of moving in a short while. He improved very quickly with the approach I described in video.
I have a mare like this palomino who is very insecure when we try to take her away from our gelding. Currently, I have them boarded and work with them separately just the way you describe here. My question is-once I move them to our home on 1/2 acre and put them in corrals on our property, how can I separate them without enough property to do that? We have outdoor corrals and will be riding together, my husband and I off the property. Seems like an impossible situation for me to be able to work them separately. Would placing a wall between the corrals do any good? They can still hear each other as they would only be maybe 20-30 feet apart.
That does sound like a difficult situation. The other side of the equation is continuing to improve your and your husband’s leadership and communication so you can help them learn to be more comfortable with you. You can work together while you ride on the same ideas.
My horse has very severe separation anxiety he has a bond with a horse and every time I fetch him from his field he just turns around and gallops off to his friend and he’s really strong so I can’t even lead him let alone ride him if I got on him he would just gallop off with me on him I can’t even lunge him like I used to be able to because he pulls away to go find the other horse I have been taking him in a different field away from other horses but all he does is freak out and gallop around even know he can see the other horse how should I deal with this?
It is very unfortunate when they’ve been shown how strong they are and learn to just leave like that. It requires getting the groundwork solid (not just lunging) in a round pen so he can’t really get away so he can re-learn how to properly yield to the halter. Then you’d be able to begin to incrementally apply some of the ideas in this video.
My wife and I make it a point to ride away from our horses. Helps quite a bit.
Bdub78 dub absolutely! An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure
My guy red can get herd bound. He’s a great dude, but he can get s bit ants in his pants occasionally. That’s a horse for ya. The more I do with him the more he gets into the routine and the drama goes away. He’s a good horse, just a bit insecure. Great tips
I have a problem. My new horse is 7 years old and has severe septation anxiety. The problem is she doesn't trust me yet and she doesn't have only one horse that she has a bond to, it is the whole herd. I can't separate her from the whole herd since I don't have my own camps and the rest of horses belongs to the owner of the farm and she can't let her graze alone. What should I do? How do you build trust?
It can take quite some time to really build trust and understanding - it starts as we begin to understand horses better and how they actually think and look at life. Have a look at my other videos on here and I also have a full Online Video Library available on my website that can help you approach this from multiple angles. Check it out for free at truewesthorsemanship.com
My horse will leave his companion easily without any problem, but if I take her away from him, he will work himself into a lather. How should I deal with this?
My horse does the same thing . Any ideas?
Nice property. Do you own the hillside with the timber?
Gerry Coleman thank you. No, that’s the forestry across a little river. We hope to have access to ride across there.
@@TrueWestHorsemanship That would be nice to be allowed access to that area. I bet you miss Colorado. I hope we can hook up sometime and compare notes on our horsemanship journey.
Gerry Coleman yes, I miss Colorado a lot. Be great to catch up with you sometime.
My mare is buddy sour but only when she is tied and being left. She is okay if she is the one leaving. If I have her tied she will rear up and try to climb up/over whatever she is tied to and also dig a hole in the ground while tied. What can I do to stop this behavior?
Do you have to leave her tied? She'd do better if she could move her feet around. Are they pastured together all the time? The rearing and pawing can be result of her not knowing how to tie well, ie yield to halter and wait patiently. I address the pulling back in a video in our Online Video Library at our website. The pawing you can address a little at a time, discouraging it be making a sharp noise or getting her attention when she goes to start. Praise her when she stands quietly and try not to leave her tied too long.
How do you handle this with a horse who is not deterred by work? My thoroughbred will choose to trot/canter near his buddy for hours with no attempts to slow down, even with I try taking him away to show him that he can rest further away. I run out of energy long before he does.
Jordyn Bush horses with lots of energy would also benefit by being kept separate at times and regular changes to the “herd” so he doesn’t get so set in the status quo. There are multiple strategies that can be applied depending on your situation.
@Eden Holley I ended up going the +R route and 2 years later he’s a totally different horse. Still anxious, but can handle his stress and cope rather than having a complete meltdown.
@Eden Holley positive reinforcement training. There’s tons of folks who cover it well on CZcams and Instagram! Highly recommend it.
What if the one with the anxiety is an unbroke two year old? just longe and trot him around the buddy horse? Also what about when you put them back in the pasture, they are then with other horses with out having to work? or do you keep them separated during this training stage?
Yes, you can still find ways to make the right thing easy and the wrong thing difficult. I would change things up and not keep them together constantly. It's not that they have to work whenever their around the other horse, but just so they will change their mind and can realize it's a good deal to go with you.
@@TrueWestHorsemanship Right now my mare is leased out so it's a good time to work with the two year old, so youa re saying sometimes have them turned out together and other times not? He needs to get over this long before we break him in or it will be an issue . Thanks for reply.
@@ebonypegasus9864 yes, so he doesn’t get too stuck with a “norm”. The better your communication the more comfortable he’ll be with your leadership.
is the 'anchor buddy' just ground tied ?? !
Yes he is.
Anyone have any tips on seperating two horses who have been together since birth? 😓 I have to split my herd.
Ashley Walker that’s going to be quite a mission and will probably be stressful on them, even if you do it gradually or you have other horses to use for varying herd dynamics. Starting to separate them gradually with electric tape or across the fence from each other might be good. Also working them like I describe just a little at a time will help.
I had 3 horses but one died and now my appolusa (17) makes so much noise when I take my arabian out of the corral which makes my arabian freak out. My arabian tried to kick me off when I road him. Any ideas?
kathy dinsi have you watched this video?
I’ve been practicing this with my mare for the past three days (her friend is in a paddock sharing a fence with the arena so she often wants to look and be over there), but the more that I push her to work along that fence line, she gets super agitated and tries to buck. I give her plenty of opportunity to rest at the other side of the arena but she quickly tries trotting back to where her friend is, so I push her forward and work her down there again until she bends through her rib cage and lowers her head and I left her walk off again. I’m treating her for ulcers as she has a history and is exhibiting symptoms. She is even worse than your palomino when left in the paddock alone… but do you think pain from ulcers could be enough to explain this “bratty” behavior!? I’ve had her for a year and this brattiness has really only showed up in the last month… she was herd bound when I first got her but she had been going really well until recently.
Well horses are herd animals!
My draft woulda busted down that gate by now. Lol
I have an amazing mare BUT her vice is herd bound. It's so bad 😭 she literally shakes violently when we try to leave others. She is also a nervous Nelly. She's a fiery mare. This horse acts alot like mine.
Michelle Melton it can be pretty challenging. Do you have a good leadership partnership so you can help her develop better confidence and go with you better?
@@TrueWestHorsemanship I would say yes. Most of the time. I have found that she does better with just me and her, but if I go on a ride with friends, and get a distance from the others, she gets nervous. We've been working on this a few years. She's a "hot" horse but when it's just me and her, you can't tell. Once saddle is on and I'm on, she does very well. When riding in a group, I never Kno if she will throw a fit if the others get too far ahead on the trail.
Michelle Melton yes, the herd dynamics always change things that way. Have you tried setting up scenarios where you consistently work her while in proximity to the others (ie trotting or loping circles, serpetines, figure 8s) and letting her find rest at a distance from them? Another variation, especially if the trail is too narrow for lots of activity, is to play Leap Frog - taking turns passing one another at a pretty good trot and letting them have a break way out ahead.
@@TrueWestHorsemanship well....not really like the way you are talking about. The area we ride is extremely Rocky and hilly. It is rural small mountain terrain and it's not like we are in an open field. There are none where we ride. Usually it's narrow steep trails. So we have to ride in a line with alittle distance for safety. At times, she will get too close to the horse in front of us and I'll have to hold her back. When I make her stay a safe distance, she can get nervous and clumsy. That's when I really get nervous she will cause us to have an accident. BUT if I'm on a trail, I really know and I put us out front leading, she does great! She does not get excited about how far behind us the others are. I rescued this horse at age 4-5 and I have heard from others this horse had a rough life. She was "rode hard and put up wet" if you know that ole saying. She has come so far in 3 years! You would not believe! But I am still having this issue. I do think, I need to ride more often. That is my fault. In winter once a week. In summer, maybe 2-3 times a week. But I only have company on Sunday.
@@TrueWestHorsemanship also I might add that sometimes she gets very nervous with horses that get too close to her behind on the trail but it's like she's afraid. She doesn't ever try to kick at them. It's just like she's afraid of some behind her. But she wants to stay close to that horse in front of her
What is stationary harder is freaking out?????
You may need to apply a variety of these strategies and work with both horses on this issue.
Why separate them if they feel best together?
Vladimir Rurik mainly it is for when you’re wanting to ride and have trouble with the one you’re riding or the one staying back because of separation anxiety. It causes people a lot of trouble, and stresses the horses. It’s much better if they’re comfortable being separated and willingly go with a person., even if they spend most the rest of their time together.
I had 3 horses,one died and my appy makes noise when I take my young arabian out of the corral. I tried taking my arabian away from my appy but he freaked out and tried to kick me off. Any suggestions?
I’ve that you actually show a horse with the separation anxiety. SO many videos show after the horse has been trained. You show the actual process. Love it!!
Stop talking! Start helping!
you know nothing about how horse learn